Comments by "" (@thehumanity0) on "FULL DEBATE: Jimmy Dore u0026 Sam Seder on 2016 Presidential Election" video.

+HelloThere - Probably because Jimmy didn't even understand basic principles about the Senate and how the Republicans would just hit "the nuclear option" once they had a Republican president so they could get Gorsuch in. I'm not a Seder fan, but It's scary how accurate Sam was about the entire thing honestly. Jimmy just wanted to rant about Hillary's corruption the whole time when Sam was trying to engage him in a deeper political theory about what would realistically happen. Jimmy's more fit to debate with Joe Rogan who also has nearly no understanding of how politics works. At least he was 2 years ago when this debate happened, but I always feel like Jimmy never really knows wtf he's talking about. This finally reinforces those feelings though.
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+HelloThere - As I said before, I'm not a fan of Sam Seder. I understand the problem with both Sam and Jimmy and they both basically have the same problem just in opposite directions. Sam seems to want to only back Democrats based on logic and the 'lesser evil' argument, which is a real argument that even Noam Chomsky is in agreement with, but he goes too far in that direction in my opinion, to the point where you do need some accountability for these people especially corporate Democrats who most deserve to lose if they cannot back policy that the majority of people want. However, Jimmy goes too far in the opposite direction (which was not always the case) and basically swears off the entire Democratic Party without even looking at the individual and any one politician that even slightly conforms with Washington or 'plays the game' of politics. If a politician does something he personally does not like slightly, he starts smearing them on his platform even if they're actual progressives and have all the right policies and all the right goals such as Ocasio-Cortez. Sam and Jimmy also both voter shame, which is something I highly disagree with, and again, they do it in the opposite directions. Sam does it to tell people to not vote for the 3rd party because 'they will lose anyways', but then Jimmy does it in the opposite direction and tells people to DemExit and not vote Democrat because 'they will never change' (even if they're progressive Democrats). At least Sam's voter shaming has logic attached to it, because he is mostly right from a rational standpoint, but it still lacks any sort of empathy for what the voter wants. Jimmy's voter shaming is just straight wrong though and it seems to be in line with his own personal vendetta against the Democratic Party and Bernie Sanders than it is with any sort of logic besides "Some Democrats are fake progressives and wolves in sheeps clothing". This is not an excuse and a giant false equivalency if you base all Justice Democrats and Our Revolution candidates off of one of them out of 150 total that ended up switching their policies after the primary or seemed to just be pretending to be progressive. They're both wrong and their voter shaming is both equally bad especially Jimmy's. Even though I do not particularly like either of these political commentators I can at least tolerate Sam because he mostly tries to make logical sense. Jimmy, on the other hand, is just leading his viewers down a dead end road that doesn't actually lead anywhere and is not productive in any way. The logical conclusion of ONLY voting 3rd party, starting a 'new party', and completely abandoning any progressives that run within the Democratic Party would just lead to corporate Democrats continuing to have full complete control of the Dem Party and it would just split the leftist vote and lead to Republicans having a majority vote in the country. His "solution" is a bad one that even Kyle Kulinski and all other progressive media understands would not work, which is why Jimmy Dore is the only person that backs it.
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@TrollWithN3oN Bernie shouldn't be grouped in with Warren and Cortez. Bernie may not always have the right attitude for a fight or choose the most effective way to win battles, but he's shown to be unquestionably devoted to improving the lives of the working class. Cortez, on the other hand, gets lost in the culture war constantly that she can't see the forest for the trees anymore and Warren is just a total charlatan. That's not to say that Bernie deserves our support or loyalty when he can't seem to choose a winning strategy, but I think it's a real stretch to think that he's not honest with his convictions. Ron Paul never seemed to win or have the right strategy either, but no one doubts he cared about the issues he championed and conversely Bernie was exponentially closer to winning the presidency than Paul ever was along with some of the key issues Bernie actually won on such as his work with unions and his 'Fight for 15' victories.
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@shinybeast8946 Funny considering those 3-year-old posts have me criticizing both Sam and Jimmy pretty equally on issues like voter shaming or how both of their stances on the Democratic Party can be viewed as problematic, but this is the type of smooth brain reactionary shit I've grown to expect from Jimmy Dore fanatics. Oh and also ya'll are completely obsessed with the Young Turks for some weird fetishistic reason
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@shinybeast8946 It's not hard to figure out by just watching the debate. Jimmy was objectively wrong about nearly every single thing he said across the board. This debate is famous nowadays for exhibiting just how little Jimmy knew/knows about actual politics or his inability to foresee consequences from political action that he frequently supports. We're currently seeing the outcome of 3 Trump Supreme Court appointments during Trump's time in office and how that chain of events is now on the verge of overturning a court ruling that is 50 years old and essentially deep rooted & grandfathered into our culture and society. One of Jimmy's main arguments in the debate was that Trump would not have much material effect, especially on the courts, which we now know is just objectively false - he basically ushered in a new Lochner era, which will stifle progress for literal decades to come. I don't entirely agree with Sam on these issues, but it's undeniable now that Jimmy was completely talking out of his ass for a lot of this. He even said that he thought Elizabeth Warren would be a good choice for president in 2020, which is just another example of how badly this debate has aged for him.
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@shinybeast8946 Yeah agreed
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