Comments by "Sandy Tatham" (@sandytatham3592) on "An adviser to the Israeli PM is asked whether Palestinians should have a state" video.

The Jewish people were acknowledged as the #indigenous people of the Holy Land by the League of Nations in 1920. They've had a "continuous connection" with the land for over 3500 years!!! Why can't you accept that reality?
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"Its MOTHERLAND..." What are you talking about? The majority of the Palestinian Arabs only arrived in the area AFTER the Allied Powers defeated the Ottoman Caliphate in 1918. They came due to the improved economic opportunities that the British and the Jews created. Their own countries don't want them back so it's a very difficult situation.
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 @jedisamurai : What lies have I written? Are you prepared to debate this topic or are you just ranting?
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I think the so-called Palestinians have by now FORFEITED any right to a state. They had years to show that they can govern themselves and all we've seen is corrupt leaders getting richer and Islamic terrorist organisations growing in power. After the collapse of the Ottoman Empire in 1918 the Arabs were granted self-determination in 99% of the Ottoman Middle East land. Israel is a tiny less-than 1% and one-fifth of Israeli citizens are Arabs who have equal rights with Jews.
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All Israeli citizens are #equal under the law. There is no apartheid.
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@daniaa3205 : Remember that #indigenous peoples include those who were displaced from their ancestral homeland. For example, thousands of Jews were taken to Europe as SLAVES by the Romans, and maybe the Greeks too. The descendants of those Jews have now come home. And more than 60 percent of Israel's Jewish population today comes from other Middle Eastern and African countries. After the founding of Israel in 1948 around 800,000 Jews were expelled from their generational homes in Arab countries.
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@litekuk5053 : Are the Romans the #indigenous people of Britain? Can they claim, like the Jewish people can, to have had a "continuous connection" to that land for over 3500 years? Do the Romans, like the Jewish people, also have a unique language, kings, coins, cultural practices, artefacts and ancestral burial places all relating to that particular land? Was there a World War that gave them an opportunity to be granted the right as the #indigenous people to return to that land? Many things had to line up before Israel was fortunate to be created. I'd also like to point out that after the DEFEAT of the Ottoman Empire, the Arabs were granted self-determination in 99% of the carved-up land (today's Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia and Jordan). The Jews want less than 1% and they share it with one-fifth Arabs who have equal rights under the law with Jews. That seems pretty fair to me, but I guess you might want no Jews at all in the Middle East?
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@heatherlinnette189 : Is the so-called 'Palestinian' claim greater than the Jewish people who have had a "continuous connection" to the land for over 3500 years? Do the 'Palestinians' have a unique language, kings, coins, artefacts, burial places of their ancestors, and traditions which centre on Jerusalem by any chance? Being "indigenous" is not about DNA. I suggest you read an article by an indigenous person, Ryan Bellerose, in Tablet Magazine called "Are Jews Indigenous to the Land of Israel?".
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@heatherlinnette189 : The key to being #indigenous is having had a "continuous connection" to the land through your unique traditions, language, culture, etc. even while in exile or displaced. The Jewish people are an ethnic group. Religion has nothing, or very little, to do with a group of people being indigenous. Here's the World Bank definition: "Indigenous Peoples are distinct social and cultural groups that share collective ancestral ties to the lands and natural resources where they live, occupy or from which they have been displaced." Israel is a sovereign state and all sovereign states can have whatever citizenship laws they choose.
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@heatherlinnette189 : It is possible that Arabs, especially Arab Christians, also have a claim to be #indigenous to the Holy Land. But does their claim predate the claim of the Jewish people? Maybe the Arab Christians could apply to the government of Israel for citizenship on the basis of also being indigenous because Jesus was a Jew and all Christians thus have a direct connection to the Holy Land?
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@hasinarian6711 : The League of Nations was the precursor to today's United Nations. It was founded after World War One. It was "the first worldwide intergovernmental organisation whose principal mission was to maintain world peace". They convened at San Remo in 1920 and passed a unanimous vote to acknowledge that the Jewish people were #indigenous to the Holy Land. The Jews were granted the right to reconstitute their ancestral homeland, so long as they gave equal rights to all current occupants. One-fifth of Israeli citizens TODAY are Arabs and other minorities who have equal rights and freedom of religion. Their families accepted life in the Jewish state of Israel in 1948.
