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Moon Shoes
The New York Times
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Comments by "Moon Shoes" (@moonshoes11) on "The New York Times" channel.

@alishatate7940 Chasing confirmation bias isn’t research.
1800
I find it odd that they cry about freedom, when they are also free to choose to be vaccinated.
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@dantecanava5370 Again, you state that you hold a belief for which you do not require evidence. In other words, you don’t have any reason to believe, but you believe just the same. I never claimed that I expect any god to do anything. I asked you for evidence that any god exists. And you not only failed to offer any, you asserted you made your conclusion without requiring evidence of any kind. By that same method, you could also conclude Allah, Vishnu, Zeus, Odin, and Thor also exist. As well as Big Foot, Pixies, Hobbits, and Unicorns. Right? So, it is was easier for you to be fooled into your conclusion than it will be to convince you that you’ve fooled yourself.
45
@dantecanava5370 We’re all entitled to our own opinions. That isn’t in question. You don’t have a need for evidence for you to be convinced. And that is your failure point. You don’t have and cannot provide evidence that any god or devil exists. Just repeating the claim isn’t sufficient. I challenge you to provide evidence for the existence of any god. Being convinced isn’t evidence.
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@dantecanava5370 I find your comment ironic, because you can’t provide evidence that the devil exists in reality.
38
@RoyGBiv-mb8xt Odin did promise to rid the world of ice giants. To this day, I have never seen an ice giant. Praise be to Odin. Praise be to Thor.
33
@JesusisLordgh8j So what you’re admitting is that there currently isn’t any reason to believe? Let’s pretend that when we die, a god reveals himself. That would be the time to be convinced. Not before. But now, you’re making a claim that we are still aware after we die. There isn’t evidence to support that claim either. And which god would be there? Allah? Jehovah? Odin? Vishnu? It’s obvious that you’re convinced. But it seems you’re convinced without good reason. So, instead of dropping lame threats about the after life, why not get into your own epistemology? Is there any good reason to accept your claims? Is whatever that convinced you actually convincing?
15
@honestyisthebestpolicy1696 That is circular reasoning. Is there good reason to accept what the Bible says? And, why would anyone worship the god of slavery?
14
@__-go9cj That’s a lame equivocation fallacy. So why would anyone worship the God that made actual slavery permissible by law?
13
@peachyrose3499 It’s not necessarily that you or any other believer is crazy. It’s just that your belief likely isn’t warranted, and certainly isn’t demonstrably true. The problem isn’t only with your conclusion, but with your methodology. Do,you find using reliable methodology to be foolish?
8
@DIYTFY Very few. Like, 7 in a million. Per the CDC. Don’t neglect that fact that the CDC also recommends being vaccinated, and says the vaccines are safe.
8
@RoyGBiv-mb8xt I hear Joe Pesci answers prayers more frequently.
7
@peachyrose3499 Way to be vague. Do you also believe in magical things for which you don’t have evidence?
7
@rolandpereira4161 I agree. Either side can make the same assertion. Only one side, it seems, values evidence.
7
You seem confused.
6
@peachyrose3499 I named the shows in my previous post, but here they are again…. Talk Heathen and The Atheist Experience. I don’t expect you will necessarily change your mind, but it may provide a different perspective. It’s nice to be able to have conversation without it turning rude. I appreciate your time. Peace and reason.
6
from religious indoctrination?
6
@ninavanina8455 Despite all the evidence to the contrary. Your single data point is statistically irrelevant. Learn science.
5
@DIYTFY Don’t pretend the vaccines are being forced. Don’t pretend the side effects are more likely or worse than virus side effects, including death. Nobody is suggesting people shouldn’t be aware. That is why they are published. If people are free to choose, what is wrong with choosing a safe vaccination?
5
@peachyrose3499 Whether things today are normal isn’t relevant to whether or not a god exists. I wouldn’t accept that as anything more than evidence that things don’t seem to be normal today, at best. Depending on what one means as normal. Now, if the evidence you have isn’t sufficient to demonstrate a god exists, I would say that is evidence for a god either. For example, if three believers of three different gods all claim a god come to them in their dreams, this may be “evidence” enough for each of those three people, but it isn’t evidence for any of those gods. I accept your apology. Please understand, I can be a civil or uncivil as the next guy. If you’re interested in civil discourse, I can oblige. No harm no foul, or as I like to say….peace and reason. If your evidence wouldn’t be convincing to me or others, why would it convince you?
4
@peachyrose3499 Some people point to the Bible as evidence for a god, but it isn’t evidence so much as it is a series of claims.
4
@LostinMIA Yes, these are rather tired arguments though. First, love is a chemical reaction in the brain, and it in fact can be measured and demonstrated by science. So your claim isn’t exactly true. And when discussing love between two people, you can demonstrate those people exist, right? This doesn’t get you closer to demonstrating whether any god exists. I don’t accept your claim that love requires compete commitment either. On what do you base this claim? People can love imaginary characters. People often say “I love you three thousand” when referring to Iron Man. As for faith, faith is just the excuse people use when they don’t have evidence. Faith can be used to justify any belief, whether or not the belief is true. Right?i All religions can’t be right if they claim theirs is the only god…yet people use faith for both religions, or gods.
4
@LostinMIA I am not denying people their experiences. I’m denying there is evidence to support supernatural conclusions about those experiences. People have reported near death experiences for example, however the conclusion that their “soul” left their body isn’t supported by evidence. I’m not saying they didn’t experience something. I’m saying the conclusion they make extends beyond what is factual. And yes, mental states can be measured. Not only can they be measured, they can also be stimulated.
4
@LostinMIA So love is an emotion which is a chemical reaction that takes place the brain. There is no evidence of anything supernatural in regard to the brain or in regard to anything else, ever. If there is, link me some proof, please.
