Comments by "Nattygsbord" (@nattygsbord) on "Military History not Visualized"
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Sweden and Russia was also large iron producers and made more than 90% of all iron in Europe in the 1700s. 80% of all export revenues for Sweden came from iron around the 1790s, so when England invented new ways of massproducing cheap steel with the industrial revolution Sweden took a heavy economic blow.
Before railroads and the industrial revolution, you made iron near the iron mines due to the high transportation costs. And coal also had to come from a local source because of the high transportation costs. The Swedish government made laws that forbade farmers from cutting down trees, so that there would be no shortage of wood to make coal. And with low prices of wood, you could have low prices of coal, which in turn could make Swedish iron and steel cheap and competative on the world markets.
But England invented new ways of using coal dug up from the ground instead to make their iron, and the good waterways and railroads made it possible to transport their iron and coal at low costs long distances... and that in turn made it possible for England to begin large scale steel production in huge industrial facilities.
Sweden didn't have that luxury. It rivers were frozen by ice half the year, and sawmills could not be used since they used water to power them - and the water was frozen. And Sweden was a poor country with a small population so it was not profitable for private entreprenours to build any railroads. So transportation had to be done by horses or by foot - which was expensive - and that prevented the transportation of large amounts of iron and coal needed to build the same large steel making plants like in England.
So even if Sweden, Finland and Russia were all covered by trees and had plenty of iron, those resources were useless until someone invented an idea on how to transport all those resources out to the coast at cheap cost, so that they could be loaded onto ships and sold to other countries.
Sweden had 4x times more forrest land than Norway in the early 1800s, but
Norway exported 4 times more timber than Sweden back then because they didn't have any frozen seas like Sweden.
And Finland had almost as much forrest as Sweden, but it could not export any timber at all because all of its forrests were sitting too far away from the coast.
So Sweden only became a rich country in 1870s, when the Swedish government decided to build the railroads. And that brought down the transportation costs so it became profitable to start exporting timber, and coal and iron could now be transported to huge steelworks, so huge amounts of steel could be mass produced at a low cost.
And when the sawmills began using steam engines instead of waterwheels, then frozen rivers would no longer halt production during the winter months.
So Sweden could now massproduce timber on a scale never seen before.
And the newly invented Martin-process made it for the first time possible to use iron ore containing phosphorus - so that the huge iron mine in Kiruna could be opened and start producing all the high quality iron that Hitler and others wanted for their tanks and guns.
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I don't think that robots will come as far as to replace humans the coming decades, but I guess that the infantry will rely more and more on sensors, drones and such. But I still also think that old weapons will continue to be useful in some areas of the frontline / or against low tech enemies.
And I also think that IT-security is a pretty safe bet, if I would buy stocks in area of the economy which I think will grow in the future. If you fail on cyber security, then your best weapons can be copied by the enemy, all your battleplans could be stolen, and your electronic weapons can stop functioning. Furthermore can the banking system stop working, the electric grid can be knocked out, and the transportation and healtcare sector will be hard hit as well.
So the importance of better IT-security cannot be understated in a world which is starting to doing everything digital nowadays.. everything from self-driving cars to shopping at the grocery store, and not to mention all the internet shopping.
On a more general level, I think that the ideal would be to let the country become self-suffiecent in food, energy and do some manufacturing before going to war. And then I think that information and co-ordination among infantry, attack helicopters, tanks, artillery, recon and other types of troops will become increasingly more important. And the individual solidier will get more and more firepower in his hands.
Some say that teams of snipers is the future, while the historical trend the last 200 years have rather been the opposite; and more about putting up as much lead in the air as possible to win battles. And ammunition consumtion and the cost of killing an enemy solidier have risen.
And I would say that I am impressed by weapons like TOS-1 Buratino, and I think they could be very handy in a world war when keeping losses low is having a low priority compared to victory. But the old conventional wars seems rare nowadays so there might be better ways of dealing with junk armies of the middle east than having a rocket artillery piece capable of flattening an entire town.
Drones is the western solution since it can deliever firepower without any risk to the lives of our own solidiers. But there is of course a risk that they can be hacked, and used against us. And having the police using them to fight terrorism, could lead to a slippery slope where they then are used to fight violant crime, and then minor crimes... and the police force becomes less interested in negotating and de-escalating situations and become trigger happy instead. And then will personal integrity be totally destroyed by drones, mass surveillance and data gathering. And we can get a 1984 society, like China today with their internet scorepoint system.
And this time around there would be no succesful escape attempts from the Gulags, since now there would be drones with heat seeking cameras to seak up fleeing prisoners. And there would be nowhere to escape, since every train ticket and purchase of food will be done electronically and could be traced. And passports contains biometric data and RFID-tags so that the government can track you with a radar.
