Comments by "Winston Smith" (@kryts27) on "TIKhistory"
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I don't want to take away Rommel's ultimate skill as a CIC and his outstanding career as a soldier, but he did have good forewarned intelligence (equivalent to the Ultra decrypts for Montgomery later), early in the North African desert war, via the help of the Americans. The American embassy had been raided in Cairo by Italian intelligence (during 1941) where their "Black code" had been stolen. Incredibly, the Americans did not report these codes as compromised, and did not immediately change their signal codes. Since, by Churchill's insistence, the American embassy attaches got much of the British forces' strength, readiness and disposition, Rommel (via the Italians) got this valuable intelligence firsthand as well and put it to good use with his limited forces in 1941 & 1942. There was little guesswork in Rommel's forces deployment and campaign objectives, early in the desert war.
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"History is wrong", even when you dig up old pots from thousands of year ago (archaeologists love ancient rubbish tips). It's a negative reactionary viewpoint that not only affects historians, but venerable professions like archaeology, forensic science and geology. That is why the scientific method works and the emotive method doesn't, i.e objectivity. What people write down, under certain regimes with their own biased objectives, are important (although not vital to evidence such as Hitler's Table Talk), and often their viewpoints and language do not concur with your own. We should be not bothered by that, but what they might have said (not verbatim, but in essence), might be useful. Now we're getting to a point of stupidity matching an eight year old and a CCP official: Possibly the Second World War never happened (even though it was allegedly over just under 80 years ago) and the Roman Empire was non-existent with lot of pots under the ground with a few marble ruins (the Romans built primarily with brick, by the way). Worse, putting the pots and ruins there was the work of forgeries (very busy and unnoticed forgers, by the way, seeing the extent of the Roman Empire in three continents). But we shouldn't trust what Cicero said or what Pliny the Elder said because it was mistranslated Latin or Greek, incomplete writing (because of bits of age damaged scrolls), had been repeatedly translated to and from other languages, or these (alleged) people lived in age very different from our own.
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1.Fascism, Nazism and Communism = The dictator will make the total decisions (of your life, relationships and livlihoods) for you, in the name of " The people" or "The collective" or "The party", 2. Feudalism = The monarch and the nobles will make the total decisions (of your life, relationships and livlihoods) for you, in the name of " The king or emperor", 3. Democracy = pretty well the same except allowing for some liberties of the individual, and the individual adult is allowed be a tiny stakeholder in the nation state by the vote (these last two concepts are disallowed by the totalitarian fascists, communist and hereditary monarchs with total power). Note that these types of governments exist in about the 190 nation states of planet Earth, with democratic nation states being in the minority of all countries.
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I don't agree with the analysis that Tic put forward, except that it makes more sense than "we're all Aryan brothers" nonsense proposed by Halder and Rundstedt. I strongly suspect that the halt order was given; 1. Because of the end of the logistics train that the the Panzers found themselves and needed time resupplying initially and 2. The French Army in the Dunkirk sector fought more skilfully there in a non-outflankable defense than the Germans had so far expected or received and so the Panzers attempted pushing forward after a scant few days of refitting, but without sufficient infanty and artillery units to overwhelm a well-prepared French Army defense in depth around the Dunkirk perimeter. Having been knowingly been defeated by the French in this critical action, which failed to prevent the British Army from evacuating Dunkirk (as well as some French soldiers), Rundstedt and Halder et al. Then later lied about the Halt Order, that erstwhile pushed the blame onto the dead Hitler's shoulders (again), and not about it being an actual battlefield defeat of the German Army in the offense in this sector (on their part to save face etc.), by the French Army at that critical time. Note that the French surrender was not signed until June 22, from which date the remaining French Army would cease fighting. Note that the last troops were evacuated from Dunkirk by June 4, when it was finally taken by the Germans, nearly 3 weeks before the armistice was signed.
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To be initially slightly reasonable to Churchill, there were significant Australian forces in North Africa (and Greece) at that time. However, in early-mid 1942 when major British offensives out of Egypt were being planned against Rommel, the Japanese invaded Rabaul and New Guinea (if you don't know where that is, get a map). The two main Australian army divisions in the Middle East (the 7th and 9th), were needed to defend Australia much closer to home by a rapidly advancing and utterly ruthless enemy. At the time, Australian undertrained and undermanned consripts called Militia were fighting seasoned Japanese troops in those Pacific places and losing. While Churchill very grudgingly released the 7th division from North Africa, like the schoolboyish idiot that Tik correctly identifies, insisted that they steer themselves (while steaming towards Australia across the Indian Ocean) towards the lost cause of the Japanese invasion of Burma. To his everlasting credit, the Australian PM John Curtin fought Churchill over long phone calls to prevent this, and in high dudgeon, Churchill refused to supply RN troop ship escorts (for 2 whole weeks) while most of the troop ships steered towards Fremantle. This is grave act of unnecessary treachery that could have been an unmitigated dssaster for the defence if Australia in 1942 , for which i personally hold Mr Churchill plausibly responsible. Okay, i've rammed this point home, unintentionally.
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Living standards in the 2 decades after WW2 only recovered in Western capitalist countries, e.g United States, UK, France, during the 1960s. These 3 countries continued to spend significantly into their industrial-military complex (although not at total war levels) because of the Cold War and decolonisation (which did not go well for either Britain or France). However, not at the expense of bringing back the pre-war consumer market, although this was slower to recover in Western Europe (and Australia), than the United States. For example, petrol rationing continued into the early1950s in the UK, and ended in Australia only by 1950. Furthermore, meat rationing in the UK continued until 1954. This was a sign of not a fully recovered consumer market, in capitalist countries, as a result of the total war military economy from 1939-1945. The socialist-totalitarian Soviet Union did not even get anywhere near as, say Western Europe, in establishing a proper consumer goods market by 1960. Consumer goods were always scarce in the Soviet Union, including in the economically better times of Krushchev. I agree with Tic, socialism (in any guise) fails miserably at economics.
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