Comments by "Taint ABird" (@taintabird23) on "Brexit: How did we get here?" video.

You got here because you never came to terms with winning the war and losing an empire; Germany and the liberated nations of Europe grew prosperous while the UK almost went bankrupt. Brexit is the politics of self-pity.
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@CastAirLead I have nothing to be ashamed of. Europe has had a troubled past, but has moved on in peace and solidarity. The UK hates that solidarity, because as one of its richer members, it pays for it. The English in particular do not see themselves as equal in the EU - they feel superior. To those who feel superior and exceptional, such equality feels like oppression. EU Oppression is an invention of the Brexit elite.
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@ Fintan Stack Communism is dead and has been for three decades in Europe.
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@king dong How could there are so many British immigrants - sorry, 'ex-pats' - in every EU country? Some of those fuckwits actually voted for Brexit because the UK was being 'over-run' with foreigners. 'lol', indeed
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@Freeze Peach They would have their self-respect. Brexit takes no account of the fact that Scotland and Northern Ireland voted to remain. Give that devolution indicates that there is a diminishing UK Demos, this will have consequences for the United Kingdom. Brexit is the greatest exercise in national self-harm since the Easter Islanders cut down their last tree.
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@ king dong Of course I work. Play the ball, not the man unless you wish to expose the poverty of your argument.
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@ Frazer Duncan Bollox. The EU has been the scapegoat for the failures of domestic politics in the UK for 45 years. Democracy? Brexit is the undefined, negotiated by the unprepared in order to get the unspecified for the uninformed. Some advertisement for democracy.
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@king dong Got anything to contribute to the conversation? Or do you want to continue to shoot the messenger? I'm a busy man.
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@john kelly The English idea that the Celtic Fringe would be nothing without the England is an old trope. The irony is, that while Brexit is mainly an English brain fart and aspires to 'sovereignty' and 'independence', it does not extend to the Scots or the Northern Irish. British 'sovereignty' 'freedom' and 'independence' is an English aspiration. Why? Because the English have yet to grow a pair, admit they are an actual nation themselves, and become truly independent of the UK. Instead Brexiter English, many of whom identify with being English first and British second, hide behind the security blanket of the Celts.
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@ Soggi Biscuit You sum up the self-pity behind Brexit succinctly - very well done and best of luck with your 'war'.
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@ yes I'm confusing nothing. The European Union IS united - you only have to look at how the 26 backed Ireland in relation to the border to see it. Brexiters expected the EU to throw Ireland under a bus because it was small and it was assumed that the Germans would hold it in the same contempt as the Brexiters did; they expected an EU squabble about concessions to the UK in order to give it a 'cake and eat it' deal; if all else failed, the cavalry in the shape of Audi, Mercedes and BMW would ride into the fray at the 11th hour... The EU has never flinched. You describe Brexit as a type of 'crusade' to save Europe from itself - it is nothing of the sort. It the self-serving agenda of an elite cabal in your country that are intent on gambling with your future in order to expand their personal wealth. These people are gamblers by profession, they are Brexit proof, and if/when it falls flat on its face, Brexit will simply be added to list of England's heroic failures which includes Dunkirk, The Charge of the Light Brigade, Scott in the Antarctic, the Franklin expedition etc. Your explanation of Europe is full of age old English tropes about Europe: England v Europe, Protestantism v Catholicism, Freedom v Tyranny etc. You stopped short of the usual conclusion, working your list of through to Napoleon and Hitler Nothing to see here.
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@ Greg Sturmer I'm 97% Irish/Scottish and 3% English. It cost me £50. So what? The UK couldn't manage its war debt, while Germany rebuilt itself from the stone age in 1945 to have an economy that was larger than the UKs before 1960, continued to fork out its reparations for the First World War until it was paid off in 2010 and came to terms with its past. The UK got themselves a bail out from the IMF in 1976 and were the least productive major economy in Europe. It has never come to terms with losing its empire. For that, the English Brexiter has a chip on his shoulder. DNA has nothing to do with it - its all about the politics of self-pity.
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@ yes The English can't use their democracy to decide the future of their neighbours any more - you will do well instead to sort your own problems.
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@ yes Brexiters have been heralding the future victory of EU leavers in France, the Netherlands and Italy since June 2016. Elections came and went and the England remains alone. You must love that. Standing alone. Thanks for the list of the UKs achievements. They're not much use where the UK is going...
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@ Hercule Holmes You did not give up your empire voluntarily, as you claim. The Atlantic Charter, dictated by the Americans and signed by Churchill gave the commitment allowing self-determination for all peoples. This is an American value, not a British one. The English are fine with the subjugation of others as part of the Empire - apparently it was the nicest empire in human history - they only claim to value democracy and freedom when they imagine they are being oppressed themselves. Incoherent buffonery. You better get used to the idea of the UK going bankrupt: post Brexit, the UK will have higher inflation, less purchasing power, a weaker pound. The UK has a huge set of imbalances, huge trade deficits, huge budget deficits, people are living way above their savings and they have to pay it back too much consumer borrowing – the household budget is getting worse, the trade deficit is getting worse, their borrowing is getting worse, at a time when they are leaving their biggest market with its economies of scale; inflation will mean it will be harder to pay it back. Project fear? Project reality that is pending...
