Comments by "andrew worth" (@andrewworth7574) on "Hindustan Times"
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@HANSMKAMP the US didn't force Yanukovych to run away, the Ukrainian people did that.
They revolted against their president, as did their parliament, after Yanukovych announced that he was going back on his promise to get Ukraine into the EU. An association agreement had been agreed, which Yanukovych, after a chat with Putin, refused to sign, instead announcing that Ukraine would instead join the Eurasian Economic Union, an economic alliance currently composed of 5 former Soviet states.
Here's the shocker, Ukrainians didn't throw their president out on behalf of the US, they threw him out on behalf of themselves.
The narrative you've bought into is straight from the Kremlin. The US didn't have any resources in Ukraine to remove a president, and Victoria Nuland doesn't have super-villain mind control powers that enable her to control hundreds of thousands of people, causing them to revolt against their elected president. It was Yanukovych's own actions that led to his downfall.
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@HANSMKAMP of course you don't believe it, you've been fed a carefully constructed narrative through anti western outlets, supported by the same narrative on social media by Russian troll farms.
There are other falsehoods that are also fed in to support the narrative:
That Zelensky wasn't democratically elected - he was in 2019, beating incumbent president Petro Poreshenko.
That Ukraine killed 14,000 civilians in the Donbas - total civilian casualties 2014-21 was 4000, 1000 of those in 2014, 900 in 2015.
In the 3 years between Zelensky being elected and the February 2022 invasion by Russia the civilian death toll was about 75 on both sides, and the majority of those were from landmines and unexploded munitions mostly planted or fired in earlier years. In those 3 years the civilian death toll from active military operations was about 10 per year on both sides, the conflict was petering out, with static lines of control. Life was actually fairly on both sides in the Donbas.
There's a UN monitor report online with the details.
After Yanukovych fled there was an armed revolt in the Donbas supported by Moscow that attacked police stations and other government people and facilities that didn't support the revolt, so it was the separatists that initiated the violence, it was after that that the violence really kicked off with efforts by the Ukraine government to suppress the revolt.
Russia supported the revolt and war against Ukraine from the outset - (Putin actually acknowledged that in one interview).
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@lukebandolino882 there are good grounds to believe that there were war crimes committed by both sides in the Donbas in 2014, arguably Ukrainian forces were responsible for much of the worst of it. However, the civilian deaths quickly tailed off after 2014, from about 2,000 in that year to 900 in 2015, that decline in civilian casualties continued so that in 2021 it was down to around two dozen civilians killed on both sides, with the majority of those deaths being front landmines and explosive remnants of war expended in the earlier years of the conflict. Total civilian deaths 2014-2021 was about 3,500.
With it's February 2022 invasion, Russia, which used it's reliance on concentrated artillery fire, increased the rate of civilian deaths in the Donbas from that two dozen a year to over ten thousand in a year.
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@lilidezman624 re hate crimes. There's a site nationmaster that tries to compare countries, Ukraine ranks better than most, far better than the US, Russia, UK and most other countries, the data I found is from 2014, and should not be taken as totally reliable, but as an indication.
Ukraine has a national identity, it's origins are irrelevant.
Ukraine parliament has elected representatives elected using a proportional voting system, the policies of those representatives gives a good indication of how nazi the population is. There isn't any evidence that nazism is a problem. When Russia invaded 60,000 foreign students, most of them from the Indian subcontinent and Africa fled the country - fled from the Russian invasion, not from Ukrainians.
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@tokyo.peking Bucha, execution of civilians on road, execution of prisoner, beheading of prisoners, abduction of children, bombing of multiple civilian facilities, torture of prisoners. Video evidence of killing of prisoners, injuries and evidence of torture, evidence of murder of civilians in Bucha, Putin charged with child abduction.
I'm not a court so, no, I'm giving an opinion, not a conviction. Amnesty also claims Russia is responsible for many of these alleged war crimes.
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The Euromaidan started in November 2013, it was a popular protest to President Viktor Yanukovych’s sudden decision not to sign the EU association agreement that had been worked out between the Ukraine Government and the EU. Yanukovych announced instead that he would seek closer ties with Russia. Ukraine’s parliament had overwhelmingly approved of implementing the agreement with the EU, Yanukovych changed his mind about the agreement after having a little chat with Putin.
Russia pushed a narrative that it was a US plot to orchestrate a coup against Yanukovych. This narrative does not stand up to critical thought.
