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Big fan of this channel, I never miss a video. I appreciate your perspective of usage, and the somewhat "EV spec sheet beginner" angle of this review. I understand it was a shock to find it being powered by a "Golf cart" powertrain more or less, but thats still where we are at with EVs when trying to save those last extra cents.
As you alluded to, being realistic this vehicle was never meant to be recharged on the go, no matter what the manufacturers PR might tell you. Its strictly a "Recharge at the company every night" kind of deal. A friend of mine run a local plumbing business, this is the kind of vehicle he would like. Since they only do a few miles between stops, all other considerations fade into nothingness, since they are in the car at most half an hour at a time. For every one else with differing needs, _stay away_. This is the bargain basement/dollar tree EV van for short local transport and nothing else at cheapest possible price, full stop.
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@raiinydayz1889 Yes, I know about the AWD system. Still has more hardware to spin, which robs some power.
Regarding torque, revs and power delivery, those factors are as good as irrelevant to the acceleration numbers. Only average power in between gearshifts count, and that number is often very closely correlated to the peak power number.
In as good as every petrol powered car, shifting earlier, "using the torque", or power delivery rpm mattering at all, are sadly all just effectively long-lived myths that for some reason became popular, but have no basis in reality.
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@seinfan9 You, and many others are woefully naive when it comes to this. Realise 90%+ of all people dont have any conception of your "objective good/evil" at all. Scientific experiments and general world history throughout the ages have shown as much. For most people, "moral relativism" is all that exist, and you calling it evil wont change that. They will do what their leader tell them, thats all there is to it.
I have not said I agree with such things, and I am sad thats all most humans are, but you and other would be well advised to keep this in mind, and adjust your mindset accordingly. You can scream all you want about how the ones lining you up in front of the firing squad are "evil", "hypocrites" and so on, and many have thoughout history. It matters not at all, unless you are counting on some kind of divine intervention.
Admitting the truth is the first step. Then you can plan ahead accordingly.
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@GeekyC Heres what I do; I dont follow social media much and certainly not the main stream media. I know whats going on that relevant is to me just fine anyway.
You watching this video by lotus eaters means you are already more clued in about some/most bigger issues than almost everyone in the general public, you could leave it at that...
Sidenote regarding gruesome footage and images:
As a kid, I grew up on the "unregulated" internet that existed back then. It was "cool" to watch the most horrific videos that could be found, some sites collected them Perhaps they still do, I dont know, I only knew about them back them from how my friends talked about them. But I never watched a single one of those videos. Why should I? Didnt interest me.
The psychology is a bit interesting, I can only assume my friends saw it as some kind of "manliness ritual" of being a rebel similar to mouthing off to the teacher, etc.
Since I grew up in quite different and a bit harsher circumstances than those kids, I had no need to prove anything to anyone....
Anyway, my point is: If it affects you negatively, try to avoid it best you can. unfollow or block some content some contacts posts for a time if you absolutely have to keep using social media a lot.
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@derkatwork33 I figured thats what you were getting at. Cant agree though, not by a long shot. A piece of text and paper is just that, nothing else. It has to be followed, and thats not being done currently at all in egregious ways, and even earlier in US history in smaller ways.
Free speech is absolute, or it isnt free speech. Everything else is but a slippery slope. All the nations held up as the grossest violators of human rights throughout history have also, according to themselves, had "free speech". Namely Soviet union, to name but one example.
Lastly, a few people such as Alex Jones, Snowden, Assange and even president trump would disagree with there being free speech, all of whom have court cases against them involvoing just that in some capactity. Not to mention a lot of whistleblowers who have curiously "unalived themselves" already.
Wake up and smell the coffee. There is, in practice and as shown by overwhelming evidence throughout history, no such thing as free speech anywhere, and there never was. It only extends to the point you start to annoy the ones in power, and thats all she wrote.
Be aware of this, and act accordingly.
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Sorry man, I dont doubt you are a mechanic, but if you are serious about this post, you surely are heavily affected with what equals to "survivor bias". You see the ones where things have gone catastrophically wrong, and extrapolate that to the entire fleet, most likely.
Trust me, none of what you write are issues if the car is handled as a normal car would be and taken care of according to common sense and service plans. This amount of power, pressure and so forth is a none issue in a correctly designed engine these days. 120k will easily come and go, so will 100k more miles than that as well.
More power at a given capacity = less longevity, is an old myth that has no real relevance to road driving since... I dont know, pretty much forever? Certainly many decades, as least. The mechanics of the 1920s would have been staggered of the ludicrous power/liter output of the 1950s engines.... And so on.
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OK I will give some thanks to the community by transcribing the voiceover of the old video at the end. Starting at 8:59
(My note: Swedish military calls some of the their trucks ”cars” as well): ”Terrain cars are nothing new for Scania. In fact, Since 1916, they have built those with 4 wheel drive and 4 wheel steering vehicles, when the first ”Tow wagon” saw the light of day, so 25 years before the American ”Jeep”."
"But times change, and with that the demands on a ”terrain car”. The main requirement from the military was to produce a terrain vehicle with good terrain crossing ability, good drivability, good reliability, cheap maintenance, good road ”agility”.
The military demanded a substantial engine power, 15hp per metric ton, but that wasnt a problem for Scania. The engine is a 6 cylinder boosted Scania Diesel in the 3 axle variant, and a naturally aspirated in the 2 axle configuration. A special demand was that the oil scavenging pump should be able to cope with a vehicle angle of 35 degrees in every direction.
The cars are equipped with a fully automatic gearbox, which means the driver can focus fully on the driving.”
Upvote if you want others to see this comment. I used to drive one of those older variants showed in the last part as well (they were around for a loooong time, probably 30 years), so if you want to ask anything a driver would know, I can hopefully answer it. Cheers mates.
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@Jabbadoor2 Can only assume you misread my post and its intent. It was a reflection on how its pointless to be angry about the young ones not knowing the truth, when A: There is nothing to be done about it in the short term and B: You and everyone else is likely just as misinformed, just about other things throughout history that you learnt.
The people of west europe (And the US, but it took longer) were subverted into oblivion by the eastern ideology, this is the logical conclusion.
This repeats my prevous post heavily, still, perhaps its more clear this time?
Also, you are wrong about me being overseas or the grandparent remark, but I will chalk that up to you misunderstanding the post as well, no big deal. I also had grandparents that lived through a literal "eastern ideology" occupation, them talking about other ideologies and how terrible they are is nothing new. Its to be expected.
Now, as to what little you and everyone else can do IRL: Vote for people in power that wont falsify history. So far, most people hasnt really cared. Well its time to start, to say the least, if there is going to be any chance of getting the world you want with the correct history recorded, the proverbial clock is 5 to 12.
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@288gto7 I can agree with everything you wrote here. Consumer proiducts are different to military ones after all.
By the way, I currently own a BMW with the M57 diesel engine, and its normal operating temperature is 89C. The car, as many other BMWs, does not feature a temperature gauge, but I have an aftermarket one fitted that reads the onboard data from the ECU.
When I drove on Nurburgring this summer, it wasnt until about (according to the gauge) 123C it threw up a warning about excessive engine temp and cautioned me to slow down. Since I wanted to keep going at full speed, I did so. At about 128C It gave me a red light and "very high temp, stop immediately". I went on a bit further at a quite fast pace, at most I saw 131C ...
Funnily enough, the engine survived (at least short term, knock on wood), however, it killed the thermostat of the engine, which failed open, so after that it wont go above 60-65C during normal driving when I drove the car home. Cheers.
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@GBNationalist You dont get it, or the point of my posts here at all. But dont feel bad, many others dont either.
I will explain it to you: It doesnt matter who you vote for or what their manifesto (which I am well aware of, thank you very much) say. Thats not how representative democracy works.
The voting public should be more discerning in who they are voting for and not fall for empty promises. Thats all that needs to happen. Instead, they have been asleep at the wheel to say the least.
Its not helped by those somewhat awake, like yourself, running cover for the lazy, "two party brain" general public. The electorate has failed, and this is what you get.
Clear enough? Read this post quickly, if it will be readable at all, I doubt it will last for long since I am on a naughty list.
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@CPEngineeringSolutions If they were really interested in cars and what make them go, they would learn a bit about what engines and other stuff they had, even for historical vehicles. These days, that info its just a few letters typed on your smartphone away.
I certainly wasnt around when the model T was popular, nor a 1946 chevy, nor a 1977 cadillac malaise era car. But I still have a rough knowledge of how they worked, size, weight, engine power etc etc.
This is where most car reviewers/journalist utterly fail. They got their job because they are entertaining for people to listen to, not because they know any more than the average Joe. Which is a shame, I think.
SO yeah, its ignorant, but age isnt any excuse. If they truly cared, its easy enough to read up on. Cheers.
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@Haris1 1 and 2: Yep aware of that too, and there are many foibles depending on country, but as a general rule for the purposes of keeping theses posts relatively short, the "must have above 50% to be safe" is close enough.
If it wasnt clear enough, I am not from the UK, but another european country. I have heard the same/similar-ish "excuses to the "we were never asked" for decades now in my native language.
I have sadly, you might say, grown a bit cynical of the publics ability to do more than talk, no matter what country.
Sweeping changes are led from the top, is my conclusion from studying history and pragmatics of every country I have come across...UK is seemingly in no way different.
Just look at the OP, which is presumably on the "dissident" side, yet has no ability to realise how the political system of his country even works, never mind what to do about it. Theres just too few of "us" with true insights vs them and their resources to hope for the public changing their voting patterns enough.... such is my conclusion, sorry to say.
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@freepieanchipsgarage Either you read my comment a tad wrongly, or you like moving the goalposts a bit. As you can see, I only talk about factory stock and produced BMW e34, of which the M5 is included. One would assume thats what you talked about in the first post I replied to, no?
Anyway, Alpinas are therefore not BMWs, nor M5s (Quite self evident, with their turbocharged engine etc), as I am sure you know. Also, serious speed records for production cars are set to FIA rules, which are quite stringent. Two way averages, no gradient to speak of, time limit between runs etc.
Many "record runs", are in fact not really record runs after all. Only a few are. Seems unlikely your M5 runs fit the bill, unfortunately. Cheers mate.
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Serious question, not facetious, to all that do it: Why do you adjust the climate control so "often"?
Isnt the point of it, conversly to manual control, that you can set it to a temperature and the rest is automatic?
Seems to be a bugbear for many in the US and UK, but I have never seen anyone that touches it where I am at, and I dont do it myself either.
Is it a generational issue where people are used to normal control and cant help themselves? Sort of like a lot of "older" people are scared of cruise control (at least where I am at), because they arent used to it? Again, not criticising anyone, just curious.
Myself, I got it at 21C for my cars, and it works perfectly. I never touch it really.
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@blacksmoke6292 Ok, thats fine.
However I am going to be real with you, dont feel bad, its not in any way an attack on you, just a note on what could be seen from the start by other people:
-She didnt seem real in regards to those remarks, for people with a good B.S meter or that have experience with her personality type. In fact, I watched the clip videos of a good chunk of that stream, and I laughed out loud when she said "you built this empire on my body" to her BF on the phone. Obvious B.S. (to me)
-The "entire internet" wasnt on her side.... I mean the internet is a big place to start with. I get what you mean, you mean high profile people were on her side, but you got to consider those people are either very often not experienced in dealing with B.S like this (like charlie isnt) or they knew but just pretended they got taken in because it was good content and good PR for them "standing up for an abused woman".
Personally, I fully expected it, the views and cash got to flow. This is just the easiest way.
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@seinfan9 Yes it is my line of thinking, as well as most peoples (on a less aware level). That doesnt mean I agree with the consequences, is that so hard to understand? You are reading my comments like the devil reads the bible. As I have repetedly stated, I am not arguing for anything of the sort, I am saying you have to come to terms with most people being wholly uninterested in your worldview when push comes to shove.
Are you interested in finding solutions to this predicament (the things you call evil) or not? If you are, then acknowledging the mindset of most people would seem to be essential. The train that carries your worldview have already left the station in the west. Now, how are you going to get it back on a societywide scale? These are surely much more interesting questions than simply proclaiming something is evil and leaving it at that? No one is impressed, it influences no one and makes no difference in the end. Engage yourself and others and accumulate power to make the 90% of "followers" most people are bend to your will and morality, that is what will make a difference in the end. Otherwise, you will get steamrolled, just as those with your worldview have been for decades already. Your choice.
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@danmac6185 I am in europe, where at least until very recently, just about everyone learnt how to drive manuals. To the point that some people dont dare drive automatics, because its too unfamiliar.
And even here, where almost everyone know how to drive a manual, most people dont care, Thats what I was getting at.
No amount of teaching people how to drive manuals will change "most" peoples mind. Enthusiasts maybe, but there arent many of those as buyers of new cars, even sports cars. Look at europe again, most performance cars are sold with autos, even though their buyers almost certainly know how to drive manuals. Its a losing battle, sorry to say.
The other points you bring up, I didnt really comment on. But I can sympathize and agree somewhat, but it is what it is.
Now me personally, I honestly dont care much about automatic or manual. Maybe the manual is a little, tiny bit more fun. But I honestly dont care much. My present cars are automatics, but thats because you couldnt get them in anything else, yes even in europe. Still, the automatics are faster, som I probably would have gotten both as automatics anyway considerng what they are used for. I got a bunch of motorcycles that are manuals anyway if I feel like it.
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@Maarten_vd Eeeeh? This is a Dutch channel that tests acceleration performance on the autobahn.... 100-200 is the end all, be all for that. 10-11s for a M3P is an enormous difference compared to the 7.2 of this car, easily 100hp, and a very big percentage. Also, the Golf has a much higher top speed than a M3P, dont know where you got the inverse from?