4
@BIG-qn6ed Actually, the Bible,makes it permissible ephyrae law to own people as property, and pass them down as an inheritance. Yes, it also speaks to indentured servitude. Hebrew males were released after six years. Females were not released. Non Hebrews were not released. If two slaves had children, the children became property of the slave owner, and those slaves were slave for life. This is not inherently good. This is immoral.
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@dougwhitney4258 Actually, I think I made it abundantly clear. Evidence would change my mind. What is also abundantly clear is that you don’t have any. Then you say the time is coming. Well, when the time comes that there is evidence, my mind will be changed. The problem is, you’re convinced without evidence. The earth isn’t flat. Creationism is a myth. You were never abducted by aliens. Trump lost the election. And your god is a delusion.
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@DIYTFY The difference is….people are actually trying to ban abortions. And nobody is forcing vaccinations. Just because there are legitimate reasons for being vaccinated, doesn’t mean they are being forced. It’s too bad you can’t be honest enough to have intellectual dialog. Another difference is that abortions aren’t contagious, and we aren’t in the middle of an abortion pandemic. So, you’re wrong again.
4
I don’t think it is reasonable to assume physiological advantages.
3
@loganq Learn science.
3
@loganq So, what you’re saying is you aren’t capable of understanding? That explains a lot.
3
@rosemarysypolt2197 Can you demonstrate what you promise? Being vague suggested perhaps you cannot.
3
@peachyrose3499 Emotions and feelings can be wrong, and aren’t reliable when determine whether or not something is true. I prefer to hold as many true beliefs and as few false beliefs as possible. Going back to my other example, if two other people have feelings about other gods, would you find that sufficient evidence to be convinced other gods exist? Again, the Bible isn’t evidence. It’s a series of claims which must be supported by evidence. And keep in mind….my claim isn’t that no gods exist. My position is that there isn’t sufficient reason to conclude any gods do exist. I can understand that feeling of not wanting to betray a god belief, though.
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@peachyrose3499 of course I am interested. However, if there is a claim in the Bible regarding the existence of a god, and it can be supported by evidence, then you’d have evidence of a god regardless of the Bible. Circular arguments aren’t evidence. Will you be interested if/when your claim is debunked, or is shown to not be evidence for a god?
3
@peachyrose3499 I recommend seeking more specific info from a geologist, as I am not one. Mount Sodom began its rise hundreds of thousands of years ago and continues to grow taller at a rate of 3.5 millimetres (0.14 in) a year. Movements of the Great Rift Valley system, along with the pressure generated by the slow accumulation of earth and rock, pressed down on the layers of salt, creating Mount Sodom. It is about 80% salt, 720 feet high, capped by a layer of limestone, clay and conglomerate that was dragged along as it was squeezed up from the valley floor. It is approximately 8 kilometres (5 mi) long, 5 kilometres (3 mi) wide, and 226 metres (742 ft) above the Dead Sea water level, yet 170 metres (557 ft) below world mean sea level. Because of weathering, some portions have separated. One of these pillars is known as "Lot's wife", in reference to the Biblical account of the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. Again, these pillars are dated to be between 100,000 to 200,000 years old, which doesn’t fit the Biblical time frame. The natural formation of geological structures are evidenced all over the world. The Bible makes a supernatural claim about the formation. But again, it is a claim…not evidence. You’d have to provide evidence showing the Bible’s claim was accurate, but we have evidence already suggesting it isn’t.
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@peachyrose3499 Also, I find it odd that they point to Leviticus 26, while dismissing Leviticus 25 and Exodus 21 which speaks towards the biblical god’s endorsement of slavery as permissible by his own laws.
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@BIG-qn6ed Can you interpret Exodus 21 in some way other than slavery being permissible by the law of god? All data shows slavery being bad for society. Slaves, obey your earthly masters with all fear. Not only the one, but the cruel. If the Bible can be intercepted for bad and for good, then what value does it hold? You’d have to use a standard outside of the Bible to determine if the interpretations were good or bad. Stoning homosexuals and non-virgins? We clearly have different standards on what is best for society. Worshipping an imaginary god that made slavery permissible, and caused a great genocidal flood is a sub standard moral model.
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@peachyrose3499 Would you do me a favor in return? There are two call-in shows on Sunday where the format is about discussing what you believe, and why regarding religious beliefs. The first is Talk Heathen, the other is The Atheist Experience. Would you be willing to listen to some of the conversations and maybe call in if you feel comfortable? They’re on YouTube, and have been having conversations with people every week for years. It may help with perspective.
3
@peachyrose3499 Leviticus 25 44 “‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.
3
@BIG-qn6ed What is inherently good about slavery?
3
@dougwhitney4258 Sounds more like a koolaid inspired delusion. My world view depends heavily on evidence. Do you have any of that? Because currently, the evidence is overwhelming that vaccines save lives. If you’re going to make claims, cite sources.
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@dianabruijn8283 The standard isn’t whether anyone can show a god doesn’t exist. Nor is that my position. My position is that there isn’t evidence to warrant believing any gods do exist. If the standard is proving gods don’t exist, then you can’t prove Big Foot and unicorns don’t exist. So you must believe they do. You can’t prove Allah, Vishnu, Odin, and Zeus don’t exist….can you? So you believe all of those gods exist? Do you see where your method fails? Time can be measured. Love can also be measured using brain imaging technology. So those examples also fail. Now, I notice you can’t offer any evidence for any god. Why are you convinced?
3
@dianabruijn8283 The flow of time isn’t man made, but our means to measure it is. However, your good is man made. A concept based on the human experience. You’re not offer any evidence for any gods. Claiming you talk to a creator is no different than admitting to your own delusions. I can talk to imaginary being part too. That doesn’t mean those imaginary beings exist. When someone says they love me, I don’t accept it based on what they say. I have experienced people claiming to love me, but their actions demonstrate otherwise. I’ve seen a abusive relationships where a man claims to love his wife, but beats her. This isn’t what I would consider love. What you’re offering are anecdotes. You’re not offering evidence of any kind. All these silly examples of falling asleep and planting a flower aren’t evidence of any kind. They just demonstrate you’re convinced for very bad reasons.
