General statistics
List of Youtube channels
Youtube commenter search
Distinguished comments
About

Engineering the weird guy
7NEWS Australia
comments

Comments by "Engineering the weird guy" (@engineeringtheweirdguy2103) on "7NEWS Australia" channel.

Break even against what? I purchased a Tesla model 3 for 60k. I drive around 120/day for my work commute alone. At the rate I’m saving money at in fuel savings and regular servicing savings, after 5 years it would have cost me the same amount of money to buy, fuel/charge and service my Tesla model 3, as it would have to buy, fuel/charge and service an entry level Toyota Camry, except an entry level Toyota Camry doesn’t come with any of the features, comforts, safety, or performance at the Tesla. Break even point depends on where you set your bar.
4
On average a modern EV will last twice as long as a combustion car. With none of the regular maintainace and all the parts a fluids that go with it which all have their own footprint. EV’s will also do this for 10x less cost per km than combustion cars
3
You ok there bud? Nobody claims EV’s are perfect but they are by far better than combustion cars
2
You don’t understand much about how the energy grid and EV’s work do you?
2
The standard range Tesla model 3, the shortest range Tesla you can buy in Australia (which is shorter than the long range model 3 or performance model 3) has a 400km range. It would be fine, and exceptionally cheaper to use an EV than a combustion car.
2
The majority of Australia don’t regularly drive more than 400km per day. In relation to your question there are in the order of 150 or more service stations between Melbourne and Sydney once you’re outside the metropolitan area. In Germany fuel stations have begun adding charging stations. It is a relatively low cost investment but it was mandated by the government. If that occurred you would need only have 1-2 charging stations per stop to satisfy the current needs. But with the infrastructure as it is currently I would say if you do that trip regularly then EV’s aren’t for you. However they would be applicable and an appropriate choice for the other 98% of the country who don’t have niche anecdotal use case not shared by the average Australian.
2
Let’s talk about how good petrol and diesel are. They use exorbitant amounts of energy to drill from ocean floors (sometimes leaking killing millions of animals and destroying ecosystems but who cares right?) it’s the SHIPPED on cargo ships that use crude oil to fuel them as there are no environmental regulations in open waters, before its PIPED to fuel refineries where its refined using exorbitant amounts of grid electricity and by burning its own crude oil to heat up the rest of the crude oil, it also uses a lot of rare metals such as cobalt to remove sulphur from the fuel before it’s put in a TRUCK to go the fuel stations burning more fuel before it’s finally burnt in a combustion engine. And not only that, you need to continuously do that for every single km, you drive, unlike lithium which only has to go into a car once and will last 500,000 miles or so, before it’s finally RECYCLED into a new battery.
2
@robboot2801 or try to find a new job.
2
@robboot2801 people carry on about how the need 1,000km of range “minimum” claiming that’s their benchmark. If that’s the case that’s like 90% of the most popular cars in Australia off the table. But more to the point. When was the last time they drove 11 hours straight without so much as a pee break. My guess is never.
2
Why? Because they don’t make loud noises?
2
Still more emissions friendly than combustion engines even on a coal only grid (which Australia isnt). Especially when you think about the energy required to drill for oil, off platforms run by diesel generators, then to be shipped tho countries on ships run by burning crude oil. To then be transported by diesel or diesel pump to refineries. To then use copious amounts of grid energy as well as straight up burning crude oil into the atmosphere to refine the fuel, before its pumped into diesel trucks to be delivered to a fuel station where its pumped into a car where it is ultimately burnt into the atmosphere. But you’re right. close call
1
They’re really not though. And even when considering where the energy comes from. They are still vastly lower emission than combustion cars. Especially when you consider the energy and emissions used to refine and then transport the fuel in the first place. Infact EV’s are so efficient that’s it’s more fuel efficient to charge your EV off a small portable generator than it is to use that same fuel in a modern efficient combustion engine.
1
The Tesla model 3 and BMW M3 have similar price points and similar features. And are similar sizes in the same market niche. The model 3 however has more features which are native to having a large battery, as well as better performance, handling, safety and operating costs.
1
@phalanx3803 actually according to all known statistics as well as multiple vehicle safety Authorities around the world EV’s are actually 11 times less likely to spontaneously combust and 5 times more likely to combust in an accident. The only reason people think they are flammable is due to media bias in report vehicle fires. Vehicle fires happen all the time every day, it’s never reported unless someone famous dies… or it’s an EV.
1
@phalanx3803 for example I bet you didn’t know a handful of Kia models have been recalled this year for catching fire spontaneously. Or BMW and Mercedes last year, or Alpha Romeo the year before that.
1
Why would you need charging stations every 5km? What storage and charging issues?
1
@thomasdavie4813 it’s not 13 hours normal charge at home. It’s 4 hours. From from flat to full. Which you’d likely never need to do since you only have to charge up your daily drive. I drive 120/day in my model 3 and it takes 1 hour to charge. The shortest range Tesla on the market in Australia has a 400km range. Next shortest is 500km. The longest range is 700km. Charging stations are not 400km apart, for example take the Euroa super charger. It’s niebouring super chargers are yea (70km), Myrtleford (120km) and wodonga (150km). Or take the Bendigo super chargers which is more disadvantaged. It’s nearest are Ballarat (120km), yea (130km), moonee ponds (145km) and Horsham (215km). All well within the 400 minimum range. Not to mention that they are only Tesla super chargers. The cars can also use the charge fox, chadmino and RACV super charging networks ontop of that. Then there are the slower destination chargers. The ones that do 120km in one our. If you even need it.
1
@thomasdavie4813 and terrible product? Tesla is already the highest value auto maker in the world at the moment. The model 3 has one of the highest customer satisfaction ratings of any car. It’s the highest selling luxury car in the US in ANY category and out sells it’s next two competitors combined Doesn’t sound like a terrible product to me
1
@thomasdavie4813 you just repeated your initial comment twice
1
@thomasdavie4813 no. I just pointed at that you will rarely if ever need a super charging station more than once or twice a year, and that you just charge from home when you're asleep. I also pointed at that because you charge from home there is no issue with charge time. There is no issue with storage either. so now you're repeating the same concerns which have already been adressed. its like going to a doctor and saying cut off my foot because it has cancer. the the doctor pointing out that you only just have a splinter in your foot and all the you respond with is "my foot has cancer cut it off"
1
@thomasdavie4813 the lack of coherent logic behind it
1
And my do. Current EV ranges are more than satisfactory for most urban, sub urban and inner rural commutes. And charging infrastructure in Australia, whilst still in its infancy, is still adequate to travel interstate without adding more than an hour or two of stops, which is only 0.5-1.5 hours of downtime after the biologically necessities of travelling those distances (toilet, food, rest stops)
1
Someone’s salty
1
Actually various studies have shown EV’s to have remarkably low depreciation with the model 3 in the USA Having the lowest depreciation over the first 5 years of any car in history, in addition there are still 2012 model S’s with 300,000-400,000 miles (400,000-650,000 km) on the oddo still selling for over 70K USD.
