Comments by "D W" (@DW-op7ly) on "Inside a Chinese Ghost Town of Abandoned Mansions | WSJ" video.

  1. Do China's ghost cities offer a solution to Europe's migrant crisis? By Wade Shepard * Even though there are between 20 and 45 million unoccupied homes across China, which account for roughly 600 million square meters of uninhabited floor space - enough to completely cover Madrid - these places are not the urban wastelands they are often posited to be. While many of China's new cities and urban districts are deficient in people they are not deficient in owners. Nearly every apartment that goes on the market in China is quickly purchased, often at exorbitant prices that commonly range into the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Far from being unwanted infrastructure that could seamlessly be doled out to refugees, those arrays of vacant high-rises are actually the proud possessions of people who paid a lot of money for them. * A huge portion of the homes that are purchased in China function very much like stocks or a trade-able commodity. As an incredible number of new apartments are sold as unfinished concrete cavities without any interior fit out or even windows, they are in no way immediately livable. Strange as it may seem, they are very actively bought and sold in this bare-bones form. In fact, investors often prefer them that way. In many ways they are purely economic entities, quantifiable placeholders of value that are traded on the open market akin to precious metals. Just as one doesn't need to mold a piece of gold into something usable, like a piece of jewelry, for it to have value and an economic function, an apartment in China doesn't need to have people living in it for it to be economically viable. "Empty units leave flexibility for quick sales in a changing market or need to cash in quickly," said Barry Wilson, the founding director of Barry Wilson Project Initiatives, a Hong Kong-based urban design firm. Another reason for the sheer number of unused apartments in China is the fact that there is often little financial incentive for owners to do anything with them after purchase. There is no yearly property tax in China, so vacant properties are not a financial drain on their owners. While the potential returns that could be had from renting them out (1 percent or so) is often not worth the hassle - especially because it costs tens of thousands of dollars to construct the interiors of new apartments in preparation for tenants. This is combined with the fact that Chinese homeowners, especially investors who have multiple properties, are remarkably un-leveraged. According to Mark Tanner, over 80 percent of homes in China are owned outright. This means that most homeowners, especially the big investors with multiple properties, generally don't have any mortgages to pay off or any other leans, so there isn't as much financial pressure to make a profit from these homes in the short term. Additionally many empty apartments have owners who intend to occupy them at some point. A huge number of China's new apartments are located in new development areas, which are, by definition, new. The thinking is if you buy property in these emerging new areas early, you can get a better price. So it's common for people to purchase homes in places that are not yet ready to support a large population with the understanding that they won't be able to inhabit them for many years. Reuters
    15
  2. Their people have added 5 trillion to their savings these last 2 years
    9
  3. Only the tier 1 big cities are charging property taxes and that was to try and cool down their real estate markets The rest of the country pays no property taxes You try not paying your property taxes and see what happens to your home
    8
  4. Even though China has invested trillions in their belt and road partner countries China exports are up 7.1% In 2024 And it still has a 820 billion plus dollar a year trade surplus with the world the last 2 years Even though their Central Government is cracking down in real estate speculation Slowing down the economy? The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
    7
  5. You got to go back to 2010 when they cut off money flow to these developers It just took them 13 years to get this under control
    6
  6. This was when the developers got the money flow cut off to them in 2010 But then this is when they started flogging these investment vehicles to wealthy Chinese investors If all you know is how to build homes and building higher end homes And then suddenly you get money from investors What would you do? Build
    5
  7. Yeah donā€™t pay those property taxes letā€™s see who owns your land
    5
  8. The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
    4
  9. Even though there are between 20 and 45 million unoccupied homes across China, which account for roughly 600 million square meters of uninhabited floor space ā€“ enough to completely cover Madrid, these places are not the urban wastelands they are often posited to be. While many of Chinaā€™s new cities and urban districts are deficient in people they are not deficient in owners. Nearly every apartment that goes on the market in China is quickly purchased, often at exorbitant prices that commonly range in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Far from being unwanted infrastructure that could seamlessly be doled out to refugees, those arrays of vacant high-rises are actually the proud possessions of people who paid a lot of money for them. So why would anyone spend incredible amounts of cash on houses they do not intent to use? * A huge portion of the homes that are purchased in China function very much like stocks or a trade-able commodity. As an incredible amount of new apartments are sold as unfinished concrete cavities without any interior fit out or even windows, they are in no way immediately livable. Although they are very actively bought and sold in this bare-bones form, which is often preferred by investors. In many ways they are purely economic entities, quantifiable placeholders of value that are traded on the open market akin to precious metals. Just as one doesnā€™t need to mold a piece of gold into something usable like a piece of jewelry for it to have value and an economic function, an apartment in China doesnā€™t need to have people living in it for it to be economically viable. ā€œEmpty units leave flexibility for quick sales in a changing market or need to cash in quickly,ā€ said Barry Wilson, the founding director of Barry Wilson Project Initiatives, a Hong Kong based urban design firm. Another reason for the sheer amount of unused apartments in China is the fact that there is often little financial incentive for owners to do anything with them after purchase. There is no yearly property tax in China, so vacant properties are not a financial drain on their owners. While the potential returns that could be had from renting them out (1% or so) is often not worth the hassle ā€” especially because it costs tens of thousands of dollars to construct the interiors of new apartments in preparation for tenants. This is combined with the fact that Chinese homeowners, especially investors who have multiple properties, are remarkably un-leveraged. According to Mark Tanner, over 80% of homes in China are owned outright. This means that most homeowners, especially the big investors with multiple properties, generally donā€™t have any mortgages to pay off or any other leans, so there isnā€™t as much financial pressure to make a profit from these homes in the short term. Thevagabondjourney