Generally, you seem to have gotten bad info allround, for some reason?
Especially since you said "cherry picked", when this Golf is faster and quicker in everything, yes, even 0-100kmh. Hope you can find better sources next time?
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Yeah but to be honest theres nothing really surprising about this, Leaf values have been low compared to other EVs for close to a decade now, because of their rapidly degrading batteries compared to other EVs, and the first 1-2 years of production was especially terrible, after which they use another battery chemistry thats much better but stll far from good. The Leaf, compared to other EVs of that age, was always built to a price whcih brought lots of compromises compared to other EVs.
Teslas for example at least used to have a much better used market value compared to similar ICE cars ( E class, 5 series, A6 ) from the german brands, and by a lot.
Things might have changed a lot since I last checked but I just dont see the data to support the conclusion they will depreciate more havily than ICE cars of the same age. On average for all EVs sold, the inverse have been true so far, I am pretty sure. Things might of course change in the future.
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@Islam_is_the_truth.4 Well, horsepower is horsepower, doesnt matter if its petrol, diesel or electric.
But I guess this could be geared too short for top speed, putting it into a unfavorable rev range with less power.
Maybe thats what you are thinking of, diesel cars that are geared too short, because if they are in the correct revrange, top speed is identical to anything else, in fact it might even be a bit better with the diesel compared to petrol since it needs less cooling which in turn could enable better aero.
Hard to tell from the video, but it doesnt look too bad, about 4000 rpm which should be ok...I should think.
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@fireblade1329 Depends on what your alternatives are. Compared to direct electric, they are very good, cost wise. Compared to relatively cheap gas systems, not so much.
This also explains their popularty or lack of: If you got cheap gas, stick with it.
If you read my previous posts again, I really did write all this already, wont you agree?
Just setting some misconceptions straight, thats all, I got no dog in this race. If you only got electricity, like many countries do, they are a natural alternative to direct electric heating. In scandinavia, where I hail from, gas heating is more or less unknown. And why wouldnt it be, electric is much simpler... but it is very dependent on cheap electricity, or you will be bankrupt, which brings us to the current day, where this is now the case.
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@halogod0298 Sure, I can agree BMW hasnt covered themselves in glory, certainly when it comes to the platforms and engines launched in 2001-2010 or so, they were often terrible. Shockingly, unacceptably bad.
However, as I said, thats not the case for every platform or engine even in those years. I should know, I have owned a few and they worked just fine. But I did my research before I bought and I take care of my cars.
In the 1970-1980s, BMWs were one of the highest quality cars you could buy. 1990s less so, but engines were almost always good. Things change.
All data I have seen is that since about 2014 they are much, much better than the decade earlier in general. For now, I see no reason to believe the Z4 platform with for example the B58 engine will be any worse than most cars in this segment.
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@noahmcdaniel4920 As an owner of multiple Cayennes, and have driven multiple Touregs, I am pretty well suited to answer this.
If you want a "can do it all" car with no asterisk after, better than almost anything else, even new cars, you need the air suspension. Especially if you got a cayenne. And live with the headaches that may come. You also, if you got a mk2 cayenne that is supposed to "do it all" need the active anti roll bars. Big difference in corners when at high speed, and they presumably can disconnect the sway sway bars in terrain mode as well. Cant say how good it works in terrain, havent really tried it much. Another system that is potentially a huge headache, but makes a big difference for some uses when it works.
Toureg has visually more ground clearance, certainly the air sprung version does. Also higher nose and rear, which should mean better angles.
It is also softer sprung than a cayenne, no matter air or steel springs. Some of that difference is because of the ride height difference in the different modes, adjust the air ssupension so the have the same wheel travel, and it would be very close, I bet.
Personally, I could afford a newer car, but I purposly bought a mk2 (facelift) cayenne in good condition (knock on wood), because I have yet to find a new car at any price that can do the same things it can.
If you can accept some small compromises in overall ability, and dont want to spend a lot for maintenance, then by god dont get anything else but a steel sprung V6 touareg or cayenne. Or another car entirely.
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@hi_tech_reptilezz The suspension was very good for what it was set out to do. It wasnt as unreliable as people think either and for a mechanic that knows his stuff it isnt very hard to fix if it does go wrong either.
That being said, as the roads got better in europe/france over the decades it didnt have the advantage of old days anymore. Citroen also made it gradually more stiff over the years to match what people wanted, further limiting its advantage. In the end, when most customers didnt really care about it, it was an easy decision to skip it to save a few bucks production cost.
For me it was great because even though I am not a big "comfort" guy, I use the varying ride height feature a lot, as well as the auto leveling, since I tow heavy with mine and drive a bit offroad. Sadly I had to sell my C5, the sucessor, because the FWD isnt great at a slippery boat ramp, with a really heavy boat behind (it was a lot over the max legal tow weight as well, but except for eventual legal issues if I got stopped, it easily coped with it). Wish they did an AWD version. Now I got an old SUV with more mainstream air suspension instead. (which is currently, of course, broken...)
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Nice video as always. You really are tenacious in a good way, but every mortal man has his breaking point, even if yours is way beyond what most people can muster.
My thinking, as well as others I am sure, back when you got the Rover, was that condensation, oxidation and other (electrical) problems would be quite grave, even if the rust wasnt that bad. I will not tell you to put more money into it, but I hope you can let it rest for a while, unless you get a great offer. Maybe after a few weeks, you have the energy to start digging into the electrics. Maybe it wont even cost anything more to get it sorted. Maybe it will even dry out by itself by some miracle and start working again? Stranger things have happened.
In any case, I hope you succeed, if there was anyone I would put my hope into being able to soldier on and bounce back, it would be you. I am keeping my fingers crossed for you, Matt. Whatever you decide to do, I will keep watching.
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@dagnut Both true and not. The f80 is for sure more optimized than an e90, it is as you say bigger. But the marketing said it was 80kg lighter than the older one, which it did not seem to be.
Also, I am sure they made an effort with this, but it is a bigger car again, it has an autobox which is heavier than a dct, and it is prepared for 4wd, something the old platform wasnt. Every car is heavy these days, I think the guilia QF was heavier than the f80 as well. The bigger M5 is well over 2 tonnes.
BMWs were never light cars compared to other brands at the time, M3 has been said to be grossly overweight since the e36 back in 1993..
Bottom line, M3 is not a sportscar and never was. Its a sporty GT with 4 pretty good seats.
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@klaspeppar5619 A very good reply, hope you dont mind if I explain some things about what I meant, dont take it the wrong way...
Warning, long reply But I think you will find it worthwhile...
Yes, 250hp is very believable, no doubt about that. But how is the number 250 reached? Most tuning companys dont have the resources to test engines the way manufacturers does. They also have an incentive to inflate the numbers, and little to no negatives in doing so. Many people will buy the tune that promises the most hp increase.
But that also goes for the engine in the Golf of course, since it also is tuned by a tuning company.
That doesnt mean the numbers are untrue per se, but that the variations could also potentially be larger. And if your Volvo makes 260 hp, and the Golf 230, that makes a really big difference in the race, but is still well in the variation, I would say even a 15hp swing per car would be, so potentially 225 vs 265 or 255 vs 235.
As you say, there is also the condition of the car to factor in. A small leak or almost imperceptible misfire, some less than optimal old fuel, a slightly bad MAF and many other such things can sap 20 hp without being noticable, very true.
There is also the definition of what kind of race it would be. Lower weight and power gives an advantage at low speeds, while higher weight and more power gives an advantage in higher speeds, were aerodynamic drag is most important. So it could well be possible to see the lead change several times in the race, as the speed goes up.
The comment you made on the cylinders and torque is interesting, as I said dont take this the wrong way...
Number of cylinders dont matter. At all. They only matter in in indirect way, as in, can the car produce mpre horsepower because it has more cylinders? If the cars have the same horsepower, it doesnt matter they got 1 cylinder vs 12 cylinders, when it comes to speed and acceleration.
Same deal with torque, it matters only in an indirect way, as in can the car produce more horsepower becuase it got more Torque? Sometimes the answer is yes, sometimes the answer is no. But the "peak Torque number" in itself doesnt mean anything when it comes to maximum acceleration. Only "in gear mean horsepower" does, which is a number that is not availible from any manufacturer or tuner as far as I know.
Yes, the DSG gives a big advantage, even though it saps sligtly more power and makes the car heavier than a normal box. But at very high speed, where the shifting is a smaller percentage of the time spent acceleratiing, then the advantage goes back to the manual box, for the reasons stated above (less weight and power loss). VAG themselves used a manual box in their Nurburgring lap record attempt with a Golf or was it a Seat leon Cupra, dont remember, but they are more or less the same car anyway. One or the other.
Yes, indeed it would be very interesting race, too bad I dont have my old tuned BMW 120d diesel, which could have added an extra dimension. But with only about 215-220hp and more losses since it was rear wheel drive, it would surely lose against both this and your car. I also had a BMW 123d diesel with about 270 horsepower, and that would have also been interesting, maybe it would have been slitghly faster.
Currently I have a BMW 335d, but it is tune to waay to much horsepower curerntly for it to be a worthy race for any one of us, though I suppose I could flash the software back to the factory standard of about 285-290 hp, and that would maybe be a bit competitive, since the 335d I have got is very heavy for being a coupe.
Hit me up if you are interested, It could be a fun race. Since You own a Volvo and got the name you have, I take it you are based in Sweden just as me, or am I assuming too much?
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@gasparinizuzzurro6306 Since you brought it up: I am a physics teacher. Maths as well by the way. I have also studied vehicles and their propulsion systems for soon 30 years (Mostly with reciprocating internal combustion engines) as a hobby on the side, I would like to think I have a pretty good idea.
But that, of course, doesnt really matter.
What matters is the strength of the argument. This is where you got it what one might call it "backwards" as I said earlier.
Understandable of course, I have known plenty of people making the same mistake.
They are mostly locked into one mindset favoring this line of thinking, and I would wager you are too, probably taught to you by school or something similar.
Please Re-read my post again and think about it some more and hopefully it will become clear, I think you got the potential to understand where your assumptions went wrong.
If you still dont see it, Please realise that time as a factor can never be discounted. I would like to give a friendly suggestion of you quoting some acceleration numbers to me from just vehicle mass and max propulsion system torque numbers, which should be easy enough with your line of thinking. You will then see, you wont be able to, because its physically impossible to solve the equation without knowing the "time" component. Hopefully this makes it more clear.
In short: You are conflating "active force" (energy conversion, also known as power), working over a time, for "torque". They are not the same.
As I said, dont feel bad, there are even people tuning engines for a living that are a bit confused by all this because what has "wrongly" (too simplified) been taught to them and/or force of habit. Cheers.
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@xrissio Can only agree with most of what you write, though I think it wont be easy.
I suspect he uses the throttle range of 30-70/80 percent a lot, which makes the auto hesitant to shift down, but still perhaps a bit to much for it to enable its "slow cruise" mode.
As I understand it, he also says he has a lot of problem with auto boxes shifting down slowly or never, and the only reasonable explanation to that is that he doesnt use the "Kickdown" part of the throttle, since that should make them shift down pretty fast. Same with the wheel mounted paddles, you can "prepare a gear" for overtake with them, but he has said he doesnt like using them, since they can get mixed up for up or downshifting.
Also, I can only speak for myself personally, and I am normally not to fussed about auto box differences, for the driving I do. But the ones that were the "best" for me that I have driven have been the ZFs fitted to most modern BMWs, I was quite satisfied with them all the way back since the 2nd gen 5 speed (I think thats what it was), all the way back in my 1997 BMW 540i. Of course, the newer ones are even better. Cheers.
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@willswheels283 This will turn into a bit of a philosophical and long winded discussion, but....
No, I am not sure I could tell either, when driving in a parking lot at 5 mph. But I certainly could when doing any normal speed on a normal road. And the differences would be very obvious when doing 120 mph through a sweeping bend, as this reviewed car was designed to do.
On one end of the spectrum we have the person that wouldnt know if someone replaced their car on a parking lot with a completely different model from another manufacturer, as long as it was the same color. On the other side of the spectrum we have a factory test driver which entire job it is to recognise minute differences. If the test driver is 100% and the parking lot person is 0%, I wouldnt put myself above 70-80%, and I am a professional driver that does many miles every year, and as a hobby races cars, boats and bikes. I have sold cars at a pretty big economic loss, just becuase I didnt like the steering feel.
Maybe you are a bit closer to the middle of the scale? Nothing to be feel bad about.
Now, on the other side of the coin, everything is overhyped. It is also, simultaneously, too despised. Especially on the internet. Strong and polarized opinions gain more traction in the mind of the public, it is just the way humans work, making opinions always gravitate towards the extreme. There is a lot of research about this phenomena.
In the end, it is a normal car, like everything else. But there is no doubt that when the E39 debuted it had the best feeling interior quailty and the best driving dynamics of anything in its class. Whether those, sometimes small, differences matter enough for one to care is, as I said, very much up to the individual.
Edit: There are also those people that "think" they can notice differences, but dont. They think this because they own one of said cars, and want to have a "team" to root for. They are sports fans, but for cars instead. These are most likely the opinions you have heard, if they are very strong.
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@dannyseville2543 Yeah, bad traffic is a killer for ICE vehicles. But it varies heavily everywhere, thats the problem.
EVs dont suffer as much since they got miniscule parasitic losses.
The 330 number is for combined driving, no doubt. This test is more akin to "high speed" extra urban. Thats why the difference. City driving benefits EVs enormously compared to ICEs, multiple times over.
Most reviewers are mostly big city based, and tests close to citys. This influences consumption. But more importantly, many of them are not very good drivers, and foremost dont care much about consumption of the car they test. You might call it "chronic lead foot" disease or "rental car driving style".
