Comments by "K `" (@user-jt3dw6vv4x) on "VICE" channel.

  1. True, many South Asian Americans with East Asian or even Southeast Asian features have faced COVID-19 related racism (especially Nepali Americans). It would be interesting to hear their views regarding Stop Asian Hate.
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  2.  @mimiad397  That's just in the USA. You may be surprised to know that in the UK, "Asian" means South Asians in colloquial contexts but they still know that East Asians, West Asians etc. are Asians too. So it's really just an American thing.
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  3.  @hejiranyc  There is no such thing called "Asian race". Idk what type of "Asian" you are speaking about when you say "Asian race" but I'm assuming you are talking about East Asians since this is an American video. Well the fact that is Asian is just a demonym, if you want to be specific about the type of people in the region you can say "East Asian" for example because not everybody in Asia is the same "race". Also, people must stop bringing up Russians as a point. White Slavic Russians are not Asians, they are not native to anywhere in Asia. The native people of Siberia (Asian Russia) are ethnically and culturally related to East and Central Asians. White Slavic Russians colonised Siberia.
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  4. Yeah they really need to bring in some dark skinned South Asians and Southeast Asians.
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  5. Ikr that was so confusing to me. I've noticed that there are some mixed white people who really want to believe that they face the same issues that non-mixed race people go through even though they are physically more similar to White Europeans or White passing. Someone needs to tell them that it's okay if they're white passing, it doesn't undermine that they are of mixed origin. However, trying to claim you face colorism when you're pale skinned or insisting you look "non-white" even when you're literally white passing (like I see many Americans do on TikTok) is just a strange thing to do.
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  6.  @MrColdwilliam  I agree with you but the global perspective will be kind of hard to achieve but they can certainly do a part 2 and include other groups (including recent migrants) to continue the discussion. That would be interesting because this video was very interesting.
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  7.  @cjo4210  Since when did "dark skinned people = Black Africans only"? You say they have "[nothing] in common with darker skinned people", so where do all the dark skinned South Asians and Southeast Asians go? Colorism in Asian communities has nothing to do with White European people.
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  8.  @hejiranyc  Exactly
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  9.  @Catlily5  India's colorism is not from caste. There are dark skinned people who are high caste and light/pale skinned people who are low caste.
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  10.  @HenryLeslieGraham  Maybe stop thinking everything is about left-right wing politics. OP made a valid point. If one is talking about colorism, why select people from mostly one racial demographic and people who are mixed race and fair/pale skinned?
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  11.  @Catlily5  I have to respectfully disagree, there aren't exceptions. Caste has a genetic element to it based on autosomal DNA but it's not exactly about skin colour. There are light skinned people who are classified as low caste in India (e.g. Other Backwards Class category) and that's because they're tribals. Caste is about occupation in society. Some of the most important gods in Hinduism like Vishnu and Krishna have dark skin.
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  12.  @Catlily5  I have to respectfully disagree.
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  13.  Vegas Element  No I absolutely am not. If you think a White passing mixed person in the United States faces colorism then you're either living in an alternate universe or have a strong desire to be treated as a victim.
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  14.  @lello5100  They bring up a point though. In the US, they always represent South Asian Americans with Indians (especially North Indian Hindus). The rest of that community is ignored. If you're talking about pan- Asian issues why would you only bring Indian Americans to represent the South Asian community? So when you're talking about something like Stop Asian Hate which was born out of discrimination against people of Chinese or East Asian descent or appearance as a result of COVID-19, it makes no sense to be asking the conservative Indian man called Vish Burra about his thoughts on Stop Asian Hate, who doesn't have East Asian features, because it hasn't affected him. He's never going to fully understand it. Conversely, there have been many South Asian Americans with East Asian or SEA features who have faced COVID-19 related racism. Many from the Nepalese American community have faced racial abuse and violence and a Sri Lankan American was bashed on the NYC subway. Nepalese Americans (all of whom look "East Asian" or "South Asian") have also widely participated in Stop Asian Hate rallies in the US because it affects them and their friends and families, it affects their community. So if you're going to discuss the topic of Stop Asian Hate with South Asian Americans, it makes more sense to discuss it with people who have had to change their behaviour or become vigilant as a result of their appearance. That means South Asian Americans with East Asian-looking features. I don't see why doing that is a problem. I'm from Australia, our former Miss Universe representative is of Indian descent but phenotypically she is physically more similar to Southeast Asian populations and the media interviewed her on COVID-19 racism and rightfully so because it has affected her and she's been an outspoken advocate for calling out COVID-19 related racism against East Asian-looking Asian Australians. So they can easily do the same here by bringing in South Asians that have faced this type of racism.
