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  923. They are very much like fundamentalist Christianity, when given power fundamentalists are universally repressive misogynist, intolerant, violent homophobic and oppressive. Evangelical Christianity has all the innate problems fundamentalist Islam does but has been watered down here because it exists in a secular environment that curbs it's worst impulses which are nearly identical to those of the Muslims you attack. You are literally advocating treating of Muslims as the other and your spin is tone deaf as you complain about the treatment of Christians which is based on the same kind of spin from Muslim conservatives. Under secularism all religions are more moderate. In the US Muslims for example support gay marriage at higher rates than fundi Christians do. The worst aspects of any religion do not define all followers and the reason Muslims are more conservative as a rule is they come from societies that do not benefit from secularism like the fundamentalist Christians do. When they exist in a framework that promotes religious freedom followers of Islam become ever more like moderate Christians and less like the christian fundi's who are very similar to the deeply conservative Muslims even as they are their loudest and most vocal critics. In the context of modern Muslim extremism we need to acknowledge the external powers including our roll in it's rise. Intelligence agencies have trained and funded extremists for decades to further other political goals and those terrorists who share nothing with us ideologically have since turned on us when our alliance was no longer convenient, this should surprise no one. These people are scum but they are largely a monster we created to solve other issues. We have consistently empowered conservative dictators and over turned secular governments to replace with them religious yes men ass holes. In almost every case the deeply conservative Muslims you point to as the problem are backed or were originally trained by one colonial non Muslim power or another for political and economic reasons that benefit the investors at the cost of the freedom of the people who live there. As of right now we are close allies a country that spreads the radical Wahhabi sect in the Saudi's because they sell us cheap oil. There seems to be little concern that they are chief exporters of Muslim terror, including the ass hats that did 911. I loathe all fundamentalists as regressive cancer, I do not single out Muslims as a group while i have no issue attacking the worst actors in the same way I kick fundi christian policy that we as a secular society should not be supporting either.
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  1054. +George Montag Atheists in general know more about the bible than most Christians. That is because in spite of the their claims to follow it the book is so full of nonsense most churches only focus on the stuff they push and ignore sections that they do not follow. The religious are ignorant because they have no call to learn the bible, they have only submit to their chosen flavor of religious dogma. The average church does not need or want you to read the bible and they offer simple answers to complex questions for people who do not want to learn or think too much. They are aided by the fact it is a terrible boring book to read and it is little wonder most Christians never bother.   The image of god is different from christian to christian dogma to dogma, there is no unified view of God and everybody's version is different and no one denomination can claim to have the correct version. Christianity is not the united front you pretend it is, if you as a single christian can not explain why your version of faith is correct and the other Christians who you disagree with are wrong then it is clear you are making an arbitrary choice.   The moral superiority of Christianity chopped apart with a look at any stat that matters. Atheists go to jail less frequently. They care about issues like torture and civilian deaths more. There is nothing I can think of that makes a christian innately more moral and for them to use the spin that atheists are immoral is just fact free garbage that idiots sell to other like minded idiots. Associating things that are universally disliked to those you oppose is time tested propaganda material but is innately dishonest. It is as valid to associate leaders with a mustache to the history of murder in soviet Russia as it is to try to pin it on atheism. The spin trying to pain atheism which makes no moral claims at all and sets no moral compass with Stalin's or Hitler's actions is base stupid and invalid. Morality can be derived from many things, atheism does not contribute to that process in any way as it is simple stance on a single subject, that being a belief in god. Atheists choose their morality as individuals and it is clear that some of them are better people than others. It is also clear that on average they appear to have superior morality than the religious and that is because they are not tied to a dogma and are able to choose what is right and wrong without millennium old nonsense getting in the way. When you make an assertion like "It is caused by atheism" I am not beholden to prove you wrong when you can not prove the statement correct. You are the one who makes the claim here and that which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
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  2112.  @Madmartigan6  1) It was approved under emergency use to get it out fast. The fact is pfizer is being fully approved this week and that undermines this entire spin. 2) The analogy is apt and if there was an anti cancer drug movement this is exactly the same kind of nonsense they would push to get to you avoid taking the treatment. It is completely valid in it's comparison to claiming the vaccines causes heart attacks because there is no corollary data to support it outside some reports people had one after. The analogy is to show the error confusing causation with correlation. 3) The vaccinated are contacting covid (especially the new variant) because the mutation end runs some of the protection offered. They still get it at far lower rates than the unvaccinated as proved in places like Israel where they have very high vaccine rates and half of the people contracting are unvaccinated. A minority represents half the cases reported. The efficacy of the vaccine against he original strain is still very very high. The chance of you contracting it after being vaccinated is very very low. 4) The threat of long covid is not nearly as rare as adverse reactions to the vaccination. But even if you dismiss the personal threats of getting the virus you stand to a better chance to pass it on to others just to achieve some immunity. You become a link in a chain that kills others instead of gaining your protection from a inoculation which has no chance of harming others and at very very low risk to you. 5) Waving away numbers that do not agree with you makes you look like a cultist. There is every indication of this and that you are ignoring data that you dislike is not an argument or reason to pretend it does not exist. 6) Ya, they made billions. What does that change? He never said they did not make money on selling it. It is not clear you understand what cognitive dissonance is as you accuse him of it here. 7) The viral load spin is more meaningless anti vax nonsense that does not invalidate the use or the advantage of being vaccinated over getting this novel virus unprotected. Those who are vaccinated die from the virus less frequently and get less sick than the unvaxed. This is what we would expect if the vaccine had value. 8) Your numbers are ridiculous. I have spoken to others in your camp. They consistently bring up places like Israel in an attempt to undermine the vaccines effectiveness without any understanding of the numbers in the places cited. When you cite percentages it is always to mislead. In your case I have no doubt that throwing out the 80% number covers up fo the fact the numbers admitted are a fraction of what they were in the peak last January. In the case of Israel half the people reporting are vaccinated even though the unvaxed are a tiny minority. But the over all numbers are 1/10th what they were in January. Hard to paint the vaccine as a failure in that context. You are not thinking, you are parroting fear and ignorance under the guise of being informed. You are not. You are acting like a cultist. I do not care if you reply at all.
    6
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  2221. +Markus KRATOS28  There is zero discrepancy between these positions and your confusion is based on an error in your assumptions of why we support each one.    On the abortion issue it is a matter of the promotion of a woman's right to control her life.  It is about her right to choose if she is any position to undertake the massive and life consuming responsibility of having a child while risking her health to do so.   It is about that choice wrapped in reasonable restrictions designed to ensure it is not possible for the zygote or fetus to suffer or feel anything. The fact is we have very reasonable laws around this complex issue and most people who are pro choice do not advocate for a system where anyone can have an abortion any time.  The rules that are in place restrict when you can have one and are based on the best science and study tells us.   On matters of education and health care we advocate for polices that have been proven to work well in other places.  We seek to get the best versions of these systems in place for the betterment of our society and to ensure as many people as possible have access to them as they are both critical to future success.  We see this as an investment in our countries future and our place as a beacon of prosperity the world can look up to and every American and future American should benefit from.    These ideas are not in conflict at all with the idea of promoting reproductive liberty for woman.  We can most certainly disagree if it is moral or not.   I as I said before I sympathize with your position personally.  But know if you ever fight for the restriction reproductive rights then those like me will oppose you and call you out. You will get flack for your support in a forum like this because it is easy to mistake the simple sharing of an opinion with advocating for a change in policy.
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  2873. @gz The predictions you claim as validated by "secular sources" are not validated. This is a slight of hand and does not pass any kind of rational sniff test. The prophesies you cite are very very general and the nature of the language used or in some cases because of bad translation is so unspecific as to be realized many times since they were made. To walk through the list of fulfilled prophesy you cite is not compelling without your mask of faith over them. The self importance of those expecting the end times any day now is the root of your unearned and identity based superiority. Your empty claim to special knowledge backed up bogus claims to have evidence speaks to your brand of delusion. Every deeply faithful person no matter what the religion has the exact same amount of validation as you do, the exact same amount. You all think you have reason for certainty but are backed up using the same mechanism of blind faith. The way you divide us by left and right while attaching your religion to it is revealing on the kind of media you consume. It attaches you to a movement that moving ever further away from the actual teachings of Christ in the bible, toward an abject worship of power and might makes right. The movement hijacking your good intentions is based on fringe and concocted wedge issues, many of them contemporary and not well referenced in the bible. When it comes to finances or helping the poor these godly people, consistently spit in the face of Christs ideals to enrich their donors. Neither party is particularly Christian as far as I can see. They are both far too focused on corporate welfare, war, empowerment of the rich and social stasis instead of the meeting the needs of actual people as Jesus would encourage. The GOP is hard mask off anti Christian with their attacks on any service to the poor and focus on empowering only the rich and the repressive. Those who have a better chance of getting trough the eye of needle (according to the bible) than getting into heaven. They are pro war, anti poor, anti sojourner, pro crony capitalist ,the antithesis of the big J who was more anti wealth than even communists are. Not being evangelical is not equal to being godless, respecting others right to worship as they choose is not being godless. Opposing law based on anyone's faith claims is in no way godless! Having a different take on reproductive rights or health care between you and doctor is NOT godless! Cutting lunch programs for kids, advocating for endless war, attacking all sojourners as criminal, servicing ultra rich mega donors and repressive religious grifters hoarding mountains of money at their temple, unilaterally supporting governments ruled tyrants and murders most certainly is.
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  3011.  @idimo7976  Pretending the corporate or financial institutions have some plan to override the mono cultures is empty nonsense. The ability to easily and cheaply travel the world has been their demise. What has moved us toward "globalization" at an ever more rapid pace is our increasing ability to do it cost effectively. As long as these corps write the rules for us we can not expect them to be beholden to arbitrary lines on a map. We can not expect them to be good citizens of anywhere unless we give them some legal obligation to do so. Globalization as you describe it has had some downsides. It has seen the west's total strangle hold on modern manufacturing broken. This is especially true in the developed world who had a total monopoly on mass production coming out of WWII that has since been diluted by trade and outsourcing policy written by said corps. The problems with pollution and the decline of western manufacturing communities are due to a lack of will to regulate industries on behalf of the respective constituencies in service to overt greed. The exact same greed the right often lauds as some kind of bizarre virtue. To problems of globalization are all economic and are directly tied to blind greed as mentioned. We are getting exactly what we should expect from corporations that have the ability to write trade policy to benefit them against that of their workers and the populations they serve The spin that economic globalization or support for manufacturing saving money by polluting is a left wing idea is ludicrous. A quick glance at who is deregulating said industry makes a lie of it. Every single right wing government in the west has put the polices driving it on steroids and ignoring that is myopic. You are attempting to link globalism with immigration and it is not valid. That large scale immigration is fairly new to Europe does not mean it's implications are not well understood and detached from your empty concerns. Your spin is actually identical to the backward Americans conservatives you seemed to deride. You are spitting the same nonsense they always have and are as wrong as they were. As for who liberalism benefits? Everyone including you who is far more liberal than your ISIS associates. The most conservative places on earth are universally considered backward freedom hating hell holes. They are universally repressive and advocating for that is a tough sell as I see no model among them to emulate. Freedom is not something the conservatives have ever valued as they are always about the status quo. They have been on the wrong side of every single fight for it. The economic totalitarianism you call globalism is an elitist concept populated by monsters that pretend to be both left and right wing but are really just self promoting greedy assholes that are ok with stepping over bodies for an extra dollar. They are not owned by the left and your spin they are is ignorant identity partisanship. Anyone that calls others "human filth" based on skin tone is a simple minded moron who is unlikely to be superior to anyone. You are the kind of loser that builds your own value on the effort of others while doing nothing of note yourself. Bigots like you are a problem as you promote stasis by swinging down not up. By doing so you consistently give cover and votes to the monsters you say you hate even as you own their spin.
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  3449.  Progressives Against the Regressive Left By your logic no one can support trump because all the actual Nazi's and white power freaks back him. Guilt by association is worse for Trump than Biden. But that aside these guys are not Biden fans outside he is no fascist. Joe is same asshole who helped author the hated 1994 CRIME BILL passed under that well known commie and Antifa hero Clinton. Joe voted for the Iraq war, the patriot act, etc, ect, ect. He is MIC controlled proven neo-liberal shill. Biden is is basically a 90' republican, he is only better than Trump because he is not overtly fascist. You should really avoid talking about the whole Antifa thing, I will tell you why. Antifa is bunch of unorganized, unfunded, powerless, un-led misfits whose single reason for existence is to oppose the examples of actual brown shirts that exist in our society. In opposing openly fascist militant groups who are willing to inflict violence as they advocate for policy that overtly marginalizes others they are not acting like historical brown shirts at all. They are in opposition to fascists, you get your first clue as it is in their name. There are literally no parallels between this group and the Brown Shirts. They are have no affiliation or representation with any party or even or a identified lobby organization. They have no voice or power or public input or direction, they are in no way the fascist enforcers you fear monger about. Back to why, to use this spin you have to ignore the elephant in the room that you pretend that Antifa does not oppose our actual version of the assholes you fear monger about. It points back to you and is therefore not the best your best argument. But hey, have at it,
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  3638. +Titus Orelius You stated the very clear reason why the process has some bias. If first choice goes to the father the mother has the exact same issue you attack coupled with the burden that she also just carried the child to term. I do not see an alternative method of determining primacy suggested in your response and I am interested in how you think we should apply this "equality" you pay lip service to. The fact there are innate biological differences is precisely why it works as it does. As I said before there is going to be inequity no matter who has primacy unless you have some better way of determining it. Such is the nature of the issue and it is not as black and white as you paint it. The whole tempest in a tea pot spin you have is mitigated by the fact joint custody is a Fathers option if both he and the mother are willing to take equal responsibility for the care and raising of the child. That the woman gets to speak first is means little if the father wishes to be involved anyway. As to the standard of government paying for abortions. All the readers should who are concerned should be comforted to know that not one penny of federal money can or has been spent on abortions since the Hyde amendment in 1976. Your hopelessly dated question about the nonsexistant issue of government funded abortions has been a non issue for couple of weeks now. She may be against paying for anyone's child period. It is interesting that many fiscal conservatives who are against abortion at all costs and welfare spending also do not support you being a deadbeat. They would have you take personal responsibility instead of putting the cost on someone else while snow flaking behind social justice equality arguments.
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  3679. +Wolf  It is not a matter of if they do that but when as the dems are not even trying to appeal to a large segment of the base.   It is how they are paid losers and keep the spectrum pointed to the right.   If it was not this time they put some insane clown in charge it would be the next.   As long as there is no option between right and right light the right will always win as there will be little enthusiasm from the left for the option.  This was especially true this cycle after being dismissed and ignored by the candidate chosen to represent them. (As it turns out with exposed chicanery which did not help)  Clinton pushed the bubble too far and promised no change against a guy who actually appealed to his base no matter how repulsively he did that.  She excited no one and many I know who voted for her were actually voting against trump.  That has to end.  Obama won with a large segment of the population because people thought he was progressive, even if they did not understand the term.  He excited an element of the base that simply stayed home this time.  He was popular with them because they expected change from him.  Obama did not win by pretending to be republican light but an actual champion of the people.  We all know the truth of that deception now but if we are talking about what gets people to the polls this is it.   They (the donors) have been driving the GOP further and further right into insane previously unimaginable territory and it pulls the dems to the right as well,  against public opinion.  It is inevitable at some point people will just stop voting for the "lessor" evil while getting the status quo and give up on the system entirely.   Now this is terrible as they allow the trumps to happen, but this should be expected.  I would not be surprised if this is exactly what the powers that buy our elections want as it plays into their hands tied in with campaigns of voter suppression hidden under the guise of fighting "fraud".  Under the Hillary/Donald choice they knew they would win with Hillary anyway and if trump ended up winning because Hillary was their shill and people hate that,  bonus.   Bottom line, we need to break this strangle hold on our system or we will never have people that represent us.
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  3680. Greg Torrez You are wrong.  We bend over backwards to protect freedom of religion for everyone not just the local faith.  The moment anyone breaks the law or seeks to harm another because of their god tells them to they should be busted.  But the automatic demonization of Muslims is monumental fail and represents ignorance personified.  The moment we let religious extremists of any brand have power they seek to crush all opposition including a lack of belief and the moment we let you freely attack any one faith we give you the power to crush any of them. No progressive defends a jihadist, we just stop you from trying to tar all people of a group with the same brush.  Your idiot simplistic spin is counter productive and misses the point.  If the real bad guys are ever going to be stopped then we will need  the help of moderate Muslims and attacking them for something they are not doing has no value in that process.   Progressives stand against radicals of all stripes all the time and attempting to put us in the same camp as suicide bombers is nonsense.  The fact is our conservative Christians have far more in common with them than any progressive.  Like the radicals of Islam they hate  anyone who disagrees with them and seek to attack them general principle in the name of their faith.  That your own extremist group dislikes us both does not mean we share anything.  Your predictable hatred is all we have in common. To answer your question, no you can't "get this one" because it appears you have your head up your ass with spin not connected to reality.
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  3733. ***** ID is not gaining any momentum in the scientific community.  If it is gaining it as a propaganda hit piece in service to a rich fact free form of religious dogma.   There is NOTHING that validates ID or refutes what the all non dogmatic researches have found for the last 150 years.  ID has been rejected by the US supreme court as surreptitious religious dogma and they could not prove any scientific merit supporting it.  NONE.  When you say it is a just a theory you give insight into your own ignorance.  A theory in science is the closest science ever gets to definitively asserting anything.  It is an idea that has so much proof it is a scientific theory and there is no higher standard of verification. One embraces something like evolution because you have looked at the data and it is unrefuted.  It requires zero faith.   You embrace ID for religious reasons, projecting your own failure onto science is not very compelling as  you have no data for any of your assertions and take them on faith.  ALL of the "controversy" is manufactured and there are answers to every nonsense  question ID asks.  They base their spin on assumed ignorance and misdirection and exploit a innate desire of the faithful to blindly swallow dogma.  The questions you would ask have been asked and answered. That the leaders of your movement pretend they have not is an example of how they lie to you to support their fact free religious view point against all we know.  To teach the "controversy" is to sell religious ideas not attached to the data, it is invalid and if you want to misinform your children do it at home. 
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  3744. Warrior Woman Our social safety net is a tiny fraction of our budget compared to what is spent in other first world countries.  Our benefits lag far behind the rest of the developed world, there is no way to qualify it any other way.  The only places behind us in any social support metric are places no one looks up to and abject poverty is a way of life for many.  What you argue for is for us to become more like the 3rd world and that is a very tough sell to those of us who know what a change like that means.   On health care, spreading the cost across us all makes it cheaper for us all.  This is why every other first world system is public.  We spend the most money out of everyone on the planet and get the 37th best results while not covering our entire population. Every other 1st world system has a public element and all of them rank above us.   Even if you do "pay for someone else" you pay less than you do here yet everyone is covered.  It is impossible to argue that we should be paying more while getting less and that is exactly what you fight for. When it comes down to your whining about force you have a pretty weak hand as you fight for the right to watch the poor die because they can not afford care.  You fight for the right for people to go bankrupt because they got sick.  You fight for the right to monetize and turn into profit an unavoidable element of being human causing an undo burden on business and the entire population.  Nothing you stand for is principled or fiscally responsible even as you pretend it is.
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  3756. ratatatuff Nato members should be free to expand defenses inside their boarders.  I do not blame them as Russia flex's it's own muscle and makes rumblings about taking back it's own, by force if necessary.   Nato was not involved in Ukraine, it was simple Russian heavy handedness and over reach that did Moscows control in.  When their puppet started to threaten to kill protestors under Moscow's orders they effectively severed their own control of the country by turning him into a monster that had to flee to safety with them.   Any assertion this was a done on behest of Nato is naked Russian propaganda, they own the whole mess. If the idea of people protesting against the state's right to kill you if you disagree with their policy is bad then by all means pretend it was a Nato sponsored coup. As a stop gap after that failure Russia then annexed Crimea because they did not want to lose access to some critical port facilities.  None of their public or private reasons make what they did acceptable or easy to overlook.  This is doubly true if you might stand in the way of their plans.  It only makes sense many Nato states want additional protection when next door is a dangerous war monger who has said it wants to get the band back together at all cost.  You are going to work hard to convince me the Nato democracies in tandem are more dangerous than the Russian dictatorship who shown a taste for control of not just their country but others as well.   
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  3770. Red Pill I do not have to shut you down, you have no power. I have answered every single nonsense assertion you have made and I am pretty sure at this point you have not read a word I typed except to look for phrases that trigger you. Modern socialism has nothing to do with the promotion of the rich and its history is far less of concern than what it stands for now. It is akin to the brands in Scandinavia or that we had in the days before our golden years of the late 40's. As you babble about dependency on the state it hides of a euphemism for the creation of the shanty towns and crowds of abject poor we see in the 3rd world. It is a literal race to the bottom handing control to the rich and powerful with no check on them. This does nothing for almost anyone except the very very few at the top and is step on the path to true tyranny. The price of paying a pittance in taxes is more than worth the society we live in and all of the "free" societies in the world are nothing but backward holes. If your spin had any merit you would have at least one success story, the fact is you do not. I support Marx the same amount you do, not at all. Your silly straw man field of pretending anyone left of you is a communist is ridiculous. It is base stupid pretending what I am arguing for is remotely similar to communism and it is the goal of no one of importance. To pretend otherwise is dishonest or base dumb. I hate no one, and I consider no one "better than me". That some have more resources because of luck, guile or connections does not make them better. I do believe that we should all pay our share and when you have much more it is more than reasonable you pay more as you gain more benefits not to mention you can afford it without changing your life. There is nothing envious or hateful about that position and it is more than arguable your defense of greed and hoarding does not exactly ring of virtue. Your assertions are the same fact free nonsense I see from your ilk. By your spin it seems you have a declaration from the courts that backs you up. It in fact is not unconstitutional or a challenge would have already been brought. Please cite the case that you base your claim on because I do not see one. What you and your friends think is unconstitutional means as much as what my dog thinks. Cite the case that backs you up or stop making dishonest assertions. The last 40 years since 1970 have seen a massive transfer of wealth from the middle class to the richest. This is attached to the relaxing of campaign laws starting around that time. Over time corporations and the super rich have bought our leaders and have shaped trade, tax and labor policy to favor them transferring vast amounts of wealth from the massive productivity of modern workers while leaving salaries flat absorbing all gains. The current crop of leaders at a federal level on both sides are paid shills of who ever dumps cash in their elections. This has been facilitated by the same people who promote your ultra libertarian spin which would only empowers them further. Our failures and decline are not attached to socialist policy and we have the weakest social safety net in the first world and the most expensive mess of "free market" heath care anywhere. Until we vote for leaders who make decisions based on their constituencies needs and their own principles we will continue to see decline. The costs you point to are not a hindrance to business and in fact it ensures the stable prosperous clean market they need to make money. Those are all costs and in any given business they represent a tiny fraction of all costs of production. No one is just breaking even because of regulations and complaining they are all bad is silly as some are more certainly necessary. Talk about specific regulations and how the harm business and we are likely to agree, blame all the failures on them and you are not going to be attached to reality. I would argue they should not force employers to offer health care at all and instead offer an option for everyone to opt into a public program. I think we should be able to buy into private programs as well forcing real competition. I do not think I am smarter than the founders of the country but I have almost 250 years of perspective on my side they never did. They never expected the country to remain static and added a facility for amendments for a reason. Since then things have changed and that you want to roll back to the 1700's quaint but has all the value of a horse and buggy. You sir are part of no majority and have not been in living memory. You guys did not even win the popular vote forgetting the fact it is a safe bet even most of trumps voters do not buy your spin.
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  3805. sausagemcbean We agree people should be paid what they are worth, that they are not  is the problem.  Value and productivity has little to do with pay as we have increased productivity exponentially while wages have been flat or gone down with the people at the top pocketing that money.  The goverment needs to step and ensure that a basic wage is paid so we do not have to subsidizes their workers and if the company can not pay a basic min wage they need to go away and make room for other successful business.  History has shown that there is no down side to the min wage and spin to the contrary are not based on facts.  Increasing the money that is circulating in the system raises demand and that is the only thing drives hiring. We do not have to imagine what happens when we raise the min wage the data is in and it does nothing but help. It is only your assertion that those civil servant jobs useless influenced by your fact free vision of the world that clearly shows you do not know what they do.   It is a pretty common canard that you people call taxes theft that is not shared by the vast majority of all populations that simply do not see it that way.  Most understand that there is value in goverment even if we all agree it could be done better.  Your spin is not attached to reality and is rejected by anyone who does not share your narrow simplistic vision of the way economics and a state functions.  I have heard the mugger analogy before (you guys love it) and its no more valid this time the the 1000's of times it has been used before.  Muggers never give you anything as they rob you and that you pretend the taxation is the same is not true.  I call you shills and morons as logic and actual information never has anything to do with your narrative.  The fact is your pie in the sky vision has not ever existed in the modern era and could not survive contact with reality.  You do not in fact have arguments yourself but instead fall back on tired talking points and weak ass spin instead.  You are not offering any viable options and your attempted pretense that you are is misdirection and not true.  You try again and this time come up with something a little more original as few are buying what you are selling and those that do are not that sharp or are shills that hope to benefit personally.
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  3881. magottyk You are incorrect, there is no double standard here.  I was simply applying your argument to another court case and this time justifiably.  You were trying justifying India's 25% conviction rates with a claim of no evidence.  That does not hold water when everyone else can get a rate from 40 to 75%.  There is a failure in the system in India and nothing you shared validates this spin.  It was you who used the argument about about not enough info when it was rape but call it a double standard when I apply it to the people you want to see prosecuted.  Physician heal thy self.  I never disagreed that there were miscarriages of justice.  We have innocent people on death row for heaven sake.  The way it works makes sense and that you want to put the victim on trial is bullshit.  People are innocent until proven guilty and that you assume a crime is committed every time a man is accused of rape is impossible to justify.  This is exactly what I was talking about when I said your changes would demonize all victims in the name of protecting what are mostly rapists.  A woman's sexual history should have zero bearing on her charging rape.  Upon reflection the anonymity thing does not make sense when we do not extend the same thing to people accused of murder or child molestation. Rape is not a special case.  Here is a tip, people accused of anything are generally considered guilty in the eyes of many and guaranteed to be vilified without evidence.  Woman accused of sex crimes are now seeing jail time,  they do not get the blanket dismissal that they might once have had.  The fact that woman so rarely commit sex crimes probably has something to do with why it was perceived differently. 
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  4238.  @antcap66  Blaming co-morbid's for the deaths of most of these patients is silly. It is like blaming the sudden stop after a patent is shoved out of a ten story building instead of who pushed them. I am not a consumer of main stream media. Your assumption I am is natural but unfounded. There is no virus agenda, there is nothing to be gain those who were already in charge did not have. In fact is their apple cart that is turned over and there is no upside in promoting a world wide shut (that is still partially in effect the world over) as some kind of hoax. The people with the power to do this gain nothing from fucking up their cash cow. I have seen no remotely valid reason why anyone would do this or an explanation of what you think they get. We are in agreement that it more radically effects nursing homes and has a very high mortality rate in those facilities. It speaks to how poorly we have managed the pandemic and that suggests the experts were learning as they went or did not have the ear the politicians who could actually enact the change. The common flu killed 34,000 people last year. It was considered one of the most deadly and pernicious virus's in the population. With that said, outside some partial inoculations against specific strains and no social distancing or any other precautions it killed less than a quarter this one has. We are not done the year yet. I think we can agree that these two pathogens are not the same and probably should not be compared as similar. Covid 19 is novel virus, this means the human immune system has no counter to it. None. It means every person starts the fight from zero, those with strong immune systems generally fare pretty well with a low count of long term disabilities and deaths. It is particularly dangerous to the elderly and anyone that is immunocompromised or sick with something else they are currently battling. The reason the virus is such a social health issue is the danger to vulnerable populations but the significant percentage that require hospitalization if allowed to spread unchecked. The fact it can be spread by asyomtomic vectors it is both air borne and spread by contact with mucus membranes in the form of droplets from peoples mouths when they talk means it spreads quickly in close contact. I have done a lot of research both from medical professionals but also in the annals of where you draw your inspiration. I find it much more plausible this is a real pandemic run by assholes who are learning on the job than part of a grand conspiracy by evil genius's all seeking some dubious and unmentioned reward for turning the world upside down and pissing everyone off.
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  4244. ​ @stephenrobinson3301 The numbers out of Israel are concerning. But it should be noted in a country that is highly vaccinated nearly half of those contracting the virus are not vaccinated. A tiny minority makes up half of the infected because they have NO protection at all. Israeli numbers are like a vaccine commercial if you do not dishonestly attempt to spin things as worse now for the vaccinated. Look at the death counts for england this week compared to last January. They had 688 deaths this week, any given day from mid to late January was over 1000. There has never been a claim the vaccine protects you entirely. That was never the goal of this drug. It was to give you protection and a resistance to a novel virus you had no protection from. The vaccines very effectively protect against the strain they were developed for. Less so against the new variant even though they clearly still have value if we look at the numbers in the places you cite. Your claim to censorship in the peer reviewed and professional community is empty There is no world wide conspiracy. The experts DO NOT SUBSCIBE to your faith based nonsense because the data does not support it. Science has a built in mechanism to counter your concerns unlike your gut/ignorance based claims. When almost every expert thinks you are wrong it rarely validates you. If you have data bring it forward, publish it and you can win the Nobel prize. We both know you have nothing of the kind. I have spoken enough with you medical Mennonites to know what your silly arguments are based on misinformation, misinterpretation or overt lies.
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  4377.  @bearyhot  I can list the good qualities of conservatives, I needed to understand them in more detail to better communicate with them. Most do not overtly back white supremacy but end up tacitly supporting it because they stand beside actual hard core racists who also contribute to the narrative. From an outsiders perspective Sherry's opinion has some generic merit. Conservativism is literally about group think, conformity and promotion of the status quo. This is easily confused as racism when the status quo has deep racist underpinnings from our past that in living memory were the standard and have not been erased. I disagree with her that all conservative are morons, most of just unsophisticated or poorly informed on key issues but they are not innately stupid or greedy. Their leaders consistently represent the worst traits of the group. I would argue that these conservatives leaders either cynically say stupid things to appeal to the base or have been convinced of nonsense themselves. The people who really understand the platform and what the GOP actually fights for are pretty bad people and are consistently greedy or directly seek policy that enriches their ingroup as a focus. Most conservatives are not that brand of fail. They are otherwise good people that have swept up by terrible leaders because their primary focus is continuity and moving toward a rosy picture of some imagined past they idealize. That is what the GOP sells. They have been tricked and misdirected by empty wedge issues and overt misinformation about those they oppose as not just in opposition but as evil. Any group that radically demonizes the another does so to bind them closer and helps the individual dismiss the ideas of others as wrong before evaluation. This is a 2 for 1 as it effectively strawman's opposing policy while satisfying a deep need to belong that is desired by the conservative mind. In the case of policy I do not see the two groups as equal in the veracity of what they demand. The conservatives have become overt tools of corporates lackeys' as have those who worship establishment democrats. Both these political leadership's would focus on identity nonsense over change in pursuit of the stasis that their donors love. One party has independent non corporately owned leadership and one does not. Until the conservatives steak some ground away from the corporatists they will consistently be called greedy and racist by outsiders because of who owns them and a blind need to defend broken things just because they are a legacy. There is a strong as of yet unanswered desire among the conservative electorate to change this dynamic. The Tea party and more recently their broad support for Trump shows a deep desire to move away from the status quo of the old school establishment republican leadership. This is clear recognition their existing leaders have been deeply problematic even before the orange man baby came along to break the republican mold and throw them into chaos.
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  4714. There are biases in every single media source, this one says theirs up front at least. They are honest about it unlike most of the other media. If you see both sides of this debate it is clear this is a nuanced issue that the Charlie's of this world are not only hypocritical on but lie about. His spin is bigoted and ideological not balanced, finding the middle ground between being a fringe hate and being thoughtful will often put you in the camp of the bigots. You do you, but that is not a principled place to live. There were plenty kids not getting in because of race in the past and i suspect the removal of controls will see a decrease in their numbers. Going forward the schools will only chase the cash and go back to serving the richest alone regardless of race. You will note that Charlie says nothing about legacy admissions. Legacy admissions are affirmative action for the rich but you will not hear any of the bigots or your "both sides" ilk pointing out that truth. The joke is based on just raw talent white males are getting in ever less, there may be a day in the near future that your hero will be crying for white male AA. He is already playing victim hood card really hard. The system has always had a version of AA promoting the powerful. It will continue to in order to give the elites an extra leg up that they always had. Not a peep from you "both sides" clowns who make apologies for and plainly ignore systemic inequities built into the system at the core. You are spitting the spin of elites and monsters like you are the reasonable one, you are not and the people you stand beside are hard core bigots even if you are not.
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  4860.  @stopwritingthatreplyjohnat6638  They are on the same party but I struggle to buy the do nothing bullshit they are on the same team, they are supported by entirely different means. Force the vote was a distraction with emotional appeal and it was weaponized to attack the only unowned representatives in congress as identical to the establishment sellouts who run it. Ryan was always up front stating his expectation of what Biden would achieve and never pretend he would be anything but the corporate hack he was. He did not apologize for Biden but explained what the votes were and what they options might be in a very honest if not clinical way. At no time was he an apologist for the establishment failure. To say he was makes the term lose all meaning and to me sounds like more of the same bullshit I have always heard from the right as a distraction for those they dislike. He is for all the polices you pretend to support. That the establishment leadership is and always was bought by the highest bidder is not his fault nor did he ever paint them as anything but what they are. There were moves to get these key policies done and he reported on them. But any hope it was going to be biden pushing them through was not built on spin from people like Ryan. Ryan for example made it clear he did not expect Biden to be warrior on anything. Ryan may be a bit too boring or technical for some viewers. What he is not is a shill and you look deeply ignorant or like a psycho partisan who hates his allies as you try.
    4
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  5498. Greene Fyre Total nonsense,  you sound like trump making excuses before the election while expecting to lose.  If Bernie would have been in the election he would have crushed Mr. Pussy grabber.  The down ticket races would have worked out differently too if we had a candidate that actually excited the people.  You will never motivate most normal people to vote when they are voting for the potential leader  they hate less.  People want to vote for a leader they like, for all trumps many many faults he had elements of that within his base and Hillary at best was the lessor of two evils for many even those who reflexively vote democrat. We won huge with Obama's first term because democrats were mobilized and motivated.  We lost ground in the second not because of election fraud because it turned out Obama was business as usual and people lost interest and faith in him/democrats, the results reflect that.     The fact is at least fully half of the democrats had zero reason to be excited about this campaign and our turnout and the election results reflect that.  We had less people turn out and that will ALWAYS favour the republicans, this is the root of the reason for GOPS (and dnc establishment in the primaries) attempt to restrict the number of voters.  In the last cycle DNC fought to get rid of progressives running for them and replaced them with establishment whores who then lost and you are shocked we are doing badly?  We have been running losers against the GOP time and again and that republican light is losing to actual republicans should not be a suprise.  We need candidates that actually represent the interests of working people and do not just talk a good game and then act like Bush light once in power. Bernie proved there is a huge untapped constituency to draw from that the establishment on both sides of the fence wants to write off.  The Republicans and establishment democrats are the only ones that benefit from your spin and you fight to effectively do nothing.  As long as you are cool with that have at it but that is all you are achieving. 
    3
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  5502. Doctor Detroit He will be backed by the GOP and he will march lock step with them through his presidency. That you imagine he is going to be anything but a rubber stamp for the regressive nonsense they push shows you have not been paying attention. One of two things will happen. He will just do what they want him to (and there is no reason he will not) or the GOP will impeach him and put thier water boy Pence in. Either way your vote for an "outsider" will amount to nothing as the GOP is fully owned and does not even pretend not to be. The "populist" things Donald said in the campaign will never see the light of day and he will rubber stamp every single tax cut and budget exploding measure they put on his desk. I was completely and irrevocably instructed this election cycle about how corrupt the dems are. But it is clear no one highlighted the fact the GOP has been and will continue to be worse. It appears you never got the memo about the GOP who never saw a donor idea they did not like and every policy they push is establishment backed. Hillarys main problem was she was too much like them and there is no reason to expect donald to stand on principle here. The greedy clowns who run your party will be taking advantage of a win even they did not expect. Being told to stay in mommies basement by an ignorant child is not compelling. If you are not a child that doubly sad as you are using weak half ass canned spin that only resonates with other losers like you and is empty and meaningless.
    3
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  5582. ChristianMission Shrug, you could say without Islam we would not have math. The truth is Islam does not get credit for those advances either and Christianity does not get credit for the ones you claim. The barbarity of Christianity was not what brought us forward and it was only with the advent of secularism and freedom from the confines of religious thought that we really started to take off and prosper. We in the west advanced in spite of chrsitianty not because of it. The more we freed ourselves of religious law the better we have done. This is exactly the path that Islam has to follow if they are ever to mitigate the worst elements of fundamentalism that trouble them today. I am secularist that means I value freedom of religion and freedom from it. I see religious law as a wholly destructive force that has always held humanity back. I would fight for your right to believe whatever nonsense you want but would fight just as hard to restrict your ability to push your faith into law. Freedom to believe whatever you want is the corner stone of secularism and attempting to equate it with the promotion of atheism is a fail and not remotely valid. A focus of the state not promoting your nonsense is not a promotion of atheism no matter how hard you try to pretend it is. I am not an authoritarian and believe in freedom unlike you and ISIS or any of the assholes who push for a state religion or restrict individual religious rights. I stand in opposition to the USSR, China and all authoritarians because I know that I do not have to subvert a religion by law to empower my views. You project your perspective onto me and the fact is we share nothing. I am not like you and that you imagine I am the mirror image of your failure is the first thing you have to correct to get where I am coming from. You are the only slave here and your dogma proudly proclaims it.
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  5614. whyamimrpink78 Again contact with your version of reality brings you to a completely opposite conclusion than anyone outside your bubble recognizes as truth.  Unions are often the only protection for non skilled jobs and are the  type of jobs that most benefit from unionization.  For these types of jobs a union ensures worker safety, job continuity and greater pay.  The idea they place there is a cap on success is a joke as we have seen non unionized labor's pay stagnate for the last 35 years.  The only thing that encourages the "job creators" to share their profits with the people that work to produce them is legislation or a union that forces them to.  Wages have been flat or have actually declined in this era where we have far fewer unions to fight on workers behalf.  This is anecdotally true even from your own rhetoric.  I hear it often said by the right that union workers are paid to highly,  you can't have it both ways that union workers are paid too well and the union stagnates their success. People formed unions to get better wages and working conditions as employers had no interest in either.  The idea that unions were dreamed up by politicians is more bullshit from the right who does not care about anything they say being attached to facts.  That unions then turned their attention to seeing laws passed that served their workers is the only reason we have the limited labor laws we do today.  What you call politicians buying votes the sane call them doing their job and severing their constituency. There should certainly be public unions, just like any job people have the right to band  together to get better pay and benefits and who pays them should not change that.
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  5655. Red Pill So? It does not mean anything of the kind and your defense of useless and needlessly expensive insurance companies is not a rally cry of freedom but treadmill of tyranny to their profit. There is nothing that is working in favor of "freedom" for the vast majority as it ties them to jobs they need just to ensure their family is covered. We are stifling innovation and the entrepreneurial spirit to foster a dependence on insurance giants who have no other goal but to make profit. Health care is not a free market commodity and when you need care you often do not have the luxury of shopping around. No matter what you are going to "buy" the product. It is the sale of oxygen and just like selling air it means some are not going to be able to afford it and will die if the only way to get it is to pay money they do not have. If you point at the emergency room loop hole you are using the most expensive form of taxpayer funded health care and it is literally pouring our money down a hole with bodies at the bottom of it You are in favor of a bankrupt system that bankrupts its victims not because of taxes but because of ridiculous health care bills. Your position is untenable to the educated. One way or another the only way a system works is if someone insures it. Single payer systems are simply insurance systems funded by the state with no profit motive and a mandate to provide care. They help control costs and ensure everyone get the medical care they need in a much more efficient and seamless way than the expensive and convoluted way we do it.
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  5679. stegokitty 1) It is not a matter of belief because that is not what defines a historical account.  Independent verification is the only thing that makes something historical.  In the case of the flood, there is nothing that confirms a world wide flood let alone the huge list of painful inconsistencies with the story that make it more like a fairy tale than an account to be taken seriously. 2) Flat out false unless you are talking about the time before we had actual archeologists.  Before we used the scientific method we had theologians making wildly incorrect claims about the origin of sites based on the biblical musing and their innate cultural bias and not fact. Almost all of their "discoveries" have since been reclassified as false as we looked at evidence and not some dogmatic gut feeling.  The bible is referenced primarily by a specific sub group of people and only on issues associated with a relatively small area in the middle east.  Your assertion is fact free. 3) Your ignorance of what I know of the bible makes your assessment meaningless. 4) This does not surprise me, I will not be seeing it either for a whole other reason. 5) Respect and fear are not should not be akin to each other in the mind of those who are not craven.  I respect people and institutions who earn it but would NEVER respect anyone I fear.  Making movies is about money for Hollywood and there is no reason to make a movie that would cost more in cash and hassle than it would make. 6) That you are clueless about the nature of the religiosity in the united states is hilarious and not based on reality. The US has a huge and influential group of of dogmatic fundamentalist Christians who attempt to influence policy at every turn and we are counted as among the most conservative of the developed nations because of it. Your claims about bible the bibles veracity are simplistic fiction.  People are free to do what the want to to any story in it.  That it is sacred to you means you should be accurate in the movie you make but means nothing about what others choose to do.
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  5720. sausagemcbean Workers are not paid what they are worth, their salary is determined by what the market for the job dictates. That is not always based on value and the fact is employers will rightfully pay as little as they can get away with and still retain their workers. This is more problematic in low skill jobs when the economy is slower as the people who take them have few options. They are in a captive market and are forced to take what is being paid regardless of value.  No one is choosing winners and losers.  No group should be allowed to pay a wage that is too low and goverment has a responsibility to be involved as they are forced to pick up the slack.  We do not have to imagine what happens when the wages are raised as we already know.  Facts about what occurs when it is implement trumps your purely theoretical spin.  Our productivity is much higher than it was and none of that money has flowed back into the system and is being horded at the top.  You can see this trend in the income inequality growth and the diminishing consumer demand.  Your spin about saving has nothing to do with growth and it is only spending that drives it.  Calling taxation theft is a ploy by a specific group to demonize a basic function of every organized goverment since the beginning of time. To do so fundamentally mischaracterizes it in an attempt to frame the goverment in a way that suits your narrative.  There is no validity in doing so.  Theft is taking something while offering nothing in return and that is not the case here.  If the mugger provided your infrastructure, security and entire regulatory system you might have a point.  But then we would not likely call him a mugger would we. We are in agreement that things are in shambles but likely disagree on the reasons.  The fundamental issues innate to the way global monetary systems work is a huge problem outside the scope of this particular issue.  Arguing we should pay what the employers want to pay does nothing but empower them at the expense of society in general.  We are in complete agreement on ending corporate welfare and bank bailouts but that is unlikely as the our form of government as it is serves them and no longer works for it's constituency as a focus.
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  5721. sausagemcbean Workers are not paid what they are worth but what the market dictates and this is not driven by value but availability.  This is especially true of unskilled workers where they have few options to increase how much they are paid.  Our system is not a meritocracy as libertarians would like to assure us and wages instead are a function of worker availability and how easy to replace them not how much money they generate. The argument about if the government can impose a minimum wage to protect those that are most vulnerable to employer misuse is a debate you have already historically lost.  All we are talking about now is how much that rate is set at.  The goverment has a mandate to ensure those that are working full time still do not require public assistance just to make ends meet. A low minimum wage backed by food stamps is tax payer funded subsidy to employers that hire primarily unskilled workers.  Productivity rises as a direct result of an increase in worker productivity and your attempt to separate the metric from that truth is not valid.  Human beings through the use of technology are fundamentally more productive than they were 40 years ago and that is why that stat is reported as it is.  Our productivity has risen precipitously but our wages have not and that is very telling in the sphere of employee value. Saving has no innate value as the money saved is simply reinvested (not necessarily here) for a higher return by someone else.  The metric that matters as a employer is sales and that is wholly driven by spending.  The idea of printing unlimited money and throwing it around is not the same as putting the money already in circulation into the market thereby generating sales, jobs and all the benefits that spin off from that.  Our economy was at its best with strong middle class that had money to pump into the system.  As that class has shrunk and spending has retracted so has job numbers and the health or the economy in general.   The robbery assertion is not a fact,  it is spin demonizing an institution our system (and no other one either) could not do without.  Your desire to characterize taxes as theft resonates well with a certain kind of person but is not responsible or valid.  It is no less valid to say paying taxes is patriotic and I do not agree with that spin either.  Taxes are what they are, a necessary evil.  The best we can do is fight to ensure they are spent in a reasonable way that benefits the most.   If I do not pay my taxes it is me who is committing theft against every other tax payer by not contributing and that is why as a member of this society if I choose to opt out there are well understood ramifications that in theory should be the same for everyone. The fact is our tax money is often is not being spent wisely and those in control owe far too much to a tiny group at the top that funds them.  Until that changes debates about the best way to proceed or make changes will be academic.  Unless you are pumping millions of dollars into the election machine no one is listening.  In the mean time please know as you make an argument for no minimum wage you serve the handful at the top who are writing that narrative.
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  5767. Buzzbeat7268  This spin is nonsense,  it is not a religion and is based on empirical data unlike any assertion of faith.  In science they NEVER definitively prove anything but do come to conclusions based on the data we have and that system works pretty well in figuring things out.   Your false equivalency is not remotely valid.  95% of all peer reviewed papers support the idea of man made climate change.   The "scientists" who disagree are consistently shills paid by the fossil fuel interests to maintain the status quo longer.   Either way a theory backed up by data in science is not what you are pretending it is as no one on the scientific side is simply guessing and have to back up every claim they make in a public forum you are free to join. No one should care what you or anyone who is ignorant of what is being asserted thinks.  Your opinion on this should be valued as highly as my 6 year olds is.  We addressed the issue of acid rain because we actually made changes that reversed the damage.  This is precisely what you clowns argue not to do now because the oil companies told you to. You are not open minded and I suggest you follow your own advice.  Follow the dollars and it is clear who has a fiduciary motive to lie and misrepresent data and it is not the consensus of profession you slander with your own sides failure.   Don't be fooled you are arguing for the overt shill side of this debate and accusing the scientists of what you are guilty of.  Pointing to the daily wire does nothing but make you look more like a sellout.
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  5771. luvcheney1 You offer choice between "force" as you define it where I pay less, everyone is covered and there are no copays and a system that leaves the poor to die , sky rockets prices and charges double what those in public systems pay bankrupting a hundred thousand Americans a year. Selling the idea that insurance is a "voluntary" product is tough being that you if do not purchase it you will doom you or a supported family member to death or guarantee your bankruptcy. Health care is not a "nice to have" you should opt into as everyone will need it at some point in their lives and those who do not buy into insurance cost us all more later in emergency room care anyway. The right to opt out for "freedom" and against "coercion" at the cost of actual lives and all our public funds while we are charged double what someone in a public system pays is tough to sell as the moral high ground. The idea we should throw our elderly under the bus is another tough idea to sell to the sane. Arguing against health care as a right is going to be hard as your position boils down to we should let the poor and their children die because they can not afford insurance. You argue we should bankrupt and leave our seniors to die who are just retiring to fixed incomes after contributing to society their whole lives just as they move into a stage of life they need care the most. You are on no moral high ground and need to stop pretending you are with your faux outrage at inequity and a nonsense definition of fair. The key difference between a public and private system is who administers the fund and that everyone is included. Like all insurance the bigger the pool the more the risks and costs are mitigated for the whole group, the public system is the biggest insurance pool you can get. The system takes the pressure off business from providing health care and allows them to focus on what is important. It eliminates mountains pointless expensive bureaucracy and overhead created by the many insurance companies and consolidates it into one non profit organization focused on providing care not making money (gasp). It gives workers the freedom to take any job without worrying about having to find care on their own. That some clowns are not making billions off being middle men while providing no value does not concern me in the slightest. Paying half of what I pay now to the government instead of an insurance company is hardly onerous especially as now all Americans will be covered. I am surprised you use the term redistribution of wealth (and it is clear you support it in its current form) as it has been happening to us for the last 40 years, it would be nice to see it go the other way for a while. The wealth of the middle class has been redistributed to the rich and they have never been richer while the comfortable working class shrinks. The idea the mega rich who are absorbing all our gains should be paying more will never bring a tear to my eye especially as it puts more money in the hands of actual working people while ensuring we no longer deny care based on wallet size.
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  5826. Manly Commercials She has been lobbying to kill public education and set high standards for public schools and lower standards for her privately owned ones. She said it herself she favors accountability but not equal accountability between the systems. She does not care about the quality of children's education and is pushing an agenda that enriches either herself or some group she is part of at the cost of education. The charter schools she pushes do not do better job and she is part of the cancer who does not even want to hold them the to the same standards while setting up different metrics for public schools to make them look like failures. Pretending charter schools are the solution to our education problems is betrayed by the fact the best systems did not solve their problems the same way. Our schools systems failures have NOTHING TO DO WITH COMPETITION and that is a stupid talking point not connected to reality. No one else has solved their problems this way and our public school system suffers because of assholes like this harridan purposely undermining it and setting up standards and funding that harm it to sell their greed based solutions. An objective view does not lead one to your conclusions and it is your spin is counter factual and you defend the partisan side of this debate. EVERY SINGLE SYSTEM that rates better than ours is public. The very best system in the world is focused on a very public centrally control structure that focus's on children's needs and not breaking the system to make some billionaire another billion to throw on the pile at the expense of our education system. I have done extensive research on this subject and it would be partisan to pretend her views are what educators the world over would choose. The fact is the best in the world do not agree with her spin and that she does snot even know the basic terms associated with education speaks to how unqualified she is.
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  5828. magottyk But you know when I was talking about bad police work and poor investigation I was speaking solely about India.  To try to call me a hypocrite because I want justice done in all situations (including when the claimant lies) is disingenuous and invalid.  I never have argued that prosecution of rape is easy or that the evidence is simple to come by.  You are straw manning position as you say I did.  There are great many of you who want a woman's sexual history included. The rape shield law was put in place because woman who reported rape were being put on trial and torn apart in court based on their sexual and reporting history.  So if a woman reports a rape multiple times and is never indicted for lying about it why should that be material to any case?  It is not unless she has shown herself to be committing criminal actions in misrepresenting the herself in court.  The sex crimes legislation was put in place to give the victims privacy and to encourage them to report criminals.  The accused rapist like anyone other accused criminal does not have the same rights and I do not see any reason they should and child molesters should not as their victims are also protected.  I simply do not see protecting accused rapists as a very high priority if we protect no other  accused criminal.   Is your assertion that woman commit sex crimes as the same rate as men?  You have nothing to back that up but go ahead and call me ignorant with nothing but bluster an bullshit.
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  5903. exiled68  Why coddle clowns who are bigots or support them?  They do not care they are bigots or they hurt people with their spin and that is why they are so objectionable.   If they were actually concerned about what they stood for they would change and asserting they should be treated with kid gloves as these are the same assholes who consistently spit total nonsense about the left is a tough sell.   I personally go into detail and explain why someone is a bigot if I bother to say it, not that it makes any difference.  People know what they are and just get comfortable with bad ideas.  The fact is the spin that the "left" should not  call them out at all is empty nonsense.  Yes you are being judged.  In this forum you get labeled not based on what you think but what you support and what you say as the information is limited.  Attacking the left for calling out bigots while ignoring the right does not make you right winger just poorly focused but it does speak to your state of mind.   The complaint rings as empty in an environment where right has gone off the rails and consistently supports overtly toxic policy much of it actually racist.   That you are more concerned about what the "left" is doing speaks to your proclivity as you again ignore the brutal mess of psycho's and knuckle draggers the right advocates for.  You misrepresent our argument with this spin.  The idea the left should not call anyone a bigot is a right wing talking point of zero merit and it should be and is dismissed out of hand.