1
@john abruzzi like all the ones in the US where they’ve been popular since 2012 and the 2012 model S’s are still going with 400,000-500,000 miles on the clock (600,000-800,000km) and still going?
1
@john abruzzi ...... and your point is? You’re claiming that in 10 years we will see heaps in junkyards. From what we see in the US, that’s categorically false. What does import costs have to do with that statement? You think that because you have to pay more money for them They suddenly don’t last as long or are somehow less recyclable?
1
@UCF3WfvuxRwxmXkboc_S-Iig and let me guess. You’ve had to rebuild the engine at least once? Either that or replace some major parts of either the engine or drive train? You’ve also had to regularly service the car every 10,000km to keep it running, replacing oil, filters and spark plugs? And do a major service every 100,000km (or less) where you have to replace everything else including timing belts and pumps? And you’ve probably broken down a whole number of times because of failing parts over the years as well. There are model S’s on the road today which have last 1 million miles without having the need for any major services or regular replacements of parts or fluids other than tires and brakes. That’s because a an EV has a couple of hundred moving parts. Nothing else wears. A combustion car as a couple hundred thousand moving parts. Most of them wear and some of them wear quite a lot. So much so you need to constantly replace parts and fluids to keep the thing going.
1
@john abruzzi most parts that aren’t regularly replaced in servicing (as as the distributor for example or fuel/brake lines which weather away) don’t go slowly. They go suddenly. Which is a break down.
1
@john abruzzi they don’t float. They sink. Why would you think they float!
1
No it’s not. The government still gets tax on electricity. But even before excise electricity is drastically cheaper than fuel. Coupled with the fact that EV’s are so much more efficient that it’s literally more efficient to charge an EV with a small portable generator than it is to use that same fuel in a modern combustion engine.
1
@nampam3945 well that’s a lie, I just looked up the specs of a Honda 2.2kW generator. It runs for 3.2 hours at full load on just under 1 gallon of fuel which is around 3.8L of fuel. So 0.84L of fuel for one hours operation at 2.2 kW’s Which gives 2.2 kWh. So how far will 2.2 kWh get you on a Tesla model 3 for example. Well a Tesla model 3 will get 130Wh/km. Or 0.13kWh/km. So 2.2/0.13 is 17km for only 0.84L. So that 20km/L of fuel. Or a fuel consumption of 5L/100km. If you do similar calculations with a diesel generator it goes as low as 3L/100km.
1
@nampam3945 I’m a Mechanical Engineer. This is sorta what I do. I wouldn’t try to bullshit me.
1
@nampam3945 I can link you to the Honda website which show the specs if you’d like. 5L/100km is a lot better than it’s direct competitor the BMW M3 at 11.6L/100km
1
@lordsamich755 probably worth adding to that, that if you only need to use a super charger on unusually long distance trips that the average person might take once per year or less. Every other day of the year they charge their vehicles either at home or at work when they're not using it. This means that statistically speaking the average person would save 16-17 hours per year from running around getting fuel each week. So perhaps counter intuitively, EV's charging actually saves you time. Not wastes it.
1
Do you really think it isn’t real?
1
Except Melbourne didn’t get sympathetic news coverage. Just 24/7 dictator Dan comments. Funny that there aren’t any dictator Gladys articles in the news though?
1
Not quite how that works bud. With any new technology, initial costs are high. Very high. Unlike existing technologies which have massive infrastructure to mass produce units extremely cheaply with capital equipment which has already been paid off. New technologies simply don’t have that massive supply/demand infrastructure, manufacturing infrastructure which has already been long paid off. In addition EV’s are fighting quite a bit of misinformation being spread by oil companies. Here are a few quick examples 1.) EV’s are a fire hazard: false, they are universal recognised as being 11 times less likely to spontaneously combust and 5 times less likely to combust in an accident compared to combustion cars. 2.) EV batteries don’t last long: false, EV batteries in current cars are set to last well over 500,000 miles (around 800,000km). (Compared to average combustion engine lifetime of 250,000-300,000 km) In addition previous generation batteries are already showing their ability to well surpass 500,000 miles of driving. 3.) EV’s cost more in servicing: false, EV’s don’t have transmissions, spark plugs, oil replacements, fuel pumps, timing belts, oil filters, etc etc etc. they require zero regular maintenance. They are for the most part, service free. 4.) EV’s can’t drive far enough: false, most EV’s these days can drive up to or well over 400km to a charge. Much more than your daily commutes. Most people only travel further than those distances once or twice a year. 5.) You’ll be waiting hours to charge your EV: False, whilst it takes hours to charge from a home charger (1-4 depending on battery level). You won’t be waiting for it. EV’s are typically plugged in at home when you’re not using it. You get home, plug it in, continue with your evening, dinner, family time, sleeping, morning rituals, before coming back to the car. The car has on average between 10-14 hours in which it can take its 1-4 hours to charge while you’re not using it. Meaning without any effort at all you get up each morning with a full tank of gas. Instead of driving to a fuel station every week to get fuel. This last point is praying on people’s ignorance in automatically accepting that EV’s aren’t dissimilar to other vehicles in that they need to go to a station to charge. They don’t, they do it at home. Some people in these comments have said if we had EV adoption, there would be ques at charging stations a mile long of people waiting hours to charge. Simply not the case. You’d only need to do that if you were on a long distance trip which most people don’t take very often. You’d also be using the super charging network which will charge your car anywhere between 5-40 minutes with the medium time being around 20 minutes. That network is expanding rapidly every year in Australia yet alone the rest of the world.
1
Download the PlugShare app. Have a look at every charging opportunity from Melbourne to mt Gambia. Alternative go and google “a better route planner” and select what ever model EV you want and put in your start and end destination and it will work out how to get there and how long it will take
1
After a quick check it says you can get there in 4 hours and 45 minutes, inclusive of 28 minutes charging at Ballarat. As for when you get there, there are free public chargers at a pub, at a McDonald’s and 2 hotels/resorts in the the town centre alone. Free to use 24/7.
1
Won’t quite work like that. Sorry.
