Comments by "Vic 2.0" (@Vic2point0) on "Should Wives Serve Their Husbands? Tradwives vs Feminists | Middle Ground" video.

  1. I'm with the tradwives. My wife and I have lived this way for 17 years now (14 with a son) and we're both very glad we did.
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  2. Yep, I noticed the same. The workforce masculinizes you over time. Women don't like to hear it, but it's true.
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  3. Hilarious that the feminists couldn't even answer the divorce prompt correctly. So a woman should be considering divorce under most circumstances? Really? Lol.
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  4. Agreed.
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  5. Notice how happy the tradwives look compared to the feminists though. Only thing the feminists seem to take joy in is mocking the other side.
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  6. "If you find it empowering to be submissive, that's fine." What incoherent nonsense. The point is to have a sense of purpose or duty that's higher than self-empowerment. And everyone submits. If you're an employed woman, you submit to far more people (most of them being men) every day than any tradwife.
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  7. 56:12 "Can we all agree that PDFilia should be shamed?" All the tradwives nodded their heads. Only two of the feminists did... Very telling.
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  8. It's wild how the feminists couldn't even answer the divorce prompt correctly. "In most circumstances, a married woman must not seek a divorce." The phrase "most circumstances" could refer to literally anything. "We're having chicken for dinner" is a circumstance, as is "I'm watching TV". But they don't catch that, and just default to divorce as a solution for most situations. The tradwife position of limiting it to things like abuse or cheating is perfectly reasonable. But then, they actually mention children a few times in this debate, indicating they realize that marriage isn't all about your own personal feelings of happiness.
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  9. The traditional female role has been devalued.
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  10. So funny that the feminists wouldn't even try to defend the premise they sat down to agree with concerning happiness ("Women are happier post feminism"). First one to speak immediately contradicted it by admitting everyone seems less happy nowadays. Second one just said she didn't actually care about the question. And the third basically just said women are happier and also, she's scared all the time, lol.
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  11. At the end of the day, most men are going to want a more feminine woman just like most women prefer masculine men. You can't lecture someone into finding you attractive, and complaining about this isn't going to help the feminists anymore than it helps the incels. Meanwhile, the workplace has a way of masculinizing you. Makes you less sensitive, less gentle, more assertive/aggressive, more callous, etc. That's not to speak of how stress from work can increase your cortisol levels which will minimize your fertility. So even if you don't wait too long and end up "hitting the wall" before trying to start a family, it can make it difficult to have children.
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  12. Agreed. Although there are always going to be outliers, most men prefer more feminine women.
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  13. @ It's "ridiculous" to say that most men want feminine women? Lol. Anyway, my response to azoo seems to have been deleted. But very quickly: Feminism promotes women entering the workforce, which tends to masculinize people. That's the line of logic behind that.
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  14. Exactly. You end up submitting to more people as an employee. They never want to acknowledge that most men work the type of job where most of the day is just doing what your boss(es) tell you to. But they mean the type of "liberation" wherein you can just abandon your husband whenever you feel like it, which is why all the feminists literally took the position that under most circumstances the woman should be considering divorce.
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  15. "Submitting to someone means you're less liberated." Meanwhile, employed women submit to far more people and far more often than the tradwives.
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  16. Disagree on the abortion thing, but yeah. I kind of assumed the tradwives would get decimated here because feminists tend to be more well-versed on political arguments than your stereotypical tradwife, but I think they did great. Even the "fact checks" largely backed up what they were saying.
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  17.  @bruceleroy5585  Exactly. And so much for feminism keeping women safe, lol.
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  18. You can tell these women are tradwives. As soon as they walked in they started cooking and mopping the floor with the feminists 😋
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  19. Same. What a headache that would be.
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  20. Not to mention the fact that by the feminist's own admission, that woman ended up disappearing. So, so much for feminism making women "safer".
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  21. Agreed. Promiscuity is a bad idea for both men and women.
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  22. You can tell these women are trad wives; they couldn't resist mopping the floor with these feminists! The "Women are happier post feminism" prompt was especially amusing. First feminist to sit down in support of that claim immediately conceded that people in general are less happy, so that was fun. Second one admitted she didn't even think the prompt mattered, so I guess she just wanted to sit down? And the third basically said "Women are happier now because I'm afraid of being oppressed all the time". Real big-brained stuff.
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  23.  @totallynotrandom6081  And you're free to think whatever you want. Can you show how anything I said was false though?