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  5941. v1v2x3 No, but then I do not do that. I do not want to align with buck tooth drop outs who are fundamentalist nut jobs who married their sister like you do either. I call all violence criminal unlike your fascists on the right who only whine when the violence is against them. Where was your concern when trump supporters were beating peaceful protesters as a daily event? Honor killings and kids that kill themselves because they are gay and their parents hate them because "god" happen but they are all part of a cancer I universally oppose. Fundamentalists of all stripes are cancer but in a secular society their violent actions dictated by their sick god are considered a fail. I do not support them and never will. I do support their right to worship as they choose but they should not expect law ever back or step aside for any of their nonsense. You do know the Muslims you hate so badly are also Conservative don;t you? The ones who want sharia law are not liberals in any way shape or form. I fight for the right of people to worship as they choose as long as their nonsense hurts no one else and is not expected to be law. Your characterization of what liberals fight for is just not attached to reality as the clowns in question have far more in common with you than me. I am someone that believes in individual freedom and equality for everyone. I am the kind of liberal that thinks everyone should be treated equally and that free speech and faith are a shield against extremists shoving their garbage down our throats. You are con, a fear filled clown who misrepresents all he opposes because you imagine your opponents are a mirror image of your own failures. You have no idea what a liberal is and even your bizarre attempt to classify me ends up saying far more about you than it does me. Nice work that it says nothing good and validates my first impressions of you, I do like to be proven right.
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  5976. Artan Xhezairi The death of Saddam and the birth of ISIS are directly linked.   They arbitrarily deposed basically secular military leadership who joined with ISIS when we handed the country to the radicals of the other faction.  Saddam like him or hate him was and essentially secular dictator that once held the radical elements we now fight in check.  The country is a cluster fuck construct that would never be a peaceful state as it is really trying to cram a whole wak of people who hate each other together. Saddam no matter what an ass hat he was did exactly what was needed to hold it together.   The moment Bush created a the power vacuum he did with his no post war plan invasion he created ISIS.  The equipment and money and the effort we poured in through bushes terms all benefited the birth of ISIS.   For a group like ISIS to grow chaos is needed and that is exactly what the neo cons created with their Iraq policy.  The middle east is a cluster fuck of bad policy choices dating back a long time, almost all of  them are about controlling oil and if you look at Iraq the same applies.  If you imagine that the Bush clowns gave a rats ass about human rights you are not attached to reality and gloss over the shit they did. You are dreaming if you think this is the fault of Obama and anyone who looks at the history of these groups can see what birthed them.   None of it would have happened without Iraq and it took our military to take that asshole down and ISIS for all their "scary" power are not us.  That is doubly true if they never had the military leadership we trained while Saddam was fighting Iran on our behalf that we kicked to the curb expecting they would just go away.   The poor planning of the Iraq war is wholly to blame for the cluster fuck we face now, it is that simple.  The only ones who think different are the neo cons and even then many have correctly distanced themselves from Iraq.
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  6337.  @NewNormalWorldOrder  No one is getting beaten you drama major. You get a ticket. Your straw men are so weak it makes me feel bad for you to read them. Who has demanded documents saying one does not have the virus unless you were suspected of having it? How is basic common sense tyranny? If you have been tested as a matter of public health you should be following public health protocol to save others lives. Not sure why you would not want to prove you had a test, not that anyone really asks. Locking down the world was necessary in this unprecedented emergency. It was the not the only thing to do to save lives. There were many ways to do this. Some countries like Germany nationalized wages and ensured everyone was paid so nothing closed. Others mitigated job loss by freezing rent and mortgages. Our problem is government fucked up and gave trillions to the richest to ensure no one lost their job and then they fired everyone anyway. The reason this pandemic response is impoverishing us is a direct failure of our government to support the correct people. The shut down was necessary either way but the only thing tyrannical about it was who they bailed out and who they left to rot. You have a mistaken standard medical health rules for tyranny. It seems like a pretty silly mistake to make. Rules around quarantine and isolation of people with a potentially deadly virus's is not a new thing. Pretending it is looks ignorant. You have sovereignty but fail to acknowledge you live in a community with others. Basic protocols like this are required for it to function. You not being able to follow basic annoying but non invasive rules marks you as an psychopath or anarchist. If you can not abide these simple restrictions that save others lives the problem is you not the society around you. As to the strange question with the soul thing, I don't care very much where I go. If I go anywhere I will see when I get there, not sure how that will work without my brain but why not hope for the best. Better than just rotting I suppose. That being said I see no reason to throw a dart and pick one of the ten thousand charlatans who tells us they know. What is your spin on this soul question? Since you asked me.
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  6423. JAY MIDDY Why do you imagine I excuse our government bombing anyone? Why do you imagine I am unaware of the fact our "liberal democracy" supports 70% of the world dictators? Why do you imagine I am not aware of the fact our government is sale to the highest bidder on both sides? Why do you think I am concerned about attendance at "frat parties"? I do care if one citizen here fights to systematically marginalize another because of stupid counter productive bigoted reason. I do this because I believe personal freedom and equality of opportunity should be the corner stone of our system. I can care about bigots and the issues you describe, I am not restricted in that way. I see no allies on anything I stand for in the crowd of bigots you want me to ignore because of other things I also oppose. Bernie got cheated because he actually cared about the people and was progressive. He was not focused on the donors and so they just barely succeeded in marginalizing him as their ideas not popular on the left. They are not acting on our behalf or according to our principles and so they had to cheat to win. Pretending what i said is about a party is myopic as I never once mentioned the democrats establishment or otherwise. That the establishment democrats have abandoned liberal principles does not mean those principles do not exist or that there is no right wing to fight. The world is and has been backward for a long time and no matter how many terrible things you can point at there is no reason not to stand against overt bigots who marginalize and hold back people based on nothing but skin color. I could not disagree with you more as there MOST CERTAINLY A RIGHT WING for me to fight. The people who vote for the right are the same people who universally support the policy you outlined even as both parties do it.
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  6447.  @rsync9490  Nonsense and this is a talking point with no merit. The most efficient and highly rated education systems on the planet are public. The problem with our system is how funding is distributed and the fact we face an open effort to undermine it by the very people you advocate for so they can make profit. They plainly pay leaders to mess up our education system in order to justify them taking over. What is really inefficient is having many individual for profit bureaucracies that all have overhead and a profit motive rather than a well funded centralized system that ensures continuity and common standards. There is no working example of an education system that is better served by "competition" and this is a talking point from corps to undermine our public system by further splitting needed funding. The schools you refer to are in fact not better rated and often do poorly compared to even our challenged public system. They also end run common standards on behalf of lobby groups who drive them. If you want a religious education you should pay for it not the tax payer. That our system has failed some people is no argument we should hand it over to corporations whose primary focus is not education but turning a profit and running duplicated bureaucracy with lower standards than the public system on our tax dollars. More money into programs to help those who need it is what is called for not handing it to a group of billionaires so they can throw more money on the pile.
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  6572.  @andrewdornan587  Short answer a deeper great depression coupled with a second wave of the infection worse than the first. All caused by the government's inaction in supporting good covid policy for it's citizens while giving trillions of our tax dollars to richest.. A synopsis of our leaderships actions to date: -Start with a slow and limited response downplaying it's potential threat. -They recognize the treat still move slowly, start blaming everyone from the Chinese to doctors who "hate "the economy for the issue. -Tell everyone there are lots of tests when in fact there are very few in most places that need them. -Then only bail out industry to the tune of 4 trillion giving almost nothing to workers. -Inform the base of possible home remedies like fish tank cleaner and injecting bleach as well as other misc products he may or may not have stock in. -Tell everyone there are lots of tests when in fact there are very few in most places that need them. -Have your senior covid task force members setup astro turf groups to fund the organization of protests. Drive desperate people who are out of money out to demand they go back to work exposing them to the virus and taking pressure off your bad policy. Once they achieve their policy goal and everyone is forced back to work everything goes pretty good for about 3 or 4 weeks as the economy surges with its renewed energy. About a month later the back to work order triggers the second wave of infection, this time costing hundreds of thousands of lives as resources already thin run out. All this cascades to total crash of the economy a which does not flourish as well as some apparently imagine it will in that environment I say that is worse.
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  6573.  @andrewdornan587  I rail against them gaming the system and paying our leaders to lower their taxes. I do not resent these peoples wealth, I resent that they do not play by the same rules we do. That they would make nothing without us and their workers undermines their individual value, almost anyone could fill their spot given the chance. Our system does not reward innovation if it challenges the status quo. Electric cars and new power generation options are a good examples of that. We now literally design our products to break after a couple years so they can sell you another one. A fridge that used to last you 30 years will now last you 8. That is the efficiency our system brings us. I am successful by most standards and I pay my share of taxes. I do not begrudge paying them because they are based on my income which is generous. Because I take greater benefits from living in this country it stands to reason to me that I pay more. Toss in the fact I can afford to and still live well takes away the sting. All this is even more true for those who make more than me. We do not buy any leaders to give us more tax breaks or ignore our tax havens. We do not get special bailouts because we shook the right hands or donated to the correct guy. I resent these rich assholes not going to jail when they illegally foreclose on a hundred houses stealing them to later get small fine they easily pay while you and I could get tossed in jail for not remembering to pay a speeding ticket. Some of the people who work hardest get paid the least. We do not live in a strait meritocracy. If we did you would have made a hell of lot more than 28k last year. You are an example that working hard and doing the right thing does not necessary reflect the money you earn. Thank you for your service.
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  6599.  @Bos2709  Good question for which there are good answers. This virus was novel meaning we literally have no defense for it. Before the inoculation the only way to get any immunol defense against this virus was to get the virus. That is problematic for a few reasons not the least of which is potential personal health issues but the chance you pass it on and continue the chain to others. The vaccines were designed to give you anti bodies to teach your immune system how to fight a virus your body had no defense for. It gives you tools to fight it without you getting the virus itself and becoming a potential transmitting vector. It is why those with the shot get the virus less frequently than those without. Those who are inoculated that do contract it have less severe symptoms, are hospitalized and die less frequently than the unvaccinated. The fact is the vaccine does make you largely immune to the original variant and continues to. The protection against it still sits had a very high efficacy rate in the high 90's with now hundreds of millions of shots issued. The vaccines are less effective against the new variant and that is the what is causing most of the break through cases in places like Israel and the UK. Deaths in both places are far lower among the vaccinated than the unvaccinated even though both places the unvaxed are the minority. There will likely be a booster more targeted at the delta variant going forward. Keep in mind this is a vaccine that was never developed to get 100% efficacy. It was designed to give you the tools to fight the virus without first getting it.
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  6768.  @idimo7976  I did not contradict myself at all. I see you erroneously linking the promotion of mono cultures and economic globalism. If they have any connection it is incidental as people seek to move where there is opportunity and a better class of life. Immigration has increased because it is easier and cheaper. That is not attached to globalization at all, it connected to the expansion of technology that has made the world a much smaller place. At one time people rarely went 50 miles from their home, those days are gone forever. So "they" did not. Any assertion "they" did is silly. There are economically right wing liberals and they are the problem as much as economically right wing conservatives. Liberalism is not the issue at all in any way you have highlighted. Because you do not like it does not mean you get to link them. I have noted in places that have enforced religious freedom the troglodytes are an ever smaller minority year to year. The places without religious freedom are dens of troglodyte behavior. Fundamentalists exist in every single society but the troglodyte cancer they represent is mitigated in places secularism is enforced. As long as they harm no one and do not demand their nonsense is pushed into law their right to be deeply conservative idiots is protected. The more conservative the place the more they act in a troglodyte way, so blaming liberals for that phenomena seems bizarre. These foreigners you despise are deeply conservative and only become tolerable from your stated perspective once they adopt liberal western values of plurality and equality. As you talk about black criminals and sexual deviants you sound like the kind of old man who should be and generally is ignored. You and yours never valued freedom and spit on it as you attack things feigning morality you do not show. When you shove your personal standards down other adults throats to make you feel better I see that as actual moral filth. it is the reason I oppose conservatives generally. I have no interest in maintaining the status quo but have not bought in to the tribal nonsense that owns you. I see you as controlled opposition on behalf of the real monsters that are fucking us all over to throw another bucket of money onto the pile. Your passion and concern is 100% real but is misdirected to attack people with no power. You do this while consistently giving cover to the actual cancer of establishment types who do.
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  6772. The establishment democrats do not win because they are the same flavor of fail that was rejected by GOP voters in the primary. Hillary the unpopular establishment candidate only won her primary because of a staggering head start coupled with overt cheating backed lack of coverage for her competition. Trump won his primary because the GOP could not get its act together and crush him with their clown car of loser presidential hopefuls like they clearly wanted to as none of them had the initial lead Hillary did. The GOP's leaderships ineptness in pushing their desired candidates is directly why they won the election as the frauds they chose all would have had most of the same issues associated with years of overt selling out Hillary did. If the GOP had run their own version of an establishment candidate instead of a clown who could pretend to be populist they would have lost even against the weak sellout loser that is Hillary. Every single one of the establishment picked GOP leadership was clearly worse than her and they would not have used the same tools trump did to attack her as they have been guilty of much of same garbage themselves. Trump took advantage of an electorate who is universally tired of choosing the lessor evil and the GOP won because the "populist" candidate the leadership did not want beat their chosen stooges. Trumps very narrow election victory should not be taken as sign progressive ideas are unpopular but is a direct rejection of establishment leadership on both sides of isle. Bernie by every standard would have kicked trumps ass and continues to be the most popular politician in the country by a wide margin, this undermines your spin. If the democrats want to win they have to give up being GOP light and then they will wipe out the republicans who push virtually no policy that is remotely popular.
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  6888.  @yameshraberts3652  There is nothing left leaning in Trumps admin, even the good ideas he ran on against the corrupt hillary were overt lies now I have seen him in office. The guy is a wanna be fascist on steroids and if you have any libertarian bent in you and are not just a crony capitalist that hungers for the military on our streets I have no idea what you see in him. The corporate democrats including Biden are sell out cancer but that fail is built on the fact they chase the totally sold out GOP and ignore their own base. They have no fail that Trump does not share as proven by how he has acted in his presidency despite his 2016 rhetoric. You do not have to like AOC, no one should really care if you do or not. But when you level naked partisan talking points as the core of your objection you loose all credibility with those who value criticism to make things better. What you call "extremism" is supported by a large majority of the country and that fact should expose a significant flaw in your classification of the policies she supports if you bother to poke your head outside the bubble you have chosen lately. How is she extreme but Trump is not? She is not advocating for the arrest of reporters not friendly to the state? She is not calling for the arrest of the opponents she is running against based on deeply questionable claims. Trump by any sane measure is extreme and it seems an odd charge by one of his supporters against anyone. How do you square your libertarian values with these facts? I do not ever expect to change anyone's mind in a forum like this. The very least I can do is expose that your spin is not based on reason but on the media you choose that you like but is not necessarily valid. That of course is your prerogative but you should understand how it makes you appear to those who do not share your minority perspective constructed to support corruption by the corrupt.
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  7081.  @bubasmollett8610  Nothing you said contradicts any of my points NOTHING. Trumps failure was in not supporting the people during that process. He bailed out corporations and forced people onto unemployment (he has now cut even though it is still raging) while doing almost nothing else. Blaming riots for the spread of the virus as the orange man baby holds super spreader events and clowns protest to go to open things up during a pandemic without masks is weak and silly. No one is doubling our daily average, we own that hard fail. Trump owns everyone on shitty numbers that no one in the first world is even close to. The idea you solely blame democrats for the failure in their states is pretty stupid but I expect no less from the dupes who still support Captain bone spurs. If it was Obama overseeing this mess and he did the same thing you clowns would never stop screaming about it. Trump did a terrible job as he did the very very least he possibly could while pretending it was going to end imminently since before Easter. I would argue no one in our system did a great job but the President does not get to wash his hands by saying the Americans who died were in blue states. They were all Americans. If you step anywhere outside your right wing bubble Trump is vilified as an absolute failure on Covid world wide. Almost no one has done a worse job leading their country through this global crisis. The voters will not forgive or forget this fact. You do not get to talk about monsters anymore, you support a hateful beast.
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  7091.  @Ryan-rc3kq  Actually having a government system is preferable because it is innately efficient compared to the private counter part we already have. It is an insurance truism that the bigger the pool the better it mitigates costs. 100 small pools will never be as efficient as one large one . We are already carrying the old and the poor with public money, they are just skimming the healthy that should be mitigating our costs for the minority elderly and poor. Services we all, already pay through the nose for. Our system is out of control on costs because it is private. There is literally no incentive for insurance companies to control costs and that is why they have not bothered to try. The more health care costs the more they can charge increasing the amount they can skim off the top. They have a literal inverse incentive to control costs and if they price people out of the market this actually serves them too. The poorest are most likely to get sick and need care, this makes them a good market to cut out and leave for the public purse to carry as they are lousy insurance customers. The insurance vampires skim the most healthy/profitable and leave the poor and old for us to pay for. Having a 100 bureaucracies, head quarters, accounting departments is always going to be far more expensive to maintain than one. The doctors have overhead dealing with separate billing to many providers all with different policies and standards. All this overhead plus their need for profit while doing nothing extra is directly attached to our out of control costs. Americas health care system is failed because of private for profit insurance, the first step to doing anything to fix it is to cut out the useless blood draining middle man.
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  7208.  @albertsimmons2743  Reread my post. I never said that men are not hurt by woman, they are not hurt at the same rate woman are by men but should and do get the same protections under the law. The laws protect both men and woman the same. What you are pointing at is a lingering societal standard from the 50's that estrages men from coming forward and treats them differently under law. The nature of the courts is a legacy of the distant past and is not reflective of the standard applied in the new laws you ignorantly oppose I see the MRM movement as a useless emotional identity crutch for a specific audience. I would argue it is counter productive in the same way the fringe man hating element of feminism is. All the rights you demand are even up for discussion because of the classic feminist movement that has opened the door to change old historic and failing standards. The very ones would point to within family law and domestic violence issues that are a legacy of a time regressives say you want back even as you complain about them as a failure of the movement you think you oppose. You do tacitly support violence against woman as you oppose rules like this. Woman should be held accountable and nothing in this law states otherwise. As we leave the 1950''s standards and attitudes further behind it will only get more fair. You should probably not admonish anyone on "knowing what you are talking about", I get the feeling from your spin I have forgotten more about this subject than you know.
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  7269. @Anthony Gordon  The idea that men are not matterlistic and women are is silly on the face of it. Men control almost all the resources on the planet and always have, it is not unreasonable the half of the population that has tradionally been forced to take what they got would reach out for more given a chance, maybe you crave to have no power over your finances or comfort but the idea is bizarre to me Times have changed and the fact woman work and have jobs today changes the power dynamic of tradional relationships, I would argue the change is good for all as it allows us to choose what we would be and what we value instead of society choosing it for us. Those who need simple black and white rules as to what they should do and who they should be are the ones struggling. I want and demand more from my partner than sex and companionship, so should every man. If you have no ability to be introspective, to be empathic, to care about her as a person, then you will struggle as you are not well equiped for a modern relationship. If you do break the mold and find a way to appreciate her as someone you like and not just a maid and whore you will do just fine. You will have a happier, stronger relationship than your grandparents did even if they stayed together til the end. If you want a relationship that is more traditional, it exists out there for you. I posit these are the relationships that struggle most. In the past, they were held together by the women having no options. That time is not coming back. I see more freedom and less cookie-cutter roles as a good thing. I value the individual contributions of men and women as people instead of the cardboard inflexible chactures that defined their roles in the past, The parallel stat that many men have no close friends is the canary in the coal mine to me, if you can not form basic friendships It should be no shock you have trouble with romance or long term relationships. These lonely confused people need to look at themselves first before complaining about all women.
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  7298.  @kodekorp2064  Objectification of woman? Are you kidding me? You have to be either a strange special snowflake or an overt liar to even make this claim. This misogyny garbage is a naked establishment opo attack you have fallen for. I have been watching for as long as the show has been on. I have watched Jimmy on and off over his entire time on this venue. I do not see what you do and recognize these attacks on them as a variation on right what wing trolls in the comment section have spat for the whole time. The characterisation of them attacking allies and misrepresenting others is much better applied to Jimmy and those like him than it does TYT. I do not have to like or agree with everything TYT says and does to reject your empty spin that has no value. These attacks are like wedge issue complaints that do little more than attack a group that agree's with me on policy and has been part of positive change we need. I can not say anything remotely similar for an actor like Jimmy. They were pointing out Jimmy's character as he uses 5 year old troll talking points to attack them on baseless bullshit while not even denying he was abusive at work. His defense in this example is a story of him being abusive for gods sakes. You are like the 3rd person I have talked to that complained they asked for money like that is some kind of fail. Did you get some emails? That must explain why you are so mad. No one is making you pay anything and your spin is an appeal to a problem you have that I do not remotely understand. All these attacks are old school nonsense. When you use right wing smears to attack someone you may be a npc, just so you know.
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  7398.  @PublicEnemy-kf1bu  I like the idea of covering vets tuition too, but this fact is largely irrelevant to the proven point that educating people has benefits to the country a whole. The fact gi bill covered most of the adult male population at the time meant basically universal secondary education. This investment was at the core of the expansive middle class growth of the era we all agree was great. We ignore our veterans these days and many live in destitution because of service they rendered us. If only we ensured they all got an education that would be something but they do not even do that. The fact is this is an investment in us, in the future. In the same way we pay for public school so everyone can read and write we should ensure being educated is not limited by your pocket book, it should based on aptitude and ability. The entire garbage about immigrants being the problem is just naked misdirection to take your eye off the ball. Our borders are already secure. Biden to many of his voters horror has continued most of trumps border and deportation policies. The undocumented workers both parties let drive in could be addressed by simply going after those who employ them. That is not done for the same reason both parties do not care to solve this issue, the rich who own both parties love the cheap labor. This is a punch down to take your eyes off the monsters that are actually robbing us all into the poor house. They own both parties and create identity nonsense and misdirection like the immigrant thing to keep us at each others throats. They do not want us looking at them as the real problem no matter what our complaint. This has to change.
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  7498.  @Vanderearden  It is not complicated. The fact is Schumer backed by a stain like Joe is still better than Mitch and his pack of sellouts that have every single fail the neo liberal centrists do plus a raft they don't. Schumer is primarily better because his base is better. He will not block everything that is attempted. Even if they only pass incrementalist change because of his donor based limitations it is still better than what mitch will do. Mitch overtly supports raw patisan do nothing but super serve the donors stasis while having every single issue Chuck does. I totally understand that the establishment democrats in leadership have the same limitations as the GOP because they chase the same donors. The key difference is one has a base that values ideas like democracy and basic governance. The GOP clearly does not and win by cutting voter roles, gerrymandering and overtly lying about what their opponents stand for. If there is a choice of which corporate party is in charge that is an easy choice for me as one party has a base that agrees with me and another who I directly and consistently oppose as fact free dupes We are literally represented by elected law makers even if the system has been traditionally skewed toward one type of candidate. Neither focus's on me but one is overtly hostile to what I stand for and the other at least pretends not to be a corporate sellout. Choosing one is not a matter of who I support but who I wish to oppose in power and fight see their policy changed. I see no path to do so with the GOP but see the establishment democrats can be bent or broken as the movement I belong to gains power. Progressives have literally put major polices on the map over the last 4 years. Ideas like a living wage and M4A now have majority support with all voters even as the establishment wings of both parties ignore that fact. Rome was not built in a day and your estimation of progressive wins is famed by a dishonest narrative that promotes stasis and encourages hopelessness in the face of real appreciable gains. I have no idea why you are talking about 40 years when this movement is a scant 4 years old and has already shifted the Overton window in a way it has not moved in decades. I know exactly what neo-liberalism is and would argue the progressive movement is the only response to it that has any hope of effecting change. Neo-liberalism and neo-conservatism have the same economic and military goals and are the enemies of what I stand for. I hold the positions I do because I see the establishment as feckless and vulnerable. It is ripe to be taken over as they stand for nothing and as you point out do not serve their voters at all. That is their innate weakness, it is the reason Donald and the Tea party were able to crush the establishment GOP even if their actual opposition to it was a mirage. I know exactly what the words I use mean. If you do not see that the GOP openly pines for a federal cop on every corner police state or the idea elections overridden by fiat is fascist then you define these terms differently than I do. There is little on this subject you can inform me on as I have forgotten more about this subject that most will ever learn. Your spin I do not understand what I am talking about is empty dismissal that has no substance. So stop with the unearned superiority, it is not remotely compelling.
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  7815.  @beckydoesit9331  Ya, I do know. That does not explain why our numbers are ridiculous compared to those who test basically as heavily as we do per capita or are just behind us. The fact is our death numbers are unapparelled and that does not speak to the "power" of our testing. The rest of the world correctly considers us a covid hell hole. It is our cases and deaths that are the problem not a hatred of Trump. They would treat us this way no matter who was in charge because we are basically a dangerous typhoid Mary at this point. South Korea takes it very very seriously. They are not ignoring the virus like our officials are, when you make out they are it is an assertion you have no clue what you are talking about. They have extensive electronic and in person contact tracing and support for those infected + their families to ensure they quarantine. They are nothing like us. Their hospitals are not full like ours are. Japan since the beginning had near 100% public mask use. Again they have a history of taking public health issues very seriously. That alone could have mitigated as many as 100k in deaths here. Oh, their hospitals not full like ours. The same efforts that protect us against Covid protect against a much less contagious or deadly virus the flu when we normally do nothing to avoid it. You clowns need to stop babbling about the flu as it makes you look extra ignorant or indoctrinated. Pretending we are doing well is nonsense propped up by bubble think and naked partisan garbage chosen because it makes you feel good.
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  7837. Will Liu BLM is not a violent group who is not espousing hatred but fighting injustice and unequal treatment. Their message pressing for policy that stop cops from killing unarmed citizens is not the same as fighting for a white etheno-state or calling specific doctors baby killers. Anyone that has taken BLM's message too far and attacks officers misses the point of the entire movement badly as is its root function is literally against shootings. Antifa does not represent the left and fails because they break with liberal principles in being proactively violent against others like the Nazi's they oppose. Their primary failure is directly attached to the fact they wholly reject the liberal principles tolerance, open debate and non violent opposition to those they disagree with. The fact is they are a tiny spec compared to the real constituency represented by the Alt Right who have supporters in government. No one praises antifa, get your head out of your ass pretending otherwise. If anything the main stream media is soft on the right who commits the vast preponderance of violence and almost all of it if you include the fact Muslim extremists are not remotely left leaning. 0 I point out that terrorist violence primarily exists on the right (especially in the US) and it is a weak attempt at false equivalency to pretend the numbers of the two groups are remotely comparable. As a member of the left I defend literally no one that would commit violence against someone else. That is not true of the right and their consistently violent and divisive rhetoric drives their increased terrorist involvement.
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  7896.  @mikejohnson9606  I did read the report and it is not clear you did. This partisan conservative spun study lays out the costs and even their assessment is 2 trillion cheaper. This is not up for debate and by every single study medicare costs less not more. This is because simply cutting out multiple middle men with their massive overhead and need for profit is directly invested back into the system. Couple that with medicare's much cheaper overhead costs and and an ability to negotiate drug prices and the system saves consumers money. We pay double what the rest of the first world pays for health care per capta and their systems covers all their citizens and bankrupts no one on behalf of the insurer's profit motive. Quit pretending the data backs you, it does not. When you have to lie to make your point you do not have an argument. On the ACA it was the deeply conservative crony capitalist Heritage foundation plan, it was not "the democrats plan" and was better than what we had but was signed into law by Romney and later was was touted as the free market solution to health care by the GOP. It was literally the republican plan before they went insane and several GOP leaders ran with it as their proposal while the democrats ran on a public option or single payer. The base of the democratic party openly objected to the ACA on the grounds it was the con plan and wanted at least a public option which was rejected by the establishment democrats that do not and never have served their base as they are republican light and suffer from donor control just like the GOP. Look up the "liberal" Heritage foundation and get back to me, they should never ever be writing democratic policy and if they do the leaders that push it should be running for the GOP. This gives you a little of the history so you do not say uniformed things in public because someone was lying to you. https://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/15/health/policy/health-care-mandate-was-first-backed-by-conservatives.html
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  8135. The right wing is all about identity politics, religious nonsense, racial nonsense all driving forces in conservative politics. The red states are the poorest in the union and universally take more money in than they put out. They are the welfare states dragging us down and no one should be taking right wing economic ideas seriously after looking at where they have power in the abject poorest states in the union. Every single policy proposed by progressives has an explanation of how it will be paid for. The idea there is no plan and no explanation is empty nonsense. The way it structured for Medicare for all it means the average worker gets more for the taxes they already pay and in the case of health care get money back while being fully covered working or not. The health care solution is cheaper than what we are doing RIGHT NOW, There is no argument on fiscal grounds to keep our existing system which is unsustainability growing and has been for some time even if briefly slowed by the ACA. When someone says it is free, it means free at the point of service. When you need health care it is "free". You of course pay for it, you will pay for it as part of your taxes. As it turns out the vast majority of working families will pay far less than they do now with no co pays or deductibles. But this means people get taken care of and expensive and procedures are nipped in the bud before they cause bigger problems. It free's you to start a new business or leave your job you stayed at for health care, it frees business people do so what they make money on instead of worrying their workers have health care saving them money. There is no upside to our existing system which is the most expensive in the world at double the cost of any other but still lets over 30,000 Americans die without care.
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  8194.  @Anjalena  I think you your concern is the real root of this issue, how to move forward? What are our options as more people wake up and recognize our democracy is broken? I think we have a giant up hill battle but open armed revolution against the american military is a non starter and will only be used to clamp down harder and run off the cliff faster. I think there is a path forward but unfortunately it looks like it will be too slow to effect the changes and give us the satisfaction we crave now. Over the last 6 years there has been sea change in the views of moderates and democratic leaning voters on what they demand of policy and a rude awakening to the corruption endemic in our system. I do not think that the changes I mentioned and you saw have been effectively harnessed yet. Many tens of millions of people who were formerly not engaged like you were are now asking the same questions you ask. We need to start getting involved much more than we have, first at the local level and then up. We need to look at who we are voting for with new eyes to understand what to expect from the candidates who will work for us. At a federal level gaining access to the ballot is hard, but it is much easier a local level and we need to seek out candidates who reflect our values there to start to make change. The power and money wielded by the parties is clearly formattable, but it is not unbeatable. The cracks are already showing through in poll numbers and the fact the old business as usual tricks are less and less compelling to voters. The bought and sold leaders are largely unpopular and do not advocate for policy people care about. The idea they are unbeatable is a myth they want to propagate but I see as a smoke screen. It covers for deep and uncorrectable weakness they are forced to embrace to get the donor cash they think they need to win. It is going to take people like you and me caring more than we have in the past, it is going to take our effort and focus to lift up leaders that serve us. This may sound like a pipe dream but we have organized and done similar things in our countries past. We have come together against entrenched establishment interests to make monumental change. It is an innately american skill and I am convinced we can do so again.
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  8197. James Thomas There reaches a critical mass you can not break a movement with a single link, where brutality against it is counter productive creating martyrs and a new rally point. These underhanded options exist and if used against us we must forge through them. We have one path to remaining free and taking our democracy back, anyone who values that will fight despite what is arrayed against us. I do not underestimate their resolve, but I also know their base of power is built on people like me not them. I have a growing number of hearts of the voters and the Americans these leaders are supposed to serve. Most of the population agrees in principle and loathes corruption the same way I do. As they are woken to options on how to combat it they will gather their sparks of power into a force that makes a lie out of the power the establishment possess as they have no popular support. All they have is the machine, it was never built to stop us from usurping it as no one imagined what this movement is doing could be done. They have been rolling downhill in neutral so long the system that keeps them in power is not exactly under control. I do not see how they can turn it around to face the kind of threat we represent. They are coasting on manufactured voter apathy, donor cash, name recognition and diminishing momentum and have configured the system as a consistent battle about wedge issues that each other champion and never about real policy the unrepresented electorate cares about. Their ideas are not popular (especially economic) and when faced against non purchased leader they will always struggle once the candidate challenging them is known as they never had to win on the merit of their ideas. This is a genie that is not going back in the bottle. Their strengths can be turned to weakness's are are.
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  8252.  @ericaugust1501  Don't agree with you at all. I have seen no numbers that validate you in any way after a year or so looking at stats from around the world. Addressing your points: -Irrelevant to the points made, that specific demographics are more effected does not invalidate the efficacy of the vaccine across all age groups. -That the virus "harvests" the high risk groups first again does not invalidate the idea the vaccine protects all those who get it within a given population. -That the vaccine has not stopped the spread does not change it has shown value. In communities with high vaccination rates infection and death are down against communities within the same group that are unvaccinated. -Natural immunity is acquired at much greater risk to the patient/society and has a fading value just like the vaccine does meaning you need to be reinfected retain your Immunol protection. -The assertion the vaccine causes any damage is entirely erroneous and has no data backing it. It is empty scare mongering by brand of asserted luddites who reject medicine and lie about it to make an audience feel better about being medical Mennonites. The vaccines work if you look at the numbers. I am up for a discussion on changing how big pharma works and how they price gouge people over issues of life and death. That being said, that they are greedy does not mean the products they produce have no value. You are part of feeling based cult. The science, the medicine and the stats do not back you up. They NEVER have.
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  8336. Manchin can be defeated in a primary, I see no reason why he can not. He has name recognition but it is not good name recognition unless you vote republican. I have no idea how any democrat could ever vote Manchin and call themselves a democrat so the idea he can not be beaten seems off especially in the primary. The polices he opposes are largely popular even in his home state with republican's. There are numerous centrist but less radical opponents lined up to crush him and I do not see a primary as outside reality. I am not convinced we have to run right to get votes in W Virginia. Our issue is we have only ever run corporatists and right wingers there. We have never ran on the ideas that poll well in the state, even with republican's. The idea we have to sprint right or go hard core corporatist because WV's love them is a fiction built by the same media that ignores polls on taxing billionaires and pretends the support it is split 50/50 to justify just over half of our representatives ignoring the will of the people.. That being said, what "plight" of the health care workers? There are handful of people who refuse to get vaccinated but no one sane has any pity for them. Mandates are not new and if in health care you have already had vaccine mandates for half a century. Adding another vaccine to the list is not undue burden and if you can not get vaccinated during a pandemic because of your ignorant fear then you should not be working in health care. I would suggest they find a job that does not expose them to as a many at risk people if they arbitrarily refuse vaccination.
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  8503. I have spent a great deal of time talking to conservatives and the fact is I do not think they are as different as it first appears looking strait on. The gulf between us is primarily defined by the fact our differences and not our similarities are talked about on purpose. The distinction is enforced by media based on wedge issues and misinformation to keep us divided from achieving common goals. In the free world conservatives are not anti universal health care. Our conservatives are because of their group think nature and pervasive propaganda pumped out constantly over the last 50 years. Conservatives are generally as caring and concerned about many of the same issues we are, they just tend to focus that care on a smaller group. The core difference between between "left" or "right" leaning individual is the right has a tendency to have a much larger group they consider the other. To be defined as other for humanity in general is to dehumanize them, it becomes a crutch that allows a person to disregard the cares and concern they typically have for another person. Conservatives do care about those in their own community and those they have relationships with, they also tend to otherize anyone outside it. The fact they follow what is now a corporatist convention as part of their identity and see anyone one outside their group as less deserving of concern leads them to supporting counter productive corporately sponsored policy. The polices they parrot are consistently against their own interests and are based on a corporately inspired false moral imperative of individualism which always melts when a emergency issue occurs to them or someone they care about. As I said before there is common ground, the problem is you have to dig through and walk past a mountain of nonsense to even get through in a meaningful way to them. You need to point out their globalists are our elitist and the "job creators" the media crows about, that our mutual anger should be focused on the same people. Even language and commonly understand terms are now seen by each group fundamentally differently further making it difficult to converse or come to consensus. I have come to see the divide between the right and the left as an intentional construct to stop us from talking and coming to a consensus the ruling status quo does not want.
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  8840. fbda5555 You do not represent "whites" and you really need to stop pretending you do.   You and those like you are a  tiny fraction of the population and talking like change ever needed your nod is silly.   It does not matter how you feel about becoming a minority as no one had to ask you permission.  I personally do not care about skin color and look at the quality of individuals characters not their skin tone.  But then I live in a diverse place where I know people of all ethnic backgrounds who live in work in harmony.   Your simple minded fear and useless appeal to skin tone based pride hides and empty nothing under it. You have personal no reason to be prideful of your skin colour. You did not earn it,  the achievements you lay at your "races" feet were achieved with no help from you.   You are attaching yourself to a group you perceive as successful while offering nothing yourself,  it is a weak attempt to pump yourself up based on who your parents were.  Just like all your spin it is paper thin useless bluster. What you say is universally bullshit and even if based on fact your kind will consistently misinterpret what data actually means.  NO ONE but overt racists share your spin and that is why you clowns are forced denigrate actual scientists who disagree with your conclusions.   Get this through your head your arguments fail the second you step outside your dishonest bubble and face reality. Your bullshit is empty and your spin unpopular, it is easy to see why because it is really bad.  I have no idea how anyone can put that fact aside to buy into weak poorly thought out nonsense.
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  8878. mahesh samaru Ya it based off first world models but as I pointed out to your associate that being small is a disadvantage in any insurance pool. It means it is harder mitigate costs so that it is failing in your tiny market is no reason to assume it will with us as our market is huge and already proves it can support the costs we are already paying. The fact is removing the profit motive from the system, negotiating common prices with providers and reducing the exorbitant cost of drugs in the us will save us trillions. ALL of the first world countries have better health care ratings than us (and much better than you). They are a much better analog to what single payer means than your example. You do not have the common experience of other the large single payer countries and your opinion when it comes to what they succeed in doing is ill informed. Your taxation talking point is silly because this system would see MORE money in the hands of the people not less. That Canadians pay higher taxes than the US is balanced by the fact the Americans pay twice as much for health care and that comes out both taxes and their pockets. Arguing for the right to pay less taxes but more for the service is not only counter intuitive it literately does not make sense. Under this system the rich do pay more depending on how much they make and those like poor children pay nothing. It is system that is prioritized on need not how fat your or your guardians wallet is. Forty thousand people are dying in the US a year because they can not afford care and medical issues are number one reason for bankruptcy. That number in the rest of the first world is zero.
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  8880. mahesh samaru This is not a pie in the sky idea and it has many proven analogs that show properly managed it works. What does not work as demonstrated by reality is a the system you advocate for if you are remotely concerned about quality accessible health care for everyone and not just the rich. If you are concerned about working families being economically decimated by an accident or illness they have no control of even when they have been paying for insurance. If you are concerned about the quality of health care for poor and lower middle class children our system fucks over for no fault of their own. The root issue is that it is not based on need but their parents ability to pay killing some of them all to protect a trumped up faux moral outrage about theft. You asserting the practices in Europe are failing is not backed up by the facts. They produce better results than we do while spending less and pretending they are "failing" has literally no metrics behind it and is nothing but naked ideological clap trap not attached to reality. What is failing is our system as less and less can afford it and we are letting people die to directly serve a corporations profit motive. We already spend far more than everyone else and the assertion we can not support this kind of system is not attached to anything but your bias as we could pay for care two times over with what we spend now. If the care was "free" for those coming here you might be right but the fact is that 99% number is pulled right out of your ass. Being bankrupted by the health care system is not as attractive of an idea as you paint it. The countries I cite and would model on universally have very high approval ratings for their health care systems. Your assertion that 99% of them all want to come get care in the states is entirely fact free, forget the fact almost none of them can afford it and that is the chief problem with our system which is only getting more expensive.
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  8988. JANET MITCHELL You mask your hatred under a cloak of self riotous bullshit and that you validate it as noble does not make it any less what I called it,  hatred.  No one is denying you freedom of religion. You are free to be as hateful and backwards are you want to.  You simply can not do so as a purveyor of a public establishment.  As long as this tenet of your faith is a cornerstone you should not sign a public business license because you can not fulfill the terms.  This is your choice and no one is stepping on your freedom but you.   You are the one with an empty mind, filled up with unending nonsense assertions that are not remotely true let alone undisputed fact.   This country was never founded as a "christian" nation and if it had been god or Jesus would  have been mentioned in our founding documents.  The idea your wak job fringe version of faith represents the will of the founding fathers is just plain nonsense.  Your brand of Christianity did not even exist at the founding of our country.   There is zero chance they had you in mind when we were founded.  Fundamentalists of all stripes are a cancer.  Anti science, anti education, anti freedom you are all the same version of a nightmare wrapped in a different package. You do hate education because the educated do not join your idiot cults in real numbers, ignorance what you encourage as it empowers you.  No matter what version of faith you follow you are all very similar in your zeal and certainty on subjects there should be zero certainty on.   You are the people that suicide and abortion bombers are drawn from.  You are the last to catch up on every single social issue and stand on the wrong side of history on them every single time. You clowns are the same kind of fail as a the Taliban and I no more trust you to run things than I do them.   You share far too much with them to be trusted with any kind of power and the sooner you are all relegated to history the better the entire species will be.  Your assertion you are attached to reality is not borne out but the moronic things you say.  You are so clueless and mired in your churches fact free spin almost nothing you say is connected to reality.   You are a prime example of what your version of religion can do to a human mind.  It is a sad thing to see a waste of intellect and passion like yours it is akin to watching it be poured down the drain.  
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  8989. Andi Pandi They had it "stolen" from them in the same way bigots who could not stomach serving black people did.   Frankly I do not give a fuck about them and they  were not exercising freedom, they were exercising a non existent right to withhold it from others.  Letting the bigots have their whites only restaurants would have served no one. The "rights" they lost were balanced by the equity gained by a group who were no longer rejected as a customer by an arbitrary whim of the proprietor.   To me this is no different. All rights end at the tip of your finger and the tip of another's nose. They are free to believe whatever nonsense they want to, they are not free to discriminate as a purveyor of public goods regardless of their justification.  If they feel a need to do this they could form a private club and pick and choose their customers at will.  The "right" she claims does not exist.  This issue was already adjudicated in preventing white only bars, these same rules also apply to her. I apply this standard equally and not just when it suits me.   I like that the system is constructed to do the same.  This means obvious neo nazi's could ask a Jewish bakery to make a cake and they would have to as long as the cake did not violate their  terms of service in what they will and will not make.  These rules ensure everyone has access to all public services.   It is a balance because historically the situation was so bad left up to the kind of "freedom" you are espousing that it had to be corrected if balance was to be found. 
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  8990. ***** I am also confident that that christian prejudices and irrational hatred will inevitably collapse.  I see no value in supporting the enactment of bigotry though.  We have already seen a pretty fundamental change in race relations since enacting the laws that enforced it.  De-normalizing racism in the public square contributed to that effort.  The Christians are losing on this issue rules or no.  There is no upside in empowering their ability to pick and choose customers based on proclivity, we don't let racists do it and I see no reason to support these bigots either.  My confidence is as high as yours is,  I see the positive moves we are making as a society as inevitable.  That does not mean I support bigots and racists pushing and enacting their spin in the public sphere.   The rules we are talking about ensure equal access to all goods sold under a public business license are available to all. You seem to feel this is an onerous attack on freedom, I do not.  That you attempt to call a pretty reasonable law "force" says a great deal about your outlook.  I am not sure what you imagine the downside of these kind of rules are.  Could you lay out what the fallout was from the days we banned whites only restaurants?  Would it be better in your mind if we had not? If so why? I support these clowns rights to be as ignorant and bigoted as they choose.  Their right to be assholes does not override anyone else's to unrestricted commerce.  I care about freedom and rights too, I just care about the side being persecuted more than the ones who want to unfairly target another citizen to be treated differently.
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  9014. ***** Of course they do and they move from ignorance to knowledge by evaluation and study.  Ignorance is simply the state of not knowing something and any mind with the will to question the status quo has the opportunity to advance us.  Religion once claimed to have all the answers and they have been systematically stripped of credibility as we have learned more about the world by using our minds and not closing them. I will say this one time for you there is nothing scientific about the idea of god.  Even if we do not have a complete idea of how everything started there is zero reason to fill in a god as an answer to the question.   Science has no intention of threatening your imaginary friend and has nothing to say about his existence.  What it does speak to are claims that have been traditionally made in his name by the faithful.  In everything from cosmetology to germ theory the church has been on the wrong side of history time and again.  The transitional form argument you make is borne of ignorance or an open attempt at misdirecting the truth.  It is  classic creationist misinformation that is refuted every day in 100's of ways.  There has been no credible evidence refuting evolution and if you have it I suggest you publish and win a Nobel prize. The article you cite does not refute evolution and and merely expands on the existing data we have giving us a more complete picture.  Christians are not innately ignorant but fundamentalist dogma consistently is.  Not everyone is as myopic as the close minded faithful who ignore reality in favor of an old book written in the bronze age by people we have little in common with. 
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  9016. ***** Your spin is garbage not the data or the questions raised.  That you imagine that ideas should be static and not open to new info is borne of your theist nature which demands that things be set in stone with no new info allowed.   The awesome thing about science is that is open to change and anomalies are not dismissed but explained.  That we are learning more and the general population is behind what science has recently discovered does not invalidate the process or detract from its viability as a process to better understand our world You apparently do not understand what the term transitional fossils means and your attempt to use the it as a punch line does not validate your spin.  We have a great deal of proof and you have been sold on the most ignorant of the creationist claims which are regularly destroyed as it is an argument that has no merit.  Creationists maintain the fiction you share here by moving the bar as new transitional fossils are found.  There will never be enough evidence for you people as you will simply demand more even if we had a 100% complete (which is not gong to happen) lineup of fossils for a given organisms development.  You and those like you are not honest players in this debate and the facts that are available for all to see mean nothing to you as they do not support your ideas.  I am not impressed that you seem to get all your information from a creationist website and do not care about anything science has to say on the transparently weak issues you consistently raise.  If you actually cared about the subject you would do some research that is not based on propping up your faith you would find you spin has no merit and is supported by raw ignorance.
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  9059. MRostendway The escalation of tension between nuclear powers is over blown and as much of non issue as it has been for the last 60 years.  Mad is no less true now than then and any saber rattling is exactly that and is not the first step to nuclear destruction. Trump by all accounts has been almost fawning over a dictator who wants to be the king of every castle he steps into.  Cozying up to an alt right nationalistic totalitarian dictator is not something anyone who is not a fascist should be comfortable with.     Your spin mirrors that of Russia and wholly mitigates them of any culpability in these events.  It may turn out that they have none but the accusation is certainly out of character with normal diplomatic efforts and strikes me as genuinely possible in the existing climate.  I was surprised to see the expelling of ambassadors especially with the friendly nature of the relationship trump has imminently imposed.  It leads me to believe there is more than they are willing to share and that we are missing part of the story.  It does not make me think Russia's cries of innocence ring true.  I think evidence will come to light,  I will not be surprised when it does.  In the mean time concern about some foreign power messing with our electoral process should be a page 2 story. Page one should be how corporate interests have been manipulating our system for years and have driven policy through their bought and paid for leaders.  You want to talk about concern about manipulation,  that is a the real crime. 
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  9068. Ibber That is not about parenting, I would argue in the case putting a 12 year old in hand cuffs is not standard procedure either and would be arguably excessive.  That being said I was not concerned about the cuffs but the unreasonable use of force on a minor who was in direct care of the state who is responsible for their welfare.  You are creating a pretty strange straw man of what I represent.  I would see all minors treated the same way with younger children given even more leeway as they are not legally responsible for their actions and are prone to make less responsible decisions.  I am not asking for special any special status that is not already granted to minors by law.   Children require special care as dictated by their legal status and these rules do not exclude law enforcement.    The younger the child the more care needs to be taken.  Your entire spin about the 19th amendment is entirely fact free having nothing to do with what I said and misrepresents my point entirely. No child can be held criminally responsible the way an adult can for their actions without a special waving of said classification only granted by the courts.   The officer is required to understand the law and that children have a special status in it.  Every single case is different and the force should be proportional to the resistance and danger involved.  In this case it is clear it was not proportional and the officer clearly overstepped what is reasonable in the given situation.  He can and should be held criminally responsible for his actions. I watched it again,  that her knees hit before she was knocked out by slamming her head into the pavement does not mitigate the excessive use of force in displayed in this video.  
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  9098. Jacob Marburger They have not grown at all. They have remained flat or have actually fallen backwards. There was a day not so long in the past where you could raise a family on a wage just above min and those days are long long gone. Our productivity is exponentially higher than the 1968 figure cited. None of that value has been passed onto the workers and is reflected in an every shrinking middle class and the growth of the poor. To argue they need to be more productive after massive unrewarded productivity games is at least tone deaf. The working poor are already fucked and arguing a low min wage is in their benefit as we starve our markets of their spent wages to pad the pockets of the uber rich is a very tough argument. Conservative prognostications are empty nonsense written by shills that is never borne out in the real world. We know what happens when the min wage is raised across a system and we do not have to count on think tank crystal balls to figure it out. The data and real world examples already exist and do not correspond with the doom and gloom fiction they sell. The argument is not 100 an hour and everyone who looks at this issue knows there are diminishing returns. What it should be set at is a basic living wage. No one who works full time should need food stamps to have enough to eat and we need to stop subsidizing corporate remuneration packages with tax payer dollars as the low min wage demands. $15 has been cited as that median number so even bringing up 100 is just a distraction from what is being proposed. I have looked at a great deal of information from both sides of this debate. I made my choice based on the preponderance of data and am aware of the information you provided..
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  9106. +Snakeeye808  And they have control of those houses because of sellouts like the clown you say we should vote for.  It is him and those like him who has made the democrats into the failures they are today.  These people are democrats in name only and it is establishment "democrats" like him and Hillary that saw us beaten by a clown that should NEVER got close to the white house.  We lost the house the senate, the presidency and most of the governorships + state houses and what you are advocating for is we do more of what we have been doing in order to win.   To advocate for continuing to bang our heads against the same rock that has seen us bleed out is either crazy or stupid.  I do not say we should replace these guys out of spite but because they are losers who are the reason the democrats have zero credibility.   Many who vote for dems at this point are not voting for the specific candidate but against the gop who does not even pretend not to have sold us out.  That has to end and every one of these sellouts has to go not so we lose seats but so we have the credibility we need to actually win them.  The idea it is guys like this clown who are holding us up is betrayed by the fact he is an example of the cancer that has seen us fall.   I am not the reason we can not get progressive policies in place,  your boy is.  He votes with the GOP on everything important or drags our polices right so he will sign on making them unpopular.   Blaming me for the sellouts being overt losers that people hate is weak sauce.  You go ahead and defend a losing record as the path forward,  your spin is empty and I reject your assertions as poorly thought out.  No one should listen to anyone that supports establishment dems at this point as having a path forward,  you have proven you do not know what you are talking about if elections are any measure.  Don't pretend you want progressive polices as you support a crowd who openly distains and does not value them.
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  9107. +Snakeeye808  You say he represents voters but actualy he more accurately represents what the voters have had to choose from, he represents who the DNC has been selecting to run his riding against some clown the GOP puts up who is somehow more distasteful.  At best the voters get to select one out of two or sometimes more people in a primary. Over recent history excluding the last notable election the one with the largest amount of corporate support or money consistently won those matches. This came to mean they were not even incentivized to represent us based on any collective will and regularly passed unpopular measures watered down by corporate interest that owned them.  This is not what they are put in power for and they are now only represent the will of the people who elect them,  the donors.  This has to change and Joe is symptom of the it.  In many cases choosing one candidate over the other is a matter of the choosing what you consider the "lessor of two evils" and when both your choices are bad it ceases to be a democracy at all.  By establishment standards  modern candidates are chosen for either party by how much money they can raise and if they follow the status quo.  This means that the choices the voters are given are false and that one party is better on some issues does not change it is complete mess on all others dealing with holding the powerful to account and not basing policy on contributions. The idea that Buddy is popular so we should not primary him seems like an oxymoron.  If indeed he is what the people want there is no danger in us primarying him with honest candidate who points out his record, his votes and who his donors are.  Don't worry we will have the power to do the same to the GOP when we work to claim the seat because we are not tarred with that brush.  If we run people across the board and replace these clowns by being actual populists we can expect win.  For every seat we lose in a place that would want a nightmare like Gorsuch we can expect to gain back ten more who are tired of voting for a sell out and want real change and not support for a corporate religious puppet.   There are some hard lines when it comes to an issue like the ramming through appointment of Gorsuch and he crosses them all.  The right most certainly has lines that won't ever be crossed unless at great pain, so should we.  There is no reason to back down from this fight at the risk of losing a man I do not trust to vote for my interests anyway when it promises to pay back much more by being principled and actually attracting new and excited voters.