3
@boganshazz821 Lol. Borderline heroic? That’s terribly funny. At best, I’m an average Joe. But then I am reminded of George Carlin; think how stupid the average person is, and realize half of everyone is more stupid. Or something along those lines. Peace and reason. 🤘
3
That is demonstrably false.
2
@peachyrose3499 If you were provided evidence for a natural explanation for salt pillars, would this change your position? How would you be able to determine whether the pillar was indeed a person turned into salt? This is a claim being made by the Bible, that isn’t supported by evidence. These cover rocks date back to 100,000 - 200,000 years ago when the slowly rising salt pillars passed through a layer of underground water.
2
@dkdc1256 I love the Marvel franchise.
2
@peachyrose3499 You’re asking me to view a video that is an hour and twenty two minutes, to determine if they are lying? About anything specific? Keep in mind, when you claim the pillar of salt is Lot’s wife….I don’t assume you are lying, even if you’re wrong. They may be subject to bad mythology or indoctrination. It wouldn’t be fair necessarily to say they are lying, if they’re convinced…even if convinced for poor reasons. Sure, I will view the video as much of the video as I can stand, and offer an opinion. No promises, lol. :)
2
@Hippy2021 Your question is posed improperly, as it assumes a who, rather than a what. It also assumes the universe was “created”, as if it was intended to exist. We as humans don’t currently know how,the universe came to be. We do have evidence for the expansion of a singularity, which is referred to as the Big Bang. We cannot currently investigate the conditions of the Cosmos prior to that event. The only honest answer as to what caused our current presentation of the universe is “we don’t know.” Keep in mind, the only examples we have of a brain or a mind are the result of biology. We don’t have any examples of any minds or consciousness resulting from anything other than a biological brain. You may feel humans are stupid, but what are you contrasting them to? If you want to understand how planets and galaxies came to be, and how the laws of physics work, I recommend that you speak to an astrophysicist.
2
@dougwhitney4258 Oh, so in three years you will maybe have evidence which you only have in your imagination today? That isn’t very convincing. Meanwhile, vaccines are actually saving lives in reality.
2
@dianabruijn8283 Is that the best evidence you have? Because it isn’t convincing by any stretch. You claim god is love? How does that make sense? Love is an emotion, which is a chemical reaction within the brain. It seems your good is a delusion, also a chemical reaction in the brain. So, what proof are you offering? Don’t Muslims make similar claims? Does that make Allah real? Hindus make similar claims. Does that make their gods real? Besides, the Bible suggests god is a jealous god. It also says love is not jealous. So how can a jealous god also be love, when love can’t be jealous?
2
@dougwhitney4258 Mountains that exist only in your imagination. Even by your own claim, it will,p take three years. How could you have anything but imaginary evidence already? Why not study biology instead of trolling incredulity?
2
@dianabruijn8283 Yet, your god cannot be measured in any way.
2
@dianabruijn8283 Much of what you’re saying is lost in translation. I commend your attempt to use my language, so no offense meant. However, I am not saying love does not exist. What you call bad energy, I don’t know of what you mean. You don’t have evidence that a devil exists. I understand much better than you do. I understand there should be good reason and evidence before becoming convinced of claims. And I understand that you cannot,offer any evidence at all. You can only offer claims. Most are very silly.
2
@dianabruijn8283 And do not ever ever ever pretend you have a better idea of what I know, or who I am than I do. Your last comment proves beyond all doubt that you have no idea what you’re taking about, but think you have magic access to knowledge. Don’t be rude. Do a better job at understanding reality.
2
@riannebaker2415 Rianne, blind faith is your answer? You’ve just admitted that you cannot provide proof/evidence, but instead appeal to faith. Then why aren’t you a Muslim or a Hindu? If you’re going to assert the use of faith, can’t faith be used to justify any belief? Faith is the excuse people use when they don’t have evidence. You can believe the earth is flat using blind faith, right? Just as you can believe Allah is god, using faith, right? I care whether or not my beliefs are true. I prefer to hold as many true beliefs and as few false beliefs as possible. So faith won’t get to truth. It only reinforces beliefs, regardless of whether or not they are true. And since faith overrides your requirement for evidence, it means your faith based beliefs are likely to be wrong. Sorry if this harsh reality upsets you. You call my word view blind, but you reject the need for evidence.
2
@riannebaker2415 Please don’t try to explain things to me that I already understand better than you. Evidence for things is the only good reason to belief things. Explain the me why you don’t believe in Allah. Or Vishnu. You’re admitting that you first must be convinced of something, which means you don’t have any reason at all to be convinced. Yet you are.
2
@riannebaker2415 Instead of going on with nonsense, why not address the questions I raised? With blind faith, you believe literally anything. Whether it is true or false. Faith doesn’t have a mechanism to determine if the belief is true. It just bolsters your confidence that it is true, even when it isn’t. Muslims have faith. Is their belief true? Hindus use faith. Is their belief true? The reason your good doesn’t work by evidence is because there is no evidence. When a baby is born without a hand, it doesn’t grow up believing it has a hand now does it?
2
@riannebaker2415 Also, you’re being rude assuming that I haven’t already pursued a relationship with your imaginary friend. After all, out of the two of us, it was me that attended Seminary.
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@riannebaker2415 And I never said you were angry or hated me. So whatever that nonsense is, it’s rude. You do, however, worship the god that made slavery permissible by his own law. And that is immoral.
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@riannebaker2415 Instead of making elementary arguments that are easily debunked, maybe pursue the counter arguments yourself. If faith can be used to justify belief in ANY god, and ANY god claim, then using faith means you’re likely wrong.
