Comments by "gingerBill" (@GingerGames) on "ThePrimeTime" channel.

  1. I love how people are rediscovering Arenas again! They are pretty much all I use for all my allocation needs because an arena equates to a lifetime group for allocations. And using arenas (like in Odin), you can just free all of the things at once rather than individually (e.g. paired malloc/free in C), which means in practice, you rarely need to free anything manually and just allocate when needed. And because arenas are really simple allocators, they are as fast as they can possibly get compared to any other memory allocation strategy.
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  2. This is one of the reasons why I hate OOP (not necessarily objects): all of the stupid names for simple things. "Dependency Injection" is just passing objects to procedures as a value. WHY DOES IT NEED A SILLY NAME LIKE THAT?!
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  3. OLS is well loved as an LSP for Odin. As I kept trying to stress in the video: LSPs/IDEs hindered my personal productivity. If they increase yours, that is great! Everyone has different needs, wants, and preferences. Try to tailor your experience for yourself.
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  4. ​ @dealloc The only people who use the term are OOP people. Everyone else doesn't even bother naming it because it's such a trivial concept, and only seems "great" if you have been doing insane OOP things.
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  5. "I just choose the right language for job". I effectively said this for tools in general with my interview with ThePrimeagen but I did caveat it with you need to know the alternatives. If you don't know the alternatives, you can NEVER say it is the best tool for the job because you only have one option. It is by definition the worst choice too because it's the only choice. And when it comes to programming languages, I am one of those weirdos who is a polyglot who knows literally 100s of programming languages because that's kind of what I do for a living. So knowing "the best language" in that case is because I know the alternatives; most people don't.
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  6. I apologize that I was doing that but doing any form of voice chat with people on the other side of the planet does have a lot of latency. And to keep the quality of the stream there without many large gaps requires you to preempt where the "gaps" are going to be and I sometimes guess that "gap" incorrectly. I wasn't trying to be rude, just a failed latency preemption.
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  7.  @privacyvalued4134  And what symbols are you going on about? Just the colons for value declarations and maybe `->` for return types? If so, that's your honest complaint? That's the "symbol soup" that you speak of?
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  8. Worse: I use Windows 11.
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  9. That's completely right and I wish I said that now on stream because that is a better framing for the more web-based audience.
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  10. ​ @thewhitefalcon8539 I am not asking about calling singletons. I am literally saying that "dependency injection" is a silly name, not that is a bad idea.
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  11.  @CamaradaArdi  Arenas are built into Odin's core library. An Arena is a Bump Allocator. They are just different names for the same thing.
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  12. Where is this "symbol soup" that you speak of? Can you show me a code example of what you mean because the only main addition to Odin over C is the use of colons for value declarations. How is doing `x: i32 = 123` "symbol soup" compared to `int32_t x = 123;` in C? I am honestly trying to understand your criticism because none of what you are saying even sense. And you sure you are reading Odin?
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  13. As I said: it automates dependency hell. It's not just that "you can go crazy", everyone goes crazy with it. And package managers have accelerated that craziness. And doing it manually slows down that craziness. Does it stop it entirely? No. But it does nudge people go at least consider what they are doing most of the time. And if that still doesn't help, that person cannot be helped at moment in time.
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  14. What other options? If you want a imperative procedural language with manual memory management, that works on Windows, Mac, and Linux, you have about 5 options: C, C++, Odin, Zig, C3. When I see these kinds of comments, I don't think people know how little choice there is in the systems programming domain, especially before those latter 3 alternatives popped onto the scene.
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  15. The latter usually started out life as the former, and vice versa.
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  16. Public by default is on purpose because of the amount of times I've had so many issues with things being private all the time and I've not been able to access things without modifying the source code directly. I understand why people "think" private-by-default is a good idea but it really isn't for the actual users of the code. The library writer doesn't really know what I need and is usually wrong too.