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  9109. gatesbrown26 The real bad guys are extremist Muslims and no progressive defends them.  Your straw man is some real weak shit.  The bible is full of awful garbage too but we do not fight to outlaw it or kill its followers.  If christens followed their holy book they would stone their children for disobeying, would kill people worked on the sabbath and would prosecute people for the abomination of eating seafood or wearing two kinds of cloth.   Personally I think you are all a bunch of wak jobs (even the moderates) for venerating a book with that kind of nonsense in it but that is your choice.  To tar all Muslims with the terrorist brush as you attempt to is ignorant and invalid.  It is like me saying all christens are like Timothy McVeigh or abortion doctor killers. Every single fundamentalist says they are following their holy book to the letter.  That does not mean they are right or that they represent most worshipers.  Your assertion that the moderates agree with the extremists is just plain wrong and not attached to reality.   Your black and white version of the world is hampering your ability to see the issue clearly.  People are not all in or all out like you appear to be and the vast majority have no interest in the extremes of any religions declaration. I loath all extremists be they Christian or Muslim. The assertion any progressive ever defends terrorists actions based on religion is nonsense.  You can not tell the difference between an extremist and a moderate because you are so extreme that to you anyone who is different is bad.  You literally add no value to add to this debate as you are part of the problem and have far more in common with the clowns we are bombing than anyone should.
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  9110. gatesbrown26 There are many reasons for the rise of extremism inside the Muslim world.  None of them validate their actions.  But the fact is the causes have less to do with Islam as a whole and are more about the complete lack of stability in the regions that give rise to the worst of them.   The same murdering fail could be attributed to Christianity not so long ago.  That we have moved beyond the barbarism represented by the dark ages, the crusades or inquisition does not mean Christianity can not be used the same destructive way.  Religions of all stripes can be twisted into something horrible and that they sometimes are does not mean the religion has to be innately evil.  The bible commands you kill people too, did you skip those parts?  Read the fucking book it is littered with genocide and  commands to execute those who do not follow outdated dogma.  This is why for a long time the church burned people it did like.  You are detached from reality if you do not think that shit that justifies that is not in the bible.  Your assertion Tim was an athiest is not attached to reality.   Right at the end of his life he called himself agnostic but was raised catholic and attached church regularly.  He was never an athiest.   He belonged to a Christan militia and if you find any athiest militia's scattered through out the south do not out them as all the other militias would ostracize them.  On the abortion killers, it does not matter how many people died just that they were killed to serve god.  If you can tar all Muslims with the terrorist brush there is no reason why we can not do the same to all Christians now they have recently murdered in their gods name.   Your numbers about how many people Islam killed compared to Christianity is pulled right out of your ass.  Right now, today Muslims extremists are more aggressive and have been kicking up a big body count but Christianity has 12 century head start on them and has done a fair share of murder as well in the mean time.   Religious radicals of all stripes are a cancer.   This goes for Muslims or Christens or any other faith you want to name.  I no more support terrorists seeking to kill others than I do you ramming your bullshit religion down my throat.   You are all failures for the same reason.   To stand against people like you and the radical Muslims who would cram their fist down our throats should be every progressives first duty.  To protect others so they are free to live in peace with a right to worship as they choose is a close second. 
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  9111. gatesbrown26 Because it is the exact same kind of fail.  The religious right agrees with radical Muslims on countless subjects and some high profile Christians even advocate for religious law to be enacted here.  Your definition of what leftism is surely includes the nazi's which is just another fail on your part.  It is hard debating with people like you as you do not value history or information and just make shit up.  Right wing and left radicals have led to a great many deaths, it all swings back to extremism and a cult of personality.   Fundamentalist authoritarians of all stripes secular or religious are cancer and are at the heart of most issues of genocide, murder and the crushing of freedom.   Radical Islam, radical Christianity, Stalin's version of authoritarian communism and Hitlers brand of nationalist Fascism all share a common trait.  They are what you get when you empower authoritarian radicals creating a cult where the leaders spin has more value to the followers than rationality does. As you try to excuse Christianity of the same fails as Islam is guilty of you show yourself to be disingenuous.   We know that given half a chance the christian version of the Taliban here in the US would see freedoms curtailed and agree with the radical Islamists on far too many things.  I support all moderates right to self determination and freedom to worship as they see fit until they try ram it down anyone's throat by force or law.  I stand against all fundamentalists as they are a cancer and nothing good ever comes from them.  I do not support Jihadists  at all and if you are concerned about what they are doing and not just they are Muslim look at the christian right here.  Progressives share nothing with the radicals of Islam when in fact the christian right has a great deal in common with them.  This should not be a surprise as they just have a slightly different dogma that was derived from the exact same source.
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  9115. Nathan Robinson Conservatives and the right wing are synonyms.  The distinction between them is non existent.  The Nazi's were conservative and by extension right wing.  They crushed trade unions, communists and actual socialists, gay people and anyone who opposed them.Their actions were universally conservative and they had that support even here in the US. Nationalistic authoritarians are not progressives but cons.  In any sense of the word?  Please they were worshiped by the cons here and it is telling that neo Nazi's are UNIVERSALLY conservative.  You literally have to change the definition of the term for it not to apply.   Conservatives are universally ill informed on any subject that they care to discuss.  They misrepresent the truth or change entire definitions to suit their narrative as they can not face what they are dead on.  You sit in a camp with self declared racists, homophobes and actual living breathing Nazi's.  Our education faces challenges mostly attached to funding and the fact we have elements on the top working against it for their corporate masters.  A properly funded public system has proven to be the most effective education platform and moving away from that model has never been the answer in any of the places that rank best.   The GOP who represents cons in our country universally serve coreprate agendas and the dems are not much better.  Neither serve their constituency but at least the liberals do not clap their hands and cheer the policy of handing over power the country to multinationals and billionaires.  It is undeniable that cons do.  
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  9136. Hiraghm Your brainless assertions are not attached to reality.  The entire 1st world enjoys a min wage that ensures a basic salary for the workers.  As we are not a third world county and do not let our people starve in the street the state is beholden to set a certain standard so that we are not supporting dead beat employers. I showed you it was too low.  If it had kept up with inflation it would have been set to 10.86 and not what it was.  I get the idea because I look at the numbers and we can see what the rate would be if we had adjusted it appropriately.  I own a business and you have exactly nothing to teach me about running one.  I say if the only way a business can work is paying starvation wages then it should not be here as it is not viable.  You may argue it would be awesome if we had more low paying starvation wages sweatshops but this is just you trying to make us into a banana republic again.   A national min wage sets the cost for labor at a standard and because of that does not effect competition in the slightest.  We know what happens when business gets to set the labor rates and if they all set it low there are zero options for workers in that market.  We created a min wage because employers were trying to pay less at the cost of the state.  The idea this is a market where the workers have real options especially at the low end is fact free.  Get rid of the min wage and create wage slaves and sweat shops.  All anyone has to do is look at the world where the polices you support are in place and there is no result there that we should copy.
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  9164. ***** It is nonsense title that is meaningless and your spin supports real regressives who jump on.  Your spin is the same as opposing fundamentalists whose goal is to wiping out opposition because of the xenocideal nature of all fundamentalists and right wingers.  I care that my classifications are accurate and regressive does not fit the target in this case unless you seek to redefine it.   Just pointing out what I see and there may be exceptions to that rule but for the most part my assessment is spot on.  You my not like your bed mates but that does not change who they are or what they represent. Generalized classifications of any type are "pejorative" and I am calling out what the clowns you are linked to support.  That is an observation and I am speaking in generalities which you are not countering by saying I should not do so.  Yes it does say a great deal about you. It shows your inclination toward specific way of thinking.  It is not definitive or all encompassing but in a forum like this where we have little to go on but what you say and who you are associated with it does have value in classifying you.  You are being a quasi PC dirt bag pretending I should not generalize when that is exactly what you are doing with this entire spin.  Fuck that, I call a spade as spade and if you do not like that change your spin or be correctly tarred with the assholes you sit with. I am saying many of the losers who share your random demonization are self avowed racists who do not care even a little bit about Armenians when they could not find the region on a map.  Call me superior but i do not see eye to eye with those empty sacks of shit on anything.  You are big man that you can but I will not climb into their steaming bowl of reeking nonsense and that you do does say bad things about you.   This is a forum where who you associate with says something about your nature.  The clowns I speak about values are not in question and that you want to give them tacit cover and support is your burden to deal with and you should not whine when someone makes you do it.   My point is I do not care what he said decades ago and judge him on what he says now an the value he brings to the conversation.  I do not see this issue coloring anything he says now and that is what is important to me.  You may want to prosecute him for things he said decades ago but I think there are bigger fish to fry.  As you sit in the camp with self avowed racists and worse your "principled stand" appears weak and tainted to me.  Go ahead whine about what he said 15 and 25 years ago, the sane without an ax to grind generally are not as concerned as you are. You are the ridged one here and nuance is not your medium as you take an absolutist stance for whatever fucking reason you do so.
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  9245. justun chan There was no reason for the heavily pregnant Mary to journey to Bethlehem.  The event that forced them to make the trip is not documented anywhere,  at no point was there ever a proclamation that had people journey to another city to do a census.  This is exactly the kind of thing that we would expect independent verification of.  The whole reason the Christ ended up in Bethlehem in a manger never occurred.   Your wild claims are not attached to reality, they are make a good story but hurt the credibly of the source.  This makes a claim of the bible being a historically accurate text very weak.   The more inaccuracies and unverifiable statements a text makes the more its value decreases as a historical reference.  When you can not verify any of the independently important components that should have some outside references it calls into question the veracity of whole thing as a literal report. Some of the the new testament books supposedly are written by one writer. But when studied it turns out they are actually written in several distinct styles suggesting several authors.  The idea these texts are accurate or that we even know who penned, edited or translated and then re translated them is not a valid.  The new testament is a fascinating incomplete collection of stories that may or may not resemble what the originals looked like.  The original manuscripts were edited out of existence are not fully represented by the modern text that has been deliberately modified to suit a political needs of churches leaders perpetuating their bias.  The idea there is anything historical about them should be in grave question. 
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  9267. whyamimrpink78 None of the most successful systems in the world private based. All of them are public.  That stat alone is very telling.  There are a few reasons the right is pushing for private schools.  The first is their curriculum can be fact free and is not tied to any kind of national or international standard.  This allows them  to teach whatever they want to valid or not.  The second and more  important is money, the same way our prison system has been privatized (to our detriment) they have turned their eyes to education making billions on it too.  To that end our school system has been consistently attacked and its finances drained off to serve partisan interests and tax cuts.  There is no justification for the selling of out school system to the highest bidder if oyu are not a shill for the school lobby or you want to see your child is taught nonsense instead of science on the tax payers dime. Either way do not expect much sympathy from those who value the idea of reforming our education system to bring it line with other 1st world players.  There are better options than vouchers and with the proper focus and funding we could easily do much better.  We have examples in this very story how voucher schools are failing their students and outside your rhetoric there is no reason to think the solution lies in handing over our children education to the likes of these greedy clowns.  If you want to pay for your child to be taught nonsense that is your business but do not expect the state to pick up the tab.
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  9303. The Earth Circus Shrug, that depends on how you define freedom I guess.  Most people I encounter do not define it like you do.  A great many consider the goverment getting involved in things like heath care and a wide range of legislation is a good idea.  In the entire developed world people who undoubtedly value freedom consistently have no issues including government as part of system that makes things work. The kind of freedom you are seeking exists in no developed country in the world. There is no reason to expect the kind of economic anarchy you want would be anything but a disaster for everyone but a handful at the top. The "many people" you cite who want a departure from centralized government consist of a group who has a faith based view of how things will turn out and shills who will profit from it.  The number who agree with your radical views is not large, no more than 15%. As soon as you start listing the many popular programs people appreciate that you would disband it drops even further. The real issue for most is not less government but more effective government.  That ours has not worked for the population at large for about 30 years is very telling in our growth stats and where the money has been flowing.  Governments who actually serve their people are enjoying metrics on key indicators that put our system to shame.  There are good reasons why we are doing poorly against them none of which have anything to do with "too much" socialism and everything to do with crony capitalism. I am going nowhere as the vast majority of Americans agree with me on all the key policy points.  Your economic views are not well represented in any of them. And for Pete's sake do stop +1ing yourself.
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  9457. khav99 You are wrong.  Nothing in the bible inspired any scientific advancement and I challenge you to give me a good example of a concept we used today based on the bible.  Giving god credit for everything is a pretty common thing for theists to do.  You see it every football game, the loyal follower thanking god for the victory.  This assumes you ignore that one team lost and god did not see to reward them.  God should not get credit for the capability of individual men or woman's success.  A great many fantastic things were invented by people who never heard of your god and if your odd assumption that we could not do it ourselves was true then they must have got that inspiration from their god, right?  The only realistic assertion is we as a species are capable and do not need any god to be inventive and brilliant.  That gods have been around for a long time does not mean any of them get credit for our advances.  This is the product of man and by our hand and our minds did we advance.  To give credit to your version of a deity is both unfair to those who made great strides and to those who never heard of him yet still advanced us.   If the bible did anything for science it held it back and persecuted those who dared to question it's dogma about reality.  We have advanced in spite of religion and not because of it.  The moment we stepped free of it's relentless yoke it had on us throughout much of human history technological advancement accelerated exponentially. 
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  9484. SpeedyRemake They fully point out the nature of the Clinton's even if they as they do not spit your often fact free spin.  The way their opposition is expressed is to show the nature of our leadership as bought and sold to the highest bidder and that tiny group own them all through donations and favors.  It has nothing to do with the nonsense ravings of the right who are just as bought and sold as anyone.  This is why the show also openly calls out Hillary as a problem while acknowledging the most other candidates baring a very few exceptions share the same issues which affect the policy they support. That this is not a 24/7 anti Clinton channel is because they have goals much larger than taking down a single set of plutocrats so they can be replaced with others.  As bad as the Clintons are the other side of the coin has been shown to be as corrupt and far worse on the issues that matter to the people on the show.   No one you support on the right will do any better and polices they support will only make the problem worse.  If you look at Belgium and who committed the crimes it becomes clear your solutions would not have helped there and will not help here.  Your border security trope is nonsense and shows you do not understand the issues or what the real problems are.  You are in a fact free bubble and actual information has no value to you. Islam is no worse than Christianity.  The key difference between them is that secular thought has pulled the teeth of crhistianty in the west and taken away its ability to make law for all.  All fundamentalists are the same brand of cancer and all are dangerous to those who love freedom.  They are most dangerous if they are allowed to impose their will.  How much damage they do is driven not by the quality of their ideology but how much power they are given over others.  The path to making Islam more sane is secularism just like it was for Christianity.  Demonizing moderates and those who do not support violence as the same as terrorists plays into the terrorist hands.  This show does not support Islam just the right of people to make a choice.  If we give the right remove peoples choice from religion it plays into the hands of other fundamentalists who want to remove all choices but theirs.  This show opposes fundamentalists in all forms including Islam, pretending they apologize for their failures is fact free. Thanks, you validate everything I have ever said about people who use a the term "Young Turds" as exactly what I said you were..
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  9502. +mopground  I did watch the clip and there was nothing dishonest in her query,  if Carson had no intention of enriching trump he was more than free to say so but he refused.   That is telling and speaks to the fact he could not or would not answer the question.   This is not a "how often do you beat your wife" question and he was free to say he had they would avoid giving contracts as a policy that would benefit any public official but he could or would not.  My response does make her question more specific and derails it.  If you are concerned she was trying to say he was going to use his position to enrich Donald he could have dismissed it with a simple denial that it would.   That she used the word benefit does not change the context of my response and makes it specific to the tacit charge she made that he would be working for trump to make him money.  He was free to respond and deal with her becoming more specific but he failed to do so and it makes him look crooked or stupid.   Carson is swimming in the big pool now and better take off his water wings if he intends to stay. I never said my accusation was proven.  It is a one I make though based on Carson's performance and answers to questions a first year law student or high school debating coach would walk past.  From his answers it is not clear if he will be enriching Donald's family or not and this was his opportunity to show he is not shill put in place to make the Trumpster money.  He failed in this because he is either not competent to deal with strait forward questions or he is crooked.  Neither recommends his services to me.
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  9505. whyamimrpink78 Being obsessed with debt is a joke if you understand the nature of how money is even created in fractional banking system the world we live in employs.  When it come to spending money we do not have I see no complaints as we pour it down the drain for any number of things the right agrees. Ludicrous military spending and corporate welfare and policy that ensures our social safety net is required by working Americans just to eat are all things supported by the right.   You are cool to waste money as long as it is not spent on anyone but the richest and most powerful. The US has the 37th best health care system in the world not the best and the only ones that consider it superior live in a world where cost is not a concern.  For the rest of us representing the vast majority of Americans it can mean financial ruin for no fault of our own.  Being it is 37th best puts a lie to your insurance company propaganda.  For the first time in history more doctors are leaving our system to go work in Canada than are coming here and that is very telling.  The idea that unions are for people who do not want to work is a lie made up in the service of those who see the bulk of the population live in wage slavery.  The work unions do raises the collective wages of all workers and their decline has seen a precipitous growth in income inequality in our nation.  The decline of the middle class is directly attached to the think tank spin attacking unions that people like you mindlessly parrot either as shills or ignorant patsies.
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  9548. Progress and Peace 1 Nato had nothing do with the the collapse of the middle east. They were not even involved in any of the invasions until 2003 and then came in under a peace keeping and training roll. Laying the failures of the neo cons in the middle east at the feet of NATO is misleading and is russian propaganda that does not pass the sniff test. I do not pretend NATO is virtuous but I do not lay false charges at thier feet either. The members of NATO represent some of the most liberal least war like nations on earth. The idea that countries like Germany, France and Canada should be lumped in with the manipulative war loving clowns inside the US and Russia russian leadership does not hold water. Much of what you implicate "NATO" with is the doing of the US and you conflate thier policy failures and conveniently lay them at the feet of the only force that challenges Russia for control of eastern europe. I do not pretend any state is innocent of sin but when i compare the collective actions of the NATO countries against Russia's actions it is clear who the aggressor is. I got news for you, NATO exists because of Russia. It is the only threat that justifies it's existence. This is why Russia spends so much time putting out nonsense to undermine the alliance. The idea that NATO is acting imperialist in afghanistan is not well thought out. Last time when russia abandoned the country after thier failed invasion monsters took over that country. I am not a fan of any involvement in the middle east but NATO pulling out would serve no one but the extremists and would create another safe haven for them to attack from. That is not in anyone's interest including Russia. Nato is a military alliance formed to defend from russian aggression. The idea they should not be doing what they were formed to do is a tough sell. It is an alliance that has seen the longest run of peace in Europe in centuries and I do not see pulling its teeth as serving anyone but Russian expansionist interests.
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  9606. +Red Pill You are the one running away and clearly can not face ideas you do not like.  You need a safe space and it is whiners like you who are consistently the biggest intellectual cowards in any debate they join.  Only in your fact free bubble does your spin even make sense.  The opposite of a statist is an anarchist and you spent some time pretending you are not one of those in an earlier post.   So if my choice is between living in a society of laws and living in chaos I guess I am a "statist" as are most of us.  Your assertions are fact free and it is you who uses invalid talking points not attached to reality.  If you can pretend I am ok with stealing then it is very fair to say you are ok with murder and you need to own that.  You want to let insurance companies choose who lives and dies based on how much money they have so they can make a profit and then call that "freedom".  I want the system of providing health care that does not pick who lives and dies based on their net worth.  I am pointing out you are far more concerned with "theft" from those who have he most than the deaths of the poor. I am both intellectually and morally superior to you.  What I am advocating for is what the best systems in the world universally do.  I am pointing out that what you want never leads to good results and never ever has.  The country was created because the people rejected taxation without representation.   That they solved that  problem does not make taxation evil. I have lived all over the world and read more books than you have touched.  I know what works and what does not and your faith based version of the economy is nothing but sloppy blow job to those who think profit is more important that peoples lives.  You turn your head and ignore those that die around you to support your spin and this marks you as neither principled or moral.   That you care nothing about life and focus on property speaks the value of convictions.  I do know what a constitutional republic is and there is no reason we can not provide universal care, none.
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  9607. +Red Pill Fact free, there is nothing in the constitution that prevents this as I have already clearly shown.  You are clearly wrong about centralized government programs in a constitutional republic, we have had them for 80 years.   I am not arguing with you I am just pointing out the fact and you care more about "theft" than "murder" and that is a position that is basically indefensible.   You would forgo the "mob" to hand power to a few so they can enrich themselves and their friends at everyone's cost.  That is another tough sell and I challenge you to pump up your next leader by talking about how they do not have to represent the American people and how our system was never intended to.  The mob rule is better than taxation without representation, at least that is what the founders thought. You claim to speak for the founders and it is clear you have no idea what you are talking about when trying to apply what they did to this situation.  The ideas we are talking about simply did not exist when our forward thinking founders wrote  the original documents.  There is literally nothing in the constitution that precludes us setting up an opt in Medicare for all system. I am saying the government working for insurance companies speaks to corruption and not them focusing on principle.   More and more Americans can no longer afford our over priced system and there is literally no merit to defending it unless you own an insurance company.  Giving them the power of life or death over Americans is an indefensible potion and you have not made a single argument that does so.  Practically NO ONE CAN NOT AFFORD CARE without a middle man, there is a reason we have hundreds of thousands of health care bankruptcies even with insurance. I can't "get" your failed arguments and assertions through my head because they are poorly made and not attached to any working reality you can point at.  You do tacitly defend insurance companies as you support the status quo because there is no realistic form of any health care system anywhere that works as you assert it should and there never will be.  Insurance companies love your spin that promotes stasis and handing them more power, own that. Do not admonish anyone on reading skills as it is clear yours are not strong,  just saying.
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  9609. Red Pill by pretending I have shared Marxist views you show yourself to be patently ignorant of what the term actually means.   We (USA) are the poster child for the first world nations and they you imagine we are not one speaks to more of your ignorance and nothing else.  You have no idea what the term actually means as you make the painfully miss the point arguments you do about home ownership, property taxes, etc.  The entire first world has these things and pretending that we do makes us not first world is marks you as base ignorant on the subject. There is an answer to the question "Who exactly do you consider "rich"?  and it has nothing to do with what I make as unlike you I do not want to exclude myself from the system.   Paying taxes is not punishment it is the cost of living in a modern society and that you are a deadbeat who wants to sponge off others does not mark you as principled.   What has been proposed is that anyone who makes over 200k pay a few more points on taxes and that would raise the money needed for many programs.  This represents 2% of the population and crying for the most affluent paying another 2% like it is immoral is a real tough sell for most.  You do this trying to appear moral and high minded  while saying it is ok for the poor to die, making you look just douchy.   It most certainly will not make those who have to pay a little more poor and whining that they make a little less will be a tough sell to the vast majority who make an average 30k.  Every single term you use you seem to misunderstand willfully or otherwise.   Graduated income taxes are not a slippery slope to anything else and I have already hammered down this particular weak talking point.  That you can afford to pay more taxes when you make more money is not a complex idea.  The system does not level the playing field so everyone makes the same amount and if you think it does then you are clueless and really need to study up on what you are talking about before saying incorrect things in public. That you see taxes as theft and are deeply concerned about it is undermined by the fact you do not care if the poor die or even worse a child does because they can not afford health care.   You accuse me of emotional porn while you base you entire argument on doing just that by misrepresenting taxes as theft.  The fact is the group I belong to do not think it is ok to go over seas and kill people,  it is the corporate funded dems and the entire GOP including your leaders that support it.   So your question "why it is not okay for our government to force our military to go halfway around the world and kill millions of people, but it is okay for the government to forcefully steal the fruits of other people's labor and redistribute " is moot because we as a group who disagrees with you generally do not support murder of in the name of oil companies and it is your guys who do. What you fail to understand is what you advocate for is slavery to the rich and a lower standard of life for all Americans to make those at the very tippy top far richer.  Your pipe dream of a pure voluntary system simply does not work and never ever has.  You are free to think what ever you want to as this is America.   Whatever that is you still have to pay your taxes or you are completely free go and live somewhere that does not collect them.  It literally makes no difference to me.
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  9610. Red Pill  I know I am digging in sand talking to the likes of you.  That is ok as talking out loud in place like this is often the only forum people see our ideas and it has value to me.  You calling me a "Marxist" shows you have no idea what the term actually means admit it or not.  I have heard your empty stance from dozens of greed based halfwits in the past and you said absolutely nothing new nor have you refuted anything I have said.  You support an imaginary pipe dream cooked up by crooks who are buying your leaders and robbing us all blind.  When talking to people with your spin I am never trying to convince you as your have a hard core faith based vision of reality which does not value facts or data or that your vision of society will not and never has worked for anyone.   I don't think we as a people actually have to pay more tax just that the tax we pay is necessary and that it should and would e spent better if our leaders were not for sale.   Your argument we should not have any taxes is an extremist position of little moral value as "voluntary payment" is clearly more important to you than a child dying in the streets because their mom is poor.   This country is not based on volunteerism and no country on earth has had this system in any working capacity in over 100 years.  There is literally nothing in our founding documents that validates your spin and you are just making shit up.  We were minor colonial power in the days of the system you want to go back to.  You are as poorly focused as hard core communists in that you both imagine your ideology will ever survive contact with reality giving good results when they never will.   You both share a faith based fact free version of reality where you do account for the greed of those who will be given unrestricted power in your system.  The fact taxes are wasted instead being spent here is based on who we elect to our system and who they work for.  The way our taxes were once spent building infistructure, developing and supporting new technology, supporting workers rights made us the envy of the planet.  Since then we have moved away from that and those who write your parroted spin have been robbing us into decline ever since.  If our health care was public no one would be paying anymore, we would all pay less.  I am interested in how you address this fact or why you ignore it.   I must assume you purposely ignore it because it hampers your spin.  I challenge you to ask everyone you know if they feel more free paying double for their health care than anyone else in the fist world.  As far as the rich paying more, why should I care if they do not want to?   They are already benefiting from our system the most and I guess they can just leave and not make money here if they feel that strongly.  In any case arguing they are having a right stepped on by paying a couple more points on the millions they throw on the pile is defense of greed that does not look shiny when exposed for what it is.  You make paying taxes into some kind of high crime and it makes you look silly as you are clearly willing to let a person next to the one you defend die because they can not afford care.  How to better distribute our taxes and what level they are collected at is an entirely valid topic of conversation and there is room for argument debate on that subject.   But please understand that is an entirely different spin than taxes is theft.  The term first world has a definition.  We are all industrialized liberal democracies/republics meaning we value free speech, right of assembly of free press.  We are all secular states that do not actively promote any single religion and are universally market based economies.  It is associated with the countries that were considered on the allies side (later joined by Germany and Japan) and represent the countries with high standards of living.   It is summed up as the countries of the world that have many industries and relatively few poor people : the rich nations of the world We qualify because we were the first to coin the term and literally built the alliance and life style the first world represents.   The first world has high standards and are prosperous and comfortable because of that, The countries you want to be like are third world because they have none of that.   You ask who determines my health care standards and I counter with who determines yours?  Mine are based on a clearly defined set of metrics you and anyone else can validate.   I am sorry to say there is zero chance you can say the same.  So good health care and education are measured by a standard,  that you do not accept that standard or for some arbitrary reason (that you have not shared) and that you decide to reject it does show they are not better. You have not shown any insight into economics and what you propose is not used anywhere for a good reason.   Your simplistic cookie cutter talking point spin is not validated by anything but your in the bubble ignorance.  You are not learned on this issue and do not appear to have anything to teach me as your talking points are NEVER backed up with single number and your bizarre claims to some kind of superior knowledge are not proven by what you share as it is never validated nonsense.  It is clear it is you who does not understand economics as you try to pretend our credit card debt and the national debt are the same thing.  The fact is every time we print a dollar bill we create debt.  The very act of printing money creates debt out of nothing.   Hate the world economic system all you want but it is the base nature of it that debt increases and unless you propose something else to replace it you at blowing hot air and are just complaining about a symptom of it.  Our financial system is wholly based on debt and I am convinced what we are doing is not a long term solution for a great many reasons.  That being said what you propose is not the answer either as ignoring the problems your spin would cause does not make them go away.   The tip of the ice burg is the failure you have with an issue as simple as health care for the poor.  Your argument we should let them die or hope someone donates money to help them is not well thought out or actionable if we want anything but chaos.  All this bullshit about force is nonsense.  You are free to go anywhere and no one keeps you here.  Go or pay your dues to society as that is the choice you make by living here.   Vote with your feet as you have no right to make the country into a third world hell hole where poor children die because of who their parents are so you do not have to pay taxes.  Regardless of what you want it is not going to happen anyway so as it stands the only thing your empty spin does is empower the super rich to rob us more. That our government spends money poorly is not an argument we should not have one or they should not have money but that they should all be replaced.  The system is broken largely because of the fact our leaders have not and do not work for us.  We have none the services the rest of the first world enjoys because our leaders are paid by the interests who make t he trillions off our backs.  As long as our leaders are legally for sale we can expect no change.   You are not in favour of liberty, you fight for economic slavery and the empowerment of the very cancer that is rotting our system.   Greed. I would humbly suggest you find a group of like minded voters and primary the corporate whores who own the gop and pulling the sellouts in the establishment dems with them.  Until our leaders work for us they will waste our hard earned money in giveaways to their buddies and wars instead of what it should be spent on.  I want my tax dollars to be injected into our shared infrastructure and R&D and education at home creating good jobs and putting much needed money in the hands of people who work for a living reigniting the growth of the middle class.  Get your leaders to push your goals,  because as it stands they are not working for either of us it appears.
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  9611. Red Pill I say it because it true.  You are using it incorrectly and that you have your own definition does not change you have it wrong as I am in NO WAY Marxist.  You are speaking your own language and no one out side your bubble understands what you mean when you say it.  Could you define Marxist for us? I am not trying to fit anyone in my "socialist" box I am talking about what people want.  I am not sure how popular you think your vision is or why, but it is not.  You have to have workable options that address real world concerns to counter the proposals I advocate for and your spin can not and never will do that.  You are forced to use double speak and emotional terms like force, coercion and theft to frame common ideas as villainous while ignoring the deaths caused by the policy you advocate for.  You are not concerned about real world results at all and are 100% ideology based.  Accusing me as being indoctrinated does not ring true from someone that uses coded language and espouses a religious like certainty on economic assertions that have no real world model.   First rule of any cult like group of thought, accuse others of what you do.  If you are indoctrinating your followers then accuse everyone else as being indoctrinated and that is why they can not see the truth.  It allows them to dismiss when the Marxists bring up facts they have no answer for.  You are part of pretty small minority and have not shown you have an understanding of the basic concepts and terms you consistently and incorrectly use.  You mix up abject tax rejection with advocating for state and local taxes.  You used the credit card and home finances analogy when discussing the immorality of the national debt.  You think Marxist means people who  disagree with you, who are not "informed" like you.  You are part of no majority anywhere and belong to a bubble of those so lost in group think you do not even define common words the same way as the rest of the planet does.  The constitution does not layout a workable solution to health care, if it did we would have had it enacted at some point.  Please share your clearly deep insight to show I am wrong. The constitution is not a silver bullet with all the answers and it was not meant to be.  Our founders designed it to be amended and updated as we go along.  It was never meant to hold us back from what was coming next.
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  9640. Piece Be Still I think we agree on a lot actually.  The fact is many attack trump and Hillary on valid grounds even as it is often not well focused.  They do not call their authenticity or consistency out nearly as often as they should.  That being said the idea that trump is being treated unfairly because he is a man does not seem to hold much weight.    I agree that calling Hillary shrill can be considered accurate and non gendered.  But then I think she is a terrible candidate as well and it has nothing to do with her sex. That aside, there undoubtedly have been gender based attacks on her that I see as a fail because they are used to rally unwarranted support for her among a specific constituency.  I do not see this as an active issue for trump and the number of voters influenced by the way he is covered as a man would not be significant.   The gender card is played for Hillary because the idea of a woman running for this position is still considered a winner for some.  This is an idea pushed by the media who supports her and thinks it gives her an edge.  Anyone voting for her because she is woman or because of "gender based attacks" is poorly focused as her record and who she actually represents should be relevant.  That same fail can be attached to anyone who is or is not voting for trump because of his gender or any attacks he receives because of it.  He either is or is not a bully, that stands alone from gender. Woman can be bullies too and most understand that in this day and age.
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  9659. +degen83 More nonsense talking points with no context. White on white crime is the same rate and your silly spin ripped from the lips of overt self declared racists not withstanding who want blame anything but oppression for the economic state of black community.  You ignore the fact that after centuries of systemic racism with half century has consistently gone down even at the objection of an element of our society. But the always existing discrimination lack of economic opportunity and the piling of poor on tope of one another drives the numbers you cite,.  We can trace the "break down of families" and the decline of the community at large directly to government policy on trade and law enforcement.  We can map the root causes to economic contraction and an high number of imprisonments for crimes committed at the same rate by white people but not nearly as often resulting in jail.  The war on drugs and a reduction in the number of factory workers needed say the community hit harder than other sectors undermining its foundations, adding new challenges.    You may want to blame this on biology but the nature of the problem is pretty well understood and your spin is empty in the face of the facts giving it context. What is disproportional is the number of black men shot with no justifiable cause. You were earlier sighting 90% as a number of shootings that were justified. That number would mean 1 in 10 were bad. That may be an acceptable stat for you but for the sane we see it as far too high. The number of police shootings are too high no matter who they are blowing away. Of all the people who get shot for traffic offenses or selling loose smoke etc no one who is unarmed doing a non violent crime deserves to die.
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  9670. stegokitty You calling something a straw man does not makes it so.  You called the bible a historical accurate document and the only way to do that independently verify the contents.  To say otherwise is fact free.  You asserted it was my "disbelief" that drives me and not the fact very little of it is independently verified.  You asserting they are true is meaningless drivel that has no value except to someone who shares your delusion and willful ignorance. When I say independent I mean sources that are not the bible, you can not use the bible to verify itself.  The existence of Caesar is verified by multiple sources and this spin does not validate your argument but does support mine.  Addtionally Plato has been verifed as a real man by several independent sources and the survival of his writings, again this weak argument fails for the same reason as the last one.  It would cause more far hassle than it would make money and that is why they would not green light it.  It is simply not worth it.  That we have a legal separation of church and state built into our constitution is the only reason the powerful church lobby has not extended their reach deeper than they have.  Even as the bulk of the western world has legalized gay marriage we languish behind precisely because of this backward movement. That you imagine the US is progressive in the ranks of the 1st world marks you as clueless on the subject. You are the only moron in this conversion and you would be better to keep to your ingmorant bubble if you do not want to be called out on your pathetic rantings.   I have forgotten more on every subject covered so far than you will ever know.  Your assertions about archeologists are as fact free as the rest of your post.  The bible is an interesting set of documents but it takes raw unvarnished faith to call it historically accurate when much of it can not be verified. Go ahead and leave, nice of you to wrap up on a consistent note and be wrong about me yet again.
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  9693. Trexson Cole Yep and they go to jail for it too. You need to join the new century we live in.  Start watching more closely because now prosecutors throwing the book at these woman as is correct.  There is a historical double standard that we should all expect to change and it is as evidenced by the arrests.   Traditionally men were the providers but were forced into that roll as much woman were forced into theirs.  In this day and age we have options and many woman work and earn more money than their husband.  This was unheard of even as many as a few decades ago.   Access to birth control makes sense from a social and fiscal standpoint and that is why insurance companies are behind the idea,  Providing it as part of coverage actually saves the insurance companies money.  It is conservatives who are trying to step in to make choices for other people who do not agree with them.  If the cons do not want to use covered birth control no one is making them do so. On religion no one cares if you attribute your success to god except for the fact you look foolish, self important and arrogant to everyone who does not drink your coolaid.  It is when you try to force your bullshit down everyone's throat in your gods name we rightfully take exception and openly stand against you.   Standing against all religious extremists should be every real American's focus because to let them take control is to let psychos set policy and slash everyone's rights.  You may want to live in a theocracy and if you do perhaps you should move somewhere does not value freedom.
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  9810. Triangle Man Shrug, what you propose would not mitigate their power only grow it.  I am talking about groups that manipulate any system that is in place and if there was none would form their own.  Without a hand to control or limit those with power there would be nothing to curb their worst excess.  This is not about envy as you imply but the idea a society should not be contest of survival of the fittest especially when the contest is rigged from the start.  The system you propose would not be a meritocracy in any sense of the word. The idea of a classless society is an ideal that has been attempted and failed spectacularly in contact with reality.  Weather you support communism or libertarianism they both have the same basic flaws of being impossible to implement in a form that benefits the society that adopts them.  Anarchy is chaos anytime it has reared it head in human society. To imagine your vision of it is any different is bury your head in the sand and deny reality.   The government is force, tax is theft mantra is popular but simplistic and valueless as anything but a catch phrase that has a visceral appeal but is poorly thought out. Our society would be a shadow of itself with out them and you can point to no society in the history of man that has prospered with that as a guiding principle and certainly no modern one.  I know that the state "interfering" in the market helps, heck the market would not even exist in its current form with out the infrastructure and legal framework that allows it to exist.   Does that mean I do not think it has problems and it it is perfect, of course not.  I just do not think throwing the out the baby with the bathwater is a solution in favor of hope based nonsense that has clear and definable issues.  We are much better to try to work to change our existing system and curb its worst excess's than to throw the whole thing out and then throw ourselves on the mercy of the greedy and most powerful.
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  9812. Triangle Man You are an idealist, I am a realist.  I do not seek perfection I seek a system that is workable that serves us in a way that promotes freedom, ingenuity and equality of opportunity.  I know that does not sound much like our society today but that does not mean with the correct changes our system could morph to be more like what I am talking about.  I have heard of no workable solution attached to your views.  I seen no set of polices that would achieve it after a great deal of searching.  I am no slave to the system and the idea I can not see beyond it means you have no idea who I am or the path I have taken to come to my conclusions.  The farm analogy is pretty funny as few animals who live in on a farm do very well outside it on their own.  Out in the wild it is literally dog eat dog and that you imagine most wild animals are better off or lead more comfortable lives than those on a farm does not say much for you spin.  Almost all animals who live on a farm would not exist but for the farmer.  Now do I not imagine our society is a farm and my government is a farmer. We know what happens to a society when there is no common education.  We know what happens to a society that does not have taxes and can not enforces law.  We have examples of these societes and they are not remotely desirable or workable in the management of a large population like ours.  I have long rejected the taxes is theft mantra as thieves NEVER give you value or provide services for your money.  The fact is I look around this country and then compare it to tax free states like Somalia and it then make an easy choice.  Until someone explains how this tax free classless society you imagine will work I will continue to regard it a pie in the sky fiction.   I will instead work to ensure the taxes collected  are spent in the most productive ways to encourage growth and innovation.  To promote equality of opportunity and that a high standard of safe comfortable living is ensured.  This can be and is already being acheived in a great many societies throughout the world who have found a much better balance than we have.  I have sound models and examples to base my changes on, I can not imagine you an say the same.
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  9813. Triangle Man What is ironic about your pig analogy is the pig is one of the few animals on a farm that can survive on it's own in the wild.  If you imagine just because it can do that it is better off you are missing some key facts.  The freedom to go hungry, the freedom to die early of preventable disease, the freedom to never grow as large or live as long are not freedoms the sane fight for.  There is no time in human history where so many were so comfortable, so many were so rich, so many were so well fed and few children died just after birth. The west meaning our societies have real problems but represent the pinnacle of comfort of lifestyle for all of human history for the vast majority within them. That you imagine your system would do a better job is not validated by anything other than your imagination.  We  know what happens when the type of stateless chaos you desire is enacted, we have real world examples. The way we run our society is a failure except in comparison to every other system or proposed system I have have ever seen or heard of.   Since you have an inside track that is not propaganda I am more than happy to have you lay it out as I do not think you have an actual workable system but would be interested to hear what you think it is. Be warned I have watched a great many clownish ideas be put forth and have rejected them for very good reasons that have nothing to do with my love of "slavery". There is nothing desirable about Somalia and that they had issues before does not mean any of them have been addressed in chaos.  If they are your buddies example of a society in transition then he will be correctly dismissed as sharing nonsense. I compared Africa to the west because it is the only place on the planet that has that has a semblance of the system you desire.  A society free of a social contract where the individual rules supreme and everyone looks out for themselves with no responsibility to anyone else.
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  9890. George Montag 4% of the population makes up .07% of the federal prison population .. This means atheists go to jail at a much lower rate than the faithful as a percentage.  It appears numbers are confusing to you but try to keep up.   Education is attached to this subject but the fact Atheists are better educated should say something about them too.   Religion is attached to ignorance and in every community the worse the education the higher the popularity of religion is.   I am not saying atheism causes anything. My point is the evidence no matter what reasons are supports the assertion that the atheist sub group is not "less moral" than the religious majority.  If you want to say they have no morals then you need something to back that up.  Otherwise it is a specious claim that should be rejected by anyone that looks at any of the data.  From crime statistics to divorce rates theists literally have no metric that marks them as more moral.   Give me a metric that validates your claim (not that you can) and I will play the same semantic game you are attempting to here.  Theists in this video claim moral superiority with absolutely nothing backing it up but bad smelling air.  All the stuff brought up about prison, divorce, torture support is just evidence to show their assertion is dead wrong.  That they do not present any data themselves marks their self serving spin as weak and without merit.    I will say this one more time slowly for you, atheism does not inform morality at all.  What it does do is free you from the shackles of dogma and when people do that it appears on balance they end up choosing to act more moral.  This can be tied to making a conscious choice of how you treat the world and a realization of the value of the only life you will ever have.  A world with out divine forgiveness inspires a need to take personal responsibility for ones actions many theists apparently ignore. 
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  9926. Enemy Sub It is not an innate feature of the religion that has inspired Christianities step away from barbarity.  They equally as flawed and it has been the advent of secularism in christian centered nations that has made them more benign not the merits of the faith.  It was not long ago the exact same barbarity was done in the name of Christ and in places that allow it the religion is still used as a hammer for maintaining conformity. I am not pretending there is not a problem in the Muslim world.   I universally deride all fundamentalist positions and claims.  I am just pin pointing what the real issue is and what the process that tamed the barbaric tendencies of Christianity was.  It had nothing to do with demonizing the faith, it was changed by secularism taking away its ability make law and control education. Historically rulers of the christian regions no longer wanted to be subject to religious law  or control of the church in general.  Christianity then progressively lost the power to promote dangerous xenophobic education and policy.  It has not stopped extremists from trying but the bulk of "Christians" no longer have the desire to promote it in free societies because of this process. It was the freedom to step from under the finger of the church and church law that changed  Christianity into what it is today. We should be encouraging a path toward secular governments not under control of church law to combat extremism.  Places that do this universally have less of this brand of barbarity.   Ensuring and promoting actual freedom within our partner states is the only long term path forward.  Demonizing the entire group as the problem does nothing but alienate our best allies who get swept up in generalizations about the faith that are no less true of Christians. There is nothing regressive in my position.  I do not apologize for any religion even as my nuanced view on how to deal with this huge problem is not universal derision for the most actively barbaric.  I do not count all Christians as abortion bombers and clowns who think the our constitution should be replaced with the bible.  Likewise I do not tar all Muslims as idiots like ISIS and monsters that hack a man to death with a machete.  To do so with either is counter productive and serves the needs of extremists to appeal to moderate members as jointly demonized.  You are playing into the hands of actual regressives by taking this fundamentalist spin and you only need to look at your allies to know the danger of the path you choose.
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  9936. Gatesbrown26  It is true that fundamentalist is an adjective but it is also distinct classification of religious thought and you can ignore that fact but it does not make your spin stronger. . As far as the base religions are concerned they are much the same and agree on mostly everything except who is right about their version of nonsense.  The key difference between them is the amount of political power they wield and their ability to write law based on dogma normalizing it. I learned that they were the much the same cancer by talking to actual different types of fundamentalists at length and after a great deal of study.  I am parroting no one. It is true that fundamentalist is an adjective but it is also distinct classification of religious thought and you can ignore that fact but it does not make your spin stronger. I never said fundamentalist implies murder and personally make a strong distinction between backward dogma mired fundamentalists and terrorists who are fundamentalists that have taken it one step further driven to push their political ideals. I can oppose both religious dogmatic, anti science anti freedom, fundamentalists and fundamentalists who have all those flaws but are also terrorists at the same time.   In actuality the plain fundamentalists are the larger danger to their respective societies as there are many more of them.  They universally work to enact restrictive law and shove their bullshit down everyone's throat with the power of the state and over the long term cause more damage to their societies by holding them back.  I universally oppose fundamentalist thought because they do not value freedom and have been on the wrong side of every fight for rights waged.  Those that murder in their gods name are terrorists, jihadists or what ever you want to call them but they consistently are fundamentalists first.  There is no such thing as a liberal Christian who bombs abortion clinics or a non fundamentalist Muslim who declares a jihad. I will most certainly not give up hacking on fundamentalists, it is my religious right.  Every time I see a right winger talking about the evils of Islam hating gays I am reminded that Christin fundamentalists have the exact same flaw.  The key difference as always is the amount of power they have to enforce it.
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  9971. Sasha Shepherd Your anecdotal assertions are simply not true.   The idea of patriarchy is well established and is not a demoization of men but instead speaks to a way off a society organizing itself.  In the past we most certainty were a patriarchy and have been moving away from it but the legacy of that truth still lingers.  Most men had no more say in how that society was run than woman and were pigeonholed into roles not of their choice because of societal standards thrust on them just like they were for woman. There is nothing wrong with talking about the enduring legacy of patriarchy even as we move away from it.  Again this concept is not a men against woman thing and anyone who thinks it is has it wrong.  They may believe it, because in many respects it is still true. Of course it is not the 1950's anymore but to say that being a man does not have distinct unspoken advantages in specific circumstances is silly.  Woman have their own advantages in our society too as dictated by social standards. It is very arguable our move toward banishing these kinds of standards has been unevenly applied but it is invalid to say they do not exist.  Some believe a) and b) but not many do in the context you imply they do.  You are a denying these ideas are remotely valid and in doing so you have taken an position that ignores historical and societal truths.  None of these issues are distinctly about males or females but instead are about societal expectations and rolls thrust upon us by society rather than individuals choosing them.  Anyone who plays the woe is me card is missing the point that we are not trapped by anything anymore and are free to break the chains that held our grandparents into an assigned place based on their sex.  That does not mean there is not continued pressure based on the way we did things that will not push back sometimes. You can hold both mentioned positions and not represent the simplistic caricature you draw.   There are radical fems that miss the point too but as you take the stance you do you become their polar opposite and become as misguided in your passion as they are.
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  9982. Chronicles Of Manliness Your views and choices to reject the ugly part of your dogma by understanding it's context is laudable.  It means you are using your own ability to discern good from bad to inform your faith.  I see your type of theist as more or less benign except for the credibility you lend to the crazies.   The real issue in the debate is neither of you gets to claim you have the only "correct" vision of what your faith teaches.   Even as I more or less agree with you on your approach I am forced to point out saying they do not follow the faith is a fallacy.  You are committing a no true Scotsman fallacy in rejecting the fundamentalists as a true members of your faith.  You are forced to do the mental gymnastics explaining how their vision is wrong and yours is right when in truth neither of you have a definitive claim to being the correct version of the religion. Personally being forced to live according to anyone's religious vision holds no appeal to me as there is no guarantee the flavor who takes control will value my freedom to reject it. Religion should be a choice but never a foundation of law because to do so is innately discriminatory to those who do not share it. Any country that lives under religious law is under control of fundamentalists who will consistently maintain outdated age old dogma rife with failure over justice or freedom. That is the key failure of the Muslim world especially the places that are theocracies or the church has a major say in policy.  Christian's would be just as bad given half a chance but we ripped away that ability from them long ago and are protected by a separation of church and state that supports progress on rights issues. 
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  10029. ***** Your stated position enacted would make many woman into baby making slaves, it does not matter why you support it. Your counter arguments do not address this key fact.  Your solution that they should not get pregnant is a painfully childishly simple and is burying your head in the sand and dumping the issue on the woman.  You support a policy that dehumanizes them and makes critical life decisions on their behalf.   Your view represents the biggest of big government and it is you imposing your view point onto living breathing people for the sake of those who do not even exist yet and may not ever. There is no way to objectively debate the subject of totally banning abortion if you value freedom.  This is a subject that marks you as either pro tyranny or in favor of individual freedom.   It is like arguing in favor of slavery, it does not matter how calm and respectful you are your position is bankrupt. I personally abhor the need for abortions and because of that I support policy that has been consistently shown to fundamentally reduce them.  I argue for economic and education changes that would see the problem mitigated further. This effort is also obstructed by your allies in the anti choice movement.  The attack on abortion rights is an attack on woman and that is a result of your effort no matter what your motivations are.  You may argue that this in not why you hold your views but that is irrelevant to the results. We already have a moderate policy on abortion and the line can not be drawn back from there. The cost of equality and the right to control ones own body and destiny is too high for us to let the standard slide any further. 
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  10211. You are free to think what you want but atheism has NO tenets and does not inform the atheists actions in anyway. It is a single stance on a single subject and if you do horrible things you do not get to blame your faith like the religious do by laying it at the feet of a gods will. Stalin had nothing to point at as justification for his actions besides his own standards which had nothing to do with him believing in a deity or not. He was a product of his time and was an authoritarian at heart and any whim he personally had was imposed by the state. It is not shocking a dictator and a man who was comfortable killing millions to further his goals and the growth of his power had other policy failures including an attack on unpopular minority community that was traditionally shunned. Pretending his atheism drove this policy in the same way it does fundamentalists who point to their holy book is not remotely valid. It was a short time ago that Christianity preached the exact same spin against the LGB community as Islam does and some still do. It was secularism and the pulling of the teeth of the power of the church that allowed tolerance to grow against the objections and the continuing objections of the church. Pretending that atheism is a faith that informed anyone's actions in the same way the church overtly promotes garbage based on text in their respective holy books is a simple false equivalency that has no basis in reality. Christianity (recently historically) once had the same diametrical sets of rules and the bible overtly calls homosexuality an abomination. Atheism literally does not inform opinion about gay people either way. Islam is worse on this issue now because much of it still lives under religious law and has not enjoyed the benefits of secularism unlike Christianity which has been made it much more moderate and modern. That is the key difference.
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  10219. whyamimrpink78 You have been misinformed about Canada and there is nothing wrong with thier system and no one who is informed there envies us.  The only wait time that are longer are for elective procedures have a longer wait time but that is balanced out by the much lower cost per consumer they all pay directly thru their taxes instead of to an insurance company.   Government involvement lowers the cost of health care everywhere it is involved and it is a lack of price controls and the nature of our private insurance supplies that makes our prices so high. We are not #1 but are ranked 37 in health care.  If you are a billionaire and money is not object then our system is great. For everyone else the costs in our system are problematic at best resulting in health care being the single largest cause of bankruptcy in the US.  Health care is rationed everywhere including here.  The difference is there they do it by need and not by cost.  If you are doing an elective procedure you can expect to wait longer.  Here the insurance companies attempt to ration it by rejecting certain procedures or trying to invalidate your coverage not to mention you actually having insurance.  The spin that anyone dies waiting for care in the Canadian system is patently false when it is a estimated that over 40,000 people died in the US because of a lack of insurance.  The choice between these two evils should be simple for most people. Our non secondary eduction system is in shambles because of an attack on it from within.  Just like the private prison industry now monopolizes our jails the private education industry wants our tax dollars from schools.  There is a great deal that can be done to improve our systems to be more like the best in the world and none of them has anything to do with handing a few multinationals billions of more tax dollars.  Your diversity argument falls flat when you compare the US to a place like Canada.  Their major cites boast the most diverse communities on the planet and are considered a model for strong communities.  3 Canadian cities rank in the top 5 for comfort and happiness.  The idea we have a monopoly on size or diversity is not well founded.  None of these issues explains why you imagine a min wage is harmful.  It does not explain why you advocate a health care system that is the most expensive in the world but delivers consistently below par results for a first world country.  It does not explain any of the right wing spin that no one else anywhere else follows.  I say we look at what works and not what will make your think tank spin generators happy.
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  10245. J Stevens Of course regulations are not our problem.  The issue is not as nuanced as you want to sell it as.  Taking your car to a body shop when you pay for it is cheaper than when you go through insurance is because of cost control. You can get a better rate than insurance companies because you care, you are motivated to get a better price and the repair guys know this.  This same phenomena occurs in medical insurance and private for profit hospitals.  Insurance companies pay whatever and simply pass the cost onto you with no problem for them. This has seen our insurance premiums explode as costs are raised which are passed onto us.   In single payer systems that problem is mitigated as the costs are controlled from up front and economies of scale are achieved. Not to mention the useless middle men that are insurance companies do not have to get paid saving you the consumer even more. There is no proposed system put forth by anyone on your side that mitigates these issues.   Health care is a specially closed market so your free market fixes all claims do not apply.  The free market is about generating revenue and if that is the measure then ours is a great system.  The nature of the product drives this fact and not regulations.  The blather that "the free market" would fix it is pie in the sky nonsense not validated outside your imaginary world when in fact it is already wildly successful by corporate standards. Which system works best is already decided by empirical fact unless your measure is how much cash does it generate for hospitals and the insurance industry.  For many that would be a bad focus when the goal should be to provide health care without bankrupting the population.
