Comments by "D Mc" (@dmc8092) on "On Bernie Sanders & Libertarianism (Pt. 3) | John Fugelsang | COMEDY | Rubin Report" video.

  1. Libertarians like to say they are just fiscally conservative and socially liberal--but it's really not that simple.
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  2. The Rubin Report And I really appreciate it. You're doing great work.
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  3. whiff1962 Certainly libertarians don't care about facts because their minds reside in a cloudy land where everyone acts in good conscience and no business ever defrauds or harms their customer.
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  4. Lil Dragon Libertarian philosophy is completely utopian. To succeed everyone would have to be on their best behavior and always act for the greater good. It's as delusional as Communism.
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  5. Lil Dragon Which is pretty much what I said. It's more than just being fiscally conservative and socially liberal.
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  6. Anti Cosmic That's the problem with people defending libertarianism. They don't address actual issues they just say people who disagree with them are stupid. And that's pretty much what you did here. I listed a few of my issues with it above, as have several others. But you don't read that you just go on the attack.
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  7. Anti Cosmic Also, I didn't call it simple I said it's NOT as simple as fiscally conservative, socially liberal. You seem to not understand things.
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  8. Lil Dragon I don't know that what you say is true. I think regulations have done both great and bad things, but lack of regulations is definitely not great. If you actually look at the 1800s and think things were great I would have to think you're crazy.
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  9. Anti Cosmic Can you only read things that are directed at you? You didn't really invite discussion. You were just being an ass. If you really think "simple" and "not simple" mean the same thing I don't think you're capable of discussing anything.
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  10. Lil Dragon It's bad to have children working in mines. It's good to allow people to have weekends off. It's good to ensure that employees have at least minimum training for safety and that employers are at least minimally responsible for keeping their workers safe. If you think employers do these things out of the goodness of their hearts you are wrong.
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  11. skidmoda But I've never met a libertarian who can stop there.
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  12. Drew McTygue If it's not true libertarians should stop saying it.
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  13. Anti Cosmic I clarified it in other posts. I'm sorry you feel you need personalized attention and unless you stop whining I'm just going to stop responding to you.
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  14. Lil Dragon Study some history so that you know what regulations have done for us. Regulations also kept the banks stable for decades until deregulation allowed banks to almost bankrupt the country.
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  15. Lil Dragon If businesses did these things because they are good they would have done them without regulations--but they didn't. That's something else history tells us.
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  16. Lil Dragon You really don't understand what you're talking about. The regulations put in place after the great depression kept the banks stable for years until under Reagan, Bush, Clinton and Bush they started stripping away those regulations, allowing banks to mix funds and speculate using depositor money. If you're going to make these arguments you should really do some research.
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  17. Adam Fitzpatrick What was hard to understand about it. Libertarians will say that they are just fiscally conservative and socially liberal (although that's sometimes sketchy because many aren't socially liberal) when in reality there is far more to their ideas. They often espouse no government involvement in anything including consumer safety. They oppose the government even doing things like building roads. They think that businesses will act in good faith because capitalism, when we've seen from history that this isn't true.
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  18. Anti Cosmic And that is why libertarians always lose. You can't actually argue for your point so you insult people. But thanks for not responding.
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  19. Lil Dragon It's better that companies are just required to have minimum safety standards than having employees have to do vast amounts of research before they accept a minimum wage job to lift them out of poverty.
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  20. Lil Dragon It doesn't though. That's just something libertarians say but there's no actual evidence of it. If you can provide even some anecdotal evidence I would love to see it. And markets don't arrive at safety standards. Markets are about making money and there is no morality beyond that.
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  21. Lil Dragon This "are just people" isn't really an argument. That people do bad things are reason for protections not arguments against it.
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  22. ***** You go to an extreme. Government regulations on business practices are not group think.
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  23. Cryptaris Protocol And things are better now that we don't let small children have to work in mines and we have protections so that companies can't poison us without any recourse. They were even better when banks were regulated so they couldn't bankrupt our economy.
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  24. whiff1962 Did I say that? I said government regulations on businesses can, and have been good and to look at it as a black and white thing is a mistake. If it suddenly turns out that your cell phone starts shooting rays in your head that give you tumors I hope the government will regulate against that.
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  25. whiff1962 That's the thing. You have to go to ridiculous extremes to support your claim. The government should protect its citizens to the best of their abilities whenever possible. The only thing businesses actually need to do is make money--so they need to have some regulations because if not the bottom line is where it will stay.
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  26. whiff1962 Yours are extreme. You strawmanned my statement in the first place.
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  27. Lil Dragon Because deregulation was a big part of it. And we still haven't taken care of the problem.