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  17. Build systems and package managers are separate problems. And if your metric is "at least it is running", I don't want to see what code you are writing... There is a reason I said that package managers are a big reason for the acceleration for the why software is getting worse.
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  18. And that's why software is utter crap and so so slow and buggy. Software doesn't have to be this way.
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  19. That's quite the opposite. Odin is on par with C. Where did you get your information from?
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  20. It's slower in the short term, but you actually start learning and retaining the code base in your memory. So it is a lot quicker in the long run.
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  21. As for the dependencies thing: people never read through it if they automatically download it. They just don't. That's human nature. So the downside is that it doesn't happen.
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  22.  @lazyh0rse  if I transliterated C to Odin, it would perform the same. Because Odin can express the exact same concepts (if albeit slightly differently) as C. These benchmarks aren't even estimates of anything really. They are not comparing the same thing ever. Even if they were the same, at best you are now comparing compiler optimizer backends and not even the language, which is more a measure of maturity than anything intrinsic.
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  23. Please don't do it. The reason there is little good information is because if you know how to do it, you know what to use it for. If you don't know how to do it, it's really not for you. It's just applying the lessons of relational databases to games. That's pretty much it.
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  24. ​ @gercius  I am literally a language design and I do actually know probably over 100 of languages. And after a while, you actually see the commonalities and the subtle differences in the semantics between the different languages within certain families.
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  25. @LTibor2012  we do support OpenBSD and NetBSD but you will to compile from source. Odin is very simple to compile.
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  26. Huh? The very first thing I said was recommend OLS to people who like LSPs. All I said is that when I stopped using things like LSPs/IDEs, I PERSONALLY got more productive. If those tools make you more productive, that's great! Everyone's workflow is different, and there is nothing "elitist" about that. So I am absolutely baffled that is what you took from what I said since it was the EXACT opposite of what I said.
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  27. I don't even think it was recorded. It was just for the people who paid for it and attended live. And why is that gross? Why is it bad that some things cost?
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  28.  @lazyh0rse  benchmarks for any language are awful because they are never comparing apples to apples. They are all bad. Look at the code for each and then see if they are even similar, and then look to see what the compiler flags are for the respective compilers. I am betting the Odin ones don't even have bounds checking disabled nor many other things.
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  29. Elixir and not Erlang? Also, why are you not trying Odin? 😜
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  30. I love you too ❤
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  31. Why are they going the pseudo-destructor route rather than just having an explicit `defer`? The Drop trait makes sense in Rust due to its ownership+lifetime semantics, but does this `using` idea actually make any sense in JS? Why would `defer` be a bad idea? (I know `defer` is kind of already a thing for `<script defer ...>` but that's not technically JS at that point). let resource = getResource(); defer resource.dispose(); // or defer await resource.dispose(); This is just objectively clearer, even if you have to type an extra-line (oh no, not another line(!) /s). It would work with everything else already too that doesn't have the Symbol.dispose/asyncDispose nonsense too.
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  32. Our very early users of Odin were all Scandinavian and they had the same "problem". It turns out that in practice, using `^` is not as common as you think due to Odin's type inference. And typing that dead key is not that much of a problem in practice.
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  33. How?
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  34. @samhopkins1456  that's the joke... and clearly not _pretending_. "Pardon my French" and then going "Merde" is the joke.
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  35. @AG-ur1lj  you don't get that much money off ads, nor is that the equivalent of paying for it. Also private chat was a lot spicier and more causal, which might not even be appropriate for YouTube.
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  36.  @ThePrimeTimeagen  No worries! Enjoy Elixir, it'll be a good experience.
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  37. @RasmusSchultz  Sublime text has inline errors, and odin check is so fast that it acts like that. I think you might misunderstanding what I am saying.
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  38. @RasmusSchultz  we also export the error messages as JSON if needed, which could be used for any need. But an LSP is more than you're letting on, and its design is very limiting too (because Microsoft didn't think that far ahead). But in general, I don't need an LSP and odin check is extremely fast negating the issues of "slow compile times just for semantic checking".