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  10312. Moe S That spin about people in other countries is a straw man as there is no proposal to 'redistribute' our wealth globally even on the table and we are talking about solving an internal endemic problem that is hurting production and killing our citizens. We all are complicit with murder in the respect you talk about as we let children die of starvation in other countries. I can imagine a time where it will be unconscionable that we ever did that. In a perfect world we would see some of the massive resources we spend on the military world wide spent on a effort to end child hunger, but one battle at a time. Your spin about the poor in other countries literally has nothing to do with this discussion. This is not a slippery slope argument. We are talking about a better way to distribute access to a critical resource like health care, to make our systems work better and more efficiently. Babbling about conceptual theft when the system is already communal marks your weak talking point as having no merit. No one has to advocate we support the planet to fight for the most effective and affordable version of health care or education for Americans. The idea of a system working for the majority is far better than one that works only for the powerful and the rich. A wise man once said a democracy is the worst political system except as measured against all others. Your concern for theft is telling as you are willing to let bodies drop to defend it. This undermines your morality concern, in honesty it seems to be about greed and rings as very poorly focused as it supports an existing status quo which is neither moral or efficient.
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  10369. fouroverseven Referring to it as anything else but a health care choice is only anti choice spin.   Abortion is 100% health care and nothing else about it matters.  The changes that occur in a woman body when she carries a child should be hers to control.  This is a process that directly affects her heath and there is no way to spin the procedure as anything but her health care choice. She many not "lose any organs" but having a child permanently and fundamentally changes a woman's body.  It alters it in subtle and not so subtle ways. It is a procedure that at one time killed a significant number of woman and still can. Why the pregnancy occurred should be irrelevant to the fact it is the woman and the woman alone should determine if she is going to elect to carry it to term.  Neither rape or consensual sex is a pathway to force a woman to do anything against her will, especially if it directly effects her health. Your spin is not an apt analogy. A pre 20 week fetus (representing all elective abortions) is not the same thing as a free willed living human who can exist as something other than a parasite inside the mother.  A better analogy would be; when traveling while passing through a town you have a bad car accident.  It was your choice to drive that car so what occurs is on you.  You are rushed to their hospital but they do not treat you there because they believe it is better to pray your injuries away.  They would make your health care decisions for you because of their faith,  it does not matter if you share it or not.
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  10371. fouroverseven It is only you who classifies life as cheap valuing what comes after much more.  I value actual life in a way you never ever will.  In valuing a persons freedom and an individuals control of their own health we are hammering the home the value of it and even better taking steps to see it is productive and happy.  You would fight for everyone to bow their head your rules, to conform to your narrow and simple spin.  You value this as a concept far more than you value the quality of any of the lives touched by your used of force. It is you and your kind who would jam your vision of morality down the nations  throat in a fit of self riotous chest beating which as usual is only half the story.   It is the people of your ilk that would force mothers to have children and then is the same breath say they are moochers when they are not prepared to support it on their own. Every time you improperly classify a pre 20 week fetus as a person you are doing nothing but naked spin.  Under it all your initially apparent concern for a fetus is really driven by a desire to punish woman for acting in a way you do not agree with.  Your own poorly thought out vision of what is right is made paramount over the quality of life and heath of the mother.  You do not really value any fetus the second it takes a breath of air as evinced by other polices "pro lifers" support.  This fact betrays your true motives. You would blindly and indiscriminately force the child on her because she had the temerity to have sex. Most woman who get an abortion later go on to have children,  this makes it not a matter of if she has the child but when.  I stand firm with the law that it should be her making that choice and never the state and most certainly not you.
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  10372. fouroverseven If I ask any embryologist none of them should call a fetus a person because they most certainly are not.  An abortion ends the life of a potential person, calling a fetus a person is like call batter a souffle.  They call it a fetus and not a baby for very good reasons. A fetus is not independent life form and have no existence or ability to live without compromising the mothers system.  It should be her choice and her choice along weather or not she chooses to carry it to a point it can exist without her. You are choosing to shove your particular morals down our throats,  Based on nothing more than your own feelings you would presume to make rules that only apply to half our population.  The selective nature of this law is what sets it apart from all any of the standard ones you can point to.  Most laws apply to everyone and not just specific members of society.  The laws are innately sexist as they can only be applied to woman.  The balance between abortion anarchy and no abortions we have struck is an effort to grant them a path to make their own choice while weeding irresponsible termination of viable fetus's.  Very few people espouse Abortion anarchy in the same way you fight for prohibition.  Our postion is balanced and fair and leaves room for each person to oppose or support abortion while allowing each woman to make her own choice. When it comes to "morality" laws like public nudity they are not in stone and change with the times.  Most laws associated with morals have been attempts to deny fundamental rights and many of them that once existed are now defunct as is correct.  In the end this issue is not about morality but a desire to deny woman a choice that has been on the table for all woman all the way back into antiquity.    I do not think a "supposed right" trumps your desire to force children on people, I think is a definitive right.  A living woman's right to self determination and control of her body sit clearly above your concerns.  It is a health care issue and that you do not value that truth does not change why it is so critical.  Women have always sought out abortions when they felt they were not in a position to have a child or if having one would kill her.  Before a woman's right was put in stone by Roe vs Wade women were dieing because they could not access safe abortions.  You would go back to those days with no concern for the lives that would be destroyed and the living breathing woman that would most certainly die.
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  10373. You use no defensible standard to determine person hood from what I can tell.   Abortion is never ever genocide if it is being chosen by the individual woman.  To say otherwise is emotionally loaded bullshit.   Laws in our society should apply to everyone evenly.  The laws against getting an abortion are by default innately sexist.   You are forced to apply a set of laws that only applied to half our population.  Laws are the feature of every society but laws that apply to only one group of people are only common in theocracies and backward tyrannies. Say sorry again but it does not matter if you see it as health care as this is a matter that has already been decided.  This is an issue of health care first and foremost and not amount of anti choice rhetoric changes that fact It is not a myth.  We have documented abortions all the way back int antiqity. The bible itself has one of the oldest abortion reciples Numbers 5:12-28.  The idea that they were not occurring here before legalization is pure clap trap.  We know what happens when medical procedures are done under the table and there are documented cases of women losing their lives.   This continues to occur in places that have banned abortions (see the locations mentioned above) When it comes to misrepresenting statistics you and your group are not one to point fingers.  The pictures of "murdered children" you are so proud to march around with are from late term abortions.  These are abortions that are only legal in the US if the life of the mother is in imminent danger of the fetus is not viable or a couple other stringent restrictions.  This represents 5% of all abortions here but if we were to listen to your emotion head crushing bullshit you would imagine it is business as usual.  Honesty is not your strong suit.  I have not idea who you are talking about when you mention NARAL, they are not one of my sources.  As far as I am concerned if one living breathing woman dies because of your midi evil spin that is one too many.
    2
  10374. fouroverseven Well you may not but that does not invalidate the people that do.  I care for all individuals right to self determination as a key component of the pursuit of happiness and what it means to live in a free society.  I reject your definitions and therefor it makes it easy to reject your spin.    You ask how a set of laws that only pertain or effect 1/2 of the population are sexist? This is not a complex idea.   These rules only apply to and effect woman.  To make a set of laws that only applies to part of your population is the path to tyranny.   The only places that do so are represented by the most backward religious states and that you agree with them does not give the idea any merit. It has been decided by the supreme court of the United states.  Most americans do not in fact agree with your spin and see giving the woman a choice as the correct path.  You belong to a minority who would gleefully see your values and simplistic vision of justice driven down living breathing americans throat to serve an ideal no one is compelled to agree with.   Again your subjective determination of what is evil completely precludes the valid and often life saving reasons for making the choice.  They did so for reasons that were important to them and that you do not value their ability to make such critical choices does not mean there were not very sound and good reasons to make it.   You are not part of the crowd that looks forward or would see the inequities and failures of our past left behind. Your views are a direct attachment to a time where a woman's choice meant nothing. The pre 20 week fetus weighs  less than 10.5 ounces and looks like many other mamales at some point in their development.  They do not even a have a nervous system yet and this is one of the many reasons the 20 week period was chosen.   In many places abortion is legal it is open up to the due date but here we have a much more balanced approach.  Getting an abortion is a very safe procedure and no more less woman as a % ever die from them than they do child birth.  Our pre 20 week date is in place to eliminate the chance there is any suffering on behalf of the fetus being aborted.  For ever anecdotal set of bullshit you share I can give you a 1000 stories that lead to the mother completing her education and have a child late when she is ready for it. You make the implication we have more than 5% when you talk about the ease of getting a medical exception to the rule.  If it is so easy why is that number only 5% then?  You own failed rhetoric is tripping you.  And I do not care who they are.  As long as they are not trying to shove their views down anyone's throat by law they are free to be ass hats or angels as far as I am concerned.  You are the ones that need to be stood against as you do not values the rights of half our population to control their bodies or their health.  You and yours are the cancer that would see your stunted simplistic version of morality shoved down an entire nations throat.
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  10395. +Paul Swanee They have gain additional profit by being freed from restrictions and safety measures imposed by the public.  This is why they have bought our leaders to take things like  our taxes and cut programs that help us and transfer that wealth in the form of subsidies to themselves.  This is only an interim tactic as if they had no government and no regulations and no taxes they would not need to manipulate the system and it would be ideal for them except for the fact we would not have  a country.   There would be no worker or environmental protections and product standards would be based on what they could get away with and not safety.    The idea there is no need for federal standards and that every state should decide what level of poison is ok for their constituency is nothing but a defense for pollution.   It does not change anything but the scale and the results are actually far worse for everyone living under it and far better for the corporations which will force a race to the bottom on standards.   That you think only the states should set labour standards does not eliminate the corruption aspect it just makes it easier for those who want to manipulate the leaders in any given state,  There is no upside for this unless you want corporations to have far more power over your daily lives than they do now.  The idea that the free market corrects polluters and rip off artists is undermined by the fact the consumers often have no idea who is poisoning them and most have no capacity to find out or they do not buy the product anyway. Either that they find out far too late and those responsible may not even be in the market anymore by the time the problem is even detected.  Additionally if they sell a product like coal or some industrial chemical that you do not buy and the purchaser may not care about your river then you are screwed.  At that point if they own your leaders (as they will and they did) then you will have zero recourse except to suck it up and watch the rivers catch fire exactly like they did before the EPA. That the government who ostensibly represents us has the monopoly on power instead of some multi national who would otherwise is fine with me.  That power should be in the hands of the people and not the mega rich who will have it otherwise. If there is going to be a monopoly of power it should be based on our elected government and not dictatorship like corporations slaved to profit and nothing else.   The idea state governments do a better job is betrayed by the fact they never have and it took federal standards to correct our formerly grievous problems that are still effecting people today.  This is plan of yours licence to live under corporate feudalism and is a giant step backwards.
    2
  10396. The nature of our markets is too complex and there is no reason for someone else in a distant district to care about your river or any way to collect or report on the information of who is poisoning it.   In the system you propose you expect the small to police the big in court and there is no way to apply this concept in an way that will not favour the powerful in real life.  You can not be educated enough to know what if any given product you buying off any given self is safe in your system.  We currently have a system that sets standards and it allows you to expect your product is safe as you buy it.  There would be no such expectation with no regulations.  Now that peace of mind has cost to it, but as a system it works pretty well.  What you propose would mean you would have to know on your own the background of every single product you buy at any given grocer or at the best would require that level of scrutiny by the grocer in question who would pass the costs onto you anyway.  We should all be smarter consumers but in this day and age when products can come from anywhere and many will not have any back ground on them for you to research even if you wanted to the idea we should let the market take care of it is not well thought out.  We know for a fact that even with standards many groups try to end run them to save a buck.  Opening under new names after old names were tarnished removing your ability to even know what they make now.  The sue the company argument breaks down when it is not about money.  What happens if it costs the life of a loved one or your health.  Then the money they pay you will be cold comfort and may just be the cost of doing business for them.  Using the courts to enforce your basic rights against those with many more resources to throw at the problem seems like a system made to serve them. I personally think we should stick with first world standards as the liberty to be poisoned or robbed by a crooked agreement is not one I seek.
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  10402. ZZzzzzzWhat Not true, I see him decrying terrorists all the time and that you do not is simply a function of your bias.   He supports islamo fascism like he supports any fascism. not at all.  I challenge you to validate he or anyone on this show does  by providing a link proves it.  Do so and I will explain why you are wrong.   If you call them attempting undermine my personal freedom, our education system and our foreign policy aesthetic reason we have a different definition for the terms. All progressives criticize Muslim fundamentalists of all sorts.  They actually are consistent and attack all fundamentalists.  But the fact is Muslim fundamentalists have no power in the us even as it is undeniable Christian versions do.  Muslims are powerless in this country and being concerned about them is worrying about the threat in the distance as a knife is pushed against your spine.   I do not support any religion let alone Islam. But if I let clowns like you attack any faith and succeed I know others you oppose are next.  We all have to be free to pick our religion or no one will get to.  I do not agree with any faith on the plant but if I value my religious freedom I have to stand up for all religions right to exist if I am to expect my freedom to remain intact.   Your desire to go on a holy crusade against those you do not agree with is an innately religious perspective.  I get it you all like to murder people you do not agree with but we should probably limit to the actual criminals. Our best sources for information to use against real Islamic fundamentalists comes from other Muslims.  Just like when you go hunting christian murderers you talk to the other Christians they interact with.  There is no solving the issue of Muslim extremism by attacking other Muslims who think the clowns who cut off heads are assholes too. I actually want to deal with the criminals, you just want to throw wood on the fire.  
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  10438. Joe Verlander Of course they identify themselves as athiests but that is primarily a function of rejecting all versions of religious claims and what that means to theists.  It says almost nothing about you as an individual or what policy positions you hold. The risks you mention are mitigated by the groups in question not fighting for the primacy of their views but an assurance any one of the religions has no power over them.  Your hypothetical concern can be traced to no real world implementation or even common proposal where policy has been by tilted by atheists against another group. If all theists and especially Evangelical theists in general did the same thing you ask of the secular groups there would be no real opposition to religion by athiests.  The only reason secular groups are organizing for a common cause is to promote the idea that no dogma should be driving public policy.  There would be no need to form secular or atheist groups to counter the religious if they were not trying to impose their views on all. When one advocates public policy that is entirely based on what their vision of god wants it is valid and even laudable to call them out on it.  I see no value in silence when there ore others attempting to base real world policy on their interpretation of a special book each of the religious cite as guides.  Faith is belief in something in spite of the lack of sound evidence tangible evidence. Any attempts to dominate public policy by theists as theists can not be ignored as their views are universally validated by nothing but blind and unreasoning faith. In the US Christianity has never ever been under attack, their right to unilaterally impose their vision of law, science and "morality" on everyone else is.
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  11043.  @Greendalewitch  Pelosi feels no pressure on M4A no matter what. If she does stage this vote under "pressure" she will then paint it as validating her as both fair and a correct when it fails. Biden just won as he said he would veto M4A and sadly since the primaries it no longer enjoys the support it once did at it's height. The support has declined because it is out of the spotlight and is out of mind of many voters who only consume corporate media. Meanwhile unsurprisingly the public option has gotten more popular. I am unconcerned about our ability to make M4A popular again. All we really have to do is put it in the news cycle. Doing so would be even more effective and easy during a pandemic as you correctly point out. That being said I point to the fact that in a short amount of time the corporate media has managed to dim M4A's popularity as it fell out of the news cycle and was no longer pushed. This makes it clear to me our bump in support has a limited shelf life if we do not capitalize on it. I am concerned that playing that card now will give the corporate stooges too long to mitigate it with spin and lies and crush what we gained before the primaries where it would be of most use. Expending the capital in this way precludes us from spending it on others. It takes other options off the table and to me this is arguably the biggest downside. This is if they do not successfully use it in a media fest to attack the policy and paint the lost vote as a failure of the fringe undermining the exercise entirely. We already have a battalion of establishment democrats to put pressure on for this issue including the president. We should be doing so as we speak by contacting them and letting them know how we feel. Demonizing any of the few leaders that actually represent ideas we stand for because you do not share their political strategy is only counter productive in my eyes.
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  11192. Devoted Any baker could say no to that, just like they could say no to making a cake for you where you are buggering your lovely bride to be. He can not tell the gay person because I do not like your life style I will not make that cake and then make it for you and your wife to be. He could say no to both of you as a creative choice as that is not the kind of cake he makes, he could offer you both an acceptable option he could make. Putting their names on it is not a creative design consideration and if he offered the service to anyone else then he is obliged to offer it to them. An objection or inability to create the design is not the same as caring if both names are male or female. Would he feel the same way if the hetero couple Pat and Steve get married? We know the answer. It is not a creative objection, it is literally not. If he sells cakes with names written on them then he is compelled to provide the same service for all. If can not do so like the Mennonite and his choice not to be a bus driver it should only effect him. He is not serving all people equally. He is denying service to a minority based on his own personal deeply held beliefs which are his right but should not extend or effect anyone else but him. What is cruel is to force others deal with marginalization in defense of bigotry based on faith based garbage and the fact they are throwbacks with more akin to ISIS than a modern american. Don't pretend you are moral or value anyone's rights but the bigots with your spin. Buddy has right to believe any nonsense he wants to, he does not have the right to marginalize other Americans access to goods and services. If he honestly can not make the cake then he should find something else to do, it is on him as it should be.
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  11200.  @jaydilla519  This issue is not about gun ownership, it is what gun ownership means there. The strict regulation around firearms the NRA prevents here is the key difference between us. The rules around storage, procurement and distribution are such in their system that gun ownership is thought of as a responsibility, here it is treated as a right. The idea it is a right (sold by the NRA) has stopped legislators enacting the common sense restrictions which limit the gun violence in other regions. We have much of the gun regulation they do, sadly here it is sporadically enacted and unevenly enforced between regions. These inconsistences render the rules useless even though they work well in other regions where they are universally applied No first world nation has our issues with gun violence, we are dead last in every category that matters on this issue. Racing to the bottom by comparing us to a list of countries that are in literal civil wars or some state of war lord of the week anarchy is not much of a sell on your spin. We give gun ownership the status of a right even as we openly acknowledge in our legal system some people should be restricted from access. Our system (through the efforts of the NRA on behalf of the gun manufacturing lobby) ensures those people who should not have access to high capacity potentially very dangerous weapons have it, theirs does not. The NRA takes ownership of our gun problems as they insist on leaving loopholes for stopping undesirable procurement open and fight to stop all common sense universal regulation even if widely popular and proven effective.
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  11267. I am a big M4A supporter but I do not agree with Jimmy or Kyle on this issue. The fact is I see the demand as symbolic at best, M4A is losing popularity since the primary and a loss in congress will do more harm than good until we have an opportunity to rebuild it again. This will not pass and is as I see a it a poor use of political capital. I agree with the idea of getting something for her leadership support in principle but see the demand for this vote right now as of little value. Any of these leaders that vote yes can not be trusted (just like the co-sponsors) and those who do not can evolve when it comes to real vote with the pressure Kyle speaks of. The vote count demanded is as "good" as the M4A sponsor list, meaning it is deeply flawed.. We know who to organize against in the next elections already. Best we get from this list is a few more names. We have a whole raft of anti Medicare targets to hit even without this vote. Any of us who would be concerned about how this vote would go are not going to vote for an anti Medicare candidate anyway. I do not see this vote changing the status quo or even threatening it. If she is going to demand something for the vote attach it to relief bills or other priorities that change the here and now not this gesture that will be forgotten or invalid in two years. She said she was focused on doing other things, that is not saying she was doing nothing or leaving M4A behind. It is not a matter of they support a vote for M4A but if pushing it the best use of our limited political capital in this moment.
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  11305.  @disciplewill7696 You do need to go on, On the issue of black jobs Trump inherited and continued Obama's policy that saw the largest declines joblessness in the Black Community in history. Unfortunately Trump also continued the trend of those jobs being low paying and sub living wage. Opportunity zones are bullshit to allow already rich assholes to dodge taxes. It does not go to the people in the community and has primarily focused on real-estate development for already wealthy. Trump pretended they were some kind of boon when in fact they were just another tax cut for clowns who do not need one. The Pay Protection Plan (PPP) from the Small Business Administration left Black businesses out in the cold. Over 90% of Black-owned small businesses that applied for PPP funding were denied. This has led to over 40% of Black-owned small businesses being shuttered during COVID-19. Trump ended racial sensitivity training stating it was racist and it is ironic considering that hate crimes increased over 200% in places where he held a campaign rally in 2016. His language about “Liberate Michigan” and “Stand back and stand by” may have contributed to the kidnapping plots of Michigan and Virginia Governors. In addition to Trump’s inflammatory rhetoric, the recent ban on trainings using critical race theory and addressing white privilege are an admission that improving workplace culture is not part of a Trump administration. Trump has appointed the most Appeals Court judges since President Jimmy Carter. Not one of them is Black. With a strongly conservative set of judges, many of them will affect judicial outcomes for at least the next generation on topics of critical importance to Black Americans, including policing, sentencing, voting, healthcare, and racial equity. Trump was CANCER for the black community and the lie putting him in the same stratosphere as Lincoln is base stupid and detached from reality. You trump cultists would hate Lincoln if alive today, Most of you would be fighting for the confederacy.
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  11376.  @MrNH718  I simply know better than you. I read everything I could on this subject and it boils down to investigators did not agree with your spin at all. Dollars to donuts you have no idea what the investigators found based on your parroted nonsense from a specific media type. It is pretty clear Trumps team did collude with the Russians, some of them went to jail for lying about it. Ignore that chestnut at your leisure. The argument is he sought out Russian help to get a leg up in the election. This is a pretty well established fact based on the evidence. He specifically was looking for dirt on his rivals. Asking Russians for help in doing so is deeply illegal and he does not get a pass from the likes of me even as you do not seem to care. Hillary did the same kind of thing and I would see her charged as well. Pretending it is ok because anyone else did it is empty nonsense. But then I support the rule of law and it is pretty clear people like you and Trump only want to apply it sporadically. Education is not your thing sparky. I would not even say the Russia thing was Trump's worst crime. I blame the weak feckless democrat's for choosing this esotaric and easily dismissed case in a huge filed of issues they could have more easily convicted him with. That being said the whole thing was a dog and pony show anyway, they knew impeachment was not going to fly before they even passed it in the house. If the dems are bad on anything here it is the fact they gave false hope to many that this was going to result in change.
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  11642.  @daveadam435  The establishment media did it because they did not want to look at the primary crimes that would also implicate democrats and their matching malfeasance. The whole Russia thing was largely a distraction like the Benghazi bullshit the right wallowed in forever with no results. There was never any chance of either amounting to anything. They dem leadership had no intention of changing the status quo and never had a chance to win. It was theater to rial up both bases and take our eye of the ball as both parties were robbing us blind with bipartisan votes. You appear to have bought into the shitty spin as badly as the hard core Russia Gaters on CNN. They imagined Nancy actually thought she could impeach him with half measures and an unapologetic deeply partisan senate. You thought a partisan senate ignoring the issue meant all the charges were meritless and proved Trump innocent. I personally knew that the GOP senate would never convict Trump, so did dem leadership and the media. Ignoring issues around the emoluments clause or pay for play access to the Saudis was a giveaway to Trump. If they really wanted to get him they could have but it would have stepped on their own dick too. They ignored the more definitive issues because like the hunter Biden story proved the corporate dems are crooked too. No one wanted to actually rock the boat and highlight the corporate corruption which is our root issue in both parties. The GOP and the establishment dems are owned by the same monsters. This Russia thing was theater to distract us as they passed bi-partisan tax cuts for the rich, massive increases in military spending and record deficits. While basically changing nothing for working people on either side.
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  11646.  @whyamimrpink78  The only reason our large existing systems can exist is because they are paid one way or the other or they could not stay in business. Our system is already challenging for health care providers because they have to speak to multiple groups to get payment. Changing it to pay as you go will not help in controlling costs and it will decrease coverage because there is no way to budget for the amount of service you will provide without a consistent source of income that is able to pay on demand. The first of what could be considered modern hospitals were made in Germany and were paid for by groups of workers coming together to make regular payments to it. This was an early example of health care insurance and was a system that ensure the hospital had the budget to build out an hire the staff to provide care. The health insurance systems are the reason large hospitals are viable and funded. Your ignorant assertions about pay as you go does nothing to address the root problem of cost and actually undermines the viability of large scale modern health care facilities. So it is not a question if we use insurance or not, the question is if we let for profit middle men skim off the top and deny care so they can make an extra nickle instead of what the rest of the world has done and ensure health care for all at a much lower price per person. Relying on the rich to trickle down on the poor out of the goodness of their heart is stupid and no solution at all. Our system is the most "free market" in the first world and we derive NONE of the benefits you promise, I do not see going further and throwing the poor at the mercy of the rich as a remotely viable or desirable path to choose.
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  11661. ThE DuCk Your entire narrative is total nonsense and Bernie is popular in the internet and in real life according to every real world poll he is in. Bernie lost at the ballot box because he was going against a person who started with massive name recognition and cheated in the primary while the corporate media ignored him. Despite everything being against him he came within inches beating Hillary who the establishment had crowned queen before the primary even started. If you think her win was huge at 4 million votes you have no idea what you are talking about because this race was not even supposed to be remotely close. If any one of the factors had changed or the primary ran for another month there is zero chance she would have won. If the same match up happened today Bernie would crush her neo-liberal sellout incrementalist ass early. She had a massive head start, support of the entire establishment and the media and still barely won against a no name guy with bad hair who actually spoke to the voters and not just the donors. Hillary was a terrible candidate who spit on half her base and promised the status quo in a cycle when people were demanding change. She owns the loss and the establishment democrats need to stop talking about knowing how to win as they are overt losers who can barely win when shooting fish in a barrel only to lose in most general elections. How many houses of government do we have to lose before you are willing to try it our way. Buck up you can always go vote for the GOP when we take over.
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  11774.  @gregcoleman7093  They are the corporate left and agree with crony capitalists who own your party on economics. All the main stream media including the "left" spits all your talking points on actual left wing economic ideas. These "left wing" media groups are the exact same people who have always had power. Like they always have, they are pandering to their targeted market on social issues. A market that has changed over time. All establishment media targets it's audience this way while largely pushing the exact same economic agenda. What you see and feel is that the market is not the same as it was 20 or 30 years ago. It is not that they have shifted left over ideology it was chasing dollars. They are blanks and follow the crowd and where the money is on social issues. Fox panders to the right, others the left. They do the same on economic issues that is why they have stayed static and all push for the status quo and no change. Even the most left wing establishment media is against health care, unions, high min wage even as they bend on the things you point out. The left has no power and I would argue now you have less too. Because you are no longer hold the majority views on social policy you feel as cut off as the left was in recent times when being openly gay was taboo and the media canceled people for it. The fact is instead of calling each other names we need to focus our attention on the clowns at the top. The corruption flows from there. The redefining of political terms and calling the other side baby eaters is all spin to keep us from speaking. As long as they can push divisive wedge issues and convince both sides the other is evil they will hold onto power. The sooner that we see we have a common enemy the sooner we will talk. Perhaps we will be surprised that we can agree with the "evil" other side on anything. Not the least of which is our mutual hatred for corruption and dishonesty.
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  11939.  @michaeltaddeo3242  Nice you told me how you feel about sex, now you need to understand not everyone has to agree. I as grown man know that sex at it's best is between two people who love one another. But to deny the pleasure of sex for it's own sake is empty posturing to prop up some personal romanticized identity standard. You do you but your limitations should be and thankfully are your own. When we let people choose how and when they have sex we hand back power to individuals to make their own choices, free of the pointless repression you crave. The demonization of porn or open sexuality in general is a puritan way of thinking that only appeals to conformists. Those who feel the need to dominate the actions of others over empty moral certainty. Abortion is a medical procedure, woman should have free access to within a reasonable set of rules dictated by medical knowledge and concern for both parties. That is what we had for decades, first trimester was unrestricted, second and third trimester were on medical advice only attached to the health of the mother. There was never were any elective late term abortions, the law of the states all prevented it. The fatherless homes you refer to are a product of a failed Reaganomic neoliberal system and a draining millions of jobs overseas in a matter of years. It is the product of a brutal drug war, raged primarily waged against these communities disproportionally putting them in jail comparted to white people who use drugs at the same rate. The cities that you point to that are failing are not failing because they are super liberal. They are falling apart because they had all their jobs shipped overseas with nothing to replace them. You have no idea what argument you are actually making. None of this supports your notion of traditional gender rolls. Keeping them would change none of these issues.
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  12019.  @davidanderegg1232  I too think gender reveal parties are odd. But I can understand the appeal to publicly come out and announce their new self to their world in the form of a party. The analogues for this grand reveal exist for sis gender kids too, but are getting rare. Sweet 16's, Bar Mitzvah are great examples but our culture has largely abandoned the right of passage stuff. We hold rallies for marginalized people that we seek to uplift. if you consider being sis gender marginalized you playing victim a little too hard. Advocating for your child's rights is what should be expected of every parent. Supporting your child through something you do not understand is not promotion. Giving them rein to figure out who they are while engaging with them through the process is not promotion. I do not know your brother but the idea he was excited by this occurring to his daughter is silly. He is making the best of a strange situation that no one is prepared for. He is not stopping her or putting her on trial, but instead is talking her through a process neither of us have any experience with. This is not promotion either, It is what a good parent does. I would say the exact same thing to a trans kid as i would any kid who came to me doubting themselves and who they are. I would talk them through it to help them find their personal truth whatever it is. This process would in no case be about me. Unlike you I actively encouraged neither. Like your brother if we tacitly encouraged anything it would be toward the standard. Most children who choose this are going against the grain of their examples. All the more reason to give them support and talk them through it. It is a choice that comes with challenges.
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  12192.  @joemoore4813  You are incorrect. Numerous studies overtly rejected it. You pick and choose the medicine you want based on the media you like. Taking medicine meant for other animals especially in the concentration meant for horses is always problematic and is not tested on humans at all. That a drug has existed for a long time does not mean taking outside the care of a doctor is anything but Darwin award brain dead. You have no idea what you are talking about and when you call it gene theory in a pejorative way you look clueless. That this spin has made you scared of it as and taking a drug meant to deworm horses does not makes you look pretty crazy. This vaccine tech was started in 2012 and was in full testing against other spike virus's in 2014. The drug was the ideal candidate to attack this particular virus with very few changes. It was well understood existing technology that was quickly adapted to covid which was in the same family as the original targets. The vaccine may have been quickly developed but the technology behind it was not a new idea. That is the reason they could produce it so fast. Pretending it is somehow dangerous when compared to getting the novel virus, or taking unprescribed horse pills and malaria drugs is poorly informed. Pfizer has been was officially approved now, it is no longer is under emergency approval. You can let your always flimsy experimental talking point go. I will stick with the vast majority of doctors, experts and anyone with a lick of common sense who thinks taking horse deworming drugs for a virus is loopy.
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  12247.  @idimo7976 Total nonsense. Please show me the bank or the country for that matter randomly offering housing to new migrants as some kind of incentive. New immigrants consistently have very limited access to welfare and social services and pretending that is why they come is just common anti migrant partisan framing and purposely misrepresents them. Lumping liberalism and neo liberalism together is patently ignorant as they are not the remotely the same thing. The modern conservatives are neo liberal too and fail because they serve donors and the MIC first before anything else. That is where all our economic problems spring from, they have NOTHING to do immigrants or the social safety net all neo liberals have sought to erode to serve the elites that own them The idea that live and let live is some kind of fail is really gross and marks you as a repressive monster. The societies that share your views on fornication and homosexuality are universally backward and are the source of the foreign troglodytes you dislike but agree with on social policy. That we stop repressive assholes from picking how other adults have sex has nothing to do with our problems. Becoming more like the backward societies you point at has zero merit and does nothing but make authoritarians like you feel better as they put a boot on others neck. What you advocate for culturally is literally degenerate by definition. Know you are always going to be putting lip stick on an ancient and ever more hideous pig with your freedom hating spin. When you agree with ISIS on anything you are going the wrong way. No one in my camp advocates for rapists and lumping immigrants and those who fight for individual freedom with them is pretty sick and more idiotic than you appear to be from your diction. You would be much more at home in Saudi Arabia than anywhere in the west.
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  12257. curtflirt2 All "high dignitaries"' deserve extra scrutiny and more tough questioning not less. They are invested with great responsibility so they should be held to task on consistency more than normal citizens. That idea our leaders should get automatic "respect" is an authoritarian principle I see as having zero merit. Asking our leaders to defend their own record should be the very least they should be expected to do. The days of kings and queens are now behind us .. these leaders including her work for us. Please give me the names of journalists you imagine were jailed in the UK for asking tough questions to a leader, ideally make sue to note what year it was. I suspect the number of journalists in the post monarchy era list is pretty short .. She is a consummate politician and not she showing what she feels is treasured skill. She was on the wrong side of history and pretends she was not, calling out her position is more than fair and she should own her record and not try to hide what she really feels. It is her choice to be duplicitous and paper over her record and you for some reason want to ignore that even as she pretends to support the now currently PC position diametrically opposite her old one. If you agreed with her pro apartheid spin in the past there is no reason support her now as she no longer does. If you are anti apartheid there never was a reason to support her because even as she changed her positions she did it kicking and screaming while backing the losers. Either way she is a disingenuous politician who has no values of her own and does what is politically expedient .. nothing more. Exposing that truth has value to all voters that support or oppose her and is what the press is supposed to do in service to us in a free country.
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  12429.  @Raijin1506  The left is not pushing sexuality on children. The video's pumped into your Facebook were crafted to trick and distract you. They do not represent any significant movement. What is under attack is teaching acceptance of others. That being different is not bad. In my day kids that might have been gay or trans would be mercilessly teased. The reason more kids are saying they might be trans is exactly like the tendency over time for left handed people to identify as lefthanded. At the turn of the century only 2% of the population said they were left handed and now it is as high as 10%. The difference between now and then is acceptance and non demonization. In the day to be left handed was to be literally called sinister. That is no longer true and so more people say they are left handed. This is the reason more kids are experimenting with the idea of being trans, it is because they can. The fact is most only do it for only a short while. The whole trans panic thing is a tempest in a tea pot and is not a real issue despite the tragedy it has drawn many well meaning people into is empty overt lies. It sells the idea idea that being decent to someone not like you is grooming. This is nothing more than a dishonest church lady attack against people they have always ignored or just quietly hated until schools decided to treat them fairly. Empty moral outrage about grooming sexuality is rich from clowns who are literally passing rules to groom kids and force a standard that spits on acceptance and discourages empathy This whole non issue is distraction meant to get you take your eye off the fact the clowns pushing this bullshit would do nothing to improve your life and are always against doing so.
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  12451. Phoenix 115 Their fair share is more than mine because they reap proportionally more benefits from the society. There is no solid non shills argument against progressive taxation unless it is your goal to promote wealth inequality and further impoverish working people to make the super rich richer. I agree everyone has to pay their fair share and that has been determined by how much you make. We can make the rich pay more and should as they make more. The fact is they have been buying legislation that lowers their taxes for decades and the growing wealth inequality and the countries ever increasing debt is a direct response to those polices. If they can demand leaders transfer their burden onto the middle class and poor then it is more than fair the rest of 99% of the country demand it work the other way for a change. It is clear you have no idea what I want and your assertions about what I would see public money spent on are pointless misdirection in defense of the indefensible. Nothing Bernie offers is free, it is paid for by our collective taxes and if we can find trillions to go fight stupid pointless wars then it is more than fair to say we can find the same amount the defense budget was just increased to provide education for all citizens who show they have the faculties to get one. We all pay taxes and that burden has been shifted onto us to make the super rich insanely richer all the while they pour our public money down the toilet. Infrastructure Grade D, 37th place in health care while spending double what everyone else does, highest incarceration rate in the first world is legacy of the root spin you promote. The demand we start getting value for our tax dollars and see services and investments that will enrich the country and make us more competitive in a world market is not free stuff, it is critical unless you crave further decline.
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  12475.  @EvsEntps  Ok, but picking out people you dislike because of their unique quirks or personality is not like systemically marginalizing a group based on their skin tone, sexuality, gender or any other element that is not variable. No one says you have to like someone that is different than you but supporting rules that allow the powerful to marginalize a community based on empty bigotry has zero societal value. Your sexuality is not just a personality quirk but an integral part of who you are. I see no upside in letting bigots marginalize a community because of their ignorance or personal preferences. Sexuality or gender is as innate as race. That in the past we forced people to suppress non standard identities to comfort overt ignorance and repressive tendencies is not something to look back at as good. Arguing for the right to be bigoted is not an expression of freedom but overt suppression of it. No one is telling you how to feel just how business's that serve the public with the blessing of the state should treat it's citizens. I would argue if you can not control your bigotry do something new where it will not be challenged. No one should be marginalized simply because you have power and dislike who they are. It is not a suppression of your freedom to deny you the right to suppress others. You make the exact same argument bigots who wanted to suppress people of color made. It is as failed here as it was there. You are not principled at all but are protecting a special snow flake right you claim that is wholly negative in its application. Your spin is not a manifestation of any kind of freedom but instead is wholly repressive. When you have the same policy as ISIS and the Saudi's babbling about valuing freedom is pretty empty. There is no special treatment for these groups under these rules and there is under yours. It is you who wants the right to marginalize anyone based on your whims and not based on who they are. These rules as suggested do not give special dispensation to anyone and are equally applied for all. You are the one who does not value freedom and as you fight for the right to repress those you dislike based on your ignorance, it makes you are the enemy of actual freedom. I have no problem with demanding real reasons for terminations and your sating your personal bigotry should not be counted among the valid ones. You defend the status quo and totalitarian spin not me, you are on the wrong side of history and agree with its greatest totalitarian monsters. Own that.
    2
  12476.  @EvsEntps  That you do not like associating your bigotry which is basically identical in nature to racial bigotry is the only reason you reject my correct contextual use of the word marginalization. Your short pointless essay on the entomology of words never explained how I misused them. It does not discredit my point nor is it an example of how “people like me” are incorrectly or dishonestly using them. The minority in this case are group of people who identify in a nonstandard non binary way (well less than 50%) and is an apt and valid description of the group you target. That you just want to ignore that these people are different as your root goal and that is the problem. The issue is not as simple as you paint it and it your attempt to make the world black and white because it is for you clouds your perspective. Sexuality and sexual identity are not binary no matter how hard you want to insist otherwise. These people are a definitive minority and that you try to dismiss who they are and to end all discussion of gender aside from ones physical sex may suit your agenda but is definitively an anti freedom argument. Gender identity is not a new idea, the claim it is new or just made up is an assertion of ignorance. The fact is there is a range in the way people identify and more so as people are less restricted by repressive standards. What is changing is that there is a movement to stop forcing the suppression of their nature to suit the proclivities and sensibility of people like you and those in power who garner your support by pandering to your personal prejudice. The change in the discussion you highlighted in your partisan way as bad is a recognition that in the past we had repressive standards that took away the options of this group to suit the contemporary majority’s proclivity to no one’s benefit. Your slippery slope argument is empty as these groups are definitively defined. It is hard to argue form a business case gender identity should have a bearing on your employment. The way one identifies sexually should have no roll in how employers treat them in the same way sexual orientation, or your race should not. The idea that because we extend the same protection to these groups people will make up new genders to get a nebulously and poorly defined advantage is silly. We know definitively what we get with the policy you advocate for and it is most certainly not freedom and only leads to directly to repression. Attempting to dismiss gender identity simply an objectionable personality is an empty dodge in defense of what is bigotry targeted at a sociality recognized group of people you happen to find distasteful. The defining of gender identity is not as nebulous as you pretend it is and there is no reason to extend the right to dismiss people on that basis. The argument that defending the rights of these people to be who they are leads to totalitarian policy is undermined by the fact your spin is totalitarian and is the standard in every totalitarian society that has ever existed. The assessment of marginalization is not always simple and has many of the same limitations that we run into when applying equity rules on sexuality and other more clear-cut issues like race. This allows tacit bigotry to still exist as all the employer must do is come up with a viable business reason to justify a termination even if initiated because of an identity objection issue. There will be other cases where a person in the minority is fired for justified reasons and that is why challenges to terminations need to be handled on case by case basis encouraging employers to document and correctly justify terminations to remain in the clear. In no sense is the implantation of this kind of policy a restriction on anyone’s freedom nor is it totalitarian in the sense the word is applied in the real world. In fact, protection of gender identity in employment standards it is no more totalitarian than any other work place or employment policy that puts any responsibility on employers to justify a termination. You can argue we should not have those regulations either but that is little more than demanding the owner class having to justify a firing = “no freedom”. This does not fly outside a very specific bubble. Gender identity upends nothing any more than gay marriage does. (not at all) It changes nothing except for a specific group of people’s ability to openly discriminate against a group they dislike. People who have been traditionally pushed to the margins and denied the protections against overt bigotry others already enjoy. Please explain how you imagine extending common rights to a group who has been traditionally pushed to the margins impedes proper functioning of society any more than applying the same standard to people of color. The argument that the courts can not properly adjudicate this issue is not well founded. As it stands the bar to prove that any individual has been dismissed for being who they are is high as it should be. The fact we are even looking at the issue and addressing it after ignoring it so long is a good thing. Whenever you agree with ISIS on anything have to take a hard look at what you stand for because it invariably is anti freedom. When you agree with totalitarians tarring those you oppose with that brush is a patently weak starting point.
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  12656.  @johnkeane1419  These stupid stats are a reason for you to fail, if that is what you need have at it. Being a brooding defeatist spells like death to everyone. The idea only 20% of men are interesting is empty and incorrect unless you really focus on a tight specific young demographic. Even then it is a an optertunity to be interesting in a sea of those who do not normally get looked at. Young men are struggling more than all men are. Once getting into relationships was was the primary focus of young woman. That has changed and I see it has upsides for both men and woman. Getting married young is what we have traditionally have done but I do not see it as something we should be pushing for now. I generally see young marriages as deeply problematic for many reasons. Not the least of which is financial in this day and age. Better to get married later when you have a idea of who both partners are and what they want. Better to do it when you are not hand to mouth, with 3 roommates to help you pay for your rent. Getting married later ensures the person you marry is more likely to be who they are as they age. Marrying someone in their early 20's ensures you will go through a time when they grow up and change. Without good communication this is not always ideal for a relationship. I do not see these stats as catastrophic as some might. What does concern me is many of these guys also do not have friends. I see this issue a symptom of the real problem, it speaks to why they do not have female relationships if they can not even foster one with fellow men. Are men shallow and greedy too, is that why these guys are alone?
    2
  12657.  @johnkeane1419  I think there is a narrative attached to your concerns which does exist, but it does not have to change or apply to your life unless you let it. Soft skills are valuable and possible to learn if you are missing them. The idea men can't do that kind of work is silly and is like saying woman can not lead because of some random and empty reason. Woman do find men attractive, that they do not find twenty something men very intersting is not a shock to me. As a group, they regularly have no idea who they yet are or what they want from life. Strait out of mom's basement you are not as good of a catch as you imagine yourself. No one wants to take on roll of mother and housekeeper in their 20's. I do not blame woman for looking at these guys who are just starting out with no relationship experience, no life experience, limited prospects and an inherited set of poorly thought out expectations as less than interesting. The key to being interesting to any modern woman is to have your own life, to be independent, comfortable and happy in your skin without needing anyone else. Loneliness and unrequited desire smells like death to everyone. Owning yourself and who you are goes a long way to being attractive to both friends and lovers. This is not just an issue with woman, these guys are apparently having issues forming any relationships. That is the root of the problem. This is not about being easy, life was rarely ever easy for anyone. In the past. it was often much much harder. This is about taking advantage of the new freedom you have to pick who you want to be and to own it. Do so and you will find people that appreciate your focus.
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  13095.  @arceusthomas2447  I care about the wellbeing of the living breathing woman who can have another child when she wants it over a group of parasitic cells that will spontaneously abort 10 to 15% of the time anyway. You are dishonestly conflating a child with a fetus or in many cases a zygote neither of which are viable and can not exist outside the mothers womb. Once born and no longer reliant on the bodily process's of the mother to resperate, take in nutrients and expel waste it is no longer a parasite of any kind. Existing laws associated with murder would apply if a parent murdered a child because a child is a person not a half developed thumb sized parasite which can not exist outside the woman carrying it. This is the woman's choice, how you or I feel about it is and should be irrelevant in the same way we should have no say in anyone else's medical options. This choice should be between the woman and her doctor alone. I am all for any education and access to contraceptives that help prevent abortions. I am also in favor of universal child and medical care so that poor mothers can afford to work and be productive and care for their children. These policies would go a long way to greatly decreasing the number of abortions, if that is what you really cared about. I am not in favor of imposing my will on woman forcing them to be baby making machines at the command of the state. Treating woman as baby factories slaved to the will of society by the force of law only appeals to most totalitarian and repressive. A crowd that craves a government so small it climbs into every woman's uterus. When you agree with the Taliban on any social issue, you are going the wrong way.
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  13101. the op kingdom We have to continue to fight the democratic establishment as I see no reason to leave them at our back. We do not have to expect them to give way, we can and should tear it from their hands as the last time anyone checked the establishment is not popular and is eminently beatable at their own game. There is a great deal of evidence a progressive can win a primary in the democratic party but the idea we should not try is poorly thought out defeatist nonsense. We need to push all options as David is saying and if you have a good progressive candidate in your region vote for them otherwise support a candidate that will serve you. The green party has a progressive platform but much more work has to be done before it is viable. It will not matter if they have the ballot on all 50 states as they will not even be in the spotlight. The development of the party is a labor that will not be remotely viable by 2020 and the effort to unseat the corporate dems has to continue from within the party in the mean time if we are to have any representation at all. You can not talk reasonably about the democratic party as being unassailable while waving the flag of the green party as a viable option. It is necessary to forge a new party but the fact it is pie in the sky to imagine they are going to make major headway in 2020. if you think that the loser establishment candidates can not be beaten toe to toe in the primaries I am not sure why you imagine an upstart party who is not even in the debates. The only thing the green party you imagine is going to do is sap power away from the dems and give the GOP 4 more years. The key this election and in the short term will be to primary as many of the establishment sellouts as possible and take the party from therm. .
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  13172.  @bobbun4369  THEY CAN CREATE LIFE! I live next to a female couple who just each had a baby via invitro from the same donor. As a couple they each had a baby. By your own stated standard they created life and totally qualify for marriage even though that is not not a standard you would ever demand of baron or older heterosexual couples. Male gay couples often use a surrogate with one or both partner's dna to have a child just like hetero couples where the woman can not have a child do. These pregnancies are happening every single day now. I am shocked you are asking this question again as it has been answered multiple times above so far. The "they do not make life talking point" is really really dumb on the face of it and is countered by a very quick glance at reality. The benefits and responsibilities of marriage are all legal in nature and seek to promote and support families. They are attached to the specific legislation defining the frame work and terms of the marriage contract. The marriage contract applies to wide range of family law issues from inheritance, to spousal guardianship and advocacy, to custody issues associated with children. There is no function in a marriage contract that requires those entering into it are of opposite sex or that they can procreate as a team without aid. The sex of the respective parties should entirely irrelevant from a legal perspective. Now stop asking this silly question! You are looking like a bigger and bigger moron as you are apparently repeatedly play stupid
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  13321.  @freedom-not-oppression  Your spin indicates this is a huge problem that somehow undermines all woman, this is dishonest bullshit used to attack trans people. The distinction about them being biological woman or men is empty and fucking totally stupid in this context. Some men are great at sports, some are not. Some woman are great in sports and some are not. There will always be athletes in a given sport who are better than others because of some genetic advantage, such is the nature of sport. In almost every iteration of sport it is largely irrelevant if woman and men play on the same teams. The Taliban like need to separate woman and men from playing together is a legacy of a time when woman were not allowed to play practically anything. The separation of the sexes is in sport is a cultural phenomena that has been breaking down in the last decades. This is especially true outside the professional level where most players of all genders play. The fact is woman have been playing in men's leagues and have been for a while. Your faux outrage over protecting woman is thinly veiled bullshit from a group who happily strips other fundamental rights of woman as a focus. It is a thin cover for your real hunger to be a bigot. Someone that crushes others rights over your feelings because you do not understand or like them. Your LARP as caring about them is exposed as a naked lie. Unless you are trans, this issue has literally NOTHING to do with you. Your whiney nonsense is akin to complaining you are playing in a league where there are people that are better than you in your sport; then seeking to ban them for it. You appear to love oppression ... a name change may be in order for your account
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  13386. niceguy60 There are literally no mental gymnastics because I do not fall in line behind the establishment and your assertion I do is nonsense. A lessor evil is an evil in place until it can be replaced with an ever lessor one until we are not voting in evil at all but those who represent us. This is not a defense of the status quo and Cenk's pragmatic vote for hillary over trump is not support for the failure she represents as he clearly has shown. It is for me at least was a recognition that if Trump won he would overtly turn over the keys to the robbers, and that has been proven true. I see both parties as innately corrupt and have recognized the flaw for long time with few options until last cycle. Since then the door has been pushed open and it is not going to close. I understand people who could not vote for the her after she plainly spat in half the bases face, but none of that precludes trump is by far a worse evil who has already set us back decades. Ignoring that has little to no benefit as far as I can see. I make it clear what i fight for and am not going to stop until I get it. That does not mean for the time being I should cut off my nose to spite my face by attacking allies while I fight to get leaders who actually work for us. Your inability to see nuance or reason is worthy of a hard core trump supporter and I wholly reject your stupid and counter productive spin that makes it seem you you do not care about seeing real change. TYT is definitively against the establishment democrats and pretending otherwise marks you as ignorant or dishonest. PS: you might want to stop spitting trump slogans if you want even a little unearned cred. If you are looking for converts you might not want to use the same stupid tactic that the establishment DNC is using to shame voters the other way.
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  13427.  @kodekorp2064  I see people with your spin as the divisive ones as you attack ostensible allies over nonsense. You are the ones on the side of stasis and are tearing down the work done not me. You make assertions of false claims and expect that to be taken for granted. Back in the AIU days I saw endless claims of lies and misrepresentation always framed by right wing smear merchants that had no connection to the truth. At some point you get tired of running them down and snuffing out concern raised by the claims. The charges of lies and poor sources always amounted to a mountain out of a mole hill. JD is causing a commotion to get views and does not give a flying F about policy, the movement or getting anything done. He appeals to a latent anger generated by our broken system to lash out at those who are working for positive change while do nothing to forward us. What Jimmy says does not have to be valid to resonate. That he picked up old establishment and right wing talking points to do so speaks to the veracity and value of his complaints. I do not always agree with everything they do but as a progressive TYT are inarguably allies. They push for workable change and take no donor money. They support humanitarian crisis/condemn genocides and give correct news sources as a standard. They are reaching out and talking to an entire set of witnesses/ guests of all different walks of life and professions representing a wider range of the social spectrum outside the standard TYT audience. The money complaint is stupid. Just yesterday I was told by a Dore fan he was better because he did not ask for money and they were corrupt because they did. Let that float around your brain a bit and perhaps you can see the irony in it. Again you make baseless claims about spin that has been adjudicated a long time ago. I know Cenk may have said some off color things in the past but he has stood up and taken that on the chin. You may or may not know that. The claims of them covering things up is poorly founded and the idea they do not take responsibility for mistakes even less so. Your questions are nothing more than talking points made by people who are in stone not allies of the progressive movement. All those old questions have answers if you honestly look. So this attempt to pretend you are just raising concerns marks you as clueless or just another hater. Either way you should do more digging outside TYT hate piles to get greater context on the concerns you have. You seem to have been contaminated by your chosen bubble as something in the content appeals to you personally.