1
@john abruzzi because you can charge your EV anywhere there is electricity. Namely at home or at work. Most EV owners charge their cars at home when they’re asleep and otherwise not using it. Full range the next morning. Unlike combustion cars, EV’s don’t have to que at a dedicated fuel station to get fuel each week. The only time EV’s typically need to use a public charging station is when you’re doing a long road trip (over 400-500+km). A trip most people only take once or twice a year. Even in Australia.
1
well the Cheapest Tesla being the model 3 is the direct competitor of the BMW M3, They are both similar is cost. The model 3 has more features, better performace and better handling. The model 3 also doesnt require any servicing and is more than 10x cheaper to run per km and has a higher safety rating that the BMW. Infact I am a lower middle income earner, just starting out my career in Engineering, so im only just trailing off graduate wages and I purchase my Tesla Model 3 on graduate wages. (it was a big financial stretch). I deemed the cost justified though. here is why; The model 3 is a very cheap car to run. Infact its so cheap without servicing or fuel that I worked out that with the amount that I drive, after 5 years it would have cost me the same if I had purchased, charged, and serviced my Tesla Model 3 than if I had purchased, fuelled and serviced an entry level Toyota Camry, but after the 5 years I still have something that has better performance and features that a BMW, Audi or entry level Mercedes. I also justified it because of the massive jump in safety, the model 3 being the second highest scoring car on the AANCAP safety board the year I purchased it. The Tesla Model X being number 1 and the Tesla Model X being 4th. with the Mercedes CLA in third. They are incredibly cheap to run. more than a year since my purchase and i'm already looking at beating that benchmark with the Toyota Camry before 5 years is up. These cars are also designed (yes, battery and all, dont buy into the blatant lies spread about EV's) to last more than 20-30 years worth of driving. How much do you think I would have saved after 2 decades with my model 3 compared to if I had purchased a toyota Camry or a BMW M3?
1
@JulAlxAU like it or not the BMW M3 is the main competitor for the model 3. As it stands the average Austrlian doesnt own a new car. They own second hand cars. There are no second hand cars if other people dont buy them new in the first place. There is a huge media bias against EV's in this country. Which makes it all the more worse. I agree we need more insentive. Its new technology, people are always hesitant about new and it doesnt help with all the misinformation out there, even from our own prime minister. The way the become affordable is if interest is shown to incentivise the import of cheaper models and if there is a second hand market for them. Even on a coal based grid EV's are vastly better for the environment over combustion and even dramatically better for public health. I don't see the need to swap with green energy just yet, but to slowly add to it with green energy as required.
1
Oil company political donations
1
Actually the technology is already there. We are already seeing older generation EV’s outlast their combustion counterparts with no mandatory servicing outside of tires. And newer model EV’s are designed to last well over 500,000 miles, batteries included. So construction quality is good, so is their lifetime Tesla’s finish quality when initially ramping up to mass production was poor, with paint issues and panel gaps, hardly major mechanical issues, and something every automaker on the planet went through when stepping into those kind of production numbers for the first time. Super charging times are down to 5-15 minutes, hardly slow, and most people charge their EV’s at home when they’re not using the car. Statistically speaking that saves the average commuter 17 hours a year not having to find and get fuel. Further to that Tesla’s shortest range vehicle has a 400km range, very few if anyone at all has a daily commute more than that distance. EV’s also have better performance and safety than combustion cars, they also cost 10x less to run per km, and features native to having a large battery make the cars far more convenient and practical. For example forgot where you parked? You can see your car on a map in live time, honk the horn or flash the lights from anywhere in the world. Forgot to wind up your windows, they’ll send you a notification telling you and it’s as simple as a button on your phone from anywhere in the world to wind them up. Went away for a trip and left it on the driveway blocking in your wife’s car? From anywhere in the world you can unlock the car and give remote access to drive it. Parking next to a dodgey car or in a dodgey area? High definition cameras record around the car constantly as a huge deterrent to vandalism and also means, unlike any other car in the market, you can chase up people responsible for door dings on your car and go through their insurance without raising your premiums or playing an excess. If you want to leave your dog in the car you can leave the aircon on indefinitely or turn it on or off to heat up or cool down the car before you even get in it. Seat heaters included. The technology is already there. Don’t be fooled.
1
@gazg1546 as for the cost. really. you think EV's are more expensive than fuel... REALLY?! laughable idea but no. Average price of Electricity in Melbourne is around 25c/kWh. The model 3 uses 0.13 kWh/km, that means it costs 3c per km of travel. The average fuel price in Melbourne is $1.42/L, for a car that does a conservative 7L/100km, it costs 10c per km. which is to say, a fair bit more expensive than eletricity. but it gets worse, that's not apples to apples. The models 3's closest competitor in price, features and performance is the BMW M3, which has a combined fuel consumption of 11.5L/100km. Which puts fuel at 16c per km. but wait theres more there is nothing to service on EV's. No oil filter, no engine oil or transmission oil, no fuel pumps or spark plugs and no timing belts. that means that you're saving on average around 4c per km. which means that your 16c per km, inclusive of regular maintenance is 20c per km. so no. not more expensive. They last longer than a standard combustion cars starting at a lifetime (to 70% of original capacity) of nearly 500,000 miles (800,000km). They also perform better having a drastically lower centre of gravity, and better acceleration and response without sacrificing practicality and they are also safer than combustion cars.
1
So. So very wrong. Firstly modern EV batteries last well over 500,000 km. Which is 30-40 years of driving for the average person. Secondly modern renewables last 30-40 years also. Third, even if EV’s are run from a pure coal grid they still pollute significantly less over their lifetime than combustion cars (yes, that’s including manufacturing and end of life). And lastly, LPG is not clean, like oil and gas they are hydro carbons. Meaning they still emit. Additionally while the emissions aren’t as concentrated as say coal, they are far more toxic to people and wildlife.
1
Long comment but I thought laying out all the details might help.
1
And you base that on what exactly?
1
Driving Melbourne to Sydney in my standard range model 3 takes me an extra 1.5 hours. Not really worth complaining about seeing as I am saving on average around 17 hours a year on refuelling a combustion car.
