Youtube comments of Iazzaboyce (@Iazzaboyce).

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  1158. A second in/out referendum: There could be no £9 million government leaflet supporting Remain 2016 ‘project fear’ will be exposed as propaganda ‘Project fear part two’ will be ridiculed The 2016 racist slurs against Leave voters would not be effective A second referendum would be seen as being anti democratic, a waste of time and money In 2016 there was huge ‘status quo’ advantage for Remain - this no longer exists Since 2016, EU leaders have made disparaging remarks towards UK Leave would argue the UK’s relationship with EU is irrevocably damaged In 2016 the perception was Remain would win - some people just like to win In 2016 Remain seemed the safer option - those in ‘two minds’ more likely to have voted Remain In 2016 Leave bus said ‘£350 million’ a second referendum Leave bus would say ‘£39 billion’ Leave would argue the UK crawling back to the EU would be national humiliation Leave would argue the UK could never be serious in negotiations with EU again UK ‘opt outs’ would be seen as worthless In a second referendum Remain would not be able to exploit the murder of female Remain MP Most under 35s would support Remain without having to go to a polling station Deceased over 55s would be replaced by new living over 55s Recently bereaved non voters would use their vote to proxy deceased Leavers Remain would have no popular leading figures... Vince Cable? Politicians on all sides would be wary of nailing themselves to the mast of a sinking Remain cause Leave leaders would look like winners deprived of rightful opportunity Leave campaigners would deride Remain as anti democratic, anti British Remain would look like bad losers and the pendulum would swing Bring it on
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  1339.  @allan2765  Here's the way I see it (and I admit It's all guess work). A GW is a big predatory fish (I do have a fair bit of experience getting smaller predatory fish to bite on things). I have observed that, a predatory fish has two methods of feeding: it scavenges around looking for dead/injured meat and it attacks certain moving prey. When a fish attacks, its brain is triggered and it uses all energy to injure/kill/eat the prey. This is an instinctive behaviour that the fish has little thinking control over. This is exampled by the many artificial lures made of metal that look nothing like fish. There is footage of GWs attacking a basic seal shape lure which doesn't much resemble any seal. I think it probably goes something like this: GWs have feeding areas where they head for when they are hungry: there's no humans in these areas - so no problems. When a GW is around where humans are swimming, GW is probably digesting a seal carcass and does not get triggered to attack. Occasionally, GW is ready to feed and encounters human in distance. The human gives off various stimuli which are sufficiently 'seal like' to trigger the GW's brain to go into 'attack mode'. Bang! in seconds the person is hit - the GW now either recognises human is not usual prey and backs off - or continues in instinctive feeding frenzy. The problem is having made the mistake the GW's orange sized brain is able to learn that, humans are a potential prey animal. I think the idea that GWs see humans as food, cannot be so. If this was the case humans would never be in the water where GWs are around - it would be the equivalent of hundreds of seals floating with blindfolds on. The GWs would soon be on them.
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  2040. This is why British are 'ex-pats': Former colonies of the British Empire: Afghanistan -1919 Antigua and Barbuda Australia-1901 -1986 The Bahamas-1973 Bahrain-1971 Barbados-1966 Belize-1981 Botswana-1966 Brunei-1984 Canada-1867–1982-(From 1949 this included Newfoundland and Labrador). Cyprus-1960 Dominica-1978 Egypt-1922 Fiji-1970 The Gambia-1965 Ghana-1957 Grenada-1974 India-1947 Iraq-1932 (British Mandate) Jamaica-1962 Jordan-1946 Kenya-1963 Kiribati-1979 Kuwait-1961 Lesotho-1964 Malawi-1964 Malaysia-1957 Maldives-1965 Malta-1964 Mauritius-1968 Myanmar-(Burma) Nauru-1968 New Zealand-1907–1986 Nigeria-1960 Pakistan-1947 Qatar-1971 St lucia-1971 Saint Kitts and nevis-1983 St Vincent and the Grenadina lines-1979 Seychelles-1976 Sierra lione-1961 Soliman islands-1978 South Africa-1910–1961 Sri Lanka-1948 Sudan -1956 Swaziland-1968 Tanzania-1961 Tonga-1970 Trinidad and Tobago-1962 Tuvalu-1978 Uganda-1962 United Arab Emirates-1971 Vanuatu-1980 Yemen-1967 Zambia-1964 Zimbabwe-1980 United States-1776. Prior to the American Revolution the 13 colonies were governed separately, these were New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina and Georgia. Current British Territories Overseas: Anguilla, Bermuda, British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, British Virgin Islands, Cayman Islands, Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Montserrat, Pitcairn Islands Saint Helena, Ascension and Tristan da Cunha, South Georgia and the South Sandwich Island, Turks and Caicos Islands.
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  2055.  @seriousthree6071  The message contained a statement of fact: "We send the EU 350 million per week" and a suggestion: "let's fund the NHS instead". The statement of fact appears to be accurate, as the UK does send this amount to the EU (confirmed by the UK Statistics Authority). Whilst, it is true that, the EU returns and uses some of this money for projects in the UK, this fact does not alter the validity of the original fact and this is particularly so, given the ‘fiscal independence’ context of the Brexit referendum. This first part of the bus message is therefore, not a lie. Now the 'suggestion'. A 'suggestion' or ‘proposal’ cannot be a statement of 'fact' under any circumstances, so this part of the bus message cannot be adjudged to be 'false'. Also a 'suggestion' cannot be a 'promise' so there can be no expectation that the terms of a referendum suggestion should be carried out by the person that made the suggestion or by a person that, concurred with the suggestion when there has been no opportunity to do so. So the bus message is not a lie. In pure fiscal terms, the bus message was entirely accurate, as the saving would be always used to 'fund the NHS' for as long as NHS was state funded and expenditure exceeded 350 million per week. This is because all government spending comes from the same coffer; moreover, the government was borrowing more than this amount to meet its spending commitments. The referendum was not a general election, the Leave supporting MPs were not going to form a government and the public fully understood this. Indeed, the only people complaining the NHS has not received this money are people that, voted to keep sending it to the EU. An example of a message that is an actual lie, is the claim made repeatedly by the Remain supporting media and Remain activists that, 'the EU funds the UK' in various ways. Of course, this is fiscally impossible, as the facts easily prove the UK has always funded the EU.
    2
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  2062.  @NB-gu9rs Why was it a lie? The message contained the word: “instead” however it did not contain the word: ‘extra’ this is always added by Remainers as a straw man. The message contained a statement of fact: "We send the EU £350 million per week" and a suggestion: "let's fund the NHS instead". The statement of fact appears to be accurate, as the UK does owe this amount to the EU (the figure was not contested by the UK Statistics Authority). Whilst the EU rebates and uses some of this money for projects in the UK, this fact does not alter the validity of the original fact and this is particularly so, given the ‘fiscal independence’ context of the Brexit referendum. This first part of the bus message is therefore, not a lie. Now the 'suggestion'. A 'suggestion' cannot be a statement of 'fact' under any circumstances, so this part of the bus message cannot be adjudged to be 'false'. Also a 'suggestion' cannot be a 'promise' so there can be no expectation that the terms of a referendum suggestion should be carried out by the person that made the suggestion or by a person that, concurred with the suggestion. So the bus message is not a lie. In pure fiscal terms, the bus message was entirely accurate, as the saving would be always used to 'fund the NHS' for as long as NHS is state funded and expenditure exceeded 350 million per week. This is because all government spending comes from the same coffer; moreover, at that time, the government was borrowing more than this amount to meet its spending commitments. So, the only people complaining the NHS has not received this ‘extra’ money are people that, voted to keep sending it to the EU. An example of a message that is an actual lie, is the claim made repeatedly by the Remain supporting media and Remain activists that, 'the EU funds the UK' in various ways. Of course, this is fiscally impossible, as the facts easily prove the UK has always funded the EU.
    2
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  2563. It's not realistic to compare the current petition to the petition against leaving the EU. The petition against leaving the EU was clearly both futile and absurd, because it occurred before the UK had left the EU and only reached a fraction of the number of Leave and Remain votes; thereby having no added meaning and only demonstrating most Remain voters had accepted the democratic position. This current petition is not about opposing a democratic binary decision, but about a fundamental pillar of our democratic system: We believe democratic governance is not just about the ability of voters to remove those in power, it's also about choosing who we give power to. Clearly, this part of the democratic process depends wholly on those seeking power to be truthful with the voters about what they are seeking to do with that power. There is a concept in democratic governance that democracy applies equally to all – if we don't get what we voted for we respect democratic authority and dissent peacefully. Our's was but one vote among many. Starmer dismissing the petition by claiming those signing the petition are not his political supporters goes against this vital communal aspect of democracy and is divisive. Alarmingly, it reveals an obvious disdain for ordinary members of society that do not agree with him. Once we have voted, how we voted is not material. What is material is we are all equal citizens with the right to decide how to cast our vote at the next election. And we have a right to express discontent with elected members who have promised us they would act a certain way and then thrown our cast votes into our faces. Labour now smugly asserts: 'The votes are in the bag – you are too late suckers – we now have all the power based on 14% of the population to attack those in society we despise.' The question here is: 'Should we (the people) be able to demand/enforce an honest democracy?'