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  24. Siete is supposed to be the most intelligent of the feminists, from what I keep seeing in the comments section, and yet she doesn't realize "But that's coming from a very Westernized perspective" is literally committing the genetic fallacy - trying to dismiss or refute a position by pointing to how your opponent came to believe it. Even if it were true that only the West adhered to these traditional values, that wouldn't do anything at all to show that those values were wrong or inferior to anyone else's. She needs to come up with an actual argument, not just throw out buzz words she likely learned in college.
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  25. Exactly.
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  26. How so?
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  27.  @janetappmeyer7483  It depends on many different factors. But do you agree with the feminists that in literally most circumstances, a woman should seek a divorce? I will say that traditionalists emphasize duty over these temporary feelings, so the kids are typically fine. Ideally, it's a temporary problem they overcome and the kids don't even know the parents are ever "miserable" as you put it.
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  28. What's so funny? A quick Google search for "vasopressin aggression" will confirm the tradwife was correct.
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  29. So women are supposedly happier post-feminism, even though the very first feminist to sit down in agreement with that prompt admitted both men and women seem less happy nowadays? And it supposedly made women safer, even though Ms. "Empowerment" told us that story about a woman who was kidnapped and probably murdered because she went outside wearing just her underwear in the name of feminism? That's not to speak of men who identify as women invading women's spaces which they're all okay with... Anyway, I'm seeing tradwives who look very happy vs. feminists who only seem happy when mocking the tradwives. And I'm seeing the feminists themselves talking about how afraid they are all the time vs. tradwives who don't seem afraid of anything.
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  30. The premise: "Women are happier post feminism." The feminists: "I agree! Because both men and women seem less happy nowadays, I don't care about this question, and I'm afraid all the time." 🤣
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  31.  @mhorworshipper7456  I was paraphrasing what the first feminist who sat down to "agree" with that prompt said, so you'd have to ask her. Just pointing out how ridiculous they sounded, is all.
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  32.  @mhorworshipper7456  14:52 I think her name was Jazmen. She literally begins with explaining why she thinks people are less happy, even though the prompt she was supposedly agreeing with was that they're happier.
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  33. Just because you and your friends' grandparents were miserable doesn't mean everyone else's were.
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  34. @ Yeah, but you're still implying that this was the norm when it could very easily have been the opposite. You even assumed that the tradwives' grandparents had that experience. Some of us chose traditional marriage because we know plenty of examples of it being better.
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  35. Yep. Even the OF feminist chick essentially admitted everyone's less happy now.
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  36. Love how Siete's great example of how traditionalism is unsafe for women, is a woman stripping in public in the name of feminism and apparently being kidnapped or worse. Yeah, way to keep women safe. Not to mention letting men into their sports where they can get injured faster.
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  37. "We feminists stand for making women safer! That's why we're cool with letting men invade women's spaces like locker rooms and prisons, and why we think a woman walking around town in just her underwear is a great idea." Also, very ironic that it was a feminist who said they didn't feel comfortable talking about "transwomen" because there wasn't one present. Guess they needed a man's permission to give their opinion on the subject? "Liberated" indeed.
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  38. The feminists are so liberated they have to get a man's permission (one who identifies as a woman, no less) to continue talking about transgenderism, lol.
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  39. I noticed that too. Like on the prompt of "Women are happier post feminism". The first feminist who sat down (to agree with the prompt) began by openly admitting that both men and women seem less happy now. Second one just thought the question didn't matter. And the third said something weird like "I think women are happier now and also I'm afraid of oppression all the time." Lol.
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  40. "Feminism is the reason you can choose to be a tradwife." Tell that to all the women I've seen saying "I would like to be a tradwife, but in this economy it's not possible". With the influx of women into the workforce in the 1970s came a decline in men's wages, and now employers can treat their employees as truly disposable, paying them essentially dirt so that tons of households have to/feel like they have to make two incomes just to get by. So for those women at least, feminism has been more of a hindrance than a help.
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  41. Feminists are hilarious. Sit down to agree with the prompt "Women are happier post-feminism", and the very first one to speak admits she thinks everyone's less happy now. Second one just says it doesn't matter (Guess she was just tired of standing and wanted to sit down?) And the third claimed women are happier but then went on to talk about how she's afraid all the time. Real convincing.
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  42. Same. And they did way better in this debate than I expected them to.
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  43. The "Women are happier post feminism" prompt was hilarious. First feminist to agree with the prompt: "Both men and women are less happy nowadays." Second feminist: "I don't even care about this question." And third feminist: "I think women are happier and also I'm afraid all the time."