2
@riannebaker2415 You never held may same views of god, and claiming to have done so is dishonest. Please don’t be dishonest in our discussion. Don’t assume things about my views. You’re welcome to ask, but assuming is why you’re wrong about god. If you want to have honest dialog, address my questions about faith first. I’ve asked multiple times.
2
@riannebaker2415 As for what I believe…. I believe that people that are convinced that a god or gods exist, do so without being able to demonstrate their claim that they do. I believe they’re convinced without good reason. I believe no god claims have ever met their burden of proof. I believe faith is the excuse people use when they don’t have evidence, and that faith can be used to justify literally any belief…which makes it useless when pursuing truth. The reason I ask believers for evidence of a god, is to demonstrate that they cannot provide any. So far, after witnessing literally thousands of conversations, none have. I get that you are convinced, but what you offer is easily debunked and unconvincing . And yes, you claimed you had believed as I do, but you never bothered to ask relevant questions and made an assumption. This is an example of forming conclusions prematurely. Perhaps you’re misunderstanding reality by first assuming a god exists, and then buying into the delusion. No offense.
2
@riannebaker2415 You said you speak with god. I ask suggested you ask god to tell you what would convince me. Then let me know. I spent time at Seminary. I’ve read the Bible multiple times. Of course, I once believed the biblical god existed, and spent more the twenty years for a revelation of some kind. Instead of assuming I am somehow responsible for doing it all wrong, try to understand that you don’t have reason to believe and cannot offer evidence of your god’s existence. You don’t seem to be paying attention to much of what I say. If there were evidence for a god, I would be convinced. Of course. If a god revealed itself, that would be evidence…providing I wasn’t experiencing a hallucination or,otherwise deluding myself. But that’s the catch, isn’t it? If god is only in one’s mind, and different people are convinced different gods have been revealed to them, then isn’t such evidence useless?
2
@Desicuevas So what you mean is that you’re undereducated, and get hung up on common dialog? Your being rude only helps my argument. I’ve read the Bible multiple times, and even attended Seminary. If one of hasn’t read the book, it’s clearly you. After all, your biblical doctrine shows that your god made slavery permissible by law. Slavery not doubt is one of the greatest human causes of suffering historically. According to doctrine, your gods also sent a genocidal flood, wiping out virtually all life. Even Thanos only wiped out half. You stated the world was proof of Satan. My response was that your god allegedly created Satan and created evil, has supposedly has the power to stop it but chooses not to. Try to keep up. If you’re interested in honest dialog, start by being honest. And no, I’m not angry at a gods that don’t exist. There are plenty of people like you who bring evil into the world based on your delusions. That’s where my problem lies.
2
@adiblatif How do you account for your claim that only supernaturally this could happen? How do you know a god made such prediction? If I order a steak done medium well, and it arrives medium well, was it a prophecy? Creation presupposes a creator, which is why existence is considered existence, not a creation. In order for you to call existence a creation, you must first demonstrate a creator, otherwise, you’re using circular reasoning. To be completely ignorant of science and still suggest it is ludicrous is called incredulity. You have nothing but post hoc rationalizations to confirm a bias formed by indoctrination. After all, it wasn’t prophecy that convinced you your gods existed. You already believed long before you read of any prophecies. If other religions with other gods have similar prophecies, do you also accept their gods? Gold isn’t scattered, humiliated, or persecuted during processing is it? Be honest.
2
@Krioque I’m sure you’re convinced of many things for which you don’t actually have evidence. The answer to your question as to why a vaccination was created remains the same. Also, Trump lost the election. The earth is an oblate spheroid. Your were never abducted by aliens.
2
@DIYTFY There you go being dishonest, again. I pointed out specific differences between abortions and vaccinations. You didn’t address those differences, and instead offered two straw man positions. Nobody claimed abortions aren’t a personal health choice. Nobody claimed the virus could not be spread through the vaccinated. Do better. Stop being dishonest.
2
@DIYTFY Stop with the false narrative of forced vaccinations. Not a single person has been forced. Be honest, for once. Per the CDC, naturally immunity is not equal to vaccinations. Why are you being dishonest by cherry picking? If you want people to mind their own business, start by logging off and doing so yourself.
2
@DIYTFY Though I have provided data from the CDC that demonstrates otherwise. You can’t do any better?
2
@wesdex04 Abortions aren’t contagious. Right? Abortions are typically only a group of cells, like a blastocyst. Right? So,calling it a death is an equivocation. Based on these, the analogy doesn’t quite fit. Whether it makes it a valid angle seems subjective. What numbers do you have, and can you cite sources?
2
@moirainabox4367 If you’re not going to be vaccinated, you’re part of the problem. Contributing to a pandemic is shameful.
2
@ivareskesner2019 I did. And different people develop differently. People don’t get the same advantage across the board, as you seem to think. This is why science matters.
1
@ivareskesner2019 Oh, suddenly you have the magical ability to know what others believe? This demonstrates you admittedly cannot defend your own position. Perhaps depend less on your own bias and more on evidence.
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@ivareskesner2019 You’re addressing differences, not advantages. I was pretty clear when I said people don’t get the same advantages across the board. Pay attention and ask better questions. Don’t pretend to mind read and fill in blanks based on your bias and incredulity.
1
@ivareskesner2019 As for your being mortal….it makes me wonder if you’re aware we all are mortal. Do you know anyone who isn’t?
1
@ivareskesner2019 And my point, that you’re desperately trying to dismiss, is that your suggested advantages are not as across the board as you suggest. I will ask one question, see if you can answer honestly: Have you ever seen any women taller than a man? You can replace taller with stronger, faster, etc.
1
Imagination.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه I’m not your dear, to begin with. And all gods that cannot be demonstrated to exist in reality are likely imaginary. Could you… ask Allah what would convince me he exists? And let me know what he says?