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  2793.  @ardakolimsky7107  This is why British are 'ex-pats': Former colonies of the British Empire: Afghanistan -1919 Antigua and Barbuda Australia-1901 -1986 The Bahamas-1973 Bahrain-1971 Barbados-1966 Belize-1981 Botswana-1966 Brunei-1984 Canada-1867–1982-(From 1949 this included Newfoundland and Labrador). Cyprus-1960 Dominica-1978 Egypt-1922 Fiji-1970 The Gambia-1965 Ghana-1957 Grenada-1974 India-1947 Iraq-1932 (British Mandate) Jamaica-1962 Jordan-1946 Kenya-1963 Kiribati-1979 Kuwait-1961 Lesotho-1964 Malawi-1964 Malaysia-1957 Maldives-1965 Malta-1964 Mauritius-1968 Myanmar-(Burma) Nauru-1968 New Zealand-1907–1986 Nigeria-1960 Pakistan-1947 Qatar-1971 St lucia-1971 Saint Kitts and nevis-1983 St Vincent and the Grenadina lines-1979 Seychelles-1976 Sierra lione-1961 Soliman islands-1978 South Africa-1910–1961 Sri Lanka-1948 Sudan -1956 Swaziland-1968 Tanzania-1961 Tonga-1970 Trinidad and Tobago-1962 Tuvalu-1978 Uganda-1962 United Arab Emirates-1971 Vanuatu-1980 Yemen-1967 Zambia-1964 Zimbabwe-1980 United States-1776. Prior to the American Revolution the 13 colonies were governed separately, these were New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina and Georgia. Current British Territories Overseas: Anguilla, Bermuda, British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, British Virgin Islands, Cayman Islands, Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Montserrat, Pitcairn Islands Saint Helena, Ascension and Tristan da Cunha, South Georgia and the South Sandwich Island, Turks and Caicos Islands.
    2
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  2795. The British Empire did do some good things like build a few universities: 1592 - Trinity College Dublin, Ireland 1636 - Harvard University, USA 1693 - College of William & Mary, USA 1701 - Yale University, USA 1740 - University of Pennsylvania, USA 1742 - Moravian College, USA 1743 - University of Delaware, USA 1746 - Princeton University, USA 1749 - Augusta Academy and Liberty Hall (Washington and Lee University), USA 1754 - Columbia University, USA 1764 - Brown University, USA 1766 - Rutgers University, USA 1769 - Dartmouth College, USA 1770 - College of Charleston, USA 1772 - Salem College, USA 1773 - Dickinson College, USA 1775 - Hampden–Sydney College, USA 1784 - St. John's College (Annapolis/Santa Fe), USA 1785 - University of New Brunswick, Canada 1789 - University of King's College, Halifax, Canada 1794 - College of Engineering, Guindy, India 1802 - Saint Mary's University, Halifax, Canada 1813 - McGill University, Canada 1818 - Dalhousie University, Canada 1818 - Université de Saint-Boniface, Canada 1818 - Serampore College, India 1827 - University of Toronto, Canada 1827 - University of Sierra Leone 1829 - University of Cape Town, South Africa 1833 - Sydney Mechanics' School of Arts, Australia 1838 - Acadia University, Canada 1839 - Mount Allison University, Canada 1841 - Queen's University, Ontario, Canada 1841 - Dhaka College, Bangladesh 1845 - University College Cork, Ireland 1845 - NUI Galway, Ireland 1847 - Indian Institute of Technology Roorkee 1850 - University of Sydney, Australia 1852 - Université Laval, Canada 1853 - University of Melbourne, Australia 1853 - Ajayi Crowther University, Nigeria 1856 - University of South Australia 1857 - University of Calcutta, India 1857 - University of Madras, India 1857 - University of Bombay, India 1857 - Presidency College of Madras, India 1860 - King Edward Medical University, Lahore, Pakistan 1861 - Chittagong Cantonment Public College, Bangladesh 1864 - Stellenbosch University, South Africa 1864 - Government College University, Lahore, Pakistan 1864 - Forman Christian College, Lahore, Pakistan 1869 - University of Otago, New Zealand 1870 - Federation University Australia 1870 - University of Colombo, Sri Lanka 1873 - University of Canterbury, New Zealand 1873 - Mount Saint Vincent University, Canada 1873 - University of South Africa 1873 - Rajshahi College, Bangladesh 1873 - University of Allahabad, India 1874 - University of Adelaide, Australia 1878 - Sydney Technical College, Australia 1878 - Lincoln University, New Zealand 1878 - University of Yangon, Burma 1882 - University of the Punjab, Pakistan 1883 - University of Auckland, New Zealand 1886 - Bangalore University, India 1887 - Allahabad University, India 1887 - Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology, Australia 1890 - University of Tasmania, Australia 1893 - Maradana College of Technology, Sri Lanka 1896 - University of the Witwatersrand, South Africa 1897 - Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand 1902 - University of Khartoum, Sudan 1904 - University of the Free State, South Africa 1904 - Rhodes University, South Africa 1904 - University of Technology, Malaysia 1905 - University of Malaya 1905 - National University of Singapore 1908 - University of Pretoria, South Africa 1911 - University of Hong Kong 1911 - King George's Medical University, India 1914 - University of Mauritius 1916 - University of Fort Hare, South Africa 1917 - Patna University, India 1920 - University of Dacca, Bangladesh 1922 - University of Delhi, India 1922 - Makerere University, Uganda 1923 - Nagpur University, India. 1931 - College of Agriculture Malaya 1937 - Hong Kong Polytechnic University 1939 - Egerton University 1942 - University of Ceylon 1948 - University of Ibadan, Nigeria 1948 - University of Ghana 1948 - University of the West Indies 1948 - Technical University of Mombasa, Kenya 1952 - University of Zimbabwe 1956 - University of Nairobi, Kenya 1963 - Chinese University of Hong Kong 1984 - City University of Hong Kong 1991 - Hong Kong University of Science and Technology 2015 - University of Gibraltar
    2
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  2815. CountJimbo It's people like that are keeping the concept of racism going by insisting those you perceive to be inferior to you need your superior acceptance. There were no lies made by the Leave side, because it's against the law to provide false information as part of an election campaign. The slogan on the bus was investigated by the appropriate authority and was found to be not false information. Had it been "a lie" as you claim, it would have been stopped. The lies and unfairness was on the Remain side. For instance, having the government send a leaflet to every home in the land at a cost of ten million pounds telling taxpayers to vote Remain. This was ten million pounds over the allowed equal spending limit the Leave side was forced to comply with. The real big lie of the campaign, as repeated consistently by politicians and media was that, the EU funded various projects in the UK. This is fiscally impossible (particularly within the context of a referendum to end UK membership of the EU) as the facts show the UK has always funded the EU. Then we had all the bogus 'expert forecasts' that have since had to be revised. And the shameful exploitation of a murdered woman MP for political ends and disgusting insinuation that anyone wanting to regain national sovereignty was somehow a racist. In the end, Leave won because the Remain side had no positive message about the EU... Just elite, establishment threats and scaremongering that, has all turned out to be false, unfair propaganda.