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  15.  @cjo4210  Huh? Where did you hear this?
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  16.  Zaydan Alfariz  He's no dark skinned, he's just trying to make an unjust remark about the USA
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  17.  @Catlily5  I don't think so. Nepal and colorism are not correlated. Many people can be high caste and be of darker colour but generally speaking, most Nepalis have lighter skin compared to most other South Asians (Himalayan people are generally the lightest people in South Asia). I would say it's because of India's cultural influence. India was the main cultural power in South and Southeast Asia and the concept of idolisation of light skin and high bridged noses among other things can be seen in Hindu poetry. Indian cultural influence spread across South and Southeast Asia so that explains why lighter skin is preferred across South and Southeast Asia (even in countries where a caste system doesn't exist and were never colonised such as in Bhutan and Thailand).
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  18.  @HenryLeslieGraham  I feel sorry for you people, imagine living in a toxic country where you can't see the world without making everything a left/right wing issue even when it has nothing to do with any of that. This is why the USA is experiencing societal collapse and China is rising. Have fun on the ride down Henry, I'll be laughing at the top.
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  19.  @shalonsmith3653  You're probably the type of person to think South Asians are just Indians and believe in sweeping generalisations, just saying.
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  20.  @HenryLeslieGraham  You're talking about the US, not the West. Don't drag the rest of the West into this. Nobody in Australia or New Zealand is obsessed with right/left wing politics unlike you. So like I said, enjoy the ride down Henry. You're focusing on the wrong things and you don't even realise it.
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  21. ​ @HenryLeslieGraham  Australia is not polarised along right and left wing politics unlike the US. There is no bona fide left wing and right wing party in Australia unlike the US. It is blurred. This is what I mean. Maybe do a little reading on Australian politics and society and you'll know. "You must not watch the news? I live in Australia, I know more about my country than an American. Be serious. Our location in the Indo-Pacific honestly has made us cultivate a different type of mentality.
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  22.  Vegas Element  If they're light skinned and white-passing they aren't going to experience colorism.
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  23.  Vegas Element  You must be a white-passing mixed race person that wants to be a victim so bad.
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  24.  Vegas Element  No, there was that man that was completely white passing. I'm from a country that is not obsessed with race unlike the United States of America. If people in my country saw that man on the street, everybody would think he's white. White-passing people don't face colorism. Don't make this about "sweeping generalisations" and all that, maybe stop wanting to be a victim so bad and just accept the fact that you're lucky to not have to worry about being stopped and attacked because of the colour of your skin and your features.
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  25.  Vegas Element  So white-passing, that explains why you're gravely offended by what I said.
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  26.  Vegas Element  He's white passing and I have every right to talk about it because I'm from a Western country and social media is American-dominated. Seeing white-passing people claim they're victims of colorism and racism is really strange to me because nobody sees you as anything but white European. Shouldn't they be glad that they don't have to face racism or colorism? The answer is "yes" but because of identity politics, so many of these people try so hard to be seen as victims and co-opt struggles of non-white people who just want to move on with their lives and not have to worry about these types of things. That white-passing man who said, "i'm the darkest black person in the room" while pointing to his pale skinned hand was really surprising to me.
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  27.  Vegas Element  I actually do know what I am talking about, you don't however because you're supposedly white passing.
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  28.  Vegas Element  I know exactly what I am talking about. You can keep replying to me and getting upset but I 100% know what I am talking about. Stop being xenophobic and just accept that I know what is being discussed here. Rich of you to talk about you facing colorism as a pale skinned man and then go on and be xenophobic to me in the same breath. Please, be serious.
