Comments by "" (@jmitterii2) on "The Plain Bagel"
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REITs are a disaster to housing. And should be outlawed. They do the same thing back prior to the 1934, whereby many investors would gobble up land in various cities, especially during the 1800's and very early 1900's. Many surrounding towns, hence why there are surrounding towns and many of the capitols that were forming, are smaller, because the surrounding areas created their own townships with charter laws that outlawed the speculative nature of lots for sale. Keeping prices low and thus the lots were bought not by speculative stupidity and becoming unaffordable to essentially everyone, residents and employers alike, but kept them relatively affordable and thus they grew larger as a town while the capitol grew but slowly or just fizzled altogether and was moved to another town... Idaho... Lewiston, then moved far south to Boise. But then Boise started having the same land grab hording via speculative I want my goofy NFT cuz all the Paris Hilton's of the world are coming to town! So you have several, as you do in just about every major city in the US, other cities next to each other; all that chartered their property laws with anti speculative ordinances; limits on lots, requirements on development before even getting close to the max limit of lots per year or more, etc.
REITs really are a disaster for everyone... including morons who bought some of these shares on them... as they're also levered to the tits.
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The amount of debt in concern is insolvency throughout their entire banking system.
So plan on all the developers eventually becoming nationalized.
And the properties not built and even some that are, won't be because they were investment properties fueled by the prospects of more investors... no actual underlying demand.
Since 2013 we had those ghost cities... and even through to 2017 they were continuing to build on those ghost cities and build more ghost cities.
And as China's manufacturing became more expensive than other nations, they were losing any labor competitive advantage and subsidies by the Communist party on manufacturing long ago dried up and instead the various provinces were making money on the real-estate quagmire developing... there were Chinese executives on national/international programs warning as early as 2015 that it was an insolvent mess and when it finally busts... it's going to be spectacular.
The entire world utilized the borrower of last resort, China, in the 2008 western meltdown to get commodities up... lots of commodities went to the roof during the early stages of the western debt collapse. Brazil benefited from this early on. Many other commodity producers, particularly those near to the country like Australia saw their economies recover very quickly and not even dip into a full recession at the time... Australia not at all and only kept going with their own real-estate bubble never popping at all... while the commodities heavy Brazil.... by 2014ish went into a severe depression of which it sort of remains as commodities took a dump around 2015.
China is now down and out. The borrower of last resort... there really isn't anymore borrowers of last resort this time around internationally... and world banking systems are rather caught in a gigantic debt trap.
This is why you observe Russia acting "weird" invading Ukraine... and China with their "Zero Tolerance" policies... COVID really isn't the factor here... it has always been through this entire year, record protests... COVID just being an excuse to get people off the streets from protesting the insolvency of all of the developers and most of the banks. Summer they "relaxed" the COVID thing only to have those protests immediately re-ignite. And, surprise, surprise! WE have another possible lockdown due to "COVID".
The way a communist nation or really any other non-plutocratic nation would handle this bank bust... nationalize all the banks. Which is likely... and what this means creditors internationally, the rest of the banks internationally will get nothing. Their risk came to full fruition. Similar to Iceland where the banks were nationalized. Instead of bailing out the rich, they bailed out the country as a whole, redoing and remark to marketing all existing debts to the real values of the collateralized loan... your home is now worth 50% less... your principle is now origination amount 50% less, and all proceeding payments went to that loan... oh and interest rates are lower so we'll refinance that new half off mortgage at a lower rate... and you're now right side up on the loan to equity ratio with an even lower payment.
Who loses... the bankers and "investors". Which is what most nations should have done.
Now on an investor side of things... you should be scared... you're not going to get treated as the endangered species.
What makes China more complicated is that many of these properties were not even built, nor for their own use... they weren't living in these properties, but speculative investments to flip them or charge rent on them.
Only real demand was new investors with no actual real need/use demand. So... you could see remarking these loans to a newer market price may fail because investors suddenly right side up with some equity will immediately sell that property to lock in their profits only plunging prices further.
And now that the music has "stopped" the realization there is no real use demand, that it was only speculative fueled demand... it could take some time to reach a bottom on housing prices.
Additionally, there are more competition on labor for manufacturing outside of China... and lots of China's economy relied recently on their domestic housing bubble.
In addition, the Belt and Road policy, all of those loans across the globe to very poor nations, are also insolvent and cannot repay those debts made by various private and public enterprises of China... Belt and Road policy was a way to keep their people employed often sending them to these poorer nations to build the lent project: a sea port, airport, commercial or housing development, rail, etc. A type of Chinese worker program. And that's gone.
So household incomes are likely to fall and continue to do so.
Basically, as an "investor" any investments with China would be considered suicidal. Just stay away.
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