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  3050.  @denismorgan9742  Here's a few universities built by the English while they were doing all those other bad things in other countries like building schools. churches, hospitals, orphanages, roads, railways, water systems etc. 1592 - Trinity College Dublin, Ireland 1636 - Harvard University, USA 1693 - College of William & Mary, USA 1701 - Yale University, USA 1740 - University of Pennsylvania, USA 1742 - Moravian College, USA 1743 - University of Delaware, USA 1746 - Princeton University, USA 1749 - Augusta Academy and Liberty Hall (Washington and Lee University), USA 1754 - Columbia University, USA 1764 - Brown University, USA 1766 - Rutgers University, USA 1769 - Dartmouth College, USA 1770 - College of Charleston, USA 1772 - Salem College, USA 1773 - Dickinson College, USA 1775 - Hampden–Sydney College, USA 1784 - St. John's College (Annapolis/Santa Fe), USA 1785 - University of New Brunswick, Canada 1789 - University of King's College, Halifax, Canada 1794 - College of Engineering, Guindy, India 1802 - Saint Mary's University, Halifax, Canada 1813 - McGill University, Canada 1818 - Dalhousie University, Canada 1818 - Université de Saint-Boniface, Canada 1818 - Serampore College, India 1827 - University of Toronto, Canada 1827 - University of Sierra Leone 1829 - University of Cape Town, South Africa 1833 - Sydney Mechanics' School of Arts, Australia 1838 - Acadia University, Canada 1839 - Mount Allison University, Canada 1841 - Queen's University, Ontario, Canada 1841 - Dhaka College, Bangladesh 1845 - University College Cork, Ireland 1845 - NUI Galway, Ireland 1847 - Indian Institute of Technology Roorkee 1850 - University of Sydney, Australia 1852 - Université Laval, Canada 1853 - University of Melbourne, Australia 1853 - Ajayi Crowther University, Nigeria 1856 - University of South Australia 1857 - University of Calcutta, India 1857 - University of Madras, India 1857 - University of Bombay, India 1857 - Presidency College of Madras, India 1860 - King Edward Medical University, Lahore, Pakistan 1861 - Chittagong Cantonment Public College, Bangladesh 1864 - Stellenbosch University, South Africa 1864 - Government College University, Lahore, Pakistan 1864 - Forman Christian College, Lahore, Pakistan 1869 - University of Otago, New Zealand 1870 - Federation University Australia 1870 - University of Colombo, Sri Lanka 1873 - University of Canterbury, New Zealand 1873 - Mount Saint Vincent University, Canada 1873 - University of South Africa 1873 - Rajshahi College, Bangladesh 1873 - University of Allahabad, India 1874 - University of Adelaide, Australia 1878 - Sydney Technical College, Australia 1878 - Lincoln University, New Zealand 1878 - University of Yangon, Burma 1882 - University of the Punjab, Pakistan 1883 - University of Auckland, New Zealand 1886 - Bangalore University, India 1887 - Allahabad University, India 1887 - Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology, Australia 1890 - University of Tasmania, Australia 1893 - Maradana College of Technology, Sri Lanka 1896 - University of the Witwatersrand, South Africa 1897 - Victoria University of Wellington, New Zealand 1902 - University of Khartoum, Sudan 1904 - University of the Free State, South Africa 1904 - Rhodes University, South Africa 1904 - University of Technology, Malaysia 1905 - University of Malaya 1905 - National University of Singapore 1908 - University of Pretoria, South Africa 1911 - University of Hong Kong 1911 - King George's Medical University, India 1914 - University of Mauritius 1916 - University of Fort Hare, South Africa 1917 - Patna University, India 1920 - University of Dacca, Bangladesh 1922 - University of Delhi, India 1922 - Makerere University, Uganda 1923 - Nagpur University, India. 1931 - College of Agriculture Malaya 1937 - Hong Kong Polytechnic University 1939 - Egerton University 1942 - University of Ceylon 1948 - University of Ibadan, Nigeria 1948 - University of Ghana 1948 - University of the West Indies 1948 - Technical University of Mombasa, Kenya 1952 - University of Zimbabwe 1956 - University of Nairobi, Kenya 1963 - Chinese University of Hong Kong 1984 - City University of Hong Kong 1991 - Hong Kong University of Science and Technology 2015 - University of Gibraltar
    2
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  3140. Samuel Wan Answer the following:    Would it be better for the UK Government to have control over who works in the UK or be forced by the EU to allow every European citizen to work in the UK? Is it better for the NHS to be available to UK citizens or to be forced by the EU to allow every European citizen to use the NHS? Is it better to house citizens of the UK in the UK's social housing or be forced by the EU to allow every European citizen to qualify for social housing in the UK? Is it better to allow citizens of the UK to have free school education in the UK or to be forced by the EU to allow every European citizen to qualify for free school education in the UK? Is it better to spend UK taxpayers' money in the UK or to be forced by the EU to spend UK taxpayers' money in other EU countries? Is it better to have UK laws made by elected UK MPs in the UK Parliament or for UK citizens be forced to obey laws made by unelected EU Commissioners and MEPs not elected by UK citizens in the EU Parliament? Is it better for democratically elected UK politicians to decide how to spend UK taxpayers' money or to allow unelected EU Commissioners to decide how to spend UK taxpayers' money? Would it be better for the UK Government to make trade agreements with any countries wanting to trade with the UK or be forced to trade only how the EU dictates? Is it really likely the EU would make it difficult for the UK to sell to EU countries when the UK as the World's fifth largest economy buys much more from EU countries? If, as the EU has indicated it will, the EU formed an EU Army, would it be more or less likely for UK service personnel to become engaged in a war that the people of the UK disagreed with? Do you think the UK's membership of the EU causes divisions within the UK that would be solved by Brexit? The UK is the World's fifth largest economy, do you think it's more likely to become the forth largest economy in or out of the EU?
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  3190. ***** The Telegraph has recently described the following 4 things as being “advantages” of the first past the post system (FPTP). I have provided some reasons why these so-called advantages are detrimental to the United Kingdom having a true democracy. 1) “It is easy to understand”... FPTP can appear simple, but only because its is not easily understood. For instance many people do not realise that if a person did not vote for the successful candidate their vote is automatically disregarded. Or that many of those who understand FPTP are put off voting because they believe their preferred candidate will not win and their vote will be disregarded. How many people are really aware that in each constituency every losing vote will count for nothing, along with every vote bar one in the winning candidate's majority. 2) “It can be quick to count the votes and declare a winner”... This is at best a moot point, as everyone knows that all voting systems require every vote to be counted. In any case it's hardly an issue if a better way to elect a five-year government takes a little longer to announce the results. 3) “Voters can express a clear view on which party they want in government”... This is true of every voting system with the exception of FPTP, this is because FPTP forces many to vote against a party they dislike and not for the party they would like to be in government. This is known as 'tactical voting' and is employed to reduce the possibility of a vote being disregarded and thus wasted. 4) “In a two-party system, it has normally produced a single-party government with a clear mandate to govern”... Firstly, we do not have a two-party system. Secondly, if the election method is not representative, then a 'clear mandate' actually constitutes unwarranted power. Under FPTP the 1997 General Election elected 418 Labour members of parliament (out of 650) for a 43% share of the national vote. In the 1980s FPTP delivered similarly unrepresentative majorities for the Conservative Party. 5) “It is a fair and democratic system”... No, the Telegraph didn't state this as being an advantage of FPTP - I added it for a joke!
    1
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  3327. ***** What exactly is 'least damage supposed to mean? As far as the voting system goes, I think it is highly probable that we will change to PR because people are seeing that the current system is not democratic. The Telegraph has recently described the following 4 things as being “advantages” of the first past the post system (FPTP). I have provided some reasons why these so-called advantages are detrimental to the United Kingdom having a true democracy. 1) “It is easy to understand”... FPTP can appear simple, but only because its is not easily understood. For instance many people do not realise that if a person did not vote for the successful candidate their vote is automatically disregarded. Or that many of those who understand FPTP are put off voting because they believe their preferred candidate will not win and their vote will be disregarded. How many people are really aware that in each constituency every losing vote will count for nothing, along with every vote bar one in the winning candidate's majority. 2) “It can be quick to count the votes and declare a winner”... This is at best a moot point, as everyone knows that all voting systems require every vote to be counted. In any case it's hardly an issue if a better way to elect a five-year government takes a little longer to announce the results. 3) “Voters can express a clear view on which party they want in government”... This is true of every voting system with the exception of FPTP, this is because FPTP forces many to vote against a party they dislike and not for the party they would like to be in government. This is known as 'tactical voting' and is employed to reduce the possibility of a vote being disregarded and thus wasted. 4) “In a two-party system, it has normally produced a single-party government with a clear mandate to govern”... Firstly, we do not have a two-party system. Secondly, if the election method is not representative, then a 'clear mandate' actually constitutes unwarranted power. Under FPTP the 1997 General Election elected 418 Labour members of parliament (out of 650) for a 43% share of the national vote. In the 1980s FPTP delivered similarly unrepresentative majorities for the Conservative Party. 5) “It is a fair and democratic system”... No, the Telegraph didn't state this as being an advantage of FPTP - I added it for a joke!  
    1
  3328. ***** The Telegraph has recently described the following 4 things as being “advantages” of the first past the post system (FPTP). I have provided some reasons why these so-called advantages are detrimental to the United Kingdom having a true democracy. 1) “It is easy to understand”... FPTP can appear simple, but only because its is not easily understood. For instance many people do not realise that if a person did not vote for the successful candidate their vote is automatically disregarded. Or that many of those who understand FPTP are put off voting because they believe their preferred candidate will not win and their vote will be disregarded. How many people are really aware that in each constituency every losing vote will count for nothing, along with every vote bar one in the winning candidate's majority. 2) “It can be quick to count the votes and declare a winner”... This is at best a moot point, as everyone knows that all voting systems require every vote to be counted. In any case it's hardly an issue if a better way to elect a five-year government takes a little longer to announce the results. 3) “Voters can express a clear view on which party they want in government”... This is true of every voting system with the exception of FPTP, this is because FPTP forces many to vote against a party they dislike and not for the party they would like to be in government. This is known as 'tactical voting' and is employed to reduce the possibility of a vote being disregarded and thus wasted. 4) “In a two-party system, it has normally produced a single-party government with a clear mandate to govern”... Firstly, we do not have a two-party system. Secondly, if the election method is not representative, then a 'clear mandate' actually constitutes unwarranted power. Under FPTP the 1997 General Election elected 418 Labour members of parliament (out of 650) for a 43% share of the national vote. In the 1980s FPTP delivered similarly unrepresentative majorities for the Conservative Party. 5) “It is a fair and democratic system”... No, the Telegraph didn't state this as being an advantage of FPTP - I added it for a joke!
    1
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  3384. WorkingClassTories This is the way I see those factors: 1, Labour's lead is small but FPTP is just like horse racing - only have to win by a nose to get the cup. Economy - the economy was growing in 2010 it didn't help the government then - I doubt it will this time. Yes more people will say they trust the Tories on the economy but many will still vote Labour. As for increasing employment....Where? 2, Yes many voters are becoming concerned over immigration, but these people are mostly Tory voters switching to UKIP.  Some will go back but many will not and this will cost the Tories seats in marginals. 3, True Ed is not Blair. But the Labour vote is holding up and though many Labour voters would have preferred a different leader they will still vote Labour. Also he has the advantage being a PM in waiting ahead in the polls - Cameron is looking like a loser having to hang on not able to chance a snap election. 4, The Lib Dem collapse is the left of the party that now has one choice to keep the Tories out. True (if opinion polls can be applied evenly the Tories stand to win 20 -30 seats from Lib Dems but there may be tactical voting in these constituencies because these are the Tory hating defectors. It's more probable the Lib Dem defect will be greater where Labour stand to win. 5, IN/OUT EU Labour has enough support to win so isn't bothered at the mo. 6, Scotland - We'll have to wait and see. 7, True Labour will not win in certain areas - it doesn't matter. In FPTP it's 'miss an inch just as well miss a mile'. 8, I don't think enough ex Tory voters will go back - most people don't understand our electoral system and vote for who they want to run the country. Also Tory party membership has halved in the last 7 years. Anyway didn't the Tories say we should vote for the party we want to win - in the AV referendum? Whatever we think the independent experts (Electoral Calculus) are now predicting a Labour majority of 48.         