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه God isn’t a who. God is a what. A concept. Not an actual being within reality, as far as anyone can show. You could ask God what would convince me, see if he knows.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه It is fine if you misspell things. So far, you are doing fine with communicating. I am from America, if that is what you’re asking. I’m not a sister though. I realize my screen name doesn’t reflect gender. Peace.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه Gods that don’t exist can’t love anyone or anything.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه Gods that don’t exist cannot send angels which don’t exist.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه To say Islam is the strongest religion in the world only means it has the most people convinced of something. It says nothing about whether the claims are true. You can ask your god what would convince me it exists. If a god exists, surely it would know what would convince me, yes?
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه If want to know whether or not any gods exist. This isn’t about feelings. Can you ask your god what would convince me it exists? It should know, right? Does your god want me to know it exists?
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه I don’t believe any gods exist. I don’t have a religion. If your god wants me to know it exists, what’s the problem? Ask him what would convince me. He should know, right? Being a god, he should know. Ask him.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه Why would you a “who” is responsible to begin with, regarding the existence of the universe? There is no reason to conclude the Qur’an came about by any other means than any other book; men wrote it. Adam and Eve didn’t exist, they were created as literature, not as people. And they were not the first of mankind. Most of your education is still ahead of you.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه Again I plead, ask you god what would convince me. He should know, right?
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه Is that what He told,you to say? Because it isn’t convincing. So, He must be wrong.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه A god nobody can show even exists? Not even your god?
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه Ask you good, or ask your elders what would convince me. Let’s see if either one knows. Why do you believe a god exists? Please don’t say “a book”.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه Making claims and promises about better places and better days is deceitful. If we were friends, you’d be honest.
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه I’m not saying there are no gods. I’m saying there is no reason to be convinced there are any gods. There is no reason to conclude your claims for a god comport with reality. But if a god exists, this god should know what it would take to convince me. Right?
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه It is currently almost 4:30 in the afternoon where I am. I’m sure that isn’t relevant to ether or not a god exists though. Lol. :)
1
@فاٍٰطمٔهّالزهْراءُ-ض2ه Tell me why my gender is relevant, and I may share.
1
@loganq Except, that isn’t true. You’ve just admitted you don’t require evidence to form your conclusions, which is why you’re wrong, This is very likely a pattern in your life, and your world view.
1
@loganq No, you made a conclusion without any evidence. And you were wrong. Like I said, likely a pattern.
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@Hippy2021 Now Mary, you’ve made an awful lot of claims in this post. I’d like for you to offer a demonstration that any of them are true. I’ve heard all these claims before. Muslims make similar claims. Hindus make similar claims. The only thing you all have in common is that you cannot offer evidence that your claims are true. You see things occur in the natural world, and attribute them to a god for you were indoctrinated in believing exists. I know I was not hatched from the dirt, because I understand how biology works. Of course, the Bible claims Adam came from the dirt. We know this is false. So, you believe in a biblical god, but you reject the Bible. What brings you to a conclusion that a god exists? Is it because you don’t have a better understanding of reality? This is what is known as an argument from incredulity. So please, don’t just make claims. Offer evidence. Just believing doesn’t make it so. Again, Muslims and Hindus make similar claims. Do their gods exist too? As for your recommendation to use my brain and not waste it, It seems that I have already put mine to better use. I don’t mean that to be insulting, but if you believe things without evidence….then you’re not using your critical thinking. If others can make the same claim about other gods, then what you call evidence is no better than theirs, and is insufficient.
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@sophiacherrington6765 I’ve read the Bible multiple times. I’ve attended Seminary. The government exists, and there is evidence of it’s existence. You can’t say the same about any gods.
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@dianabruijn8283 MRI imaging technology can measure emotions in the brain. Not only measured, but stimulated. Your god cannot be measured in any way. You seem to lack any scientific understanding.
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@riannebaker2415 The Bible is not an authority on reality. If a god exists, and does not reveal itself in reality, then it has no interest in whether or not I am convinced it exists. And, if it does not reveal itself in regality, then you don’t have any reason to believe it exists either. You can’t have it both ways.
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@riannebaker2415 I do want the truth, always. What you’re offering is to believe things that are not true, and for which you have no reason to claim they are true. You’re not helping me by suggesting to use faith. In fact, you’re not even having honest discussion. Why can’t I use faith to believe no gods exist? Why can’t I use faith to believe in Vishnu, or Odin? If you talk to God, as you claim….ask him what you can say that would convince me. And only respond when he tells you.
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@riannebaker2415 You should stop assuming you’re right.
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@riannebaker2415 You haven’t answered my question on faith. When a Hindu uses faith for their beliefs that multiple gods exist, does it get them to truth? When a person uses faith to believe in Allah, does that mean Allah is also real? I realize Allah and Yahweh both come from the Abrahamic god myths, but so does Judaism. So if someone who is Jewish uses faith that the savior has not yet been sent by god, is it true?
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@Desicuevas I don’t think I am a god, so retract your claim. And yes, my morality is based on well being over suffering. According to biblical doctrine, your god cares very little about human suffering. But you still can’t provide evidence that any god, or the devil exists. The world is evidence of the world. You can’t just claim it is evidence of a devil. Besides, according to your doctrine, your gods is responsible for creating evil, creating the devil, and would,be powerful enough to stop evil, but doesn’t. Your believing a god exists doesn’t make your god a reality. You don’t have evidence that Adam and Eve existed. All you have are claims. Remember, the Bible is a book of claims, and those claims require evidence. This planet doesn’t depend on my opinion, but your opinions are demonstrably false. So go ahead and admit you don’t have evidence for your god or for a devil. Be honest.