1
lots of mis-information there. Firstly EV batteries currently are set to last more than twice the average distance of a combustion engine. Secondly while they are more emissions heavy to produce (around 1 Ton of emisions extra) over their lifetime, even on a coal based grid EV's will produce 30-40 tons less emissions over their lifetime. Third EV ranges today are very close to normal cars tank ranges for similar type vehicles. For example, a long range model S can get 700km. while the cheapest Tesla you can buy in Australia at $60k AUD has a range of 400km. Even the new Nissan Leaf has a range of nearly 400km. and there is a super charging network allowing you to get anywhere in-between Adelaide and cairns. I can drive Melbourne to Sydney with only 1.5 hours stopped for charging. with the food, toilet and fuel breaks i'd usually take anyway on that trip that's only an extra 45 minuets spent charging. I can get from Melbourne to Mt Gambia with only a single 28 minute stop even on the shortest range Tesla available in Australia. No one is suggesting electrics should replace freighting or agriculture but rather personal vehicles of the 95% of Australians who live cities or suburbs and even some in rural communities.
1
Advancement doesn’t occur without investment
1
@hankmoody9965 that’s a very naive view of how the world works. In reality thing become cheaper for 3 reasons. 1.) technology and manufacturing improvements which give better results for less cost. But this only happens if interest is generated in the development of the technology. That means people need to want them, they need to buy them. The money from the sales goes towards continued development. 2.) economy of scale, the more people want them, the more that are made. The more you make, the cheaper they are per unit. You want your car to be cheaper, people need to buy them more. 3.) second hand options. The more people buy into a market, the more second hand option are available as it penetrates through the market. But this assumes people buy them on the first place. At any way you look at it, if you want an affordable EV you need to invest in them. Straight up. As for the cost currently, the Tesla model 3 which is an excellent car goes for around the sale price tag of a BMW, or entry level Mercedes. Every time you see someone driving an BMW, Audi, Mercedes, Jaguar, Lexus, most Voltswagon models, new land cruisers or patrols, all those cars are worth more than a Tesla model 3. That’s a lot of people who can afford one. How do other people get their hands on these cars? Second hand. But nobody buys into EV’s in Australia because of all the misinformation and lies spread about them by the media. Also because they are new and people don’t often trust new. The way you get around that is with incentives.
1
@hankmoody9965 you name me the top 4 biggest flaws with EV’s and I’m betting more than half of them are blatant misinformation.
1
@hankmoody9965 for my previous points 1 and 2, automotive manufacturers will only send vehicles over which do well in that market. If we don’t take up EV’s they won’t be sent here. There is a lot about supply and demand. I wasn’t insinuating that you were anti-EV and I apologize if I came across that way. I’m just trying to outline that adoption won’t happen passively if there is an anti EV campaign actively working against it. As for your issues raised, not quite 4 points but I’ll elaborate on the two you did raise and I might mention a few things you didn’t realise or didn’t know about. Infrastructure: there is enough infrastructure in Australia for rapid charging alone to travel from Adelaide to cairns and anywhere in between. And they infrastructures is increasing constantly. I live in Melbourne with a model 3. I’ve never been excluded from going anywhere. Even with my standard range, not a long range variant. I even had to go pick my brother up from Benalla in the middle of the night when he hit a roo. And I had no issue or second thoughts about it. It only took a 15 minute stop at the euro super chargers on the way home. Only slightly longer than the 5 minute fuelling stop id have to take if I still had my old Impreza. Ontop of that I can charge my EV anywhere there is a power point. This means every times I’ve travelled somewhere, most places have some form of outdoor PowerPoint. I’ve stayed at multiple air bnb’s and gotten a full charge overnight. A step up from that is there are many many many places which have destination chargers. For example when I took a trip the the beach at Phillip islands, there was a destination charger at the public bus depot. I didn’t really need to but I plug in there and it meant I could leave the aircon going while we were at the beach on a 42 degree day and it was fully charged and Icey inside when we got back to the car. Destination chargers are relatively cheap and easy to install and are popping up all over the place. If you want to see the tens of thousands in Victoria alone simply download an app called PlugShare and have a play. It outlines all public charging infrastructure in Australia. The next you mentioned cost. Tesla’s are some of the highest priced EV’s on the market, because they’re luxury vehicles. I purchased mine for $60k AUD. I’m a lower middle income earner. It was a stretch and a big decision for me to purchase the model 3. But I did so because I worked out the following. Fuel prices are only ever going to increase but when you work out the cost per km on the yearly average fuel price with a comparatively efficient 8L/100km car, you get 12 cents per km. Whilst a model 3 will use 1.2 cents per km worth of electricity which becomes cheaper if you also have solar. Additionally EV’s don’t need servicing. There is absolutely nothing to service. That also saves a significant amount of money over time. And the more you drive the Tesla the more vast the savings become. As it stands at the current rate I’ve been driving my Tesla it will have cost the same the purchase the $60k Tesla, charge it, and maintain it, as it would have if I had purchased, fuelled and maintained an entry level Toyota Camry. So while the upfront cost is much higher and hard to swallow, ultimately it’s significantly cheaper, especially since the car is set to last around 20-30 years before it required a battery replacement. So upfront cost is high, lifetime costs, much lower. As a result of working this out prior to my purchase, I decided that stretching my finances to buy a $60k car was cheaper and worth it in the long run but I also get a car that has the luxury and performance equal to or exceeding BMW’s Mercedes or Audi’s. I also get one of the highest rated cars for safety on the market. So in all it seemed like a no brainer to me. But it’s something a lot of people don’t understand. I was spending $60 of fuel every week, now, instead of paying $60 per week on fuel, I’m spending $10 a week on electricity.
1
@hankmoody9965 well if you’re ever in Melbourne hit me up. I’d be glad to take you for a spin.
1
Not exactly true. Even from a coal only grid, EV, wells to wheels produce significantly less emissions over their lifetime
1
It’s actually not. World Powers are trying to impliment a global carbon tarif. That means that your exports/imports will be taxed depending on your countries carbon footprint and environmental policies. Weather Australia signs up for it or not, as the Tarif is imposed by the countries we’re importing/exporting with. What that means is if we keep fucking around with environmental policies like tax EV’s and committing an entire generation to a gas lead recovery, pretty soon Australia won’t be able to compete on the global market, cost of living will skyrocket and exporting business such as fruit, ore, wool, meat, wine, gas, etc, will have to close as they won’t be able to competitively compete. So we’d be left with a tanked economy. This isn’t something new either, it’s been inching its way toward implementation for years now and it’s almost here. So all these politicians who think a gas lead recovery is the way to go after they actively ignored the contradictions from their own science organisation (CSIRO) their own Energy Market operator, and Nobel prize winning economists to chase a gas lead recovery on the basis that they asked gas executives where recovery money should go and they said “just give us the money” despite gas being one of the most expensive forms of energy you can get. Gas is definitely not the answer.