    4
  10. In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
    4
  11. If this was around 2010 then these Property Developers would have had the flow of money cutoff to them.
    4
  12. I was going to argue the same thing Add into the fact only property owners in the bigger tier 1 cities in China are charged property taxes And that was to cool down their markets Probably should have made it nation wide a decade ago
    4
  13. This guy best explained what happened šŸ‘‡ Do China's ghost cities offer a solution to Europe's migrant crisis? By Wade Shepard * Even though there are between 20 and 45 million unoccupied homes across China, which account for roughly 600 million square meters of uninhabited floor space - enough to completely cover Madrid - these places are not the urban wastelands they are often posited to be. While many of China's new cities and urban districts are deficient in people they are not deficient in owners. Nearly every apartment that goes on the market in China is quickly purchased, often at exorbitant prices that commonly range into the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Far from being unwanted infrastructure that could seamlessly be doled out to refugees, those arrays of vacant high-rises are actually the proud possessions of people who paid a lot of money for them. * A huge portion of the homes that are purchased in China function very much like stocks or a trade-able commodity. As an incredible number of new apartments are sold as unfinished concrete cavities without any interior fit out or even windows, they are in no way immediately livable. Strange as it may seem, they are very actively bought and sold in this bare-bones form. In fact, investors often prefer them that way. In many ways they are purely economic entities, quantifiable placeholders of value that are traded on the open market akin to precious metals. Just as one doesn't need to mold a piece of gold into something usable, like a piece of jewelry, for it to have value and an economic function, an apartment in China doesn't need to have people living in it for it to be economically viable. "Empty units leave flexibility for quick sales in a changing market or need to cash in quickly," said Barry Wilson, the founding director of Barry Wilson Project Initiatives, a Hong Kong-based urban design firm. Another reason for the sheer number of unused apartments in China is the fact that there is often little financial incentive for owners to do anything with them after purchase. There is no yearly property tax in China, so vacant properties are not a financial drain on their owners. While the potential returns that could be had from renting them out (1 percent or so) is often not worth the hassle - especially because it costs tens of thousands of dollars to construct the interiors of new apartments in preparation for tenants. This is combined with the fact that Chinese homeowners, especially investors who have multiple properties, are remarkably un-leveraged. According to Mark Tanner, over 80 percent of homes in China are owned outright. This means that most homeowners, especially the big investors with multiple properties, generally don't have any mortgages to pay off or any other leans, so there isn't as much financial pressure to make a profit from these homes in the short term. Additionally many empty apartments have owners who intend to occupy them at some point. A huge number of China's new apartments are located in new development areas, which are, by definition, new. The thinking is if you buy property in these emerging new areas early, you can get a better price. So it's common for people to purchase homes in places that are not yet ready to support a large population with the understanding that they won't be able to inhabit them for many years. Reuters
    3
  14. In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
    3
  15. This engineered slowdown was by design of their Government Long story short the developers were building higher end homes But not the affordable homes a few hundred million rural migrants will need as the migrate to the cities to join their more well off urban countrymen But to many???? China will crash!!!!!! The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
    3
  16. Yeah I saw a interview with one guy who bought 2 apartments for 350k in total crying about how he invested in one of these Real Estate Developers who were cut off from money flow by their Central Government in 2010 That you are crying for Obviously your going to get a first time home buyer who will fall through the cracks especially one not smart enough to know these Developers were in trouble since 2010 But thatā€™s not the majority Like I said 70% of the people buying homes in their cities were buying their 2nd and 3rd home in 2018 They would be on their 4th and 5th homes right about nowā€¦even with the crackdown on housing speculation since 2010 And there are still another 300 million rural people expecting to move to the cities who canā€™t even afford these overpriced homes Where no affordable housing is being made for them But letā€™s cry for the more well off Chinese who took a risk
    3
  17. Works for them Americans invest around the same amount of their wealth 35% into their stock markets That is propped up by borrowed money to do share buybacks
    3
  18. This guy best explains it šŸ‘‡ Do China's ghost cities offer a solution to Europe's migrant crisis? By Wade Shepard * Even though there are between 20 and 45 million unoccupied homes across China, which account for roughly 600 million square meters of uninhabited floor space - enough to completely cover Madrid - these places are not the urban wastelands they are often posited to be. While many of China's new cities and urban districts are deficient in people they are not deficient in owners. Nearly every apartment that goes on the market in China is quickly purchased, often at exorbitant prices that commonly range into the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Far from being unwanted infrastructure that could seamlessly be doled out to refugees, those arrays of vacant high-rises are actually the proud possessions of people who paid a lot of money for them. * A huge portion of the homes that are purchased in China function very much like stocks or a trade-able commodity. As an incredible number of new apartments are sold as unfinished concrete cavities without any interior fit out or even windows, they are in no way immediately livable. Strange as it may seem, they are very actively bought and sold in this bare-bones form. In fact, investors often prefer them that way. In many ways they are purely economic entities, quantifiable placeholders of value that are traded on the open market akin to precious metals. Just as one doesn't need to mold a piece of gold into something usable, like a piece of jewelry, for it to have value and an economic function, an apartment in China doesn't need to have people living in it for it to be economically viable. "Empty units leave flexibility for quick sales in a changing