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@riannebaker2415 Are you familiar with Disney’s Dumbo story? The mouse gave Dumbo a magic feather that convinced him could make fly…. But he didn’t really need the feather.
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@joniberry3257 Joni, I spent years of my life being a believer. I even attended Seminary. Don’t you think that perhaps I tried that? In thirty years of really meaning it, I never got a response. If what you say is true, then there obviously isn’t a god, and now you have a broken promise. And think this through. Don’t you think Muslims say the same thing about Allah? And Hindus say similar things about their gods? Also, I know of many people who have done this, and really felt like God revealed himself to them. And they spend many years as true believers. But later realized they were deceiving themselves. So, everything about your claim is false. Do you have anything better than self deception as evidence?
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@Desicuevas You can pray all you like for me to stop what I do. But prayers work at about the same rate as chance. And there is no chance I will stop being better informed than you. There is only hope you decide to be intellectually honest. Oh sure, you try to insult be but sincerely wish magic blessing on me. I don’t buy it, believer.
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@myettryet70 You’re lying.
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@rmason5477 That is nonsense. Things seem bad, but between 1339 and 1945 during WWII there were a thousand people dying per hour. If you consider all of history, has there been a time where we have had better access to freedom, education, medicine, or food? And if your god had the power to help, and doesn’t…. Then even Spider-man is a more moral fictional character.
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@rmason5477 Prayer works at about the same rate as chance. In this case, the only chance of convincing me a god exists is with evidence. And you can’t provide any.
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@rmason5477 One makes a slave of one’s self? Really? It was your god that made slavery permissible by law. And in the Bible, when your god order men, boys and women with children slaughtered, taking the virgin girls as slaves… We’re they making slaves of themselves? Your comments are an example of the harm religion does.
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@alfredwilsbury8397 I agree, people often rely more on emotions than reason. It seems religion capitalizes on this, encouraging people that believing without evidence is somehow virtuous, and adds the threat of torment for even questioning. I regularly spectate conversations where people’s beliefs are investigated. If you haven’t heard of Street Epistemology, I recommend Anthony Magnabosco’s channel. I appreciate your comment. Peace and reason.
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@12jkp59 Some people actually understand what science is, how it works, and why it is reliable. People that don’t know better believe in magic, and conspiracies.
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@alfredwilsbury8397 I also recommend The Atheist Experience, and Talk Heathen shows for various conversations from people about what they believe, and why they believe it.
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@adiblatif Does your god also say slavery is lawful?
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@saintmikey9103 How do you know a whole nation saw him? Is that based on hearsay from a single person?
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@rmason5477 Sort of like Dumbo’s magic feather, from the Disney story. Yea?
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@rufusking430 Franklin was a man of science, and knew what questions to ask. Question authority is good. Assuming you know better can be problematic. Especially of you don’t understand science, or simply reject it.
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@akhandhan6620 Yawn.
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@gailclough1665 McDonald’s isn’t contagious. Right?
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@kevinwest1607 I watch the news regularly. It isn’t evidence that a supernatural being exists. Not in the slightest. Bad things happening is part of a natural world. It is what we would expect if no gods exist, and is no evidence to the contrary. Consider: Can you name any time throughout history where we have had better access to freedom, education, medication, and food? So how,is today’s news relevant? Are you aware that during WWII, there was a six year period where almost a thousand lives were lost per hour? That is horrible, but it isn’t today’s news. By your same argument, are you suggesting there is also an all powerful god that could stop bad things from happening, and chooses not to?
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@kevinwest1607 Please don’t say you were ever like me. It can’t be accurate, and it comes off as dishonest. Also, by saying “worse” you’re suggesting it is bad. That’s rude. No offense meant. I’m sure your experience is very important to you. I was once a believer, and I even attended Seminary. So I doubt very much much you were like me. Please consider: Faith means believing without evidence, right? Faith is used by different people to accept different gods, right? Muslims and Hindus use faith as well, would you agree? And people of those faiths also offer similar arguments about having awful periods but pulled through. Faith can be used to justify any belief, regardless whether or not the belief is true. It does serve to bolster confidence in the belief, even if the belief is false. So I find faith to be problematic, especially because I care whether or not my beliefs are true. Also, Letting go of my religion has helped me through tough times, as it has for other non-believers.
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@Jona7Fer These are claims. Can you offer any demonstration that your delusions comport with reality? No…you certainly can’t. Don’t Muslims make similar claims, also without evidence? “Sin” is a concept which is absurd anyway. Being a human doesn’t make people bad. Being religious does.
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@saintmikey9103 I’m probably better aware of most Abrahamic religions than you are. After all, I attended Seminary, and I bet you didn’t. You don’t have “many witnesses”, as you claim. You have one hearsay account claiming there were many witnesses. What you’re suggesting was passed down you must acknowledge was passed down like a game of “telephone” for several decades before it was ever written down. Not only that, you don’t even have original transcripts of what was first written down. And the earliest copies of those transcripts that we do have are a few fragments smaller than an index card. Right?
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@Jona7Fer What do we need to be saved from? Eternal torment orchestrated by an immoral god, that you can’t demonstrate even exists?
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@Jona7Fer Even if there is a god, your god’s view on morality would be subjective. Just as your opinions about gods are subjective. And since you can’t demonstrate any gods actually exist, morality would necessarily be subjective. Right up until the point we agree that morality is about well being versus suffering. At that point, if we agree that well being is better than suffering…then we can agree some things are objectively immoral. Slavery is an example. Murder is an example. If you don’t care about well being, then you don’t fit well into society. This may be a subjective opinion, but most agree…which is why we maintain laws. So morality seems to be the result of evolution, like everything else about humanity.
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@Jona7Fer I prefer to hold as many true beliefs and as few false ones as possible. Which is why when people make unsubstantiated claims, those claims get rejected. If your best evidence is nothing more than a delusion, it isn’t convincing.