1
You know planet of the humans was thoroughly ridiculed and debunked by the wider scientific community as being grossly inaccurate right? Such as using solar panel specs which havn’t been current for 30 years. Seriously, you can find point by point breakdowns of the entire shamble with a very simple search.
1
My model 3 has been worth every cent and more of the 60k AUD I paid for it. Especially when you consider the features, comfort and performance it gives, not to mention the safety and drastically reduced fuel and servicing costs.
1
@glenngolding6375 I guess it will always come down to personal opinion but I never got my model 3 because it was eco friendly. I got it because I thought it was the best decision. $60k is around BMW pricing, which is costly for me. And while it does come with all the bells and whistles you’d expect on a car in that range it also comes with a gaggle more because of the advantages of having a huge battery. Ontop of that it out performs the BMW’s Audi and Mercedes in that price range and has a better safety rating. But most of all, Electrics don’t need servicing and they’re a lot cheaper to run. 1.2 cents per km for my model 3 in electricity vs 12 cents per km. That’s a big saving. And that’s excluding regular servicing. The only thing you need to look after are brakes and tires, even then the brakes will last 5x longer because most of the braking is done by the electric motor in regenerative braking. We ended up with the model 3, because it has a 500km range which is more than enough for me. Better safety, performance and features than anything else in its price bracket and after 5 years it would have cost me the same to have purchased, serviced and fueled my model 3 as it would if I had purchased, serviced and fueled an entry level Toyota Camry.
1
@glenngolding6375 bottom line. It comes down to personal preference but I think a lot of people don’t realise that the technology is already there. And it’s a more sensible purchase than a lot of people realise.
1
do you honestly think that the energy does nothing year on year? since the first power station was built power capacity has never failed to double every 20 years or so. By the time we reach 50% adoption, we will have 3-4 times the current power capacity we do today. In addtion, even on a coal only grid, EV's are far better for the environment and for peoples health than combustion cars. And Australia isnt a coal only gird. hell in victoria is well over 20% renewables and SA is getting up to 70%.
1
@stephenbrown5921 I live in Victoria. I can’t remember the last time we had a brownout other than when lighting struck a national grid interconnector throwing NSW, QLD, ACT and Victoria into rolling blackouts.
1
@stephenbrown5921 also the government also pays around $3 billion a year to fuel companies to subsidise fuel. I’m sure they’d love to pocket that money instead
1
@stephenbrown5921 also worth mentioning that EV’s are typically charged when energy demand is at its lowest.
1
@stephenbrown5921 Actually I was wrong, the governement last year handed $10.3 billion of taxpayer money to fuel companies last year alone. And last year only $20 billion was brought in by fuel tax. Thats half of the fuel tax spend on subsiding fuel. So while im all for Ev's paying something to make up some of the lost revenue which would have otherwise gone to public use, I dont see why EV's should have to pay to subsidies a fuel they dont even use. and southern states of 35? South Australia has been a net exporter of energy since 2018, and tasmania and NSW have been net exporters for longer than that. and whilst growing a second head isnt accurate the reality is almost as dramatic, Microparticle emissions caused by fuel refineries and tailpipe emissions are so bad for peoples health that your life expectancy can drop by as much as 15 years or more just by living with 5km of a major freeway. infact in Australia, more than 6,000 people die every year due to microparticle emissions. and for every one that dies another 20 require on-going medial aid which costs the tax payer sever billion dollars every year. Children who live in close proximity to fuel refineries have a higher chance of mortality and cognitive developmental defects. In otherwords, if you child grows up near a fuel refinery they're more likely to be dense as a door stop. I know everyone likes combustion cars because they make loud noises and tickle your cliterous when they rev their engines but is it really worth all that suffering. 3 times as many people every year due to tailpipe emissions than died in 911. so whats the excuse? 911 didn't make sick turbo noises?
1
@stephenbrown5921 i'm sorry if all that seems a bit intense, but I don't understand hanging onto a technology which is out dated and is literally slowly killing you. I own an EV. I'm not saying everyone should have one, or that they're suitable for everyone or every application. I'm not saying we should ban new cars or ban fossil fuels. I dont want any of that. But i do want all these bullshit myths about EV's and renewables to stop being spread out of fear of something people dont understand. for example you've probably heard that EV"s are a fire hazard. thats false, according to the beuro of statistics, the AANCAP safety board, European NCAP safety board, the US highway traffic and safety Authority, EV's are 11 times less likely to spontaneously combust and 5 times less likey to combust in a serious accident and when they do combust are usually more survivable. you've probably also heard that EV's have a short life, also false, EV's on the road today have already started punching more than 500,000 miles (800,000km) without any real servicing what so ever. and one has even gone over 1 million miles. They are designed and generally accepted by the Engineering community to last at least twice the average lifespan of a combustion engine. you've probably heard that the SA big battery cant power adelaide for very long therefore its a waste of money? thats false, that was something started by our dear primeminster who would have had a report telling him that, that is exactly NOT what the battery is designed to do. When wind and solar are over performing for grid demand they have to be shut down, wasting all that every. Similarly when they're under performing but still performing. its called curtailment. Batteries absorbe the excess energy when they're over performing and deposit what they're short for when they're under performing. making renewables more efficient and more reliable. ontop of that unlike coal or gas, which have a response time of 5-12 seconds. the Big battery has a response time of just a few nano seconds. that means it can respond to fluctuations in the grid much faster making it far far FAR more stable. Infact in the last 3 major events which either blacked out NSW and VIC or sent them into rolling blackouts, SA was unaffected because the Big Battery regulated the grid frequency fast enough to prevent it from ripping the other generators out of phase and off the grid. Here is another one. Renewables are unreliable. You've heard that one right? makes sense, sun doesnt always shine, wind doesnt always blow. However when you have a gird with minimal storage, and diversified renewables, the grids actually become more stable. Whilst it may not be windy in one location, if you go 50km, you'll likely find somewhere the wind IS blowing. Again, Australia is a large place, only extremely large weather systems overcast entire states, distributing solar over many areas helps to stablalize their output. and when you have wind AND solar both distributed across large areas you start to get something very consistent. If its overcast one place, its usually windy. If there is no wind in another place, its likely sunny. Renewables have had such an impact that SA which used to have the most unreliable grid in Australia, invested in renewables and storage and according to the AEMO are now one of the most stable gird in Australia. They also went from being the most expensive wholesale energy prices in Australia to being the second cheapest wholesale prices right being Tasmania as number 1. and all that with 70% renewables. and its not just SA. Germany has alot of renewables. And now they have one of the most stable power grid in the world, somewhere in the top 5 last I checked. They also have some of the cheapest wholesale energy prices in the EU. But here comes another myth. Germany retail energy prices are very high, some of the highest in the EU. so people blame that on renewables. In reality renewables have driven down the WHOLESALE price of electricty. The government then adds a 44% tariff the that whole sale price to make the retail price very very expensive. Its not renewables making Germany's power expensive. its government taxes.
