Comments by "" (@neutronalchemist3241) on "Beretta SCS-70 for Italian Special Forces" video.

  1. It's the SIG 540 that's similar to the Beretta AR70. Beretta and SIG parted ways because Beretta wanted a AK style action (long stroke gas action, three lugs rotating bolt) and SIG a roller delayed action. In the end SIG didn't manage to make a roller delayed action reliable enough to fire the 5.56 NATO cartridge and ended up making a roller locked gas action for the SG530. After the market failure of the SG530 SIG adopted a bolt nearly identical to that of the AR70 for the SG540.
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  2.  @stealthnoid  That was being outdated? The German army replaced the G3 in 7.62X51 only in mid '90s. The Brits replaced the FAL with the abysmal SA80 only in 1985. The Argentines are replacing now the FAL with the ARX200, still in 7.62X51.
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  3.  @TotalRookie_LV  They are front heavy. It makes the burst more controllable. Like for the BM59, the idea of the Italian Army was to really use the automatic fire, so to issue to every rifleman an "occasional light machinegun". Hence the bipod mounted on all the rifles.
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  4. Oh, well, if "a guy" said it....
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  5. What's the use of a safety if your hammer is down on an empty chamber? It's not like a round can magically appear there.
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  6.  @Cyan_Nightingale  To economically make BM59 you have first to have M1 Garand receivers to convert. Otherwise to machine a new receiver is out of this world compared to a G3 or a FAL. Beretta could make BM59 for the Italian Army because it received one of the two production lines for the M1 Garand (that of Winchester) and a ton of spare parts already produced (that's why many Beretta made BM59 have the original Winchester and Springfield markings). But in itself the BM59 is a great battle rifle. Easily the most controllable of the four in full auto. Easily the one with the best magazine (and it was straight in, not rock and lock) and the most complete out of the box (select fire, bipod, grenade launcher, winter trigger, muzzle brake). The problem was that it was a battle rifle, not an assoult rifle, but that was in common with the G3, FAL, M14...
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  7.  @stealthnoid  the 7.62X51 was what the NATO selected and used. The competitors to the BM59 were the M14, FAL, G3 and AR10, all in 7.62X51 period. It doesnt' have any sense to say that the BM59 was outdated in respect to something that couldn't exist in the west. The 5.56X45 was standardized as NATO cartridge ONLY IN 1980.
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  8.  @stealthnoid  Sorry, but you switched your argument. "Italian military individual weapons has been outdated until '90." is not "NATO military individual weapons has been outdated until '90". BTW the early studies on intermediate cartridges (IE for the Terni 1921) came from the experiences of thrench warfare and the need of automatic fire to clear trenches. When the Germans adopted the STG44 they already passed from fighting in the steppe to the forests of eastern Europe. The US switch to the M16 was due to the forests of Vietnam. In Afghanistan the GIs often found themself outranged with the M4, and had to dust off some M14. As a result of the perceived shortcomings of the 5.56 NATO, the US Army had just adopted another battle rifle, the SIG Spear. To me it's a mistake. The Spear has almost all the damning defects of the M14, and some more, but that demonstrates that the question had not been settled yet.
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  9.  @stealthnoid  It's not in opposition. It's only an elegant way to switch argument. Because if the argument was that battle rifles were outdated it would have been "battle rifles were outdated", not "Italian military individual weapons has been outdated until '90." if someone wants to say that gasoline cars are obsolete, doesn't say "Jason Smith's car is obsolete". And no. GIs were not amazed at all. The M16 had an atrocious reliability in Vietnam, due to the poor choice of the ammo's propellant. Still in the '80s the general opinion was that the M16 was a lemon. As already said: "the early studies on intermediate cartridges (IE for the Terni 1921) came from the experiences of thrench warfare and the need of automatic fire to clear trenches. When the Germans adopted the STG44 they already passed from fighting in the steppe to the forests of eastern Europe. The US switch to the M16 was due to the forests of Vietnam. In Afghanistan the GIs often found themself outranged with the M4, and had to dust off some M14. As a result of the perceived shortcomings of the 5.56 NATO, THE US ARMY HAD JUST ADOPTED ANOTHER BATTLE RIFLE IN A CARTRIDGE THAT'S MORE POWERFUL THAN THE 7.62 NATO, THE SIG SPEAR. To me it's a mistake. The Spear has almost all the damning defects of the M14, and some more, but that demonstrates that the question had not been settled yet." Can you get it?
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  10.  @stealthnoid  Put it how you want and invent any story about the M16 you want if that makes you feel more comfortable, but not pretend to sell it to others.
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  11. In the '80s selection for the 5.56 NATO rifle for the Italian Army, in the end, the AR70/90 competed with a AR15 derived rifle, the SOCIMI AR831.
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  12. It's the contrary. Beretta and SIG parted ways because Beretta wanted a AK style action (long stroke gas action, three lugs rotating bolt) and SIG a roller delayed action. In the end SIG didn't manage to make a roller delayed action reliable enough to fire the 5.56 NATO cartridge and ended up making a roller locked gas action for the SG530. After the market failure of the SG530 SIG adopted a bolt nearly identical to that of the AR70 for the SG540.
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  13.  @JR-pr1xh  Italy and Romania (licence produced) as standard infantry rifle, then it's used by the special or police forces of a dozen other countries. The derivate ARX200 had been selected as standard infantry rifle by Argentine (replacing the FAL) and Qatar (replacing the M16).
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  14. In the '80s selection for the 5.56 NATO rifle for the Italian Army, in the end, the AR70/90 competed with a AR15 derived rifle, the SOCIMI AR831. However the AR831, like the Daewoo K2, replaced the direct impingment with a long stroke gas piston with an AK-syle recoil spring over the bolt, so to use a folding stock.
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  15.  @Cyan_Nightingale  "much better" in respect to what? The BM59 was not adopted without competition, see the Franchi LF59, that in itself would have been an outstanding battle rifle, easily on par with the FAL and G3. The BM59 won because it was not inferior, thus being (for the aforementioned reasons) more economic. As said, many countries didn't adopt an intermediate caliber AR until recently. The 5.56 NATO cartridge had been standardised only in 1980. Before, it only existed the .223 Remington. A cartridge that the US Army decided to use, but not NATO standard.
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  16. The ARX 160 is currently in service.
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  17.  @skepticalbadger  To me the ARX160 is beautiful, especially the last iterations, with the more vented handguard.
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  18. There are 9mm carbines with sights up to 500m
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  19. In the '80s selection for the 5.56 NATO rifle for the Italian Army, in the end, the AR70/90 competed with a AR15 derived rifle, the SOCIMI AR831. HOWEVER the AR831, like the Daewoo K2, replaced the direct impingment with a long stroke gas piston with an AK-syle recoil spring over the bolt, so to use a folding stock.
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