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  13653. I KNOW I'm cynical Your cynicism is warranted and logical but does not mean we will not try because as strong as they are they have a critical weakness and that is people really do not like them. I understand what we face in the exact same way you do but am not going to come to the same conclusion as you until the effort that saw Bernie's rise dissipate and I do not see that as the case now, in fact I see it as gaining momentum and campaigns are barely even running yet. The facts is the establishment can no longer control the vote the way they once did, they can tweak it and cut around the edges but their popularity is falling to where no amount of simple gerrymandering or poll closures can fix it. The ugly win of trump and that Bernie's upstart explosive campaign nearly burned through their firewall despite their every advantage and cheating proves it. Trump definitively proved the establishment chosen candidates can be beaten and Hillary proved they are not popular even if they squeak in undermining their future claims to leadership or that they know how to win. No matter what the establishment does our efforts organizing around them can not be stopped by their standard methods. It is only a matter of time until they are pushed out against a focused attack based on the fact they all sell out on principle and represent what the vast majority of Americans hate about government. That they flaunt their corruption is an Achilles heal that has not been properly highlighted and utilized in campaigns and now can be by a new breed of candidate not burdened by the same weakness. I am not certain we will win but I can not imagine not being part of the fight
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  13676. David O Donovan 1. ISIS would kill you too so what is your point? You share the same outlook on gay peoples rights as ISIS and other christens including assholes in this very comment section who say they should be arrested. Even if you just think they have no right to standard access goods and services based on who they are your spin is still innately backwards and destructive to no ones gain. 2) All business are accessible to the public by virtue of their business licence and to be an establishment open to the public you have serve all people regardless of your personal problems and choices. The idiotic Christians busted were in breech of their business licence with the state that no one made them sign. No one is being forced to do anything and if they can not make a cake based on their faith that is on them and they should not expect to void their contracts set for the common good. Like a Mennonite who drives horse and buggy who should not apply to drive a bus those who can not sell cake to gay people because "god" should never sign a business licence. No one is being marginalized here except the people denied service because of naked empty bigotry. 3) I have complete tolerance and respect for all religious beliefs. I am a secularist and freedom religion is a key element of that standard. But it must be understood your religious rights end at the tip of your finger and the tip of my nose. If there is any penance or price to pay because of a chosen prejudice the bigot is the only one who should pay it not the ones they arbitrarily marginalize based on their empty choices.
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  13749.  michael nola  Your points are valid and I do not dispute them. The fact is Biden is a shit show, they both are. I do understand your point of view but do not see what my saying I will withhold my vote from him will do. Ya I might vote for Trump in that case, but there is a bounds of reason. I could understand if you hit yours with Biden. To me seemed like symbolic resistance that is most likely to encourage the admittedly greater evil. But to see Biden as a Trump like figure and write him off is totally fair. It would all be a matter of personal scale of tolerance. I understand that you are making your stand on principle, I am too just a different way. If you ask me the plan should be to build on the smoke we have and turn it to fire. We have a core to build on, there is a large number of organized active people willing to resist from the populist left. I see fighting Biden as easier because he has to at least pretend to pay attention and take notice of a large contingent of protesting "democrats" meaning diverse crowds not bearing arms and wearing tricorn hats. We have to organize and find ways to motivate and engage voters to look closer at their leaders to ready them for primaries before they are primaried as a public service. We have to encourage the young people we know to vote by giving them something to vote for instead of against and make it clear . I do not see abandoning the party as the only path because I do not want to leave corporate drones consolidated at our backs with knives as we move forward. They are beatable and I see no reason to give up on beating them. We have to get off our ass and stop expecting a savoir, if this is ever going to change it has to start with us. All that being said without some act of god nothing substantial is going to change before November. I do not see giving Trump another term as having any upside as I move forward. I am not campaigning for Biden but if he is the choice against trump I will hold my nose and vote for him before moving forward either way.
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  13787.  @user-ei9ns9hq6b  They are not left, they parrot right wing talking points on every left wing economic issue. The are establishment which promotes the status quo, business as usual, not the change the actual left craves. A cadre of billionaires who own the media consortiums support the existing system as it put them where they are now. They like the DNC they have no interest in the actual left as evidenced by their treatment of Bernie and left wing non corporate candidates in the primary. Both the dnc and the main stream media throw bones to the left on some social issues after the popularity of those issues hits a critical mass, especially if it does not cost billionaires any more money. Hillary Clinton was famously not pro gay marriage until 2014. Pretending the establishment is "left wing" has been shown to be a lie as they back right wing spin on everything from tax policy to endless funding of the military. You will never catch a CNN host asking how they are going to pay for the next giant military increase but mention health care and they want to see a plan. The main stream media purposely focus on silly issues to annoy and sew division between the people of the left and the right. They drive us apart using wedge issues and annoying fringe nonsense to keep us divided and fighting among ourselves. They work to stop us unifying and blaming those on top with the power to actually enact change. As a member of the left the main stream "left wing" media does not represent me at all and never has. Almost all the democrats are corporatist, the key difference in the parties is all the GOP is. You may not know that but it is a fact.
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  13825.  @SkidRowTrash  None of those are left wing, let alone far left wing. They are all establishment media owned by the mega rich to promote their own interests. This means they may pay lip service to already popular left wing social ideas, they are literally chasing a market. But on economics, foreign affairs and trade they promote a neo liberal, pro corporatist, status quo and shit on the actual left as a standard. They are all owned by billionaires (for CBC, leaders put in power by the elite) who hate all left wing ideas that would cost them a dime. On economics, these media sources are center right leaning at their most leftist, often they are full right wing. The only one calling those media sources "far left" is singular and very specific brand of media. A reality challenged, identity focused, literally far right media catastrophe. It is partisan nonsense marketed to a specific identity. It ignores the fact all these outlets support right wing economic and taxation policy even as they call them "far left". These media sources are just being otherized as a visible enemy for those like you. It is very likely you disagree with the main stream and hold values that are considered more traditional. These sources do represent the corporate curation of what is popularized as liberal. To you it is easy to paint them as as "radicals" to be opposed. The fact is their content is marketed to the majority of the country who largely agree. That is why they share it, it is not based on ideology or feelings, it is business. Their content is then repackaged and counter marketed back to you as radical. This feed back loop is used coopt both sides justified anger at a broken system by pointing them at each other. To weaponize our discontent so it will not be used to promote actual change. It is in their interest to sell hate for the far left, or far right instead of where it belongs. When you call the CBC, NY Times or hilariously the hard core establishment Toronto Star "far left", it says far more about you than it does them. It makes it clear, you have no idea what the far left is, or who you even hate.
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  13862. Ian Alan These rights were recently extended to gay people and you can not deny them service without rolling back the changes in place. There is a federal law prohibiting a business owners from not serving a customer because they are gay as that was branded sex discrimination by some courts. There have been several people successfully charged with it. There are most certainly hard and fast state laws that prohibit this actions in line with the changes associated with civil rights and there is no federal protection or support for bigoted actions you suggest are in place. These state laws are in line with the civil rights act which if written today and not almost 60 years ago which would include LGBT's just like all modern free countries do today. Courts have repeatedly sided with this view point creating a precedent that only an amendment like the one trump suggests could override. The laws in place have been tested and are exactly what trumps new amendment is supposed to circumvent. You do not have an innate right to reject customers on an arbitrary basis and most certainly because of stated bigoted reasons which is why the court cases against self the righteous Christian cake bakers went through and were successfully prosecuted. If what you said was true then you clowns would have nothing to whine about and would not need any kind of amendment as this would be settled to your favour in the courts. We both know that is not the case. Trumps change would effectively roll back all changes made in the civil rights act and empower bigots to freely pick who can and can not use their services based on completely arbitrary reasons attached to religious belief. A constitutional amendment giving business the right to deny service for random reasons would completely undo the civil rights act with regard to commerce and even possibly the governments right to impose any regulation on them. It would empower business to pick winners and losers in any given economy as they would be free to marginalize whoever they wanted to based gut feeling or overt targeted discrimination. There is no upside to going back to the 1960's or even arguing for it.
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  13891.  @Vanderearden  Why do you think they can not coalesce in a block? They most certainly have. That block just got significantly bigger as the number of corporate dems decreased. That block is represented by Justice democrats who all take no corporate money and rely on small donor money to get elected so they can pursue a platform focused on those who fund them. These polices are core issues for them. The fight against the corporate democrats is harder than the establishment GOP as they are not as apparently terrible as many of their republican counterparts. Their rhetoric is better and they run as being better than the GOP by attempting to be just left of them. This suits their donors needs and until their mask is ripped off by a challenge they seem hard to unseat. The fact the change is slightly slower is primarily driven by main stream media control of the narrative, that is rapidly eroding and that process will only speed. The tea party was a movement before Obama but was spurred to action by the hunger for populist sentiment on the right which was not being met by establishment republicans. See any parallel there? I am not sure what you expect the first handful of unowned leaders to do. They consistently have opposed leadership on many key issues and have been on the correct side of most issues. Any failures you may point to does not dismiss what they represent or the successes they have planted the seed for. They can do what they can do, your cynicism that they do not support the policy they purport to has not been validated yet. There has been no option to more than has been done. Your concern seems like a style over substance issue and I would ask you to look at the good and not just what you have been told is bad.
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  13958.  @enumclaw79  We have barely started looking and already we are finding noticeable "bugs". So perhaps you are right and there are more bugs to find that we do not want have the tests to see. The idea that you and I could not conceive of how this technology might work does not change it's probability it might someday. As in the trenches experts, our skill set as engineers is iinatly limited by our understanding of existing technology, tools and available topologies in an evaluatin of a working version of this system. To say they could never exist feels premature given the rate of our change and therotiecal leaps gained by proposed future tech. The idea this system could not run without constant bugs that would be noticed ignores that the subjects of the simulation could not just be configured toì ignore them. Maybe they are occuring but like badly scripted bots we do not see them, yet. The kinds of bugs we have faced in the past and you outlined will be mitigated. Details easy to miss for any programmer will not be mussed by these systems and subsystems crested by the constructs. This kind of expert system will be working in conjuction with human designers to create next gen tools, which will allow complexity and topologies currently unmanageable. They wil bel built in a way to allow the constructs within the simulation to meet the applications needs. The idea it can't be done feels too attached to an aopeal to a staus quo. Citing the concept is at home in the 1970's is not the compelling point you think it is. You were the one who played the argumet from authority fallacy in your reply. It weakened your unearned crediblity with me. There is no consensus among current experts this can't be done in the future. No amount of attacking my personal credibility does not changes that Your offence that I called your novel a book is you expecting respect while showing none. It is hard to take your scolding seriously
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  13981.  @charleslesorcier5569  This is not Tuskegee and any assertion it is betrays your ignorance of the subject in general. Any half baked illusions about Gates are not connected to this vaccine. Wild polio is now gone in Africa because of Bill's work. Non wild polio is in a small group that end up contracting it from the vaccine, they will be among the last to get it now everyone is immunized. We had the exact same thing happen here when we mass inoculated and wiped out the disease here. Africa is now in the same boat as us when it comes to this brutal and debilitating illness do to Bill's efforts. I personally think Gates is stain for other reasons. He directly stood in the way of opening the patents on the covid vaccines to get it to the third world. A move that is going to cost millions of lives. It makes him your ally as it keeps the vaccine out of the hands of uncounted hundreds of millions. He is problematic but literally not what what you NPC's pretend he is. The elite got the exact same shot everyone else did. Your assertion otherwise is empty and pulled right from your ass. I give it the same value as anything else you scoop out. We have always had a group of loopy losers who were afraid of vaccines. For just10 pathogens across 112 countries, 62 million deaths were averted by vaccines between 2000 and 2019 directly. We did this despite the anti vax luddites not because of them. You are ruled by the twin dragons of fear and ignorance. You are a cultist slaved to asserted nonsense, at war with science and generally accepted reality. You are not special or informed, you are a talking point machine that does not understand half of what he says or you would not say it.
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  14408.  @mrdannyheim6712  Just like when you run from a dog that is snarling at you, running from them will do little good. The key is to not have a reason to be nose to nose to begin with. We are talking about empty ignorant bullies that are breaking the law in real way, that appeals to a minority even in the clown show of fringe right wing idiots who are more talk than action. Leaving them spout about it unopposed in rhetoric is tacit support for what they do. I am unconcerned about needing to stand my ground with a gun. I am not in these halfwits cross hairs, nor either are you likely. They are more venting anger at boogie men they have had invented up for them like a bed time story that justifies the deep anger they feel at the sense the world is leavening them behind. They would be well served in venting that anger at the crony capitalists they elect. But instead all their ire is focused on the democrats who for the most part act like 90's republicans on foreign policy and economic issues as godless America hating communists. They have propagandised to make them hate the least purchased leaders in either party the very most. They can be weaponized to become actively dangerous. This may still happen in small isolated groups , but that concern is unlikely to connect with either of our lives in this largish country. Very few will have to actually run and hide or decide to pick up a gun. That being said standing up and calling out any asshat leader that plays into this murder porn narrative has value. I can't see why we would not do so, even if they paint me as "angry".
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  14817. mowgli Hassan No it is not. You pay 6500 per person on average and we pay 9500 according to the WHO. The key difference is you pay based on how much you make while in our system you pay the same amount no matter what and get less coverage or huge deductibles and pay far far more depending on the coverage you can or can not afford to buy when you need to get care. Your system is cheaper than the the US. Despite your spin we actually have waiting times too unless you have can pay an extra premium for immediate access the vast majority with or without insurance simply can not afford. Every single system has wait times and ours are not so good they mitigate the extra costs we all pay. Not to mention the fact we hang a segment of our population hung out to dry and we literally let them die because they can not afford care while bankrupting another group because they had the bad fortune to be forced to get treatment. In 2016 Norway placed 15th on the world health care index and we placed 25th. You are selling your system as failed when the vast majority of articles on the quality of it consistently described it as good even as many acknowledge wait time issues. No matter how you slice it outside a wait time concern it does an objectively better job than ours does in providing universal affordable care with good outcomes. Letting the insurance companies privatize the profits and pass off the extra costs associated with care of those who are "risky" to the government (the taxpayers) as preexisting conditions does not and never will make sense. If an insurance company is not capable of providing for the care of people with "preexisting conditions" it does not meet a basic requirement of the service as defined by a just society and should pass it's entire function to an entity that can. In this way the more capable payer can mitigate costs of those who are the riskiest by spreading them over more people that are less risky This would make the service of covering risky individuals (we are already paying for anyway cheaper) over all while having the benefit of not bankrupting the patient or sticking the tax payer with the bill because their costs are mitigated by the larger pool.
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  15001. I am for calling out fundamentalists of all type but the focus on Islam as the problem is incorrectly focusing the debate. The reason this radical brand has power is because of polices that we in the west and the east drove. We chose the leaders of these places, those that drive restrictive policy promoting extremists. We trained insurgents who were handy allies of the moment to attack other powers. We should be doing nothing in these regions militarily. We need promote secular governments in the regions with aid and trade policy kicking to the curb the power of those who do not value individual or religious freedom. Nothing will be done by demonizing all Muslims just like you can not fix radical elements in any group by attacking the whole thing. The wall spin is stupid, we have a wall. The idea we needed to put a wall from sea to shining sea is silly. Most immigrants legal or not come across the border and the border wall was a red herring issue. The issue is no one on the republican side ever wants to talk, they want the dems to bend on everything. The wall was a trumped up crisis to a problem that has existed for decades, the immediacy of it was a lie, the critical state was a lie. Giving trump any oxygen on this stupid spin is service to bad actors. On this I Issue do not agree with her. No one argued for tearing down our wall. Just that building a sea to shining sea because Trump promised to make a bunch of people who do not understand the problem happy was a not an option.
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  15049. @The Market He is only considered "radical" because that is the establishment media nonsense narrative. In the rest of the free world he is center left at most. His policies instead of being "too radical" for the american voters are widely popular with them. He represents the actual center if you look at what he promotes on a policy by policy basis. The assertion that most Americans love it as it is plainly false if you look at any polling. Obama was elected on a platform of CHANGE and won the house and the senate promising it. The idea Americans like the status quo is betrayed by every metric and both Obama's and Trumps wins. Bernie beats trump head to head in every single poll while "centrists" do not. Hillary lost running the exact same campaign you would suggest. Bernie disarms Trump entirely and has none of Hillary's weaknesses. He steals Trumps greatest strength by appealing to honest populism countering Trumps fake version which won him the election against someone promising the status quo you say Americans like. Bernie is an Obama but better because he is real. He is not beholden to the highest bidder like Obama was proven to be after being elected. He filled his cabinet with wall street insiders and enacted the right wing heritage foundation health care plan with zero GOP support. His move toward centrism and not change then saw him lose the house the senate and ultimately the presidency as the DNC pushed the status quo you say is popular. Instead Bernie works for his voters and will fight to deliver popular policy that has wide public support among even GOP voters. The taste for change among the american electorate has not gone away and Bernie is the best one to deliver it. He has a credibility and consistency all other candidates lack.
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  15094.  @LouisFGraham  Unimportant in context and his record is second to none for any presidential candidate in living memory. His message of economic justice is colorless and is the right path away from the naked baked in division your spin engenders. He stood on the front lines of the civil rights movement and your attacking him on that front is empty considering who he is competing with. He did march with king and that he has not made civil rights his focus does not change his voting record is second to none on most issues we all should care about black and white. He literally made the idea of medicare for all a viable option. No other leader can make a claim to have a larger influence on it's wide scale public and political acceptance. He lost the "black" vote because Hillary's name was well known and his was not. Bernie was a nobody when he started. The DNC and it's pet establishment media did their best to minimize access to him by scheduling debates at bizarre times and showing trumps empty podium rather than his speeches. The longer he ran the more popular he got despite the cheating, the dirty dealing and oceans of corporate cash. Even so he barely lost against a candidate who owned party and literally set the narrative in the media. His campaign far from being any kind of failure created a template that has seen others follow him into service to the american people and not the corporations that own most there. Today he the most popular politician in the country and recently African Americans as a group gave the senator the highest favorables at 73 percent. It is time to put the black vote talking point to bed. I simply can not buy this spin he is not ethnic enough or civil rights enough for you given all our choices to date. Lots of white people care about race the same way you do, they are just as concerned about this subject for own empty reasons I see as very similar to yours. I reject both of your spin. You are both are missing the point badly. Neither of you ever get what you want because both you chase identity rather than policy to the establishments benefit.
    2
  15095.  @LouisFGraham  The center of american progress is well known to me I have seen your organizations work. Stasis of policy will most assuredly continue the growth of income inequality at a record pace if we were to do nothing as you might suggest. Without understanding what you mean by "current economic inequality solutions platforms will worsen disparities" it is pretty hard to swallow your line. I would argue all of these polices are color blind and why you imagine access health care would be better for white people I do not know. The new new deal would create jobs for those willing to work free from the traditional bias we know exists in the corporate world. Min wage increases would greatly benefit whole segments of the African american community and the argument keeping them so poor they get food stamps is great for them is pretty hard to swallow in a modern world. Anyone who is poor or working class stands to greatly benefit from accessible medical care that they simply do not have or are too scared to take advantage of now. Medicare for all would save us 2 trillion dollars a year according to the Koch brothers funded study. You will have to do some real fancy dancing to show how keeping parasitic for profit private insurance companies in the loop does anything but cost us money. I need to understand why you think new new deal will create more economic disparity, I challenge you to show how it would. By all accounts it would be a great source economic growth if trends hold true. Putting more money back in the hands of people who spend it as they work to rebuild our crumbling country is a win win. I have not seen a single credible study to support the idea of living min wage is a business killer after looking closely. A strong min wage as a policy has the benefit of transferring the cost of many workers from the welfare rolls to the industries that should be making slightly less to pay rather than pocketing the difference while making 10's of billions in profit. I would be very interested in what policies you think would cause increased disparity and what you base that on. This is knowing our disparity at best is historically high and growing quickly as we speak. Any suggestion to do nothing at this point should be deeply questioned.
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  15166.  @contessaanthrope5775  You came to an erroneous conclusion. I do not call them uneducated because they disagree with me. It is based the overtly ignorant things they say. I am doing it for my own peace of mind. I am countering fact free self important troglodytes spreading misinformation in public. Hard to do that with a friendly smile. The clowns I am arguing with are not remotely balanced. They lie and spit total guff while pretending they are experts. Their unfounded totally ignorant assertions said with ridiculous confidence have the same effect on me as my lack of decorum when dealing with morons has on you. They are pretending basic health care precautions are tyranny and that medicine that will save lives is poison. Meeting them anywhere close halfway seems a waste of time to me. Not expecting any of these people to change their minds. They are cultists who have rested their entire identity on being part of this group in opposition to basic science and public health initiatives. We already play too nice given that are literally killing fellow citizens over unvarnished arrogant ignorance. I will leave the being nice to them to mental health professionals and those with a proclivity to put up with nonsense. I am not part of either group. Perhaps I have had one too many conversations with them, my patience is clearly wrung pretty thin. I understand how to use honey to change minds, this just feels like a good time to use the vinegar. It may not change minds but it does sluice away filth. I do appreciate your intent though, thanks.
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  15213.  @volunteerjb1  Please understand being called "dumb" by the vapid is not very damaging. Historically elections with high voter turnout disproportionally benefit the democrats. There is a reason the GOP has made voter suppression a key element of their platform. But you clowns ignore all data that does not match your preconceptions. It is why they have attacked voter registration efforts in the past and defunded them. Your certainty the turn out will be proportional is nothing but wishful thinking. Republicans win by having a dedicated base that always turns out but this has a downside as it makes their policy have a limited range of appeal except to that hard core. The GOP is not known for large turn outs out side that group and are in trouble if the democrats are actually motivated to vote as they often are not. Visions of 2008 spring to mind as examples. Trump won last time because hillary both de-incentivized half the democratic voters while the media told everyone she was a shoe in. Trump lost the popular vote in very low turn out election caused by how distasteful they both were. That is not in play this time the same way other than Donald is now a known quantity and failure in the eyes of the majority according to all polls. The fact is Trump barely won last time when he was not overseeing an economic collapse and a failed response that sees millions about to lose their homes. Good luck with that superiority complex, perhaps do something to earn it before claiming it publicly.
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  15702.  @jboyko3  New York marks your spin as poorly thought out. Even if we have plenty of people with anti bodies the bulk of the population is fully exposed and overflow the hospitals if the community interaction is uncontrolled. The issue is not the 80% that only show flu like symptoms it is the other 20 that require hospitalization and are in danger of lung damage or death at rates much much higher than the any recent flu. The fact is we are greatly under reporting the deaths do this virus because the only ones that are counted are the cases where we tested and verified the patient had it. Otherwise we call it death by flu and move on, by ignoring many deaths in old age homes we have been suppressing the counts because we do not have the tests to verify what they died of. Sars and Mers were a fraction as contagious and were symptomatic as soon after you got the virus. Covid incubates unseen and contagious for a week before you even see symptoms. They are not the same thing and are not the same level of threat. That is why they did not shut anything down for those others. Your brand of concern over people working is an empty lie that is better addressed by good policy our bought and paid for government has completely ignored in favor of bailing out their buddies. They have left normal working people in the cold making social distancing a problem instead of a solution. These now desperate people are encouraged by their leadership to ignore the advice of scientists and doctors at the risk of their very lives or that of their families instead of our government bailing out us and not just billionaires who not even need it.
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  15761.  @jeffgojail The numbers you cite are a reflection of the fact free attacks by right wing media and the post election honeymoon enjoyed by the pelosi. The entire establishment media hates her so it is not a surprise that consistent attacks even if empty and stupid hit home. The establishment blatantly ignores what its base demands to chase the same donor cash as the GOP and are essentially paid to lose. The democrats are manovoring themselves to hand over power to the GOP in four years. Which is fine either way as the consultants that serve both parties and the donors win. The GOP super serves its base while calling the democrats communist and the DNC spits on what their base wants chasing republican voters and talking points. You have no idea what virtue signaling and really should avoid using the term. The fact is AOC and the squad has limited power and even so is much more relevant than anyone in the establishment at her tenure. Proposing legislation is exactly what these congressmen should be doing. The manufactured consent and attacks on unowned leadership is created and distributed by an establishment that loves our broken status quo. The numbers that really matter are during elections and on policy. AOC killed in her last outing and no democrat running on M4A lost their seat. M4A is still more popular than any establishment leader. As long as we are suggesting courses of action maybe you should consider what your facts actually mean and where they come from before making self serving conclusions. No one gives a fuck about private insurance, most people hate them as they are thieves that live to rob you and do not care if your family lives or dies. No one I have every talked to cares if they exist and no one is backing way from paying half what they do not to keep a parasitic industry that has the popularity of head lice alive. Your spin is bankrupt and well over half of americans want the system gone, almost no one backs them up. Your spin that people do not like progressive ideas is brain dead and not remotely true. You spit the garbage of corporately owned shills who step over the bodies of americans for donor cash.
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  15841.  @RosyTintedLife  When you act triggered and storm from the room over something so cut and dry you undermine your crediblity in this venue. You may be sincerely concerned and have been bamboozled by Warren's shinagains but if you are a troll or someone that has been duped amounts to a distinction without a difference. Buying into establishment tropes and non issues so easily makes you functionally indistinguishable from the trolls who spit nonsense about Bernie dialy and want nothing to change. I have defended Warren over and over during this primary but as of the debate that ended. The bizzare timing, the duplicitous nature of her comments on the issue and who her actions benfit has culminated in my decision to cut her loose from my support. At this point in the conversation I have little patience for those who buy into her pointless and counter productive spin that only helps Biden or Trump. It is Warren who is promoting the political abusers who have been beating us all for decades forcing us to choose between lessor evils. With tbese actions Warren has joined thier ranks attacking the progressive cause empowering actual abuse, all she had to do is stab her 'friend' in the back over a year old conversation which if true should have been addresseed long ago between themsleves when it happened. NOTHING Bernie has saod is remotly similar to the actions of an 'abuser'. This was a silly issue to attack him on as his crediblity on it is well established. It does not stick unless you are looking for a reason to attack bernie in the first palce or are already bought into overtly dishonest main stream spin desinged to distract voters from the real issues. I expected much better of Warren and am very disappointed in her.
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  15938.  @1neAdam12  You have no idea what the word research means. It does not mean going through your face book feed or consuming nonsense that validates your preconceptions. I have forgotten more about this vaccine and virus than you will ever bother to learn. I got news for you sparky, you are a cultist and no version of any kind of scientific expert. The concerns you cite are all valid and based on real science. The hyperbolic nature of your fear of them is entirely manufactured nonsense for a specific brand of clueless NPC. The "Jabs" are working, that they do not give total Immunol protection and will require boosters does not change that fact. No matter how you get it Immunol protection for this virus is transitory and fades. This means via shot or infection your Immunol protection fades over time and you will need booster or another dance with the virus to top it up. The side effects of the vaccine were deeply concerning especially early on when there was no context for them and we did not know how often they occurred. Those days are now well behind us. The actual science on this issue is in. The danger associated with the vaccine is dwarfed by the consistent deeply problematic long term issues attached with contracting and helping to continue to proliferate the virus. You are not special or informed, you have bought into a brand of nonsense that appeals to your personal fears and feelings. You are not a scientist and never understood them, that has not changed because you joined a cult.
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  16181.  @RogerStarks  The FDA does not consider that using ivermectin as useful in treating covid. Animal versions of the drug are not the same in dosage and are highly concentrated so using them is ALWAYS problematic even for worms. The only data that validates using a fucking deworming drug against a virus is CHERRY PICKED! Your projection and asserted ignorance is off the scale. Pretending I am the one who is clueless because I do not consume the same nonsense self serving media you do daily is silly. This is as you advocate for medicine that is literally detached from the issue. It makes you a poster child for your cognitive dissonance you accuse me of. Please understand I am aware of everything you are on this subject. Seems like I may know more because you add in total nonsense and some how rationalize that in. So yes I am aware that the vaccine takes a while to take after your shot. They tell you this as you get it, that it takes 2 weeks to activate. What is your point? What about this well known factoid makes you think the vaccine is a fail? The virial load talking point is entirely irrelevant. The fact is it is harder to contract the virus if inncolatied and you do not tend to get it as bad if you do. None of that changes with your empty spin about viral loads which is discussed by doctors for an actual reason. In the fully vaxed countries you are discussing the infection rate is 1/10 of what it was in January. This wrecks your talking points. It makes sense that in a country where everyone has the shot most people who get the virus have had the shot, this is not a fail of the inoculation. The raw numbers are what matter and they are LOWER! I have seen all the data and am not sure why you think it validates your spin or why you think I did not know it. Your conclusion it is not working is born of the spin you are consuming and is not attached to the data which clearly shows it is. You are starting with a conclusion and working backwards not me. You assert I am not informed tell me stuff I know like it is a drop the mike moment and then they say crazy things. You have to understand that is not compelling. No one you know ever came to you for your critical thinking skills. You are a mess and should not be lecturing anyone that does not want a deworming drug packaged for horses to attack a virus. Informed, pfffft! Broaden your news sources, you stuck in a bubble that has you saying things with assurance that are not attached to reality. Let go of this secular vaccine death cult you joined, it gives you nothing back but empty assurance just like every empty self serving faith.
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  16267. Like I sad he can end run the rule or just beat it if he has to. That this is all they have speaks to how desperate they are and nothing else to me. I have seen them trying to mimic him and that is a good thing. They still have nowhere near the momentum or credibility he has and they are the upstart underdogs this time. They have the same hill to climb that Bernie did and I frankly do not see them beating him toe to toe. Every leader that does this is moving in the right direction but everyone of them is a pale copy of Bernie and are not and never will be remotely as popular. Bernie is filling halls and gets coverage on his own merits now and pushing one candidate over him will be seen for exactly what it is. Bernie voters who did not even exist last time at the start of the campaign are fighting twice as hard this time from the outset. Tricks like forcing voters to register far ahead of the primaries will no longer work and people are organizing around them from the start this time. The two party system most certainly has to change. It is only marginally better than a dictatorship and has been shown to promote the status quo over what the voters want. Bernie running as an independent does not solve that problem and would just empower the status quo and make him irrelevant splitting the left and ensuring GOP victory. There is no prize for second place in our system. I simply can not agree that Bernie is an "idiot' if he runs within that system as it stands today with the options for victory as they are. This is especially true as he almost won last time when he was the underdog and not the fave. Your concerns about him being hoodwinked are well founded and based in fact. But we really do not need the Joe's or even the Obama's of this world in order to win because what they really stand for is not and never has been popular with anyone but donors. The republicans went through this same thing last time with Trump and lost. The key difference between the democrats and them is none of their candidates had a giant head start and support of the entire system pushing them ahead on day one. They could not make anyone else win and that is what will happen the dems this time even as they would like to desperately change that fact. In the end I suspect we agree on far more than we disagree on. It looks like our key differences are on our estimation of how powerful we expect our opposition is and how effective we imagine their tricks are. I for one do not see them as very good at what they do, they barely beat him last time with every advantage and they are starting in a giant hole this time not at the top of the hill with all the momentum.
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  16560.  @exiledhebrew1994  Yes, one of those goals is certainly Medicare for all. But this vote not going to pass with this congress, senate or presidency. So you are demanding a symbolic vote to out liars that know the vote is not going to pass anyway. You gain nothing and end up getting the exact same certainty of support you have now with the co-sponsors list .(meaning not that much) She has done a great deal in expanding the popularity and appeal of progressive policy. She personally put the green new deal on the map. The complaint you have is similar to the complaint against Bernie that he has not passed many bills. It is poorly thought out and misses the value of what he has brought and how he (or she) has moved the bubble on what is even discussed. That she has not in her freshmen term converted a corporatist entirely sold out party to the policy now supported only lately by a majority of the democratic voters is not a failure on her part. To say it is speaks to your poorly thought out expectations and little more. Jimmy's spin appeals to our anger at how slow change has been. How we have been largely shut out by establishment spin compounded by the fact we just elected another incrementalist stain to the presidency. It feels like doing something when in fact even it was applied would do nothing or end up costing us. Directing our anger at the flag bearers over a matter style just as we have found a path to taking power from the corrupt feels like going backwards. I do not see it as of any value except to divide our like minds stopping the advancement of the movement that will otherwise give us Medicare for all as we gain more leavers of power. Corporate democrats are weak, but attacking the only unowned reps at the beginning of a term ignores the fact the time to put pressure on all democratic leaders was before the election. Even better in the primaries.
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  16770. fbda5555 I do not know how you are dumb enough to buy the fringe nonsense you spew.  You are the one who is spitting the garbage of clowns who are considered gross by the majority.  Quit pretending you represent the main stream as you are a fringe dwelling throwback, own that. I do not give a fuck about how we did things in the past or that other bigots have power now or had it in the past.   You represent a failed way of looking at the world and that you want to hang onto that says nothing good about you. I am unconcerned about "white genocide in south Africa" as you clowns regularly use the term and have no fucking clue what it actually means.  Give me more detail and it is safe to bet I would oppose anyone committing murder in he name of racial purity but that is not what is happening here and the policies of some on the fringe of SA do not define everyone of color.  I oppose all fundamentalists having political power including Muslims.  Again this has nothing to do with race or the color of my skin or those I oppose. I dislike them not because they are different than me but because they are regressive and do not share any ideals with me.  There are already laws against murder half wit and I do not fear being attack by a minority than I do white person.  The spin that because they have a different skin tone than you they are dangerous is idiocy personified.  Your stupid railing on the jews marks you as below contempt.   You clowns have always did this bullshit and now is no different.  Keep it up as it makes you look like the sack of shit you are and clearly identifies what garbage your views represent.   Your guesses about me are as weak and fact free as the rest of your spin.  I live in a city and not some po-dunk backwater like you do.  Places where you are exposed to other cultures do not breed the kind of overt ignorant racism in any kind numbers that you represent.   That treat people as individuals and not stereotypes may be "gay" in your backward world but to the sane it is the only way to go.  We are all the same and if we made the same kind of money integrated communities are safe affluent nice places to live.  When you pile poor people in any one area it becomes a place people want to move away from.  Black people tend be disproportionality poor and that is why there are large comminutes of them congregated, We are the same in the same way you are same as a billionaire, identical just poorer.  This is not a complex idea. Merry Christmas. 
    1
  16771. fbda5555 It is not "good",  it is normal, expected and I frankly do not care what the predominant skin tone around me is.   The fact is give enough time the distinctions in color that were built around regional isolation that is no longer a reality will continue to shrink naturally. You decry this as the world losing something when I simply do not agree.  The genes of both parents carry forward so no one is shut out, no one is destroyed.  The phenomena you discuss with regard to eastern Europeans being poor and not being violent is not well thought out.  The fact is in their society the poor parts of the country are more violent, there is more crime and that you do not think there is speaks to your ignorance willful or otherwise.  Same goes for the "millions of whiles" who live below the poverty line and if you look at who gets arrested and convicted the poor consistently drive those numbers.  What is repulsive is your ignorant ass pretending you are superior and when fact you demonstrate how woefully inadequate, undedicated and self serving your stupid spin is.  I do not give flying fuck what an empty sack of shit like you thinks and will always oppose half wits like you trying to pump yourself up based on the actions of people you could not hope to compare yourself to.  That you share a skin tone with some successful people does not say anything about you.  The questions you ask all have answers but you are not going to find them in the white nationalist drivel you clearly consume.  I have answered some of them and that you ignore that to make the same assertions again like I said nothing speaks to what how dishonest you are in this conversation. White propaganda?  Whatever safe space boy, you are pathetic and your skin is so thin it is probably not white at all but transparent. You have not made a single argument as you accuse me of the same thing. You spit discredited nonsense that is easy to dismiss with a simple google search.  You are not informed, you do not represent "white people" and no one sane wants you to. 
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  16828. ***** That you ignore facts that do not agree with you is telling but is not compelling as an argument.   Ignorance is the bed rock you live on but that does not validated your fact free spin.  I got news for you sparky, every first world country has a heavily regulated health care  market.  They actually are much more regulated then we are and that is why they are way cheaper.  Lasic surgery is competitive because it is completely optional.  The same does not go for heart surgery and no one shops around for that type of procedure.  This is a stupid argument.  If optional procedure are not competitive others step in and go cheaper, this is not the case for most medical procedures because when you sell oxygen you do not have to work hard at it.  Your bullshit about individual rights speaks to a deep ignorance about the rest of the developed world.  All first world countries value individual rights and it is a key component that differentiates us from the rest of the world.   This is not about rights this is about corporate control over a resource to no value.   You are fighting for the right for people to go bankrupt because they get sick.  To die because they can not afford care to make some already rich assholes even richer.  This is horrible spin one has to be morally bankrupt to support.  Your rhetoric is nonsense and I look at results not partisan bullshit when evaluating any system.   Your numbers do not add up as we pay the most and while at the same time leave more people behind and ruin more lives than any other first world nation when it come to health care.  We have unfairly burdened our employers with providing insurance making them less competitive than their first world counterparts.   Unless you are an insurance company or a billionaire there is literally no upside to our health care system and it is not remotely socialist let alone communist. You have not stats, you have nothing but ignorant fact free assertions and I will not stop calling out ass hats like you for sharing your nonsense.   
    1
  16829. ***** Shrug, I am not defending our failed system you are.  EVERY other first world health care system is cheaper than ours and sees no one die because they are poor.  It is sad you are paying more but there was no guarantee you were not going to have to pay more anyway as insurance prices were climbing out of control before the ACA anyway. You keep asserting we have the best.  This is an idiots talking point.  What we have is a system that drives the vast majority of our bankruptcies.  that forces employers to pay for health care when it has nothing do with their business, that empowers insurance companies and private for profit hospitals to financially rape people when they have no choices at their most vulnerable.  They litterally sell life and death and you defend that. I am saying that every other first world system is cheaper in every way than ours.   You could give me an example of one where people pay more?  I find it telling you do not. Here is how it works.  In Canada it does not cost you a cent.  In Germany it does not cost you a cent,  ect, ect.   Even if you factor in higher costs for taxes they still pay less then us if you add both insurance charges and taxes together.  There is no copay or deductible or other bullshit like that.  It cheaper and they spend less per person than we do by a long stretch because they actually have this fancy idea called cost control.  It is illegal in Canada to have private for profit clinics because there is no cost control and they would take money from public system making it as failed as ours.   I got news for you,  they like their system and there is no large constituency that looks to us with envy on health care,  the fact is almost no one does.  It is your assertion that capitalism is the answer to every question.  You are fact free zealot on this issue and are part of a fringe movement who sees everything in black and white.  The fact is capitalism is good for some things and socialism is good for others.  When it comes to issues like health care socialism kicks ass and the numbers from the rest of the developed world bear this out.  Your ignorance and partisan spin on these issues are clear.  The world is not as simple or cut and dry as you make it and that you want to demonize words like socialism does not mean your spin has any merit outside your fact free bubble. My country is free and I will say what I think.  That the gop bought the election and that the dems were too weak to call them out on their failures does not change what I think in the slightest.  You and those like you are the ones that go with the crowd no matter what, not all of us are blind followers. 
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  16898. diapersFTMFW11 I don't act like he purposely nose dived his company, I think he is less than competent and failed more than his share of times. That he could not handle competition from non professionals in the form of the native gambling establishments does not speak to his business acumen either. There is no reason to expect he would have done any better if any other non "Indian" establishment came along and crushed him. I am not sure how additional competition in the market that won is the excuse you point to but frankly if he could not compete he should not have been in the market and should go bankrupt, These places were all competing for the same clients in the same environment and that Trump lost does not speak to his leadership or business skills no matter how you spin it. Saying trump does not change his positions is ridiculous. He has flip flopped on abortion from the 90's but more recently on taxes, the min wage and even his ban all Muslim nonsense as he pivots left. It appears you have no idea what your hero has said or is saying and it does not do your argument justice. I have watched his interviews from the 80's and 90's and see inconsistently woven through out it. I have no idea what source you gather your info from but it past time you cast a wider net. His candidacy has been successful but points out what a travesty fox has created with its years of backwards spin. He is literally policy free and has almost no detail about what he will do either in speeches or on his website. The fact is you can not trust anything he says and will change what his spin is depending on the group he is talking to. He is not attracting bigger crowds than Bernie who has been consistently breaking records not that you would ever hear many of the actual success stories for either his or Bernie's camp from the main stream media. I will admit he is the best candidate put forth from the GOP but that is damning with faint praise as they were all terrible this cycle. I put my trust in a man who is supported by his voters and has been consistent for the last 30 years. I understand Trumps appeal, I just do not share a taste for it as you clearly do. This is a strange cycle that Trump can win especially if Hillary gets rammed through as the nominee. That being said I will not be pleased if he does. I hope I am wrong about how dishonest he is and you are right but I fear my analysis is spot on.
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  17084. ***** Muslim apologists would and do say the same thing about terrorists.  I put them in the same class as Jihaists because their views (which are attached to their faith) are as driven by social identification as all religions and extremist violence is.   You go ahead and ignore Brevik called himself a christian, I will not. You go ahead and ignore that the movement that McVeigh sprang from consistently claims to be christian, I will not.  You do not get to ignore the ass hats on the fringe because you do not agree with them.  If moderate Muslims are scolded to decry radicalism you should be mad to do the same. I don't know what you mean about big numbers as I am talking about these two case's.  I have not done any of the bullshit accuse me of and choose people who have specifically been associated with Christianity even as you try to wash your hands of them.  Christan terror does not = Islamic terror and there are good reasons for that.  Those reasons are not attached to the Christians being superior but because we have systematically stripped away their ability to do so.   That being said Christianity is just as big of a concern if not larger as the most dangerous proponents have much more power than the most powerful Muslim extremist group.  I am very concerned about the group who craves the end of the world not just for them but for all.  A group of Christians who expect to be raptured up in our lifetime is now driving policy in the middle east with a desire to hurry the end times along.  If that is not a concern I do not know what is and I will not give fact free assholes like that a pass.  I dislike all fundamentalists in the exact same way and do not apologize for any of them.  Violent or not they would all drag us into the dark ages given half a chance. 
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  17115. ***** Why are conservatives such dishonest fucks?  You never say anything but fully imply it with your bullshit spin.  You did say I contradict myself,  you said; "Do you realize that you just said in one sentence that the tax increases would not be used to expand welfare programs and in the very next said that the increased taxes  , on the wealthy , would be used to expand welfare programs... lol." That is saying I contradicted myself and it is wholly untrue because I did not say the extra taxes were to expand welfare programs. Not only is this dishonest it makes you into blatant hypocrite as well.  It was you who "put words in other peoples moths" by pretending I said the taxes were to expand welfare when I do not do so. Then you whine about it being a victim of what you just did in the very next post.  You and those like you are polluted with need to project your own clear failures onto others regardless if the smear is valid or not. Actually Bernie fully explains how to pay for all of his proposals. After looking at the plan I understand what they actually are and how it is done.  Every single thing he proposes is paid for by the small increases he has laid out.  You are fact free in your assessment that he can not pay for them and it again speaks to your ignorance and nothing else.  Give me specifics of what you base your assertions on and I will show you how you are wrong.  Be warned your talking points will not stack up well against the facts, choose well. We all work, the vast majority of all Americans work.  Pretending fact free ideologues like you have some kind of monopoly on it is idiocy. The proposals I fight for help all working people representing 99% of us and it is you who fight against your own interests.  
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  17131. Radical Christianity is in decline because of secularism not because we banned it. I am saying Christianity was identical when they had the power to write law. They wrote the same kind of laws that Islam does in the places you point to. What corrected Christianity was secularism which removed religious law and allowed people to chose ever more moderate versions of the faith. We achieved this "reformation" not by banning the faith but by empowering religious freedom which saw the gradual decline fundamentalist religious thought in our society until they became the minority. In our case secularism was first promoted in an attempt to sever the control of a corrupt church from state control and the leaderships dependency on them for support. Over time this saw the decline and influence of the church and an ever continued relaxing of a state sponsored promotion dogma leading to the much more moderate majority of Christians we see today over time. Christianity in the same period you point to as highlighting Islams failures owns it's share of genocide, oppression and murder too. Ignoring that fact to paint Islam as more dangerous is not well thought out. That humanity will always have some in every religious group who want to roll back into the 600's is inevitable but it has been shown that secularism pulls the teeth of the worst freedom crushing aspects of the faith. This currently well demonstrated by the much larger percentage of actually moderate Muslims (support gay marriage, etc) in western societies compared to places controled by religious law. It is undeniable that regions which are problematic have not enjoyed that benefits of secularism. The only places that have seen the rise of moderate thought are those that have embrace it. Religiously imposed law and authoritarian government is the root cause of this problem and all faiths have shown they are repressive and backward when they have legal control of a society in promotion of unsupportable self serving dogma. We agree on keeping Assad in as replacing him with a new dictator is likely to blow up in our face if we look at even the recent past. As an effort to attack this issue we need to put pressure on the governments of the region to promote moderate policies and support administrations that do so while turning away from those that don't. Sadly this is unlikely to happen because the driver or our policy to date is not ideology based but economic. This means that the promotion of the very idea's that would make a difference is not nearly as important to the profits of the oil companies who really call the shots. Couple this with the fact we a have an element of our own government who openly derides secularism and it is not shock they don't promote it. An excellent example of the fact we are not serious in dealing with "radical Islamic terror" issues is our continued alliance with Saudi Arabia who is a wholly backwards, repressive, Salafist terror exporting state we ignore because they sell us cheap oil. As long as we call these guys and the other radical assholes friends we are going to be part of the problem as we prop up the very root of the cancer. As long as we back clowns who sell religious ideals promoted by state law this issue will not be mitigated and any hoped for reformation will not happen.
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  17147. TheGodYouWishYouKnew As usual you are full of shit and 100% wrong, at least you are consistent.   Dissenting voices on fox are nothing but staging or a foil for the assholes there to yell at.  They do not present both sides of any issue and if you hear the "liberal position" it is only so they can be attack and belittle it.   The opposition is consistently outnumbered and marginalized by the rest of the panel and there is NOTHING BALANCED about fox no matter how you want to spin it.  I have seen right wing speakers come on TYT and have their ass handed to them, they do not come back because it is not a safe zone for them and they get their stupid bullshit called out.  That they do not come on all the time does not speak to a bias but the right wings fear of facts.  I say you live in a bubble as you make blatantly incorrect statements all the time like they are universally excepted facts.  You are either willfully ignorant or just out of touch with reality because it is clear by your spin you only watch this channel and talk on the forums to hack on it.  I am not convinced you hear or read anything that that does not support your narrative and instead consume this media looking for something to attack.     I don't give a fuck if you fell out of Saul Alinsky's ass the only things you will be judged on here is based on what you say.  You say a lot of stupid things not attached to reality that marks you as a fact free ideologue.  Deal with that truth because as long as you share the fact free spin you do that is what you should be rightly called.  You are the troll here, I have no idea why you show up but calling out your kind of idiotic bullshit is something I am happy to do for free.
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  17240. +Mats Jönsson Hey dude, that meteorologist is the closest thing on your list of signatories to a climate scientist who actually is an expert on the subject. And that guy is a shill and one would not expect him to get the weather right but to say what the interests that own his dishonest ass want him to. As far as being an apologist you have no clue what the word means and you are much more an apologist for big oil than I am for anyone. I know dishonestly and misrepresentation of those you oppose is your goto move but for once actually listen to what I say instead of making shit up. That I do not share your spin that all Muslims are dangerous does not mean i agree with them about anything or give them a pass for their faults. I unlike you have the capacity to disagree with someone without resorting to fabricating nonsense to make them into dangerous caricatures of no value. I also do not need to misrepresent or straw man those I oppose because my arguments against them are already sound by sticking to facts based on their own words and what they claim to stand for. Fun fact: Industrial driven climate change is personified by unusual and rapid global scale changes in expected weather patterns and local weather occurrences. The manifestation of colder or warmer or drier or wetter than recorded norms is climate change at work. We have seen records set all around the world and our average temperature is climbing very very rapidly by historic standards. What we do expect to see coming as attached to global trends that are changing much more rapidly than any example we have is going to be manifested in larger extremes and changes to systems that will drastically effect whole regions and billions of people including some of the most powerful nations who at the very best exacerbate a real issue.
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  17274. BUDS: The Animated Series We already enforce the laws and what he wants to do has nothing to do with law and everything to do with throwing red meat to his voting base who loves his spin.  Nothing he proposes would solve the endemic problems we have on immigration and the wall is a stupid idea as we now have net negative immigration from Mexico.  This means more people are leaving than coming.   The idea you have to buy better education and healthcare is the root of our problem because not everyone can afford and people are literally dying and going bankrupt by the 10's of thousands because of it.   Our public education system has been systematically undermined by those who want to belly up to the bar and scrape billions of our education dollars off the top when that money should be spent on education not profit for corporations. The price going up has nothing do with crossing states and you are using a fact free insurance company talking point.  The only reason they champion this idea is because it will allow them to circumvent state regulation that curbs their worst excesses by choosing the most corrupt state to base their operations out of.  It would do NOTHING to cut costs.  No one who is informed and not on the payroll of the insurance company defends our health care system that feeds money to a useless third party who acts as real death panels every day to make another buck.  Their biggest fail is they provide zero cost control for the consumers because all they do when prices go up is raise the rates.  The buck stops at us who have to foot the bill with consistently higher premiums while no one is working for us to lower costs because there is no mandate to.
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  17276. BUDS: The Animated Series What are you a talking point machine?  We have a high statutory tax corporate tax rate but the effective rate is very low after deductions. They are misleading you when they say they pay high corporate taxes.  We have companies that made billions but got tax returns. We should not be surprised as corporations wrote most of own their tax law and handed it to their property to pass and are the source or your spin.  Our taxes are already low by first world standards and good thing too as we get next to nothing for them compared to everyone else.  Our problem is we have devalued work and gave corporations intensives to outsource jobs here.  It does not matter how big of  tax cut you give to a business the only way they invest more and create jobs is if there is demand.   Demand is ONLY created by people wanting your product and for that they need money.  This idea we should hand billionaires money to throw on a pile or for out sourcing and they will create more jobs is nonsense on the face.  I can not understand how anyone buys this bullshit that has zero basis in reality but people spit like it is gospel.     The concept of giving the richest of us more while removing regulations and allowing to poison us will create jobs has zero merit. Trickle down is discredited garbage.  Tax cuts are a terrible way to create jobs especially if you do not put any strings on them.  The idea we have to become more China or the third world is only good to someone who expects to be at the tippy top and even then they are an asshole.  Their air and water is poison and people work like slaves for next to nothing,  I do not see their model as strong. The money we spend needs to be spent better and those at the very top need to pay more back into the system.  The middle class is shrinking not because regulation or taxes but because we have allowed corporations to ship jobs oversea while handing them tax cuts to do it.   You only pay tax on your profit and if you make money in the US you should be willing to pay your taxes on that share.  We as the people should demand it.   If they abandon the market because they are making 3% less profit than they did before that is fine because someone will step in and take that business.   Trump is only leading the GOP polls,  he is behind both dem contenders.  Even the corporate shill Hillary is beating him.
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  17301. So what you imagine is we should take a state that is working collapse it and enact your nonsense and that has no place in reality. You are looking a church that needs paint and then saying lets burn it down that will solve everything.   I say you have a faith based view because you have literally nothing to validate it will work any better than what has been tried before as the paint will crack on your new church too. The reason your plan is valueless is it does not address the real root cause of the issues.  You are improperly diagnosing our problem on the nature and failure of a state when the real problem is innate to any system.   Corruption is the problem and there is no reason to think your vision will not suffer it too.  Any system that goes in place will have rules.  Any set of rules or adjudication of those rules is corruptible.  It is the cancer that ruined an idea as idealistic as yours (communism) and it is a crippling palsy that is in the process crushing representational democracy too.  Nothing in your or any similar manifesto addresses this issue in a meaningful way preferring to imagine it will just go away.  Your views are idealistic and honest but not well connected to reality.  Your plan to burn down the church will never appear well thought out until you explain how it will be any different to past failures.  Until you can better explain why you think almost no rules will help it will appear you are proposing to rebuild said hypothetical church out of rainbows and unicorn skin.
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  17304. freefallfalcon I don't have blind faith in anything and prefer to base my views on good ideas supported by evidence that has been evaluated in the public sphere and not just in some fringe group.  "Stateism" is not a god to me it is a tool. Tools neither good or evil or to be worshiped. They are meant to be used and maintained toward a goal. Anarchist schools of thought can differ fundamentally, supporting anything from extreme individualism to complete collectivism. Strains of anarchism have often been divided into the categories of social and individualist anarchism or similar dual classifications.  The desire for a stateless system of governance is universal throughout. The concept has no more claim to success than true communism does. There is no reason to expect it will not suffer the same kind of failures that commission did, that being crippling corruption.  The original ideas of Communism has been proven to be unworkable because in the real world corruptible elements destroy any chance if the ideal implementation.  Your vision contains no mechanism to counter that. I don't have faith in anything.  I look at systems and evaluate their strengths and problems. The issues and benefits are categorized with a specific weight.  It is not faith that drives what I think but an analysis of the respective systems and their viability and value.  Your vision is simplistic and incomplete and based far more on your visceral gut feeling than anything empirical.  I call your views on this subject faith based because there is not much else to support you.  States fail but always another rises, this is not an innate weakness of states as you assert but a natural cycle in a world that is always  changing. Fundamental or even sometimes small changes are what kills states   There are a myrid reasons bey environmental, social or political for the collapse of any given state. To assert it their failure is due to an innate weakness of "stateism" is not well supported. Some of them can adapt better and last longer but in the end all likely to fall and be  subsumed by something else. his is not an inate flaw but an expected process that has often resulted in something better.