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@Mooseflows : DNA is not a criteria for being #indigenous to a particular place. It's the "continuous connection" to the land that counts, even while in exile or displaced.
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@Mooseflows : DNA is not a criteria for being #indigenous to a particular place. It's the "continuous connection" to the land that counts, even while in exile or displaced.
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@rose-maries7131 : That might be interesting to some people, but I don't find it worth investigating because DNA is not a criteria for being #indigenous to a particular place. It's the "continuous connection" to the land that counts, even while in exile or displaced. DNA is a genetic identity, whereas being indigenous is about a person's cultural and political identity.
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@rose-maries7131 : I'm not "avoiding the question". I don't care about it. I don't even know for sure that you can't get a genetic test done in Israel like anywhere else in the world, because in Tel Aviv there is a DNA Worldwide clinic and their website says you can get results within 3-5 days. I can't see any requirement to "go to court to get approval". Besides that, all governments have the right to make their own laws regarding citizenship, DNA testing, genetic screening, etc. and I'm not too bothered by anything in this respect. As for Jews and Christians "living mainly in harmony" with Muslims under the 500 year Ottoman Empire, you must know that the Jews and Christians lived as "dhimmis". They had fewer rights under the law than Muslims. They were totally dependent on Muslims for their security, and they were always treated as second or third-class status. The Qur'an states that dhimmis are to be "humbled, brought low, subjugated". When the Islamic forces invaded and conquered the Middle East in the 7th century, they followed Sharia law and accorded Jews this subjugated status. So there was only 'harmony' if the Jews behaved, ie. they accepted their low status and didn't resist.
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@rose-maries7131 : I'm not "avoiding the question". I don't care about it, and I already made that clear. I don't even know for sure that you can't get a genetic test done in Israel like anywhere else in the world, because in Tel Aviv there is a DNA Worldwide clinic and their website says you can get results within 3-5 days. I can't see any requirement to "go to court to get approval"🙄. Besides that, all governments have the right to make their own laws regarding citizenship, DNA testing, genetic screening, etc. and I'm not bothered by anything in this respect. As for Jews and Christians "living mainly in harmony" with Muslims, under the 500 year Ottoman Empire rule Jews and Christians lived as "dhimmis" and had fewer rights under the law than Muslims. They were totally dependent on Muslims for their security, and they were always accorded second or third-class status. As Qur'an 9:29 states, dhimmis are to be "humbled, brought low, subjugated". When the Islamic forces invaded and conquered the Middle East in the 7th century, they followed Sharia and accorded Jews and Christians this subjugated status. So there was only 'harmony' if the Jews behaved, ie. if they accepted their lower status and didn't resist. Now the Jews are back in control in their ancestral homeland and they don't have to abide by any of that nonsense. It's great.
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@rose-maries7131 : DNA is genetics which don't factor in #indigenous rights. You might find this topic "fascinating" but I don't. Even if an Arab found out that they have Jewish DNA it doesn't mean they've had a "continuous connection" to the land for the past 3500 years.Thousands of Jews and Christians were coerced into converting to Islam after the Muslims invaded and conquered Israel in the late 7th century. The so-called 'Palestinians' are not Israel's citizens. They are under the control of the Palestinian Authority and Hamas, both of which support the killing of Jews. Israel has the right to self-defence, including the right to defend its 21% Arab citizens from Islamic terrorists.
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@rose-maries7131 : France also strictly prohibits the use of direct-to-consumer (DTC) DNA testing websites. Do you obsess about France too? Once the DNA information is available in the public arena, you can't get it back. That's one reason why I haven't had a DNA test myself.
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@heatherlinnette189 : A "continuous connection" also applies to those indigenous people who have been 'displaced' for some reason or another. For example, Jews have a prayer which says "next year in Jerusalem" which is a pretty obvious connection to the land. They also have a unique language, culture and traditions which they kept practising wherever they were exiled to. Ethiopian and Indian Jews are good examples of this. Plus over 60% of Israeli Jews today are those who were expelled from their ancestral homes in Arab lands in the Middle East and North Africa where they kept up their faith, language and customs. Most people who live as minorities in another culture eventually get absorbed into that culture, but Jews are well-known to maintain their own traditions, possibly because they were often exiled and persecuted.
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@heatherlinnette189 : Since 1948, the Israeli government has had their own citizenship laws. Israel accepts new citizens on whatever basis they choose, as do ALL countries around the world.