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  44. It's funny how the feminist in light blue tells the story about a woman who disappeared after walking around nude in the name of feminism and then they go on to talk about how it's making women safer, lol.
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  45.  @tiahnarodriguez3809  Yep yep, I have a traditional marriage and we're both so happy with it that we like to promote it. Are you happy with your life? Because you follow me around a lot to reply to every comment you see. By your logic, wouldn't that imply you're miserable?
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  46.  @thankyouforbeingafriend9632  I'm being perfectly considerate. I even asked my little stalker friend if they're happy too. I'll ask you as well. Are you happy? Because the feminists in this debate certainly didn't seem to be...
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  47. The feminists handed the debate over to the tradwives with the divorce prompt. It's just a truism that people shouldn't seek divorce under most circumstances, because "most circumstances" would include literally "We're having pizza for dinner" or "We're watching a movie", lol. Seriously, how braindead can you get?
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  48. All Jazmin's anecdote proves is that her current boyfriend is a POS person who abandoned his wife, and that those wanting to be tradwives should get with traditional husband types who believe it's their role to provide and protect. That should be obvious but I guess it has to be spelled out for some people.
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  49. Too funny how the "feminists" are all super-cool with men invading women's spaces in the current day. The tradwives call transgenderism out for the incoherent worldview that it is.
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  50. The claim that non-parents are happier than parents is likely based on the 2016 Glass study, but even that study admits that this purported gap between the groups emerged in the 1970s. So it could very well be the fault of feminism that parents are less happy than they would've been without it.
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  51.  @janetappmeyer7483  Yeah, that's why anecdotal evidence doesn't really amount to much in either direction. But even studies aimed at suggesting people shouldn't have children admit that parents used to be happier before feminism, was the original point.
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  52. Agreed.
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  53. Lol, interesting idea! In a way, it's already happening. Being a tradwife is counterculture these days. The sermon from the establishment as of late has been essentially one big Democrat depopulation agenda, and the younger generations are rebelling against it because it's lame.
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  54. Agreed. Most women have more potential in those roles than they will in the alternatives, just like most men will have more potential in traditionally masculine roles. It would be foolish to structure society to favor the outliers (exceptions to the rule), which is why we have gender roles and norms to begin with.
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  55. I agree, but you have to break it down for the feminists in language they understand... Ahem... If you make more babies, you can boss them around at home and feel empowered! There ya go.
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  56. @ No one mentioned force...
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  57. How so?
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  58. But it is a fact that if you're in the workforce, you're literally competing with men for jobs. And feminists do like to brag about being "better than" men a lot, they were even doing that in this debate.
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  59. Tradwives FTW. And that first prompt is a bit misleading. If you want a stable and happy marriage, you'd be well-advised to make your spouse a top priority. This goes for husbands as well as wives, both serving each other just in different ways (husbands serve as protectors and providers). Traditional marriage simply goes beyond acknowledging that men and women are different, and lets that fact inform what should be expected of each.
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  60. Even though I'm on the tradwives' side overall, I mostly agree with you. I think cheating should be a dealbreaker for men and women alike. That said, I know a couple where the wife cheated early on but they worked it out and have been happy together for 20 years now. I only agree with you because I don't think exceptions prove the rule. It's probably more likely that it won't play out that way after someone cheats.
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  61. How are they wrong?
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  62. Submitting to men, lol.
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  63. @ "Doing what men want you to do" is a pretty clear understanding of it. And if they didn't want their bodies to be a focus they wouldn't make it a point to show their cleavage or be on OF.
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  64. @ I had answered in my response to sally which I guess was deleted, but she's an OF "model". But also, being a lawyer requires submission too if you think about it. Your whole job is memorizing what you're told to memorize and operating within the boundaries someone else has set for you.
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  65. Agreed. But alas, when there is no real oppression going on, people have to make it up in their minds.
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  66. Same. Although even the feminists on this panel admitted they don't think anything's wrong with seeking a divorce in most circumstances, so they're kind of telling us that already.
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  67. Exactly.
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  68. In reality, everyone submits to someone, whether they realize it or not. The great irony is in saying it's normal to submit to tons of strangers every day but strange to submit to one person.
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  69.  @user-bx1bj4of7b  Disagreeing =/= being brainwashed. And she said that on the basis of their discussion, so it's not like she judged her at first glance. Talk about being "dramatic". "Insane" and "brainwashed" are very dramatic words...