Take a look around of some storys of "press cars". They are almost considered junk after testing, they abuse the cars to no end. I dare say some of them are no better than the average car theif....
These things together make an enormous impact.
Source: I have been involved in different business with road transport and motorsport since I was a kid, so 3 decades or so. That doesnt mean I know everything of course, but I have a bit of insight in these things I think.
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@Jeffrey_M Here is just a friendly (no really, it is) tip from me: Learn to ignore stuff people say, even if its often. Nobody got opinions 100% aligned with your own. I watch ton of different youtubers that are really good at some things, but absolutely terrible at others. Going on about a gearbox preference is really nothing, as far as I am concerned.
Now, your presumption is as far as I can tell correct, he really does think every car better with a manual. Thats fair enough I think, its just a quirk of his driving style. Ok, he brings it up a lot, but I am not bothered by it, once I realised thats just "how he rolls".
From your post, I get the impression its really the "pub knowledge" that automatics are bad that you dont like, and I get that. But thats not going to be affected in the slightest way by one youtuber having a preference. As a pretty technical "car guy" myself the amount of bunk info the average person got about cars is mind boggling. I habe learnt to tune it out...
By the way, I have no preference for either type personally, though I currently own 2 automatics since neither of those cars were offered with a manual.
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@blackwidow7804 Well, yes and no. Its a "byproduct" (<- note the quotes in this and previous comment), in so far in how the number is relevant to acceleration. Therefore, its not really meaningful to mention it when it comes to acceleration, dont you agree?
Anyway, I must say you have got most everything right, but as I said before, you and a lot of others have been a bit conditioned to think backwards in this subject. Torque can be said to be a factor, but in itself its utterly meaningless. It needs time added on top to supply any meaningful information about movement and that gives us: Power.
Its akin to talking about the size of a house with how many windows it has got. A larger house with more rooms is likely to have more windows, but there is no direct correlation. A smaller house could well have more windows than a larger one.Its the same with torque, no direct correlation to anything to do with speed or acceleration of vehicles. Power, on the other hand, has.
Regarding you last statement; Well, I like to believe there are few people that know power, torque etc better than me. Because I am a former physcist and physics teacher, with a keen interest in vehicles since many decades ago. Maybe I will make a youtube video about this subject myself one day, because I find the ones already here a bit lacking. But in the meantime, even though its far from perfect, you can check out this Engineering explained video: https://youtu.be/u-MH4sf5xkY?t=305 You seem to be most of the way there already.
Cheers mate.
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@volvo480 Sorry, I misunderstood. Its very good you cited your sources, already since the beginning as well. 👍
Yes, exactly as I suspected, the 50kg was a regional difference in how the UK classes/measures their cars compared to Netherlands. Such differences are very common. Sweden, where I am from, has another again, I think.
Yes, every country has their own vehicle tax system, it varies a lot to say the least.
Just curious, did you change screen name? I see "volvo480" as the name on my screen, which I am not familiar with, however I got a notification for your reply that said your "old/other" screen name "Robert ***" (last name censored if you dont want it visible) which I am very familiar with from seeing your comments under various videos.
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@MsArchitectschannel Steelies are often lighter than alloys, and thats not a joke. Especially the cheapo alloys ones are often quite a bit heavier than steelies actually, so beware if its weight you are looking to cut, it might just be a step backwards when put on a scale!
The alloys generally significantly lighter than steelies/cheapo alloys are specialised performance ones, but they tend to be expensive. Certainly not 300 quid for a set of new ones. I guess some second hand ones that are a bit beat up and have done some races maybe could be found for 300.
As, as I said above, steelies arent really heavier than normal alloys, even with "race" forged alloys or magnesium, you wont save 30kg on rims for this kind of car. Any rims you can fit are just too small to be very heavy, its borderline if the original rims even are 30kg in weight in total to begin with, of course making it impossible to save 30kg. You have to get larger, heavier dimensions like 18s, 19s at the very least (more likely 20s or above if originals are ok-ish) to be able to save 30kg in all. Cheers mate.
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@TassieLorenzo I dont know anything at all about how the Adelaide Hills look, but as I said above my perspective was mostly UK roads and to a lesser extent northern european ones.
I am a bit curious though, in your example you compare the station wagon (Dont know if the AU verion is the same as here, but my brother has euro spec one. Hes also had both Clio RS and Megane RS before, all of which I have driven, as well as many other similar cars), you note the station wagon is On Eagle F1 and Civic AD08R. Surely AD08R gives a lot better base grip from its compund? I did note in my post that modern cars are "mostly tire limited" on a road with a lot of curves, though not especially hairpin ones, of course..
Light weight is very nice and always preferable, especially for driving involvment.
However, talking about pure speed, even in corners, with the correct tires and driving style, I think people underestimate what larger, heavier cars, especially RWD or AWD ones can do these days. The 640d in this reivew might well "feel" like a boat compared to an mx5, but it would keep up with it easily on most uk roads.
I drive a bit on the nurburgring sometimes with my, compared to your E46 M3 example, even heavier E92 335d. Its about 120kg or so heavier I would say (1670kg). Now nurburgring is a track that is quite similar, more so in fact than other tracks, to a normal northern european smaller road. I sometimes encounter Old CRXs and similar, with gutted interior and cage and quite a bit of track prep. Nevertheless, my very heavy full interior BMW with all the luxuries and tow hitch etc. can keep just about the same pace, even in corners to them... Thats the power of modern tires and chassis. Or maybe I am just that good of a driver compared to most 😁.Not stock suspension though.
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I like your sentiment but true "homologation first and only" street legal versions of cars like this, are more "how cheaply and how few can we get away by making the things and still get it approved by the class regulators".... The pure racecar is what you are thinking of.
Consequently, all such street cars have way lower horsepower figures than one might expect, because they just didnt care to give them more. They could have given it 30 or 40 horsepower more, but that would cost them a small sum extra. Since the street cars in themselves were never made to appeal to a general customer (just a few collectors even at the time) it just wasnt prioritised, which is different to say the least to every normal car on sale.
Every car was sold at quite a economical loss for sure, building them was just part of the marketing expense of going racing, so they cut all the corners they could.
Of course, that doesnt mean they are bad cars in any way, in fact them might still be sensational to drive, but its a very different mindset for production compared to normal cars. In a way, these kind of cars are more like movie prop cars in how they are designed. The movie props are only made to look ok in the movie as cheaply as possible, the rest isnt interesting. And this is only made to be able to class in a racing version, also as cheaply as possible.
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@halogod0298 There is just more crap to break on newer cars, this is true for all brands. Look back on cars that had a lot of stuff on them already decades ago and they really werent much better.
On top of the BMW I own currently, I also own a first AND a second gen Porsche cayenne with all the bells and whistles with active sway bars and such. If you think BMWs are bad, let me assure you they are kindergarten level in comparison when it comes to hilarious costs. On top of the electrics, my gen 2 cayenne needed a complete new engine at just 40k miles, cost about 22k USD with install. factory Warranty covered it though.
German automakers have pushed the technological envelope the last 30 years more than ever, as well as aggressively tried cutting costs. Toyota uses tech at least one generation behind. That is a good thing for reliabilty, to say the least. Iron out most bugs or dont go down technologically dead ends.
I think the Z4 will be in line with most other cars in its class. It wont match up to a bare bones Yaris, not by a long shot, or any toyota most likely though, yes.
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@DjNikGnashers First I want to say that I certainly dont need to have "the last word" in this exchange. That being said, I will adress some things:
"Unsporty" cars being de facto faster than cheaper or sometimes even more expensive "sporty" cars is nothing new. There are hundreds of examples through out car history. I will give an example. Have you ever driven something like an old 1960s Cadillac? If you have, then you will know that you will struggle to find anything less sporty, and that includes, no joke, a modern lorry. And they certainly were not marketed as anything resembling sporty at all. Still though, even with high weight and terrible automatic gearboxes, they made an honest 300 bhp, which would blow the doors off any sports car in the price range of an normal income europen man not only in the 1960s, but the 1970s and a good chunk of the 1980s too. In a straight line of course. Certainly nothing but a straight line. And as I said erlier, I would wager a similarly equipped 320d was at least 30% more expensive. That is a lot to some people.
Yes, all of those hot hatch et al. cars are just as fast or faster than the VRS. But most of them not eyebrow raisingly so, most of them were in the same ballpark. The "common guy" did percieve all of those cars as fast when they were new, and that includes the VRS.
Seems like some of your objection stems from people calling the 320d slow which is of course false and is rooted in their lack of knowledge. If we take the average car sold as a comparison, the 320d was not slow obejectively, it was faster than the average car sold in those years for sure. I am pretty sure even the 318d was.
So in summary: The VRS was maybe in the top 5% of cars sold speedwise when launched, if not better. Most people would call that fast or fast-ish.
The 320d I am more unsure about, but it certainly was way faster than the average car sold in the UK, expecially the 177ps version with the N47. So most people, if they knew about it would not call it slow either. .
A lot of them didnt know though. You should have see the face of the guy in his mildly tuned impreza Gt turbo which I easily passed on track with my remapped 120d I used to have. "I never knew a diesel could do that". In the end, its all in good fun... I prefer to compare it to its contemporaries and to the average car sold, for me that is a more tangible comparison. I do not really believe in such a thing as an objective "fast" or "slow". Its all relative to me, expecially when you have been a part of the drag racing community for a long time as I have. You may not agree and that is perfectly fine. But please dont take any stock in what the average person says, their car knowledge and interest is extremly lacking compared to almost anyone that would watch one of furiosdrivings videos. Nice to talk to you.
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@Morten54 If they care enough to state their opinion in a comment, they should care enough to learn how it really is. And many times, they do, I have been thanked countless times.
The ones who dont, generally are the ones who take being wrong in itself as a personal attack upon them. Its quite sad they feel this way, if you ask me. It benefits no one. Still, true enough, there are many of those as well. Less than the other ones, thankfully.
Now regarding my wording, yes it was indeed not the best. But I make a lot of comments and it get tiresome sometimes hearing the same old myths perpetuated into infinity itself. Especially when people got the tools to understand this in school already as young teenagers, if they think about it a moment before they reply. Its not rocket science.
Lastly: No one (presumably?) is forcing you to read, nor reply to the comments, so that annoyance is easily mitigated. Cheers mate.
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@UserBeenBanned Seems you answered your own question. That is good, and I mostly agree.
However, if people cant even take such an easy action as voting for someone that can represent their own interest, what can they be trusted to do? Not much, I would say, History would seem to agree, which is why we are in this situation to begin with.
If you ask me, the "every citizen" democracy will go down in history as just as ludicrous utopian idea as many others, a fanciful dream born out of misinformed ideas of human nature that can only exist when society has relative abundance of resources. The fligthless bird of governance; it can only survive with no predators. Its a self regulating/balancing system, a cycle.
Dictatorship and similar ways of governance is the only thing the average human is mentally equipped to handle/understand on a fundamental level, whereupon society always returns to it, sooner or later. Enjoy the air of freedom above the surface while it lasts and we are dragged down again, statistically chances are we wont get another breath for hundreds/thousands of years.
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Nah, its how almost everyone in not just America, but everywhere thinks. Its a hardwiring in the human brain, the ones who dont think that way more than likely have some kind of neurological abnormailty to them.
In any case, the question itself is not as simple as one might think. Adam alludes to it in this video, the wordplay in the question is made to make you confused. Speed can only be measured against a frame of reference, if one looks at it a certain way the "matches the speed of the plane" could be taken to mean the conveyor belt will increase its speed forever until the plane is stationary. Yes, that would theoretically mean an extremely, almost infinitely fast conveyor belt. But in such a case, the plane should be unable to take off. Its a case that will not happen in real life, but could happen in theory.
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@MW-te5fv Britain is a market upon itself, very different from the US as I am sure you are aware. As long as there is a significant following of a car, and there arent many left, they can garner big money. People have been saying that about beetles for decades now, but it seems they just made to many of them, and too many are left?
I think 2CVs might be the same, and they dont have such a big follwing in countries were people collect cars a lot.
But its hard to say it really depends if one thinks of as a percentage or as in pure money. I dont think a Trabant or cars of that nature will ever be worth more than 100k USD in my lifetime. But they may well be worth 20k, that could be possible, which is a big increase from lets say the 3k you could buy one for.
MG seems like a car just about only brits care about to be honest, but that doesnt really have to mean much, I never really thought a Ford sierra (cosworth) and other "fast Fords" would be worth as much as it currently is.
The saying is a Ford Model T had its peak value in the 1950s, and after that went down, even though they became even rarer. Most people that had any connection to them and wanted one simply got too old to buy them any more. I think MGs are in danger of this maybe, hard to see a lot of people currently under 50 or heck even under 60 that are really into MGs.... but we will see. Cheers.
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@KTMcaptain Eh, dont know if I misunderstand you, but a locker will not send torque to the wheels with most traction. If it does, its not a locker. You might be thinking of some sort of "smart diff" such as a torsen, or a what might be called a "diff brake" which comes in numerous flavors. None of those are lockers, per se. A locker, locks the rotation of a an axle together, thus the name "locker"
Now open diffs, can be made to work like a smart diff or even a locker. Its all a matter of what software and how great your mechanical modulation of the brakes are. Theoretically, its very possible. That being said most cars are very far from it. On that we agree. But as far as software solutions go, the Touaregs system is one of the best, for sure, even if that may not say much. All a matter of perspective. I think its ok, but no more than that. A true locking diff would be much better sometimes.