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  29.  @shay5839  Colorism is not about race. Colorism is discrimination based on skin colour and it happens within the same ethnic group or race.
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  30.  @maxa6453  That's not at all what colorism is, that's what certain race-oriented people in the USA will say but colorism has never been about wanting to be European. Whiteness is not just about White European people. One of the people on the panel spoke about Asia and skin bleaching, in Asian countries and communities it's not about being proximate to White European people.
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  31.  @maxa6453  White does not equal European, that's the distinction here. Most East Asians have white skin too. Colorism isn't linked to race, it's a phenomenon that exists within many communities around the world.
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  32. Indo-European is just a language family, not a race and not everybody in South Asia speaks an Indo-European language (same with Central Asia and Iran). In fact, the people who brought Indo-European languages to South Asia are more recent because the first inhabitants of the region are actually closer to East Asians, Southeast Asians and Aboriginal Australians. The people who predominantly carry this ancestry are now in the minority in South Asia.
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  33.  @AngryKittens  Yes you are absolutely correct correct but Indo-European is a language family, it's not a race. Race is a social construct anyway. There are "East Asian" looking people in South Asia whose native language is Indo-European. There are "South Asian" looking people in South Asia and Myanmar who speak Sino-Tibetan languages. In the case of South Asia, this does not make sense. I know what you're talking about, you're talking about the Steppe pastoralists who brought Indo-European languages and understand what you're saying but the case of South Asia is very different because miscegenation has occurred ever since the first humans settled in the region. I wouldn't call it "Indo-European" either but Steppe ancestry. Dravidian speakers are not the first inhabitants of South Asia. They seem to have emerged from the IVC. The first inhabitants of South Asia are the AASI and they are related to East Asians, Southeast Asians and Aboriginal Australians. It's tribal groups in South Asia that have the highest levels of this AASI ancestry out of all South Asians, not the large Dravidian-speaking groups (Tamils, Telugu etc.). The AASI emerged from one of the earliest waves of humans out of Africa. This ancestral Asian population settled in South Asia and genetically split into three populations: AASI, ESEA of E/SE Asia and AA of Australasia. All of these groups are related to one another and consequently share varying degrees of affinity to an early modern human known as Tianyuan Man. Source: "A genetic history of migration, diversification, and admixture in Asia" - Melinda A. Yang, 2022 Nagas are like other South Asians. Everybody is a descendant of various migrations into the region that mixed together. The dominant ancestral component of the Nagas is known as Ancestral Tibeto-Burman (ATB), while small amounts of their DNA comes from mainland India much like the Meitei and Chakma. What I was trying to say is that not all South Asians speak Indo-European languages and genetically, the "Indo-European" component you speak of (which I call Steppe ancestry) is not the dominant component of any South Asian population that speaks an Indo-European language. The dominant ancestral component of most South Asians is Indus Valley Civilisation (IVC)-related ancestry, which is older than Steppe ancestry. IVC ancestry is predominantly made up of West Eurasian Neolithic farmer ancestry from what is now known as Iran (87%) with smaller amounts of Southeast Asian hunter-gatherer ancestry (13%) - related to that first wave f humans out of Africa. Source: "An Ancient Harappan Genome Lacks Ancestry from Steppe Pastoralists or Iranian Farmers" - Vasant Shinde et al. 2019 The IVC is also suggested to be the home of Dravidian languages. Yes, the case of Singapore is like any other area after the Era of Exploration, yes most Singaporeans speak an Indo-European language despite ethnically being Chinese, Malay, Tamil etc.