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  70.  @user-bx1bj4of7b  "Discussion or not, nobody has the authority to tell someone how they're oriented, emotionally, or otherwise." Of course they do, people do this all the time. If someone's acting a certain way, you draw conclusions about their mental state on the basis of their behavior. And it's strange how you claim we can't know how someone is oriented emotionally based on a single conversation, but then it's perfectly fine for you to call them insane going by the same limited knowledge. Technically, the tradwives knew the feminists better than you know them, because a lot of the conversation they had back and forth was probably cut from the final edit. "To say "thats because you're hardened and can't feel" to a stranger because they don't share your beliefs is (like I said) insane.... and very much a judgment." Yes, it's a judgment (just like you're making against them), but you haven't been able to show why it's incorrect so far. You're just complaining about them doing something you're doing too.
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  71. Feminists can reproduce, but they'll reproduce at a much slower rate than we traditionalists will (for only about a thousand different reasons), which is great.
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  72. ​ @cannibalbananas  Well there are various features of traditional marriage that help your chances. The traditional husband doesn't just protect and provide when he feels like it but believes it's his role to do it. He derives his sense of pride from being able to do these things, and that's usually because he was raised that way. Ideally, you start out by courting rather than just dating. This means dating with marriage in mind. So you ask the important questions on that very first date instead of waiting until you've "fallen in love" with someone (because as we all know, once you've caught feelings for someone like that, you'll ignore or downplay all the red flags and that's how you end up miserable). Traditionally, wives would also establish and maintain relationships with the local community as well as friends and family. And everyone would have several siblings and the branches of their family trees would all be affiliated. This meant having a robust support group in the off-chance that something tragic happened. There is that stereotype of families hosting dinner parties or barbecues and having dozens of guests over, after all, and stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason. I could go on, but you get the idea!
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  73. @ How so?
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  74. Agreed.
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  75. Where's the bible verse that says their outfits aren't modest?
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  76.  @headerahelix  Well of course the answers are confounding. The first answer is a direct contradiction to the prompt they were supposed to be agreeing to. The second suggests a complete lack of thought given to the prompt at all. And while the third could technically be reconciled with saying women are happier now, it better qualifies as evidence to the contrary. "Women are afraid of being oppressed" is something a conservative might say to suggest that feminism was a net negative on women's happiness.
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  77. I don't blame you, lol. This was difficult to make it all the way through. I don't typically agree with feminists, but these takes were especially bad.
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  78. @ True enough, but feminism leads you into the workforce which has a way of masculinizing you over time.
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  79. What are you referring to? Was there a specific law that forbade women from promoting these traditional values?
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  80. Agreed!
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  81. So it's not possible for a woman to disagree with you on her own?
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  82. @ There are plenty of people who become religious all on their own, as adults. And you could also indoctrinate your kid to be an atheist, a feminist, etc. Indeed, some of the tradwives flat-out say that's how they began (as feminists) and then they changed their minds. So my question to the OP still stands. They seem to be implying that women aren't capable of making up their own minds, which would be very misogynistic.
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  83. A fair point (though I hope your prediction's wrong). I think both men and women should embrace their respective traditional roles. No one should be forced, but I will be promoting that choice because I think it's what's going to be best for society overall.
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  84.  @tiahnarodriguez3809  Can you provide any substantiation for your claim it isn't true? Because I literally gave you a study, lol.
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  85. Lol, exactly. Plus she literally put herself in danger in the name of feminism, yet the feminists claim that this worldview makes women safer.
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  86.  @jypsych3556  You say "allows" and "forced", which are irrelevant terms. No one's talking about banning this or forcing that. But a lot of what we expect of men vs. women is informed by our biological differences. Men have more of a capacity for physical strength, while women are the only ones who can bear and breastfeed children. We can go into it in more detail if you like, but acknowledging these differences in any real way leads to men working outside the home and women generally staying home with children, if you want the best results. That just means it's going to be encouraged and deviations from it will be discouraged on at least some level.
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  87.  @livinglightlylauren  I can't actually see my comment here anymore, but I don't recall saying "The jobs automatically belong to men". I think I just pointed out the obvious fact that if someone (anyone) is trying to get a job that men/other men are also trying to get, that's literally competing with men for that job.
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  88. You didn't catch that she was talking about cycle-tracking? There are ways to prevent getting pregnant (outside of abstinence) without ingesting a bunch of chemicals. And yes, lots of people are happier with more kids!
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