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@heatherlinnette189 : The World Bank definition of #indigenous is as follows: "Indigenous Peoples are distinct social and cultural groups that share collective ancestral ties to the lands and natural resources where they live, occupy or from which they have been *displaced*." Jews were ethnically cleansed from many places but that doesn't mean they are no longer indigenous to the land of Israel. In 1920 The League of Nations voted to acknowledge the Jewish people as indigenous to the Holy Land. The vote passed "unanimously". This resolution was then ratified by the United Nations when it was founded in 1945, taking over from its precursor organisation The League of Nations.
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@heatherlinnette189 : The World Bank definition of #indigenous is as follows: "Indigenous Peoples are distinct social and cultural groups that share collective ancestral ties to the lands and natural resources where they live, occupy or from which they have been *displaced*." Jews were ethnically cleansed from many places but that doesn't mean they are no longer indigenous to the land of Israel. In 1920 the League of Nations voted to acknowledge the Jewish people as indigenous to the Holy Land. The vote passed "unanimously". This resolution was then ratified by the United Nations when it was founded in 1945, taking over from its precursor organisation The League of Nations. Note: sorry if this comment appears twice. I'm in Goa India and my wifi is not great!
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@heatherlinnette189 : I believe this so-called 'Palestinian' group of Arabs have #forfeited any right to a state. I don't even think they ever had grounds for a state of their own! In 1924 the British Mandate for Palestine, which was to be the reconstituted home of the Jewish people, was divided and 75% given to the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan (an Arab tribe from the Hijaz, today's Saudi Arabia). Jordan was for the Arabs. Jews were not given equal rights in Jordan, and most had to leave. That left the land "from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea" for the Jewish people. Then the British and the UN reneged on their promise to the Jewish people and once again carved up the land for Jews (who accepted) and the belligerent Arabs (who refused to accept the land they were offered). This group of Arabs has since been made many offers and they have refused all of them. They've also refused to accept Israel as a state, and they won't negotiate peace. The Arabs who were #displaced by the 1948 war, which began when the seven neighbouring Arab states attacked the new state of Israel and lost, should by now have been absorbed into those Arab countries. But the Arab League forbade giving them citizenship and they are being USED as pawns or weapons against the Jews. The HUMANE thing to do would be to give them a #choice to be resettled somewhere else in the world, preferably with their own people, ie. in Egypt, Jordan or Saudi Arabia because most of them have families there as they only migrated to Palestine after 1920, when the British and Jews created economic opportunities for these Arabs. Look at their last names and you can see where their families are from.
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@wordgun1903 : How can you occupy land that doesn't yet belong to anyone? It's "disputed" land. Repeating a lie often enough, or saying that billions of people believe it, doesn't mean it's true.
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@wordgun1903 : Sadly you don't always get what you want in life🙄. When the Ottoman Empire was defeated in 1918 it ceded its Middle East land to the British and French. The land was then carved up for self-determination by the occupants and 99% of it went to the Arabs!!! Israel is less than 1% of that land, and it is now home to the #indigenous Jewish people. One-fifth of Israeli citizens are from those Arab families living in Palestine in 1948 who accepted life in the Jewish state of Israel. They have equal rights with Jews and freedom of worship, as do Christians, Druze, Circassians, etc. The majority of Arabs refused to live in a Jewish state, or alongside a Jewish state. They sided with the attacking Arab armies who lost all of those wars against Israel. Today these Arab 'Palestinians' are still crying and playing the victim, and they violently resist whenever they can, but they've #forfeited any right they ever had to a state of their own.
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@wordgun1903 : Wherever there is "Muslim rule", Jews and Christians are second/third-class citizens, ie. 'dhimmis'. They are not equal to Muslims under the law, and they are humbled, humiliated, brought low. That's not "coexisting peacefully"!!! That's oppression. Today the #indigenous Jewish people are back in control in their own homeland. Land that was ruled for centuries by an Islamic Caliphate. You have to deal with that. The Jewish people are back to stay. Christians are leaving all Muslim-majority lands. In 1950, Bethlehem was 86% Christian. After the Palestinian Authority took over, the Christian population dropped to around 12%. But the Christian communities are growing in Israel where they have equal rights under the law and freedom of worship. The Ottoman Caliphate was DEFEATED by the British and French in 1918. Wars have consequences, and the Jewish people supported the British in the war so they were rewarded with the right to reconstitute their ancestral homeland. One-fifth of Israeli citizens are *Arabs who are mostly Muslim*. They have equality under the law with Jews and other minorities. Arab Muslims sit in the Knesset, on the Supreme Court, and even serve in the IDF and security services. They are thriving in the Jewish state of Israel. I recommend that you watch the 5min video called "Does Israel Occupy the West Bank?" by PragerU. You might learn something.
