Comments by "Arthur Mosel" (@arthurmosel808) on "Medical Examiner's van arrives at Champlain Towers South in Surfside" video.

Sympathy for the families involved; however, I wish that they would stop giving everyone false hopes. Given the condition of the rubble, and the existence of the fire makes any survival this late unlikely. Severe injuries, depletion of oxygen, heat and lack of water is a cocktail of death.
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@bubbles3042 My son deployed there on the 12th of Septmber. Name me one survivor found after the first day, and I suspect you can't.
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@aick I don't agree with you, but you are free to have that opinion. My feeling is that giving false hope is more dangerous to the survivors. It slows the grieving process and makes the eventual results even more painful. A more honest answer would be that there is little hope, but all efforts will continue until we can confirm either survival or death. A very unpleasant reality is that given the collapse of the floors many bodies will never be found or confirmed. The degree of damaged caused by tons of material will be very much like putting a body in a rock crusher. I am sad to say this; but once upon a time I was responsible and trained for emergency planning and response at a certain level. While the ranking official seldom like to give out this kind of word, either because they will be blamed for not doing enough to save someone, or in the extremely unlikely case there is a survivor they would be attacked for having said that as well.. In someways like the flight that hit the Pentagon on 9/11; people who ask where is identifiable parts of the plane don't understand a fully fueled aircraft in a dive hitting a reinforced concrete building designed to take artillery shells of 15 or 16 inch caliber will make mince. Wheat of the plane and occupants. In one accident that I know of an aircraft going slightly more than 100 miles an hour was turned into 30 foot high pile of metal [including 17 people on board, if i remember the number of trainees aboard) after hitting a protective pedestrian walkway at an airport.. most people are shielded from the reality of this type of catastrophe.
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@aick I stand corrected, 27 hours, and none found later. So, I was off by 3 hours. Yes, I van use Google, however I was working from memory, not looking for absolutes. Check out the results of earthquake building collapses, unless a void is found, very few survivors in multi-storied buildings of cement construction.
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@aick No, I am not saying give up, but rather be honest. False hope is worse than realizing that there is little hope. What events have you actually been involved in? I have been in hurricanes, typhoons and earthquakes (never shot at though). So, I suggest that we may have had very different training, as well as experiences. Realizing the odds of a situation and course of action, and then making the best decision to survive is the goal of someone at the operational level. How to handle the fallout after something occurs isn't the same. If you remember my comment it was that an honest comment would be that there is little hope but we will continue to all are accounted for. That hardly qualifies as giving up. If someone said there is no hope and we will no longer search is giving up. As I said, I suspect we had very different roles.
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Mince meat
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By the way, I checked Google, and as I said survival in a void is possible, especially one that can be reached. She was found in such an area, then area seems to have been identified by one of 300 search and rescue dogs used. No where near that level of resources have been deployed in this case. Also, it appears to have been a fluke (described as a miracle) that she wasn't killed outright; since only dead people were around her. She had done what she could to ensure her survival, evacuated by the safest route (stairs) and had reached a lower level (started on the 64th floor while trapped by the collapse at the 11th floor). This is what you mean by not giving up, and I agree; w hat I was talking about is equivalent to an on- scene commander briefing the media and families, a very different part of the response. What I feel that you are discussing is part of the pre- emergency training of personnel. An organization/unit needs to ensure that people are trained on what to do before something occurs. How and we hen to evacuate is part of that, something that couldn't be done in this situation. Like the earthquake that occurs in the middle of the night, the damage is done before an individual can respond. Yes, don't give up if you are in that void, try to get out if possible, knock on pipes or anything that will carry sound or yell, don't panic, these are the things that a trapped person can do. So, we are talking about apples and oranges here, both are fruit but not the same pre-event planning and training and post event actions with regards to individuals verses people dealing with the response and provision of assistance.
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@aick You got insulting. How about dealing with what I wrote in response to your post,? Oh, forgot that requires objectivity.
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@gardensofthegods The scale is different, but the biological processes are the same. The odds of a survivor drop precipitously the longer you are from the event. The affects of crushing injuries are the same, lack of water with or without injuries are the same. I won't say that there could be no survivor; but the likelihood gets smaller by the hour.
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@aick Again, where have I said to give up? I have said that the people shouldn't be given false hope. There is a large difference. By the way, 1 dead in hospital, 8 dead on site and additional remains found and a call for DNA. My "dire predictions" are based similar events. I deal in facts not emotions; and as painful as they are, given the nature of the event and when it occurred the odds were never good.
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@aick If you think that I am happy about being right you don't understand at all. I would have much preferred if none had died. We were trained to look sat things dispassionately. One of the jobs was to do surveys of aircraft crash scenes including mapping locations for mortuary affairs, you can't allow how you feel to affect how you work and think. So, yes, I am rather cold blooded about things. Chaplains and grief counselors are for the touchy feelly stuff, some people have to face the dirty part of an incident and still sleep at night.
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@aick Sorry that feelings are. Hurt, but my comments were initially involved in stating officials shouldn't give false hope something that you didn't agree with. By the way, being a mathematician is nice, but it isn't a qualification for dealing with planning for, r expanding to, and dealing with a disaster or mass casualty event.
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@aick I notice you review reverted to the imperial we and other pronouns that either imply an elevated opinion of yourself or that you are representing others. As far as your opinion of me, you are welcome to it, like the portion of the anatomy that all human kind shares.
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@aick The final defense of a beaten commenter, insults.
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@aick LOL you can't recognize your own conduct. Stop looking in the mirror. By the way insanity the first one to call you out on the imperial use of "we".
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