Comments by "Jack Voss" (@jackvoss5841) on "MyLifeOutdoors"
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In the Great Lakes areas, it’s different than when I camped in the Sierras. A “relatively high” spot of ground is important. An inch or two of elevation can help prevent sleeping inside an invasive water bed. EVEN ground can be both important to good sleep, and a detriment to good sleep. I often scoop out a 1” deep hip hole. It can make up for an air mattress that isn’t quite thick enough.
The next step, after scooping out a hip hole, is to scrape away all debris from the area that will be under the tent, and in the entry way./s. That is both to protect my tent, and my sleep.
I do not waste my time, money, or energy carrying a footprint for under the tent. They only prolong the inevitable leaky tent floor. Already knowing that my tent floor cannot be depended to be water proof, I work to protect myself. I make and use a visqueen plastic “bathtub” for inside the tent. Hardwares sell large sheets of visqueen. Cut a piece that is about 6”-8” longer AND wider than your tent floor. Fold up the edges and miter the corners. Secure each folded corner with duct tape. This bathtub goes into the tent first. Several campsites and rainstorms have conspired to let me see water puddled - or flowing - in my tent, but UNDER the bathtub. I, and my gear, were dry.
If you have to pitch on sloping ground, pitch to sleep ALONG the topographical line, not ACROSS it. Then stuff clothing and gear along under the downhill side of your sleeping bag.
Courtesy of Half Vast Flying
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@nedanother9382 G’day, Neda. I understand your confusion. Here’s my train of thought.
All tent floors will leak or seep water; if not today, just wait. Most of them not when new, but will with use. A bit longer if a good footprint is used. I have had brand new tents that weeped or seeped in nonrainy weather, so that water droplets covered the floor.
Tent floors will leak or seep right through the fabric. Or water can enter through seams or sidewall fabric when standing or flowing water is around the tent.
I scrape away debris from the tent site before laying out the tent. This helps to protect both the tent and my air mattress. Lotsa junk in campgrounds.
Lastly, I’m more concerned about protecting the camper (me) than the tent. The plastic bathtub has served to do that several times. When, not if, a tent didn’t meet expectations, the bathtub does.
I strongly concur about the Sierras.. I was up around Route 49, Foresthill, Lady Canyon, and Ruck-A-Chucky Rapids. My best to you.
Courtesy of Half Vast Flying
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I like your analytical thinking process. Here’s a suggestion that was recommended to me by Cliff Jacobson. In my experience, he is correct.
All tent floors either already leak, or will. A footprint - no matter how much overpriced they are - can prolong the leak starting. But seldom prevent the final onset of seepage and leakage. The emphasis here, should be to PROTECT THE CAMPER, NOT THE TENT.
A cheaper, more effective approach is to get a piece of visqueen plastic drop cloth. Measure the tent floor, and cut a piece of visqueen that is 4” longer, and 4” wider than the tent floor. Fold up a 2” high edge on each side and end; miter each corner; and secure the folded corners with duct tape. You now have a waterproof bathtub to use inside the tent. In several camps, I have had rain seep, soak, or leak in. It ran between the plastic and the floor. I and my gear remained dry every time. When the plastic does get a pinhole, duct tape on both sides is a temporary patch. A new piece of plastic starts you out all over again.
Courtesy of Half Vast Flying
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My experience with ponchos was disappointing. They drip onto pant legs from the knees down to the toes. Then, as I walked, it wicked upwards, reaching my belt loops. In the meantime, if there’s any wind, it flapped around - once in a while becoming a sail. I gave it away to a guy whom I didn’t particularly care for.
Goretex jacket and pants was my next try. When new, they kept out the rain, AND kept in in the sweat. As they age, water from the outside started to join sweat on the inside. Upshot: Goretex - and likely other “breathable” treatments - don’t work. As proof of that, when the rain starts to come inside, the professional advice is to “treat the fabric to restore water repellency”. HELLO! That is the job of the manufacturer - NOT the purchaser.
Here is the sum of over 50 years of experience on various rivers and trails in rainy weather:
rain gear will not keep you dry. It can help to keep you warm.
So, for half the price - or less - I now have plastic rain gear. I do not back pack any more. At 85, I camp with a canoe or a motorcycle. So, I also carry a rainfly, under which, a candle lantern can dry me out.
Other people will have reached different conclusions. We will all get wet together when it rains.
Courtesy of Half Vast Flying
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Your analyses translate well into my costs for canoeing and camping. A problem is: “the gear we left behind us”. Previous tents, footwear, sleeping bags, sleeping pads, jackets, etc etc. sigh
In some gear categories, I’ve done “not bad”. (NOTE: not really sterling either. But, not bad). In other gear categories, I have a fairly well populated trail of “previously best gear”.
A trend that I can see only by looking back, is that my gear is working its way back toward the fewer, simpler things that I started out with 60 years ago. The fewer part, doesn’t offset the more expensive part. But, it’s at least a step in the right direction. another sigh
Thanks for looking at this in a “cost per trip per year” format. Also, thanks for including the costs for only the gear currently being used, If we include costs for ALL of the gear we have. . . . . WELLLLL, we really don’t wanna do that, do we. 😌
Courtesy of Half Vast Flying
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