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@Whosthat_ Thousands of Jews were taken as slaves by the Romans to Europe. Jews were also persecuted and displaced, or threatened with death by Muslim invaders when they refused to convert to Islam. They went to Europe, North Africa, other countries in the Middle East, and to Ethiopia and India for economic survival. No matter where they are living in the world they are still #indigenous to Israel. It's the "continuous connection" to their ancestral homeland and their "unique culture" that counts. The Jewish people have a unique Hebrew language, ancient kings, coins, traditions centred on Jerusalem, and ancestral burial places in Hebron. The archaeological sites of the early Jewish people are very well-documented. That's the reality. Arabs are indigenous to Arabia, Kurds to Kurdistan, Maoris to New Zealand, etc. No matter where in the world they find themselves displaced today. The fact that "Arab lands" are so vast is because the Arabs were at one time the biggest imperialist forces of invasion and conquest the world has ever seen. Thankfully today we see Islam losing power everywhere, and the Jews are back in control in their ancestral land.
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It's a Jewish state, but one-fifth of Israeli citizens are Arabs, mostly Muslim, who have equal rights under the law. That's how democracies work.
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@Dimedivathekeeper1 : Israeli Arabs sit in the Knesset, on the Supreme Court, and they work in the highest levels of business, education, health, government and technology industry, plus some serve in the IDF. They have national and civil voting rights, and freedom of religion. Maybe you are talking about the Palestinians? Israel has little to do with the rights that the corrupt Palestinian Authority and terrorist Hamas give their own people. Or maybe you are talking about the East Jerusalem Arabs who have residence visas? They don't have national voting rights but they do have all the normal civil rights that people on long-term residence visas have in other countries, which includes equal access to education, health and employment, and full civil voting rights with a path to Israeli citizenship. They often don't take advantage of civil voting rights, however, because they believe it goes against Islam.
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@TheShinestroke : That's all nonsense. The Jewish people were granted the chance to reconstitute their ancestral homeland in return for Jewish support to Britain in World War One. The Allied Powers DEFEATED the Ottoman Empire in 1918, and in 1920 the League of Nations ratified the Balfour Agreement which gave the #indigenous Jews the right to their homeland, so long as all occupants were given #equal rights with Jews. Today one-fifth of Israel's citizens are Arabs and other minorities who have #equal right with Jews. These people are from families who accepted life in the Jewish state of Israel in 1948. The 'Palestinians' are a political construct from the 1960s, and there was nothing "generous" about the violent Arab revolt of 1936–39 and other uprisings against the Jews before 1947.
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@sharnachristina7504 : I'm not angry in the slightest. These kinds of comments are *delusional*. They don't help in the solve this conflict.
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@sharnachristina7504 : Not at all. I'm a strong supporter of "indigenous rights". I want all indigenous communities to at least have 'autonomy' within their country, if it's not pragmatic for them to have their own country. I'm disappointed that the Kurds and Assyrians didn't get their own country at the same time as the Jews, after the Ottoman Caliphate Middle East land was carved-up in 1920. Arabs got 99% of that land!!! And Turkey took all of Anatolia with no thought for the Kurds. In my countries, Australia and New Zealand, there is much happening to redress the wrongs of colonisation.
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@sharnachristina7504 : Not at all. I am strongly in favour of "indigenous rights". I think Israel is an "indigenous rights" success story. I want all indigenous communities to at least have 'autonomy' within their country, if it's not pragmatic for them to have their own country. I'm disappointed that the Kurds and Assyrians didn't get their own country at the same time as the Jews, after the Ottoman Empire's Middle East land was carved-up in 1920. Arabs got 99% of that land!!! And Turkey took all of Anatolia with no thought for the Kurds. In my countries, Australia and New Zealand, there is much happening these days to redress the wrongs of colonisation.
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