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Logistics is about transporting fuel, ammunition, food, medicines, spareparts for vehicles, cigarettes, winter clothes and other things to the troops sitting in the frontline so they can keep on fighting.
If your troops cannot get those things then their ability to fight will fall.
Lack of food can make your troops starve to death or easily fall victim to diseases when they are undernourished.
Lack of winter clothes can lead to solidiers freezing to death or men having to amputate frozen legs. Lack of spareparts will make tanks useless if they cannot move when there are no tracks or parts to fix their engines, or when their gun is not working. Lack of medicines can increase mortality rates and human suffering. Lack of ammunition can turn even the most powerful tank and the best machine gun into useless pieces of junk. And the lack of fuel will make tanks into useless bunkers, and without fuel to your supply trucks you cannot transport food and ammunition and other things so that your combat effiecency will fall.
So as you see are logistics important things that needs to work if you are going to lead millions of men into war.
Even the best solidier or tank are useless without food, ammunition and fuel.
And if you can cut off your enemies ability to provide those things to his troops, then victory can become relativly easy and not so costly in human lives. This is why encirclements can be so catastrophic for armies. When all supplies are cut off, then hunger and ammunition shortages fastly appears. Because modern amries needs gigantic amounts of supplies. An American Division in World War II needed 800 tonnes of supplies per day. And a German division on average used 400 tonnes.
So if you have an American army of 20 Divisions then you would need 8000 tonnes of supplies per day. Think about the gigantic amounts of supplies that is.
When the German 6th Army was fighting at Stalingrad it needed 13 railway wagons of ammunition per day for all for machine guns, pistols, rifles and other sall arms. And on top of that you needed to also give that army food and fuel and other supplies - including ammunition for mortars, howitzers and cannons of all kinds of sizes.
Modern war needs gigantic amounts of planning and coordination to get all things at the right place, at the right amunt and at the right time.
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@RussianThunderrr "King Tiger is not a very good tank"
It was an excellent tank but it was too damn costly to build. You didn't as much bang for the buck. StuGIII gave much more value for your money, since it was a cheap machine that also did a lot of useful things on the battlefield unlike the King Tiger that was rarely ever seen on the battlefield thanks to its many mechanical failures.
"As for Stug... Well heve you heard of VK 30.02(DB)?"
Yes I have heard of it. But as I sees it, I would rather keep the Stugs and Ignore the VK project.
Germany needed to shut down production lines instead of open new, and thus create an even larger logistics burden. If they did that, then it would be easier to start building tanks in large numbers. Tanks without a turret are cheaper to build, they are less complex, they take less manhours to build, and when you save weight by not having a turret you can build a tank with more armour and a bigger gun instead.
So I rather pick StuG than VK, because you more easily can make StuGs in large numbers. And numbers is Germany's biggest problem at the moment.
StuG also got a reliable good chassi with excellent traverse speed, and it got optics superior to any German tank (except the panther). And you don't have to deal with costs related to opening a new production line and research, and kinderkrankheit problems that leaves German troops without tank support.
The VK is after all at best just an average tank with a good gun, and the allies can easily outproduce VK30D with their T-34/85, Comets and M4E8s. And when the allies come with their T-44, Centurions and Pershings then the VK will start becoming obsolete and the Germans needs to invent another tank to replace it with and have to start building Panther tanks anyways.
So I think it is better than to the chassis of old production lines and make them into StuGs or Jagdpanzer IV with the same powerful 75mm/L70 as the Panther tank - which is capable of knocking out any allied tank at very long distances.
And should the allies come with tanks too hard to kill even for the high-velocity panther gun, then the Germans could just start using Nashorn tank destroyers as a stop gap measure until they have found a good replacement for the old PanzerIV tank. The nashorn gun was capable of turning any big allied tank into a burning wreck from 3000 meters away, and it was also a cheap vehicle to make.
And when the German panzerIII and PanzerIV tanks and TDs would become outdated, then their chassis could simply just be converted into artillery pieces, Whirbelwinds, flammpanzers, and so on.
And then the war would hopefully have ended. The allies would probably have won even if Germany had played the cards on their hand in a better way. But it is also maybe possible that the D-day landing could have failed and that the Russians would run out of manpower and the war goes into a stalemate and peace would be signed on much more fabourable terms for the Germans than just unconditional surrender.
Maybe they for example could have kept East Prussia, Austria, Bohemia and German speaking areas in France and Denmark.. while giving up everything else they had conquered.
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@RussianThunderrr "There are few of different factors affected Tiger II reliability"
You know, all tanks got their flaws. I know that Russians never admits tis to be true about their own tanks, but it is true.