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@KTMcaptain I will start from the beginning of your post and adress your points in order:
The word I was opposed to is "sending". A locker doesnt send anything, anywhere. saying it send something somewhere make it sound like it actively is doing something. Its not, it just locks an axle together. Splitting hairs maybe, but that is the difference between a locker and a smart diff, where the later one is active and the former is just an on/off thing.
Again, a bit of hair splitting but if one want to get really technical, a unloaded wheel can develop torque, by virtue of the inertia it takes to spin up/down.
You absolutely can simulate a locker perfectly with the brakes, in theory. The physics are identical if you have an advanced enough system. No car does, but it is possible. I dont see how the braking can have a negative effect when it can be regulated perfectly, in fact one could even theorise that an open diff could possibly be even better than a locker depending on the material/ground the tire interfaces with, as far as I can see. Non-newtonian friction and all that. Dont know, have to think a bit more about it to be sure.
I know how a torsen works, thats why I asked if that was what you were referreing to when you said it "sends". But it was not, it seems.
But ok, all this post is arguing over semantics it seems, which isnt that helpful really.
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@KTMcaptain Now now, it wasnt my intention to be petty at all, sorry if it came across that way.
Thats why I wrote "hairsplitting" about my own comment which is a self deprecating remark. Getting bogged down in semantics is not much fun, the technical details on the other hand is more fun to discuss.
Yes of course my comment presupposes everything works mechannically perfectly, snapping an axle shaft is not one of the cases I had in mind.
Annyway, there seems to be somewhat of a misunderstanding here. I dont disagree that lockers are much better for terrain driving than a software solution for every car ever made so far, including the one I got. I would much rather have a locking rear diff than the software I got today. No ifs and buts about it.
But I found it interesting to discuss if a brake derived solution can match a locker. Theoretically*, I think it can. Or maybe even better, I am not sure, because in that case the wheels doesnt necessarily rotate at the same rate as they have to do with a locker. As for if/when that might be an advantage, I am not sure. I will state again: *This is a theoretical thought experiment about if software using brakes ever could match lockers, which presupposes a lot of computer power, very fast reaction speed of the brakes, much engine power, very good granularity in brake modulation etc. Not a real world availibility of such a thing at all
I hope I have made myself sufficiently clear.
In any case, the whole reason I replied to your first post, was because the way I read what you had written, I thought that you maybe didnt fully know what a mechanical locker was. I hought that might be the case, because there are a lot of people out there who dont, and mix them up with other forms off smart diffs, e-diffs etc. But it is clear to me now that you do know what a locker is, and how it works mechanically.
That is all I wanted assure myself of, grounded in the desire to help increase knowledge if you didnt know. But as I said, it is now clear that you do. Sorry for "butting in" but I cant help myself sometimes, please believe me when I said I did because of well meaning.
Anyway, on another note you may be interested to hear that I, on top of my personal car, have driven a lot of all terrain military trucks in my day. Some of which had a sytem fitted that might be called "terrain brake". This is a system where you got an extra pedal on the floor. It is similar in function to "ride" the brakes and is calibrated to make sure the vehicle never moves, no matter how steeply it slopes up or down. Then it is just a matter of using the accelerator pedal to overcome the brakes and you got an easy way to crawl over rocks without jerky motion. OF course you can perform the same function just by kkeping your foot slightly on the brake pedal at all times while crawling, but this takes the modulation out of the equation, since its already pre-set. I think its pretty neat, dont think any street vehicle has a similar function, closest would maybe be the "hill descent control" of many vehicles, but its not really the same in what it can do.
Anyway, thats it. Cheers.
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@KTMcaptain No, I am the one who should apologize, my wording in my previous posts was sorely lacking any finesse, and can absolutely come across as rude and condescending. Its a failure on my part because it was lazily written.
In any case, as I said earlier, the "open diff" software and hardware solutions trying to emulate a locker of todays production vehicles are very much lacking compared to a real locker for terrain driving. But could that change? Theoretically, I think so, but its probably more likely we will be all electric first, as you hinted at.
I also agree it uses more power, since one is effectively using engine power heating the brakes, rather than rotating the wheels... though I dont think that is all that much if an issue really with todays engines. I am more concerned my rear e-diff is wearing out my brakes when track driving.
Long story short, seems like we agree on just about everyrthing, as far as I can see. Thats nice. Cheers.
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@Haris1 I take it you meant "electoral" system?
Its not about third party "chances", its not a lottery. If enough people vote for them, they will win. But people dont, so it wont happen.
Ergo, either you live in a literal dictatorship, and the exclamation "we were never asked" doesnt make sense, because, well, duh. Thats how dictatorships work.
Or admit the general public is too ignorant/intellectually lazy to vote for anything but status quo even though they could change it. In which case the "we were never asked" only highlights their own mental shortcomings and it could rightly be argued the elite is in the right depriving them of influence since they obviously dont know or care what they even vote for in the first place.
In short: They were asked. Perhaps they didnt understand/didnt want to understand the question though. But thats on them, as adults, I think.
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@chir0pter Hate to butt in in this fight, but we have to be fair here. I own several cayennes, so I know a bit about them. It can go offroad, and quite well at that. But that doesnt mean a touareg cant be better in some ways however small.
Firstly, do you have any data for approach/departure angles of the cars? As far as I know, the Tourag has a bit more ground clearance, though not by much, less than an inch. This would mean a little bit better angles as well, unless the cayenne is designed with shorter overhangs. I find that hard to believe, the touareg looks visually shorter. Nah, dont believe it, I think the Touareg wins that one.
Secondly, when it comes to air sprung cars, which is what I have I can with certainty say the Touareg has more clearance when in highest mode, for sure. It can easily be seen with the naked eye.
NOW, as I said there are other factors to consider, such as disconnecatable swaybars which I dont think the old toureg ever got? But if we are talking just ground clearance/approch angles, I am pretty sure the toureg is better.
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@chir0pter Firstly, I used the common British terminology of giving a car an increase in "mark numbers" even for a facelift. Thats why the facelift may be called mk 2, depending on your outlook. However, I see you are familiar with the internal code names, so I will use them going forward.
I currently own a 957 and a 955. I am also pretty familar with Touaregs of the same years, the later ones dont interest me.
I can see you are very loyal to your cayenne, and that is all very good, but we have to be honest and admit there are some things a Touareg might do differently or better, even if only marginally, just as there are things a cayenne might do better. Its only fair.
I looked at several Touaregs as a possible alternative before I bought my cayennes, and I inspected them thoroughly, including the tires sizes. So, the tire size isnt a factor in the percieved height. But for further clarification, I brought out the spec sheet. I have the Cayenne serivice manual and spec sheet on my computer and have now downloaded the same for the Touareg.
With air suspension, the factory spec is:
Touareg max ground clearence: 11.8 inch
Cayenne max ground clearence: 10.6 inch.
so about an inch, as I said.
Touareg max front angle: 33 degress
Cayenne max front angle: 31.8 degrees.
Considering the height, maybe the geometry of the front is about the same?
Didnt find any rear angles as of now when skimming through.
The Touaregs with air suspension has the exact same damper stiffness modes as the cayenne does.
In the end, a cayenne can easily be raised to the same height as a touareg if modified, and the 957 can be had with active anti roll bars, something I dont think the tuareg got, as I said earlier. It is also availible with more powerful engines, and has a bit better/more fun tarmac handling. Thats why I got 2 cayennes in the end.
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@DavidPeacock1972 How is it false advertising? Are they not using the standardised test numbers for the range in the sales material, but their own concoction? I somewhat doubt it, but if you can show me otherwise, I will of course change my mind.
ICE cars are exactly the same, in as much as I have never heard of one being sold in the western world without using standardised test numbers as well.
As for you last sentence, I can assure you the driving habits/pattern have much more influence on consumption in an EV than any ICE car, since it has very little parastic engine drag/friction, making the potential differences larger. Considering this, I wonder where you got that (faulty) info from, do you mind enlightening me?
Anyway, for clarification I am 100% "agnostic" when it comes to EVs/ICEs but I would say I have a fair interest/knowledge in the workings of both, since circa 1990.
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@DavidPeacock1972 Holy moly, I have been more than corteous and polite. But you are testing me with this, I must admit.
Your comment here makes zero sense, there isnt a single thing I have written thats even biased in the sligthest, let alone cult-like. Dreadful comparison, and 100& unwarranted.
Show me where I have written a single thing thats untrue or biased. You cant, because there isnt any. And if you "read between the lines", let me assure you this reading was incorrect and what I mean is exactly the words I have written, not anything more, not anything less.
Simply put: I am 100% correct in my post as the words are written. If you claim otherwise, show me where and a source that shows otherwise that I may read myself.
Ironically, it seems that its you who got the cult glasses on, because I have not written a single thing about where technology is or isnt. Not a single word about it in my post. Not in my scope of posting, I was making a comment about your OP statement, and later on explained how consumption can be affected by driving in EVs vs ICe vehicles. Thats it.
It seems you are reading things that arent there, when it comes to what I have written.
I implore you to settle down and read my posting again, exactly as its written, and not as you seem to think it is. This is just needlessly sad to see these kind of misunderstandings for no reason.
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@andrewwatson5360 Well I am not doing anything with EVs professionally either, I am just a hobbyist. Not enough EVs, nor people for that matter, were I am at (rural Sweden) to make a business out of it. I am just speaking about what can be done. I have been interested in EVs and the technology behind them since I had a electric RC car as a kid, long ago. Havent owned one yet though, theres not any availible that fit my needs and budget.
As for cars I do personally own, I am quite picky compared to most people about what I like when it comes to cars, as well as having many needs that have to be fulfilled by one or two cars. They have to be practical, and fun at the same time. I need a tow hitch capable car for example. I have finally found the cars that fullfill those needs and will never sell them, unless forced to by some new law.
I do everything on my vehicles myself these days.. Just arent enough trustworthy people around that takes pride in their work. I was too busy so I left a car at the main dealer to fixing an egine misfire problem as well as a loss of power, at a eye wateringly expensive rate per hour (about 200 quid per hour). They couldnt find the fault with it though, because their computer didnt find any error code.... hilarious. Thats when I swore off it for good, even if I had to use time I really didnt have to fix it myself.
I like to drive fast, really fast on both tracks and the unlimited parts of autobahn. Cant risk things not being 100%.
Anyway, EVs make sense in some perspectives, such as taxis or delivery vehicles used in heavily populated areas, but still see a lot of mileage. Both from a cost and enviromental perspective, thats when they make start to make sense compared to ICE cars.
Cheers.
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@HD-sx3he As I said, your english is lacking. Look up the word "likelyhood" that I used, and get back to me. Then you will see where your lack of command of english led your assumptions down the wrong path.
Secondly, it was you who said that maybe I havent been on the autobahn, so I replied that I had. Now you know. Oh, and by the way, In all likelyhood I have still driven faster than you ever have in a wheeled vehicle, as well as done more high speed braking. I certainly have done more so than 99% av all motorists, including german, which gives me a pretty good pool of experience to draw from, wouldnt you say?
Nobody is saying that german cars dont have better braking performance on average than american ones, certainly not me. What I am saying is that its not relevant in this case. Have I made myself sufficiently clear?
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@MrBubblebananas No, I am actually not contradicting myself if you read my earlier posts and have a modicum of reading comprehension. Its pretty basic english really, how some things can be implied and words can have multiple meanings but maybe its not your native language? Misunderstandings are understandable if that is the case.
Anyway, it seems you are arguing for regulations of brakes that are more stringent than currently, since you say "consumer not wanting to pay a premium for brakes that should be standard is not the fault of the consumer", because that would be the only way to ensure this.
A valid viewpoint, but I dont agree.
You say it "endangers" the consumer, and that can be argued, but I dont agree that is a problem either. They have accepted it themselves after all. We have to draw the line for safety somewhere, or we would all be locked up in airbag equipped rooms wearing indoor helmets. I think the current braking performance level is sufficient, and so does the average consumer, or else they would not buy the car. You do not agree with this. Also a valid viewpoint but I dont agree with it either.
Finally, to answer your last paragraph: No, I think current safety level for cars in europe are just fine, because I know that you cant get something for nothing. Everything has a downside, such as increased weight of vehicles which is bad for the enviroment.
As I have said in comments above, relative braking performance of cars because of brakes is a so small accident contributor as to be unmeasurable.
What would make a big difference, many thousand of times larger, is:
Increased driver training.
More stringent control of drug/alchol abuse while driving
More stringent psychological evaluations
My daughter would be very welcome to sit in the car, I know from statistics (I have worked in transport authority accident prevention department) that its the driver that is 99% of the cause of accidents, and I have confidence in my driving. If I hadnt I would let somebody else drive.
All this serves in my view is a faulty focus on the wrong issues. Machines are rarely the cause of problems, humans are. Same goes for plane crasches etc.
Cheers.
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@d4a Ok, but please for your own safety, fix the light. Imagine you pass an intersection with the indicator still on, leading others to think you will make a turn, and them pulling out in front of you when you are going straight instead. I am sure you have the skills to do it in a few minutes if you can rebuild an engine.
Regarding the "powering out", the ability to predict stupid/blind drivers and risky situations is sort of what defensive driving is. I am a professional driver and do easily 1000k km per year, and I have ridden motorcycles for a long time. Now, its possible I have just gotten lucky (but not likely, perhaps?), but I have only needed to "power out" of a situation 1 time in my whole life so far, and in hindsight I would say even that was the wrong choice, but I had a passenger on my bike at the time so I didnt want to brake too hard.
Anyway, we have a saying in the motorcycle riding business "think of every other motorist as if they are out to get you". Then you will survive.
For example in intersections I go as far left in my lane as possible, so if the cars dont see me and pull out in front of me, I have more options for what I can do, and wont have to change direction as much.