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  17330. Anonb  Every item you listed is attached to a power grab and is an act that has nothing to do with the idea of atheism which make no assertions except lack of belief and has no dogma at all. All of the events you cited are based on an ideology but since atheism has tenets you should take some time if you want to be honest to see what actual ideology it was in service to.  In each case the state acted as the defacto religion usurping traditional church power and they fail for the exact same reason all authoritarian systems do. They persecute minorities or anyone who competes for power with them like all state faiths.  No matter what,  none of the events you point to are informed by atheism which is simply lack of belief, nothing more.  These actions you attribute to atheists are actually attached to wholly constructed authoritarian movements which co-opted the traditional role of state religion in "atheisms" name to take power using overt baseless propaganda.  In other words they were and are bad because they acted like the other authoritarian religions.   If atheism is expected to answer for a tiny number of atheists who acted like fundamentalists in its name know Christianity or any of the Abrahamic faiths are far more guilty of that failure. The standard publicly espoused position by vast majority of atheists is not Stalin's or Mau's nonsense but the avocation of secularism and religious freedom for all.  Practically no fundamentalist (who are the only real and opposition to atheists) can say the same.
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  17347. JANET MITCHELL She is treated the same way as anyone else.   In the same way a black bakery would have to make a cake for the KKK guys as long as the design of cake itself was not against policy. I will continue to call her a bigot because she is one.  It does not matter why she is a bigot or what she used to justify her bigotry because in the end that she has a reason changes nothing.  I will give you a quick tip on what makes you a bigot.   If you would single out another group that think should be treated differently then you are a bigot.  That you imagine your sky daddy smiles down on it does not validate you.   You do know you do not speak for all Christan's don't you?  This is a only a precept for your special brand of faith.  To open the door to let you pick who gets served and who does not based on your bias is terrible slippery slope.  It means anyone can start banning anyone based on any precept they claim is part of their faith.  KKK members could claim whites only because their faith precludes them having to serve others.   We have been down the road of letting people just like you pick and choose who gets served and the rules we put in place have worked in stopping them. Your kind have always existed and it warms my heart to see you going down in flames on this issue.  It was clowns just like you who used the bible to argue interracial marriage should be illegal.  It was people like you who cited the bible in defense of slavery.  It does not matter if you get it or not as the next generation will.  You will be remembered by history as being exactly like the anti interracial marriage pro slavery Christians of old.  This is not about religion but commerce.  We made rules that outlawed bigotry in choosing customers for business who had a pubic business license. She has every right not to serve the couple.  She does not have the right to break the terms of her signed business license to do it.  As it turns out she may not be able to run a business in the same way a Mennonite can not drive a truck.  It is both their faith decisions to limit their own options. I hold everyone to the same standard including her.   When she broke her signed contract she knew what she was doing.  She made her choice and she needs to live with it.  I do not really want to see her punished but they insured it is an expensive statement to others make if they choose to do so.  I do have to admit was pretty funny to see her crying about it.  It is kinda like me getting fired for spitting in someones face and then crying about how unfair it is in front of a crowd who would have loved to see it.
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  17348. JANET MITCHELL Yes they would have to.  They can not deny him a cake because they do not like them.  That is the way the law works.   She is not a bigot because I call her one she is a bigot for what she says and does.  It is her actions that label her a bigot and that you agree with her does not make any difference.  ' You have no idea what bigot is as you try to call me one while apparently being one yourself,  it is pretty rich watching you try though.   God is some big imaginary sky daddy, he has NEVER been proved and that you think he has speaks to your profound ignorance and nothing else.  Nice true christian no true Scotsman fallacy you have going there.  We will just toss it in the trash with the rest of your bad spin and moronic pronouncements you feel compelled to make. Like it or not simpleton you do have a brand of faith.  That you imagine you have the right one just speaks to your profound prideful self importance and willful delusion is all.  This nation was never christian and most of the founding fathers were deists at best.   The word Jesus is never in none of our founding documents and we did not put it in the constitution except to say that there could be no laws passed in religions name.  The idea we are or were ever a fundamentally christian nation or any majority ever saw religion as you do is nonsense.   You so mired in fact free bullshit everyone single person who does not live in your bubble will read your nonsense and reject is as madness from the fringe.  People like you need to be kept away from children, the majority who does agrees with you on anything sees your kind as the ones with an agenda.  You people are the kings of indoctrination and therefor it is natural you imagine anyone who disagrees with you does it.  Maybe kids are into your nonsense faith in your tiny podunk community but the real trend is going the other way.   Young people are less religious not more religious and that is a very good thing.  I know the history of this country and the world better than you ever will.  You have a version of it crafted to sell what you want to buy but your spin is not attached to reality.  In no case giving into the christian Taliban which is what you represent a good thing.  You fact free clowns are a menace to society, all society.  It is a good thing you do not have real power, it means we can step out of the barbarity you would drag us back into.   Fundamentalists like you are a universal problem the world over because you kind are not attached to reality and hate education as it steps on your lunacy.   It is from ranks of people like you suicide bombers are drawn.  When one is as detached from reality as you are it opens you up to do anything. 
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  17408. ***** He is doing well because bigots have always been there they just did not have a public voice for a long time. These people were always bigoted and always felt this way but mark my words their numbers have been steadily diminishing not increasing.  It was one business as usual to think gay marriage was wrong but today you  are in an every shrinking minority.  Even trump has little to say on this subject as he knows it is a loser. I do not care what your form of bigotry is they are all based on the exact same brand of ignorance, intolerance and will to limit the rights of those you arbitrarily do not like.  You are a bigot own it. Sexuality is not a choice and I do not choose to be strait and if you did it means you are bisexual not strait.   No one chooses to be gay and you are or not.  The spin these people are electing to be treated as second class citizens by bigots like you is you abdicating all responsibility for your own actions. No one should care what you think about gay people and no one should be subject to your personal views on the subject. You are free to be a bigot you are not free to limit the rights of others based on your spin no matter what the reason is.  Attacking gay people in this way is the exact same thing as attacking black people and you are in denial as you do so.  Every bigot has their reasons for believing as they do and they almost all deny what they are, that fact changes nothing. Murder, rape etc. are crimes because they deny the rights of the victims. To lump being gay in with these crimes is  willful idiocy and misses the entire reason these actions are illegal in the first place. That trump is doing well in the GOP primary polls says a lot about the GOP base and the mess that fox has created.  It does not speak to how the majority of the country feels or what the main stream believes.  Trump has zero chance in a general election and his openly stated bigotry that served him well in the primary is going to ensure he has no chance when it comes time to elect a president.   I honestly hope they choose him as their candidate.
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  17410. ***** Not respecting others is the path to not being respected yourself.  That you imagine you will always be in power and have the right to limit the rights of others ignores the chance that you one day may be persecuted by someone who arbitrarily decides you do not measure up.  We have seen this time and again.  It is your conceivable that your interest in the Chinese may mark you as the other or the enemy to some.  That still want to draw a line between one kind of bigotry and another ignores that what it means to be discriminated against by a powerful majority.  I wholly stand against those would lord power over the powerless and see you as wrong.   "First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Socialist. Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Trade Unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me." Is a great argument for the demand to respect of others even if you do not agree if you are self centered as you clearly appear to be.   I can and do define what is right and wrong just like everyone else. To the Mayans cutting out someone heart was ok, but I do not need to agree with them or respect that view point as valid.  I can and do so just like you do in the with your personal rejection of racial bigotry as stated earlier.  Go ahead and defend the idea of slavery or bigotry at your leisure but know you have already lost this fight long ago. If you can make a rational case for them by all means do so but I will not hold my breath waiting for it. I would not assume you did well when you ask legal questions that are moot.  I am simply pointing out facts and if you were as good in Poli Sci as you say you were then you would not have asked it in that way.  I see you as ignorant when you ask ignorant questions or make assertions that simply do not bear out.  If you were asking what it would be like if we made him dictator for life, the answer is his bigotry would still be as immoral as Hitlers was even with the power of state at his back. This is not a tough concept for most.   The fact is I talk to a lot of people those with your spin are consistently uneducated and wholly ignorant. I guess it depends on where you went to school and what your personal experience is but you have the spin of the willfully clueless and heavily cloistered.  Like it or not this is what your take on the world says about you.  Even if this is not correct about you the assumption is justified by the company you keep.  When you lie down with dogs you get their fleas and it is a fair way to assess you in this venue where my information is very limited.  
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  17488. bluecrew100 I have.  I have spent a great deal of time doing so and your assumption I argue from ignorance is invalid. I do know what I understand to be true and am happy to discuss it with you. You really should avoid telling me what I think as you seem to get a great deal wrong.  Much better to see what I think and go from there perhaps by asking.  When you make assertions about what science declares it is always best if you know what it is they actually say to avoid using straw men. When you say "hence THEORY" you misunderstand the meaning of the term in fundamental way.  In science a theory is the highest standard of proof they have and does not mean conjecture as you imagine it does .  Other examples of theories are gravity, and germ theory.  The idea is one so proven and currently unimpeachable that it gets the label.  The attempt to differentiate between micro and macro evolution is a red herring invented by creationists to continue to hold their views. There is effectively no difference between the process's except in time scale.  No one but creationists ever say we came from apes. What is asserted is we both came from ape like ancestors. We can see when we compare our genes how we were identical to a point we split apart and evolve in different directions.  We can do the same with amphibians.  Even though this science is not easy to for everyone to understand the data is available for all to see.  No one is ever asking you to trust them on faith.  How life started is another concept entirely and has NOTHING to do with evolution.  You are then discussing abiogenesis. This idea is not a theory because the evidence for it is much thinner.  What we have shown is non organic chemicals can be combined to form self replicating biological like  entities. This first step in understanding "how we came from rocks" is not complete but has infinitely more data backing it than your baseless non falsifiable assertions. The idea of the big bang has a great deal of data backing it.  No one expects you to take the concept on faith and science is not about what you believe but what you can prove.  That you project your own outlook onto those you disagree with is natural but not valid.   To sum things up no one who knows what the current science says thinks we came from rocks or monkeys.  The only ones who ever spout this nonsense are creationists who do not know what they are talking about.  From your post you fit that description. 
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  17494. MrWuhisn You ask relatively easy questions.  The beetles developed they way they did progressively or a long period of time.  Using the exact same mechanism that breeders used to make wolves into chiwawa's.  Nature selected by success the best adapted to their environment.  The beetles took small steps toward the adaption you are talking about until it is what it is today.  The individuals with a more effective "machine gun" passed their genes on more readily as they had an advantage that aided them in survival.  The ones that "exploded" did not. As giraffes with longer necks did better a getting food they passed this on.  Those with the longest necks did better and passed the trait on and over a long period short necks became very long ones.  Individuals who have the adaption you are talking about did better than others who did not.   It probably developed in parallel with the lengthening on the necks and it make sense the ones who had it would do better than those without passing it on and on. Again there takes nothing mystical to understand the process that a creature would come to understand how to maintain a nest temperature.  There are a great many animals in that have different strategies to do that., We do not require a non falsifiable designer to know that this process is repeated over an over in nature.  Creatures adapting and utilizing their environment in very sophisticated ways is a testament to their adaptability and has nothing to do with your god. Your spin is a argument from ignorance, I can not explain these things there for god.  That is pretty weak and no more valid than any other miscellaneous god taking credit for it.  We do not need your mystical mumbo jumbo to understand our world and the fact is you spin offers zero value to the conversation. That you think you have stumpers here that have not and can not be addressed is pretty sad and speaks to a very closed and simplistic mind set.   Before making the claim that your nonsense is not completely explainable by the existing process you might want to Google your talking points to see that they have been destroyed time and again.
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  17496. jamie Russell There is over 150 years of data backing up evolution.   The data is so deep and rich crossing multiple disciplines always confirming each other you have to have your head buried in the sand to not know of it's existence.  It is an act of willful ignorance to even ask the question you do. The information is widely available that it is clear you have not taken the time to look, This says a great deal about you as you talk about the subject in public and underline your ignorance.  Evolution is considered scientifically uncontested by the entire community of those who do actual science and not religious promotion. Bio genesis and evolution of distinct ideas not connected at all. That your big book puts them in the same story does not mean science considers them one and the same. They are ideas that do not rely on one another at all and that you think they are connected only further speaks to your ignorance. How about the fact your book the bible gets 1000 things wrong and even the stuff you imagine they get rights only does so tangentially if you spin it the right way. No where is it direct in sharing insight that could not be known at the time.  Historically the bible a far bigger hindrance than any kind of help in explaining our world.   Your bible has the earth being created before the sun.   It has man being created before woman.  This is base nonsense and if you were not invested in it emotionally you would dismiss it the same way you dismiss the Greek or Viking creation myths.  Your spin, your holy book,  your vision of spiritual truth has NO MORE validity than any other that has ever existed, NONE.     Trying to link your bronze age nonsense with scientific discoveries is always a stretch because the fact is the people who wrote the bible were as intelligent as we are but were vastly more ignorant.  Not lucky guesses, your spin is nothing more than  grasping for straws because the fact is your bible is a total failure as a tool for explaining the world. That you cling to bronze age ignorance over data is your choice but please know it will NEVER be compelling to anyone who is not in your fact free bubble. Your ideas have no predictive power or practical use and their entire purpose is to support your outdated version of faith and .   You have neither knowledge or truth and your spin is empty of all value.   You represent one of the ugliest faces of religion who damns data in favor of useless self serving dogma.  You are the kind of person that burned books and put to death those who disputed your ridiculous dogmatic claims back in the day.  I already know everything you know plus I also know about science which you demonize so poorly.   You have nothing to teach me and the only thing you have is an appeal to ignorance that falls pretty flat as I do not value it at all.  
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  17503. Michael Misoi Anything is admissible but ideas with no data are all less valuable than the ones that do. Religion offers certainty about things it can not be certain of and science by its very nature does not offer it and never will. One concept offers consistently successful applicable solutions and its ideas have be validated as we continue to learn more. The other is faith based and leans on a self promoting book compiled by iron age bureaucrats edited from a set bronze age zealots writings. There are plenty of groups working on validating creationism. The fact is they do not advance in the scientific field because what they practice is not science but apologetics for dogma. Science does not back up their spin and if they had data it would embrace it. What creationists have is willful ignorance and misinformation. The root of the big bang is unknown, the first fraction of a second and before is unexplained. It is a great mystery that is yet to be solved. But because it is unknown does not mean one should use another unverifiable unknown as the solution. All you are doing in trying this is passing the buck. This spin should force you to ask where cause came from. "I could as well intertwine creationism with the big bang" This is the beauty of religion from a marketing standpoint. It does not have to be remotely correct to attach itself to ideas that are empirically true. Biblical and Koranic assertions on this subject are ludicrous but can be ignored by people like you to pull out a few lines of verse you can cobble together to mean what you need it to. That does not make your claims valid or more reasonable than any other idea you make up which has no data. The real question is what benefit do you get by placing that omnipotent being in the center? I would wager it the same value as putting the flying spaghetti monster in the center, none at all.
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  17504. Michael Misoi Science and religion are fundamentally different. They attempt to answer similar questions in very different ways. If you are a biblical literalist then science and religion are not compatible. If you are willing to dismiss broad swaths of any give dogma or adopt a less dogmatic deist belief system then they are. It is a fact most people choose their faith based on how they are raised. That many scientists are religious does not validate their faith based claims any more clearly than any other faith based assertion not based on data. Great scientists are great not because they were religious but despite it. Many stood against the precepts of their church and called their church's proclamations into question. A scientist who describes himself as spiritual is not using science or data to make that claim. In fact they are stepping outside a scientific viewpoint for that aspect of his life. The fact is science will never have anything to say about intangible immeasurable world of spiritually except there is no proof for it. As long as you are making a non refutable claim science is not being stepped on. The moment you start blathering about creationism and can be proved empirically wrong you should be called out as incorrect. It is telling that he scientific community is far less religious than the elements of the society at large. Dogmatism lauded by the religious is counter to the successful application of the scientific method and we continue to advance despite the faithful not because of them.
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  17507. ***** It takes no faith. It takes an ability to read and look at the data. Science never was and never will be about certainty but about what the preponderance of data we have says. That you expect certainty is your hang up and that you have it with your faith speaks to a failure of your credulity. You have no idea what a theory is in science and it shows because your failure of an argument does not even make it out of the gate. Not understanding that the word theory has a meaning to science that gives it more value than an "idea" as you think it does is raw ignorance asserted. Accusing science of relying on some kind of faith assertion when that is literally all a creationist has is the weakest of weak sauce. It does not even try to explain why you chose your silly assertions over what the data says or why your claims are any better. The fact is understanding evolution has nothing to do with faith, it is based on mountains of non refuted evidence. Ignorance of that fact is not an argument. Oh and they were barbarians by today's standards. The activities from beating your wife to stoning people to praying to god as being the only holy way to deal with illness. They barely understood the world around them and saw evil and good spirits in their daily life as an explanation for the many things we now fully comprehend. They may have been sophisticated in some ways but by today's standards they were at best barbarians. In their defense it was the bronze age. Christians do not get a pass on handle and the fact is you would not recognize what the early Christians believed compared to what modern ones now buy into. Btw you left your caps lock is on, there is no real need to shout your fact free claims. It makes you look unstable.
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  17511. +colonelvector The stat hides the real truth about the economic status of the status of those "commit more crime per capita" is what drives that stat not race. I am not ignoring reality just not framing it to back my ignorant baseless prejudice. It appears you can't read well as I have NEVER denied the stats and know exactly what you are talking about. What I reject is your spin on what they mean but then I am not a proud bigot. You only have spin and it is more telling to say poor people commit more crime than any other demographic. If you look at the number of "black" people in that category and which individuals actually get arrested it is easy to dismiss your self serving half wit interpretation. There is also the issue of black people getting arrested more for the crimes committed at the same rate as others. Drug use as about the same in the black and white communities but black people represent the majority of drug arrests with a smaller population. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonkblog/wp/2014/09/30/white-people-are-more-likely-to-deal-drugs-but-black-people-are-more-likely-to-get-arrested-for-it/ https://www.hrw.org/reports/2000/usa/Rcedrg00-05.htm Your stat from the FBI does not say what you think it does in your simple plodding way. You are looking to demean black people as a race and that is your agenda it has nothing to do with understanding the underlying cause. You spit spin sold to the stupid who need to puff themselves up on based on a attribute as arbitrary as skin color while having personally done nothing of note themselves.
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  17542. picarochi Assigning blame to the consumer may sound like a good plan but it is useless and only feeds the status quo.  We know what the real issue is and what is empowering the criminals who are now murdering thousands.   The prohibition on drugs is the murderous monsters greatest ally as it gives them the resources of small countries to draw on    Consumers are rarely attached to the worst what is done to supply their product be they chickens or weed.  This is the same reason no matter how violent it got with alcohol prohibition there were still lots of people heading to the speakeasy.   This market is going to exist embrace it or ban it even if it has to be  underground.  Our drug war empowers criminals in a bid to protect people and because it does more harm than good at great expense it has to end.   The reason why people do not attach buying drugs with the murderers actions is because it is easy to disassociate the two.  Just like all moonshiners were not all dangerous criminals who killed anyone who got in their way the same goes for many drug producers.  The public can and does disassociate the worst from the those just trying to make a buck selling a desired product . The criminalization of drugs has been a total fail, more people than ever use them and and if the intent is to protect people it is failing miserably at almost every level.  We would be better off spending the money on treatment and education rather than pouring it down the drain trying to enforce the bans while getting nowhere.
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  17543. picarochi I do not think so.  We have had 30 years of demonizing of drugs to no effect.  If you think there has not been a concerted effort to crate an anti drug culture here you have not been paying attention.   The days of reefer madness should teach us something important.   That lesson is no matter how strong the propaganda people will take these kinds of things anyway.  There was a time during prohibition some batches of booze actually killed people.  It did not stop people from buying it and I do not think we can propaganda our way out of this issue.  We need to decriminalize and regulate these substances so they are safter and harder for children to get.  We need to take the massive amounts of money we pour down the drain in law enforcement and putting people in jail and spend it in ways that promote responsible use while helping those who are addicted get off it.  The idea we can ban this problem away has failed spectacularly.   There is zero upside on continuing to throw good money after bad in a bid to patch a damn that is already overflowing.   I see no reason to make this a focus of anyone.  We have real issues to tackle and better places to spend our tax dollars that wasting it on a lost cause that is hurting far too many people with no appreciable benefit.  Decriminalize,  Legalize,  Regulate and Tax.  This is the only way we will ever be able to control this industry and take the powerful criminal element out of the equation just like we did for booze.
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  17569. MRostendway Most people do not watch MSNBC or CNN, take a look at their ratings.  the fact is most people are either uniformed (and it was arguable they were never informed) or are getting their info from alternate sources now.  I am saying the spin that is being put out can be refocused into something positive, not that it is right now.  It highlights a larger issue the media never talks about and that is the venerability to manipulation innate to our system as it stands.  I do not think the general populace will necessarily extrapolate my conclusion from the media but it opens the door to talking about corruption of our system and there are more and more of us capable of picking up the ball from there.  It changes the conversation so the next Bernie has a base of people who already think our system is open to manipulation and know our parties including the one they support is crooked.   It puts us in a unique place where the door talking about manipulation has already been kicked open and acknowledged by a media who has pretended there is no problem to date.  The Russia thing is an attempted distraction that does not cover up the fact even if guilty they exposed real issues that no one is even trying to deny.  It opened the eyes of many voters to the fact both parties are totally owned.   Properly spun going forward that awareness tacitly and unavoidingly created can be shaped into something that serves the electorate even if the media who shares this meme does not see the seeds they sew.   
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  17723. Nathan Robinson Premium universities are only of value to those who can afford them.  No one thinks Germany, Finland's or Switzerland education primary or post secondary are sub par and no one identifies them as such.  I know several people who have gone to get MBA's in Europe specifically Germany and France.  The US has premium health care too but that being said medical expenses are the single largest reason for bankruptcies in the nation and this limits its value as we have people literally dying because they can not get care. We have the same kind of fail happening in education and our students are graduating with massive debt because of a broken system written by the banks and the for profit insinuations they go to.   The US has a mediocre welfare system at the very best and it is only good if you contrast it with the third wold.  We spend well over half or discretionary spending on the military and another huge chunk on corporate welfare bought by the donor class. Our systems are not first rate by the developed worlds standards including Canada.  The idea that social programs provide nothing is a often used right wing trope to siphon money from the poorest to the richest that directly takes money out of the economy and puts in the hands of the few on top.  This type of program not only stops the poorest people from starving but it is directly stimulative meaning all of the money flows back into the local economy instead of being thrown into a pile or invested overseas.   The problem is not attached to the average person but those at the very top who control massive percentages of our wealth and have been absorbing ALL of the growth for the last 35 years while everyone else piece of the pie has not even kept up with inflation even as we have gotten much more productive.   The country does not have to be isolationist but it's economic policy should serve the people and not the multi nationals who now drive the bus.   We do not have to have a military 10 times as big as the next rival when 6 or 8 times would be just as effective. Loans are not the issue.  It is that we have thrown in with the false notion that everything is better if you attach a profit motive to it and the prices have risen accordingly.   The price will always be what the market will bear and in the past people could not afford to go to school and we had less people educated as a result.  The current policy is fundamentally flawed because there is no cost control in included in it by design.   The referenced systems are not just a giveaway to corporations like ours is and their policy was crafted with students in mind not donors. Advocating for a race to the bottom and less education that will see us left behind by other modern nations who understand their future success is attached to an educated population is a bad direction to take.   Education is an investment that pays off  and as the richest nation in the world we should not be second best to anyone on this score. The more people who are educated the better.  The idea that only those who are willing to go in debt slavery or are from a family that is already rich should get one is a tough sell you have not made a good case for.  
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  17724. Nathan Robinson You still have to qualify to get in.  And if you can not then you should find a way to pay for yourself if your grades do not merit access.  The idea that people take useless things if the government covers tuition is fact free and not borne out by the places that offer the opportunity. Yes we spend alot of money and the nature of our free market drinks it all down while still allowing people to die on the streets. We have no cost control in our system as opposed to the rest of the developed world. We pay twice the amount in health care while many do not have enough coverage or none at all and every sickness is a financial tragically.   It the nature of insurance that drives up our costs coupled with the fact our government is owned and signs away the right to negotiate for better prices on drugs because of lobbyist written policy.  We spend lots of money but we waste it because our system is not meant to deliver service but reap profit for the providers who own our leaders.   Even the "progressive" system put through by the dems is nothing more than a big thank you to insurance companies who added 10's of millions of customers funded by the government.   I have good friends who have survived cancer, had hips replaced and got great care from their system all without the threat of bankruptcy while paying half the cost. The characterization of your system as awful compared to ours ignorance personified unless you think that paying double and still having a good chance of going bankrupt is a good thing.   Military spending is included in discretionary spending, perhaps you did not know that but now you do.   You blame the loans but the policy wrapped around the loans were written by the industries that directly benefit.  We are spending tax payer dollars to fund a process crushes the financial options of the young to make a very few rich.   You blame government I blame corruption because I know that the same kinds money can be spent to offer free tuition merit based tuition. It is pretty clear you are drinking trickle down cool aid and part of the blindness that has fostered the problem we have.  It is a wonder you do this while in a country who is not remotely right wing and by all accounts is a great place to live.   
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  17725. Nathan Robinson You do not get to say economics when in fact nothing backs up your spin and there is no model on the planet that is a success story for your brand of fail.  No I am not, I am saying and always have said it should be MERIT based not based on  how much cash you can raise or how deep in debt you are willing to go. Please go back and reread what I said.  The fact is tuition should be paid on all courses you qualify for and no capable person one should be shut out of an education because of money.  This is true of primary and secondary education and it is also true of post secondary.    Price controls are one means of cost control that government systems have as an option. Volume discounts and limiting the profit to be made are others.  None of the best systems in the world feature the for profit insurance as a center peace and all are based of them offer universal coverage that our system does not.   Insurance drives up costs for the same reason that getting your body work done on your car privately is cheaper than doing it when insurance pays.  The insurance companies do not care how much the product costs as all they have to do is rise prices.  they are selling a product that people literally need to live and because they sell oxygen do not have to care about what it costs.  This means there are no cost controls on our system hence the exorbitant costs that are passed on to individuals, businesses and government.  Our system is a total fail unless  you measure it by how much money it generates for those who run it. There is nothing socialized about Obama care.  It i the 1990 GOP's solution to medicare for all and is nothing but a giveaway to insurance companies.  That being said it is 1000 times better than what it replaced.  It crushed a system that allowed insurance companies to cut you off after you got sick and still needed care once you hit a limit.  It allowed them to go back and try to dodge covering you by attempting to invalidate your insurance claiming you broke the contract.  Tens of thousands of people died every year simply because they had no health care coverage.   The solution that came up with is a fail but it is better than what they replaced and is much better than anything the GOP talks about today. There are waiting lists for things like hips but  when it comes to hearts and cancer your treatment has been fast and professional from my experience.  If I paid half of what I do now to ensure all have coverage I might be willing to wait a bit for my hip transplant especially as I am not likely to end up bankrupt if I get cancer.   Please, it is pretty clear of where your economic inspiration sits and you do not have much to stand on in the way of data validating the spin you infer.   The places that have these systems are not the hell holes and have universally higher standards of living and satisfaction than we do.  Your country included.  
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  17726. Nathan Robinson The private system is broken because it exists first and foremost to make money from someone.  The loan system has been manipulated by the banks to be credit that the creditor can not escape from.  Our system is broken and merit scholarships do not scratch the surface of the need.  Actually the argument has been made that it does stand for food, housing, etc.  In Finland everyone gets a basic amount of money to make ends meet.  It is very arguable that the fundamentals of life should be provided and what you do on top of that is on you,.  We are not living in the stone age and are in a time of abundance where much is horded into the hands a very few at the expense of us all.  65 people have more money than the bottom 3 billion and this is arguably the worst example of hording in the history of man.   This idea of everyone having a basic living guaranted may be the wave of the future but for now I will settle with my tax dollars going toward health care and education.   Insurance companies do not sell a voluntary product because they sell what amounts to oxygen.  What is your choice?  Buy it or not, and if you do not and get sick you are fucked.  That is not a choice and it is capitalism at the barrel of a virtual financial and healthcare cannon as these insurance companies literally make blood money while offering nothing of value to the health care system at all.  Their incentive is not to provide care but to deny it and it is little wonder the system their involvement spawned.  Insurance companies do not care what they pay in the end as they just raise rates, they make money no matter what. They people in question had reasonable wait times and got excellent care without having to declare bankruptcy.  I do not know what you have been told but there are wait times here too.  Not to mention co pays and deductibles that come out of our pocket just to get the care you take for granted.  Many people do not even go to the doctor until it is too late because they do not have the cash to pay doctor even if they had insurance.  Our system is not the envy of anyone but insurance companies the uber rich and the ignorant.   Obama care was originally the GOP's plan and was written by the well known liberal bastion the heritage foundation.   It was the free market solution to health care and is not remotely socialized health care as all it did was force people to buy insurance or suffer tax penalties.  This is all a matter of record and you should really look it up before making ignorant assertions.   The best systems are universally controlled by the government, UNIVERSALLY!  That is a fact and challenge you to prove me wrong because in every single case the countries in question offer universal coverage for all citizens.   The population argument is nonsense we spend 2 x more than you do proportionately and do not have better outcomes and are ranked 37th in the world while you are 30. We already spend way more money than you on a product that sees massive numbers of our population forced into bankruptcy and many that are not covered at all who we (the government) ends up paying for through our expensive failure emergency room catchall.  Every single first world country has universal health care except us, that is fail.     
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  17727. Nathan Robinson There are some services that do not benefit from a profit motive.  Health care is one of them.   There is no upside to having insurance companies involved so they can siphon off the top and add zero value.   The private system is expensive and without the cost controls like they have in Singapore (who has a mixed system) it is a licence to print money for some and have the most expensive system in the world, just like ours is.  I am unconcerned about your realizations. Reality is not broken it is our submission to interests that do not value any metric except the THEIR bottom line that is the issue.  You can not and have not pointed to an example of a system that works better under your proposed model.   The loan scheme was made by banks for banks and is a "free market" solution to a real problem and is not remotely progressive in nature.   Again with the population argument nonsense.  That is not the slam dunk you imagine it is and waving it around does not validate you unless you actually have numbers that correlate your assertions with the limitations you imply.  Just like your Canadian health care dismissal it is nothing but air and does not explain anything.  Having a large group being culturally similar does not explain why they can have these programs while we can not.  This argument simply does not make sense at its face. None of this discussion is attached to why Russia collapsed.  They took control of all the means of production and outlawed private ownership.  That is not what is being proposed here and that you imagine this is akin to communism is a fail. I pay less in taxes that you but pay more after I factor in my health care costs.  I would take your more affordable system any day of the week and the  same goes for education. Many hands make light work and we already have more than enough money to pay for these programs that will save 100's of millions money while providing care for all. We waste billions on giveaways to banks and trillions to fight wars we should not.  It is time we spend that money at home and if I have to pay a little more taxes to save out of pocket expense down the road that is a price I and many other sane people are willing to pay.   In this country you need health care insurance at the risk of your very life.  That you imagine that is a voluntary service is just you putting your head in the sand.  At some point almost every human being will need health care and the only time you do not is if you die suddenly.  That is the bet you make in our system without insurance and it is a bad idea and not really a choice at all.   There are no free lunches, I pay my taxes and expect something for them including my fellow citizens not dying in the streets because they can not afford health care.  We are the richest nation in the history of humanity and the idea we can not afford to take care of all our citizens health care is not remotely valid.   You speak for the greed of a tiny minority with your spin and it is appalling coming form someone who enjoys the advantages of a system you deride.   You state your opinion as fact too,  this is red herring and of no value to the conversation. You have not convinced anyone you understand economics at all.  Your judgment of my viewpoint has little merit as you blithely make unbaked unsupported assertions.   
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  17728. Nathan Robinson They may be separate things where you live but here they are one in the same.  The insurance system drives our costs as we have zero cost control unlike every system that rates better than us.   The fact is it the public system is universally cheaper as our system is the most expensive on the planet and is the closest thing to what you seem to want.  When we did not have the ACA it was even worse and there is nothing that is laudable about it unless the metric you use is how much money it sucks out of the economy to serve the providers and insurance companies. Of course they are not free market they are crony capitalist inspired law written by banks for banks.  There is nothing progressive about them and a progressive system is what I am proposing not something that enriches those at the top to the cost of all.    Our economy collapsed after the same powers bought off our leadership who removed Glass–Steagall that was the wall separating investment banks for our money since the great depression.  It was the removal of regulation that punched the world in the fact not that we had too much.  Our system is owned by the highest bidder and the people who buy them spin the same deregulation garbage you are.  In fact you are probably sharing some of their talking points verbatim.  Less regulation is not the path to stop collapse, good regulation is.  Fraud perpetrated by the likes of the leeman brothers were root of our problem that crushed the world economy not housing for individuals. The whole homogeneous community thing has zero merit on a subject like giving everyone the same amount of money.  It makes no difference if you have one culture or a 100 the money and its effect is exactly the same.  There is no merit to this spin of yours and it is just attached anti multi cultural trope that only makes sense to a certain kind of mindset who is predisposed to buying into that nonsense.  The benefits clearly out weight the costs on this subject.  I am not sure what you are talking about in calling doctors and nurses monopolistic.  What would you be proposing by this spin?  This is what I am talking about when I say you make half baked assertions.    Um,  you have no idea what you are talking about.  We have the fed who is a private organization that we commission to give money to the banks. The banks do not give us anything and that is why we bailed them out after the put the car in the ditch not the other way round.  I am unsure of what the system is in Canada but I do know ours, your assertions are fact free.  We most certainly do give free loans to the banks all the time and most certainly did after the collapse.   You may rather pays as you go but the fact is you could only go once in our system as any major concern will bankrupt all but the very richest of us.  Pay as you go is a morns bet when in our system and may serve you fine for decades only to kill you leaving you broke in the end.   Singapore works because the government mandates universal care and directly controls costs.  That is key to any system that works and our has nothing of the kind and that is why it is the most expensive on the planet while letting 10's of millions fall between the cracks.  
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  17729. Nathan Robinson Nonsense, the issue is there is no cost control.  Every single 1st world country has government spending as the primary driver of health care.  We are the ONLY one with the magnitude of our cost issue.  It is not government spending but non existent cost control. The money we spend on social programs is very low by 1st world standards and the raw numbers mean nothing against our income. Even Australia who is the only first world country on the list who spends less has universal health care.  So it is not a matter of how much we spend but how we spend it and who drives the regulations we apply.   Because our min wage is so low we actually are subsidizing companies like Walmart and McDonalds remuneration polices with food stamps.  Most of their employees makes so little while working full time hours they still qualify.  We spend little, we waste money because of bad policy and we still do not cover what the rest of the first word does. In the same way insurance drives up the cost of auto repair it drives up the cost of medicine too.  the argument that our costs are high because of government involvement in the industry is betrayed by the fact every other system is too and they do not pay nearly as much.   You need to explain how government is the fail for us but only us.   The mortgage crisis was brought on by the packaging and selling of mortgages known to be high risk as safe investments while at the same time they make bets on the crash.  This was not a fail of government policy outside the lack of provisions stopping this malfeasance.   Clinton was aided and abetted by the GOP who fully endorsed the policy and continue to push for more of the same in spite of the fail it has been proven to be.  They are part of the same system that has been systematically deregulating us while we have consistently slid backwards while a few at the top got obscenely richer. We did not have to bail them out at all.  What they did in Island is they arrested all the leadership involved and temporarily nationalized the banks.  They stabilized them and then made them private again to a new group of management.   They recovered much faster we did and their bailouts went to home owners not bankers.. It ended up changing the nature of the recovery where there it went to the population, here none of it did and all of the recovery flowed to the very top.   Disposing of common standards has not been the path to success for any system on the planet.  Not knowing the quality of your doctor or if they are even qualified may appeal to you but it does not sound like a sharp path forward for me. Again this has not been the solution for any success story you can point to so I wonder what you base this faith based assertion on.   Why would any of them do it cheaper if what they sell you literally can not live without.   Do you really want to be shopping for the cheapest unregulated heart surgery? Singapore is not REMOTELY free market. The government fully controls the costs of health care there.   Our drug problems are another example of crony capitalism at work.  Bush singed into the medicare extension that ensured the government did not have any right to negotiate for better prices for drugs. Our problem is not too much regulation or that we are too generous.  It is that corporations are writing our policy and they care about profit and nothing else.  
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  17734. Alex Smith To start off I do not see not taking a side in this debate as rational or valid. The vaunted strategy of neutrality does not seem to be very noble with what is at steak.  That does not mean if you choose one way to identify yourself that you have to march lock step with every element of it.  I call myself progressive because the polices and ideals they stand for most closely match mine.  That does not mean I am "progressive" on every issue and am free evaluate where I stand on a case by case basis. Your spin on what being a progressive is has has been slanted.  Progressives are liberals but they are not the bleating sheep cons are. You are not expected to march lock step with everyone else,  it is not an authoritarian movement.  I agree that fact both planks are filled with ignorant idiots is not the fault of the idolgoy but is a simple numbers game.  A great many people are morons and that means most groups will contain them.   That clowns abound is not a reason to not chose a side.  Being independent and moderate is in no way anti progressive or anti conservative and very likely means you have views that fall on either side of the spectrum.   I will continue to call myself progressive be the bulk of my views sit on that side.  It does not mean I will not speak out when I disagree simply because a group or leader claims to be from the left. I do in fact take try to take in as much information as possible from many sources in deciding where I stand on issues and am not a slave to any media outlet.  I have noticed in my hunt that they are not all accurate a great deal of the time.  That being said in spite of it's odd failing TYT does a pretty good job in spite of your near 50% of the time they are wrong assertion. I do think that sharing our ideas in a public forum has value and personally enjoy speaking to people who disagree with me but have a good point or well thought out view.  Speaking with respectful people who do not share my views has been the source of my most interesting conversations here.  That sometimes an ideological opponent puts thought into what they say and shares an interesting point is what makes comments in this forum a worthwhile effort. 
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  17757. Hiraghm If the last increase had kept up with inflation then there would indeed be no need to increase it.  But it never did and it lags way behind where that standard should be. Please do not expect me to cry a river for anyone that does their job and gets paid a living wage.  If you feed yourself and pay basic bills on your wage and are not happy then get another one.  But as long as we pick up the slack for companies that feel it is ok to pay their full time workers below the poverty level then we need to set some standards. Walmart remuneration polices do force people onto food stamps.  This is not a debatable point. The idea that they can not afford to pay more is not attached to reality.  In constituencies that force them to pay more they continue to make profit despite the increase. They choose to pay as little as we allow them to because they can. Set the wag higher so that we are not forced to subsidize their workers just so they have enough to eat.   The argument that they are serving anyone but themselves with these polices is a very very poor one.  I would prefer we are not forced to subsidize the employment polices of one the most wealthy families.  I would prefer that people who worked for a living were not living below the poverty line so that a corporation can add another point to an already healthy profit margin. Rules that force employers to treat their employees would not be needed if we did not have so many bad actors on stage.   You may want to live in a 3rd world country but I have no desire to do so. People starving in the streets may be completely exceptable to your ilk but for the vast majority of us it is not.  I am not asking anyone to get handouts (actually I want to cut handouts unlike you) I ask we set a wage where people who work full time do not need assistance just to have enough to eat.  You can call this what you want but we are not talking about the lazy or anyone mooching off the system here. We are talking about ensuring people who work for their money earn a living wage.  Your desire to race to the bottom is evident,  you should go to a banana republic where paying nothing for workers who live in shanties is business as usual.
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  17832. Danica Lee  There is a distinct difference.  The authoritarian or regressive left who supports banning speech is called regressive because they promote right wing solitons to problems.  They represent a small minority on the left while being authoritarian is the standard position for the right.    The fringe of either group does not define them.  So when you cut off the nut jobs on the edges you are left with what the larger group stands for.  To be progressive is to support free speech, freedom of choice and freedom of religion.  To be conservative is to want to ban speech that you find offensive to your faith or your country or your sensibilities, you fight to limit the rights of those you disagree with or think do not deserve them and you argue in favour of restricting religious choices out xenophobia or fear. The establishment democrats and clowns who need a "safe space" are not progressive. They are center right at best and their deepest failures are attached to them chasing the GOP or other authoritarians off the cliff they are running toward.   The people who vote for are waking up and taking notice.  Hillary who was the poster child for the run to the right lost the election because she excited far few people than she should have especially when running against a shit stain like Trump.  But because the left is not reflexively authoritarian and do not march lock step together she failed to attract needed votes precisely because the left and the right are not the same.  The establishment democrats have become what we hate and that is why there is movement to replace them with those who are actually progressive and fight for the freedom, social ,economic and otherwise the left actually craves.   To say the left and the right are the same on a desire to crush freedom is a false narrative, one innately fights against freedom and the other the group who consistently fights for it.
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  17883. Kadrick Ninness I disagree being a self identified liberal.  It is a straw man any time it is asserted we support factions that undermine anyone's freedom.  There is no unilateral defense of Muslims by the vast majority of liberals and all of them call out the guilty consistently.   What they stand against is the blanket assertion that the whole group is complicit and of concern when in fact the moderates you alienate in doing so are the ones best placed to help curb the real concern of extremism.   I believe Ben responded to Sam correctly.  Blanket criticism of Islam should be no more excepted than blanket criticism of all christens like they are homogenous.  We know that within both groups there are sub groups who are extremist and would impose their will on others with force.  To paint the entire group with the same brush is simplistic nonsense that ignores the fact the vast majority should not be lumped in with the most radical elements.  I personally like Chris a lot even if we disagree on some political issues.  That he was divisive and had some controversial spin is not in question.  That he had enemies on both sides of the political fence is also not in question.  What any of them said is not a really reflection on any community and especially a broadly defined one.  I defend or reject issues on a case by case basis and unlike many conservatives I deal with and do not feel the need to march lock step with the most radical elements inside a movement Identify with.  We know there are ass hats in both political spheres, we do not have to take responsibility for them because we both self identify as belonging to the same broad grouping. 
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  17908. ***** Tip of the ice burg.  This is a civil rights issue plain and simple.  It is no different from bigots being able to ban black people from their establishments because that is what their religion says.   I give no religion a pass on this issue and if any other zealot wants to deny service to anyone else I stand firmly against them too.   They are free to practice their religion all they want.  But like a Mennonite should not apply to drive a bus these group of faithful should not run a business as they can not meet the basic requirements of their business contracts.  No one is making them open a business that serves the public.   There is no reason but to remove voters from the election in passing these laws.  They were universally done in red states to marginalize a group of voters that do not support them.   Babble about how it should not matter all you want, but the fact is these rules were put in place for one reason alone. None of the stupid straw men you are babbling about were an issue and you could count the cases on a hand that these laws address. The GOP is tough on immigration, that is not in doubt.  Then they go ahead and torpedo legislation that would put more guards on the border to put a thumb in Obama's eye and stop him from getting anything done.  I never said they were consistent and both things can be and are true.  One would think I could not have it both ways but with this congress's consistency in this case I do. It appears that you are the one who does not know what the hell he is taking about as you sling the simple silliness you do
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  17910. ***** Get this through your head it does.  It does not matter what they claim as the source of their bigotry, it is not protected by law.  If they honestly think they can not sell a cake to a gay couple then they should not open a bakery that sell cakes to weddings.  It is that simple.  Your defense of bigotry by attempting to legitimize it is as religious changes nothing.  This has nothing to do with my feelings about their religion and this rule applies to Muslim bakers who do not want to serve Jews and versions of Christianity that would not serve black people.  The only bullies here are the people you support and that they have some anti social religious views is no one elses issue.  I do not give a flying fuck what they believe and never will until they shove it in the public sphere.  If they sign a business license then they should serve everyone.  In the same way we stopped conservative bigots from running whites only restaurants the bigots hiding behind religion do not get a pass. There is no other reason to pass the ID laws besides to reduce the number of voters.  It is estimated a 1/2 million people have been marginalized by these law. That these laws were universally passed in states with gop control is very telling. The only reason they did this is to cut out votes that will not go to them anyway,  It was nothing but a subversion of democracy that unfairly targets the poor who lived their whole lives without the ID required. You are an idiot.  If you do not think the gop has been tough on immigration then you are fringe dwelling.  I can't help that your standards for "tough" are insane. 
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  17923. Brazen Bran  He is fighting the system from within and is making progress.  He has inspired a whole new movement within democratic party who shares his ideal of working for the American people and not the highest bidder.  There was interference in the election and it was undesirable but those of us who paid attention what was leaked it was a game changer and Bernie is showing a whole new generation of leaders how to win and what the people actually want.   He is moving the party in the direction it has to go if they are to win let alone actually get things done that will empower positive change.   Your complaints ring as an empty whine as there is no substance to them and they are all about things he should have done that would make you feel better and nothing else.   It appears Bernie is better at this than you are and I see no reason to abandon him. This WWIII thing is bullshit,  MAD kept us from war for 70 years and is no less in effect now.  No one wins these wars and the fact is a full scale nuclear fight is not going to happen.  Russia could not win it and the "Allies" would be hurt too badly by it,  there is no conceivable situation in the western nations would come together to do a first strike on Russia.  On the other hand there are real fears in the region of Russia annexing another sovereign country like Germany did in the late 30's.  This war nonsense is a silly talking point and there is no reason to give it a moments thought.  This is doubly myopic to bloviate the WWIII concern from anyone in the dems because the GOP leader just bombed Russia's allies and it is clear they are not better.
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  17988. +types10000 So if you accept the premise that they are not base ideologically tainted then you extended conclusion is not sound. We are not like them and value freedom of religion which has seen the ranks of moderates grow and the fanatical shrink. The same happens to Muslim people as they are integrated into our communities. I reject that concept that they are being Muslim makes then incompatible with our society any more than christian fundamentalists are. The fact is our constitution forbids the government setting up any standard for religious faith and this extends to Muslims as well as Christians. The elements of both faiths who would set up ideological tests are the fundamentalist elements in both religions that love to shove their assertions down peoples throat by law. The Christians have had that power stripped away in our system as do the Muslims that live here They can be as bat shit crazy as they want and as long as they break no laws they are free to be off the wall, such is the nature of freedom of religion. I do not see any value in becoming more like the Muslim societies. Your assertion they were going to be a problem or that there was any plan to take in millions of them is not attached to reality. Your straw man is no reason to fear monger a temporary ban that does nothing. The fact is if they are more progressive than our fundamentalists then your entire argument they do not fit in and will cause problems totally falls apart. You then have no valid reason besides your bigotry to keep them out and you have not shown they are a problem. You simply assert it and it is not valid.
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  17997. Mats Jönsson Its actual reformation was born of tearing its power to make law away it.  That was the actual beginning of a fundamentalist shift in the ideals of the faith.  Freed from use as an overt tool of social control backed by the state it became ever more moderate.  The results we see today is not because of any innate moderating influence in Christianity itself but a result of their lack of any ability to enforce dogma with the mechanisms of government.  Over time even ideas once held sacrosanct like the margination of gay people have had their support in law stripped away because it undermines principles of freedom and freedom of and from religious dictates.There are clowns just as backward as any Muslim in Christianity today and the chief difference is their ideas are not backed up by the state and they have no power to enforce their claims and demands.  Islam for the most part in the areas you can point to as problematic have not had the benefit of secularism to tear out the teeth of dogmatic to shove their nonsense down everyone's throat.  In the Muslim world the faith has been used as a tool of control much like the days when Christianity was used for the same purpose to the same result.  The fundamentalists who clamour for biblical law are not "reformed" and are just as backwards as their fundi cousins in the Muslim world.  The key difference is they can not shove their idiocy down anyone's throat. All fundamentalists are the same brand of freedom hating regressive cancer and empowered by law or in the grip of chaos will always be the most dangerous people on the block.
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  17998. +Cramer Long Your assertions about secularism are fact free. Secularism means the promotion right to worship as you choose and the separation of church from the apparatus of the state in pursuit of that goal.   Secularism has no dogma,  no proscribed demands besides the dictate to not validate laws using religious claims or persecute others for religious belief.  America was not found on biblical principals and several of our founders were at best deists and wholly rejected the bible and the claims of the Christian church.  That Muslims have a name for their religious law does not mean Christianity did not have them.  Gay marriage is an excellent example that both the Christian right and the unreformed Muslims share. "Traditional" notions of marriage are important to both.  They both consistently oppose any kind of reproductive rights and fight against birth control and abortion for the same reasons.  All the powerful countries you point to happen to be Christian but they do not promote freedom because of that but because they universally embrace secularism which has freed the worshipers to choose to follow ever more moderate versions or in a growing number of cases no faith at all.  The power to be regressive to the citizens in those countries was torn away from the religious political leadership (which is consistently highly conservative) and the faith became more liberal or moderate as a result.  When you look at any fundamentalist (or in the case of the USSR worship of the state) in power you will see no promotion of freedom.  Even in our country where these rights are enshrined into law we see an element fighting against the idea to make us more like the religiously controlled nations you point at.   Freedoms promotion is not Christian if you look at what the most "devout" actually want.Muslims being given a place to pray in schools is the promotion of religious freedom not the crushing of it.  That some children choose be devout is their right and we as a secular nation have no reason to curtail that choice.   If the prayer was not elective and was a mandatory part of the school day it would not be supported either.  If Christians want a special room where they can go and start the day with a prayer if they want they will get one under the same guild lines.  There is absolutely no chance that we will be taken over by any of these fundamentalist groups.  Over time all worshipers no matter what their faith become less devout as they find other options besides the hard core path.  This has been a truth for Christianity which has become much more liberal but in the end it does not matter as the fundamentalists have no power to make religious law or policy.  For the same reason hard core Christians have lost the culture war here fundamentalist Muslims will too.  Your fears are unfounded and not attached to reality, just because you feel your side (another brand fundamentalists) is losing does not mean I as someone who supports a secular state has anything to fear.   I am aware of species die off but not to come to the same conclusions as you do because your attempt to tie those facts to your faith has zero value if you want to address them.  None of that makes the bible any less nonsense than any other vaguely predictive claim from any other source.  Looking to the compiled text of a handful of iron age politicians does not strike me as the best plan for dealing with real world problems.  I will put my education and knowledge on these subjects against yours any day.  But then I base my ideas on actual facts and not the faith based credulity you have to embrace to hold your views.
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  17999. Mats Jönsson They happen to be christen but they promote freedom because they are universally secular.   Before they were they were exactly like the Muslim states you point at.  Christianity does not get a pass for what they did while in power or what many who claim the title of fundamentalist want right now. Much of the church backed down and became more liberal because that is what the bulk of people wanted.  There was and always will be a percentage of people that take comfort in dogmatic and regressive forms of religion that stress conformity and fight freedom.  The Muslim world you point at still lives under the dogmatic control of religious politicians who use the faith as a tool of control much like it was once used in Christianity.  The taking away of the power of government to promote any single faith saw the decline of institution of religious edicts for all and an ever further decline in radical elements the faith.  The same is true for Muslims in secular countries and Muslims in the US for example support gay marriage at higher rates than those who label themselves fundamentalist Christian.  You do not have to reform any divine laws,  you just stop following them.  that is what happened to all Christianity's religious inspired laws and moral dictates over time. In the US every single Muslim deals with that fact as well and become more moderate for it.  Freedom to choose or not choose to follow religious inspired law will see its the decline and early death of the ideas
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  18013.  @Eric-vh3ur  The "small government" shills you vote for explode the debt and drive us deeper into foreign useless expensive counterproductive foreign entanglements to serve the IDC. The small government talking point you use is dead, the GOP killed it with what they have done in spite of what they say. You want a government so small they put people in jail for what they ingest, so small they pick who you love and can marry. A government that fits inside every woman's uterus and makes critical health care choices for them. This is shills you back cut taxes for the richest and download the costs onto you on their behalf. The "job creators" who wrote your small government talking points then do stock buy backs with that free cash formerly spent on you or build new manufacturing plants in mexico to ship off our jobs. This outsourcing made easy by freshly minted trade deals just negotiated by your sellouts who are supposed to be working for you but work for the highest bidder. You do not vote for small government and do not even know what it means, you just like the sound of it. You do this as you stand beside open bigots and crony capitalists who vote the same way you do. If you are trash it is because of who you support and what they stand for. Saying you are for small government as they are not remotely small and always explode the debt does not seem like a well thought out reason to support the same assholes as the neo Nazi's, neo cons and a large community of religious zealots. None of which value freedom or smaller government .