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  3762.  @rowredround7206  You state: "We know it was a lie" but you cannot prove that assertion. The message contained the word: “instead” however it did not contain the word: ‘extra’ this is always added by Remainers as a straw man. The message contained a statement of fact: "We send the EU 350 million per week" and a suggestion: "let's fund the NHS instead". The statement of fact appears to be accurate, as the UK is obligated to send this amount to the EU (not contested by the UK Statistics Authority). Whilst it is true the EU currently rebates some and does use some for projects in the UK, this fact does not alter the validity of the original fact and this is particularly so, given the ‘fiscal independence’ context of the Brexit referendum. This first part of the bus message is therefore, not ‘false’ information. Now the 'suggestion'. A 'suggestion' cannot be a statement of 'fact' under any circumstances, so this part of the bus message cannot be adjudged to be 'false'. Also a 'suggestion' cannot be a 'promise' so there can be no expectation that the terms of a suggestion should be carried out by the person that made the suggestion or by a person that, concurred with the suggestion. So, the bus message is not a lie. In pure fiscal terms, the bus message was entirely accurate, as the saving would be always used to 'fund the NHS' for as long as NHS was state funded and expenditure exceeded 350 million per week. This is because all government spending comes from the same coffer; moreover, at that time, the government was borrowing more than this amount to meet its spending commitments. The only people complaining the NHS has not received this ‘extra’ money are people that, voted to keep sending it to the EU. An example of a message that is an actual lie, is the claim made repeatedly by the Remain supporting media and Remain activists that, "the EU funds the UK" in various ways. Of course, this is fiscally impossible, as the facts easily prove the UK has always funded the EU.
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  3908.  @quantumcomputation4963  Edward Heath signed the Treaty of Rome in January 1973 and the UK joined what was then called the Common Market. It was done on the basis of a commitment that we would retain our national sovereignty. Indeed, in June 1971, a leaflet had been sent to every home in the UK, promising that: “there is no question of Britain losing essential sovereignty”. Then, in a TV broadcast in January 1973, Edward Heath went even further saying: “There are some in this country who fear that, in going into Europe, we shall in some way sacrifice independence and sovereignty. These fears, I need hardly say, are completely unjustified.” Two years later, there was a referendum, on June 5, 1975, and the majority of voters supported the UK’s continued membership of the Common Market, now the European Union. But that vote was on the basis of assurances which were dishonest. Both Edward Heath and Harold Wilson knew that, in joining the Common Market they were ceding sovereignty and joining a political project with the end goal the creation of a federal united states of Europe. The preamble to the Treaty of Rome clearly stated that the objective was “ever-closer union”. From the release of government papers under the 30-year rule, we now know that both Labour and Conservative governments were briefed about the loss of national sovereignty. They were also warned the ultimate aim was political union across Europe. The loss of national sovereignty was confirmed by Judge Bruce Morgan on April 9, 2001. He said that, when the UK joined the Common Market parliament and the British people “quite voluntarily surrendered the once seemingly immortal concept of the sovereignty of parliament and legislative freedom”. So, when Remoaners talk about deception and misrepresentation in relation to Europe, the greatest deception of all was that it is just a ‘Common Market’ and ‘just about trade’ and not much more. That was the basis on which 67% of voters backed the European Community in 1975, but it was a lie.
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  3911.  @quantumcomputation4963  So, you claim that: “The UK is an independent and sovereign nation” Judge Bruce Morgan said the British people “quite voluntarily surrendered the once seemingly immortal concept of the sovereignty of parliament and legislative freedom”. Plainly, Judge Bruce Morgan is more capable than you to decide such matters, therefore your first point is proved wrong. You then claim it is "untrue" to suggest that voting Leave meant leaving the customs union: “asserting that it also meant leaving the customs union is untrue". Here’s what the ‘easy read version’ of the government leaflet said voting leave would mean: “What happens if we leave? Voting to leave the EU could also lead to years of not knowing what is going to happen to our trade with the EU. If the UK left the EU, our trade deals with over 50 other countries around the world would also stop. The UK would then have to make new ones. In the meantime, we could still trade with them but it could be more expensive. Agreeing all of these deals could take up to 10 years or more.” And here’s what the BBC says the EU customs union is: “A trade agreement under which two or more countries do not put tariffs (taxes) on goods coming in from other countries in the union. The countries also decide to set the same tariff on goods entering from outside the union. The EU customs union includes EU member states and some small non-EU members and forbids members from negotiating trade agreements separately from the EU. Instead trade agreements are negotiated collectively.” So, you see, read together the two paragraphs make it unequivocally true that a vote to leave the EU means a vote to leave the customs union. (“If the UK left the EU, our trade deals with over 50 other countries around the world would also stop. The UK would then have to make new ones” and “forbids members from negotiating trade agreements separately from the EU”) Thus, proving your second point to be also wrong... I can see why you don’t like people cut&pasting facts though.
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  4052.  @czarzenana5125  Some people tried to prove the '350 million' was a lie and failed: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jun/07/boris-johnson-wins-court-challenge-over-350m-brexit-claims The message contained a statement of fact: "We send the EU 350 million per week" and a suggestion: "let's fund the NHS instead". The statement of fact appears to be accurate, as the UK does send this amount to the EU (confirmed by the UK Statistics Authority). Whilst, it is true that, the EU returns and uses some of this money for projects in the UK, this fact does not alter the validity of the original fact and this is particularly so, given the ‘fiscal independence’ context of the Brexit referendum. This first part of the bus message is therefore, not a lie. Now the 'suggestion'. A 'suggestion' or ‘proposal’ cannot be a statement of 'fact' under any circumstances, so this part of the bus message cannot be adjudged to be 'false'. Also a 'suggestion' cannot be a 'promise' so there can be no expectation that the terms of a referendum suggestion should be carried out by the person that made the suggestion or by a person that, concurred with the suggestion when there has been no opportunity to do so. So the bus message is not a lie. In pure fiscal terms, the bus message was entirely accurate, as the saving would be always used to 'fund the NHS' for as long as NHS was state funded and expenditure exceeded 350 million per week. This is because all government spending comes from the same coffer; moreover, the government was borrowing more than this amount to meet its spending commitments. The referendum was not a general election, the Leave supporting MPs were not going to form a government and the public fully understood this. Indeed, the only people complaining the NHS has not received this ‘extra’ money are people that, voted to keep sending it to the EU. An example of a message that is an actual lie, is the claim made repeatedly by the Remain supporting media and Remain activists that, 'the EU funds the UK' in various ways. Of course, this is fiscally impossible, as the facts easily prove the UK has always funded the EU.
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  4177.  @seamusoflatcap “Shepherd would not be guilty of manslaughter because it would not be a reasonable assumption to say he would be aware of any faults.” So here you clearly state Shepherd is guilty solely on the basis of knowledge of faults. Yet, there is no evidence these faults have caused the boat to tip over and the court did not find so. In reality, a speedboat comprises an engine and steering mechanism if these components are faulty the speedboat cannot be operated. I doubt there is evidence to show he believed the speedboat to be mechanically unsafe. “He then knowingly let an inexperienced drunk woman take control of the boat. A boat that he knew to be faulty.” There is no legal requirement to have experience to drive a speedboat and he was supervising her driving. It seems they were both drunk. “A faulty boat that he drove at more than twice the speed limit.” So, Do you mean a very 'functional' ‘faulty' boat? The court accepted evidence that, he was not driving at the time of the accident. “There is evidence that Shepherd was driving the boat too fast.” The court accepted evidence that, he was not driving at the time of the accident. “witnesses from Lambeth Fire River service, footage from Charlotte's mobile as he was driving and not her.” The court accepted evidence that he was not driving at the time of the accident. “There is, incidentally, a witness who claims she saw Shepherd driving the boat alone, "chugging along" and peering into the water, it then veered to the bank and crashed.” The court accepted evidence that he was not driving at the time of the accident. “Charlotte's mother has previously claimed that the crash was deliberately done by Shepherd covering up her daughter's death.” She was not a witness to the scene and cannot give such evidence. The court accepted evidence that he was not driving at the time of the accident. “I dismissed it as her grief taking over but, with this other witness, it begs a question : did Shepherd lie when he said Charlotte was driving at the time of the crash?” The court accepted evidence that he was not driving at the time of the accident. We're going around in circles here with me repeating the same points over and over again yet you don't seem to grasp them.” You are the one going around in circles – even making wild assertions that you cannot prove. “This is the second strange scenario you've come up with. You say you've never said that you believe Shepherd to be innocent, yet you ignore every piece of known evidence that points to his guilt, you ignore the decision of the jury to find him guilty, you believe his unsubstantiated claim that Charlotte was driving, and you believe he has no responsibility for the safety of his passenger. You are wilfully ignorant.” I have introduced scenarios to demonstrate why I believe the law has been applied wrongly. It is you that is incapable of understanding this. I have not ignored any evidence - you have introduced supposition. I have said I believe he is not innocent, but I do not believe he is guilty of manslaughter. A High Court Judge has allowed an appeal of the original conviction based on the law being wrongly applied - I would assume that, a person does not become a High Court Judge without knowing something about the law.