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  34.  @AngryKittens  They are Asians because they're from Asia. They're native to Asia. That is all. There is nothing more to it. Asian is not a "race" or "genetic grouping" and people need to stop equating a basic demonym term for describe natives of a continent with a so-called race. Nobody in Asia thinks "Asian" is some sort of race. You're conflating genetic terminology like "West Eurasian" or "ESEA" with geographical terms like "Asian". Steppe pastoralist is literally the name used for Proto-Indo-Europeans. You can read the genetic studies that use this term. IVC is likely linked to Dravidian languages but we do not know for sure and the genetic studies I have given you explain this very clearly. I really can't agree with your decision to equate language families to genetics with such a narrow definition and claim genetics is mostly defined in this way. Most Burmese are of Bamar descent who speak Burmese (a Sino-Tibetan language) but are genetically mostly made up of an ancestral Southeast Asian genetic component. Kinh Vietnamese, on the other hand, are genetically closer to southern Chinese than Bamar people are on a PCA. A lot of generalisations and simplifications are going on here. Broadly speaking, East Asian and Southeast Asian people are genetically overlap with each other and understandably so because the dominant genetic component of both groups is ESEA ancestry. The DNA that came with the introduction of language families is not the prime way one separates groups of people based on genetics. There is a lot, lot more to human genetic makeup than the ancient ancestors that introduced languages to various parts of the world.
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  35.  @AngryKittens  Sorry but it's not a vague term, it's the actual term used in academics. Everybody is termed based on position in human evolution: pastoralists, hunter-gatherers, farmers etc. There is nothing vague about it. So, for example, when geneticists describe the genetic landscape of South Asia, they will say South Asians are descendants of indigenous ancient hunter-gatherers known as AASI and subsequent waves of exogenous Neolithic farmers, Steppe pastoralists and/or Austroasiatic-speaking and Tibeto-Burman-speaking farmers. These terms are used to illustrate the type of technology that developed within a civilisation over time. So, for example, with rice cultivation in South Asia we know that rice was cultivated in the IVC because that was a farmer-based society and we know that Austroasiatic speaking farmers who settled in South Asia from the east also brought agrarian practices with them, introducing a new form of rice cultivation to the region. Same thing with Steppe pastoralists and the AASI were obviously less developed, due to their early origins, having been a hunter-gatherer-based society. Well Islander Southeast Asians are close to East Asians genetically. The idea that they're far apart is incorrect. It is generally understood that Austroasiatic-speaking farmers were present across a much larger land coverage of Southeast Asia (all the way into western Indonesia) and genetically speaking, Island Southeast Asians are close to East Asians. Both groups carry Basal East Asian DNA. This is why among all groups in Asia and the Pacific that carry some degree of East Eurasian/Eastern Non-African DNA, it is the ESEA (East/Southeast Asian) groups and Native Americans (who predominantly descend from a Basal East Asian lineage) that have the highest genetic affinity to Tianyuan Man (a Basal East Asian from northern China). If you look at all of the other groups in the world that have affinity to Tianyuan Man (Australians, Melanesians, South Asians, Central Asians, Maori, Romani), they are further away in genetic distance. So this idea that Islander Southeast Asians are not closely related to East Asians is incorrect. We already know, from studies dating back decades, that East and Southeast Asians are closely related. Both regions are in proximity to each other and it's understandable that genetic influence from various groups associated with East Asian-related DNA, would have impacted Island Southeast Asia to a great extent unlike Polynesia which is further away. Yes there is a genetic connection between Island Southeast Asians and Austronesian-speakers in the Pacific but that doesn't erase the fact that the closest genetic relation these populations have is with the rest of Southeast Asia and East Asia. All of these populations carry Basal East Asian DNA. Polynesians and Micronesians are also part of this same lineage albeit having split earlier. They're all descendants of ESEA aka East Asian-related lineages. Same thing with Indo-European-speaking South Asians, they all have Steppe ancestry but their dominant genetic component is IVC ancestry which is why they're comparatively closer to Iranian-speaking populations of Central and West Asia than to Europeans on a PCA plot.
