Comments by "D Mc" (@dmc8092) on "The Issue of Free Speech in Science (Pt. 2) | Jerry Coyne | ACADEMIA | Rubin Report" video.

  1. I don't know why Milo is wanted on college campuses in the first place. What value does he actually bring other than being provocative?
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  2. German Realist The thing is, what Milo and many of his fanboys seem to think is that freedom of speech means you also don't get social repercussions. They think freedom of speech means you can harass people and that no one is supposed to be able to say anything about it. I think it's stupid for these groups to get people removed from speaking engagements--but they do have the right to protest. I think it would be better not to shout people down while they're speaking and it only gives Milo what he really wants--which is attention--but many of the people who claim they are for freedom of speech think that it ends once the person they agree with speaks.
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  3. Matthew Morton You say a lot of things that use a lot of words and don't mean anything. Of course athiests can be dogmatic--so what? That still doesn't mean there is any proof of the existence of any god and so believing in something without evidence doesn't make you crazy but it does mean you have an irrational belief. That you are projecting this idea of irrationality onto something that is simply stating that you don't believe in a god because there is no evidence is, once again, irrational.
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  4. TheSovereign500 Does the more immediate threat come from the left? How so? When you consider that Trump has put a gag order on scientists keeping them from reporting their findings are you seriously saying the threat is coming from the left?
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  5. jdnels81 Wait for what? He's already done it. What do you need to wait for? He's not just paying lip service to the right, he's doing what they want him to do. There are actions that you can look at and see what he's done.
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  6. Jesse Sewell You're saying that Jerry Coyne is irrational?
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  7. Jesse Sewell It seems like the whole Trump campaign was based on the idea that America is deeply flawed so it seems like you can't paint just the left with that brush. And you also can't call faith rational because it is belief in something when there is no proof of it.
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  8. TheAnnoyingGunner Milo doxes students from the stage opening them up to harassment--that goes beyond free speech to inciting. That crosses a line for me. He doesn't need to do that to put his point across--he does it because it grabs attention and that's what he really wants.  Also, the UC Davis thing wasn't an issue of freedom of speech. The college shut it down for safety concerns--just like when Anita Sarkeesian cancelled her speech at a Utah college because someone had threatened to shoot the crowd and the college couldn't provide security.  The students who protest Milo have a right to do so.
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  9. Irek Cz. "Yes they are expressing their freedom of speech but they use it trying to suppress other people right to free speech" So are the "Happy Holidays" boycotters.
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  10. There is also a thing such as lesbians. I know quite a few of them.
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  11. But to be fair, evolutionary psychology does not have the backing evidence that evolutionary biology has.
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  12. It is also possible that in the way our culture evolved it's less important to have perfect eyesight or great strength than to be intelligent.
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  13. Of course, Matthew, you only watch things that will confirm your preconceived biases.
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  14. Jesse Sewell I'm sure if he was on a show where the host asked follow up questions he might have more to say on that issue. It certainly does go to the level of irrationality.
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  15. Matthew Morton Once again, lots of noise signifying nothing.
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  16. Peter Mogensen Just a lot of blather.
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  17. Actually though, there have been many cases where rapists do get off more easily than other crimes.
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  18. @c30f$p@d3z It seems like we really have to parse either way. There have recently been several cases where people--especially people of means got away with rape or received very minor sentences.
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  19. German Realist Milo's followers don't offer anything of value other than insults. They have the right to do that but others have the right to criticize them. And if they do it on a privately owned social media site that company has a right to decide what kind of speech they want. Milo's "freedom of speech" is all about provocation. He really doesn't offer anything of value beyond driving certain ideological nutty young adults crazy. There are people who do the same thing as Milo and say it much better.  Also, the people who claim to be such defenders of freedom of speech can be just as bad. Look at the threats whenever Anita Sarkeesian has a speech. I am not in any way defending her--just pointing out that it's not single sided.