1
@stephenbrown5921 Sorry for the rant.
1
@stephenbrown5921 I have nothing against combustion cars. They’ll still be needed for a lot of industries for years to come. But I think we don’t have as much catch up as you think we do.
1
@stephenbrown5921 personal opinion of mine tho
1
Why do you say that?
1
Countries like American and Canada?
1
I wouldnt worry about that. ever since the first power station was built, power capacity has doubled every 20 years. by the time EV's reach even 50% uptake, the grid will have plenty of energy for demand. Its something people forget. We're not going to all go out an buy and EV each overnight. Its going to take several decades. almost a lifetime, and in that time the power gird will keep doing what its always done, upgrade/improve/expand.
1
@OZZYxcon_GTSR1000hp actually in a lot of cases, grid stabilising is typically because the grid is equipped to handle the quantity of rooftop solar being fed into the grid despite the AEMO warning the government about this emerging trend for the last decade. Due to frequency response, taking large energy sinks offline helps the grid to stabilise the frequency of older stations. Also it might be worth noting that over the last few months, older generators have been intermittantly taken offline for repair and schedule maintenance, however power companies don't often communicate when their repairs and refurbishment are going to occur with other power stations, as such an unusually high number of power stations have been shutting down after the summer peak for repair and refurbishment. However that might just be Victoria. It really depends where you are and where you live, as local conditions can also have a large impact on stability such as how many other power users are tapped into the same transfer station for example. If you're in an industrial area, the frequency at which the frequency needs to be modified to remain stable can be more, if other industrial processes are occuring nearby. an anecdotal tale about how a single smelting plant observed is operated, while interesting, isn't very representative of a nation or even state grid.
1
The media like to mislead people about the ban. It’s not a ban saying you can’t drive your combustion car, or that you can’t by fuel for it, or that you buy a second hand combustion car, no, it’s only that you can’t buy a brand new combustion car. Don’t be fooled.
1
Well the lithium is only used once per car unlike fuel which is drilled for every km driven for every car and it’s also entirely recyclable once the car is spent. As for advantages, EV are safer, have typically better performance, provide smoother driving experience, better handling, more cargo/cabin space, have better features native to large batteries such as app connectivity allowing for you to turn your aircon and heated seats on, unlock and let people drive without a key from anywhere in the world, always on security cameras capturing 360 high definition footage, being able to run the aircon while children or animals are in the car. They also cost less to drive per km, by as much as 10x less and require zero regular maintenance. So there are a lot of benefits.
1
@Leon-wd3ng lithium in batteries is, like the rest of the 95% of the batteries, readily and continuously recyclable. EV’s also last twice the lifetime of a standard combustion vehicle. And whilst all up, from mine to wheels, that accounts for 15% more emissions on production which equations to around 1 ton of emissions, it also means from well to wheel during its service life, that EV’s will cause 30-40 tons less emissions than combustion vehicles. A significant amount less. And more than offsets the 1 tons extra during production. And that only gets better when you start adding renewables to to the energy mix. Also the volume of lithium required for the lifetime of an EV is nothing compared to the volume of oil needed for the lifetime of a combustion car.
1
@Leon-wd3ng my model 3 cost me $45k USD and comes with all the features you’d expect in an EV plus more.
1
There is a lot about this comment which is wrong. Where do I start? Well aside from performance most people get EV’s because they are far cheaper to run and save people a lot of time. They also buy them because they’re safer. Battery technology in an EV is decidedly NOTHING like your phone except that they both have lithium. EV’s have some of the most sophisticated Battery Management Systems on the planet. The batteries are sitting inside a coolant which keep the batteries inside an optimal temperature range. They have a dedicated computer system to monitor charge voltage across the batteries to make sure the cells are within an astonishing 0.0000001V of one another. The car regulates the speed of charge and discharge according to the battery temperature and state of charge. If you were to drag off a Tesla at 50% charge it won’t be as fast as 100% charge. Despite being more than capable of doing so. When you’re cold, battery regenerative braking is reduced, similarly when it’s too hot. Charging you EV on a rapid charger takes longer to go from 90% to 100% than charging from 20%-80%. On top of that EV batteries are rarely if ever drained to zero. Likewise they are usually only charged to 80% or 90% except for when you know you’re going to drive a long distance (when you have a range of 500km which is refreshed every single day, and your daily commute it only 100km, you don’t typically need to charge to 100%). This is unlike a phone which is regularly charged to 100% every single day and drained to 0 or near 0% every single day. Charging to 100% regularly or draining to flat can be extremely devastating to battery health when done consistently and regularly. All this means is that modern EV’s will last well more than 500,000 miles (800,000km) to a state of 70% of their original capacity (industry standard end of life for EV’s). Older generation Tesla’s are already achieving this. A quick google search reveals this. That’s double the standard lifetime of a combust engine and it’s without any of the regular servicing required for combustion cars.
1
Also a new battery RACK costs that much. That’s the housing and coolant systems of the battery inclusive of the cells. EV battery packs are made up of thousands of 18650 batteries (google image search them). To replace the cells it’s as simple as picking up the floor of the car and replacing them. It costs around $7k today. 2 years ago it cost $10k. Prices are dropping as manufacturing ramps up. And you only gotta do that at 800,000km. If losing 30% of your range bothers you.
1
Plug in hybrid batteries are smaller. That gives them smaller cycles. Smaller cycles actually wear the batteries faster. Hybrid batteries do not last as long as EV batteries. Again, very simple to google
1
@DerekVuong7799 the cooling system does decrease range slightly but improves battery life. However in most climates the effects are negligible. Also it’s a cooling/heating system. As for EV batteries what like would you like? There are blogs talking about what it’s like to own a Tesla at 300,000 miles, 400,000 miles, 500,000 miles (800,000km) and articles talking about the first Tesla to crack 1 million miles. There are quora forums talking about EV battery technology being designed to last that long. What do you want to see. Because it’s as simple as typing “Tesla at 500,000 miles” into google to get all those results.