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@ bear jokes How can a country that had an empire claim that self-determination is 'a British value'? It is a value you intended only for yourselves. Your empire was built the backs of subjugated peoples who never invited the English to show up in their part of the world and exploit them and their resources to enrich England. The Americans had to fight a war for their self-determination and independence from a country which you claim invented the value. They were so serious about their values, they wrote them down in a Constitution. The English were so serious about the value of self-determination they tried to prevent the Americans from having it. The Indians, the Irish and others would have a different perspective on your mythical past. Churchill himself was unhappy with the Atlantic Charter, but as the US was calling the shots and the UKs back was against the wall - just like they will in their future trade agreement with the UK - he had no choice but concede. Its hilarious - the citizen of a former imperial power thinks self-determination is a value of his country.! Brexiters and their fantasies.
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@ Steve Ross Brexit is the greatest exercise in self-harm since the Easter Islander cut down their last tree. What is Tyrannical is the fact that Northern Ireland and Scotland must leave the EU against their will simply because insecure self-pitying English people out number them. Democracy, my arse. I give the UK 20 years if its lucky.
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@alfa8fake2 I never mentioned sovereignty; the fantasy of oppression by the EU is a product of self-pity. The English are in a sulk. 'We liberated Europe and look at the thanks we got.'
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@ Rich William The British legal system was unaffected by EU membership; membership of any EU Army is optional. Brexit is not happening because it is based on a pantomime script which people like you bought into: we English are superior, they need us more than we need them, we are exceptional and can have our cake and eat it. This was the aspiration. But there was no Plan A execute the fantasy.
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@rivolinho Don't worry, my expectations of them are low!
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@zoreto LOL! Brexit has nothing to do with sovereignty. That is simply the package it comes in so that those millionaires peddling Brexit can co-opt the masses in their own oppression Your elite have always done this. The financial markets control our sovereignty; All 164 members of the WTO will have a say on the UKs WTO Schedule; the UK will be the junior partner in all trade agreements with larger markets and will have to take what it is given. You will be poorer, more disappointed and just as invisible to the US and the Chinese, whom you think you are like, as you are today. But at least you can pretend it was a Heroic Failure.
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@ CastAirLead Your claim that you don't see much solidarity over the channel is a form of denial, an essential ingredient of Brexit. The European Union IS united - you only have to look at how the 26 backed Ireland in relation to the border to see it. Brexiters expected the EU to throw Ireland under a bus because it was small and it was assumed that the Germans would hold it in the same contempt as the Brexiters did; they expected an EU squabble about concessions to the UK in order to give it a 'cake and eat it' deal; if all else failed, the cavalry in the shape of Audi, Mercedes and BMW would ride into the fray at the 11th hour... The EU has never flinched. The UK is the one that has abandoned EU solidarity, resenting its payments that help to bring up living standards in other EU countries. Many ordinary Brexit supporter resent these payments as their own living standards have been allowed to decline in the 5th richest economy in the world. JRM, Farage and the other camp clowns merely focussed them on the usual trope for their own ends: its Europes fault. Now these people, people like you, actually believe you will have a better life once the EU is out of your lives; instead you will place your trust in the very people who are responsible for the very grievances you kicked out against. When will the penny drop? I've the popcorn in for when it does.
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David Davis was given the job and seems to have achieve precisely none of his aims. Of course, he blames somebody else. He was way out of his depth. The other idiot, Johnson, was Foreign Secretary and a national embarrassment. I was embarrassed by him and I'm not even British. Farage ran for the hills after the referendum and is not in the government. Cowards all!
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@ zoreto If you wish to leave a union that does not reflect European values then its the UK you need to leave.
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@ keyser soze Your destiny is in the hands of others, just like every other middle sized country in the world. My knowledge has been garnered from observing the British over several decades. Don't worry, there is a rich tradition of heroic failure in English culture - you will be able to add Brexit to it.
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@ bear jokes You still here? 'I want the total destruction of the E.U.' You want the total destruction of the EU simply because the EU flatly rejects Brexiter notions of exceptionalism. Having suffered for years as a mere equal to other members, the English drama queen has failed to get the EU membership to engage in its narcissistic pity-party. Therefore it must be destroyed. Brexit is the politics of pity.
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@ Stephen Lediard Oh dear. That does not inspire confidence in Brexit, does it.
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@ Dave Wilson You had no plan for leaving the EU, only an enormous sense of entitlement and self-pity. Everything is somebody else's fault. Imagine, English people genuinely believed they were entitled to have their cake and eat it.
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They reckon the TV and furniture belong to them, because the won WW2 and once had an empire which they miss.
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@ Stepehn Lediard Because they didn't have a plan. Is it not obvious? They didn't have a plan because they didn't actually expect to win.