Anyway, just some advice from my experience. I just want to see you safe, and learning more and having fun.
You have made some very good and brave decisions so far, I applaud you for it. Cheers.
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@Maverick If you look again at the post, you will notice the word "and" in there, between msrp and intent, meaning both must be true and coincide at the same time, and excluding other types of cars such as luxury cars, super SUVs etc. Anyway, as you see, this is not the case for the 911 turbo vs those cars you mentioned.
Same with the 911 gt2, I didnt mention the RS, only the Gt2, which is closest Porsche has come to make a car to the same design specs as the cars you mentioned, though it is of course not manufactured currently.
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@abdbach379 There may well be a common problem, but not to your extent of problems. I think I would hear more about it if that was the case, the timing chain problems of the N47 were widely reported, a disaster of an engine. Yet I owned 2 cars with that engine that ran for many miles without problems.
Its all about the failure percentage, and the widely reported N47 timing chain was likely below 20%. Since it shares a lot with the N57, one would think it might have rod bearing problems as well, but not a peep regarding that. I am not saying it doesnt happen, not at all, but as a percentage of produced engines it must not be extremely high I would think...
Here is where your N57 enters the picture. It has to have an atypical defect still present for the bearings to fail that fast/frequently. Atypical in the sense that even if the rod bearings can fail, the surely cant do so three times in 6 months without something else causing it, that isnt a common factory defect. Else it would be one of the worst engines in history and all of europe would be full of them (it isnt, not really).
If not the fuel, I can only see a few reasonable answers:
1: Something went wrong when they fixed it the first time that makes the problem come back.
2: Your car has an engined that was somehow wrongly produced already at the factory. (Not a design flaw, but a build one)
3: If you did not own it since new, A previous owner did something to it that resulted in something being "off" in the engine and causing this.
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@justincase9471 That make sense, as when I when I was supposed to drive on the GP track a few years ago they made us wait about 30 minutes or so... perhaps it was a bit longer for a bunch of bikes to finish going round, with no explanation evident. This is probably what happened.
Oh, thats a very nice ride you got!
Myself I have a 2012 BMW E92 335d. This car is an everyday car with all amenities you could get for that year, standard interior and stuff like tow hitch, etc. It is very heavy, but thats not much do about since its still supposed to be quiet for very long trips and towing boats etc.
I have made a few mods for abit better driving though that dont take away the usability, such as a remap, M3 control arms and more camber angles, sport brake pads and fluid, Bilstein coilovers and AR1 tires on separate rims which I bring with me in the back seat which I put on when going round.
Car can be seen on a short on my channel. Unfortunately I live 1500 km away, so I cant do it more often than once a year. Cheers.
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@Azurael Are you from northern part of europe if I may ask? The typical heat, usage and maintenance in the US can really do a number on the cars, it seems. I would think its a lot better in the UK as well, mostly.
You will perhaps be surprised to learn that none of things you describe happen to BMWs ran in northern germany or scandinavia, no matter what mileage. No creaks, no button wear, no door handle mess, no vents braking, no nothing of the sort.
So, since there arent any issues of that sort, I only commented on how solid the interior feels and the look of it. Seemingly it was the same for the OP.
Just curious, did you own the car since new?
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Thats what stuff like minvans are made for. Lots of them out there with better interior space than a q7, whilst still being lower and more economical. If you want markedly more space inside than a q7, thats what for example VW Caravelles are made for. Need even more space than that? There are Transit vans made these days with full interior that drive just about as well and comfortably as a normal car.
As you can see, there are tons of choices that dont necessitate putting the car on stilts, and fitting it with large tires that rob space from the interior, when most of them will never go offroad. A van will do well on enough on anything that might be reasonably called a road, the large wheels and tires of cars these days are to mask how large and slab sided they are compared to older cars. The Long wheel base, 8 feet roof height Transit I use to drive uses smaller tires than a modern Golf! And it works just fine.
SUVs are a fashion choice for most people, thats all there is to it. Perhaps inclding your sons friend as well, since, from your comment, it seems he hadnt even considered anything but an SUV, or he would have realised that its far from the only vehicle capable of hauling his dog, any van offers more space in the same size bodyshell?
Dont get me started on pick up trucks.... A Van will do just about everything most people use their pick ups for, and better...
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@sugarsaint If something is cheating or not is dependent on the rules of the game/competition etc. Ring time categories from the very beginning are ill-defined, so you have a point there.
However, you bringing up other cars that are very low volume or prototypes that arent really production cars, doesnt strengthen your point at all, in fact quite the opposite.
Guiness records for car speeds, such as the ones you name above, are a joke, as everyone that knows a bit about this business knows. Just like a lot of their other records. Ironic you shouldnt see that yourself, considering your last comment about knowing stuff about the subject...?
They will certify just about anything if someone pay their fee, such as most eggs eaten in 5 minutes while juggling. Its an entertainment book, given to children as christmas presents back in the day. I know, I have a few of them myself.
The only speed record that matters for those "in the know" are the F.I.A certified ones, you can take that to the bank.
The term "production car" on the other hand, is not hard to define. If it can be bought from the factory as a part of a production car, all is fair. Honda does not sell or offer a Typer R with different gearbox ratios etc. Case closed.
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@joshuaszeto Thats funny. I can admit I failed to take into account the North American market. My comment was based on the european market, and I didnt consider it would be all that different. But in hindsight, it seems pretty obvious it might well be, also when it comes to rims. I will tell you my theory why...
American cars are generally larger. Sometimes much larger. The difference in car sizes and weights were larger the further back you go. This means the wheel have to be more sturdy to support the weight. Ameriucan cars also generally uses older technology of the "tried and true" kind. Therefore, it would not surprise me to learn steel rims for the North american market might be made differently, and with older technology that make them heavier. In contrast, aluminium rims of certain price groups are made in the same way just about everywhere.
I have lifted many rims myself, though in europe, as I said earlier. steel rims are generally same-ish weight, or a smidgen lighter. Its a small difference, very small. But on average, steel rims are lighter here, so thats my personal experience similar to your lifting one.
The "missing article" is interesting, I made a search myself. Indeed you are correct about it not being featured.
However, there are a few reasons why that may be:
First is the obvious one: Who benefits from such an article? Will it garned a positive reception? Does the journalists themselves even know this could be a question?
Secondly: English articles are often US based, and as I said, I have no reason not to trust you, it very well could be as you said in the North American market.
Thirdly: All the articles I found, does not quoted tested / weighed comparison numbers. They just throw a few numbers out like "20% lighter". If you are into science and experiments, you know this is a red flag....
Now here comes the kicker. I do have articles about steel rims being lighter, oldest one being from about 1993. I also have comments by people in the business of them saying this (since 1995). And to top it off, I got spec sheets from various manufacturer which states the steel rims are lighter. (These ones are newer, since early 2000s and up)
Anyway, regarding the rotational mass, we dont disagree about the physics of it all, just which ones might be lighter in themselves.
Lastly, I also dont consider the corrsion could be that heavy to be an issue. You must surely live in one of the worst places for corrosion on earth. My area is considered quite bad, for european standards, and we dont come close to what you say. As I said earlier, it takes several decades here for it to begin being an issue. 99,99...% (some ridiculous number of decimals) of cars are long off the road permanently before steel rim corrosion is an issue here.
Anyway, I dont have every article of steel rims at hand, but I have quite good memory and can cite some text from memory from them if you wish. I can also dig up some which manufacturer have released spec sheets which shows "steelies" to be lighter, if you wish. Just say the word.
Long post, but this is interesting to me. Cheers mate.
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@jimboTTT I could do the math, its not that hard. Problem is we dont have accurate data of all the factors, and I am not fully sure I trust the Cd number posted by Tesla. I dont really trust those numbers by any manufacturer these days, seems to have become a bit of marketing, just like nnurburgring lap times.
Anyway, from the track video of the Plaid, even with its much better thermals than earlier model S version, it seems almost certain it will hit a thermal limit on power before it can reach its true, drag limited top speed, so you are quite right. People dont realise how thermally stressfull it really is to do a true top speed run, it is minute or so of full power...
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@AltCutTV I have seen that speculation many times before, and by different people. Also, it being beacuse of the numbers of weeks in a year. Considering that, it seems a lot like finding things that correspond to the number "52" and trying to reaason backwards from it. I dont buy it, at least for Swedish circumstances.
My explanation of whats most likely "at least for Swedes", is, as far as I know, the only one that can be verified by records as being true, and being reasonably general. It was indeed taught in various schools across Sweden for a period of time. So at least if you ask a Swede and they give this answer, there really wouldnt be any need to remember the specifics of what makes a state or nor, just the number taught to them: 52.
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@kimberleydownunder If they had a lot of time doing nothing for some reason, Its possible. But if they didnt, you payed for it in some other way, since labor costs as soon as you could be doing something else that generates revenue. And thats almost always the case, ergo almost nothing is ever "free", most gas stations that had service certainly werent, since you payed with higher pump prices.
Oh, and people have "ripped eachother off" with simlar stuff like this since before there were people, more or less... I would say its actually a sign of a healthy economic system. Buy the product/service if you want, or negotiate the price down, or dont buy it at all and do it yourself, if you care. Seems fair to me.
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@LiteralMcWho ""Do women really think this about men?" - No, they dont. Dont give it any attention, its just an empty virtue signal fad among many others.
"Why do I have to feel beaten up everyday just for existing? I didn’t ask to be born." - Too bad for you, it isnt going to stop anytime soon. But see my first comment above.
" Honestly it’s getting to a point where it hurts to know women are afraid of me and don’t want me around, because truth is I really like women and the perspectives they can bring that are different from myself." - That was your mistake, they arent afraid of you, on the contrary, this show the opposite. Words are cheap, and they arent stingy with them to begin with.
"I think a lot of men feel the same but things are so bad now, it’s hard to see that. I just wish we could get along, because this really sucks. It sucks feeling like this. We aren’t all bad. We are humans with various complicated emotions.. it’s not so simple." - Dont take everything you hear at face value, in fact, take close to 0% of it at face value. This isnt a serious question in the slightest. Again, see first reply.
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@yannicklucas1836 This post at least shows a bit more effort than most, and for that I applaud you.
However, it falls down a bit considering a few factors:
1 and 2nd pagagraph: It can happen, laws arent always followed by law enforcement and relevant authorities. I am sure you dont disagree with this if you think about it, Havent you ever heard of a case of law malpractice from your home country? Never? Well in that case, I would be worried, because that would more than likely mean you are living in a heavily authoritarian state... Its just human to make mistakes. Most nations have several millions of people, so mistakes happen all the time.
Last paragraph: Yes I agree it can be a reasonable assumption. Its also quite possible thats not the case at all though. It can be more than likely be because the people that bother to reply dont read properly for whatever reason, such as them not wanting what I write to be true.
Yes, it could be seen as a bit condescending, but it is nevertheless 100% true. Note that no one (mostly) really have asked me more about why that is or how, just broadly shouted "No, you are wrong".
If I walk into the local football club fan area in the stands and tell them their club is bad at scoring goals compared to another club, do you think I would get many to agree with me, even though I could shove a paper with statistics under their nose showing my point to be true? Of course not, its just human nature to be biased. No suprise the statistics of people being so about their own country is reasonably high on a channel that often compares different countries to the US.
Considering the replies I have (mostly) got, the second assumption seems more likely. If you are at least as sowewhat reaonable as this post make you out to be, I am sure you will agree if you think about it with a cool head.
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@AndrewFishman And they dont get charged for that in the US either. In general. Or even in the extreme. This was an illegal arrest.
Now do you see the problem with assuming otherwise? So yes, I am quite aware of the world, and how society in general works in most of the world, and especially in "western" nations (of which australia is a part, former brit colony, commonwealth and all that etc)
I summation, making assumptions from this meagre statistics about hundreds of millions to one is just not possible.
By the way, I am pretty well travelled, and not, nor have ever been, a US citizen. 100% unbiased in this matter.
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@AndrewFishman No, not at all really. Just trying to explain it how it is, which I did already good enough in my first 2-3 posts.
If people dont want to listen, thats not really my problem, but you might note from the posts above no one have really adressed my points in any way. A bit strange dont you think, if you are to make yourself out to be "correct", completely ignoring the text the other side (myself, in this case) lays on the table?
As for your post specifically, you arent saying anything in it thats at all relevant to the discusion here, I am sure you will agree. But if thats what you truly (or more likely, want to) believe , I wont stop you. But if you read my posts with a cool, unbiased head, you will see what I am talking about. It really isnt that hard.
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@Bunny_Aoife Considering the replies I mostly have got, I am not sure at all they do understand outliers.... How can you even take a single instace of a case that has happened a documented of 1 time in recent history as an example when the population of the US is 300+ million? statistically, just about everything can happen, and will, multiple times a day. No matter how unlikely it may seem.
I am telling you they could happen, not because the laws arent different, because I agree they often are. But But because If you take the "child endagerment" story for example, the arrest was against the law!
But considering the rest of your postm, you seem like a pretty reasonable person, surely you can understand my point that I made from the start about laws and culture being less than interesting when it comes to single cases like this. Law malpractice happens everywhere, all the time, wouldnt you agree? Surely you must have heard of tons of them from you own country as well?
As I also said above: "bank robberies are impossible in my country, since they are against the law"
With statistics like my first paragraph above, its not about if, its about when....
I ahve also written about more media exposure etc in my first posts above and how it skews perception.
As for the last part of your post: I know enough about most countries, more than most people, but thats not really the crux hee, not at all. I also I believe other people just fine.
But the simple fact is I just know they havent thought about the statistics and human nature enough before they replied the way the did, or they wouldnt have done so. If you will do the courtesy of doing the same, and truly try to understand what I have written, I am sure you will agree with me.