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  4178. It's apparent that you don't understand the matters of law that are in question. In relation to faults causing the crash you state: “It is entirely possible” and then: “I can't say they did nor can you say they didn't” however, this does not meet the standard of proof required. So, according to your own statements a court should not find him guilty on that evidence. I have attempted to explain the conviction rests on a presumption he had a ‘duty of care’ to her and failed in this duty by gross negligence. You argue he did owe her a duty of care, because he was the owner and had some experience, but have stated: “You don't need a qualification to know when there's a fault especially an obvious one such as the faulty steering.” Exactly! You have established that he had no more reason than her to identify any fault or understand any potential danger resulting from any fault. In relation to his ‘experience’ you state: “He's the one who has owned the boat for some time and made a number of trips in it, so he's the one with experience of operating boat & that one in particular (with the faults he must have known about) many times.” So, you are really confirming that he had used the speedboat and not seen any potential danger, as one would assume he wouldn't place his own life in danger. I think the court of appeal must find he had no duty of care to her over or above driving drunk at excessive speed for the conditions, but that he had done so without consequence, as the boat had crashed when she was driving.
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  4314.  @bryangeake5826  Thing is you blame the Tories for this and that, but you skip over the fact those Tories were pro-EU activists and part of UK's 'put Europe first' problem. The woman you blame most was in support of joining the EEC (without referendum) and part of the government that joined the UK to the EEC when the Labour Party opposed. After Labour's Brexit manifesto failed at the 83 GE all main parliamentary parties of UK government became overloaded with pro-EU activists, thereby removing any realistic prospect of the people affecting that 'very' UK changing policy. In short, what I am driving at is, we were in 'Europe' with 'EU elections' 'EU politicians' and 'EU parliament' if life under the governance and in the political system of 'Europe' was making life significantly worse in terms of jobs/wages/housing and we had 10% say in the EU parliament - what else was there to blame. If 'life in the EU' wasn't 'life in the EU' - what exactly is your argument for membership? Whatever your counter arguments might be, working class people can understand that, more people bidding for employment makes it harder to find a job and causes wages to decrease. That more people bidding for housing reduces availability of houses and increases housing costs. And that, jobs, wages and housing costs are key to decent standard of living. Remain told us there were 3 million EU27 workers in the UK, yet 6.5 million EU27 workers applied to stay post Brexit. This is 10% of the UK population (never-mind the UK workforce). This is why the UK Unions and Labour Party opposed the federal Europe project before we were joined. In the end ordinary people rejected the EU because life in the EU was worse than before. Like I said a single unskilled UK wage used to be able to keep a family and buy a home. After decades of 'Europe' both parents are forced to work - go cap-in-hand for state welfare and cannot dream of buying a home. You blame pro-EU activsts - so do I - and so did the people of the UK.
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  4327.  @bryangeake5826  First let's look at the 'polls'. These are polls of small samples of people not scientifically applicable to 35 million potential votes. They ask selected questions like Are you happy with how Brexit is going? Do you feel Brexit was a mistake? Would you consider voting to rejoin the EU? We are in difficult times and people are being told Brexit is responsible. The thing is life is generally difficult and people do believe big events like divorce are regrettable mistakes it doesn't follow they would remarry their ex. Of course by the time the first two questions are answered the respondent feels obliged to agree to consider voting to rejoin. This is the rather obvious tactic of the polls - to make people think others have changed their minds. Let's place a foot into the real world: The 2016 referendum was heavily based on fear over irreversible loss of the status quo and throwing oneself into the unknown. Ordinary people were made to identify wanting to leave the EU with being racist. The campaign was even halted (for the murder of one voter) while Remain MPs and media basically accused Brexit supporters of supporting the murder of a Remain woman MP. The law was changed mid campaign to allow more Remain voters to register. The media repeated lies like The EU pays for this very good thing and that very good thing in the UK The truth was the UK had paid the EU double what the EU had awarded to EU funded projects in the UK. As I have explained, the UK government leaflet was pro-Remain and cost £9 million over the fair spend rules. It lied about future UK eurozone plans telling the UK people both that, they would not join the euro and their voting decision would matter for decades to come There were countless fear-mongering stories about planes being grounded, no medicines, empty food shelves, emergency budget, job losses, house prices and more. All the main parties of government and 85% of MPs were telling the UK people to not jump into the abyss. You need to think hard how a 'join referendum' would actually go. Who would lead this? what would the message be? I can think of ten 'bus sized' catchy slogans - any one of which would persuade most people to stay out: Let's not be forced to join the euro! Let's not be forced to obey EU laws! Let's not make the same mistake! Let's not give the EU £20 billion every year! Let's not pay even more politicians! Let's not allow millions of EU people to take UK jobs! Let's not allow millions of EU people to use our NHS! Let's not allow millions of EU people to take our housing! Let's not have a foreign president - we already have a head of state! Let's not be forced to give up our seat at the WTO! Let' be a 'united' not 'divided' UK! Let's keep UK parliament in total control! Let's not end up in the EU with Turkey! Let's work on making our UK a success!
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  4343.  @therealjetlag  Of course, it means working for what they support - what - do you also think UKIP supporters are trying to get the UK to adopt the euro? Political activists with political ideology have loyalty and work toward the success of the political organisations they support, this is sometimes called 'vision'. I did ask for one example of what you thought to be a Brexit lie cited verbatim and a demonstration with fact why you thought this, but, hey ho Lie number 2: that the EU is “unelected” I don’t think this is a lie, I know it’s a lie Fact: The EU Commission that is responsible for all EU policy for the EU parliament to vote on is not elected by a democratic vote of the EU people. Lie number 3: that it was an oven ready deal Fact: This is obviously an analogy based statement that, cannot be a lie. It would be like saying Bob's your uncle' is a lie, because you haven't got an uncle Bob. The deal was prepared to get sorted - like an oven ready meal is prepared to get cooked and enjoyed. Lie number 4: that they need us more than we need them Fact: The import and export figures of goods manufactured by and bought from each side suggest that to be a true enough statement not to be a lie. Lie number 5: that the NHS would get £350m a week Fact: The NHS gets more than £350m a week. If you mean it was claimed after Brexit the NHS would get an extra £350m per week - the UK government has confirmed this to be the case. Lie number 6: that we would stay in the single market Fact: This was not 'promised' and no one was in any position to make such a promise. The referendum was not a general election - there was no manifesto - no government ready to take office. In a referendum people not associated with the official campaign, can say what they like within the law. It's not against the law to say 'No one's talking about leaving the single market' No one was talking about joining the eurozone - but I did not believe they were not planning it - so I didn't trust them. Did you trust that statement about the single market? No - you just think other people are more stupid that you. Besides plenty of people said Brexit would mean leaving the single market. I think you said something about more 'Brexit lies' keep them coming..
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  4346.  @bryangeake5826  I don't know about all this race stuff - I have lived a while and I haven't seen any evidence the English are racist. Yes, there's a inescapable perceptible difference between people,of different race and this will flag up in various ways, but the same can be said about being tall or speaking with an accent or having red hair. There's no real harm meant in this. English white people don't consider themselves better than black or brown people and our history demonstrates this. Both my Grandfathers were career soldiers of Empire each serving five years in India, Iraq and elsewhere. My father was a career Fleet Air Arm serving in Ceylon and elsewhere. I only heard stories of affection and admiration for the people of these places. The British were never like other European countries with empires, history shows the British had respect for diverse custom and culture (OK we drew a line at throwing widows on their husband's funeral pyres). You just have to look at the White Rose Letters published in WW2 by German students which pointed out The British do not act this way against civilians Of course the German authorities quickly silenced the students under the guillotine. Or, let's look at Leroy Henry, a US GI stationed in England in 1944. A white English woman accused him of rape and the US Army court sentenced him to hang. The local English (you would call unconscious racists) began a petition, because it seemed the woman was a prostitute who had taken payment and consented to sex before making a false allegation. The petition raised 33000 signatures (before internet) and the US Army was forced to release Leroy without blemish to his record. The same year (1944) in USA they sat a 14 year old black boy (George Stinney) on a Bible on the electric chair and threw the switch while he pleaded his innocence. No we are not racist - people like you are more racist, because your superior attitude makes you bang on and on and on and on and on and on about how you think people who were not born looking like you need your help and approval to exist and you really do this, because it makes you feel good about yourself. I bet right now you support the killing of Russian soldiers because you don't like ethnic Russians voting for independence from the EU. I bet you support the pro-EU Ukraine government ban on the Russian language in education, on TV and in employment. You are so anti-racist you support the persecution of 9 million ethnic Russians.