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  36.  @AngryKittens  Some shorten it "Steppe pastoralists", others say "Western Steppe Herders" or "Western Steppe Pastoralists". Surely, you understand what I mean now. "You arbitrarily differentiated Western Steppe Pastoralists with the ancestors of the Indo-Aryan migrations" I absolutely did not do such a thing. When did I say Iranian-speakers reached the IVC???? Huh?? Please read what I said again and read the sources I have given you. I am talking about Iranian Neolithic Farmers. They are Neolithic-era farmers that originated in Iran long before the arrival of the Steppe pastoralists to South Asia. The Iranian Neolithic Farmers are NOT the same as the Steppe pastoralists. They are called "Iranian Neolithic Farmers" because they originated in what is now Iran, some say "Zagros" instead of "Iranian" because it conflates it with modern Iranian people who are of Steppe origin. The IVC was formed from Neolithic Farmers from Iran and hunter-gatherers from Southeast Asia. Read the genetic study I gave you in my other comment. That genetic study was the biggest genetic study done on the IVC and explained one of the main origins for modern South Asians. Idk why you think North Indians don't carry IVC ancestry. They do and they carry it at a high rate. They look the way they do because of that IVC ancestry, those with less IVC ancestry and more Steppe ancestry like in Kashmir look very different and more like the Tajiks. Idk if you're just using different terminology or something but Basal Asians are not any modern East Asian or Southeast Asian group or what you're talking about. Basal Asian DNA is connected to what is known as Eastern Non-African (ENA) and today, that ancestry is detected at the highest level among tribal groups found only in South Asia and Southeast Asia like the various Negrito tribes that retain archaic ancestry due to isolation. Source: "Genetic Connections and Convergent Evolution of Tropical Indigenous Peoples in Asia" - Lian Deng et al., 2021 - this genetic paper discusses Basal Asian DNA and also includes a map of the prevalence of Basal Asian DNA in modern Asia. I totally understand your sentiment about smaller groups being erased but I think we're coming at this from two different angles which is why there is disagreement in some areas of what we're talking about.
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  37.  @AngryKittens  The reality for most North Indians is that their main genetic base is not Steppe ancestry. Many love to hype up their claims of proximity to Europeans while deriding Adivasi tribals and low caste Indians who are comparatively closer to eastern Asian populations. Only the northwestern populations like Punjabis, Kashmiris and various groups in that region have a dominant base of Steppe ancestry. The rest of North India is largely a blend of IVC and Steppe ancestry. They idolise sharp (Eurocentric) features like high bridged nose whilst deriding neotenous features (flat noses, flat face etc.) and this is why you shouldn't be generalising to begin with. By generalising the whole of South Asia through the eyes of North India you're suggesting the default for South Asia is North Indian Indo-European-speaking people (which is literally what North Indian nationalists claim to be reality) and that's not reality. If there was any sort of "default" population then it would be the Adivasi tribes (dark skinned people with flat noses, flat faces etc.) found across South Asia from south India to Bhutan. If you're suggesting North Indians to be specific are the closest cousins of Europeans, that is not true. It's actually West Asians who are the closest cousins to Europeans. Both groups are of basal West Eurasian origin. Yeah Basal Asian is basically that large ancestral population that gave rise to the ESEA, AA and AASI populations of East, Southeast, South, Central Asia, the Pacific and Americas. It's ancient and their strongest affinity in modern humans is in various parts of South Asia, Island Southeast Asia and Australasia (especially Papua New Guinea). I agree with everything you're saying about Austronesian-speaking peoples but that does not change the fact that Island SEA populations don't share strong genetic ties with East Asia. I don't understand why you're focusing so much on the concept of "Asian" as understood by Americans. Nobody in Asia thinks of "Asian" as a race or something. It's just a demonym and a secondary thought for people that are actually living in Asia. So why should it matter what Americans think when they're not the ones living in Asia and are not aware of the serious cultural and genetic overlap that Asian populations share with other continents? In the US, they transformed "Asian" into some sort of racial, pan-ethnicity, pan-cultural identity due to racial politics. Asian, in its most basic and original form, is just a demonym and at its greatest extent it's just a cultural term. Why do I say it's cultural because Imperial Japan used "Asian" in a cultural context to refer to the areas of Asia culturally influenced by Indian and Chinese culture. This is why Japan tried to create Greater East Asia, a concept rooted in their own historical idea of Asia known as "Sangoku" (Three Kingdoms of China, India and Japan). Additionally, the whole concept of pan-Asianism has been rooted in culture (take for example Lee Kuan Yew's Asian Values ideology). The term, "Asian" has never been associated with genetics or appearance in the way it has been altered to mean in the US and other countries outside of Asia. The US has its own terminology because everything is centred around "race". It's the way things are for them.