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@Disconnected66 There does what? I am not sure I follow, did you mean to write something else?
"Disagreeing with that is fundamentally disagreeing with what you just said in your comment. " - As per above, disagreeing with what, exactly?
"Also, it takes 3 seconds to verify something. 3 seconds. literally. There's no excuse for ignorance IF you also are attempting to make a factual statement." - Yes, thats the IF though. Was anyone attempting to seriously do so? You didnt tag anyone specifically, and the OP doesnt, if you read it again.
In any case, I see no one claiming "its his quote and no one elses". There is a vast difference between thinking something and claiming something is 100% true, after all, and a large spectrum between it. But trust me, you do/use the same overarching concept yourself all the time, in other areas that you arent as familiar with. All humans do, its necessary for us to function to make assumptions about all manner of things literally every single second of our lives.
You might just be quite sensitive to this specific subject, that fine. Its like any professional in their field watching a TV show and get upset how they got it so wrong or "hollwood-ize" it, but when its a subject they are not as familiar with they buy it hook, line and sinker.
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I get what you are saying, but its possible both are right in a way. For normal cars, in normal driving, on normal roads, such differences are often "meh", but noticable. Which still fits well inside the "not a huge difference" span.
Firstly, some BMWs are notoriously sensitive to... everything. BMWs were often engineered with very small tolerances in various parts, often too small for the real world usage outside of a lab and not getting pro race team maintenance.
Secondly, M539 often takes his car to more or less their real top speed on autobahn, and believe me, doing 170-180+ mph is nothing like what most people do with their cars. I do it sometimes and it really highlights every little shortcoming.
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@gasparinizuzzurro6306 You got it backwards I afraid, its the power the accelerates a car, as I said earlier.
It is quite impossible for a car (or any object) to accelerate without being a part of an "energy conversion", which is commonly called "power", and measured in horsepower or watt. It is, on the other hand, quite possible for a car to give all the torque in the world without moving an inch.
The "torque" is just a factor in it in this case, and gives no information about acceleration on its own as an isolated number like "235 Nm" for example. Power, on the other hand, does. Common misconception though, this "torque" malarkey, so dont feel bad. Cheers.
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@gasparinizuzzurro6306 Yes, every "high school student" knows this. Your basics are correct, which is good, but they are just too simplified for what I am saying here, and not applicable. Those students also know other things pertaining to cars that are too simplified in this context, such as how the weight of a vehicle effects tire grip. Or how surface area of a tire effects grip. Or frictionless pulleys etc etc. There are a multitude of simplified concepts people are taught in school.
In short, you have likely been taught the "easy" method, and now think it is the correct one in this context. This is the problem with simplifying too much and the teachers not being clear this is a simplified example, people might think it is the final answer. I do not agree with this method of teaching, but it is unfortunately all too common.
This means you have conflated lots of things with eachother, unfortunately. It seems you are even somewhat unfamilar what with what power really is. Energy conversion is exactly what power is, it is universal. It is exactly related to the acceleration of cars, or for that matter every object in this universe. The acceleration of a known mass object such as a car can be precisly expressed by stating a power number. An engine torque number, not at all.
Not much to add here really, if you wish you can search up tons of articles that explain this and even some youtube videos specifically pertaining to cars about this, though they are rarely as down in the "nitty gritty" as what I have just written. But maybe that is just what you need and my explanation was too abstract. You can get back to my post when you have read and watched those other articles/videos and I am sure it will become clearer. I am sure that all the terms I used are will also easily be understandable in this context then.
Until then have a nice day. Get back to me if you wish when you have thought about this some more, though I havent always got the time to write as much as I did today.
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Yeah I got a "dart charge late fee", which was the first I had heard of it, as well... which is a bit annoying since I am from Sweden... I did make a pass, but as far as I could tell there were not much signage except for one that simply said "dart charge", which honestly could mean anything to an outsider. Perhaps a place to charge your new Dodge muscle car EV? 😄
Anyway, I have been on quite a few toll roads over europe and I have never seen anyone without ample signage of that it is in fact a toll road you are about to enter and how to go about things. To be frank, I dont think I have ever seen one without the possibility of paying on the spot either, and I couldnt seen any such amenities when I passed. The "late fee" was quite steep, something like 50 quid.
After much emailing back and forth, I got them to waive the charge, since they really ought to have sent the ordinary charge first, without any late fees tacked on. Doubtful if its legal under swedish law to just send the charge once the "late fee" has taken effect, when no options of paying on the spot existed... /Rant over...
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@kathykirby5837 Wasnt a single sign that said "toll road" or something to that effect when I passed, I assure you. The "charge" could have been for anything, for example a congestion charge based on the Co2 emission of your car or maybe time of day, with certain cutoffs or something similar, stuff like that is far from unheard of in european cities.
But as I said, what is unheard of, at least to me, is not having the ability to pay on site for a toll road. Also, nowhere did it say "dartford crossing charge", just "dart charge".
Anyway, in the end I didnt pay a cent for my passage, because of their lacking signage, so fair is fair.
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@furiousdriving Well regarding the "sponsored" review its an age old story really, I never feeel that way myself, but its clear a lot of people do, rational or not. Similar to how people love to buy a new TV with a big red "Super SALE!!!" sticker on it for £500, whilst even if they did have a look at it the week prior for the same £500 price, without the sale sticker it wouldnt sell as well. The human brain loves to take shortcuts for "mental work" and stuff that isnt familiar mean one has to think about it, which many people dont like. Sort of a "boring math-class" all over again, albeit on a lower level."
*Regarding the bike controls*, I can for sure tell from the video, the controls (brake handle etc) are at very wrong angle, and would be better with the handlebars flipped upside down. You are supposed to have them at the angle that gives your wrist and top of your hand a straight line from your shoulder, so for most people thats about 20-30 degrees downward, not upward as you have them.
Having them the current way is very uncomfortable and almost plain dangerous in short reaction time situations becuase of how the badly the wrist needs to be twisted upwards to reach the brakes. Especially when you make the saddle taller (to the correct level as well, with an almost, *but not quite*, straight leg at the bottom of the stroke). Someone at the factory must have mounted it wrong, perhaps other things as well that cant be seen in the video.
But dont take my word for it, ask anyone that is used to cycling or a cycle shop and they will tell you the exact same thing.
Cheers mate.
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@yt_nh9347 For anyone with a bit of experience or who isnt willfully ignorant, her objective is as transparent as a fresh pane of glass, its not speculative or projecting at all. Level 1 Basic psychology and biology, This kind of pledge is part of human DNA since before humans were humans. As I said, its part of every religion or group there ever was.
It doesnt have to be wrong, but its irrelevant to the subject. Again, as said above.
The "leaders" are just that, leaders of our society, specifically the USA in this context.
I did not assume she was ordered to do anything, what gave you that impression? She is doing it of her own volition, thats what displaying fealty is all about.
I dont see how your last sentence of your post is relevant to the discussion at hand, but sure. Of course not.
She inserted the part of the post pertaining to "tesla" as a virtue signal. Thats it. Thats what the discussion was about.
By the way, your post seems/might be hidden, only accesible from my notifications. Be careful to not fall afoul of youtube guidelines regarding wording.
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@Dolphin-gr5ec I feel bad for you, I really do. Nevertheless, and I am not saying this to belittle anyone, its as I write above, very doubtful the "benefits" of ULEZ affects your asthma in any physical way. Neither for the worse or for the better.
In many/most places, the levels are just too low to give an adverse effect on even those with asthma. For example, the general pullution levels were many tens of times and sometimes even hundreds of times lower than just a few decades ago. In general, levels are pretty much the lowest they have ever been since measurement began and possibly, in many places, the lowest since the dawn of industrialisation.
There is, however, an effort from some actors to hide than information from the public, since it might go against the agenda.
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@eiji862 276 comments in total, and quite some time and multiple ones of mine later, I am honestly not exactly sure which one you are referring to.
Perhaps the one in which a person stated something like "there are laws about this sort of thing"?
If that is the one you are talking about, I am not saying at all what you think I am. He can say what he thinks, thats fine. But almost everyone knows about these laws already, so its mostly irrelevant to the discussion. He also, among many others doint the same, wrote it in a way like any law matters in a vacuum. They do, in fact, not. They matter only as long as they are followed and policed.
Which was my point, and I have written of it in my other posts: Unless something concrete and substantial will follow, the law is effectively meaningles and might as well not exist. If it wont change reality in any way, it may as well not be there. There is no god ordained thruth that things must happen just because a law is presumably broken.
So again, its fine to speak out. By all means. I do it myself all the time.
But people were talking about it as "done deal" that she would have consequences of any magnitude coming her way. Not the case at all, in reality.
Same as with any laws, its far from a given. Many people throughout history have gotten away with literal murder, after all.
And in this case its much less severe, has a very questionable case for evidence and a need to find tangible proof of any one affected. As well as someone willing to pick up the case and put it through a court. All this points to it being less than likely. Thats all.
As I have written in my other posts above as well.
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Wanted to buy a mk 1 gti as first car, but even 20 years ago, it was impossible to find one that hadnt been abused to all hell. Test drove one, but couldnt find the fifth gear. As far as I know, every gti had a five speed, so someone has to have fitted a gearbox from a lower model.
Also, the gti was availible with such incredible equipment such as a sunroof, and a primitive trip computer, and because I am a useless gadget fan, I heavily lusted after it.
Alas, it wasnt to be, I wound up with an ascona C instead, which at least in a straight line wasnt much slower, I think? This was very important to me back then.
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@SpitfireFortyFour Well I agree they likely are no better than average for consumption/hp or maybe even a bit worse. Other factors such as the automatic and the car itself can be detriments. As well as the Land Rover specific tuning, dont know anything about that.
All I can say for sure it that the M57 in my BMW, thay should theoretically be a bit similar, isnt that bad.
But I also have to admit, there are a myriad of differences for sure, such as injection pressure/technology, inlet, turbo system. And uses one of the last 6 speed ZF automatics ever made, which is quite good.
My RWD 3 series coupe has about 350hp from its M57 and can easily do 50 mpg (imp) when doing longer runs. Not too bad, I think. Works fine as well, so far. Knock on wood. But maybe not that relevant.
Anyway, just a sidennote. Cheers.
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@RedHaloManiac95 You are making progress but you arent all the way there, you are still confused over who said what.
I had to quote the other guy because of what you wrote, there was no other choice.
I can only assume, if I give you the benefit of doubt you are at full mental capacity, that youtube have mixed up the comment order you are reading (it does that sometimes) because what you write still doesnt make any sense if the comments are read in the correct posted order.
I read the comment absolutely correctly, though it seems perhaps you still didnt. He was and is, absolutely defending tik tok, Its all there in the posts above.
Nevertheless, thats not even what my posts were about really, they were about answering if suicide rate would go up if banned: Which it is a mathematical and statistical certainty they will, in the short term.
Secondly speculation on the reasons why someone would say the couldnt. I have made no comments about any article or what any kids are or arent saying.
Thats it. Nothing else has been written by me, except as a reply to other people for things that arent related to the issue itself, but the posting. Such as this post.
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@a-my9ql One can certainly suspect they dont have any statistical data of the sort, nor interest in it, no.
But its more the non sequitur of bringing it up in the first place thats the tell. Its totally irrelevant in the context, so why bring it up? The likely answer is clear; to virtue signal.
I have quite a bit car engineering experience, but thats not really necessary in this case. Just being able to access and read data of various kinds pertaining to the cars is enough. Doesnt even have to be very granular. You will find I am one of the least biased people making comments on youtube when it concerns vehicles, if I do say so myself. Not a particularly high bar though... What I do is pretty well summed up in my channel info text.
Somethings are good, some things are bad with every vehicle, none is perfect, none is totally bad. And, of course, its all in what the customer expects themselves.
If there is anything specific you want to know, let me know and I will answer to the best of my ability.
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@totallynottwo5727 @peanut said much of the same as what I am going to say but long story short, making videos about someone isnt harassment. No matter how many and no matter how critical.
Never mind the law finding it crystal clear, further back all the way to just a scant decade ago the vast majority of people in the US would find the concept of this being harassment laughable. There were prime TV shows with millions of viewers that made fun and mocked the same people as a standing joke for years at the time, and just about nobody batted an eye and had any problem with it.
Just because someone says they were harassed, doesnt make it so. Legally, it takes some form of 1-1 interaction, and repeated as well. I.e the lowest possible thing that could be considered such is repeated unwanted DM:s/phonecalls from one person to another, and a lot of them as well. Not interacting directly can never be harassment.
Now on the other hand, what she did is not only a clear moral overstep in the public eye, it is also of questionable legality for various reasons.
Conclusion: A moral end legal non issue on one side, vs a clear overstep on the other and of questionable legality.
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@dannyseville2543 Sure they are brave, but warranted, from what I have seen. Not everyone of course, but we are talking generalizations here. Dont know where to find storys about press cars, I just know I have read and heard numerous from as soon as I could read, over 3 decades ago, and they were horrific. My favorite is from the BMW M5 e39 launch in 1999, where over half of the cars had burnt out clutches that had to be replaced after the weekend press launch. Some other examples includes many journalists crashing, both on traffic and on track, Mechanics for manufacturer that have gotten press cars back and read the ECU and discovered hundreds of critical overrevs because of "Moneyshifts". Journalists driving over curbs and dislocating wheels and suspension, ripping of the undertray and oil sump etc etc etc.
I am not opposed to EVs myself, on the contrary I have advocated for them since I was a little kid and had an electric RC car I tuned up and modified the battery pack of. My self chosen "graduation work" in highschool over two decades ago was designing a PHEV complete with fuel/electric consumption simulation. Funnily enough it was not accepted because my teacher that evaluated it said such a thing could never possibly come to exist.