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  20. ***** None of that happened. You're believing "alternate facts" here. The police department has said that none of that happened. There is no evidence of it happening--because it didn't happen.
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  21. Jesse Sewell I don't care about his beginnings. The fact is that he shows poor judgement. Once he targets an individual student on a college campus, shows their photo, gives their name and points them out to his fanboys he knows what those fanboys will do. If he actually was just giving speeches and using those facts and research to make fools of feminists and SJWs I wouldn't care--but he takes an extra step and encourages the targeting of vulnerable people on college campuses. I don't think he should be allowed on these campuses at all. Whatever value he might have as a free speech advocate is diminished by his using that to target individuals.
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  22. Jesse Sewell Also, I know who he is and where he came from and I still don't see the value of him as a speaker on college campuses. There are many people who can talk on the issue of free speech who don't cause danger to students on campus.
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  23. Jesse Sewell By putting up the photo of a trans student who goes to the very college he's speaking at. Telling the audience the person's name and pointing out that this is a person who should be harassed. That's incitement and to not admit that is just disingenuous. He knows what his fanboys do because they've done it over and over.
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  24. + bluone black I don't know who you're talking about but, no.
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  25. +kabes The college shut down the UC Davis event because so many protestors showed up that they couldn't guarantee safety. Those students had the right to protest. They did not commit any violence and they stayed outside the venue. Especially considering Milo's history of targeting individual students and exposing them to harassment I think they are justified in protesting him. It's hard because everyone here has the right to freedom of expression. But, if it's any consolation Milo is still allowed to express himself and continues to do so. He revels in this sort of thing and acting like a victim.
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  26. I do think protestors are wrong when they go into the event and scream and don't allow the speaker to talk, but that's not what happened at UC Davis. Whether you think the college was wrong for shutting down the event is another matter.
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  27. +kabes When he whines about how his speeches are shut down when that is actually what his ultimate goal is. He could give these speeches without putting students on the campus in danger--but he doesn't do that because he wants to stoke the flames and doesn't actually care that he is endangering anyone. But, then he whines about how his freedom of speech is being oppressed.
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  28. I also think it's interesting that all you supposed free speech advocates are freaking out so much about campus feminists and transgender people when you fucking Daddy Trump is currently preventing scientists from presenting their research--that's a far more dangerous threat to freedom of speech.
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  29. He points the finger at SOME people who are against free speech. He's certainly not pointing the finger at Trump preventing scientists from presenting their findings. Also, those students who protest also have free speech and it just so happened that there were so many of them the college saw it as a security issue. He still has his freedom of speech--none of the people he doxes onstage so that his fanboys can and will harass them have the kind of platform he has. Freedom of speech doesn't mean that you get to say whatever you want and everyone else has to shut up. Sorry, freedom of speech goes all ways.
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  30. Point me to the videos where he calls out the right for trying to stop people's freedom of speech. Point me to the video where he takes the Trump administration to task for shutting down scientists releasing their research. College SJWs are easy targets. Point me to where he criticizes the people who boycotted businesses for saying "Happy Holidays", point me to where he criticizes 1 Million Mothers. Go ahead, point me to any of those.
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  31. He could also be speaking out against the laws Republicans are trying to pass that would make it illegal to protest at all or that would make it okay for people driving cars to actually run over protestors. Again, he's really only for selective freedom of speech. If you keep having to make excuses for Milo, maybe he's really not such a great spokesman.
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  32. There's a million things he could talk about but he doesn't because his commitment to freedom of speech is a skin deep act. His fanboys get all upset at college feminists and transgenders while ignoring actually dangerous threats. He's a distraction--and you re the distracted.
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  33. ***** Seeing as how I'm not a public speaker celebrity who goes around pretending to be a champion of free speech your comment is just silly and childish. I'm sorry your hero has feet of clay but it's not my fault you chose to buy all the bullshit he pushes without questioning.  I know it's hard for you to have to reevaluate all the things that you've devoted so much of your unquestioning brain to but you'll just have to deal with that.