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  18069. RobJohnII Your assertion it was divinely inspired is meaningless unless one shares your brand of faith, this means it is a useless unverified assertion to a great many.   But lets stick to the things we can actually verify outside claims of divine inspiration or articles of faith.  The book is not historically, archeologically or scientifically true.  In fact the science of the bible is not held in high regard for good reasons. Science has advanced in spite of the interpretation of the bible not because of it.  We should not be surprised, a great deal of it was written in the bronze age by people who has no idea the nature of the world. Your assertion of predictions are nonsense and everything you can point to is so vague that the prophesy (like almost all prophesy) can be widely applied.  None of it has any value and is only applied retroactively by people frantically seeking to verify their fact free dogma.  The predictive power of prophecy in the bible is something only a small group of Christians claim.  Most do not have it as fundamental component of dogma for good reasons, it takes a willful rejection of reality to buy in.  That you belong to a religion that has been a useful tool of control for a long time does not mean the idea that your god is made up is unfathomable.  You have a god like 1000's of others and that you belong to this one cult does not validate it as the correct one.  The chances are you belong to it by the luck of the draw and nothing else, that in itself is very telling. 
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  18110. justun chan If the bible was 100 sets of independently confirming sets of information you could make it the same as the whole of Hellenistic or Greco-Roman history but it is not.   I do not reject christian related evidence but I do reject the bible as there is no proof og it's assertions were contemporary to the events and there is good reason to question if much of it was fabricated in service to the goal of the compiled book.  At best it's claims have to be questioned and put in context of who edited and distributed the stories as they were finally cataloged.  It is a religious sales manual that claims it is divinely inspired truth when many key points can not be independently confirmed at all.  An example of an objection to the spin of Tim's paper is about his take on the crucifixion.  At the time it was the worst of the worst ways to kill any criminal and reserved exclusively for non Romans. He argues that if it was written by Christians why would they choose that as it would mean their Christ was killed in a very unsavory way and they would be embarrassed about that.  That is an argument that does not ring true to me.  The reason they may have chosen that way of death is precisely because it is so heinous and makes the claim he was like the  everyman the early church appealed to.  He makes assessments like this throughout the entire article and each can be interpreted in other ways than his choice.  None of them are definitive and that he chooses the interpretation he does is fine but does not validate you in the way you think it does. Your argumentum ad populum is not very compelling as I have read the opposing position that is still widely held despite your spin and do not agree.   There are plenty of modern scholars who do not see it your way at all.  I would be surprised if you even knew what they said as it does not seem you know they exist, come out of the cave indeed. I am not the one making fact free assertions like Jesus is one of the most validated people of ancient history. 
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  18111. justun chan Why would one expect the story to treat the "real messiah" and asserted son of god like a traditional Jewish rabbi.  This man is the antithesis of the existing religious leadership of the time and distinguishing him from them and making his death as bizzare and shocking has value in itself especially if you want to appeal to non roman citizens.  The thing is it is not an everyday punishment it is an extraordinary one.  It is one reserved for non Romans and was considered the worst kind of death.  Sounds exactly the ticket if one was dreaming up a story about vicarious redemption.  It does not discredit them as inauthentic but it makes his argument weak.  That it is non standard and that there was a taboo around the practice does not mean it is not a good choice for the those who made a story.  It is not a surprising choice from my perspective as few other popular ways of executing him would be more brutal of have a better quality to say what they wanted to say.  His argument that they would not use it if it was not real is weak at best as there are plenty of good reasons for them to have done so. As far as being accurate and contemporary the bible has neither of these two arrows in its quiver.  It is not authenticated to the era and could have been written long after the events from an oral tradition.  There is no validated authorship for any of the stories and no one who is not claiming inerrancy looks at the bible as a historical document with out skepticism. 
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  18112. justun chan Sure there are several, hell Wikipedia on the subject lists at least 5 contemporary individuals.   Take a look yourself as it seems you are not very up to speed about the assertions of the other side. Arguments to authority have little value in a debate where you have non yourself.  Please note there is NO REFERENCE to Christ before 95 years, not one.  So anyone studying " sources, and written within a hundred years of Christ' own death" are hiding them pretty well as I can fine no reference to them anywhere.  Please point me in the correct direction for a reference if you can as all sources I have can find point to Josephus as the first. I have already given you two.  Another would be Alexander the Great who minted some of the first coins with the image of the ruler on them.  The fact is you do not value data in the same way I do.  You desperately seek to turn your sales manual into a historical document when it was never meant to be one and has was assembled and edited by a group of politicians toward their own uses.  It lack of authorship, original documents or the fact we know whole books were ignored.   That it was translated and reinterpreted over and over it is a 2000 year old game of telephone. My point about Tim's argument was not about the veracity of the execution.  His assertions was that it was so odd it made the story likely to be true as there was no reason to make it up.   I disagree with him as a hard death was exactly what they would want for the story and I disagree with his reasoning as it is unsound. Christianity was a pretty radical offshoot of Judaism.  It appealed to a certain mindset and continues to today.   The statement "Jewish traditionalism that it does NOT support a myth alternative at all.  It's beyond the Jewish mindset to falsify claims of a messiah only to be crucified by the Romans" is foolish.  There was nothing "traditional" about Jesus story and that was part of his appeal.   Arguing no one would falsify claims of a messiah is silly as there were plenty of them and they all could not be the real one.  Christianity was radical and different at the time.   They were to the jews what Mormonism or any other fringe non standard version of Christianity is to Christianity today.   
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  18113. justun chan Your 25 year criteria is arbitrary but there are several, have a look at Wikipedia and you will see there are a few that have been studying for a long time not that it makes any difference.   You are not doing what evolution does.  The idea of evolution is backed by mountains of data that is accessible to you.  Multiple disciplines across multiple fields tested over and over for 100 years with no one refuting the theory.   The assertion of evolution validity is not just backed by numbers but cold hard data NO ONE has ever refuted.  As I have said time and again the mountains of hard data proving Christ simply does not exist.   I am not arguing to authority, I look at the data and the attempts to refute it and find there has never ever been a hole cut through it.   I have studied both what science says and what those who oppose it believe.   Until I see the idea soundly debunked I need not appeal to authority at all to hold my views.  I am sure they are respected by theists as they clamor for credibility garnered by having an impartial non dogmatic supporter.  That does not validate his assertions as definitive and the fact he has to work with a book of questionable historical value makes all of his claims based on it shakier than one would want them. Again you appeal to authority because you like what they say when he has no real data backing is weak.  His view is based on a extrapolation and not overt fact.  He makes a claim that may or may not have merit but will NEVER be definitive or incontrovertible.  I am not the only one who feels this way but the fact is anyone who does not agree with your spin is simply dismissed. 
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  18115. justun chan Your comparison was flawed as one is a scientific theory backed by all that means and the other is a simply a contested consensus on an assertion built on conjecture and a primary source that is unquestionably biased. I do not believe in evolution, I except it based on the data that has never been overturned.  I do not have to take it on faith as I can study and see all the data for myself and I have to take no ones word on it.  The empirical data is there for you to look at and I am not going to give you a basic biology course when you will willfully ignore all I have to share.  If you are honestly interested in answering the questions you ask open a freeken book and shed your ignorance.  I do not appeal to experts at all as I have the raw and one hundred and fifty years of unrefuted science backing it. The assertion about christ's existence is in question as history is not an exact science. That you choose to ignore anyone who has  discussed this subject in last 25 years sets the bar for your success very low.  I am not sure the majority does, perhaps you randomly eliminate everyone who does not agree for arbitrary reasons like the have not been studying long enough.   In any case your argumentum ad populum is of no concern to me because it is evidence that convinces me and you are lacking it.  As far as an explanation, I would imagine that most people who study this issue are linked to religion in some way.  It is not off the bubble given what Christians do to actual science in the name of their dogma that they are just making stuff up to suit their narrative.  In any case there are lots of reasons to hold your  view besides it is true.  You know this too. 
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  18142. ***** Nice a Pro European leader who fled to Moscow, that makes a great deal of sense, no one buys this bullshit.  RT is a mouth piece for the Russian goverment and nothing else.  If you think they are giving it to you strait you are going to end up sounding like you are from bizzaro world ( a place where everything is opposite) just like you do.  Putin has zero to fear from NATO and all who bother  to look at what that organization is founded to do know that.  To say NATO has any aggressive intentions toward Russia is a joke on it's face.  NATO was founded to counter Russian aggression and its member states as a team are not and have never been remotely expansionist.  There is no precedent in history of NATO unilaterally moving on any sovereign target and the idea Russia is actually concerned about NATO aggression is only bought by simpletons.  I do not have to know you to make statements about you.  I can judge you based on what you say.  Please know that as your spin defends fascists you will be labeled one.  Your sources are feeding you unfiltered Russian propaganda no matter what they are.  I know thinking I am right does not mean I am that is why I will go with information from more the once partisan perspective to get my information. I call you a shill because you are one.  I get it, you like the idea of a dictator annexing other states because you agree with his spin.  The thing is those of us who are not authoritarian boot lickers are going to stand against you and all those who bow down to the likes of a nationalistic right wing bully like Putin.
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  18148. ***** They have no incentive to lie to their listeners, none.  RT can not make the same claim as they are a wholly goverment controlled entity.  Comparing an independent news organization with no personal dog in the fight to a propaganda dissemination outlet is not valid.  There is no source of news that is off limits to TYT  but they are correct in questioning the validity of goverment propaganda from any source including the US.  I was not discussing their position on Georgia but was talking about Ukraine.  I am not familiar with what they have said about that conflict but I do not think it had nearly as much air time as the Ukraine situation.   Any attempt to Annex territory from another sovereign nation is grounds for concern in spite of your assertions.  We have a historical analog of these events and just letting the dictator get away with it unremarked did not turn out well.  Russia aspirations of taking additional Territory have already been telegraphed as other desired regions in Ukraine are now being contested by Russian partisans.  After comments made by Putin about other now sovereign regions of the former USSR concern he seeks to take more territory back is real. I am not advocating war,  no one in the west has a stomach for it either. That does not mean we should not be condemning Russia's actions vehemently and at the very least continue to lay strong sanctions until the matter is satisfactorily resolved.  We do not have to cut Russia any slack on this matter as their justification for their imperialism is paper thin.
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  18188. Elpeo Puru Duke is more of a main stream figure after trumps promotion and acceptance of the bigotry contingents full throated support.  David has always been popular with a specific element of society but got no main stream press and did not have a voice until this election cycle when Trumps rhetoric gave him one.  These people were just as involved in the background as they are now and have universally supported the GOP the entire time.  By not denouncing their support and often openly courting it with his spin he gave them a new voice and blaming the left for Trumps empowerment of them is poorly thought out. With regard to Lena's tweet, she asked the question how her dad felt about the extinction of strait white men, she did not call for it.  The spin that she did is dishonest. The anti male let alone anti white male democratic block does represent any significant constituency on the left and most certainly is not remotely the main stream. Seems like you have been taken in by misleading spin and if you watch it in context you can not fail to see it was both humours and is not threatening to anyone. To lay the growth of the alt right on the actions of the small and basically powerless group on fringe left is silly when it is pretty clear what is actually empowering them.  The elements of the left you refer to exist but have no power and that the right wing media and blogs overplay the nonsense they spit does not mean you get to blame the entire left for what their propaganda spawns. I am a what I consider a main stream liberal and will universally call out all bigotry because I believe in equality under the law.  That means I will oppose those who want to divide us by race or by gender from the right or the left as I believe in the idea and will not excuse one side because we agree on a few other things.  I represent the vast majority of the left who just wants everyone to have a fair shake and be treated equally. The spin that the rise in popularity of bigots is a justified backlash against the power of the left is undermined by the fact their complaints are consistently empty.  People like you typically try blame all liberals for raving of a handful on the left who live on the fringe and have no power. The real group to blame is bigots and that you feel sympathy for them speaks to the quality of your information not the validity of their concerns. 
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  18225. Mike D I pay attention to facts and nothing you assert is on the horizon.  The only time we have ever come close to default in our entire history is when the right decided not to pay our bills.  What is deindustrializing us is bad trade policy and the fact we have encouraged corporations to outsource with bad tax and trade policy.  It has nothing to do with the debt and any assertion that is the case is fact free.   Our deficit is the smallest we have had since bush destroyed our surplus by giving it away to the rich, big pharma and useless wars. The idea we are on the edge of default is spin people like you appreciate but it is the same nonsense you have crowed about for 30 years while at the same time voting in clowns that run up the debt.  The GOP consistently runs huge deficits while pretending to be against spending.  Stop voting them in as the only thing they do is blow big business with unlimited corporate welfare while servicing billionaires with tax cuts even as they never made more.   Start focusing on good domestic and foreign policy and we can get a surplus going again. Instead of building then blowing up then building infrastructure in war zones keep the money at home to develop our own.   Instead of pouring money into useless wars, drone strikes and weapons even the military brass says they don't need spend it on education that will drive innovation. Instead of tax cuts for those who have never made more keep the debt down by not throwing away revenue.  If you want to see the massive profits reaped by corporate greed spent on things that create jobs tax it and spend on things that create jobs like R&D and updating our failing road system. At that point there is zero chance of default unless the GOP continues to try to throw us under the bus in a partisan attempt to repeal popular established law.
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  18226. Mike D Since you using the same fact free talking points that have been bandied around for 30 years you will have to forgive me for not buying in.   You are projecting as you say "there is no amount of proving this to you that will compel you to see the obvious".  Every single major power on the planet has an iteration of our money system.  That you single out the US is very telling.  Your predictions are as valuable as all the others who put a time line on the end of our monetary system, meaning not at all.   I have a complete understanding of how banking works and that I do not agree with your assessment is not based on ignorance but a different take on the same information. We agree on how toxic it is and how things like the derivative market are simply efforts to steal productivity from everyone else.  I understand the dangers and stress these efforts have put not just on our government but working people across the nation.   That being said your assertions about us being the weakest in history are fact free. Our problems are associated with spending incorrectly and cutting revenue in a time we needed more money not less.  They are associated with the fact our leaders no longer serve the voters but instead work for their donors and we can see that in policy that is proposed and passed.  As long as our leaders are for sale they will continue to make irresponsible choices because in the end any collapse that occurs will benefit those who are paying to see it happen and crafting policy that pushes us in that direction. You get your spin from a different place than I do and it is your conclusions that are off not any assertions about the faults of our system.
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  18244. MsJudi54 There is circumstantial evidence at best that can be applied to any god.  There is literally none that back us your christian claims.  You do not have proof you have  willful subscription to naked credulity.   The kind of blind faith demanded by religious assertions is rejected in every other single aspect of our lives. You comfortably assert there is a all powerful all knowing invisible intangible being who watches over us and created all things but would certainly doubt me if I said I had an invisible intangible unicorn in my back yard who is the reason I won the lottery.   Your faith in god is built on nothing but overt credulity and is no more valid than that of the followers of Odin or Mohamed.  It is not a delusion to say you can validate your claims and in fact the only way to buy in is to let go of the reins of reason that you use to dismiss every other theist claim that is not yours.  Gay people do not give a flying fuck about your image of god any more than they care about the Muslim claims or any other mythical demand from an imaginary being.   Even many other Christians do not buy your bankrupt mid-evil spin.   That you imagine you have it correct and everyone who does not buy into your version of dogma is going against the "creators" will is arrogance personified.   Many people do not believe in your version of a god period and I know this is a tough concept for you but it is true.  It is because of your brand of bullying that their suicide rates are higher.  In constituencies where gay people are more accepted as normal those rates are always lower than in regions populated by your ilk.   You spin is nothing more than an attempt to blame the victims for your heinous and sicking judgement that you lay at the feet of  your god like a cowered.   When you tell someone who they are is evil their whole life and isolate them some people will break under the strain.  That is not their weakness but your brutal spin that is the root. 
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  18247. MsJudi54 I believe your honestly think you are correct but you have no more claim to the truth than a Muslim or a worshiper of thor.  You are all equally certain and have the same amount of proof.  You also share that you happen to worship the god of your region or social group and it is telling that is real determining factor in what god you pray to. The ONLY way you get to where you are is a suspension of critical thinking and embracing credulity.  I am someone who cares about the truth and as such have taken the time to look at the assertions of all believers and not just one group.  You are all far more alike than different and use the exact same arguments to validate very different conclusions.  It is your position that is arrogant not mine.  You claim to have special knowledge that directly contradicts others who are JUST AS DEVOUT as you are.  I make no claims except that what you sell is unconvincing, that your (and other theists like you) assertions are not just accepted by everyone like they are in your peer group. I do not have certainty I have justified skepticism that you share when the claims are made about anyone's god but yours.  That in addition to all the ones we agree on I reject yours as well not on the basis of any certainty but because your spin is not remotely compelling and has giant holes in it.   The idea that a being who would create me only to torture me for non compliance to contradictory and often disgusting dogma has nothing to do with love as I understand the term.  I can not see the god you worship as anything but repulsive in his need for adoration or his focus on it over the character of those he chooses to hand out unlimited punishment for finite "crime".   I never understood why people like you do not implicate god in your idea of sin.  Your god made us, he put the tree in the garden when he KNEW she would eat it, he set up the system, the punishment, all the rules, knowing every detail of what would ever happen and this means he would really have to take some of the responsibly for "sin". In your hypothetical the judge would have killed me because he handed down the conviction.  That I am not willing to accept a scapegoat for my crimes is the right and moral thing to do as no matter what someone is going to die. I would rather take responsibility for my actions than pass the punishment to someone else.  But then I believe in personal responsibility and do not expect anyone to absolve me of my actions so I carefully choose what I do.  I want to learn from my mistakes and be a better person from them and when I do fall I do not think it is fair for anyone else to eat the consequences but me. The judges offer although kind would amount to him committing suicide to atone for my actions and I can not have that.  The idea of anyone suffering for my crime is almost as repulsive as me being punished for what someone else did.    
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  18293. aSingleDallasGuy They are protesting us all being robbed just like the right should be.  That anyone lets the fuckers that collapsed the world economy by lying us into a catastrophe they caused is pathetic.  The fucked us all over and then walked away from with more cash than they started with, this fact should make everyone want to protest.  If it was down you and those like you would most certainly cite Obama's polices as the cause.  You are liar if you say otherwise. It does not change the fact the stock market has been at a near record high for most of the this "Communist, socialist anti business"  presidents term.   Go ahead ignore 50 months of consecutive private industry job growth,  ignore consistently high booming stock market,  ignore falling gas prices.  The only facts you pay attention to feed your narrative so turn your head and ignore reality as you continue to assert bullshit.  Your idiot spin is president should blamed for everything even if he has no hand in it or not  and when the news is good he gets zero credit no matter what he does.   This president has plenty of issues but none of the bullshit you attached to him is a problem.  His issue is on many issues he is no better than GB and that is a real kick in the teeth for those that voted for him because we wanted a progressive and not bush light.  You are projecting your own failures onto us as you talk about a need to be partisan in our support or condemnation of him,  but that is par for the course for you clowns.
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  18298. Jonathan Roehm Crime stats have dropped a lot right across the free world and by every stat I have seen has NOTHING to do with guns.  Gun policy changes or ownership in other places do not explain the universal drop there. The stats that matter with regard to gun regulation are those associated with gun crime.  A quick look at our numbers compared to countries at our economic level and it is pretty clear we have a big problem they don't.   The only place talking about guns driving the universal first world decrease in crime is here.  That data you point to is manufactured by the gun lobby to maintain the status quo here on gun sales. Nothing about gun ownership explains why the rest first world had crime stats drop by about the same amount as us .  But you have your gun stats in a bubble and I am pretty sure nothing I share will shake your faith in them. Forget about the fact it leaves the rest of the free worlds crime drop unexplained. You think I am arguing against the right to self defense?  Go back and reread what I typed and I am not making that claim at all.  I just question the mindset of those so fearful that they imagine they would have to.  I know no one that has ever been in a situation at home where a gun would have made it better.  I can not imagine being so afraid of a statistically unimportant boogie man to take the risk of having a loaded gun at hand that is more likely to harm someone I love than any criminal.  I just think it is bizarre as we do not live in Somalia or war torn Afghanistan and I do not see it as necessary no matter how afraid you have been told to be.  This is especially true for you as you actually know crime stats have dropped and are still strangely so scared you feel the need to arm yourself.   Your assertion I have not looked at the data is a cop out for not explaining my concerns about the data you reference.  I have looked and have never seen anyone with your spin answer the simple points I use to call it into question, including you.  I am not asked for any detail from you , I was just musing  that you must live a much more dangerous life than me or have some serious fear issues that drive you.  Either way it is almost impossible to understand a daily situation where I would have my rifles loaded with the intention of defending my family from something.  Good luck with all that scary shit you must have going that justifies it for you. It sounds like a shitty way to live is all, hope you find a path out. 
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  18464. ***** The scales on the ancestors of a chicken evolved to change into feathers.   The fact they have both and one can be converted to the other shows this.  The same would have been true of fathered dinosaurs who passed this trait onto birds.   You can not grow feathers on an alligator because their branch never developed that trait. Showing how one basic biological construction can become another fundamentally backs up the idea of how evolution can radially alter the appearance and function of elements of anatomy to fill a need.  This shows how genes can have information in them that allow a single form to have multiple functions and appearances that can over time be added as an option inside the coding of DNA They are not lizard scales but their fundamental similarities are telling.  Couple this with the similarities of bone structures in birds and theropods and the link between dinosaurs and birds becomes undeniable.  We know for a fact that some lizard like creatures once had scales and feathers, the evidence of this fact is no longer in question.    Don't talk about me being a moron as you use the most simplistic linear thinking to support your ignorance.   I have pointed this out before but I think it bears repeating.  You do not value any data as you already have your half wit bronze age answers.  You babbling about me being ignorant while asserting all we have learned in the last 150 years is false based on your silly dogma found in a text meant to sell a religion is idiocy personified.  
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  18499. Shady Brady I would not have backed the war in Iraq for any reason.  It was a quagmire of unreadable depth before we even went in with no plan on what to do after.  It saw the deaths of 100 of thousands and pretending we did these people a favour by turning their country in a bombed out lawless war zone is base stupid. It was a poorly thought out invasion with no plan what to do after which made donors trillions at the cost of our soldiers lives and money that should have been spent at home on crumbling infrastructure and R&D on new industrial tech . Saddam was murdering people for a long time. Most of that while we supported him and sent him weapons.  To talk about what a monster he was is pretty empty as he was our monster put in power by our people for our reasons. We knew what he would do with those weapons and as it turns out murdering militants is what you have to do to stay in power in Iraq and the new "democracy" there proves it.  I was no fan of Saddam but he was no worse than the leaders of Saudi Arabia who are bombing hospitals with our ordinance as we speak.    You make like the idea that America defeats evil but for the last 40 years that is not what we have actually done.  In many cases we actually empowered evil and gave it the power to grow.  We were Sadam's ally and only when he turned on us about oil did anyone talk about him as a murderer.  Before that we shipped him weapons to fight another group in Iran who did not supply us oil.  That group was run by a caliphate who took power after we assassinated their secular democratically elected leader when he said was going to nationalize the oil there.  The spin we are angels who go around defeating evil is an easily deconstructed myth that has not been true for long time.  The image you and I hold of America is painted on over what officials in our name have actually done over the last 4 decades. Seems you are conservative and you should be more outraged than me about this as we pour the lives of our soldiers and our hard earned money down the pit of the middle east. We are building roads and schools there as ours fall apart.  We are putting in water and electricity as our cites pump poison water to homes.  We have a myriad things to fix at home without dumping our cash down the bottomless hole in the middle east only to have what we build blown up weeks later. 
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  18565. Namu Tree What is considered right wing is pretty universal it is all matter of degree on the specifics.  It is very simply defined as the conservative or reactionary faction of a group.  You can not be both liberal and on the right wing as the ideas are mutually exclusive.   On individual issues one can very from side to side but there is no one who both considers them self very right wing and anti conservative.  The next logical question is what is a conservative.  A common way of distinguishing conservatism from both liberalism and radicalism is to say that conservatives reject the optimistic view that human beings can be morally improved through political and social change  Conservatives merely observe that human history, under almost all imaginable political and social circumstances, has been filled with a great deal of evil. Far from believing that human nature is essentially good or that human beings are fundamentally rational, conservatives tend to assume that human beings are driven by their passions and desires and are therefore naturally prone to selfishness, anarchy, irrationality, and violence. Accordingly, conservatives look to traditional political and cultural institutions to curb humans’ base and destructive instincts.  Right wing or conservative states are typified by strong police control and rigid hierarchy and social structures as well as a focus on tradition and continuity. They also are typified by having a political affiliation with with the gentry or upper class and advocate strong public private partnerships with them as a preferred means of economic development.  The world has come a long way since the french revolution and as you can imagine the entomology of the word does not necessarily completely reflect it's modern meaning.  You are correct that nazi's were a "new" thing but not entirely new.  They courted existing conservative factions in the country on their rise to power.  They appealed to the broken pride of the people harkening to the days before WWI.  They promised the glory days of strong and prosperous Germany of the past and in doing so courted fundamentally conservative elements.  
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  18627. xiAGC123 Not the same thing.  Scientists are making an assertion about feathers based on their evaluation of the evidence. The scientists may be proven wrong but would not be lying unless they concealed data that did not validate them. That is not the same thing your evaluation of the recounting a story about what happened to her.  If you say you do not believe her then you must think she is lying just like if someone does believe her then they think she is telling the truth.  This should not be complicated even for someone as simple as you.  If you wanted to walk this imaginary line of impartiality you pretend to stride then you should have responded with "I do not know and want to see the evidence" instead of responding "no".   I am not talking about burden of proof or any proof, I am talking about believing her charge or not.  There is no proof even being discussed in this entire conversation and people (including you) can clearly have an opinion without it.  You do not believe her and that has nothing do to with if reasonable doubt has been established or not.  You literally have no data and have still made up your mind.  In fact you would make a poor juror on the case (just like TYT would) as you have already formed an opinion of the veracity of the charge.  You are biased and as usual accuse others of exactly what you do.  You are a moron and I am insulting you because you you have it coming.  You whine about name calling all the time but did it right after a post when you blubbered for me to stop and I agreed. You are a thin skinned hypocritical simpleton.  Your spin is base stupid and you continue to prove it with your idiotic assertions that never counter me and consistently miss the point.  
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  18683. ***** We agree on a great deal.  There is a reason Obama could not pass health care and the fact is most of or failures are endemic to a single issue. That issue is our leaders are for sale to the highest bidder. In fact conventional wisdom until this very election was unless you had big money donors on your side you could not win.  Policy for the last 35 years has moved toward corporate support and away from any voter.  The system where money elections pick our candidates before we even get to vote has ensured the path we are on.   From what I have seen the most electable candidate in this election cycle is not going to be the establishment pawn and this is against a historical trend.  I openly admit Hillary is better than anyone the GOP fields but am not convinced she can win with the current state of mind of the electorate.  She is vulnerable like all establishment candidates are in this cycle. Even if she does win the nomination she will not be rallying the kind of support or excitement that accompanied Obama's wins. If she is the nominee I do not expect her to lead us to victory no matter who she runs against and that pains me to even say it.  I see the excitement in Bernie's honesty, consistency and outside the box nature being worth far more than the establishment pundits pretend it is.  In no other election I have seen in my lifetime could I say the same thing but this cycle is different kettle of fish and this truth is not just manifested on the left but the right as well.  I can't agree Hillary is a our best chance forward, in fact I disagree strongly because they way things worked in the past no longer applies. This has been proven over and over this cycle. We shall see how it all shakes out. 
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  18793. cbl1984 She still would have been seen as corrupt correctly so.   She was a bad bad choice in a cycle where all the voters wanted change.  Obama won because he at least sold the idea of change over the establishment party line the GOP offered even if it was bullshit incremental "establishment change".   Hillary offered business as usual and people are tired of it.  She barely won the primary and then turned her back on the half that did not vote for her to run right.  She lost because sucked against the worst candidate in history,  I guess she earns that moniker because the orange buffoon no matter how many normally election ending gaffs he had still beat her.  Trump won with less votes that Romany lost with.  This was because voters were so turned off by their choices many stayed home.  That is a statistic that will always play to the republicans advantage as the less people who vote the better they do.   Our horrible choices depressed the vote and handed the election to trump.  This election should not have been even close as trump is a horror show and would have been crushed in any other cycle. The reason that Trump got anywhere near the presidency is that Hillary was terrible choice and did not excite anyone but the donors.  Even many of the people who did vote for her were more voting against trump than for her as she did not represent her base. If the DNC does not learn the correct lessons they will not win again for a long long time.  At that point we will know they are paid to lose. We have to re-litigate the last election or we will learn nothing and repeat our mistakes.
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  18816. Bobzter It may be pseudoscience but it is undoubted we use that same form of judgment in our daily lives when we meet new people or are picking a candidate for a position we need to fill.  It should not be key to our final judgment but if we are honest it is certainly factored in. We agree on the image of Obama covering what he actually was.  Image is not everything and we should have learned that from his election.  That does not mean we should discount bad presentation as a fail when we see it.   If Bush had great polices and fought for the right things I would be more inclined to overlook strange ways of dealing with confrontation or an inability to assert himself. As it stands it these bizarre reactions are the cherry on top of his dismissal because not only are his policies terrible but he has a failing public persona. The longer we see this guy in the spotlight the less desirable he is to everyone but those who would pay to put him in power.  He was once the presumptive nominee and looking at him flounder in such an obvious way is news worthy. In my mind remarking on Jeb this way is not really substantive.  That being said it does go a long way to explaining why he is not popular with voters as the visceral honest reaction to these kinds of displays is not positive at all. To me the guy oozes a wishy washy air (I know that is not well defined critique) that deserves and earns comment especially when it is so blatant as in this case.  He is not in the minor leagues of politics.  I do not judge someone harshly who playing house league softball and does not play well but if pro player could not catch that would raise an eyebrow.  His shrugging ticking reaction is undoubtedly part of Jebs story where Bernie's hair is not anything that defines him in the same way.  
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  18860. shankyxyz None, I will move to none of them.  But that does not mean Christians are better just that they have had their hands tied in the west.  I do not give the Christians I am painting with radical brush any credit for my freedom when they are actively fighting to take it away by establishing a "christian sharia" here in the states.   If the religious right had their way here they would gladly make us far more like the caliphates and far less like America.  There are actual presidential candidates arguing that the 10 commandments be stamped into the constitution here and we live under biblical law.  We have clowns who expect the world to end any day driving foreign policy in the middle east to make that happen.  We have assholes advising governments in Africa to enact laws that make being gay an offense you can be executed for.   These people are exactly the the like of the vast bulk of Muslims we bizarrely label moderate.  Both are the exact same kind of fail, fundamentalist muslims and Christians are very much alike.  Muslims have more people in power killing others but that is more poltical than religous.   The day to day fundamentalist worshipers of both faiths share a great deal. I do not give a flying fuck what you are or what you call yourself.   These radical Abrahamic clowns are all a problem and as you focus on one of them while ignoring the other you are pointing out a danger  in front of you while leaving one at your back.  You fuck off you apologist ..
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  18974. Delta Fox Consensus defines what scientists a body by specialty say is true about the subjects they study.  If as a published scientist your spin is discredited it is discredited for empirical reasons and it is not a club where ideology over data rules like the circles of the racists who promote your spin. The books you cited are fully discredited as valuable data that defines genetically based ethnic differences. The studies that dismissed their value in making assertions about ethnic groups are well documented and available for you and everyone to read.  This is not a conspiracy and you are not arguing on the side of empiricism.  Scientific consensus is based on fact and the evaluation of the entire set of available data as well as the peer reviews of said data.  You and your mates can have whatever consensus you want.   Your agreement is different than a scientific consensus because science is based on informed choice and yours is based on empty conjecture.  You are not the same.   I do not care who you dated as you share discredited nonsense used to prop up empty racist arguments that have no voice except in an ignorant racist bubble.  As you spread the spin and talking points of overt racists you run the risk being associated with them.  Being you are not a racist perhaps it is time to look at who your allies in this are and come to realize they are not honest actors. These people have a distinct and irrefutable agenda and blaming the "liberal scientific  establishment" of being biased reeks of projection. I am not concerned about what ever you mean by feed my "back door".  You may not be one of these consistently dishonest race loonies like almost everyone who shares your spin but in this context it amounts to a distinction without a difference.  My assumption you were racist too is reasonable.  In my experience I have come to consistently dislike the people who share your spin,  I suspect that has colored my responses and if I my leaked distain is making it hard to communicate with me I apologise. 
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  18994. ***** It is not forced.  It is completely optional, 100% choice and options and not forced by anyone.   You loathe that people do not share your bigotry or idiot concerns for the propagation of a fucking skin tone.  Because most do not agree with idiot bias you make up bullshit saying they were forced to do anything. If what you personally value about your genetic legacy is your blue eyes marry carefully as some white people you marry will not pass them on. If you want to ensure your white blond hair is passed on be even more picky.  Whatever arbitrary attribute you value reproducing it will always have challenges.  In this case you can still be a bigot and value your lilly white easy to burn skin but is seems a poor focus.  By all means continue to breed whatever attributes you want in your children to have like a dog breeder does.  In the mean time for the rest of us we will be free to choose our own partners based on temperament and intelligence and the will to build a happy home without any your concerns.  Any children they have will contain a 'white" genetic legacy as much as yours do.  "White" people are going no where even if some of their children have a natural tan. I am not full of hate and you are the person defending simpleton nonsense based on something as arbitrary as skin tone.  Here are my own worlds,  I think you are a small minded piece of shit who puts too much value on an arbitrary attribute he has that he never earned and says nothing about him.  I don't hate you I just think you and those like you are pathetic losers. 
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  18995. ***** I have no idea why you would want to start an all white anything.   I have no idea why that you can not is a bad thing. Diversity is not forced, you make your own choices and if you choose a non diverse circle that is your right.  If one choose not to do that it is theirs as well and in no part of the  equation is "force used".  The rules that everyone is treated equally are fair and this is an argument you lost long ago.  Opportunity to marry who we choose is not destruction unless you choose to twist it to mean that.  The assertion there is any plan to force the "extinction of the whites" is moronic clap trap dreamed up by simpletons.  The process of mixing races has happened to civilizations for millennia.  This is not new even if today it is on an unprecedented scale because of the ease of travel in the modern world.   People once defined by a regional ethnicity are now free to travel the globe where we were once trapped in the region we lived in leading to the rise of the features that race.  With the advent of our ability to travel an intermingling of the races was inevitable.  All genes passed on persist even in "mixed race" children.   Your "white legacy" is going no where and the children of mixed race parents inherit every single thing you did.  You can  claim nothing they do not have.   That you fight to keep us separate also insists you remove the choice of who we marry.  In this you must be stood against as it is nothing but the worst kind of tyranny backed by abject and useless bigotry. 
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  19018. Hunter bermard The government you propose does not exist and has virtually no power as per your specs. They become a rubber stamp for those that fund them and that will be the super rich and the mega corps that will rise to take their place. We have seen what happens when government does not regulate business and what the do the environment and their workers when there are no consequences. Not having standards to for products means every single person is forced to do the work of the consumer protection agency and your products will have no guaranteed quality and you will have melamine in your baby food and tainted meat going to market to save a few bucks for the producers. These things happen with regulation in place and that you imagine that they will go away without regs is not well founded. We could expect these occurrences to escalate not diminish under your system. Workers rights and safety would become a distant secondary concern and slave or at best subsistence wages would become the norm. With nothing to keep the powerful in check history says that working people would suffer. The roads, the power system, the communication systems and many others that modern systems require would suffer under your system. The costs associated with running your business would sky rocket as you pay for access to 100 road system or pay exorbitant delivery chargers to do what has very low costs today. As I have pointed our taxes are very low after dedications are applied, historically low actually and the low taxes being a major benefit spin does nothing for the society and serves those at the top who can afford to pay for private services that the rest of us count on. We have private land ownership and that you imagine if someone owns it they will take care of it is betrayed by places like love canal and the Cuyahoga river that once was on fire before we enacted controls. There will always be those who are willing to poison the world around them to make an extra buck and many times it is not apparent what these people are doing until long after the damage is done. History does not bear our your spin and you an point to no place or time in history where your theory about what private ownership means is borne out. That you image seniors live in poverty because of poor planning ignores that many people live substance lives and do not have any money to put aside when they use every cent to live. The idea that if we let more people starve the world will be a better place is not well founded. That you argue for more poor seniors does not mark you as on the right side of this issue. Insurance and private pensions are not a options for a vast number of people and that you want to throw them under the bus is hideous callous point of view. I call your assertions fictional because they are fictional and are nothing more than hopes that are not borne out by our experience. It is counter productive as it further empowers the powerful at the expense of the weak. It will lead to a modern version of feudalism and there is no upside to that for the vast majority. Your spin attempts to solve the problem of corruption and bad business practices by getting rid of the refs. You are arguing we will get rid of crime by firing all the cops and it is a concept not attached to reality. You make no relevant arguments that are based on experience just hopeful nonsense, that it appeals to you does not mean it will work.
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  19127. Global Warming Skeptic It is expensive oil though. It is basically break even cost now so it is not exactly a replacement for Saudi oil if your goal is to keep prices down. Pumping it out fast has no upside except to the oil companies who reap the rewards as we bear the risk of having the pipelines run through our back yards and break and leak on our land. The prices being high was total based on total collusion. You thinking the Saudi's are our opposition is betrayed by their special status and that they are close ally. From the billions in weapons we ship them to their conspicuous absence on trumps Muslim ban list in spite of the fact the 911 hijackers came from there. Expensive oil was good for everyone who sold it and they all raked in massive amounts of money. So much money Putin had the cash to start making Russia a player again and they decided to cut that off. The prices has been more than halved and it has nothing to do with competition or lowering of costs and is political. This is not a resource where what we pay is tied to anything but the whims of some powerful people to their advantage and no one else's. You have this kind of power when you sell Oxygen and that the value of oil to our society. It is a closed system with a finite number of players who all make money when it is high and make slightly less when it is low. there is no way to explain the price swings we have seen in the term of supply and demand and you need to stop pretending otherwise. If you know it or not you are acting as a shill for some of the richest most profitable industries in the history of man working to make more faster before they become less relevant as they inevitably will be.
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  19248. ***** He is being supported by the same guys who birthed the neo cons. This is not a might scenario, his chief fund raiser was poached from the freeken Bush camp and they they are the banner bearers for neo con policy. I am not fearful of trump, I have looked at his policies and what he says now and in the past. I count his flip flops and empty policy declarations. I listen to the simplistic way he speaks and am left with the feeling he acts less intelligent than he actually is. I look at how disingenuous he was attacking the corrupt system that Bush represented in a debate and then hiring his staff directly linked with that corruption. The fact is you can not trust anything Trump says and he has changed his positions so many times there is no way to know which ones he actually supports. Put on top of that many of his openly stated positions are consistently terrible and unsupportable by anyone but a psychotically partisan right winger. If trump was actually independent you might have a point but with the backers he has in the party he is in there is no reason to expect he will be any less Neo con than Hillary. I agree that the status quo has to go but Trump is not the vehicle that will do so. He is corrupt clown that will say whatever he has to to get elected. Nothing he says can be trusted to be genuine but his actions in welcoming corrupting donors into his camp says all that needs to be said about his establishment ties. The guy is cancer in a party that is wholly owned by the element you rage against. A vote for trump will disappoint you in the same way the tea party people should be angry with the officials they elected but then do establishments will..
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  19316. ***** Your "common sense questions" have answers attached to reality. 1) Torture is better for wringing out a false confession than as a tool of justice.  That they have been doing it for a long time does not make it ok. 2)  They are doing it to get the answers they want not the truth.  In every case it is a tool to compel people to say things that they otherwise would not.  It does not guarantee what they say is the truth and in fact if you want the actual facts there are much more effective ways to question someone. 3) It is illegal for our cops to torture anyone.  There have been police who have gone to jail for water boarding.   There are proven techniques that work much better for torture when trying to get the actual truth.   4) One does not have to serve to understand torture is a crime.  That you have been in the military does not make your position on this subject correct.  You can be a loyal member of our society and be dead wrong on this issue.  The two things are not mutually exclusive.  In fact as we torture we put our service men at risk opening the door for other countries and groups to treat them the same way.  If we torture we are no better the barbaric assholes we fight who torture their prisoners for propaganda reasons too.  5) Got news for your sparky we got nothing from torture, nothing.  That you support it says far more that is dark about you than you imagine it does.  That someone has a minority potions does not automatically make it wrong,  in this case the only sane choice is to oppose torture for those who have not bought the bad bill of goods by our pro establishment media.
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  19365. bigaback You are talking to me like I do not know all the facts you share. I am not ignoring what we have done wrong and I do not have to in order to state the facts I do. ISIS is a cancer we created with our poorly thought out policy in Iraq that did not include a strategy on how to maintain the region after we bombed it, kicked out the government, sent the army we trained home and then put a group who was going to persecute them for revenge in power. If we are going to point at a group like ISIS as backwards or undesirable it is more than fair to point out that Saudi Arabia is an ISIS that made it, primarily with our support. I decry the policy that empowered ISIS and I also attack the policy that supports fundamentally regressive authoritarian states like Saudi Arabia. That we side with them at all for any reason is a direct indicator we are going the wrong way if we are ever going to pretend to value freedom. I do understand the frustration and the drive behind the hatred building in the middle east towards the us. We have fermented and empowered and sometimes allied the very elements we pretend to oppose in the "war on terror" Our actions have directly led to groups like ISIS having any power at all. Our policy has empowered the backwards loathsome regime of Saudi Arabia for decades. Our unilateral policy on Israel inflames the situation and undermines any talk that we even want peace. The days or our military and CIA doing the work for oil cartels has to end. The days of foreign policy being written in coreprate board rooms has to become a thing of the past. If we are to be what we can be the days of our leadership acting as corporate lackeys and yes men for a few rich clowns needs to be marked as a dark chapter in our history to be left behind.
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  19369. +Red Pill  Stop with the slippery slope nonsense,  your black and white thinking is not attached to reality and implementing an any given element of the "communist manifesto" does not mean we are communist.    Progressive taxation is not communism,  taxation is not theft.  That you hate taxes does not validate your out of touch with reality assertions about it.  You accuse me of putting words in your mouth when every single assertion you make is based in an invalid premise that anyone left of you wants communism, that any idea you do not like is communist and it is not true.  The people who make more should pay more because they can afford and they reap more rewards from our living in our system.   There is nothing unfair in asking them to. That you want to further empower the rich (like they need that) is a fall out of the policy you support.  We have built a collection of the richest humans in history under our "socialist" system so your invalid concern for them is noted but has no value or legs as they are already doing really well.  If they pay a few more points in taxes on profit or have to deal with regulations that protect it has not harmed them or their rise to greater and great power.  Now if you want to talk about tax relief for the poor and those who actually work for a living spending all they have to maintain a reasonable lifestyle I am interested because that puts more money into the economy and raises the standard for everyone.    Your assertion of what a constitutional republic is has been rejected by the courts and standard practice for a long long long time.  You make claims that are just not true. You do not care about any freedom except the right to never pay taxes.  Nothing else matters to you and be it pouring poison in the river of fucking over employees to make a buck you do not see any roll in government protecting the masses from the rich assholes who make these calls.  You would hand unlimited power to a few to crush everyone else and that is no better than giving power to a communist dictatorship that rules with no interest to the citizens it represents.    You have not answered why it is good to ignore dying people to prevent "theft".   Your whole theft bullshit spin is emotional porn too except it has nothing to do with who lives or dies but appeals to greed of those who like it.   You do advocate for stepping over those who can not pay, fuck em they are poor and should have known better.  If they can not afford it then they are screwed and that is fair in your head.  As it stands for the last few decades my government has not worked for me but instead does the bidding of the highest bidder and has for a long time. The failures in our system and our ever growing income inequality attached to the collapse of the middle class built in an actual progressive era are all attached to our leaders selling out to big donors who write trade and tax policy.  This leads us to stupid pointless wars,  deciding who should run what country to make oil multinationals happy and repressing health care and education to give tax cuts to the richest people in history.   I do not think my government works for me but the answer is not hand power to the assholes who are buying them hoping for a new result.    There are places your vote matters and they universally do not support the concept of their leaders being picked by who can raise more money from the billionaires that should have no more of a vote or influence than you do. The first world nations are by no standard hell holes.  In fact ours is slipping faster into decline precisely because of the elements I outline above.  There is no example of what you want working in the modern world and until you have at least one element of data backing your spin talking about turning back the clock to the 1700's will be real tough sell to anyone that looks at what that actually means.
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  19372. Red Pill Half way to where? I ask that you come out of the fringes and stop misrepresenting what I am even am arguing. You want to let poor people die in enacting a system that would not help anyone but the mega rich, what am I supposed to compromise with you on that? You want to tear down the economic and tax system rolling us back into the 1700's, what middle ground can anyone sane honestly find with you? How can I meet you half way you are ruining 250 years behind me, that would put me in the 1800's. Being called short sighted by a guy who imagines the world gets more efficient when you create a 100 new bureaucracies at the state and local level instead of just one at the federal is not very compelling. Your total lack of understanding of economies of scale cripples your ideas out of the gate. Moving the functions you expect to be done at a state or local level to "give you more freedom" will exponentially increases the amount of resources required to manage them, they currently do not need to support these functions or the jobs you expect them to do. Instead of one management team at the top you now have a 100 of them duplicating all the centralized effort many times over. Instead of one rule book and office to support you have 100, etc. You exponentially increase the cost of managing services formerly handled at a federal level through a single office. The means that regions that do not have resources simply will not get services. Since you think it is a good idea to down load that to states it means some places will have the full set of resources and services one expects in a modern country and other states simply and many small towns simply will not get them freed from the tyranny of being part of a country. This is one example of many where your idealistic spin crashes against simply break down of costs and benefits. But you are the one making the claims here. You assert your system would be better and that is claim you simply can not back up. That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. I am saying we should not throw the baby out with the bathwater and we still have real options before giving in and handing power to modern feudal lords like you want us to.
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  19373. Red Pill Bullshit, you are backwards and what you want has no analog on the planet and I have no faith based expectation it will be any better unlike you. Seriously I feel like I am talking to a child as well and your half way point means rolling us back into a third world country to enforce some idea of freedom that only means a complete evisceration of services Americans count on for no measurable gain or even asserted gain. Local/state control is a desire you have not justified as any better than what we have as I have pointed out destroying economies of scale by having a centralized system will be destroyed making every service enacted under your plan more costly to run. I don't think local and state control of health care is a good idea as it will cost far more to have 100 programs administrations instead of just one at the federal level. There is no advantage to leaving what health care people can get different from region to region and it is a licence to see the poor areas suffer. There is no halfway between me and your imaginary voluntary system which i have no expectations would work and you should not either as there are no examples lauding its success let along an improvement over what we or other nations do. You are the one who is asserting nonsense not attached to reality not me. I have living breathing examples of the working systems and ideas that I support you do not. This makes you the closed minded ideologue not me and that you do not understand the implications of your unfounded desire does not mean they do not have deep problems you blindly ignore. Spouting childish idealism not attached to reality and then calling me closed minded for not buying is is a weak charge that does not stick. You are not the adult in this room. What you want does not work and would kill people and bankrupt the system making it cost far far more. That you hate the federal government has blinded you to the fact it can be of use. That you ignore we would have the exact same problems at the local and state level and you are not solving anything with this spin skips over your head too. You have a faith based claim it will be better and all real indications do not agree. Your solutions would not help and you can not show they would. You need to stop pretending your ideas are based on education or experience as this form of system you want has not existed for over 150 years in the time before the world became mass mechanized and small. It has no place in a modern world and shredding our economic and social safety net to make you happy will do nothing but relegate us to 3rd world status. You want what every 3rd world country has, local health care that means if you community is rich you have a hospital if not you do not have one. It is not evil for local people to manage things but it takes resources to do so. If every community forms its own committees, purchasing, payroll. billing, etc, etc to oversee health care it means duplication of effort on a massive scale further increasing costs. I see literally no advantage to downloading something like health care to the local or state level if your goal is affordable or consistent care across the nation. There is literally no working system on the planet like this for a fucking reason. I don't hold my position because i love big system but I do want our system to be as efficient as possible and spend as much money on care not extra useless bureaucracy your proposal would create. Saying everything should be like the DMV overlooks that the dmv is universally considered a bureaucratic mess to deal with. It ignores the massive amount of resources each state has to put forward toward a system people universally deride as backwards and slow. I subject like health care is monumentally more complicate and expensive. That the state falls down on issuing a card so you can drive does not bode well for their handling of taking over health care for no reason you can justify outside you like the idea better. Your love of the idea of states does not mean there is not a role for the federal government. You have not validated the idea that they do a better job or that you understand the implications what you want or the downsides which you do not even seem to recognize. There are objective measurements of what is better and what is worse and that something makes your feel better is not good enough to upend our system for it. Your individual desires would see 10 of millions fall through the cracks for no gain you have outlined. You are clearly more concerned about your ideology than people. You are like Stalin who caused mass starvation because he decided he did not like the way farms were running and messed up Russia's food production to improve it to make them more in line with dogma. You would see people die to make your dream come true and I hope there is always someone like me around to oppose you and your greed based version of how things should work.
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  19374. Red Pill I am not misconstruing it,  I am telling you the results of your polices and you have literally no answer for what I say.   I do not think the whole country is out for themselves just the people with your spin who do not care what their stated desires would do.   Your alternatives are nothing more than an extension of your empty desires based on a dogma that by definition nothing the federal government does can be good.   The charity idea is idiocy and represents nothing more than a giant step backwards to empower the rich at the cost of everyone else.  The system you propose has never existed and does not exist because it is not workable and would not survive contact with reality intact.  Your demonstrated deep ignorance on the subjects of national programs does not make your argument anymore sound.   That you are ok with voluntary state run program means nothing to me as you are literally asking for unilateral surrender on my views and to for me to ignore my own deep and valid concerns to enact it.  This is not the middle ground,  you are asking for the whole cake, then eating it and then talking about how nice it is to compromise.  I take responsibility unlike you.  I take it not just for myself but for those who are not as well off as I am with my many advantages.   I have good health insurance and will continue to into my retirement.  My objections to our system are not about my situation but the 10's of millions of Americas many of them children who have no options.  I agrue for the 100's of thousands of American families that go bankrupt because of our greed based health care system that puts insurance companies and profit before lives.      You use "freedom" as buzz word but nothing you advocate advances freedom for anyone but robber barons.  Freedom for people to pay double for services they currently get is not freedom but robbery.   Your assertions about our federal programs not being legal are fact free as betrayed by reality.    We do have the authority to enact programs at federal level and that you do not think we do means nothing as you are talking out your ass and it is clear you are not correct as we currently have many.   Stalin was not about progressive taxation or safety nets,  they were communists where everyone made the same amount and there "were no poor" to help in his system as all were ostensibly supposed to be equal.  You do not even know what he stood for and pretending we have anything in common is droll while you are exactly the same kind dangerous ideologue who puts dogma over actual peoples lives like that monster did.   Someday you will learn what terms you use mean to those who speak English.  It will empower you to not look foolish when you talk in public.    " I'm done wasting my time with you.  You keep saying that and then coming back to spit the same nonsense.