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@saintmikey9103 Diapers are used for sanitary and hygiene purposes. It’s odd that you’re pro-disease.
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@seraphinastringer908 Great, great. Except, I’ve attended Seminary. I’ve read the Bible multiple times. I likely have better knowledge and understand the Bible better than most people that suggest reading the Bible. Guess what? The answers to my questions aren’t in the Bible. Keep in mind, the Bible isn’t evidence. The Bible makes claims for which evidence would be needed, and doesn’t exist.
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@angelabird85 Lucid dreaming isn’t a realigned,pathway to truth. If you don’t care whether or not your beliefs are true, then lucid dreaming is good for you. The problem is, using that method, one can be convinced many gods exist, or no gods exist. Just like faith. And if you’re trying to contact a god, you were already convinced. Dreams can be interesting, but they aren’t useful in measuring reality. Neither are magic mushrooms. And claiming you were once a hardcore atheist isn’t relevant whatsoever.
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@GRIM_MOD 99% of those dying from the virus are unvaccinated, according to the evidence. So, yes…the vaccination works. The claim isn’t that it prevents being infected. It reduces the risk. It significantly reduces the chances of severe symptoms and death. I’m curious how people still don’t grasp this after all these months.
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@GRIM_MOD It isn’t a lie. And 1000%? This demonstrates that you don’t understand how reality works, and that your emotions run your beliefs, instead of your intellect. Hospitalized isn’t the same as dying from, right? Over use of the vaccine can’t cause a super bug. You’re confusing a virus with bacteria. Your lack of understanding demonstrates only your incredulity. Allowing the virus to persist allows for variants to come about. It’s a shame you don’t understand evolution.
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@nellyespinosa4254 I’m not attacking anyone. I’m asking questions. So stop attacking me. There is good reason for having civil discourse, whether you’re aware of it or not. If you want to participate, I’m happy to oblige. If not, then you can move along. However, people’s beliefs inform their actions.
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@dianabruijn8283 I’m not looking in any specific direction. If you can’t offer evidence, and can only make vague claims, then you believe things without good reason. Science can measure energy. Sol can we measure social conditioning? Sure. Is there good reason to call it “the devil”. No. Particularly when there is so much supernatural baggage that is tied to such a title. Clearly, people mean different things than what you suggest. So, it’s not the “bigger picture” that is a problem. It’s clear terminology.
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@bildonwalker9430 No you don’t. That isn’t how it works.
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@mark777myers All the evidence and data says otherwise. This is where a better understanding of science, and a preference to hold true beliefs, would be of value to you.
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@marcjanverdelantar9605 I don’t need really your permission or approval to live as I do. I prefer to hold as many true beliefs and as few false beliefs as possible. Broad brushing an equivocation isn’t useful. If you care to engage in discussion, perhaps modify your approach.
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@marcjanverdelantar9605 I never made any such assertion. Looks like you’re not even decent enough to have honest dialog. Good thing you felt the need to delete your post.
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@marcjanverdelantar9605 I don’t need a lecture from someone who doesn’t understand that not all beliefs deserve respect. Do you think the beliefs of the KKK or White Supremacists deserve respect? Do you? I can be respectful to people who hold different beliefs. I have shown that in my posts. I have shown it far better then your lack of toleration for my posts. But I am under no obligation to respect terrible doctrine that supports the notion of slavery or inequality.
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@M Z So, you’d value the evidence showing how heavily censored sources are? Because I’d like to see it. Or do you reject that evidence as somehow censored too? Or are you suggesting nobody should believe anything, ever…because all claims have equal merit? The reality is, we do indeed have reliable methods for measuring reality. And science deniers don’t seem to understand this.
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@slavenrasic2173 So. You’re here on a science based computer device, over a science based internet to support the notion that science is unreliable? Sounds like you might be someone who denies science based on your own incredulity. Do you have anything of value to contribute?
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@Krioque I’m sure the evidence you have is overwhelming.
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@Krioque There are some problems with your question. A vaccination isn’t a cure. It’s a preventative measure. Also, you’re assuming it was man made. But even if there was a sinister group that created this virus with intent, the reasons the vaccinations were created remain the same. Is your question asking why any vaccinations are developed? It seems to reduce suffering and death as much as possible. The question you should be asking is whether your epistemology is sound.
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@Krioque I’m sure your belief in magic allows you to have special access to information the rest of the world just can’t see. Like your gods.
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@Krioque The entire world? It’s all over the internet? Get a grip. Reality matters.
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@Krioque So, I’m two,years you will have evidence that you don’t have? Sure. And Jesus is coming back any day now… Any day. Tru p will be reinstated any day now…. Any day. Well… We’re waiting. crickets
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@Krioque Seems to me like your posts are evidence of having done meth. Certainly more so than a life saving vaccine. You’re not supposed to snort the koolaid.
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@annehedonia156 So you’re using your magical gifts of prophecy to make predications based on nothing more than your own incredulity. You’re convinced, without evidence….correct? You don’t have evidence to support your claims for side effects that have not yet occurred. But you might in two or three years? And what of all the data so far?
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@annehedonia156 Smallpox inarguably shaped the course of human history by killing countless millions in both the Old World and the New World. Dr. Edward Jenner's discovery of vaccination in the late 18th century, and the global eradication of smallpox in the 1970s, rank among the greatest achievements in human history.
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@annehedonia156 You’re projecting, deliberately missing the point. You can’t make an assessment that side effects will be present in two or three years. You’re also neglecting the number of lives saved. Do you get some emotional satisfaction referring to the vaccine as a jab? Do you form your world view based on a lack of credible evidence?
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@spinninginspace How could you know the difference between a god that doesn’t exist, and a god that hides his existence?
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@caroldesarnoNeNe45 We have fields of study for geology and biology. None have uncovered evidence for any gods. The very examples you’ve given have natural explanations, and require no gods. If your best evidence is that one day when we die, we will find out…that means you don’t yet have evidence. And you’re convinced for no good reason.