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  4347.  @bryangeake5826  Well, I don't mind a bit of arrogance, but it must be accompanied with success - nobody has time for a big-headed loser. The point I am making about race, is there's too much unnecessary talk about it which is counter productive and even racist. It is very possible to incite racial hatred by teaching young non-whites that, white people deprived them of something. There is obvious division - if you choose to exploit this for political gain, it will backfire. Look at George Floyd - the cops didn't kill him because he was black - they killed him because they were bad cops. But, The lefty 'news' media/politicians went nuts about how white people hate black people. The US cops killed a white man (Tony Timpa) in the exact same way, but no 'cops are racist' uproar. Lots of white people have been killed by US cops and a few weeks back five black US cops killed a black man (Tyre Nichols). How is this supposed to be racist? The thing is some political activists like to make these things all about race and stir-up racial tensions. The idea is anything or anyone they don't like gets slurred as being racist and they (the accused) cannot prove otherwise. Bit like when Jeremy Corbyn wanted to make Labour policies that reflected what Labour Party members actually wanted - like nationalise the UK railway - the Labour MPs and lefty 'news' media said this was anti-semitism and now any talk in the Labour Party of socialist policies are equivalent to bringing back The Holocaust. The reason you are racist is you select people on basis of skin colour and think they should have different treatment. Like I said, the cops are just bad cops - the white ones and the black ones.
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  4363.  @bryangeake5826  You say you do accept the 2016 referendum and then immediately start telling me why you don't accept the 2016 referendum. What I meant by 'in the bank' is that result stands until it is reversed - it can not be changed in any other way than by an in/out referendum. The UK did not leave with a 'no deal' and Leave voters feel the UK is still hampered by EU restrictions. The question on the ballot stated "Should the UK leave the EU" however, NI and the UK as a whole has not completely freed itself from EU controls. The thing about Brexit is it is a massive change in UK politics and in a democracy such as ours it will take time to see how this has changed voter thinking on how the UK goes forward. The 2016 result was in effect a revolution against the ruling political class - unfortunately that ruling class has just stayed in place. The question is will the people wake up to this fact? Your Lefty news article doesn't tell us very much about this meeting other than they managed to get hold of a document revealing the meeting was "private" Why shouldn't MPs of different parties discuss Brexit? For all we know the realisation might be sinking in the UK electorate is not going to vote to join any time soon and as time goes on and the economy/living standards inevitably improve people will be less inclined to even discuss the topic. They may have all decided constantly 'blaming Brexit' is a pathetic image for a country and it's time to get on with making the UK as good as it can be. As for your hopes for a Starmer led government. I should remind you that in 1990 the polls were showing Kinnock's Labour Party to be above 50% - at the 1992 GE John Major's Tories gained 2.5 million more votes than Labour. So, we will have to wait and see. Who knows the ghost of Jimmy Savile might appear in the weeks before voting. There is also a real possibility the Torries could split over Brexit and a hundred known MPs might stand as Reform MPs giving Reform a huge nationwide boost. Have you seen Reform's 'take back British ownership' policy? A lot of Labour voters are going to like the idea of all the profits going to the NHS and UK pensions. It's just plain silly to suggest Brexit has not been a success - nothing is a success until it's had a reasonable opportunity to work. We have only really been out for 2 years. 'Sour-grapes' Remainers claiming Brexit has failed already - just makes Remainers look petulant to most people.
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  4478. The Remoaners like Channel 4 'News' always harp on about how Leave would have wanted a second referendum based on Nigel Farage saying something like, a narrow win for Remain would be 'unfinished business'. However, they are knowingly comparing two very different things here. Nigel Farage was then leader of a political party that had long campaigned for Brexit, so, in those circumstances there would be no democratic incongruity for that campaign to continue. On the other hand, parliament had voted almost unanimously to hand the decision as to whether the UK should remain a member of the EU directly and very democratically to the electorate. The government had asked the electorate to vote Remain, but promised to carry out the final decision. This is how prominent Remain supporter, Lord Paddy Ashdown described the vital importance of democracy whilst the votes were being counted: “Here’s the single point: Those that asked for this and I was the first leader ever to ask for a referendum way back in 89/90, have said so because they believe it to be an act of democracy. I will forgive no one who does not accept the sovereign voice of the British people once it has spoken. Whether it’s by 1% or 20%, once they’ve taken it, it is our duty, as those who serve the public to make the best use and to make sure that our country does the best it can with the decision the people have given us. I’ve heard Mr Farage say tonight: ‘We’re coming back even if we lose’. Excuse me! He’s the person that complained about lack of democracy in Europe! If he will not accept the sovereign voice of the British people, whatever they say, then I think he does not have the national interest at heart.” (Lord Paddy Ashdown 24 June 2016)
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  4681.  @undogmatisch5873  I cannot deal with all of that on here. The first point is easy as the then prime minister confirmed that, voting leave would mean voting to leave the single market and customs union. The second point is more complex, but easy when understood. The message contained a statement of fact: "We send the EU 350 million per week" and a suggestion: "let's fund the NHS instead". The statement of fact appears to be accurate, as the UK does send this amount to the EU (confirmed by the UK Statistics Authority). Whilst, it is true that, the EU returns and uses some of this money for projects in the UK, this fact does not alter the validity of the original fact and this is particularly so, given the context of the 'Brexit' referendum. This first part of the bus message is therefore, not a lie. Now the 'suggestion'. A 'suggestion' or ‘proposal’ cannot be a statement of 'fact' under any circumstances, so this part of the bus message cannot be adjudged to be 'false'. Also a 'suggestion' cannot be a 'promise' so there can be no expectation that the terms of a suggestion should be carried out by the person that made the suggestion or by a person that, concurred with the suggestion. So this part of the bus message is not a lie. In pure fiscal terms, the bus message was entirely accurate, as the saving would be always used to 'fund the NHS' for as long as NHS was state funded and expenditure exceeded 350 million per week. This is because all government spending comes from the same coffer; moreover, the government currently borrows more than this amount to meet its spending commitments. The referendum was not a general election, the Leave supporting MPs were not going to form a government and the public fully understood this. Indeed, the only people complaining the NHS has not received this money are people that, voted to keep sending it to the EU. An example of a message that is an actual lie, is the claim made repeatedly by the Remain supporting media and Remain activists that, 'the EU funds the UK' in various ways. Of course, this is fiscally impossible, as the facts easily prove the UK has always funded the EU. The Remainers, 'news' media and the letter from the UK Statistics Authority have used the word "extra"in order to challenge the bus message. This is deliberately misleading, as the bus message did not say 'extra' it actually said "instead" which is materially different in meaning to "extra". So the bus message was really saying: 'If we don't give our money to the EU we will have this extra money to fund our NHS'. This is not the same as saying: 'We will give the NHS extra money' it is clearly saying: 'We will have extra money to fund the NHS'. As I stated earlier the UK currently borrows more than £350m per week, so this extra money will be very useful in ensuring adequate funding of the NHS is sustainable. I have explained this in as simple a way possible. Of course, it is not helpful when the Remain side have lied so much.
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  4756. It's not realistic to compare the current petition to the petition against leaving the EU. The petition against leaving the EU was really an attempt to rerun the 2016 referendum and was clearly both futile and absurd, because it occurred before the UK had left the EU and only reached a fraction of the number of Remain votes; thereby giving no added meaning and demonstrating most Remain voters had accepted the democratic position. This current petition is not about opposing a democratic binary decision, but about a fundamental pillar of our democratic system: We believe democratic governance is not just about the ability of voters to remove those in power, it's also about choosing who we give power to. Clearly, this part of the democratic process depends wholly on those seeking power to be truthful with the voters about what they intend to do with that power. There is a concept in democratic governance that democracy applies equally to all – if we don't get what we voted for, we nevertheless respect democratic authority and dissent peacefully. Our's was one vote among many. Starmer dismissing the petition by claiming those signing the petition are not his political supporters goes against this vital communal aspect of democracy and is extremely divisive. Alarmingly, it reveals an obvious disdain for ordinary members of society who do not agree with him. Once we have voted, how we voted is not material. What is material is we are all equal citizens with the right to consider how to cast our vote at the next election. And we have a right to express discontent with MPs who have promised us they would act a certain way and then thrown our cast votes into our faces. Labour now smugly asserts: 'the votes are in the bag – it's too late suckers – we now have all the power to attack those in society we despise. The question that parliament must debate here is: Should we (the people) be able to demand an honest democracy?
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  4758.  @stephenconway2468  Data Collection and Processing Techniques Numbeo's data collection process involves a combination of user-generated input and manually gathered information from reputable sources such as supermarket and taxi company websites, and governmental institutions. The manually collected data from each source are entered twice yearly and given a weight that is three times higher than user-generated input to improve the reliability of the data. Numbeo performs both automatic and semi-automatic filters (algorithms) to reduce noise in the collected data. Numbeo restricts entries from specific IP addresses that are identified as spammers, including public proxies and Tor nodes. Some of our automatic filters use a combination of user behavior and previous data for the specific city/country to identify the likelihood of a certain input being spam. Currently, Numbeo uses more than 30 sophisticated filters to ensure data accuracy and integrity. The efficacy of each filter is enhanced as more inputs are included. Numbeo's advanced filters are designed to eliminate bias in the algorithm development process. For instance, one filter examines previously discarded data (classified as spam) and reintegrates it into the calculation if it finds that a significant subset of this data is statistically relevant. Another algorithm used to identify irregular spam data works as follows: if a single item in a city has a high number of data classified as spam, and those data have a relatively small standard deviation from users who are not classified as spammers, it suggests that these data are probably misclassified, and the algorithm corrects the classification accordingly. These filters are crucial to ensure data accuracy and objectivity. Numbeo's filtering and algorithmic technology is complex and proprietary, which limits our ability to discuss other methods in detail. In summary, Numbeo utilizes heuristic technology to maintain data quality, and regularly removes statistically improbable or incorrect data using existing data as a benchmark. Numbeo archives the values of its old data for historical purposes. By default, data older than 12 months is removed, but for popular cities, this time frame can be reduced to 3 months. If fresh data are not available, Numbeo may use data up to 18 months old, but only if our indicators suggest that inflation is low in that country. Numbeo collects and uses feedback from users to improve the methodology and data quality.