Why would hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian’s revolt against their government because the US wanted them to? Isn’t it just a tad more likely that they were not zombies under the mind control powers of Victoria Nuland, but rather normal human beings acting in their own interests?
If Victoria Nuland has the power to influence hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians to revolt against their president in this way, why on earth hasn’t she been sent to Moscow??
Since the Euromaiden Revolution there have been two elections in Ukraine, in 2014, shortly after Yanukovych fled the country Petro Poroshenko was elected, in 2019 Zelinsky was successful when he stood against Poroshenko, comfortably defeating him. Poroshenko is currently actively working against the Russian aggression, both in encouraging Ukrainian’s and calling for more international support.
The figure of 14,000 dead is from the UN observers, that figure includes military and paramilitary on both sides and civilian deaths.
By year the civilian deaths are:
2014 2084
2015 955
2016 112
2017 117
2018 58
2019 27
2020 26
2021 25
So total civilian deaths on both sides is just over 3,400 up until the February 2022 Russian invasion.
It should be noted that the level of conflict reduced substantially after 2015 and again after Zelensky was elected in 2019.
The civilian deaths from active military operations in 2019 -2021 was less than half those total civilian deaths, most of the deaths being caused by explosive remnants of war and land mines expended and planted in the earlier years of the conflict.
Since the February Russian invasion Russia has killed over 10,000 civilians in the Donbas through their indiscriminate shelling, which utterly destroyed Mariupol.
Boyd W, your claim the Nato has pushed Ukraine towards Nato membership is nonsense, in fact Nato has done the exact opposite. It has not invited Ukraine to join and has made it clear to Ukraine that under the situation that existed between 2014 and 2022 Ukraine COULD NOT JOIN NATO.
Your claim that Nato has pushed for Ukraine to host Nukes is beyond ridiculous. There are no nukes in any of the countries that joined Nato after 1990 and the only Nato nukes based in Europe are in 6 bases that hosted them prior to 1990, all of those bases are over 2000km from Moscow and the only nukes that are there are B61 free fall bombs to be carried by the aircraft of the host nations.
The Crimea "referendum" happened after Russia gained control of Crimea and has been ruled illegal by the UN and is not considered to have been honest, there were no international observers permitted and there were irregularities.
"Russian intel discovered Ukraine was about to launch a major offensive to attempt to steamroll the Ukrainian breakaway regions & Crimea."
That claim is complete nonsense the only party that claims there was such an offensive planned is Russia, while Russia lied about it's own planned offensive right up until it was launch.
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@nlorand9033 "killed civilians since 2014"
The civilian death toll in the Donbas since 2014 is around 3,500 on both sides. The intensity of that conflict has dropped substantially since the first year; In 2014 it was about 2000, in 2015 about 900, in the last three years it's been around 20/year, with half of those deaths being caused by from mines and explosive residue of war planted or expended in the earlier years.
"Ukrainian democracy is silencing jailing and killing critics"
In the 2014 Ukraine elections Petro Porashenko was the winner, in the 2019 election Zelinsky defeated Poroshenko. Poroshenko is very much alive and working to support the Ukrainian efforts to evict the Russians from Ukraine. If killing critics is a concern of yours - and it should be - you should check out the situation in Russia where critics are routinely imprisoned and killed.
"Ukraine government Kill list"
You're referring to the Myrotvorets web site run privately by former Ukraine politician George Tuka. It is not a "kill list", though it's described as such by Russian propagandists, on the site it's described as a list of people: "whose actions have signs of crimes against the national security of Ukraine, peace, human security, and the international law".
If it were a "kill list" one would expect at least one person on the list to have been murdered as it's been up for 8 years.
"Negotiations . . . for peace"
The time for negotiations is when Russia ends it's imperialist invasion of its neighbor and takes its army home. At this stage negotiating with Putin would be as pointless as negotiating with Hitler in August 1944.
You go on to mention US military actions/invasions of other countries in the past while defending the Russian invasion. This is a logical inconsistency I've pointed out numerous times on this site: If you condemn US military invasions because of the many thousands of deaths they cause, morally you should also be condemning the Russian invasion which has also caused many tens of thousands of deaths. Compare the tens of thousands killed in Ukraine in the last year to the approximately 10 deaths a year (UN observers mission reports) on both sides in the Donbas in recent years from shelling.
How can anyone justify the Russian aggression when it's taken so many lives?
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