TigerII had its flaws like any other tank does. But fact remains that Tiger II was one of the most powerful tanks in world war 2 in terms of firepower and armour, and a 100.000 Tiger II tanks could have had a significant impact on the war.
"But going by just a battle performance, a lots of times"
But the point still remains that most tanks were not able of penetrating its frontal armour and the Tiger II could kill other tanks on longer ranges than vice versa.
"King Tiger performance was operation "Spring Awakening" the force of 600 tanks 45 of which was King Tigers, and no less then 200 Panther tanks attack bridgehead at Lake Balaton in Hungary"
Even the best tanks are shit when your leadership decides to attack with them in unsuitable terrain. Just as the offensives in Ardennes say very little about German tanks, does the battle of Caen, Market Garden, Seelow say little about allied tanks. With your way of reasoning one can then just as well say that IS2 was a terrible tank because it failed to take Romania in early 1944 despite crushing numerical superiority. https://youtu.be/7Clz27nghIg?t=2791
Furthermore was most Tiger II tanks lost to fuel shortages and the inability to recover damaged tanks before the allies took control over an area - which once again are things that should be blamed on the German army and not the tank itself.
Had Germany still had control over the skies and provided their Tiger II tanks with good and infantry artillery support they would have done pretty well.
"VK30(DB) would have the same turret as Panther"
If you just want a new tank with panther turret then why build an entirely new tank as well? Why not just build a panzer IV with angeled armour and give it the L70 panther gun?
Then you don't have to create a logistical burden of having yet another tank model in the German army. Instead you could gain from synergies like commonality among parts, when you use the same wheels, engines and chassis for all panzer IV variant - hummel, whirbelwind, nashorn, jpz4, pz4, pz4 ausf. k and so on.
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This pocket was just stupid to keep.
80% of the Soviet army was positioned in front of army group middle, so a capture of Moscow would simply be totally unrealistic. The campaign in the south to capture Stalingrad could only go as far as it did because the Germans faced very little resistance when the Russians had concentrated all their forces in the centre instead, and thus leaving the south nearly unprotected.
And the catastrophic battle of Kharkov in may 1942 led to the total destruction of the entire red army in Southern Russia - so for an entire month was the road towards Stalingrad completly undefended and open for the Germans. But the Germans could of course not know how great their victory was so they could not capitalize fully from their victory at Kharkov.
But even if Germany made much progress and nearly captured Stalingrad, I do consider it to have been totally unrealistic to think that Germany would have been strong enough to launch an offensive against Moscow in 1943.
There was simply too many Russian divisions there. And too many trenches, barricades, minefields, tank ditches and obstacles had been put in place since the Germans tried to capture the city in 1941 for Moscow to ever become a realistic target.
The German army had been severly weakened by all losses in 1941. And in 1942 it gambled to capture Stalingrad and southern Russia with the strong divisions that it had left. So after two bloody campaigns launching a big one against a strong well prepared, well dug in enemy and capture Moscow would simply be unrealistic. The Germans could not even capture Kursk, and it had to deal with several big counter-offensives in the end of the battle (like the one at Orjol).
So the best thing Germany could have done would be to empty the pocket as soon as possible and create a flat defensive line, dug in and create minefields and barbed wire so that big areas of land could be defended by small numbers of troops. And then Germany could send away some men in army group middle to fight in the south to help with the capture of Stalingrad.
And once Stalingrad and caucausus was in German hands, then Germany would just make a defensive war against Russia.
And hope that superior German firepower could compensate for the lack of manpower.
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When Russia gets even more powerful and have even more monopoly over the energy will it use it for even more energy blackmail and jack up prices even more so Russia can make itself richer on your expense. Russia will get richer while you get poorer.
But if Ukraine wins, and a marshall plan kickstart the Ukrainian economy, then the opposite will happen. Competition between Ukrainian and Russian gas, coal and gas will mean lower prices for you the consumer, so that you get more money over to buy other stuff and improve your own quality of life. And as people can afford to buy more tables, microwaves and movie tickets will also new jobs be created in western countries and unemployment will go down and GDP will go up along with tax revenues for governments.
This will be a win-win for everyone. Life will be better for us, and it will be better for Ukrainians as money is flowing into their country by foreigners buying their natural gas. And the only losers will be Russia which will be forced to sell their energy at a lower price and make less money from it.
Being economically dependent on the small democratic country Ukraine is also a safer option than being dependent on a large warmongering gangster state like Russia. Ukraine lay close to Europe, which means lower transportation costs for all the food, nuclear power, coal, iron, natural gas and other things it has to offer Europe.
And with cheaper raw materials for European industry is it possible to lower production costs for European products, so that the EU could get it easier to compete with Asia on world markets.
While the opposite of course will be true if we let Russian terrorists win.
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