Comments by "" (@josephcoon5809) on "Ryan Chapman"
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@busylivingnotdying Here’s what materialists don’t understand about reality…
A rock has ONE set of material (physical) attributes: size, weight, hardness, shape, color… However, it has MULTIPLE ideal (metaphysical) purposes: projectile, container, wall, ballistic, bludgeon, cutting-edge.
Conversely, a cup has ONE purpose: contain a fluid. However, it can be instantiated with MULTIPLE materials: rock, wood, glass, metal, plastic, and you can even cup your hands at a river (contain water) or around your mouth or ears (contain air).
Reality has a reciprocal ONE to MANY relationship between MATERIAL and PURPOSE. It is this lack of understanding that Materialism fails in resulting in a loss of value for some particular material. That value is determined by the IDEAL purpose; not its material attributes. A rock is more valuable for every purpose it is given depending on the circumstances.
What “socialism” does is it limits what people can imagine a material object CAN be used for by dictating what a material object IS used for.
A free market isn’t about the ends of wealth accumulation. It is about the innovations required to stay competitive for that wealth.
That’s not even the fundamental issue with “socialism.” The fundamental issue is that socialism WORKS IF EVERYONE IS A WILLING PARTICIPANT. The moment you make it mandatory is the moment it begins to degrade.
Freedom is always the heart of these conversations, and that’s why both sides get it wrong. Socialism is JUST the communal ownership of capital (“means of production” is the same thing; it was coined to give it a positive connotation when applied by the state). That communal ownership is completely possible, and even beneficial, within a free market.
So the actual argument is about whether individuals willingly come together and collectively manifest socialist ideals WITHOUT forcing it on unwilling participants: Actual Socialism versus NATIONALIZED Socialism.
And I hope everyone is familiar with the outcome of NATIONALIZED Socialism. Most Jews do, I am sure.
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@busylivingnotdying 😂 I meant specifically how the brain is organized. 😂
Lower order neurons are represented by higher order neurons in a 10-10,000:1 relationship. That is a fractal pattern that repeats through higher orders of neurons. Using 100 as the base…
a 2nd order neuron will represent 100 1st order neurons;
a 3rd order neuron will represent 100 2nd order neurons and 10,000 1st order neurons;
a 4th order neuron will represent 100 3rd order neurons; 10,000 2nd order neurons; and 1,000,000 1st order neurons.
and so on…
All these groups of neurons are ideologically segregated but integrated with each other through higher order neurons.
If humans did the same thing…
100 adults with greater than 95% ideological agreement would create a 1st order community. They would send 5 representatives to a 2nd order community to live there 3 months of the year. This second order community is composed of 5 representatives from 20 neighboring communities of 100 adults. WITHIN each community, there is a 95% ideological agreement, but BETWEEN each community there is a 90% ideological agreement. So, this 2nd order community represents 2,000 adults. And you pest the process, like the brain…
1st order community: 100 adults
2nd order community: 2,000 adults
3rd order community: 40,000 adults
4th order community: 800,000 adults
5th order community: 16,000,000 adults
6th order community: 320,000,000 adults
This organization leads to far less law enforcement since you only need to enforce laws on people that disagree with them. Taxes all but disappear because taxes are an imposition upon those who disagree with them. If you live with the people you agree with, laws become “house rules” that visitors/immigrants must abide by or get kicked out, and taxes become voluntary contributions.
ALL decisions made by representatives DIRECTLY affect those representatives for 9 months of the year because they eat, sleep, work, play, live, and die with the people they represent. Those representatives are DIRECTLY held responsible and to account by those they represent. This is in contrast to the system of thousands and millions of citizens represented by abject strangers that pass laws that nobody is faintly aware of.
With less law enforcement, there is FAR less incarceration since anybody who breaks a house rule is exiled rather than incarcerated. The “offender” doesn’t lose 99% of their freedom; their family need not be broken up; and the “offended” community need not WASTE resources incarcerating a non-productive member of the community.
All this is possible through deliberate ideological segregation where individuals MOVE to LIVE with people they agree with instead of the antithetical paradigm of “forced inclusion” which results in the mass incarceration we see today.
