Comments by "Tiago D\x27Agostini" (@tiagodagostini) on "Don’t Do E2E Testing!" video.

@lukasdolezal8245 There are several fields that would call insanity to not do any end to end test. Would you deploy a telephony system without doing a single real call before delivery? It is not only deemed stupid, regulatory agencies demand register and proofs of a large set of REAL conditions tests . You may test every single part of your system and each signal degardation step may be within parameters but when you put everythign together the interaction along those degradations creates an unusable result. So it is common practive to automatically generate a large number of calls on a large number of routing situations and compare the entropy between the signals in the input and in the output.
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@Ash31415 Sincirely I think that is the problem with some of his videos. The title of a book gives the whole tone of the reading experience.
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This, your answers puts it much better . There are things you NEED E2E tests, so do it for those. Just try to use smaller scale for things that can be caught on that scale. A simple example is system performance, e2E testign is the only one that will give you a REALISTIC measure of the performance on a system that is asynchronous, parallel and with several dozen stages.
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Yet that is not enough. For a client the product is the interaction of the code with the environment. So systems that operate in complex scenarios that cannot be isolated (telecom for example) are usually in need of E2E testing in live scenario to evaluate extraneous factors.
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@johnjackson6262 It is still the ONLY form to ensure performance. And perfromance is part of quality! It is not a good test to get operation failures but it is the best test to evaluate how yoru changes impact load, latency, tasks paralelism etc...
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@-Jason-L Should, but you cannot! If you are making a website that sells tshirts you can risk it, but if you are making systems where a single minute of downtime can cost millions or worse, LIVES, then you CANNOT TRUST ANYONE word.
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As I heard a wise dude say once, the only contract you can trust to never change is math, for the rest is all about your naivety.
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@johnjackson6262 It is not the answer, but NOTHING is the answer anywhere in software development. Everything are tools and tools are to be used when they are deemed the correct tool for that specific moment. The simplest example is ensuring the performance of the system is still within acceptable parameters. You can only be sure about the performance in an asynchronous parallel system when you run the system in a complete state.
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@johnjackson6262 My point, to be more clear, is by your statement , I consider you a CRAP software engineer. Is it more clear now?
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That is specially true because in a legacy system you not always knwo what is expected at each point or component output, but you know with a larger degree of certainty what is expected at the end of a LARGER group of components or system.
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Specially because in several fields the clients DEMAND proof of end to end testing. When someone says do not do what your clients DEMAND, there is something wrong.
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@grrr_lef well if I have no time limit and the pay is really good I might try it :P Also more on the subject.. you cannot tell your clients to get lost. That is not how successfull companies work, besides what holywood might think .
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