I understand your problem with the consumption numbers, and it certainly is a big problem if you live in congested places, uk being one of the worst with even the countryside littered with cars making you stop/start quite often. Luckily for me I live in a very sparsly populated part of the world, thats why I can equal or even better the manufacturers numbers almost every time.
From what I know, steady state consumption is just about the only fair way of doing pure vehicle consuption numbers.
I believe extra urban euro norm speed is 84km/h or something like that. "urban" or city traffic is pretty unquantifiable. In my old car magazines, they quoted consumption at 70, 90 and 110kmh for every car tested. For your user reported numbers, you got spritmonitor.de but such sites attract a certain type of persons, similar to how if you ask men how big their third leg is, the number will be way above average... Its the nature of the beast. Anyway I mostly agree with what you write, is what I want to say, but its not so easy. Cheers.
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@furiousdriving I might be wrong, but are the brakes really that enormous to demand 19"? I can well believe the need for Mercedes original 19", but aftermarket often have alloys with more clearance. My, admittedly old, BMW 335d, has 340mm discs, it is possible to get some 17" alloys to fit. Another example is Tesla Model 3 Performance that can only be ordered with 19" or up, but can use aftermarket 18" just fine.
Edit: Just looked at your review video of this car again, at least from the video https://youtu.be/GcWr0zeHe-8?t=1278 it looks like there is a ton of clearance for smaller alloys around the caliper, so much so that unless my eyes are decieving me very much, perhaps even 17" of some brands might fit, but definitively 18". Might have seen wrong, as I said, but thats what it looked like.
Good luck. Cheers.
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@anakinskywalker4113 Well, this can certainly be true, but can we really blame the engineering in that case?
I will tell you an interesting fact not a lot of people know about: In days gone, the Golf GTI famously used to have twice the number of MOT fails according to statistics as did the normal Golf base model. The GTI was built in the same factory, by the same workes, on the same factory line. Great evidence for an overstressed engine, right? Turns out, none of those increased MOT fails where engine related, but various other components that where identical between both models.
People scratched their heads, until they look at the buyer demographic... the base CL model were bought mostly by retirees and similar folks, stickler for correct servicing and changing stuff that was bad in a timely manner. The GTI on the other hand was bought by "boy racer" that couldnt care less but driving the wheels off the car. I am sure you get the moral of this story.
A few month ago, I had a discussion with a guy in the youtube comment field that said it was impossible for any diesel engine turbo lasting more than 100k miles, absolutely impossible. He said he was drivetrain engineer. Now, that statement may well have flown in the US, where the general populace dont know much about diesel engines, but since youtube is international, I enlightened him that I oversee the servicing for a fleet of taxis and light buses/trucks, none of which generally had their tubros changed when we sell them, at about 300k miles.
Now, dont misunderstand me, I am certainly not comparing you to that guy in any way, I am just saying I am reasonably certain this car would last quite a long time if I would be responsible for the servicing and me or one of my chauffeurs were driving it. I have no sympathy for people driving vehicles into the ground, that kind of sloppy attitude wouldnt be looked at favorably by me.
Anyway, you latest post is very reasonable, I mostly concur. Cheers.
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@greatbritannialine You could get a new mobile phone for £10 before lockdown in some places. That is less than many "babys first phone". and the kids toy doesnt even work as a phone! What a total ripoff..... or different things might have different uses and customer bases.
In short, you are arguing against things I have never said. I have have been into EV:s since 1992, and I still havent owned one. Doesnt suit my needs. I have written tons of posts in other places and been called an "EV hater" every day to this day, since I have had a realistic image of what they can do. I am as unbiased as it gets when it comes to EVs and ICE vehicles.
But none of this is relevant to the post, because its not what I am saying. What I am saying is the car in the video is for those people that want a new vehicle but dont need a vehicle with more than walking/cycling range over a day. Thats it. So why would they get something that they will never use if they have to pay more? Everyone else, should *stay away*.
I was pretty clear I thought. The line of thinking of "its a van, it should do van things", is pretty flawed to me. There is no deifined range of a "van", as far as I know. Its just the learned expectation of the word... I dont agree with that kind of thinking, a bit of thinking of what might suit oneself and reading a very short spec sheet (such as the range number) could be reasonably be expected if you are buying a new car, wouldnt you say.
If you buy a new car simply because by reading a single word: (Van), you might find yourself trying to cook a meal on your newly bought "babys first stove " and being surprised it doesnt work.
In other words, I find the notion of people saying things isnt what they expected when they extremely easliy could have found out what the item could do in reality, seem a bit lazy, to be frank.
Cheers mate.
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@NathanMannin It was quite expensive at the time, some £11k , as all porsche powerkits are (well, expensive from the perspective of most people.)
It isnt just a tune after all, there are lots of hardware changes in the powerkit (and turbo S, consequently) such as intercoolers, front brakes, even new front damper struts etc etc.
Getting a hold of all those parts today must be close to impossible for a reasonable price, your only option has got to be to part out a scrapped car that already had it fitted.
Oh, I am glad you recognise my name, I am quite well. I have to admit I forgot yours... did you change your channel name or maybe I am jsut a bit forgetful when it comes to names, too much car info taking up space in the old noggin I guess...
Cheers mate.
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@CarsandChris They somewhat did tune the fifth gear to the engines potential, yes. But not fully. It could no doubt do quite a bit higher speed with another, suitable ratio or another gear.
Yes, I am sure everyone knows that it reaches the top speed in fifth, would be very strange if it could do it in sixth with such an enormous step between it and fifth.
A shorter sixth gear would give quite a bit more than 2 mph more, at least 6 mph and possibly 10 or a bit more would be easily acheivable. This is borne out from watching the acceleration of the car in the video, as well as the fact that by pure maths and numers a 530-ish hp car should do 300 kmh quite comfortably unless it got an atypical amount of drag for its frontal area.
I dont agree it was struggling, as in there is no more speed to be had. It is closing in on its top speed for sure, but as I said earlier, with that amount of acceleration seen in this video there is often at least 6 or so mph left until one reaches the true aerodynamic limited top speed.
In the end its mostly academic, just about no one ever pushes their car to their "true" top speed in the end. This fifth gear is a good compromise that is still more than sufficient for even the longest straights on any race track in the world.
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@MrFlazz99 Yes, this in indeed very common since the 1980s in American cars. If I remember correctly the first Dodge Viper for example was geared ridiculously high, with a theoretical top speed of close to 480kmh in top gear, and that was with way lower revs than this Mustang engine as well.
So none of this is new in any way. Having a very tall top gear or two highest gears is not a problem at all for the American market where just about no one goes above 250kmh regularly, certainly not back in the 1980-1990s.
Since then, it has found its way into more and more cars, with a lot of cars now having very tall top gears. My Porsche cayenne for example is also geared for a theoretical top speed of way more than 400kmh, just as this Mustang.
What is a little bit surprising is that they wouldnt make the fifth gear juuuust a little bit taller, but they probably felt the tradeoff in acceleration wasnt worth it for a bit more top speed that as good as no one ever uses. Fair enough, hard to argue with that.
Regarding too low gearing for max top speed, It is often found in diesels, just as your clio, since they have more limited revs. My old BMW 123d could hit the revlimiter in top gear already at stock power, and with just a little bit of tuning it was very easy to do so. Funnily enough, the 120d model with less power had higher gearing, and the 118d with less power again had even higher gearing than that. This was probably because BMW assume the customers buying the stronger engines prioritized acceleration vs fuel economy. Cheers.
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@chrisalexandersb1748 It is obvious you have put quite a lot of thought into this, and for that I salute you. Very well argued points overall.
I have also put quite a lot of thought into performance of electric cars, since the early 1990s with the EV1 in fact. I also happen to be a physicist with an interest in track driving. I have also seen the Top gear episode of Model 3 Performance vs BMW M3 multiple times since it aired.
Considering that, I feel qualified to give a few points of my own:
"Top Gear" doesnt hate Tesla. Jeremy Clarkson dislikes electric cars. But he was long gone when the M3 vs Model 3 test took place, the new writers of the show actually prefer electric cars.
Secondly, if you have seen the test, it is obvious the driver has nowhere near the skills as a track driver to make any comparison between cars totally moot. It really should have been the Stig driving, Or Chris Harris is also suitably skilled, but I am also not sure about his bias.
And that is all if we discount the editorial pressures. Do you remember the debacle of earlier Tesla in Top Gear running out of Juice on the track? Same thing there: Sensationalism, bias and a cheap laugh. I wouldnt trust BBC to make an unbiased test no matter what, no way. Its entertainment TV, no more, no less.
Lastly, Tracks are very different. The Tesla Benefits from stop-and Go tracks, where its superior low speed acceleration and traction gives a huge benefit. This is all inline with your autocross and other examples you gave. On those tracks, the Model 3 is seconds faster than an F80 generation M3, no doubt or argument about that.
When you say nurburgring, I take it that you mean the North loop? I have driven there quite a few times myself, and is quite familiar with it. Not sure what you mean by lack of gearing, only real place that could be an issue as I see it, is the long straight, and that would be a negligable timeloss, unless you mean to say it will accelerate faster at high speed with a higher gearing? It certainly wont reach its top speed of 260kph around any other part of the track.
No, around the Nurbrugring The Model 3 is mostly limited by its high weight and overheating of the electric motor, even if that is much better in the model 3 compared to the Model S. The North loop is really the worst case scenrio for Teslas, with its sustained high speeds straights and curves taking its toll. The Model 3 Performance is about as fast as a Golf GTI around, but that is still an enormous step forward compared to an early Model S, which was hard pressed to beat even a Golf GTD Diesel, because of its weight and overheating issues.
Track driving on bigger "normal" racetracks is mostly about pulling the most G:s . Compared to an M3, the Model 3 has too soft suspension, bad wheel angles, to weak brakes, is about 150-200kg heavier than an M3, has slower accelration at high speed, and, as you said, has worse standard fitment tires in many markets. Better low speed traction and acceleration can not compensate for these drawbacks around a normal track, where you rarely dip below 80-100 kph. I therefore stand by my statement that on a "normal" larger track where races are reguarly held, the M3 is faster. Its just physics.
If we are talking modified cars, all bets are off, of course. That is totally different, since there is no fair way to quantify modifications.
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@chrisalexandersb1748 With this post, I can see we agree with almost everything.
As far as I know, there are no 1/2 mile tracks at all. Dont know if there are any anywhere in the world, usually they use some kind of airstrip. I guess 1/2 is supposed to be a similar test to the standing 0-1000m test, which is often used in european car magazines.
I believe the times, but no video footage is unforgivable. No time on the board is also strange. Also, as I am sure you are aware if you have done some track driving is that temperatures alone and such can make a difference of several seconds. Making even the filmed top gear times almost useless. But I have no problem believing it might be a bit faster than an RS6 in the same conditions, which is even heavier and with a much higher center of gravity.
Regarding the North loop, I will go even further than you and say that ALL tracks in the world are shorter, and almost everyone is lower average speed. As I said, a worst case scenario compared to autocross. Though, as far as I know, its not the battery that overheats, its the rotor in the rear electric motor (copper windings) mostly. But the slower the track, the less the issue, which as we agree are most of them.
If you want to know which car is the fastest from the showroom, it should be run with stock tires. Of you on the other hand want to know which car is the fastest in owners on hands, I agree tires should be free to swap, since it is also a consumable. One can argue with size swap but, in the end it doesnt matter much. Changing springs goes a bit too deep in the modification category I think, if we still want to call it a stock car.
Nevertheless, for ordinary road driving, handling doesnt matter. Any car made in the last 30 years can easily cope with all legal speeds in Norway, as you seem to be based. And for track driving I dont think a model 3 is a serious alternative in most of the world for now, because of charging times. Also the weigjtnof a model 3 will be very hard on the brakes. But an M3 isnt much of a track car either, in my book. Its a sporty gt, thats it.
Many people think that a model 3 is faster on any track and that simply isnt true, that was what my first reply was based on. As I said, the Model 3 is a very well handling car, more than enough for anyone on the street, and I do mean ANYONE. That includes gentlemen such as Chris Harris, et al. The difference to a M3 is academic, and almost uninteresting. I would rather buy a Model 3 for myself. I just wont be dishonest about it being the best at everything as some (not you!) are.
Yes, I am well aware of the Alfas ridiculous stock tires, but that is ok in my book, since they are just that, stock. Other manufacturers can easily offer the same tires as an option if they feel it is unfair.
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@jamesbrook16 First, I want to thank you for giving me opportunity to explain this, as a former physics teacher it is very rewarding getting to do this again.
Secondly, dont feel bad about thinking its the time thats the limiting factor, its a very common mistake.
Now, with that said: since we have a fixed distance of runway, we are limited by that, not time. Which means that average speed is very important. If you do a 0-60 in 9 seconds, your average speed for those 9 seconds might only be about 40 mph, meaning you travelled 161 meters. This is how much you gain with a 60mph flying start compared to a standing one.
Now on the top end we already have 141mph, and want to get to 142. Lets say the average speed is just 141 to lowball it. This give us just 2.55 seconds of additional acceleration until the extra 161 meters are used up. Not much, right?
And yes, close to the true top speed, it can easily take 5-10 seconds between each mph gain in most cars. This car wasnt at its top speed, so it will accelerate quite a bit faster, but not more than one mph per 1-2 seconds for sure, which is why I said, 1 mph; 2 at the very most gain with a flying start.
Now you see why at least 3 miles or so is necessary with this car, the distance ticks by fast when trying to squeeze the last bit out.
Cheers.
