Comments by "Barry On" (@barryon8706) on "Chauvin Trial | Felony Murder Rule | The Key Question of the Trial." video.

@abrahamplepcher8985 Thank you, Abraham You've been very polite in the whole thing.
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OK, here's one for you on a different approach to mens rea. Chauvin may have been concerned that Floyd was in the throes of excited delirium and could have hurt himself, and had his knee on Floyd in the idea that it might prevent injury rather than comliance. If so, would that still constitute assault? As an aside, from what I can tell of Minneapolis's good samaritan statutes (604A.01 GOOD SAMARITAN LAW), they would not give him immunity from civil or criminal liability, for different reasons. That may not cover reckless action, but would a reasonable person consider the prolonged use of an approved technique to be reckless? Appreciate your pretty objective take on all this!
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Because that's not how drug overdoses work. Have people ODed on fentanyl with one third that amount? Yes. Have people survived having more fentanyl? Yes. There are doses that won't kill people and doses that will, but there's a lot of grey area in there that will depend on how acclimated they are to their drug (maybe very in GF's case) and what shape they're in (very poor, in GF's case).
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@blkgranitess Nate covered it somewhat. The drugs and Floyd's overall poor health contributed to the death, and nobody is denying that. If you rob a bank and someone has a heart attack, that person was probably in really bad health. But as long as the knee on the neck also contributed, that conceivably makes it felony murder.
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@JorenMathews Maybe. The medical examiner said it was a combination of things, including the knee. But like Nate said if you rob a bank and someone dies from a heart attack, it's legally felony murder. If the jury disregards rhe ME report then anything's possible.
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@JorenMathews i think a gentle.push isn't a felony so no felony murder. But as Nate described it, legally if a person is very unhealthy it's still the felon's fault. Ethically maybe not, but legally it is.
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@JorenMathews I can't agree with you there. A knee on the neck can be performed harmlessly, but that doesn't mean it can't cause harm, either. You can push someone without causing harm, and you can push someone in a way that does cause harm, right? You can twist someone's arm behind their back harmlessly or harmfully. You can put your knee on a neck in ways that don't cut off bloodflow, or ways that do. You can put a knee on a neck briefly, or keep doing it for several minutes.
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@MrRavellon According to the medical examiner, the neck compression did contribute. Maybe Chauvin didn't apply his knee correctly, or maybe you're mistaken, but I'm going to trust the medical examiner more when he says it did happen vs. someone saying it shouldn't happen.
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@MrRavellon The official medical examiner. As to what factors led him to that, I don't know. But injury to the neck or head wouldn't be needed for that to be the cause, and I'm surprised you even bring that up.
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Maybe. We know that the friend took the fifth, we're told that friend was their dealer, but AFAIK everything else in there is a conclusion. It's a reasonable suspicion that this was a drug deal, but AFAIK nobody there has said that, and we know that the level of fentanyl in Floyd could have been lethal, but that's a far cry from saying that's what killed him. Say that you saw a neighborhood ne'er do well hanging around your house one day, and the next day you notice some tools are missing from your shed. Did he do it? Maybe. Maybe someone else took the tools and this guy was out for exercise. Maybe Floyd's friend was just there to get money, or to discuss a future drug exchange free of possible wiretaps. Maybe Floyd was high as a kite but not overdosing, and was saying he couldn't breathe earlier because he was having a panic attack. Maybe Floyd was overdosing but wouldn't have died without that knee on the neck making it harder for him to breathe.
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@abrahamplepcher8985 What you say is true, and no one is saying the officer didn't have a right to use force to arrest Floyd. But if the cop used excessive force and killed him, even unintentionally killing him by keeping his knee on the neck too long, that might be murder.
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The kneeling continued long after Floyd stopped resisting. That's the key part. Chauvin's initial actions were 100% justified. I don't think anyone is contesting that. But to continue to kneel on someone after they've been complaining about not being able to breathe, has gone limp and has been in handcuffs for several minutes, could be considered assault.
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@Ray-sr9br Your definition of when to stop kneeling on someone and, according to Nate, what officers are trained to do, disagree. Regardless of where the knee was, the ME report listed what the officer was doing as a contributing factor, making this a homicide.
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@Ray-sr9br It appeared to me that Floyd had stopped resisting a long time before he went limp.
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