market or need to cash in quickly," said Barry Wilson, the founding director of Barry Wilson Project Initiatives, a Hong Kong-based urban design firm. Another reason for the sheer number of unused apartments in China is the fact that there is often little financial incentive for owners to do anything with them after purchase. There is no yearly property tax in China, so vacant properties are not a financial drain on their owners. While the potential returns that could be had from renting them out (1 percent or so) is often not worth the hassle - especially because it costs tens of thousands of dollars to construct the interiors of new apartments in preparation for tenants. This is combined with the fact that Chinese homeowners, especially investors who have multiple properties, are remarkably un-leveraged. According to Mark Tanner, over 80 percent of homes in China are owned outright. This means that most homeowners, especially the big investors with multiple properties, generally don't have any mortgages to pay off or any other leans, so there isn't as much financial pressure to make a profit from these homes in the short term. Additionally many empty apartments have owners who intend to occupy them at some point. A huge number of China's new apartments are located in new development areas, which are, by definition, new. The thinking is if you buy property in these emerging new areas early, you can get a better price. So it's common for people to purchase homes in places that are not yet ready to support a large population with the understanding that they won't be able to inhabit them for many years. Reuters
    2
  19. India with a younger workforce, larger workforce, and lower wages????? Has a 90 to 100 billion dollar trade deficit with China every year
    2
  20. Yet you Americans cried about trade deficits šŸ˜‚
    2
  21. Chinese debt is mostly internal debt they have stick in their corporations and local Governments I can show you what China does with its internal debt They have very little external Sovereign debt which they can pay back unlike a country like for example USA which not only has a huge amount of internal debt we rarely hear about But a ton of external sovereign debt 34 trillion dollars the USA canā€™t pay back But like I said China started cutting off Money flow to the property developers in 2010 The last few years these property developers started selling their junk bonds to ā€œsophisticated foreign investorsā€ These investors thinking was the Central Government would backstop these investments. My reply to the few who reached out for my opinion? Not!!!!! when they cut off money to these developers over a decade ago
    2
  22. China leads the world in 37 of 44 critical technologies of the future In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
    2
  23. They were mostly using foreign investor money these last 2 years
    2
  24. We are deadbeat Canadians who couldnā€™t replace ourselves. Thats why we pack the immigrants in
    2
  25. Yes donā€™t pay your taxes you lose your home Only Chinese in big tier Chinese cities pay property taxes Btw China with its control of 10 of 11 of Asias biggest rivers China gives Vietnam the right to use the Mekong like a renter go search that up
    2
  26. Do China's ghost cities offer a solution to Europe's migrant crisis? By Wade Shepard * Even though there are between 20 and 45 million unoccupied homes across China, which account for roughly 600 million square meters of uninhabited floor space - enough to completely cover Madrid - these places are not the urban wastelands they are often posited to be. While many of China's new cities and urban districts are deficient in people they are not deficient in owners. Nearly every apartment that goes on the market in China is quickly purchased, often at exorbitant prices that commonly range into the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Far from being unwanted infrastructure that could seamlessly be doled out to refugees, those arrays of vacant high-rises are actually the proud possessions of people who paid a lot of money for them. * A huge portion of the homes that are purchased in China function very much like stocks or a trade-able commodity. As an incredible number of new apartments are sold as unfinished concrete cavities without any interior fit out or even windows, they are in no way immediately livable. Strange as it may seem, they are very actively bought and sold in this bare-bones form. In fact, investors often prefer them that way. In many ways they are purely economic entities, quantifiable placeholders of value that are traded on the open market akin to precious metals. Just as one doesn't need to mold a piece of gold into something usable, like a piece of jewelry, for it to have value and an economic function, an apartment in China doesn't need to have people living in it for it to be economically viable. "Empty units leave flexibility for quick sales in a changing market or need to cash in quickly," said Barry Wilson, the founding director of Barry Wilson Project Initiatives, a Hong Kong-based urban design firm. Another reason for the sheer number of unused apartments in China is the fact that there is often little financial incentive for owners to do anything with them after purchase. There is no yearly property tax in China, so vacant properties are not a financial drain on their owners. While the potential returns that could be had from renting them out (1 percent or so) is often not worth the hassle - especially because it costs tens of thousands of dollars to construct the interiors of new apartments in preparation for tenants. This is combined with the fact that Chinese homeowners, especially investors who have multiple properties, are remarkably un-leveraged. According to Mark Tanner, over 80 percent of homes in China are owned outright. This means that most homeowners, especially the big investors with multiple properties, generally don't have any mortgages to pay off or any other leans, so there isn't as much financial pressure to make a profit from these homes in the short term. Additionally many empty apartments have owners who intend to occupy them at some point. A huge number of China's new apartments are located in new development areas, which are, by definition, new. The thinking is if you buy property in these emerging new areas early, you can get a better price. So it's common for people to purchase homes in places that are not yet ready to support a large population with the understanding that they won't be able to inhabit them for many years. Reuters
    2
  27. Yes only the big tier cities have a property tax
    2
  28. The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
    1
  29. Shady home builders in the USA . Just like these greedy developers
    1