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@linakhalid2700 Evil is evidence of evil. Not the supernatural. My standards of evidence are more critical.
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@blessed2338 I’ve done this. No response after more than 30 years. Can I now assume he doesn’t want me to think he exists, or maybe doesn’t exist? I disagree that the best thing you can do is ask yourself internally a question and expect a reliable result. If this method were reliable, we wouldn’t here similar claims from Muslims, and Mormons alike.
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@spinninginspace You make a lot of claims. What reason is there to conclude those claims are true?
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@spinninginspace If that is all the evidence you need, then you’re convinced for poor reasons. Those reasons you listed, nature and love, as far as we know…are the result of natural processes. We see natural processes unfold every day. You’re making a claim it is the result of a god, but what you don’t have is any way to connect a god to natural processes. I get it, you’re convinced. You have more confidence in a belief than the evidence warrants, or so it seems.
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@spinninginspace If you thought you were being skeptical, you were doing it wrong. Part of skepticism is measuring your confidence to the evidence. If person A says “my god exists, just ask him”, and person B says “my god exists, just ask him” but they believe in different gods….you should be able to see why “just ask him” isn’t a reliable pathway to whether or not any gods exist. Which of the gods do you consider all knowing and worthy of worship? Where are you getting any information about this god? Does your god allow for doctrine that permits immoral things, such as slavery? Is an immoral imaginary being really worthy or worship? See, your “seek and you shall find him” is utter nonsense. You’re assuming I haven’t. I’m just not convinced by poor arguments. I was raised to believe, and I even attended Seminary. It’s likely that I pursued an understanding for more critically than you, and far more than most believers. But when you best argument can be used by believers of Vishnu, Allah, and Odin, your best argument is insufficient.
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@spinninginspace Even your “just look at the trees” argument can be used by believers of any and every god. I hope you see how that makes it useless in pursuit of truth.
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@pahukolofoou Suggesting it was a “who” that “created” things is not the best way to ask the questions. You’re presupposing off was a who, not a what. You’re presupposing intention by creating. Some things are a natural result, natural processes. Most things are. We have countless examples. We have no examples of supernatural processes. That is just reality.
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@pahukolofoou You did it again. Suggesting nothing is created by nothing. On this we can agree. The problem is, as far as anyone can show, you’re god is literally nothing. And again, your personal incredulity isn’t relevant. You personally don’t understand how natural processes work, therefore you apply “god” to your lack on understanding, the gap in your knowledge. I genuinely understand this better than you do. The only failure here is yours.
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@pahukolofoou So, let’s just pretend your imaginary friend exists… Therefore your imaginary friend exists. This is your best argument?
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@pahukolofoou I wonder about the unknown a lot. I just don’t pretend to have answers that I don’t have. I don’t assert answers when there is t evidence to support them. If you want honest and intellectual dialog, stop being rude and stop pretending you know things you don’t. I don’t think there is reason to jump to a who, and I don’t see any reason to justify referring to existence as a creation. You certainly cannot demonstrate any such creator. Right? You keep insisting there is a “who”, which is fallacious. You don’t know there is a who behind it. Why would you assume there is? Just because you don’t have an answer, or in your case…because you can’t understand the answers we do have, doesn’t mean we should just assume any gods exist.
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@pahukolofoou Ok, I can help you to understand what an argument from incredulity is, or you can look it up. You should also make yourself aware of what the burden of proof means, and what shifting the burden of proof means. But going on and on with an insane rant about being a child of god, and a process of god isn’t helpful. If indeed your god doesn’t exist, then your claims are just childish rants. And since you can’t demonstrate your god exists, you have a serious problem. Just like every other believers, from every other religion….making claims about gods without evidence. Now, are you interested in honest dialog without making a bunch of unsubstantiated claims?
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@pahukolofoou I think I do understand where you’re coming from. You presuppose a “who” was responsible for existence, and that this “who” intentionally created existence. Is this incorrect? Then you claim you know a god exists. You don’t know this, and can’t show this. You just really, really, believe it. And you do so without warrant. Your only argument is that since you don’t have answers, you presume the correct answer is a god. But you can’t offer evidence. You just say “this is too complicated for a princess to understand, so it must be magic”. And that is pretty sad.
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@pahukolofoou I understand that we have brains, and can think for ourselves. There is evidence to support this. Is there evidence your god has a brain? Nope.
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@pahukolofoou Remember, your lack of understanding isn’t evidence for any gods. Claiming you know isn’t evidence. People claim they know other gods exist. Allah, Vishnu, Odin. Can you offer any demonstration that a god exists? And that it is your particular god? And is it the god of the Bible?
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@pahukolofoou Would you be willing to call the talk show and explain what you know about god, and why you believe it? Sunday, there are two shows, Talk Heathen and The Atheist Experience. Both are YouTube shows which allows callers a chance to explain why they believe. Can you do this?
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@brandongonzales1958 Oh yes, I’ve dedicated my life to your imagined adversary. One that neither of us have any reason to be convinced exists. That checks out.
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@blackbutterfly3248 Believers don’t have to prove anything to me. But it isn’t about whether the have to and more about whether they can. And not to me, but at all. See, the standard you’re suggesting means…if someone were to claim they discovered BigFoot, but cannot offer evidence to support their claim…would to believe them? By your standard, you can’t prove Vishnu doesn’t exist, right? And if your best argument for the existence of something is that we can’t prove it isn’t true, then I’d say your belief isn’t rational.
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@DIYTFY There yo I go being dishonest again. You neglected relevant and critical information. That is dishonest. If you’re insulted because you were called out for dishonesty, then so be it. This isn’t about whether you disagree with me. This is about your neglecting factual data and providing a misleading narrative. Do better.
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