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@ Zoreto The fact that the EU is a democracy is a given. Could it be more democratic? Of course. The idea that the UK with its unelected House of Lords, semi-theocratic constitutional monarchy and first past the post electoral system is some sort of vanguard for democracy in Europe is something you will need to explain. If you wish to be a European democracy, you need to be a republic. It does not help your cause that your country is also clueless in the exercise of referenda. The Brexiter desire to see the EU destroyed is a mere hissy fit. You cannot control the EU and you're only being treated as a mere equal falling short of the high regard which you hold yourselves, therefore you must destroy it. Pathetic really. Brexit is the politics of self-pity.
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@ Toffee Crisp First of all, thank you for the compliment. I cannot see into the mind of every person who voted, and I don't pretend to do so. What I express my observation of the culture that produced the mindset of a person like you. This is not a personal attack upon you but a critique of the culture you live in. It is also a critique of the shysters among your elite who prepared the ground for the confidence trick that is being played on you over many decades These are the people who are responsible for this mess and for the mess in your country that they blamed on the EU. You know the Leavers in the Tories never expected or intended to win, right? That is why after 40 years the euroskeptics never thought of putting together a strategy for leaving. Every single country in the EU has a misgivings about the EU. These misgivings are myriad and have little in common with the UK attitude, a country that was never fully committed in the first place. Don't be holding out for the EU to implode, it will merely continue to evolve. Brexit and the general disquiet in the EU will in time see the EU evolve in a way that is more compatible with the aspirations of its people. Sadly, the UK will not be there to benefit from or contribute to it.
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@ zoreto. He's not joking as much as you are. The UK stood alone in WW2 not for YEARS as you claim, but from June 1940 with the surrender France to July 1941 and the commencement of Operation Barbarossa. Considering the English obsession with WW2, some might be surprised you don't know this. Not me, I already know you think the EU make 75% of your laws. This is what happens when you eschew experts.
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@ zoreto It sticks in your craw, doesn't it. I merely pointed out the democratic deficit in your own country, and just look how defensive you got. Contrary to your claim, the reason we are having this conversation, you and I, is because you don't agree with the following statement: 'You got here because you never came to terms with winning the war and losing an empire; Germany and the liberated nations of Europe grew prosperous while the UK almost went bankrupt. Brexit is the politics of self-pity.' Brexit is not about sovereignty or democracy, these are the vehicles co-opted to by your political elite and their media backers to provide a reason d'etra to vote leave, - its a populist trope. Whether the EU is more or less democratic than you own country is actually debatable. That's one point, which leads me to another. Brexit and its fantasies - you expound them well - are based on insecurities, hubris, a sense of superiority, nostalgia for the past and a manufactured oppression. The manufactured oppression is important - it appears that the raison d'être for Brexit is an appropriation of the same kind of grievances those colonised by the British empire felt - but based on fantasy. Odd, isn't it? The English have never experienced oppression and have confused it with minor inconveniences. When Brexit changes none of the problems in English society and the extent to which you are holding the weaker hand in trade negotiations with peoples you feel superior to become obvious, it will be exposed. Who will be the scapegoat then? I've got the popcorn in.
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@ zoreto One other thing. Not simply content with leaving, you want to destroy the EU. This is because you Brexiter people, who see themselves as an exceptional, under appreciated and denied the rewards of having saved Europe in two world wars, can't control the EU. And you fear it may succeed without you, while the English sadistically damage yourselves as part of their national sulk. Interestingly, people engaged in self-pity - narcissists and their ilk - also have fantasies about destroying the source of their perceived rejection.
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@ EG:UK 'Britain went bankrupt and Germany had it's debt forgiven. You shouldn't bring up history if you don't know all your facts' What fact did I have wrong?
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@ alfa8fake2 'And we still have so many idiots, who think that the UK is gonna remain a Sovereign state by staying in this "Union". :'-D' On the contrary, there is a slightly larger number of idiots who think that the UK is going to become more sovereign by leaving.
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@ zoreto I'm sure the Irish will be amused that you are favour of their independence considering they've had it for 97 years.
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It wasn't, bear. They were the values of certain English people, but not of the state. That is why there was a revolution.
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@ bear jokes You said: 'And while the British Empire was all about other nations having self-determination, the U.S has actively done the opposite.' The first dozen words of this sentence is an oxymoron. The rest of your comment is based on a false premise and amounts to little more than a tedious attempt at deflection.
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@ bear jokes 'That you find it contradictory just highlights your limited cognitive capabilities. It was nice educating you and showing that you have no idea what you're talking about' Oh really? Demonstrate the veracity of this claim or admit to the poverty of by your Ad hominem attack.
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@ bear jokes 'That you find it contradictory just highlights your limited cognitive capabilities. It was nice educating you and showing that you have no idea what you're talking about' Please provide the supporting evidence for this claim.
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Jesus Christ bear, I'm far to busy to be wading through you incoherent posts. Especially as they only tenuously grounded in fact or relevance. Know when to quit, there's a good lad. And stop feeling sorry for yourself.
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