  30. Cut off from money flow from their Central Government The ā€œJunk Bondsā€ of these Chinese Property Developers these last few years started to become a hot commodity to ā€œSophisticated Foreign Investorsā€ The general consensus was the Chinese Central Government would backstop these junk bonds I actually had a few old colleagues reach out to me for advice from back in my investment banking days.. Since they knew I had been researching China investments since the late 1980s My reply to them was ā€œNot when their Government has cut off the money flow to these companies for over a decadeā€ They did not listenā€¦.šŸ¤· šŸ‘‡ A 99% Bond Wipeout Hands Hedge Funds a Harsh Lesson on China Bloomberg) -- From afar, China Evergrande Group had all the makings of a killer distressed-debt trade: $19 billion in defaulted offshore bonds; $242 billion in assets; and a government that appeared determined to prop up the countryā€™s faltering property market. So US and European hedge funds piled into the debt, envisioning big payouts to juice their returns. What they got instead over the course of the next two years is a harsh lesson in the dangers of trying to bargain with the Communist Party. The talks are now dead ā€” a Hong Kong court has ordered Evergrandeā€™s liquidation, and the bonds are nearly worthless, trading in secondary markets at just 1 cent on the dollar. Bloomberg
    1
  31. Chinese Property Developers get an influx of cash? What do you think they did with that cash? I have no sympathy for people who take a risk with their money and then cry about it And I donā€™t know what backwater boonie town you are from But where Iā€™m from real estate speculation has pushed home prices into overheated territory The average price of a home is 1.2 million Where we have speculation, empty home taxes, and foreign owners taxesā€¦. Many of them are Chinese investors That everyone seems to cheer on Even though it slows down growth and the economy
    1
  32. The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
    1
  33. The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
    1
  34. Americans these days lol šŸ‘‡ Service sector main driving force to China's GDP growth in H1 2023-07-17 ECNS
    1
  35. The other option is rich Chinese buying their 4th and 5th homes right about nowā€¦. China could easily over heat the markets/economy and have another decade of bubbles The Chinese did that in 2008 as the US subprime prime crisis crashed the world markets And put 27 million out of work and /shuttered 100 thousand factories in China In response the Chinese Government got the banks to loan out 580 billion dollars That created overheated bubbles where their Government had to come in and shutdown and regulate That 580 billion created a big ball of money that went From Real Estate, Shadow Banks, Underground economy, Commodities, Stocks, Bonds and then back to Real Estate In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
    1
  36. What do you think they did with us as they raised interest rates here in North America You did not notice the Bank ads advertising all those locked in interest rate term deposits ?? The idea was get the people to save, and they stop the consumer staples inflation Without solving our supply side issues For the Chinese The other option would have been 70% or the Chinese in their real estate markets buying their 4th and 5th homes right about now
    1
  37. You are taking about a 1980s China Even though China has invested trillions in their belt and road partner countries China exports are up 7.1% In 2024 And it still has a 820 billion plus dollar a year trade surplus with the world the last 2 years Even though their Central Government is cracking down in real estate speculation Slowing down the economy? The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
    1
  38. China has a 800 billion dollar a year trade surplus with the world The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 What did we in the west do? We lived a good life borrowed and spent it and borrowed even more šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
    1
  39. In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
    1
  40. The other option if youā€™re he Central Government did not step in???? Would be rich Chinese buying their 3rd and 4th homes about right now In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
    1
  41. Anyone of you want to dispute what I posted up feel free to do so The irony is I can tell you are one of those guys who does not believe a single word MSM tells them But put ā€œChinaā€ infront of that article and you believe everything MSM tells you šŸ˜†
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  42. Anyone of you want to dispute what I posted up feel free to do so The irony is I can tell you are one of those guys who does not believe a single word MSM tells them But put ā€œChinaā€ infront of that article and you believe everything MSM tells you šŸ˜†
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  43. Anyone of you want to dispute what I posted up feel free to do so The irony is I can tell you are one of those guys who does not believe a single word MSM tells them But put ā€œChinaā€ infront of that article and you believe everything MSM tells you šŸ˜†
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  44. Anyone of you want to dispute what I posted up feel free to do so The irony is I can tell you are one of those guys who does not believe a single word MSM tells them But put ā€œChinaā€ infront of that article and you believe everything MSM tells you šŸ˜†
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  45. Back 2008 when the USA crashed the world economy with the subprime crisis 27 million people lost their jobs and 100 thousand factories were shuttered There Central Government got their banks to loan out 580 billion That created a big ball of money that went from sector to sector Creating bubbles and overheated markets where they had to come in and regulate or shutdown From Real Estate, Shadow Banks, Underground Economy, Commodities, Stocks, Bonds and recently back to Real Estate Yes they could do another stimulus. But that will probably create more speculative bubbles they are trying to avoid Most people who are taking a hit on Chinese Real Estate are speculators these days. All these bias posters like you in this thread. Were probably crying about the Real Estate speculators in their own country. until interest rates started going up If you were not you probably lived out in the hi. Ick town boonies
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  46. Basically many in the west are complaining because the Communist Chinese are cracking down on property speculation in Chinaā€¦. Yet cheering on our own crackdown on speculators here with interest rate hikes, empty home taxes, speculation taxes, and foreign buyer taxes which many seem to be Chinese investors who buy those monster homes and leave them empty Without this crackdown The other option is 70% of the Chinese in their real estate markets buying their 4th or 5th home right about now with a few hundred million rural migrants, migrating to the city without affordable homes In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