1
@DerekVuong7799 as for battery use, as mentioned earlier, people very rarely drive more than 100km in a day for their daily commute. That’s around 1/5th the range or less. Sure people might exceed that once or twice a year but not all that often. Not enough to cause permanent damage to the battery. So off the batt we know know that for most people they won’t use more than 20% (1/5th) a full charge. So it’s never deeply drained. Tesla’s also warn the driver automatically if they try to charge to 100% about battery damage if done too often and recommend a charge to 80% or 90%.
1
@DerekVuong7799 The battery longevity of plug in hybrids isnt born out of how deep the cycles are, is the cycle size. Modern EV Batteries have a cycle life of 1,500 cycles (which by the way, a life is classed as degradation to 70% of their original capacity). So for an EV which has a large battery representing 325 miles of range. over 1,500 cycles, that's nearly 500,000 miles. however a plug in hybrid has significantly less battery storage than an EV. The wheels are also driven entirely from the battery of the hybrid, not from the generator directly. This means that it can only go 25 miles to a cycle. 1,500 multiplied by 25 miles is 37,000 miles which is 60,000 miles. Most people however dont notice this. As for 1) the is at 70% health still. The battery range is now 17 miles (28km). and 2) because they still have a motor on board which turns on to keep the battery on charge. Together that means that the effects are mostly of battery degradation, from the drivers perspective, is negligible. but its still happening faster than an EV. You cant outrun physics.
1
@DerekVuong7799 thats why Toyota states the batteries in plug in prius's will last only around 100,000 - 150,000 miles. As opposed to the batteries in EV's which are designed to last well over 500,000 miles. (in most cases, not all)
1
Hey. That’s funny, when I say it like that it almost makes lithium mining seem better than oil drilling for fuel.
1
No they don’t
1
Hydrogen are incredibly inefficient, slow and unsafe and cost more than a combustion car to run per km. Air powered cars can’t run more than 50 miles a tank and can’t get more than 40mph.
1
Australia needs more population though. Not less. Your logic is flawed
1
There are dozens of studies out there that do this including one by the council of concerned scientists who practically assessed the production, use life impact, and end of life impacts of similarly sized, classed and trim vehicles. What they found was during production EV’s produced approximately 1 ton more emissions (15% more) than combustion cars (this sounds low because people talk about the impact of the battery but forget that an EV no longer needs to mine, smelt and machine an engine block, transmission, fuel tank or differentials). However they also found the that even on a coal based grid, during their operational life they use 20-30 tons less emissions than Combustion cars. This includes wells to wheels, it includes mining, sorting, cleaning and transportation to coal to coal power plants plus transmission losses. Likewise this also includes drilling, shipping, piping, refining, then trucking of oil/fuel. As well as regular replacement parts such as regular oil changes, oil filters, spark plugs, timing belts, etc. They also found than end of life impacts between the two types of cars were roughly equivalent. Both are very recyclable but combustion cars, like EV’s currently, typically get crushed and put in a landfill. However EV batteries have the ability to have a close loop recyclability of lithium so it will be interesting to see where that goes.
1
Also, just to add as your directly asked the recycling question. With current technology EV batteries are roughly 95% recyclable with all the precious metals and materials in batteries able to be re-used in new batteries. The supply demand has not got to the point to have a recycling infrastructure for this yet, however, we are starting to see the beginnings of it as more and more battery recycling facilities and popping up year on year.
1
@jayr6637 most lithium is produced using bore brine. Salty water from deep in the earth, usually extracted from deserts. Infact Australia is the worlds largest producer of Lithium. As for cobalt. Many EV manufacturers including Tesla are sinking big bucks into researching battery technology which are cobalt free. But for now the largest consumers of cobalt (by mass, which means including in cobalt based compounds, not just pure cobalt) are fuel refineries which use it to remove cobalt. I used to be able to find the link for that information on google but since the child mining cobalt think blew up all I get are news article links about how EV’s are the largest consumer of pure cobalt but don’t mention the largest consumer of cobalt *by mass*. I’ll see if I can find the link to that study, I havn’t had to find it for a while though.
1
She’s been a lot lighter than vics second wave response.
1
Actually it’s the governments wanting the bans to help meet their emissions targets. Also the bans don’t ban people from driving combustion car, or from buying fuel or even from buying second hand combustion cars. The ban is to ban sales of brand new cars. You’ll be able to keep your gas guzzlers, your project cars and you second hand falcons, you just won’t be able to buy a brand new one
1
@figjam5181 the infrastructure is already there. It’s the power grid. At current with current charging network the infrastructure can accomodate more than double the EV’s on the road right now and it’s expanding faster and faster every year.
1
@figjam5181 auto manufacturers are in the process of doing just that. Have you seen Ford, GM and Toyota’s like up for EV’s to be released soon? It’s not exactly a short list. As for ranges, it’s not uncommon for EV’s to have ranges between 400-500km or more with the majority of people only averaging a daily commute of 70km per day. Charging for the most part is a moot point. Home charging takes around 4 hours from flat (in reality you only gotta charge from maybe at worst 60% to 90% for 99% of the year). This means for the vast majority of the population you can simply charge your EV from home while you’re asleep and not using it. And have a full charge to start every day. So while 4 hours is a long time, total time spent waiting for a charge will be zero. Most people who own EV’s save a statistical average of 17 hours per year by charging from home instead of getting fuel. Ontop of that modern EV’s are designed to last well over twice the average lifetime of a standard combustion engine with none of the regular maintenance and servicing. That coupled with the 10x less cost per km on fuel means very big savings for EV owners.
1
@figjam5181 the technology is a lot further along than you give it credit for and far more practical for the majority of people. And while that doesn’t mean it’s appropriate for everyone and every application, it is still more than adequate for larger adoption than we are seeing if people decided to stop spreading blatant misinformation about EV’s.
1
@figjam5181 they currently meet the needs of the majority. Even my old Subaru couldn’t get 1,000 km to a tank. If the benchmark was 1,000km to a tank or even 800km that would take many of the most popular cars off the road. People done need that range. Do people sometimes use it? Sure. But when was the last time you drove for 11 hours without stopping even once to pee or for a rest of coffee break? I’m guessing never.
1
@figjam5181 not the needs of everyone. But the majority.
1
@figjam5181 EV’s have been rapidly expanding. The model 3 is the best selling luxury vehicle in the US, in any category, out of all the Audi, BMW, Mercedes. And it’s sold more last year than it’s next two nearest competitors combined. EV adopting is accelerating so far Tesla and building factories all over the globe and they still can’t meet demand with a 4 month + wait list even before covid. As for other auto makers. Ford, Honda, BMW, Toyota, GM, Audi, Jaguar, Porsche etc etc have all announced or have released a wide range of EV’s. And only two of those companies just mentioned have hydrogen cars announced or released. Hell, even Toyota which has historically been staunchly hydrogen have announced the release of more EV models than all the hydrogen models and prototypes it’s ever had combined. So yeah, the technology is speaking for itself.