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@busylivingnotdying The reason there is a power dynamic in the first place is BECAUSE companies INCORPORATE and implant naturally superior hierarchies than the typical citizen that does not congregate based on similar ideological beliefs.
20 individuals reporting to a single individual creates a difference in consciousness/perspective. In a business corporation, this is a work group where 20 associates report to a SUPER-VISOR (super meaning higher; visor meaning view) the associates are conscious of their individual tasks whereas the supervisor is conscious of the summary from each associate AND the higher level view within the company.
In a community, (villages, communes, neighborhoods), the same concept applies. A supervisor isn’t one that commands. They are the ones that see further. As a community grows, the more levels of supervisors (representatives) you need to consider the summarized information from all their subordinates (not inferiors) and apply it to their broader perspective.
Otherwise, you have millions of individuals all trying to understand those broader perspectives which is absolutely impossible. That’s why the brain is designed the way it is. That’s why computer networks are designed the way they are. That’s why large companies are designed the way they are. That’s why riots and branches grow the way they do. All these systems evolve the SAME way because it is the most efficient way to organize large populations of…anything.
Democracy is tyranny, no matter how you slice it. If the answer to disagreement is to force the minority faction into compliance, that is the very definition of tyranny. These concepts are simple, and they apply at any level of magnitude you consider them at.
“Not wild “jungle freedom”…”
I’m beginning to feel like you are reading to respond, rather to understand.
It seems you are equating “wild “jungle freedom”” with anarchy.
If you feel the necessity to restrain the economy for fear of corporations ruling everything (which, ironically, is exactly what democracy is for: handing the reins of power to those who can manipulate unthinking populations), then do so IN YOUR community of like-minded individuals. Then those corrupt companies will take advantage of more free communities, and those freer communities will see the folly of their ways.
Or you will.
When you make that decision for everybody, you lose the ability to isolate what is actually leading to the corruption and inefficiency. When you allow smaller and smaller communities to try all the different ways to run a society, you’ll see exactly which ideas work and which ones don’t.
Your method is basically: when ever you don’t feel good, take an aspirin. It doesn’t matter why you feel I’ll, just resort to the same solution every time. Would you go to a doctor that has limited options? If so, then democracies are your thing. Allow everyone to have a say in what other people can and cannot do.
“People tend to cooperate when they see the benefit of it…”
When they SEE something they have no time to look at because I everybody is busy living an individualist lifestyle. What percentage of pages in the legal code have you read? You’re responsible for 100% of it no matter what your answer is.
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@keithbell9348 keep in mind, depth perception requires two DIFFERENT perspectives. Each eye, optical nerve, and hemisphere of the brain only understands in two dimensions. To understand reality better, you require a third dimension, and higher dimensional understanding requires perspectives that offer different information.
Science is all about finding data that cannot be explained in the dimensionality we currently understand things. Once those discrepancies are discovered, a new dimension that encompasses multiple prior dimensions of understanding is required. You see the same thing even in theoretical physics when in String Theory, 10 spatial dimensions enabled the combination of Einstein’s General Theory of Relativity (the astronomical) and Quantum Mechanics (the vanishingly tiny). The conundrum was that 10 dimensions generated thousands of viable solutions. It was not until somebody proposed an 11th dimension which resulted in M-Theory, and the explanation that all the solutions in 10 dimensions were merely the same solution from different 11-dimensional perspectives.
Even at the neuronal level, the brain evolved to accumulate information and after multiple iterations of similar situations, relevant information is synaptically reinforced while irrelevant information is synaptically pruned. That is the basis of bias, conditioning, prejudice, assumptions, and worldview which all describe the same thing: an individual’s logic.
The universe is filled with so many fascinating phenomena that it is truly sad that humans allow political discourse to cast a shadow on all that glory.
I apologize for bloviating, but my own personal journey has left me more idealistic than when I was far Left in my 20s, and more pragmatic when I was far Right in my 30s. I see purpose in everything, and I want to see other planets. 😂
It’s just nice to meet other open-minded people when bumping heads with closed-minded bigots is par for the course. 😂
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