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  47. Their Government cracking down on real estate does not make it worthless Their people have just tucked 5 trillion USD worth away into their bank accounts these last 2 years Itā€™s just their Government took 14 years to finally get their Real Estate bubble under control By cutting off money flow to Property developers in 2010 It just took a trade war, Covid and this 14 year Government crackdown To finally slow down this real estate market
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  48. Then you donā€™t know much about your own country as your Central Government was cracking down in this speculation in 2010
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  49. Why do I get the feeling someone like you is complaining about the democracy we have these days If only you can get a conservative government in charge Because then all our problems would be fixed Like we never had conservative Governments in the past They borrowed and spent like the other useless Governments
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  50. Like I said There is still a few hundred million rural migrants who will migrate to the cities Itā€™s be nice to see them get these homes at a huge discount But that wonā€™t happen these homes will get snapped up by other Chinese investors and these poorer rural folks will loose out We no doubt will hear about that in the coming decades But then you are a home Im builder in the USA I doubt you would dedicate the majority of the homes you build to poor migrant workers coming across the border
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  51. In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
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  52. I think many Chinese just got too much money to know what to do with it China has a 800 billion dollar a year, trade surplus with the world The Chinese ā€œpeopleā€ have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
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  53. In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
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  54. China started cutting off Money flow to the property developers in 2010 The last few years these property developers started selling their junk bonds to ā€œsophisticated foreign investorsā€ These investors thinking was the Central Government would backstop these investments. My reply to the few who reached out for my opinion? Not when they cut off money to these developers over a decade ago
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  55. He is saying cut off from money flow from the Central Government for 14 years in 2010 folks started using Shadow Banks really just Rich Chinese investors Giving loans to these Developers The Central Government came into shutdown or regulate Then these Developers started flogging Wealth Management investment vehicles to the rich Chinese Which the Government came into shutdown and regulate But then these Developers started to sell their Junk Bonds to ā€œSophisticated Foreign Investorsā€ Where this really started to take off these last few years The General consensus was the Chinese Government would backstop these Companies I had a few reach out for my opinion since they know I started researching China for investment in the late 80s My reply was ā€œNot when the Central Government was cutting off money flow to these developers for over a decade šŸ‘‡ As the Pace of Chinaā€™s Junk Bond Sales Grows, So Do Worries BY NEIL GOUGH MARCH 28, 2013 2:53 PM The junk bond market in China took off this year. Although the deals still account for a small share of the global total, Chinese companies have sold $8 billion of high-yield bonds to overseas investors since January. Thatā€™s up from $2.3 billion during the same period a year earlier, according to figures from Dealogic. ā€œBond markets are booming because companies have had difficulty getting the level of debt they want out of banks onshore or offshore, and in tapping equity markets,ā€ said Nick Gronow, a senior managing director at FTI Consulting in Hong Kong and an expert in Chinese bankruptcies. ā€œSo bonds have really taken up the slack.ā€ NYT
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  56. A 99% Bond Wipeout Hands Hedge Funds a Harsh Lesson on China Bloomberg) -- From afar, China Evergrande Group had all the makings of a killer distressed-debt trade: $19 billion in defaulted offshore bonds; $242 billion in assets; and a government that appeared determined to prop up the countryā€™s faltering property market. So US and European hedge funds piled into the debt, envisioning big payouts to juice their returns. What they got instead over the course of the next two years is a harsh lesson in the dangers of trying to bargain with the Communist Party. The talks are now dead ā€” a Hong Kong court has ordered Evergrandeā€™s liquidation, and the bonds are nearly worthless, trading in secondary markets at just 1 cent on the dollar. Bloomberg
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  57. I was watching a documentary some westerner who had come back to the poorest village in China 1 year later As he walks in on a Senior Social worker berating 5 or 6 social workers because a deadline was fast approaching and they had a quotas to meet getting people in the village above a poverty line or they all including this Senior Social worker would get demoted/fired Where they had to make sure the villagers were signed up for some State healthcare plan where the State paid 95% of the bills Then this guys follows one social worker as he shows him the newly paved roads and new houses and the donated furnishings in a home Even with all that you could get a sense of fear and worry in this guy demeanour. As we find out he was some Government banking official who was demoted to this job And the only way you move back up is to meet your deadlines and quotas Is this a better system than we have in the west? Depends on if our Government is willing to build roads and houses for people with little expected return Could ve staged propaganda video? they had some 16 year old who decided to quit school like her mother who had her at 16 Showed parents spanking their kid with a stick while the westerner sheilds the child Type into a YouTube search šŸ‘‡ Revisiting China's poorest village
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  58. Donā€™t pay property taxes and letā€™s see who owns your property Chinese donā€™t have property tax except for the big tier 1 cities where they enacted it because of real estate speculation The vast majority of property owners donā€™t pay property taxes in China Looks like they ainā€™t paying this either šŸ‘‡ Saturday, April 15, 2017 Full Private Land Ownership Returns to Chinaā€™s Cities I donā€™t see how to read this other than as a promise of perpetual free renewals. This means that people who paid for a 70-year LUR now find themselves with a perpetual LUR: the equivalent of full fee simple ownership. Thatā€™s worth noticing. Law professors typepad