1
@figjam5181 EV batteries are more than 95% recyclable with current technology. With the entirety of the precious metals used in them recoverable in that process. Including the lithium.
1
@figjam5181 very few vehicles on the market get at or above 800km on a tank. Very few people regularly need that kind of range either
1
@figjam5181 number 1 best selling car in Australia, that isn’t a Ute (not in direct competition with any EV, is the Toyota Corolla, with a fuel range of 760. Number 2 is Hyundai I30, 680, Number 3 Mazda CX-5, 700km Number 4 mazda 3, 760km, Number 5 Kia cerato 730km. Tesla model S long range 700km, Tesla model 3 long range 600km. Top 5 best selling cars in Australia don’t even measure up to your 800-1,000km benchmark. Maybe that should tell you something.
1
@figjam5181 EV’s will continue to improve I’m not saying that. I’m also not saying they’re perfect but they are at a point right now where they are practical as daily drivers for the majority of Australians.
1
@figjam5181 and they are cost economical. I own a model 3, I’ve saved $6,500 in one year on fuel and servicing. At this rate, after 5 years it would have cost me the same to have purchased, charged and maintained my model 3 than I’d I had purchased fuelled and maintained an entry level Toyota Camry. Except I will have a much safer car with much better performance and luxury features.
1
@74aussieguy the only way to mass produce hydrogen is with fossil fuels. To further that it also requires approximately 3 times the amount of electricity to produce 1km of hydrogen than the electricity need to charge 1km of charge for an EV. And both off the same dirty grid. Hydrogen also doesn’t have a good performance, safety, they’re more expensive to run than combustion cars (unlike EV’s which are around 10x cheaper).
1
@74aussieguy actually no. The only way to produce green hydrogen is with electrolysis. This requires more than 3 times the grid energy per km than a battery EV requires per km. Which means no matter which way you cut it, hydrogen will always be 3 times more expensive than Battery electric. Ontop of that you can’t just get hydrogen from home at an outlet. So you pay for 3 times more energy, plus the water, plus the facility overheads like operating costs, staffing, admin and logistics, plus transport of hydrogen to fuel stations and the suppliers profit market. The. You have to buy it from fuel stations with their overheads plus their profit markup ontop of that. Meanwhile you can just buy 3 times less energy per km directly from the power company without all the additional overheads, costs and markups. Hydrogen will never be cheap
1
@74aussieguy hydrogen also has a shorter life span thanks to.. well hydrogen. It can leak through solid metal but it also embrittles metal. Which is bad for the fuel cell and the vehicle. Given them at current a shorter life span than combustion cars whilst EV’s today are enjoying longer lifespan than combustion cars.
1
@74aussieguy lastly there is performance trade off. Fuel cells have an exceptionally now power output. So to get enough power to accelerate adequacy they use a large battery bank to supply the energy to the electric motor. But because that battery bank is much smaller than BEV’s two things happen, 1.) less power is supplied to the motor (bigger battery more power flow available, smaller battery less power flow). And secondly the battery life is drastically reduced (battery life depends on cycles, current batteries have 1,500 cycles, with a Tesla that has a range of 700km to a charge that’s 1 million km of range before it needs replacing. For a hydrogen car that has a smaller battery that can only travel 50km, that’s 75,000km of range before it needs replacing.) To get more power you need more space to have larger fuel cells and larger batteries. This means it has to take up either cargo space, passenger space, fuel capacity or a combination of the 3. So while you can have the Tesla model S which is a luxury 4 door, 5 seat family sedan with not one trunk but 2, at hyper car speeds (the plaid model is now the fastest production car on the planet), not achieved by even purpose built 2 door no trunk single seat performance cars, you won’t get the same with hydrogen. To get anywhere near the performance you’d have to sacrifice its practicality. Less range, less space, less passengers.
1
According to the CSIRO, and several Nobel prize winning economists, all of which have written to the current prime minister, (all of which have been ignored), renewables has the potential to be a 3 trillion dollar industry over the next 5 years in Australia, it would also provide 3x more jobs per dollar spent as a covid recovery strategy when compared to a “gas lead recovery”, it also has higher GDP potential as the majority of gas profits go overseas, not to Australians, and Gas energy is current the most expensive form of energy in Australia. None the less we’re committing a generation to a gas lead recovery because the PM put together “covid recovery panel” stacked with no scientists and barely any economists (who complained about the process and conclusions being be). But stacked it with gas, mining and oil executives, and weirdly a Saudi oil exec? Infact the board wasn’t chaired by an impartial third party or even another politician but by a gas industry executive. So why is it surprising in the least their response was “just give me the money”.
1
Aside from the fact most global leaders are pushing for a global carbon tariff, meaning if we commit to a gas lead recovery, and they succeed with the global tarif, Australia won’t be able to compete on the global market, businesses won’t be able to stay open, the cost of living will skyrocket and not just because gas is the most expensive form of energy. The GDP will drop dramatically, our economy will be tanked. And our gracious leader from marketing is steering a whole generation directly at that cliff, for what I can only assume are some of the under the table donations. He knows about the global tarif, he’s been to those summits. There is no way he doesn’t see that Cliff coming.
1
At what point does it stop being lazy and mindless and start being malicious and corrupt? Why more Australians aren’t frightened to the core about this, I have no idea but I’m betting it’s because the media won’t fucking go near the topic.
1
Why?
1
At least coal energy produces less emissions per km than refining and ultimately burning fuel.
1
They’re not worse
1
They don’t. That’s why they pedal bullshit like EV’s being a fire hazard. That they’re dangerous, that they’re unreliable or that the batteries have a short life or that you’ll spend hours a day Standing around a charger. All myths and blatant lies. Now why would they do that?
1
Not impossible at all. Actually fairly practical.
1
It’s now $68,000.
1
Electric F150 isn’t out yet and it’s far more expensive than the cheapest electric in Aus.
1
@snowyeyes1152 as far as I’m aware they’ve announced it. But nobody has taken delivery yet. Both the Ford F-150 and the Tesla model 3 are made in the USA, over there the F150 represents a significantly larger investment than the model 3, yet alone a Nissan Leaf or Hyundai Kona. Therefore it’s reasonable to assume it’s not going to be any cheaper for Australians.
1