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  5011.  @cjreeve79  Your comment is an exercise in sophistry: "No, only a fool would not listen to expert opinion."......Yes, but not on the future, as no one is an expert on what has not happened.... "The whole point of the open trading block, that is the EU, makes us better off." .... What is meant by 'better off' and who will be better off and in what way according to your experts that you claim can see into the future?....."The whole point of the membership fee is to mitigate any exception." This doesn't mean anything. Trade can be free or tariff based as per agreement there is no requirement to be a member of a political federation to trade..... "I don't know about you but I spend most of the money I earn as will other EU workers." ....Here you conflate UK nationals with EU27 nationals and muddle facts. I did not say EU27 workers living in the UK do not spend money, I said they spend much of it in the EU27 at a loss to the UK economy..... "The key advantage of allowing free movement in the EU is that the most resourceful educated people come to work.".... This might benefit employers, but it does not benefit the million+ UK unemployed and underemployed that have to compete for employment, wages and housing...... "We get hard workers for very little training. Lucky us! How do the countries that trained these people benefit? This boosts the economy, which in tern creates more jobs." That should be 'turn' as a 'tern' is a sea bird. It might boost the economy if you ignore the cost of paying UK nationals to rot on the scrapheap in their charity shop interview suits..... "Yes, there are opportunities to be had outside of the EU but they are unlikely to match the benefits of being part of the club."...... Again more supposition that is politically motivated. Have you ever heard a politician saying their policies will make you 'better off'? Well, intelligent people gave up believing empty promises long ago. Oh, and how exactly are we 'better off paying' EU enforced VAT - when in the USA (that trades on tariffs) people pay purchase tax between 2.9% and 7.25%?
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  5870. Martyntd5  I believe the quote was Nigel Farage saying something like, a narrow win for Remain would be 'unfinished business'. However, you (as others have) are comparing two very different things here. Nigel Farage was then leader of a political party that had long campaigned for Brexit, so, in those circumstances there would be no democratic incongruity for that campaign to continue. On the other hand, parliament had voted almost unanimously to hand the decision as to whether the UK should remain a member of the EU directly and very democratically to the electorate. The government had asked the electorate to vote Remain, but promised to carry out the final decision. This is how prominent Remain supporter, Lord Paddy Ashdown described the vital importance of democracy and deliberately distorted the distinction between Farage's political campaign and parliament, whilst the votes were being counted: “Here’s the single point: Those that asked for this and I was the first leader ever to ask for a referendum way back in 89/90, have said so because they believe it to be an act of democracy. I will forgive no one who does not accept the sovereign voice of the British people once it has spoken. Whether it’s by 1% or 20%, once they’ve taken it, it is our duty, as those who serve the public to make the best use and to make sure that our country does the best it can with the decision the people have given us. I’ve heard Mr Farage say tonight: ‘We’re coming back even if we lose’. Excuse me! He’s the person that complained about lack of democracy in Europe! If he will not accept the sovereign voice of the British people, whatever they say, then I think he does not have the national interest at heart.” (Lord Paddy Ashdown 24 June 2016)
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  6450.  @YanksandBritsProductions  Only Remainers are saying those things it's known 'project fear' propaganda. The message on the bus contained a statement of fact: "We send the EU 350 million per week" and a suggestion: "let's fund the NHS instead". The statement of fact appears to be accurate, as the UK does send this amount to the EU (confirmed by the UK Statistics Authority). Whilst, it is true that, the EU returns and uses some of this money for projects in the UK, this fact does not alter the validity of the original fact and this is particularly so, given the context of the 'Brexit' referendum. This first part of the bus message is therefore, not a lie. Now the 'suggestion'. A 'suggestion' or ‘proposal’ cannot be a statement of 'fact' under any circumstances, so this part of the bus message cannot be adjudged to be 'false'. Also a 'suggestion' cannot be a 'promise' so there can be no expectation that the terms of a suggestion should be carried out by the person that made the suggestion or by a person that, concurred with the suggestion. So this part of the bus message is not a lie. In pure fiscal terms, the bus message was entirely accurate, as the saving would be always used to 'fund the NHS' for as long as NHS was state funded and expenditure exceeded 350 million per week. This is because all government spending comes from the same coffer; moreover, the government currently borrows more than this amount to meet its spending commitments. The referendum was not a general election, the Leave supporting MPs were not going to form a government and the public fully understood this. Indeed, the only people complaining the NHS has not received this money are people that, voted to keep sending it to the EU. An example of a message that is an actual lie, is the claim made repeatedly by the Remain supporting media and Remain activists that, 'the EU funds the UK' in various ways. Of course, this is fiscally impossible, as the facts easily prove the UK has always funded the EU.
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  6499.  @markbriten6999 It's not realistic to compare the current petition to the petition against leaving the EU. The petition against leaving the EU was clearly both futile and absurd, because it occurred before the UK had left the EU and only reached a fraction of the number of Leave and Remain votes; thereby having no added meaning and only demonstrating most Remain voters had accepted the democratic position. This current petition is not about opposing a democratic binary decision, but about a fundamental pillar of our democratic system: We believe democratic governance is not just about the ability of voters to remove those in power, it's also about choosing who we give power to. Clearly, this part of the democratic process depends wholly on those seeking power to be truthful with the voters about what they are seeking to do with that power. There is a concept in democratic governance that democracy applies equally to all – if we don't get what we voted for we respect democratic authority and dissent peacefully. Our's was but one vote among many. Starmer dismissing the petition by claiming those signing the petition are not his political supporters goes against this vital communal aspect of democracy and is divisive. Alarmingly, it reveals an obvious disdain for ordinary members of society that do not agree with him. Once we have voted, how we voted is not material. What is material is we are all equal citizens with the right to decide how to cast our vote at the next election. And we have a right to express discontent with elected members who have promised us they would act a certain way and then thrown our cast votes into our faces. Labour now smugly asserts: 'the votes are in the bag – it's too late suckers – we now have all the power based on 14% of the population to attack those in society we despise'. The question here is: Should we (the people) be able to demand/enforce an honest democracy?
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  6605. This is why British are 'ex-pats': Former colonies of the British Empire: Afghanistan -1919 Antigua and Barbuda Australia-1901 -1986 The Bahamas-1973 Bahrain-1971 Barbados-1966 Belize-1981 Botswana-1966 Brunei-1984 Canada-1867–1982-(From 1949 this included Newfoundland and Labrador). Cyprus-1960 Dominica-1978 Egypt-1922 Fiji-1970 The Gambia-1965 Ghana-1957 Grenada-1974 India-1947 Iraq-1932 (British Mandate) Jamaica-1962 Jordan-1946 Kenya-1963 Kiribati-1979 Kuwait-1961 Lesotho-1964 Malawi-1964 Malaysia-1957 Maldives-1965 Malta-1964 Mauritius-1968 Myanmar-(Burma) Nauru-1968 New Zealand-1907–1986 Nigeria-1960 Pakistan-1947 Qatar-1971 St lucia-1971 Saint Kitts and nevis-1983 St Vincent and the Grenadina lines-1979 Seychelles-1976 Sierra lione-1961 Soliman islands-1978 South Africa-1910–1961 Sri Lanka-1948 Sudan -1956 Swaziland-1968 Tanzania-1961 Tonga-1970 Trinidad and Tobago-1962 Tuvalu-1978 Uganda-1962 United Arab Emirates-1971 Vanuatu-1980 Yemen-1967 Zambia-1964 Zimbabwe-1980 United States-1776. Prior to the American Revolution the 13 colonies were governed separately, these were New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, Rhode Island, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina and Georgia. Current British Territories Overseas: Anguilla, Bermuda, British Antarctic Territory, British Indian Ocean Territory, British Virgin Islands, Cayman Islands, Falkland Islands, Gibraltar, Montserrat, Pitcairn Islands Saint Helena, Ascension and Tristan da Cunha, South Georgia and the South Sandwich Island, Turks and Caicos Islands.