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  28. whiff1962 Thanks for agreeing that the government can and should have a part in protecting its citizens. This protection should include protection against abuse and criminal activity by businesses.
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  29. Lil Dragon It doesn't. You don't know a company is bad until they've done bad things. If you wait until a  million children have died from a product it's too late to find out the company was bad.
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  30. Anti Cosmic Why don't you think about it a little.
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  31. whiff1962 I have never said that I feel this at all and you have never shown any proof that deregulation helps anything. You've only spouted theories that are pretty much bullshit.
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  32. Lil Dragon And businessmen are just so honest. Listen to yourself for a moment.
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  33. Lil Dragon The difference is, with companies their products can be tested before they kill.
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  34. ***** If you can't tell why that argument is extreme and actually misstates what I said I don't think you can be helped.
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  35. Lil Dragon And those are great. But they don't preclude government oversite.
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  36. ***** "Liberal worship". See, you just have to take it to a ridiculous place. I don't worship government. I appreciate it when it works and I don't when it doesn't. But I'm under no delusion that businessmen are always looking out for the good of society either. You have to make it a black and white thing where government automatically equals bad and capitalism automatically equals good. I'm saying neither one is perfect and neither one should be left without oversite. Sorry if that messes with your worship of capitalism--but then your worship of the free market is pretty stupid.
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  37. Lil Dragon Yes. I have. And again, I'm not saying the government is always perfect or right--but neither are companies.
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  38. Lil Dragon Bringing up incidents of possible government overreach does nothing to dispute that government does have a place in regulating businesses. Also, the FBI apparently figured out a backdoor anyway.
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  39. Lil Dragon It's bullshit that government isn't needed to regulate employment practices--if the government didn't do it the companies wouldn't either--history proves that. If you want anecdotes look up the Arrow Shirwaist fire. 
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  40. Lil Dragon I trust them as much or more than I do businesses-it's based on history. Government regulations for worker protections are far better than things companies usually come up with because the company is only interested in the bottom line.
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  41. Lil Dragon Your argument has nothing to do with the issue at hand. Apple's refusal to help the FBI is not proof that government regulations are bad.
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  42. Lil Dragon I've also never argued that companies are required to never question government authority. Where did you ever get the idea that I think government should never be questioned? Do you view everything in such black and white ways?
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  43. Lil Dragon That's deluded. The idea that employers and employees are equal in their power is just stupid.
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  44. luvcheney1 You've never actually had a job have you?
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  45. whiff1962 You think I'm pretty. How sweet. Libertarianism is a delusional, utopian fantasy that completely depends on business people acting in ways they never have and never will.
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  46. luvcheney1 And if libertarians are so against government involvement why do they get married (even though they try to stop gay people getting married because they don't want government involvement in marriage).  Apparently gay people should bear the brunt of that because straight libertarians aren't willing to practice what they preach.
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  47. whiff1962 And I'll give you the benefit of the doubt when you say you're not a utopian.
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  48. luvcheney1 He doesn't know what his point is. But he think I'm pretty.
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  49. whiff1962 Thank you for calling me pretty.
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  50. whiff1962 You too chubbins. It's cute though that even other libertarians can't figure out what you're trying to say.
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  51. CaleyMcKibbin Once again, if you don't agree with what libertarians say you can't be taken seriously. It doesn't matter that they've never actually shown that their theories work in the real world.
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  52. CaleyMcKibbin That's fine. I just find a lot of libertarians who will say "I'm socially liberal and fiscally conservative" when they're not even really socially liberal.
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  53. CaleyMcKibbin They will also immediately assume you don't know anything about libertarianism because obviously, if you did, you couldn't possibly disagree with it.
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  54. CaleyMcKibbin Reference to what?  If you're looking for libertarians who are not socially liberal look and Ron and Rand Paul, look at Paul Ryan. If you want people who say they are socially liberal when they are not look at many of the supporters of the people above. During the gay marriage debates there were many people who said "the government should stay out of marriage" despite the fact that they were legally (heterosexually) married so the only ones who couldn't get married were gay people and those libertarians weren't really working to get the government out of marriage so gay people would have equal access.
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  55. luvcheney1 I didn't say libertarians were at fault for that. Great strawman.
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  56. luvcheney1 Libertarians don't have that much power.
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  57. luvcheney1 Yeah. They always have been. Which again is the problem of libertarians--they live in a fantasy world.
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  58. Lil Dragon These are the kind of arguments that just make libertarians seem crazy. "There aren't real entities called "companies", there are just people. People don't always make good decisions"-which is why you need regulations.
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