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  59. There is 50 million overseas Chinese including all their descendants. That is like 3% of all Chinese The majority live in SE Asia In many cases if they didnā€™t change their names there would be genocide attempts against them In the West like the USAā€¦. O wait
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  60. Try walking in one of those drugged up areas in our western cities And you will know the true meaning of hunger games Or You must live in a State that just sends the homeless, mentally drugged addicted to another State And pretend it wonā€™t affect you
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  61. They could always invest in US dollars and US Debt instead Unsteady of buying their 4th and 5th homes Even though China has invested trillions in their belt and road partner countries China exports are up 7.1% In 2024 And it still has a 820 billion plus dollar a year trade surplus with the world the last 2 years Even though their Central Government is cracking down in real estate speculation Slowing down the economy? The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
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  62. Problem with people like you? Is you for sure are complaining about how you canā€™t afford a house these days Or for sure how your kids wonā€™t You are more than likely cheering on speculation taxes, empty home taxes, foreign ownership taxesā€¦ and Western Governments jacking up interest rates Are you crying about first time home buyers who got hurt by these higher interest rates???? Are you crying about these real estate speculators I bet you are arguing how home prices coming down is better for everyone even the people who own a home right now
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  63. The last few years these property developers started selling their junk bonds to ā€œsophisticated foreign investorsā€ These investors thinking was the Central Government would backstop these investments. My reply to a few former coworkers from my investment banking days Who reached out for my advice Not when they cut off money to these developers over a decade ago Btw with an influx of cash these last few years what do you think Property Developers did with that money??? šŸ‘‡ A 99% Bond Wipeout Hands Hedge Funds a Harsh Lesson on China Bloomberg) -- From afar, China Evergrande Group had all the makings of a killer distressed-debt trade: $19 billion in defaulted offshore bonds; $242 billion in assets; and a government that appeared determined to prop up the countryā€™s faltering property market. So US and European hedge funds piled into the debt, envisioning big payouts to juice their returns. What they got instead over the course of the next two years is a harsh lesson in the dangers of trying to bargain with the Communist Party. The talks are now dead ā€” a Hong Kong court has ordered Evergrandeā€™s liquidation, and the bonds are nearly worthless, trading in secondary markets at just 1 cent on the dollar. Bloomberg
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  64. Saturday, April 15, 2017 Full Private Land Ownership Returns to Chinaā€™s Cities I donā€™t see how to read this other than as a promise of perpetual free renewals. This means that people who paid for a 70-year LUR now find themselves with a perpetual LUR: the equivalent of full fee simple ownership. Thatā€™s worth noticing. Law professors typepad
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  65. Iā€™d tell you not to pay taxes on your home and letā€™s see what happens But then you donā€™t pay property taxes Btw most Chinese donā€™t pay property taxes unless they are in the bigger cities Those taxes were implemented to deflate their real estate bubble
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  66. Like I said the people really getting hurt these days are the ā€œSophisticated Foreign Investorsā€ The well off Chinese investors investing in those wealth management vehicles will get a portion.of their money back Only a naive person who takes a risk with their money and expects their Government to cover those losses But thatā€™s what their Government will do unlike where the USA would make those Foreign Investors whole ā€¦ which we saw them do with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac debt much of that private internal debt held by foreigners in 2010 cut off from money Property Developers started using Shadow Banks really just well off Chinese investors Giving loans to these Developers The Central Government came into shutdown and regulate Then these Developers started selling Wealth Management investment vehicles to the well off Chinese Which the Government came into shutdown and regulate But then these Developers started to flog their Junk Bonds to ā€œSophisticated Foreign Investorsā€ Where these Junk bonds really started to take off in popularity these last few years (Btw Property Developer gets a cash infusion what do you think they did with that cash???) The General consensus was the Chinese Government would backstop these Property Developers Companies/Junk Bonds I had a few reach out for my opinion since they know I started researching China as an investment option in the late 80s during my investment banking days My reply was ā€œNot when the Central Government was cutting off money flow to these developers for over a decade They didnt listen šŸ‘‡ A 99% Bond Wipeout Hands Hedge Funds a Harsh Lesson on China Bloomberg) -- From afar, China Evergrande Group had all the makings of a killer distressed-debt trade: $19 billion in defaulted offshore bonds; $242 billion in assets; and a government that appeared determined to prop up the countryā€™s faltering property market. So US and European hedge funds piled into the debt, envisioning big payouts to juice their returns. What they got instead over the course of the next two years is a harsh lesson in the dangers of trying to bargain with the Communist Party. The talks are now dead ā€” a Hong Kong court has ordered Evergrandeā€™s liquidation, and the bonds are nearly worthless, trading in secondary markets at just 1 cent on the dollar. Bloomberg
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  67. Chinese ainā€™t covering the Property Developers Junk Bonds unlike the USA taking internal Agency debt not backed by the US Government, and Turning it into external Sovereign Debt . Backed by the US Government and the US People šŸ‘‡ As politicians call for taxpayer bailouts and a government takeover of troubled mortgage lenders Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, FreedomWorks would like to point out that a bailout is a transfer of possibly hundreds of billions of U.S. tax dollars to sophisticated investors and governments overseas. The top five foreign holders of Freddie and Fannie long-term debt are China, Japan, the Cayman Islands, Luxembourg, and Belgium. In total foreign investors hold over $1.3 trillion in these agency bonds, according to the U.S. Treasuryā€™s most recent ā€œReport on Foreign Portfolio Holdings of U.S. Securities.ā€ FreedomWorks President Matt Kibbe commented, ā€œThe prospectus for every GSE bond clearly states that it is not backed by the United States government. Thatā€™s why investors holding agency bonds already receive a significant risk premium over Treasuries.ā€ ā€œA bailout at this stage would be the worst possible outcome for American taxpayers and mortgage holders, who have been paying a risk premium to these foreign investors. It would change the rules of the game retroactively and would directly subsidize the risks taken by sophisticated foreign investors.ā€ ā€œA bailout of GSE bondholders would be perhaps the greatest taxpayer rip-off in American history. It is bad economics and you can be sure it is terrible politics.ā€ FreedomWorks