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@slh950 Well, yeah, as I said, it depends on what you mean by "in a day". There are a lot of definitions of "a day" in common parlance believe it or not. The 8 hours you mentioned; 12 hours is another one, as is 24 hours; from sunrise until sunset, which varies depending on where in the world you are, and can technically be several months long, and lastly, the time from you wake up until you sleep again, which can be a lot more than 24 hours.
Myself I have done about 2300km in what people where I live consider "a day", i.e. 24 hours, and regularly do 1500+ km "day trips" Cheers.
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@monksuu Well "answering a question" is all fine and dandy. However, there really isnt much of a relevant question to be answered in this case, since as I wrote, writing the number of valves, especially in a "V4" format is irrelevant from the video makers side, and very strange.
I can give a similar example, "Why do dogs have 6 legs instead of 3?" The answer isnt, "because it makes them run faster", the real answer is: "they dont have 6 legs, this is a misunderstanding, so the question is misstated to begin with"
The only possible reasonable conclusion is as I write above: The maker of the video either mistyped or dont know much about engine configurations in typical cars. No mainstream car in production or in recent years has a V4 engine.
Which leaves the other alternative, but the chances of the video maker defining number of valves for just a 3 cylinder engine, but none of the other configurations mentioned has to border on zero if they have enough engine knowledge. It seems far more likely that he indeed misspelled or mistopk inline 4 for V4 cylinder counts, in which case IWrockers "corrected" to I4 is indeed correct.
I cant help to think their is a language barrier at play here, with those that are well versed in english vs those that are pretty good, but perhaps not quite good enough to decipher technical details and how they are commonly written completely.
Cheers and good night!
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@ None of them got 8 inches of ground clearance for example. One can argue the 911, since its an aftermarket mod he talks about, hence it can be anything. But I am pretty sure no one sells an off the shelf lift kit that gives a 911 a 8+ inches of ground clearance, so we are talking about a custom made car and kit... .
So no, I am correct, an he is not. And its, as I said, easy to find out it is so.
You really should also have taken the time to look it up, if you didnt know. And as it shows, you didnt, even if you thought you did. Anyway, its just good practice in discussion, especially before making a definitive statement and correcting someone else erronously as it turned out to be now.
Anyway, no big deal, just a general FYI.
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@TassieLorenzo If you take note of my quote above you will see it says: "The modern upsizing is almost exclusively done for looks." Key word being "almost", not "entirely". There are lot of other considerations of why you might want to upsize the wheels, the largest one being to fit larger brakes. I can think of a lot of other reasons quite easily, actually. But in the end, they all pale into insignificance compared to the amount of cars that have it just for the looks.
How do we know this? Well, I can give two easily understandable examples:
1: Most cars sold are "bread and butter cars" not extreme sportscars like the example above. They are but a miniscule amount of the totalt car production worldwide.
Funnily enough, even in the case above of going for fastest laptimes which is very far from what a normal consumer cars is supposed to be about there is
questionable merit to what Mr AB-80X writes. I have not seen any real world lap time benefit of larger wheels for contact patch, larger rear than front wheels, or lower sidewalls. Unless I will be presented with data that shows the benefits outweighs the negatives (chiefly weight) of larger wheels than is necessary for fitting the brakes, I get the feeling that MR AB-80X have absorbed a bit too much marketing material.
2: Very few normal cars run the smallest possible wheels that can fit over the calipers, usually only the "poverty spec" version.
All in all, with a few exceptions (which fit into the "almost" category, as stated above) its done for looks. Cheers.
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@taylor92493 Dont see what is so funny about that comment, maybe you could explain? As someone who has studied and taught physics for decades, I am offering to help you understand the things you have gotten wrong. If you truly were interested in learning new stuff as you say you are, especially about physics, then you could have taken me up on it. But you clearly arent, you just want to write stuff. Fair enough, but its a bit transparent as I have said earlier. And no one else but me likes to reply to you any more, as you can see.
You got to learn to read better: The comment was neither funny, nor did I delete it. It explained the physics of how things work one more time, since I am a nice guy. But it got deleted, probably youtube did it because it contained some kind of censored word, thats my best guess anyway.
Sorry, but this has lost my interest quite a bit, I have other comments to reply to. Get back to me if you have something new to add. Or a reply to the simple things I asked earlier which are still nowhere to be found in the numerous comments you have made since.
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@frozenpete788 It seems you also have a lot of experience as well then.
But we are looking at it from different angles, you are worried the clutch might give out if it is very worn or almost at the end of its service life. That is a fair point, it is more likely to happen, certainly.
I am looking at it from the view that the clutch is in good, servicable condition to start with.
If you are stuck in mud or similar or doing heavy offroading with a lot of clutch slip and high throttle levels it is more likely you will burn the clutch, indeed. But common sense goes a long way. If you can smell it, its time to back off for a while, as I am sure you know.
Anyway, believe me when I say that if the clutch isnt on its last legs, there is no reasonable on road towing a normal weight race car + trailer that will have any adverse affect on a cayenne with manual gearbox such as this one. I guarantee it. Also, the cayenne of this model also have a low range, which if used put even less strain on the clutch. So dont let that dissuade you. Cheers.
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@papugenas Track driving. Thats what these cars are made for. Speed interval about 80-280 kph. 0-100 was a useful metric for testing engine power back in the days when it took normal cars at least 15 seconds or so, which was in the 1970s and earlier.
Thats why it was used. But it is limited by tire grip for decades now. I have never heard of anyone driving 0-100 with full throttle in normal trafic regularly, have you? Better hope that one always is the first car at the stoplights when it turns green, or one will run into the back of the car in front, because most people dont use much power when pulling away.
No, track driving is where its at for those who like to drive, and then you are usually way above 100kph, as I said earlier.
Not that it matters much, cars at this price point rarely sees the outdoors anyway, they are locked up in a multi millionaires garage. A pity, but thats just life.
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@CockatooDude I think you perhaps misunderstood me. I meant that in the case of the XL1, I believe there really wasnt an attempt to have an effective systems engineering process to begin with, hence its not a factor. I guess it depends on what scope and angle you are looking at it from.
I must somewhat object to the whole insight weight comparison that been made in this video and by various commenters such as yourself. The XL1 is much newer, and as such has to contend with a lot more stringent regulations, potentially driving the weight up.
And finally, the carbon tub, hand built nature and price werent really problems per se once the ethos of the car was set in stone, its, (as I said above) just a statement piece and not in any way meant to be a serious production car. Its a concept car made street legal, a pure vanity project through and through. i.e there really isnt a "vs" to begin with when it comes to the design process, in my mind.
The only "vs" might perhaps be in the consumption results, of which there can be little doubt the XL1 is, keeping economical driving in mind, surely quite a lot better. Never heard of any other car of its era that gets a real 100+mpg and potentially 150 or so in a cruise on fuel only from factory.
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@TassieLorenzo Dont know if I agree with that, can you give some examples of what cars have you driven at the limit in that way if I may ask?
My experience points to that a clio RS or MX5 might feel a lot faster, but really isnt in any significant way, if at all, if you measure it and everything else being the same (by stopwatch for example).
That includes in hairpins. With the correct tires, I am pretty sure this car in the review could keep up with both of those just fine, even in hairpins, unless we are talking about some truly super small roads, but that doesnt seem very representative of many roads in the uk to say the least.
Just about any modern car I have driven can take normal hairpins at double or triple the speed most people would do..., which considering what kind of channel this is, (mostly classics in the uk) I took into account when I made my comment. I think its fair to say that this is indeed far above what any reasonable person could justify doing on a public (uk) road.
Of course, if the channel was mostly about illegal underground asphalt rallying near the mediterranean, or Japanese touge one might make a different judgement.
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@peterriggall8409 Thing is, why do they (XC70 for example), have mismatched tires, often only one? I am pretty sure it most often is the case they had a flat, or semi flat tire, decreasing the rolling diameter between it and the rest of the wheels a percentage waaaay above what can be achieved with normally worn, not to mention simply different brand of the same dimension, tires.
In the XC70 case specifically, I think they just got a sub par batch of clutches, combined with it being manys "first" and consequently running with flat tires without stopping. All of those factors conspired to make the AWD clutch break.
I have yet to see a single example in the real world where this hasnt been the case, but just the simple act of using different tire brands is what had detrimental effects. Doesnt seem plausible. Better stay away from having one side of the car heavier, since it also makes different rolling diameters, or long sweeping corners, since the outer tires will have a longer path to travel.
I am to be convinced.
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Wondeful car, I had the similar-ish 540i. There is a wet (slow) nurburgring lap in it on my channel if anyone wants to see.
Few extra details:
Standard wheels were 18", not 17" I think.
A fresh derestricted one will do a true 180mph, maybe even a smidge more in the right conditions. A know a guy who did 184, but I am not sure about tailwind etc. I did 166 myself in my 540i touring with 100hp less..
Satnav was avalible from the e39 debut, I had it in my 1997. For its time very good, many manufacturers did not have equal systems until about 2010 or so. You could also have an optional tv function for analog tv. With tv, it was very expensive, dont have the exact number but I would guess 5-6k £ or so in 1997.
There might be a 60kg difference between this and the newest M5 on paper, real difference is well above 100kg, I think.
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You are correct. However, the thing about "modern hybrids" not getting much better mileage than older cars is that the cars are much, much heavier. This is a consequence of what customers and legislation demands. Like for like (same relatively heavy weight), modern cars are much more fuel efficient.
As for this car, it can do mileage no other car can, if driven in a reasonable way. The fuel consumption rating numbers are very suspect, no idea how they got them but they surely its all but a worst case scenario for the XL1 vs a good or even best case for other cars. The XL1 can do a true 150mpg running only on fuel (no EV assistance, depleted battery), this is something no other production car, even the aforementioned insight, can come close to.
So you are indeed correct, but in a way other people are as well, if not for the reason they think they might be.
By the way, I have done 55mpg in my 330hp 3750lbs car (best case scenario, mind, but still)... and its a relic of the early 2000s and not very efficient compared to more modern engines/drivetrains. How? Its a diesel and I know how to drive very economically compared to most people. That does wonders.
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@GGMatt If it (as the post you quoted asserts) is to be taken as a joke by a person, it is indeed "dark humor", you even write the definition in your own post, more or less. Perhaps the expression "gallows humor" is more likely to tickle your fancy and get the context of your quoted post across. Again, I am speaking strictly withing the confines of the viewpoint of your quoted post.
By the way, I am neither American, nor a Brit, so that assumption isnt correct, which somewhat showcases the fact that your logic for me being incorrect is built upon a faulty premise. I would suggest adressing the topic at hand instead, lest you keep barking up further incorrect trees in the future. That would be quite a pity, after all. Cheers mate.
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@will4may175 You are mostly right, but remember the stopping distances are very short at these low speeds, making the margin much smaller. 100 feet or less stopping distance is easily acheived at these speeds, thats just one second of driving at the speed the test starts at, making reaction times and even the smallest difference in start of braking more important.
Also, tire grip on this surface they are running at is lower than most well paved roads, and very much lower than most racetracks, which influences motorcycles more negatively, one can say.
Anyway, considering the low grip surface with varying grip, and the different tires the cars run, the brake tests of carwow more often than not tells absolutely nothing, and is more of a curiosity. This was one of the few times one can draw a reasonable conclusion, and it was as expected. Cheers.
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@refugeehugsforfree4151 Nope, EVs have some of the lowest profit margins to prodoce of any cars,, because of the high development cost and the cost of the raw materials and parts that go into them.
I dont have to pretend anything, I know what I am talking about, both when it comes to manufacture of cars, economics, and the linguistics part of the wording.
You seem to mix the things up I just explained how it works. Just because something costs a lot of money, doesnt make it overpriced.
I can sell a 1 lbs bar of gold for 10 grand. Thats a lot of money to people, and they would have no real use for that bar of gold.
But it would be a serious underprice considering thousand of buyers would pay much more in an instant if they could buy it.
Same with most EVs, they have much lower profit margins than say most ICE SUvs or Trucks.
Thats how it works.
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@aimxdy8680 Yep. You will note, none of those races were on normal circuit track oriented street tires, on a sandy strip, and starting from zero, as was the case in this "race" in the video.
Thats the context, and thats were 2wd just isnt enough, for any car really, and certainly no Viper ACR, just as the poster you qouted said. Other stuff (that werent the focus of the comment you quoted) are of course different, for sure.
Just talking about different things, it seems. Cheers mate.
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As I said earlier: If by "torque" you mean (horse)power in the lower revrange, then we are in total agreement.
If you however believe that torque by itself have anything to do with acceleration, which it seems to me by your examples, then you are completely wrong.
the F in F=ma is a force, not a torque. The A in that forumula includes the component of time, which is not availible in the torque measurement. However, it is handily enough availible in the power measurement. Almost as if time matters when you are talking about acceleration. Funny that, huh?
Your "real world" examples make it seem to me like you drank to much manufacturer cool-aid, and is a bit lost. Understandable, but I will gladly dismantle them as well, depending on if you see the light after this post.
No hard feelings, we all make mistakes some time, especially if you have been "taught" things which are flat out wrong.
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@Tafa-Mapa They ones replying to you are mostly, if not completely, correct. The core of their argument is broadly correct, one can say, if not all the details.
Hers the gist of how it is: The only thing that matters for vehicle (or any physical object) propulsion is (horse)power. Power means rate of energy conversion, which is what is happening.
And yes, I am a physicist that also have decades of experience in vehicle design. Not that its needed, the formulas are quite simple and can be easily understood by almost anyone, if they looked into it.
I recommemd doing so to anyone, learning how things truly work is both fun and educational. And can help one make your own vehicle better, if one builds or tunes for themselves.
CHeers mate.
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