Comments by "BlackFlagsNRoses" (@blackflagsnroses6013) on "" video.

  1. cheezemonkeyeater FDR was really a moderate like Bernie. Sustain Capitalism and have more economic and social justice. But he wasn’t a radical or revolutionary. Neither is Bernie. Social Democrats are for class collaboration not class struggle
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  2. Peter West yeah but FDR wasn’t a Fascist advocating the Corporate State. He was a modern social liberal who sought liberalism from State Capitalism of the robber barons. Classical liberalism is not the same as capitalism which started in the mid 19th century. In fact classical Liberalism gave rise to the early socialists like Thomas Hodgskin, David Ricardo, and John Stuart Mill. Social Democracy and FDR’s New Deal Coalition were and are a moderate take on class relations. It implements class collaboration instead of struggle, and government mediation between labor and business interests. Whereas the Fascists were extreme Corporative where the whole of society is made of corporations or bodies.
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  3. Peter West yes but Corporatism isn’t just concerned about labor and business relations. The entirety of society is subdivided into corporations such as labor and capital according to industry, science, medical, educational etc... all corporations mediated by the State for national interest. Mussolini said “You want to know what Fascism is? It is your New Deal.” Fascists saw FDR’s New Deal as a crude form of what their socioeconomic doctrine was. However this is why socialists like me want to go beyond Social Democracy, it is not post-capitalist, it maintains the capitalist status quo, and it is not committed to class struggle but class collaboration. It can be arguably a very moderate Corporatism, but again not as extreme as Fascism. Fascism goes beyond labor/union and capital/business interests and is far more Nationalist. The real American hero of the against Capitalism was not FDR, but Eugene V. Debs
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  4. PauliBhoy FDR saved capitalism. As usual moderate reformism like the New Deal and Social Democracies are still rules by capital. To the point where the US is back to robber barons and near unfettered capitalism. Unfortunately Socialism was hindered by the New Deal and Roosevelt’s administration.
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  5. PauliBhoy yeah that was a brain fart my bad. I was thinking of the Socialist Party he founded which was still fighting for Democratic Socialism until the New Deal basically did away with it. And explain what I advocate isn’t Socialism? I haven’t advocated anything. But Eugene Debs was an actual Democratic Socialist. I’m a Libertarian Socialist. What I was saying is Social Democracy is a moderate position in which class collaboration is promoted over struggle. And capitalism remains as the status quo. Government mediating between labor and business interests is similar to the Fascist Corporate State. In that Fascists believed in class collaboration towards national interests. The State regulating interest groups known as corporations or fascii. This isn’t to say Social Democracy is bad, or the exact same as Corporatism, but it’s not radical or revolutionary, it is not Socialist.
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  6. Peter West you’re talking to a libertarian socialist. I know what I’m talking about. And yes Market Socialism is a strain, the most radical being Free Market Anarchism like Benjamin Tucker and Proudhon’s Mutualism. Socialism isn’t just public ownership, that has variations. From communes, to syndicalism, State ownership, industrial federation/confederation, worker coops, collectives etc.... It’s a stride towards classless society. I don’t know if I mentioned here but I did say capitalism is a 19th century invention well after classical liberalism. Market system and capitalism aren’t synonymous. Classical liberals like David Ricardo, Thomas Hodgskin, John Stuart Mill were precursors to Socialism. Capitalism is a distinct socioeconomic system sustained by wage labor and underclasses ruled by capital. Social Democracy is not against capitalism, it just reforms it. Corporatism maintains the capitalist mode of production, the word privatization was literally made for the Nazis economy, but uses it for National interests through collective bargaining yes. Capitalism was never liberal, it was never free markets it was always about State privileges to capital, the ruling class. According to socialists like Proudhon capitalism is monopolistic and impedes free competition in free enterprise. Actual free markets have Democratic industrialization, competitive currencies, and competition so rampant the value of labor is the only value, and profit, rent, and interest are eradicated. Also property norms of Occupancy and Use. But this is the Market Socialist camp. Corporatism is still capitalism, it’s just not “liberal” capitalism where capitalists have no care but for individual profit. And like I said before Fascist Corporatism isn’t just about labor and business interests, it turns the whole of society into a Corporate State. Where corporations, syndicates, guilds, fascii, interest groups or whatever you want to call them are regulated by the government. And Social Democracy is a very moderate form of that kind of model in it’s mediation of labor and business interests, but remains liberal and concerned for social and economic justice, not nationalism.
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