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  68. Ā @sardu55Ā  the solution should be simple in China the last few years property developers went on a building spree in higher end homes So the people they owe homes to. Can be given one of those higher end homes The remaining can be sold at a discount to the few hundred million rural migrants still expected to move to the cities The wealthy Chinese/sophisticated foreign investors Can get back a few more pennies on their investment
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  69. Ā @gregparrottĀ  even if those numbers were to be believed The Chinese people are adding 2.6 trillion a year to their wealth the solution should be simple in China the last few years property developers went on a building spree in higher end homes So the people they owe homes to. Can be given one of those higher end homes (although the home might not be in a city/province they likeā€¦ but beats getting nothing backā€¦ on a risk they willingly took) The remaining homes can be sold at a discount to the few hundred million rural migrants still expected to move to the cities And the wealthy Chinese/sophisticated foreign investors who took the biggest hit these last few years (You invest more money into overheated market with Property Developers? They naturally do what they do best they build even more) Well they get back a few more pennies on their investment Cut off from money flow by the Chinese Central Government for over 12 years starting in 2010 Chinese Property Developers ā€œJunk Bondsā€ they were flogging, these last few years suddenly started to become a hot commodity by ā€œSophisticated Foreign Investorsā€ The general consensus was the Chinese Central Government would backstop these junk bonds I actually had a few old colleagues reach out to me for advice from back in my investment banking days.. Since they knew I had been researching China investments since the late 1980s My reply to them was ā€œNot when their Government has cut off the money flow to these companies for over a decadeā€ They did not listenā€¦.šŸ¤· šŸ‘‡ A 99% Bond Wipeout Hands Hedge Funds a Harsh Lesson on China Bloomberg) -- From afar, China Evergrande Group had all the makings of a killer distressed-debt trade: $19 billion in defaulted offshore bonds; $242 billion in assets; and a government that appeared determined to prop up the countryā€™s faltering property market. So US and European hedge funds piled into the debt, envisioning big payouts to juice their returns. What they got instead over the course of the next two years is a harsh lesson in the dangers of trying to bargain with the Communist Party. The talks are now dead ā€” a Hong Kong court has ordered Evergrandeā€™s liquidation, and the bonds are nearly worthless, trading in secondary markets at just 1 cent on the dollar. Bloomberg
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  70. You are spouting off fake news There is a 7 volume 27 book series on what the Chinese invented that says we copied from them And these days they lead the world in 37 of 44 critical technologies of the future Time to do some research
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  71. You can live in those houses Plus id advise you to see how much of these companies in your 401k/Pension get revenue from those Chinese domestic markets In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
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  72. More than Half of All Stock Buybacks are Now Financed by Debt. Hereā€™s Why Thatā€™s a Problem Fortune
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  73. Chinese are still adding to their wealth Even with their Government purposely deflating their bubble What happens when your stock market crashes? You Americans have to borrow 2 trillion a year to keep the economy afloat The Chinese have a 800 billion a year trade surplus with the world And in a personal basis? The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
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  74. Yea letā€™s feel sorrow for them and make sure we give China Financial aid Things are so bad in China the last few years The Chinese people have ONLY added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
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  75. No one talks about US Internal debt because no one really cares about it 300 trillion was my last count 500 trillion if you add in the notational value of the 200 trillionā€™s on in derivatives bets the TOOBIGTOFAIL investment banks have in their books But Chinese internal debt people are all over that
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  76. Chinese have to put their money somewhere They have a 800 billion dollar trade surplus with the world As for their ā€œpeopleā€ it looks like they are averaging around adding 2.5 trillion USD a year to their wealth America has to borrow and is projected to borrow 2 trillion a year to cover budget deficits for the next decade
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  77. The Chinese people have added 2.6 trillion to their savings in 2022 And 1.8 trillion to their savings for first 10 months of 2023 šŸ‘‡ Chinese Consumers Are Saving Rather Than Spending Amid Economic Downturn Dec 21, 2023 ā€” Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) The middle class is also prioritizing savings and seeking safe investment opportunities, according to the report. Chinese households have added 13.8 trillion yuan ($1.89 trillion) in savings in the first 10 months of the year, an 8.5% increase from the previous year. Pymnts
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  78. Most Chinese donā€™t care about a garden or backyard barbecues Where I live they build monster houses right up to the sidewalk My sister had a neighbour build so close to the fence the side door was hitting the fence when it was opened they asked if the fence could be moved over more into her property šŸ™„ We need to stop putting our western ideals/norms on them And figure out how they think
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  79. You need to do a YouTube search šŸ‘‡ ā€œWhen the West visits Africa, they talk about China.ā€