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  6998. This is the Government's response to petition regarding second referendum 6 Nov 2018: The Government is clear that we will respect the result of the 2016 referendum, and that we will not hold a second referendum. A clear majority of the electorate voted to leave the European Union in the 2016 referendum. Almost three quarters of the electorate took part in the referendum, resulting in 17.4 million votes to leave the European Union. This is the highest number of votes cast for anything in UK electoral history. This was the biggest democratic mandate for a course of action ever directed at any UK Government. Parliament then overwhelmingly confirmed the result of the referendum by voting with clear and convincing majorities in both of its Houses for the European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Bill. In last year’s General Election, over 80% of people then also voted for parties committing to respect the result of the referendum - it was the stated policy of both major parties that the decision of the people would be respected. The Government is clear that it is now its duty to implement the will expressed by the electorate in the referendum - respecting both the will of the British people, and the democratic process which delivered the referendum result. The British people must be able to trust in its Government both to effect their will, and to deliver the best outcome for them. As the Prime Minister has said: “This is about more than the decision to leave the EU; it is about whether the public can trust their politicians to put in place the decision they took.” In upholding that directive to withdraw from the European Union, the Government is delivering on that promise. We recognise that to do otherwise would be to undermine the decision of the British people, and to disrespect the powerful democratic values of this country and this government. The Government therefore continues to be committed to delivering on the instruction given to us by the British people: working to overcome the challenges and seize the opportunities this brings to deliver an outcome which betters the lives of British people - whether they voted to Leave or to Remain. The people of the United Kingdom gave a clear instruction and the Government is committed to seeing that through. We will leave the European Union on 29 March 2019. Department for Exiting the European Union
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  7169. Remain propaganda Leave voters voted for different things (they didn’t they all voted Leave). Anyone wanting a controlled UK immigration policy is racist. The EU has always funded the UK (the UK has always funded the EU). Voting Leave condones the murder of Jo Cox MP. Leave voters did not know Southern Ireland was not a part of the UK. UK unemployed are either too lazy or too greedy to work as fruit pickers. The UK cannot use money the UK does not give to the EU. The EU has prevented war in Europe (there has been war in Europe). There are no plans for an EU army (there are plans for an EU army). There are no plans for Turkey to join EU (there are plans for Turkey to join EU) EU is good for UK environment (12 UK wild mammals in threat of extinction). EU is democratic (EU leaders are not voted for by EU citizens). The Leave votes of older people don't matter, because they will die sooner. Remain votes by old people are valid as life experience brings wisdom. Thinking UK electorate should decide all UK law is xenophobia. All UK citizens that did vote wanted the UK to remain in the EU. Not accepting a democratic result is ‘democracy in action’. Only economic forecasts made by anti-Brexit economists are accurate. Any professional person who supports Brexit cannot be an‘expert’. ‘No one voted to be poorer’ means everyone voted to stay in the EU. All Remain voters are economic experts that can forecast decades into the future. ‘People’ want a second vote because there must have been a mistake as ‘people’ are the majority. ‘Democracy’ is to keep on having referendums until the unelected EU Commission gets its way.
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  7273.  @tomellis4324  Laws do change - 'The Act of Union' was law and the Irish government signed it. I'm going to take a guess that, you think that law should have changed - yet we both know some would prefer it did not and I hope you will accept that everybody should be able to have a political opinion. Yes, I already know the vast majority of Irish people get along with English people - sadly, there are some that hate the English. The 'back door' is easy. In the early 70s when ROI and UK were joining the EEC those 'English haters' opposed 'further' union with the English and anyone else. However, over time they began to realise that a federal Europe would gradually destroy English/UK sovereignty, a Single Market and Customs Union would erode the Irish border, UK adopting euro and single currency would be a massive step toward a united Ireland. And the island of Ireland would be able to gain financial support from the wealthy EEC/EU countries that included the English and get to vote against English MEPs in a parliament. Also, ROI and some NI MEPs could complain to other members about their 'oppression' at the hands of the English. In short - they believed all this would lead to the UK being forced to give up on Northern Ireland. And this is why some Irish are so rattled by the UK leaving the EU. The GFA (if you prefer) and threat of republican violence was used (erroneously) by Remainers in EU and UK governments as a propaganda fear weapon to achieve another UK referendum to prevent Brexit/hard Brexit. Like I said, the GFA does not say anything about the border or trade. There's no reason why EU/UK trade could not be regulated over the Irish border. The GFA accepts ROI and NI are separate countries and it is quite normal and accepted practice for separate countries to regulate trade. The CTA is not affected by this.
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  7583.  @redshift1053  13 December 1997 Luxembourg Council declares Turkey eligible to become an EU member. 11 December 1999 Helsinki European Council declares Turkey a candidate country. 24 March 2001 Council adopts Accession Partnership for Turkey. 19 May 2003 Council adopts revised Accession Partnership for Turkey. 16 December 2004 European Council declares that Turkey sufficiently fulfils the criteria for opening accession negotiations beginning in October 2005. 3 October 2005 Council adopts negotiating framework and negotiations are formally opened. Screening process begins. 1 June 2006 Negotiations are opened and closed on Chapter 25 – Science and Research. 11 December 2006 Because Turkey refused to apply to Cyprus the Additional Protocol to the Ankara Agreement, Council decides that eight chapters will not be opened. Main article: Cyprus dispute 19 February 2008 Council adopts revised Accession Partnership for Turkey. 30 June 2010 Negotiations are opened on Chapter 12 – Food Safety, Veterinary and Phytosanitary Policy. 17 May 2012 Positive Agenda intended to bring fresh dynamics into the EU-Turkey relations was launched. 5 November 2013 Negotiations are opened on Chapter 22 – Regional Policy and Coordination of Structural Instruments. 16 December 2013 Visa liberalisation dialogue launched and EU-Turkey Readmission Agreement signed. 29 November 2015 First EU-Turkey Summit held and Joint EU-Turkey Action Plan activated. The EU welcomes Turkey's commitment to accelerate the fulfilment of the Visa Roadmap benchmarks in return for halting the flow of Syrian refugees from Turkey to Greece.[24] 14 December 2015 Negotiations are opened on Chapter 17 – Economic and Monetary Policy. 30 June 2016 Negotiations are opened on Chapter 33 – Financial and Budgetary Provisions. 24 November 2016 MEPs vote overwhelmingly to suspend negotiations with Turkey over human rights and rule of law concerns. 6 July 2017 EU parliament called for the suspension of accession negotiations with Turkey. 20 February 2019 EU parliament committee votes to suspend accession talks with Turkey. 13 March 2019 The European Parliament unanimously accepted the call for the suspension of full membership negotiations between the EU and Turkey. 18 July 2023 The EU has decided not to restart accession negotiations with Turkey. So, you see in 2016 Turkey was joining the EU - it was just after the UK referendum result the EU started making it appear otherwise..
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  7771.  @pudpullertm  All of those things you mention are valid reasons to vote to leave the EU. I cannot deal with each here, however, I will explain why your first assertion (that the message on the Leave bus was a lie) is not true. The message contained a statement of fact: "We send the EU 350 million per week" and a suggestion: "let's fund the NHS instead". The statement of fact appears to be accurate, as the UK does send this amount to the EU (confirmed by the UK Statistics Authority). Whilst, it is true that, the EU returns and uses some of this money for projects in the UK, this fact does not alter the validity of the original fact and this is particularly so, given the context of the 'Brexit' referendum. This first part of the bus message is therefore, not a lie. Now the 'suggestion'. A 'suggestion' or ‘proposal’ cannot be a statement of 'fact' under any circumstances, so this part of the bus message cannot be adjudged to be 'false'. Also a 'suggestion' cannot be a 'promise' so there can be no expectation that the terms of a suggestion should be carried out by the person that made the suggestion or by a person that, concurred with the suggestion. So this part of the bus message is not a lie. In pure fiscal terms, the bus message was entirely accurate, as the saving would be always used to 'fund the NHS' for as long as NHS was state funded and expenditure exceeded 350 million per week. This is because all government spending comes from the same coffer; moreover, the government currently borrows more than this amount to meet its spending commitments. The referendum was not a general election, the Leave supporting MPs were not going to form a government and the public fully understood this. Indeed, the only people complaining the NHS has not received this money are people that, voted to keep sending it to the EU. An example of a message that is an actual lie, is the claim made repeatedly by the Remain supporting media and Remain activists that, 'the EU funds the UK' in various ways. Of course, this is fiscally impossible, as the facts prove the UK has always funded the EU.
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  7910.  @fundorgon  Printing a false statement in capital letters does not make it true. The message on the bus contained a statement of fact: "We send the EU 350 million per week" and a suggestion: "let's fund the NHS instead". The statement of fact appears to be accurate, as the UK does send this amount to the EU (confirmed by the UK Statistics Authority). Whilst, it is true that, the EU returns and uses some of this money for projects in the UK, this fact does not alter the validity of the original fact and this is particularly so, given the ‘fiscal independence’ context of the Brexit referendum. This first part of the bus message is therefore, not a lie. Now the 'suggestion'. A 'suggestion' or ‘proposal’ cannot be a statement of 'fact' under any circumstances, so this part of the bus message cannot be adjudged to be 'false'. Also a 'suggestion' cannot be a 'promise' so there can be no expectation that the terms of a referendum suggestion should be carried out by the person that made the suggestion or by a person that, concurred with the suggestion when there has been no opportunity to do so. So the bus message is not a lie. In pure fiscal terms, the bus message was entirely accurate, as the saving would be always used to 'fund the NHS' for as long as NHS was state funded and expenditure exceeded 350 million per week. This is because all government spending comes from the same coffer; moreover, the government was borrowing more than this amount to meet its spending commitments. The referendum was not a general election, the Leave supporting MPs were not going to form a government and the public fully understood this. Indeed, the only people complaining the NHS has not received this money are people that, voted to keep sending it to the EU. An example of a message that is an actual lie, is the claim made repeatedly by the Remain supporting media and Remain activists that, 'the EU funds the UK' in various ways. Of course, this is fiscally impossible, as the facts easily prove the UK has always funded the EU.
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