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  39. @RasmusSchultz  I didn't talk about this on the video but the entire idea that an LSP to be a fully fledged web server is insane. I'm sorry, but you clearly don't think that's insane, so I won't explain any more.
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  40. No. The reason it is not official is because it isn't developed by anyone on the core team coupled with, I literally have never used it and why would I make anything official that I have never personally used myself? And you clearly didn't understand what I said in the video. I am not against LSPs whatsoever, rather that I found I was PERSONALLY less productive using something like intellisense than without—it was a massive surprise to me. If they are great for you, that's great! But actually test your assumptions, which you are clearly making loads of in your comment.
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  41.  @eugenakv  I use scope-based `defer` in other languages all the type for many things which are not "destructors" whatsoever. A good example are any calls that are effectively in nature begin/end, open/close, increment/decrement, etc, most of which have nothing to with type construction.
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  42. I apologize for everyone named Bill. - Ginger Bill
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  43.  @gercius  I don't think in terms of "favourites" because the concept makes very little sense. It's like asking "what is your favourite tool in the workshop?" without any caveat as to what you are trying to solve. It's like saying "I love hammers" but you are trying to drill a hole.
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  44. My "advice" wasn't even advice, I literally just said that when I stopped using intellisense-like functionality, I PERSONALLY got more productive. I was not telling other people to do that. And I work in multiple different languages and projects on a daily basis. On a daily basis, I am use C, C++, Odin, GLSL, JS, etc. So I don't really have a "very specific skill profile". All I was implying is actually test your assumptions and don't just go "well using this tool makes me more productive but I have evidence for the contrary".
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  45. I'm probably younger than you, and I was taught that term, even if I know the other ones. BBC Bitesize (kids learning website) uses the term speech marks.
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  46. Thank you 😂
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  47.  @UwU-f2a  How are you even testing things? Because none of that makes sense.
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  48.  @UwU-f2a  That is still vague. How are you actually testing this precisely? What is the source code? And especially what are the command line flags?
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  49.  @UwU-f2a  I am just going to be blunt. You just told me nothing and I asked specific questions. Your "benchmarking" is meaningless without any actual context and just saying you're using `wrk` says nothing either. You didn't even tell me what HTTP packages were you using, what your code looks like—nothing. So saying things like Odin's "performance isn't stable" is literal nonsense.
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  50.  @UwU-f2a  The Odin http library that isn't even official? And did you compile Odin with optimizations enabled?
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  51. `odin check` does what you say. And it's stupidly fast, even for very large codebases.
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  52. @RasmusSchultz  through no protocol other than a basic regex parsing the command line error output. It works extremely wel.
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  53. I said I used Intellisense (the IDE Visual Studio's completion system) and LSPs are in the same vein as that. And you can disagree with everything I said, that's fine. My view on LSPs is just personal one, and my view on package managers is a very rare one too.
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  54. Thank you 😂
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  55.  @gercius  as I said, I do not think that way. I don't have favourites.
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  56. And you needed a package manager to download something to interface with a database? And I don't ship things on Mars either.
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  57.  @martinseal1987  that didn't answer my question.
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  58.  @martinseal1987  that didn't answer my question.
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  59. @martinseal1987  i think might be overestimating the need for an automatic package manager still.
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  60. @martinseal1987  where did I say implement everything yourself? I am for third party libraries, but just knowing what you are downloading and minimizing dependencies. Package managers don't do that.
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  61. Please use a debugger. How the heck do you even know the execution and state of your program if you don't use one? Debuggers have literally saved me months of time.
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  62. > you can configure to reject certain licenses That's assuming the people who wrote those libraries wrote the correct licences AND they didn't steal the code from a GPL codebase. A package manager only does what you tell it to, and people lie, cheat, and steal.
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