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  80. Working for an investment banking wing of a National Bank here in Canada I was tasked with researching investment opportunities in China. 36 years ago as we felt DotCom was becoming a bubble. It was my job to know everything and anything about the country that would affect our Investments. Right down to going there to live for a spell. This allowed us to profit greatly and myself to retire at the age of 32 I just never stopped researching China Like I said I personally dumped out of my Chinese investments by 2011 after it became clear even before 2010 their Central Government was going to start cutting off money flow to the Real Estate Markets. So people had atleast 14 years warning they were investing in a bubble As for my rantings you wouldnā€™t believe the amount of information I have compiled. Why should I keep it to myself? Especially with people who are talking about China getting their information only from MSM. Who btw are the same type of people who would never trust a word MSM tells them unless itā€™s about China In fact I warned about Communist China back in the 80s anyone talking about China within the confines of their borders was clueless How their people and Companies were already going out to areas like SE Asia, countries like Vietnam in the 80s Where the Chinese dominated their economies. And these Countries were dependent on the Chinese economy where recently our western companies thought they could head to over to SE Asia or Vietnam after trump started his trade vvar in 2018 šŸ™„šŸ™„šŸ™„ Where inside joke back then???? Was there was even more Chinese content in Vietnamese made products than there were in Chinese made products
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  81. Remarks at a White House Meeting With Business and Trade Leaders September 23, 1985 Thank you very much, and welcome to the White House. I'm pleased to have this opportunity to be with you to address the pressing question of America's trade challenge for the eighties and beyond. And let me say at the outset that our trade policy rests firmly on the foundation of free and open markets -- free trade. I, like you, recognize the inescapable conclusion that all of history has taught: The freer the flow of world trade, the stronger the tides for human progress and peace among nations. reaganlibrary
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  82. In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
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  83. Donā€™t pay property taxes and letā€™s see who owns your property Chinese donā€™t have property tax except for the big tier 1 cities where they enacted it because of real estate speculation The vast majority of property owners donā€™t pay property taxes in China Looks like they ainā€™t paying this either šŸ‘‡ Saturday, April 15, 2017 Full Private Land Ownership Returns to Chinaā€™s Cities I donā€™t see how to read this other than as a promise of perpetual free renewals. This means that people who paid for a 70-year LUR now find themselves with a perpetual LUR: the equivalent of full fee simple ownership. Thatā€™s worth noticing. Law professors typepad
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  84. 90% of Chinese families own a home 80% free of any encumbrances The vast majority of the people taking a hit are more well off Chinese who own more than 1 home or invested in the wealth management vehicles of these Property Developers China was cracking down on real estate speculation and this overheated sector People like you want us to feel sorry for well off Chinese buying their 4th or 5 th homes taking a risk in a sector that their own Government cut off money flow to this sector 24 years ago
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  85. And it would be Chinese Property Developers building these homes These Property Developers were cut off from money flow from their Central Government for 14 years The last few years they resorted to flogging their Junk Bonds to ā€œSophisticated Foreign Investorsā€ Who expected the Chinese Government to backstop their investments So what do you do when you are a Property Developer and you get an influx of cash?????? You build šŸ‘‡ A 99% Bond Wipeout Hands Hedge Funds a Harsh Lesson on China Bloomberg) -- From afar, China Evergrande Group had all the makings of a killer distressed-debt trade: $19 billion in defaulted offshore bonds; $242 billion in assets; and a government that appeared determined to prop up the countryā€™s faltering property market. So US and European hedge funds piled into the debt, envisioning big payouts to juice their returns. What they got instead over the course of the next two years is a harsh lesson in the dangers of trying to bargain with the Communist Party. The talks are now dead ā€” a Hong Kong court has ordered Evergrandeā€™s liquidation, and the bonds are nearly worthless, trading in secondary markets at just 1 cent on the dollar. Bloomberg
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  86. In China in 2008 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 1st homes in their cities By 2018 around 70% of the people in their real estate markets were buying their 2nd and 3rd homes in their cities Thatā€™s why you are hearing about problems with their property developers these days. Because back in 2010? Their Central Government started cutting of money flow to these developers. Thus why you heard about Shadow Banks and Underground Economy back then, that their Government had to come into to shutdown or regulate. Even then, It took them almost 14 years to get their overheated real estate under control Heck they were about to introduce a nation wide property tax, but then trump started the trade war in 2018 Why is their Central Government doing this? Because there are still a few hundred million poorer rural folk they still expect to move to the cities to join their more well off urban city folk countrymen. Problem is these property developers were building higher end homes, and not building the affordable homes these rural migrants will need In China Owning a home in the city you migrate to? Affects your employment, health, education and even marriage prospects donā€™t have a house you donā€™t get married Thus the common prosperity push and the crackdown on the overt displays of wealth in China Their Government probably figured out you disenfranchise the people at the bottom of your society they are the ones most likely to act out in protest
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  87. China leads the world in 37 of the 45 critical technologies of the future What kind of engineer are you not to know that???? Yes it is mostly US multinationals who make the lions share of the money exporting from China to the USA Still using that labor intensive factory formula Recently using illegal workers from SE Asia but more and more automation in their wholly owned factories in China Where the Chinese send their high tech products to their Belt and Road partners these days
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  88. The vast majority of homes in China have owners But these developers kept building since 2010 even when they had the money flow cut off to them
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