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  34. Jesse Sewell I disagree. His methods are those of a bully they are not intellectually rigorous and are just showboating. His command of evidence and facts is selective. And college campuses are within their rights to ban him considering he opens up individual students to harassment and possible violence. His "truth" is again, selective. He does not call out abuse of freedom of speech in all its forms--only very specific targets that he has gotten a lot of attention for. He goes nuts over transgender students while dismissing the abuses of our government. He's a hollow man.
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  35. Jesse Sewell He is completely a provocateur and is not intellectually rigorous. He condemns the SJWs on the left but not those on the right--many of whom have a far bigger impact than these college students. He doesn't seem to care about freedom of speech when it's someone calling in a threat to an Anita Sarkeesian speech at a college in Utah. He doesn't care that Christians are boycotting businesses who say "Happy Holidays". He is really only interested in mocking feminists and transgender people and his science on the transgender issue is crap. Also, this "command" of facts he has is also selective. It's not like there is someone fact checking him as he goes along on tv shows. It's easy to overwhelm someone if you throw a whole bunch of information at them and then expect them to respond. It's called a Gish Gallop and it doesn't mean the galloper is brilliant.
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  36. Jesse Sewell Also, the minute he doxes a student from the stage and says her name the college should ban him. There are better people to speak to this subject.
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  37. blueone black, I'll continue criticizing him. That other students invited him is unimportant. Once he doxes a student and puts out that students name knowing full well that his fanboys will then harass this student he shouldn't be allowed on campus. He is also a hypocrite when it comes to freedom of speech--he only defends SOME speech.*****
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  38. ***** Milo uses threats as much as any feminist SJW.
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  39. Irek Cz. He brings them up in dishonest ways and has a reputation among certain people as a crusader for freedom of speech when, in reality, he just mocks easy targets and is a crusader for a very thin strand of freedom of speech. There are people who bring up the same things as Milo but do it much better. There is no reason for him to be on a college campus.
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  40. ***** Seeing as how that wasn't my argument I don't know why you're moving the goal posts. I'm saying he shouldn't be on college campuses because he has targeted specific students from his platform which puts them in danger. There are better people to have address this issue than Milo.
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  41. ***** He also claims to be a champion of free speech at the same time he supports Trump who is preventing scientists from reporting their discoveries and stamping down on the freedom of the press--that seems pretty dishonest, although that was never my point.
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  42. Irek Cz. Bullshit. He hates it when SJWs suppress freedom of speech but doesn't care when the right does it. Prove me wrong. Show me where he railed against the people who boycotted stores because they didn't say "Merry Christmas" enough (he actually came out in favor of these conservative SJWs). Show me where he's come out against Trump's current ACTUAL offenses against freedom of speech which are really abuses because it's coming from the government. He, and you, are so far up your butts that you actually think you're for free speech when you're really just for narrowly defined free speech.
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  43. ***** I will agree. I will also say that, in reality, neither does he. I am fine with Shapiro on college campuses because he doesn't put individual students in danger. He is also more ethically consistent than Milo. He would be a much better choice for these groups to have on college campuses, although I think he's wrong on many things. He seems to be okay with the government being involved in the lives of LGBT people even though he wants it out of religion and businesses.
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  44. ***** Yes. The SJWs on college campuses are anti-free speech and so is Milo!  Common ground.
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  45. ***** The things he hasn't said show that he's selective. Its fine to say he's a champion of freedom of speech when SJWs are against it, but leave it there because he's not fighting against the Trump gag orders on scientists working on climate change. So, he's a champion of free speech in limited circumstances.
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  46. ***** But you're right, Ben Shapiro is better.
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  47. Irek Cz. In that case, the SJWs who protest against Milo are also just using their freedom of speech. So, this shows that Milo is actually anti-freedom of speech. Thanks for making my argument Irek.
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  48. When you're talking about "free speech" in science you're talking about acting like the things that people pull out of their asses are the same as things that people study for years and years and prove to be true.
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