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  38.  @AngryKittens  Being an Austronesian-speaker does not mean you're going to feel culturally close to all Austronesian-speaking populations. My friend is from Bali and a Hindu, outside of Indonesia, Singapore and Malaysia, she feels close to Indian Hindus. Why? It's because she's Hindu and her culture was influenced by India. Her clothing, name, etiquette an cultural mannerisms are most similar to India not to the Austronesian-speaking people of Madagascar or Tahiti. It should not matter what Americans have to say. Their worldview on this topic is narrow because migration to the US has been skewed.
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  39.  @AngryKittens  I wasn't...
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  40.  @AngryKittens  I watched it, not the whole thing though. Don't have time for that.
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  41. Colorism isn't about race though
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  42. Firstly, how is any of that mansplaining? This is not a woman's issue to suggest mansplaining is going on. Secondly, those men have differing views which is why you're upset at them. That's all there is to it.
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  43.  @falpflap892  I don't need to pay attention to chronically online people like yourself that feel the need to be triggered over everything. Mansplaining??? Nothing in this mansplaining. Stop getting triggered at everything because you want to be a victim so bad. This is why the USA is a declining power while Asian nations reach the top. Have fun on the ride down falp flap, I'll be laughing at the top.
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  44. ​ @rogeliorosas3068  How many accounts do you own?? Rich of you to talk about sensitivity when you made this into a gender issue, when it's not. Americans and their obsession with making themselves victims all the time. The world is tired. Sorry but you're NOT a victim. You want to know who the real victims are, go listen to the women that have to deal with rising misogynistic men's right movement in Asian countries like India and South Korea. Go listen to the poor women and girls that have to suffer in South Korea at the hands of men that engage in semen terrorism. Go listen to the Asian women that are trafficked as mail order brides to China and South Korea because there are too many men and not enough women.
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  45.  @rogeliorosas3068  The only sensitive and hurt person here is you. One has to be chronically online and yearn to be a victim if they are claiming this video involves mansplaining, when it doesn't. Always trying to find something to get triggered about. Clear signs of a decaying civilisation.
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  46.  @dystopiadaze  Stop logging into your 50 YouTube accounts to throw a tantrum because you're tiggered.😂 You're the same person pretending to be multiple people. These people always need to find something to get upset about. They want to be a victim so bad. They ought to be grateful for where they live.
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  47.  @dystopiadaze  You have nothing substantial to say to counter what I have said, so you continue to repeat the same thing over and over. Typical. Now I want you to do exactly what I tell you to do. Use that YouTube account of yours and reply to me again.
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  48.  @dystopiadaze  Omg congratulations you did exactly what I said. If I had gold stars, I'd give one to you. BTW, I already figured out you have multiple accounts. I acknowledged this days ago. You want it look like so many people are arguing with me when it's just one radical feminist behind a screen throwing a tantrum.
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  49.  @dystopiadaze  You're running out things to say and it's ironic how you talk about "basic English" and "democracy", the racism really jumped out. Well I'm from an English-speaking country so you don't need to worry about that but it's ironic to see how you want to fight for your rights but are also racist at the same time. It doesn't make sense but those radical White American feminists are known for being misandrist and racist. I shouldn't be surprised.
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  50.  @dystopiadaze  Nobody takes that group of people seriously, because all they do is complain about non-existent things. You're NOT a victim. That group of people should be grateful that they live in a country where they actually have rights. Stop complaining and actually contribute to society. Don't think America is going to pander to these people screaming 24/7 behind a computer screen. You're NOT suffering like the poor women who are incredibly brave and highly intelligent fighting so hard for their rights in Iran or those women and girls in Afghanistan who have been barred from getting an education and seeking medical help. You should be grateful that you live in a country where you actually have the freedom to do things.
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