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  19375. +Hank Schroeder  He can make his own choice and go bankrupt because of it because the system is not focused on providing care but making money.  Our system is not about choice at all but about an effort to enrich a handful of assholes at the expense of every consumer who cares if his family lives or dies because they have access to care.   There is nothing wrong with making money unless you have to advocate for those who can not afford your essential service to die because it is priced to high. You guys keep babbling about "more taxation" ignoring the fact you would pay half as much as you do now for the same service that covered everyone with no copay, no deductible, etc, etc, etc.  You are literally arguing to pay more and open the door to bankruptcy if heaven forbid something goes terribly wrong and you lose your coverage or someone you care about is fucked over because of preexisting conditions.   You are arguing for the worst system in the free world while spitting half wit talking points fed to you about choice when in fact you have none except to pay through the nose or die quickly once sick to spare burdening your family and friends.   Point to one system on earth where your silly ideas work on a large scale to provide a critical service, name one.  This is another fact free talking point meant to sound noble but what it really means is people will die, this is a policy that would literally kill 10's of thousands.  This voluntary bullshit  is nothing but a path to enriching the very richest at the cost of our 1st world society.  There is nothing Nobel in stepping over the sick and dying to at a little to your bottom line.   There is no where on earth your stupid service to assholes policies are in place and you have no expectation they would work any better than they do in the third world where the poor regularly die of completely preventable issues.   Enough with the childish demand of volunteerism and back up how this would work I the real world or be silent with your selfish foolish demands.  You clowns literally support overt fascists as you vote for the GOP or anyone on the right these days.   They sell sell you out the highest bidder every single day.  The establishment dems are only barely marginally better but at least they do not empower insurance companies by allowing them to cut the basic service they provide  so they can make an extra buck.  Our health system is an overt failure not because of the poor draining it (as we provide weak coverage and care for them anyway) but because we have zero cost control and as prices go up and up insurance companies just pay the bill and pass the costs onto us as it makes no difference to them and actually increases their profit margins as prices rise.   I would argue it is you and your ilk that are garbage as you fight to see your fellow citizens die because simply because they can not afford care.   You argue on behalf of your side making up what I stand for as I point out the actual results of your idiot spin.  Analysis of the situation is not your strength and if you actually did what you admonish you would find no arguments that actually back up your spin would be an improvement.  You have bought some silly spin making you sound like a moral crusader for "freedom" when you in fact preach slavery to the insurance companies and the status quo.  Even what you want is a tip of your hat to stasis as your ideas are so unworkable they will never see the light of day and the fact you by default side with the status quo empowers it. "You’re the Nazis.  You are the Stalin's and the Hitler's."   Hyperbole much? In your mind is the entire first world being run by Stalin and Hitler? Canadians, Europeans, Asians and the entire first world live under "Stalin/Hitler rule in your fevered mind?  Even you can not believe this stupid shit you spit.  The answer is no halfwit and pretending otherwise is base stupid and rejected as an idiots assertion on the face.   Call me closed minded, but I have study proposals like yours and reject them because there is no expectation they will make things any better than they are in the third world and the most backward places on the planet where what you want is the only system available.  You clowns are not connected to reality and spit talking points dreamed up in think tanks to rob you and me both.   You are the ideologues here and part of a tiny minority who as bought in the bullshit you sell.  Your analysis of the positions are as deep as rain puddle and are based on your dogma and not good results for consumers or anything that currently works let alone works well.  You literally have no reasons outside an empty appeal to faith that what you want would work let alone provide good outcomes.  I can point to the systems that are the best in the world and provide the highest quality care for the most people and you simply have no data backing your fact free assertions. It is clear you have no idea what is even being propose as you say something stupid like this: "Why in the hell would any sane person not only contribute part of their pay to their employer's private insurance company, but then also be forced to fund this "Medicare for all" through their taxes also?"  The answer is you would not longer have to get insurance from your employer as you would have options, if we paid for our health care through our taxes like the rest of the first world we would pay half of what we do not to insurance companies and everyone would be covered.   The middle man is the insurance companies that that they do nto care to control costs because they make more as they go up along with their profit motive is the root fault or our system.   I do not give a flying fuck about the insurance companies that have been selling us increasingly expensive oxygen for the last 40 years.  At best they should sell supplemental coverage to those who want it and should b e out of the primary care game as they offer zero value and the ones driving up costs for the consumer as they literally do not care how much it costs as they pass everything onto us.   So the answer to your misinformed question is you would no longer pay insurance companies for health care.  You may get dental or other coverage through work but the burden of providing health care would be lifted from business allowing them to do what they are in business to do.   I will not shed one tear for an industry that bankrupts 100 thousand Americans a year while rolling in money.  There is no such law forcing insurance to keep their rates higher as you have zero options to opt in anyway.  You are literally making shit up and I guess when you have no arguments that is what you are forced to do. We  have plenty of "competition" but no cost control and no one in it gives a fuck if you live or die as the insurance companies through a process called recidivism will work to find a way not to pay for needed care even if you have insurance.    Competition is not what makes the other systems that actually work successful and you using poorly thought out talking points as you babble about it being anything but a sloppy blow job to the status quo as you drool all over yourself.  When you ask a question as stupid as "WHY do you even need a private insurance company or government insurance IN THE FIRST PLACE" it underlines your profound lack of comprehension on how the system even works or the costs associated with it very very few people in the entire country can shoulder.  It is clear you think our system is the same as it was in the turn of the century before hospitals were expected to have million dollar mri machines or child mortality was 4s time higher than it is today.   The era you guys point to was not a golden age of medicine and people regularly died because we did not have the resources or systems or knowledge built through research (also driven by money) that cured them.   We can't do it because you can't afford your own care for anything more complicated than simple surgery.  At least no more than once.   We reject it because it is a pipe dream that ignores the costs and would mean hospitals simply could not function as you bringing in a couple chickens to pay for your health care will no longer cover it like in the good old days at the turn of the century when you dealt doc brown.  That you do not think you have an ideology does not mean you do not.   You would choose to see people die in the name of your greed and no one should let you clowns forget what you stand for even as you pretend to be moral.  I am happy to listen to ideas but listen does not mean I will capitulate to them especially when they serve no one.   You babble about those who disagree with you not being open minded as you represent the most closed minded vision there is and do not even care what your proposed policy means or who it hurts as long as it meets your faith based vision of the world.  Being lectured by the likes of you as you show you do not even know what is being debated while pretending to be morally superior as you would step over bodies is empty bullshit waved away by the sane.
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  19376. +Hank Schroeder  I do not and do not intend to defend that system,  it is not something I would fight for and see the many inherent systemic problems in it.  That being said you are not proposing anything reasonable that would replace it.  Our system has many inherent flaws but the largest of those flaws are mitigatable with good legislation and a leadership that works for us and not just to enrich those who own them.   We do not have to toss out everything to fix it.  That our system is founded on debt does not mean we are bankrupt to say so is either ignorant or dishonest.  The only way for something to be "unconstitutional" is for the constitution to specifically forbid it, please cite the article that makes this deeply flawed system "unconstitutional" in your mind.  If you are going to attack it attack its real failures (there are plenty) not something a clown who does not care about the facts told you.  As it stands you are acting as controlled dissent in service to assholes who are entirely greed driven as they at the ones writing these silly talking points that invalidate your otherwise valid concerns, minimizing them.      The gold or silver standards time has come and gone, there is not enough gold on the planet to cover the money we currently have printed so the idea of the gold standard fixing everything is nonsense.  That our (and the planets) monetary system is flawed does not mean you can demand we replace it with something that will not work.   In the time of the founding fathers there was actual slavery so the idea that the gold standard somehow prevents economic slavery is not well thought out as both economic and actual slavery were rife in that time.  Rich land owners controlled a large percentage of the wealth of the country coupled with no regulations to protect workers or consumers.   The people of that era much more economically indentured and far poorer,  they were arguably more slaves to their landowners and employers than we are today even with a gold standard in place.  Just like the founders intended us to amend our constitution perhaps they did not want us running with the monetary system conceived of before industrialization for forever.   Honestly, I am not really sure what the system that should be in place is and have seen several proposals.   But if you are going to advocate for changing it as your main thing then pick something better thought out than demanding the gold standard which only makes you look clueless.
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  19386. TheNoobSensei There is an element of america that is doing well but the vast bulk is not doing better, this is a matter of math.   Our infrastructure is crumbling, income inequality is at a record high, most of the new jobs created are low paying and the middle class is shrinking at an alarming rate.  The robbers who crashed the economy were not punished and are just as big if not bigger than when they were too big to fail a few years ago.  The TPP a corporate written licence to sell our sovereignty and more jobs coming is coming and one candidate universally opposed it and the other said she now wants to see what is in it.  Our system is awash in corporate money and they are buying and selling our leaders so that no policy advances without their nod.  When we have these massive challenges incremental change is not going to serve anything but the status quo which most certainly is not in the benefit for all or even most of us. When Obama won the first time he took the house and the senate because people were excited and engaged. He lost it because his promised change turned out to be pocket change. The path to controlling the branches is to have a candidate that brings out voters with promised change.  That is not what Hillary offers and the only excitement about her are from establishment insiders and those who do not care if their leader is bought by the same guys who crashed our economy. If you want to take the house back hillary is not the candidate to do it. The argument that he can not get anything done is mitigated by the fact he would at least fight for it and hold those who oppose him to task.
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  19526. ccdimage We did go over this and what the individuals are doing matters, especially when they are directly contradicting themselves and running on a platform of credibility while contradicting themselves. Your examples are are trying to be leaders of the free world. I do not see Cenk running for this role or making contradictory statements on the matter you belly ache about. Your comparison is silly and I ever more convinced you are a troll because no one who can manage to type could actually buy your spin. Of course you are free to attack him randomly but do not expect it to resonate when it has literally nothing to do with the subjects he covers that make the show popular. That you can not see this argument is an empty is fail for your ability to reason. For the last time we know what he named his network after and it is not your made up silly nonsense claim. When you walk like a duck and quack like a duck and make disingenuous attacks made up by ducks it is fair to call you a duck in this venue. If you are not a right winger any distinction from them that you imagine you have does not amount to a difference. This issue as applied to Cenk is only important to you and a few right wing trolls. Your social justice fight on this issue would be funny if it was not just to transparently fake. You have not lied about the genocide but you have no problem misrepresenting what Cenk stand for here and now because of what he said 25+ years ago. You are free to do this but it is dishonest as it is not facing him for what you dislike about what he says today. You do this because of naked bias you have already clearly shown with regard to the content of the show. What I don't like about your spin is that you are too much of a coward to attack him on what you really despise him. Instead you fall back on this idiots trope. It makes you look weak and stupid, whatever floats your boat.
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  19532. degen83 You say they shoot too many black people when you give a stat like 90% of the shooting are justified.  At this point I understand why they look at all shooting as suspect after multiple cases where the  cops falsify evidence and even when guilty get off scot free.  I am unconcerned about the justified shootings (even though our cops are pretty gun happy compared to other forces) but we all should be worried about a stat of 1 in 10 being invalid.  We do have a systemic problem. This is manifested in disproportionate arrests for drug crimes that white people commit at the exact same rate.   Ignoring the fact that some elements of our community get greater scrutiny and are arrested more does not justify more of them are shot. It seems to me you are the one being intellectually dishonest as you justify unequal treatment by our police and that they pull their guns and shoot citizens at an alarming rate when there are clearly other options.  Pretending we do not have a problem is weak sauce and holds no water. The majority of BLM are not anti white, they are anti cops shooting their brothers, their sisters, their dads often with almost no provocation and no way to justify it outside the context of the individual cops overt fears. Your spin is clear but I do not care how you characterize the movement.  The fact is even if there are "black power" people in it the movement is about justice for our citizens who are being murdered by those who represent all of us.  You think there is no issue or that the community has it coming because they are so violent or whatever you imagine the truth is but your spin is empty bad smelling air in defense of murder nothing more. I tolerate no racism and publicly disagree with any overtly anti race rhetoric.  That does not change the fact the base concern of BLM is valid even as you reject it.  I would feel the same way no matter who the cops were regularly shooting and I personally do not care what color they are just that there is a pattern that needs to be corrected.  I actively disagree with all racist spin no matter what color you are as you say it.  I do not feel attacked by BLM even as some of their spin alginates would be supporters by being black centric.  I understand why this is done even as I see it as counter productive.  It does not change the fact there is a real problem they want to address. Pretending I support racists while you share the white power "black crime" bad spin rhetoric is not very compelling. Anti white racism is not a thing anyone has to worry about.  If you are white you and your ancestors have enjoyed a couple centuries of privileged treatment under law. Things have gotten progressively better as far as our march to equal treatment but our current issues are rooted in a past that was innately bigoted.   Conservative leaning groups like the police are not on the forefront of change and are behind the curve institutionally when it comes to the acceptance the rest country takes for granted.  Your 90% number is damning and that even 1 in 10 are unjustified is why there are protests in the streets about this issue.
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  19555. IchbinX The thing is you do not get to pick the standard.  "traditionalists" as you describe them base their standards on idealized images of societies that never existed out of a shared story book version of history.  No one cares that you want everyone to be like you or that people who different scare you.  There is segment of humanity that you represent who despise change and love conformity and continuity to a burning fault.  You like the image of what you have so much you are willing to throw anyone who does not agree with your spin under the bus.  I makes you the bearer of the racists and other forms of "traditionalists" who have fought emancipation, woman right to vote, civil rights era changes, gay rights, etc, ect.  You and the "traditionalists" have borne our most vehement racists and divisive elements have been on the wrong side of every fight for rights we have had.   Liberals recognize that not everyone is the same.  They also recognize that being different is not the threat you imagine it is.  We are not ruled by fear and ignorance.  We are more informed about the world and because of our outward nature and our interest in it and not just what is right beside me.  Your isolation and lack of interaction outside your community limits you and perpetuates the perceptions that drive you.  There is no hypocrisy in defending the freedom for everyone and not just my group. Everyone's rights should be the same and everyone should be treated equally under the law and in the eyes of the state that rules them.  That you are part of a group who sees no downside in limiting the rights of others as long as you do not like them it shows any commitment to "freedom" you have as false.  The republicans should never use the word as many of their voters do not value it.  Republicans are the only party the KKK votes for.  The funny thing was they were driven into the shadows before Donald started tacitly supporting their spin and then not publically denouncing them.  Your vision of humanity is telling and that you think one group has to "dominate "is your failure.  You assume oppression is the standard, so fight against equality because that means you think if you re not dominating then you will be oppressed.  The fact is there are plenty of places the "rainbow" does work and no one is oppressed at all. Any nonsense assertions it can not be done are betrayed by reality.  You backward looking clowns are a relic of the past and your weak defense of racism is the same old bullshit those like you always say.  You do not care if you are dead wrong or how many times you are wrong, it satisfies your fear and retrograde world view.
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  19648. formsMostBeautiful Theft is taking taking and using others resources without paying for them, that is what you advocate for.   It is what you are doing when you do not pay taxes and drive on our roads, fly in our sky, drink the water that is kept clean with money you do not contribute to.   Anyone who does not pay their taxes is shifting their responsibility onto others and it is theft.  That you frame taxes as theft does not mean I have to buy into your spin and flatly refuse your characterization as valid.  I have all the grounds to say you are a thief sponging off us as you are.   No one does care what you individually value, they do not care what I value either.  We do have the option to work to focus how that money is spent but as individuals in a society our own choices are not what drives spending on a macro scale.  It can not and never will.   In a perfect world it might but it high time you realize that is not where we live as the option is unworkable. The moment you define statism as a totality you fail.  What you advocate for is no more moral or high minded than the idea of a state.  There has never been a perfect state but if you imagine the problems you list will go away without a state all you have to do is look at a shangrala like Somalia to get a picture of what a stateless society offers. Your broad sweeping generalizations ignore the fact your solution offers nothing better. Enacted your vision would not survive contact with reality in the way you image it would and there is no reason to believe it would be better than what we have while opening a Pandora's box of new issues.   Your broadly blame the idea of state for our woes when in fact it is the same corruption you would empower with your view that is the problem. The idea that without government the problems of corruption, waste and mismanagement go away is nonsense and all you do is remove the advocate for everyone who is not a corporation and pass all the power into the hands of a few.   Your views are simple and child like in their naivete and like all purist dogma is divorced from the bonds of reality.    
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  19649. formsMostBeautiful You do not though as you do not even understand what your taxes pay for or you would not advocate for an idea as simpleminded that they are theft. Taxes do not fit the definition of theft in a conventional sense and you have have to stretch and twist both to make the idea work. You do not have a solid position you have partisan simple minded spin that supports you pre existing narrative that is all.    You have a fringe position of no value.  You accuse me of a straw man as you stand in a field of them as your only point in your argument.   You only care what others value if you agree otherwise you dismiss it out of hand.  You are not being honest here.   What generalizations?  Please,  you redefine and straw man a concept as complex and integral to our society as taxes to suit your narrative and then misrepresent my position as supporting theft and violence.  Give your head as shake as you imagine you are being level headed and honest.   Dismissing my point out of hand is lazy and is not a counter argument to what I say.  That there are failures within our state that need to be addressed does not mean the entire thing does not have value.  This is a half witted straw man again as you blindly ignore the good to highlight the bad.  Instead of fixing what is wrong you would kill the patient to cure them.   You are not a voice of rationality you are a partisan zealot unattached to reality.  Your views have never survived contact with reality intact because they can not.  You can ignore this statement but you can not refute it.   The issues with your proposed preposterous system are legion.   Just crafting a legal structure alone is a task that is not workable. Setting aside issue health and safety and the environment there is no reason to expect the system you stand for to be any less corrupt than what we have today.  With out any power to check the powerful what you propose is the creation of a vessel state where a handful of the powerful make what ever rules they want and you as a peon take it or starve.    There is no projection and you haven not shown any.  I can point to relatively successful states that have high standards of living for all you can not and never will do the same.  
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  19700. Austrian Markets I do, because white restaurants lead to white only hospitals leading to death of citizens in the name of hatred and ignorance .Your spin ensure minorities of all stripes are treated as second class citizens in their community. There is literally no value in validating racists and bigots treating other citizens as the lass then them because of their problems.   Freedom without equality for all is meaningless.  I stand in the way of black only racism or any segregationist element who uses bigotry as a their bench mark in the public arena.  Creating isolated communities who exclude anyone who is not like them has no value I can think of and I will never ever support it. The ONLY reason white only resteraunts went away was because of the law and the market did nothing to correct this issue.  These business always target minorities with limited buying power and ensure parts of the community go without services to satisfy ignorance. It does not matter how you feel about this issue and I am personally inclined to doubt the veracity of your assertion of not being a bigot yourself.  The business model implementing bigotry is perfectly viable in certain communities ensuring the minority who is marginalized has distinct disadvantages to no ones benefit.  I do not give a flying fuck if the business owner I go to is racist as long as they can not treat anyone as less than them and are forced to serve all.  I am not looking to police idiotic beliefs just ensure they do not hurt anyone with them or take away access to services offered to the general public. 
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  19701. Austrian Markets Yes I am against black collages.  I am against segregated communities of all sorts as I see they have no value but to isolate their inhabitants.  That being said as long as they are inclusive by law there is little to say about them except I do not agree and as long as their exclusionary desires are unsupported by law I do not really care.  Any black school that turns away a student because of their race should be charged under the same auspice that desegregated schools were back in the 60's as they are doing the exact same thing.   I do think you and everyone even those I fundamentally disagree with  have the right to believe anything that want and I have no desire to legislate anything to do with what you think or even say.  But when it comes to public commerce we should all have equal access and there is absolutely no advantage to pandering to a group who wants to marginalize a minority.  The right of access to goods and services under the auspice of public business licence overrides any innate and protected right to be an asshole in every other part of your life.     They get punished for not serving everyone because they are breaking the terms of a signed contract.  The moment you put pen to paper on a business licence you commit to serve everyone.  If you can not do that because you are too big of a dick wad or whatever then you should never sign it.   Those who can not fulfill the terms of their contracts are liable for failing them.  People have the freedom to choose if their personal bias will allow them to run a publicly accessed business and if they can not it is on them to suffer for not reading what they sign. 
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  19704. Austrian Markets They are not punished under law for being a bigot.  When they break agreements they sign they are responsible like anyone else who signs a contract.  This is not about restricting their right to be bigot or punishing actions that reprehensible but ensuring that everyone who acts as a public vendor is held to the exact same standard.  Your example is not the same thing and is also bigoted but how you spend your money and who you associate with is a protected choice I would fight for everyone to make unless it is under the preview of an agreement with the state.   What you think is wrong in regulation makes no difference and it is not going to change. If you want to live in the land of no regulation move to a third world hell hole where discrimination and no regulation is a way of life.  That you expect the same here in the model for first world countries has no value and is only a step backward.   Bottom line I do not care what you imagine is a fair as it serves no one but bigots and those who support them.   The rules we have in place have been there for a long time and are eminently fair to everyone but bigots and I do not care they have issues.  If one can not serve the entire public they need to find another line of work as they can not fulfill what is expected of them here.   Our law is not about punishing racists as you consistently ignorantly assert.  It is about guaranteeing access to commerce for all citizens and any vendor who does not like it they knows where the door is.  Being a racist is not illegal and never should be and you would do well not to misrepresent my position. I am 100% consistent and would fight for your right to be bold faced racist as it is perfectly within your rights to be an ass hat.  I will fight just as hard to ensure your bigotry is not supported in public policy or access to goods and services as we know what happens when it is.  The rules now in place were put there for very good reasons and you can argue we should be empowering the ugliest throwback element to deny service but there is literally no upside to doing so.
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  19707. Austrian Markets Denying service to a good or service that may cost ones life is innately aggression.  Letting someone die because their skin color offends you is most certainly  aggression. Treating anyone as lessor because of your bigotry is also aggression even as you make fact free assertions to the contrary.  But the fact is this whole issue is not about aggression anyway so the point you are trying to make is moot and has NOTHING to do with this issue.  You can pretend there is no such thing as the public area but it is you who is denial.  Saying there is no such thing is idiocy personified as it is a simple denial of reality. It is you who is detached from the real world and as you pretend you have a principled position you are doing nothing but sucking the cock of bigotry.   I have signed no contract and until I do I am not responsible to do anything and until a bigot does so they are not either. The act of choosing to spend my money is not the same thing as having a public business license no matter how hard you pretend it is otherwise. Your argument is the picture of painfully stupid nonsense and that is why it has already failed and has lost in the court of public opinion and law.  You have nothing to stand on and as is right you and the bigots have no option to cry as people shake their heads at what losers you are.   As you make false statements over and over it shows you are out of touch with reality and why you hold the simple minded views you do, Good luck defending bigots, you have an uphill climb that has no top and your arguments lie on the trash heap of history you are just too stupid to know it.
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  19708. Austrian Markets They have a choice, play ball or do something else.  Play ball or move some where bigotry is supported by law. No one makes them sign a contract or sell goods to the public.  Just like Mennonites should not apply to drive a bus these clowns should not open a store.  They have all the choices in the world and that they do not like them is too fucking bad.   To say this is slavery is idiocy personified as these are the fucktards who fought to preserve slavery. You have the right to choose who you associate with in your private life but if you choose to operate a pubic business then you do not get to pick who you serve it is that simple.   I do not expect a bigot to let someone they loathe into their home but the moment they open a B&B then they give up the right to deny access.  You may not like this but your defense of bigots has no value and you have yet to show it does.    Your defense of bigots may seem like it is moral to you but it is not.   I will fight for your right to be a bigot, a moron or a fool.  I will fight just as hard to ensure your idiot spin is not supported by law or public policy.   Be a bigot in your own home, among your friends,  in your church but the moment you what access to the public market leave it at home or find other work.   Your slavery spin is a hundred shades of fail. Slaves were trapped and had no choices, they could not leave and they could not quit there is nothing of slavery in this policy unless someone forces them to open a store.  Your spin is as weak as ever and that is why it lies dead on the trash heap of history even as we speak.   
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  19710. Austrian Markets Slavery was an abomination because the fact the individuals enslaved had no choices at all.  It was that they were branded as lessor by law and their position had nothing to do with any decision but an accident of birth.  It is abhorrent because it takes away all freedom and is not simply the application of a law that protects a minority from abuse by the same mindset that thinks whites only restaurants make sense. There is grave injustice in our system, a legacy of the times you would support with your policy.  I do not advocate for the failures in our system but do not attack the rare examples of when they got it right either.  People are free to be racists and earn a living and there is no law in any free country that stops them from doing so.  Pretending because the law I advocate for does not stamp out racism it is useless is nonsense. It does not protect racists it simply stops them from creating enclaves of bigots where minorities can not access basic services. The bigotry that still exists in our society is attached to throwbacks lost in the past that have not caught up to the modern world where open being a racist ass hat is no longer acceptable to most. Even in the communities that have the highest numbers of racists have seen their numbers and power decline from the days your rule would harken to.  We have no solved the problems with race but going back to the rules when they were racists were prominent has no value. Racists will continue to decline in influence and power as long as we do not empower  their exclusionary nature by law like we once did.  We are not supporting them with this policy and the fact they are far fewer in number today is a legacy of rules just like the one that is currently law.  Your false assertion that rules like this support bigots is 100% wrong.  They are in place to ensure equal access to goods and services for all americans, not to punish or reward backwards idiots. 
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  19730. ***** I universally oppose all fundamentalist spin especially as it applies to them pushing it into law or limiting the rights of others. That includes Islam but Christianity or even other atheists are not immune from my disdain either.  I do believe in supporting freedom of religion as it is an innate part of honest secularism that values personal freedom. To allow the curtailing of choice empowers fundamentalists to limit anyone's religious rights to promote their own.  I see that the firewall between faith and law has to be maintained at all costs. I am not a proponent of banning any faith just their ability to shove it down others throats.   I see secularism as the tool that tamed the barbarity of Christianity and it can and does do it with all faiths where the people are free to do what they want.  There will always be a group of the faithful (the fundamentalists) among them who are authoritative and desire to shove their nonsense down everyone's throat. These people have to be universally opposed as they would deny others freedom based on a gut feeling. That being said banning them is not the answer as we are already winning everywhere the law of the land is secular.  Backing the banning of a faith or lack there of is an anti-freedom policy and amounts to admission of or fear of defeat for your personal view point in a conflict.  This is why places like Saudi Arabia ban and punish atheists. They are concerned if they do not the idea will spread and become popular undermining their power.  I am not sure trump is a racist or sexist but his spin uses dog whistles that appeals to both those groups. He is so disingenuous I am not convinced that these are his views. He may be just driving those narratives to appeal to specific voting blocks as a marketing focus. But in many cases these are not his views is a distinction that does not amount to a difference as members of both groups flock to his banner.   Bernie is not a "commie" and any spin painting him as such is a fact free statement on how far the overton window has shifted in the political discourse in the US.  On the first world stage most of his positions are pretty moderate outside his treatment of the big banks. Even then his views are rational because if they were too big to fail at the crash and are bigger now breaking them up is a wise step and is not remotely communist. The Bernie protesters violence pales in relation to that of Trump supporters.  The raw numbers of arrests tell the true story and I would question the sources that are selling you the line Bernie's supporters are as remotely dangerous as those of Trump's to date. TYT's wears their "bias"on their sleeve and does not hide it or pretend to hold "neutral" views. They openly state it up front and if you are surprised then I would put it to you that you are not paying attention. What I do not see from them is dishonesty. I understand that many of their detractors do not agree with what they say. On total it is those people who I see consistently misrepresenting them without any remorse while saying TYT lies with nothing to back it up. I find most of the "secular criticism" of TYT a mask for other things they actually dislike about what the show says that has nothing to do with secularism and regularly hides right wing ideals attached to some "anti" movement. I rarely see someone coming forward with an honest complaint and have seen the attacks hidden behind any number of poorly thought out tropes that are destroyed with a google search or a demand for a citation. These complaints often hide actually regressive views they do not bother bring up but are the real reason for their disdain for the show. When you dig into it the policy demands of the people who consistently use the term regressive (improperly I might add) it is pretty ironic.
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  19821. phantomcreamer Your spin is bullshit,  he is not invalidated by those stats.  The fact is any country that is run by their religious majorities law has real problems.  No country running under a version of christian sharia law that many clamor for would be better.  His points have nothing to do with promoting Islam and you really need to watch again if that is what you think.   He has a nuanced position and I know that is confusing for some.  Your assertion you would "NEVER see a population of Jews swelling in a majority Muslim country" is betrayed by history.  At one point Islam was much more open to living beside other faiths than Christianity was.  The only thing holding our radical right in check is the rule of law and the fact they are basically comfortable and have plenty to lose. The absolute hatred displayed and emergence of radical militant Islam over the last 60 years is attached to the policy that dropped Israel into the heart of Palestine and systematically meddled in middle east governments on behalf of oil companies.  The idea that Muslims are innately any more intolerant than Christians who have committed several mass genocides is not well founded.   I like Kyle find all religions a mess, Islam, Christianity, Judaism are different branches of the same homophobic genocide inspiring tree. The are all equally fact free and given a chance will attempt to take over and push their xenophobic bullshit into law that applies to everyone.  They are all the same flavor of fail and pointing out one set of radical as a worse cancer than the others is does nothing but empower the ones you ignore.  Attack all fundamentalists and you will be consistent, attack one group and you do the work of the others you ignore for them.  
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  19834. Melissa Vasquez Ya, a monopoly in the service of the population first.  It is a monopoly on behalf of the citizens  and the people are supposed to have a voice in it's use and control.  You are dead wrong about Monopolies only forming under government.   In parts of the world with no govermernt oversight numerous interests have taken control of entire market either locally or less often globally.  De Beers has done this for one market, diamonds.   They are not allowed to operate directly in the US because they are considered to have a monopoly.   De Beers owns approximately 80 percent of the world's diamond market and therefore virtually controls supply and demand of the gemstone.   Monopolies can exist outside a distinct goverment structure, in fact they can span the globe. Government corruption is our problem but my solution is to root out the corruption by taking away the right of anyone to legally buy our leaders.  Remove big business's hand from the tiller and we can achieve those results.   Right now our federal goverment is for sale to the highest bidder.  The leadership on both sides of the Isle is beholden to it's donors not it's voters.  Your solution to throw out the baby with the bath water does not strike me as valid or anything but a short term fix because it does not address the problem.  The root of our problem is that our system is being legally manipulated by the corrupting forces.  Take away business's ability to do it legally, fund our elections with public money so they become about ideas not how much you spend and we would see our elected officials work for us again saving our nation uncounted billions.
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  19910. Rahel Erki I am not a supporter of any faith and the more fundamentalist you are the more I disagree with you.  Any of the Abrahamic faiths when taken with fundamentalism are scourge that should never be allowed to have political power or control over others. That being said if one faith, in this case the Christians can attack and ban another then they are free to attack anyone who disagrees with them and do the same thing.  One has to stand up for freedom of religon if you want to maintain your own faith or lack there of. People like this woman solve nothing.  She is not part of any solution and is solely an agitator who has found fertile ground in the hate of a group who is different than the average American.   Conflating the worst elements of any faith with those who are simply objectionable is a fail.  That being said this woman paints a whole group of people with one brush.  We should have zero fear of sharia here our constitution protects us from it.  It also thankfully protects us from the Christians or they would have us live in their brand of technocracy too with a christian version of sharia law.  Everyone one of these fundamentalists want to see their views pushed into law.  The difference is we had founding fathers who built in protections for us. Christians effect us much more than Muslims in this country.  They have significant political power and attempt to ply their views into law all the time.  It is not only logical but prudent that we focus on Christians more as they have much more opportunity to push their will into our lives. 
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  19913. Rahel Erki What it is based on in your mind is meaningless as the people who twist it do not care for your definition. You do not think there are extremist Christians?  We have the anti abortion crowd, we have the KKK and the sovereign citizens movements. Not every Muslim is a jihadist and many honestly see their religion as one of peace and live accordingly.  I think it is all nonsense but I have seen extremists of all brands take their religion and twist it to controlling and harming others.  This is not ta new thing but it does not paint everyone else who happens to share the faith but does not agree with the extremist views with the same brush.   It does not matter what any wing nut theist thinks is justified as they all have bat shit crazy views. There are Christians in the US openly calling for the execution of gay people. As long as they are not acting on those calls they are just another hateful moron and I do not see their views as reflecting on the whole. I know some Muslims too,  none of them would advocate for chopping off a hand or a head as valid punishment.  The more fundamentalist any of these abahamics are the more sickening their spin is until they cross a line and hurt people or demand power to enact their law over everyone.   This does not mean they are all the same kind of cancer as the murder's among their ranks.  No faith should be given absolute political power to shove it down another's throat.  That power was ripped away from Christians a long time ago and it just has not happened in Muslim countries yet.  Bombing them will not drive them away from Islamic radicals but closer to to them.
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  19927. VolodyA! V Anarhist I could tell by your use of the phrase "monopoly on force" it is a buzz phrase everyone of the anti tax crowd uses.  It is a sold tell to what you think. That a system is flawed is no reason to throw it away.  There is zero reason the existing structure can not be set not to "redistribute wealth" to anyone but to do what societies have been doing forever with taxes that is to spend it on common works that benefit the everyone while opening the doors to new opportunities. I do not agree that it has to create two classes of people because the ones with power are an extension of the main group.  They are delegates and hold power at the whim of the people.  That is a lot better than what would occur with no control at all.  It stops the collection and exercise of this kind of power by individual interests who would use it to dominate those with none.   Your model is simplistic and does not speak to what we would have in the absence of that organization.  I think the common term is anarchy, that is a tough sell as it only empowers the strong and the violent. I believe in real world concepts that have at least a marginal track record at worst.  1000 individual state and local armies would be a never ending blood bath akin to the one that plagued feudal Europe.  Power loves a vacuum so we give the government the monopoly on force or we will see it divided by a whole lot of unregulated militias like the ones you were talking about.  I will take the former choice.
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  19929. VolodyA! V Anarhist That police forces enjoy special status goes along with what their roll is.  Without special protections and special privileges they would not be able to do their job.  That we accord them any different treatment may be questionable if taken out of context of their jobs but does make sense in context of what we ask them to do as a society.   Their word should be special even if in actually some individuals abuse that trust.  We need to see an attack on the police as heinous because to attack them means anyone is fair game for you as they are our representatives.  That we have issues with individuals over stepping the line is unquestionable.  These issues are partially  mitigated by ensuring these representitives wear a camara at all times .  In the constituencies this small change is in place police complaints fall dramatically.   That people are flawed does not mean the system is unworkable just that we need to keep on top of it and continue innovating.  So I not anti thank you for forcing me to defend the police force, damn you.  I have not seen any trolls that talk about a need for well focused change over throwing out our system to be replaced with some nebulous poorly defined alternative. The well being of the police is not above any standard citizen.  That we give them special powers and status is to aid them in doing their job serving the public.  That some go off the rails and abuse that power does not mean it is misplaced in it's entirety.  We need to look at ways of ensuring our servants in the police force are accoutable and deserving of the trust we invest in them.  It does not mean the institution is beyond repair.
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  19950. formsMostBeautiful If you look at the reason codes for the numbers you have supplied the denials are attached to  supported features of medicare. They are rejected for payment by medicare but it does not mean they are not covered by private plans.  Because medicare is a hybrid that often has two types of carriers it is expected components submitted will be rejected by medicare for payment primarily because part of the procedure was covered. The reason we have so many denials in medicare is it is a hybrid system that includes both public and private coverage. The extremely low claim denial is fiction. If only 10% were denies that literally means hundreds of millions of dollars in the pockets. Recidivism is a insurance company procedure that goes through and looks for ways to deny coverage based on legal technicalities that are built into the policy on purpose to increase profit.  If you can show the same kind of process in medicare I challenge you do so. Back my main point.  Medicare denies more coverage because of the nature of our system where we insist on cutting insurance companies into the action even as they offer zero value while actually increasing medical costs  If we had single payer system that covered everything like every other developed nation then there would be no need to deny vital care for anyone.   Right now there is one group who stands between you and treatment and it is the insurance companies who will deny you coverage you reasonably expect to be covered for if they have the slightest reason to as an operating principle.
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  20014. Michael Robertson It is conservative policy of out sourcing and devaluation of labor that is driving wages down not "third worlders".  It is a policy of attacking labor unions and setting tax policy that helps the rich and does nothing for the middle class.  The poor are getting more numerous not because of all the people with brown skin but because of a small cadre of rich clowns who have vacuumed up all grown for the last 30 years. They Saudi's have nothing to recommend them.  They are mono resource supplier who would be a empty desert without our money buying a resource they happen to sit on. Anyone can be successful when sitting on barrels of unlimited money and nothing about their economic or social policy is laudable. Anyone can be successful when all you have to do is haul oil out of the ground.   You can emigrate to Japan or S Korea and people do.  The idea these places have their borders closed is nonsense not attached to reality.  They are changing like everyone does with outside influence and that you pretend they do not is just an example of  you closing your eyes to reality you do not like. They have hung onto mono culture elements but even they have changed and are changing all be it more slowly.   Every mono culture society that is doing reasonably well only does so as a satellite to the west where we have embraced immigration.   The few  mono examples that thrive do so because they take advantage of our booming and growing societies especially the US that is at the root multi cultural.  
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  20015. Michael Robertson It is the fact we get payed less and our wages have not kept up with the cost of living that is the problem.  The powers that be represented by your conservative hero's have been systematically attacking all blue collar jobs for the last 30 years and it is this attack (nothing to do with immigrants) that is the issue.  It is the policy of the people who are buying our leaders that is the problem not the poor people at the bottom of the ladder that have ALWAYS been there.  In the past our poor have always bee immigrants and at one time were Irish and Italian.  They had the same kind of problems that plague modern marginalized new communities.  This was in an era when the american dream was still alive and you did not need a duel income for families to get ahead yet we still had crime and poverty issues inside their distinct groups.  That changed as their children and grandchildren assimilated.  As the old school died off attachments to the old country and culture disappeared these people became like every other long standing american. Blaming our economic woes or the decline of the middle class on immigration is nonsense when it is very clear what the problems is and who is benefiting from it.  To ignore the rich and blame the powerless may seem sharp to you but is silly if you look at the numbers.   I said they are changing I did not say they have changed.  That 2% is up and the fact is they would be nothing without us so pointing at them as a model is not compelling.  They have a very focused immigration policy but that is changing over time and will continue to as we go forward.  That you imagine these places are going to get more insular is not well founded because that is not where the trend is going.   Many of the ex pats living in Japan have married someone with Japanese citizenship and that is a trend that will continue to grow and will see them become more diverse over time. The fact is North america is a continent of immigrants a lot of them starting off very poor. That has been a strength for us as we have drawn the most ambitious, most driven to succeed from across the planet and have reaped the rewards from that focus.  The idea we should be picking a single race to draw from is idiocy personified.   Your bullshit fear mongering about immigrants is as old as time.  We know how this turns out, what happens is second and certainly third generation immigrants become pretty much indistinguishable from locals in spite skin color.  They are educated in our schools, consume our culture and become one of us. The idea they are always apart is only true in your mind because of your focused bigotry that can not get past any superficial and basic cultural difference.   
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  20017. Michael Robertson Here in the US or in Canada are good examples. There are fully integrated communities in these where the members are fully integrated and their grand children will be even more so. That you do not know of this community is not surprising but does not validate you.  Muslims have been in america since the founding hold jobs in every field at every level of education.   Just open your fucking eyes and your bullshit spin falls apart.   The proof is in the fact there are millions of expats among even in the most mono culture counties in the first world.  It was not long ago those numbers were a fraction of what they are now.  With the declining local population these countries will have no choice but to embrace immigration in the next 20 to 30 years to keep their labor force intact.  It is not a matter of if but when and no amount of myopic denial changes that.  Everyone is like everyone else with minor cultural differences that become irrelevant over a couple generations as history has repeatedly shown.  Education, opportunity and access to the larger world is a great equalizer and no race has a monopoly on success all factors equal.  Racist logic = that is the way it was so that is only way it can be.  Your simplistic myopic spin sits on the trash heap of history for a reason. Being a xenophobe has not served humanity except as a tool of division for centuries.  I call bigots bigots when they earn it with idiot spin. The evidence has never backed you.  You are not acting on evidence but instead base your spin on a lizard brain reaction exacerbated by your ignorance.  It is a fact that the countries who are the most diverse also happen to be among the best most desirable places on the planet to live, that is no coincidence.  
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  20018. Michael Robertson 99.6 is a bullshit number that is only going down not up.  The Japanese population census asks the people's nationality not their ethnic background. It is common for people to mistake nationality for ethnicity and conclude that Japan is largely ethnically homogenous. It would be more accurate to state that the population is "multi-ethnic," although the percentage of ethnic minorities is small compared with the numbers in the UK, the USA, and Canada. They are changing and they are more diverse than they were even two decades ago.   They are not becoming more insular they becoming less so and that trend will continue.   In the long run they will have no choice their birth rates can not sustain their civilization eternally.  I have no doubt they are xenophobic but the fact is I do not see them as the model for anything.  Their culture is slowly imploding in on itself with declining birth rates and a trends that are unhealthy for the long term survival of any society.  They will change or fade in this new modern world, the status quo will not eternally serve them. You have not produced evidence you have given me spin that is better explained in other ways or mitigated by context. That there are xenophobes does not mean they have it right or are on a healthy path that serves them or their country. Racism sits on the back of ignorance and always has. Trying to pretend you are high minded and that I hold the simpleton position is weak shit that has no merit.  The most uneducated insular and backward people universally agree with you and the educated, experienced and well traveled disagree.  I will take the later group and leave you to look backwards as the world marches on without you. Stop using numbers like 99.9% they make you look stupid.  Let go of the bullshit straw man about liberal guilt as I really have NOTHING to feel guilty about while you actually do. That you do not feel guilty for being a hate laden ass hat is your failure and that you imagine I ashamed of your actions is just you projecting your burden onto me.   I have said this before and will say it again, the genie is not going back in the bottle and being a racist useless except as a crutch to boost your own failing self esteem.  Whine and cry as we are never going back to the bullshit you push the world is too small and your spin can not be reconciled in the long term in a modern world.  We have nothing to learn from xenophobes while they do have a great deal to learn from us.  
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  20038. Alex K. 1) NONENSE, you are pulling those numbers out of your ass and there is no reason we have to repair every single thing in a year or that it has to do anything to our debt if properly funded. 2) We should want government to create work for things the country needs. There are lots of tasks where public efforts are not only cheaper but also offer greater benefit to the tax payers by removing a profit motive from the process and putting more money in working peoples hands. 3) We already have giant economy and what we need to do is see the wealth from it more evenly distributed to the population. We do not have a grow exponentially to simulate it if we transfer more money to those who work for a living when they spend almost all of it locally. Jobs are created by demand not tax cuts for the wealthy. If you want demand put more money in the hands of those who work not less. These are concepts completely ignore by people with your failed spin and your desire to serve the rich marks you as a shill or someone who works against their own interest to serve them .. neither is shiny. The actual reason we suffer is we have transferred massive amounts of wealth that once sat in the hands of the middle class to those at the very top who have been driving the process. Bad trade policy, low min wage and the fact our leaders work for them not us is the root of this. Those who's ideas you champion have corrupted our system by buying our leaders and putting policy in place that serves them over the people. Nothing you say is attached to reality and the fact is people with your spin have been running the show and giving away our legacy to their corporate funders as the middle class disappears.
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  20041. Alex K. You have no clue what you are talking about. Our medical knowledge has never been better and your life expectancy is the highest it has ever been in our history. There are severe issues with drug and insurance lobbiests buying our leaders and messing with the system but these problems are mitigated in places that do not allow them to do that. The vast majority of Americans pay for health care through for profit insurance to private for profit hospitals. Our issue is directly attached to the "free market nature"of the payer in our system and the for profit model that other first world nations do not use while getting better results. Our prices are high not because of the government but because of the for profit insurance companies involvement. Our system has been sold out to the insurance lobby who bought it long ago. This is why our system is double the cost of most other first world analogues who are all rated better with no need for for profit insurance and hospitals in it. Pretending it is the government that is the problem while ignoring where the corruption stems from while arguing we should give the lobbyists far more power is a weak shill argument that has zero merit. The giant companies are a product of the free market not central planning as you ignorantly assert. The best systems in the world are publicly funded universal systems and this flies in the face your anti centralized planning spin. I should not be surprised everything you say is ass backward, the more you talk the more detached from reality it seems you are.
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  20042. Alex K. Nonsense, one can win a competition and in a open free market the largest and most well funded can crush it's opponents and will. If you get "too big" you buy your competition until there is none. There is no reason to expect that the system you suggest would not result in absolute monopolies and fiscal fiefdoms in the regions they serve removing any choice from consumers. Our government is servicing the banks because of the fact they buy our leaders. This is endemic to the problem and the root is that we allow them to legally do so. The problem is not that we have a government, it is that we allow it to be bought with no legal ramifications. Stop the flow of money from the banks and all corrupters into the pockets and campaigns of our leaders and many of the corruption problems endemic in our system go away as the leaders will then serve the voters who put them in and not the highest bidder. Your claims on why companies get big are fact free. They get big because they reach an economy of scale that allows them to produce or provide products cheaper and more efficiently than their competitors. They do not get big because of government regulation as you assert. Small places can not compete with larger ones not because of regulation but because they can not provide the service of the same quality at the same price as those who succeed. They may not have enough exposure or too little money to properly advertise. Very rarely is it legislation that stops a small player from competing and this is a fallacy you can not back up. The idea that big companies would become small no regulations is not attached to reality. Where do you expect the massive resources they have to go? Why do you think a place like Walmart gets small the moment they have no regulations? This is more empty nonsense on its face. The base problem is greed of those who would corrupt any system to make a little more. This problem is not resolved by your solution and the only difference is you want to give the keys to the hen house to the fox expecting all the problems with missing chickens will then just go away.
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  20044. Alex K. Nonsense, nonsense, nonsense. The reason our manufacturing is gone is because the tax rules and agreements that our government was paid to make empowered it not because it was too expensive. It meant the owners could make a little more but it was never about viability of the business. It was about an opportunity to put more money in their hands at the cost of the people at large. It is cheaper to produce in countries that employ slave labor and no environmental protections, that does not mean we should strive to become more like them. We are not broke and you really need to stop pretending we are. There data is not on your side and spitting fact free talking points from the elements that are actively working to corrupt out system will never be compelling. Business has bought our system and wrote trade agreements that allow them to make a few points more regardless of what it does to our country. We have never had a more business friendly system in the last 60 years and pretending it is hostility that drives them away when they literally own our leaders is a joke. You have a third option that you do not put on the table, empower those who stay and make it worth their while. Make it more expensive for companies to move their production out. Change the legislation and trade policy and the move is taken off the table as a viable choice. There are plenty of business that have not left and most of that have were not going to die if they did not relocate especially if their competition was in the same boat.
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  20242. N Plutonium For example?  Where are your examples of conservative places doing better?  I can name plenty that are far worse and being more conservative is directly attached to being less free.  The poorest have not states that take more federal money than they put in universally vote GOP.  I challenged you to list the examples of your conservative success stories because there are none that would not be served by being more liberal from the perspective of their people.    Please list the negatives you speak of because on the metrics that matter they are kicking our ass up and down the street.  Why would you say we should not provide higher education if they have the aptitude. You have to understand that Conservatives just like you made the same argument about public education in general don't you?  You going to have to do better than advocate for stasis even as we are being left behind on the world stage when it comes to post secondary education.  You and those like you are asking us to compete with others that do better with one arm behind our back out of some poorly focused desire t maintain the status quo.   The 1% is a real thing, half the political money donated in this cycle will come from 50 donors.  All of the recovery since the crash has been scooped up by a tiny group at the top who have never made more.   Pretending they do not exist and do not buy our system is myopic and blind no matter what side of the political fence you sit on  They are paying historically low taxes while never making more so spare me the platitudes or defense of their actions.  Health care, education, infrastructure are not "handouts", tax cuts for billionaires and multinationals are.  The rest of the free world is offering these same things and that you imagine we can not or worse should is poor focus.  The argument we should be more like a 3rd world nation will take more than just claim to sell. Our health care rates 37th and costs us twice as much .. that is not advanced and when you advocate for something you should have a clue what you are talking about. In the US health care costs are the leading cause for bankruptcies and 36000 or more die a year because they can not get the care they need. Selling our system as "advanced" is weak as many do a better job for far less while caring for their entire population.  You are either a shill or are ignorant as you share the spin we are remotely better in this field.
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  20251. moromillas I used to be exactly like you, I held your beliefs when I did not have fact free ass hats on the internet giving them to me.  You do have a place in society and if not it is time to move because your perception is skewed by your surroundings or what you immerse yourself in.  You get attacked for saying objectionable things, as is correct. You can expect that to be the case as long as you do.  You have freedom of speech to say whatever you want to, as you do know that others have the same right to critique what you say.   The "many" man haters who think you should not be alive are fringe dwelling morons and represent a tiny vocal minority and not the whole group.  They need to be opposed every time they rear their idiot heads but not by taking the opposite stance.  Feminism IS about equality and it appears you have been in the wilderness dealing with the ugliest of the fringe.  That can twist your perception, as it turns out your perspective is off kilter with reality.  Woman should be able to get jobs when once that was not an option.  Woman should be able to walk around freely and be treated fairly.  I can not imagine how anyone can argue against that progress. I have no idea where you went after through the next part because nothing you shared countered that the movement was about equality.  Explain how it is not about equity if you have the words for that instead of telling me to shove anything "up my ass". You are in denial and that you can not see that the changes that have occurred since the movement began are on the balance positive means you are myopic on this issue.  Is the process over?  Has equality been achieved? I would argue no for both sexes.  Many of the most onerous laws still in play that unfairly affect men are products of an era before feminism and need to be addressed as well.  We still have gender issues in our society that need to be corrected, none of them will get fixed unless we can all agree equity should be the final goal.  There are those on the fringe on both ends that will try to co opt this movement for their own ends, that does not demonize the effort of those who strive for positive change. 
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  20252. moromillas Your assertions about me are weak as your ability to reason apparently.  Institutional prejudice does dissipate with education and exposure and time, the justice system lags behind the social movements progress consistently. This is shown time and again.  The fact is we are moving in the right direction and where we were was never ideal and wishing for it back is a fail. The disparity of jobs and income is not a male female issue and should be the concern of every single family that is effected.  The talking points attacking wage equity is are directly from the chamber of commerce and they are indefensible garbage.   The disparity in the justice system needs work but there is no time you can point to that was more equitable. Woman do have jobs and income and that is a big step from where they came from.  To assert that the gender gap of 40 years ago is gone is nonsense.  There are any number of gender issues that still belong on the table.  That the justice system still gives them special treatment in both criminal and family law is not because of the efforts of feminism but because of the traditional roles that woman once held.  They are carry over from a different time when woman were not considered violent and they were almost always the family care givers. The idea it was the fight for equality that created these imbalance is nonsense.  You are full of shit as you assert that the radical man haters are the cornerstone of feminism.  They are the fringe for a reason, very few agree with their twisted spin.  I know what they think and I am the first one to call them out on anything that randomly demonizes men.  That you want to paint all Feminists with that brush is like calling all Christians KKK members.
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  20269. Dietrich Lehleitner Barely different and the results and policies that flow from your rhetoric are nearly identical.  Many of your associates who share the exact same spin as you do are not differentiating it at all.   I openly and regularly oppose all fundamentalists as possessing the very flaw you point out.  I disagree with nearly everything they stand for and consider them diametrically opposite to me in focus and a respect for individual freedom.  This includes Muslim fundamentalists.  That being said I do not equate authoritarian regressive fundamentalist Christians with abortion bombers just as I do not paint all Muslims as rapists either.  I can disagree with their goals and what they believe in without misrepresenting them as a group.  The idea that multiculturalism is a problem is one held by a specific mindset that is at best xenophobic at worst driven by fear based racist garbage.  The idea we all going to live in our own tribal bubbles is a thing of the past the genie those like you want to go back into the bottle is never going to again.  You would attack the other as a matter of course and your kind exists in every society and is nothing but an expression of ignorance that breeds unwarranted fear.   Rome did not die because of multiculturalism and their chief power and reason they held their great society together so long was they openly adopted it.  They took the best ideas from many places and made them roman and this concept made them both strong and successful for a long time.  The trope they fell apart do to this influence is basically fact free nonsense dreamed up by people who wanted to validate the spin you share.  History does not back you up and if we were to look at the history of immigration it is one of assimilation into the population as a rule.   You look at the Muslims and expect them to sweep over free societies because they "let" them exist.  When the fact is a group like that will never gain control truly multicultural region because they have no purview to. The places that these kind of regimes rise in tend to be much more mono cultural than the west is. Isolation and ignorance goes hand and hand with religiosity and breeds this tribal spin. Those who are worldly or actually have real contact with with said multi cultural societies do not see it as you do. I am big enough to not call for the restriction of those I oppose as my arguments and positions are strong on their own without silencing them.  My position gains strength in the west because it works and it is inevitable.  It is groups like yours and that of ISIS who focus on uniformity that are failing.  
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  20294. Enemy Sub You do lump them together, I said you may not have the same motivation as the assholes who share your spin and use it to justify burning down mosques but your generalization is what I have objected to since the very beginning of the conversation. Framing them as Muslim or that any other Muslim is as concern because of their actions is as valid as raising concerns about Christians because of the actions of an abortion bomber.  We all know that to do so would be counter productive and a failed strategy.  It seems you do not understand this fact when it comes to Muslims.  I did not edit out the question mark .. the statement even if asked as a question is still meant to paint Muslims as dangerous by association alone.  It is like asking do the actions of abortion bombers incite other Christians to commit wanton acts of murder? This falsely paints the image of all Christians being suspect when we know that spin is not only useless but fact free and not representative of the whole group.  You could ask the same stupid question of any extremist to paint a group he is tangentially attached to as potentially dangerous. This is exactly what you are doing here to no ones benefit.    You are spreading the kind of nonsense spin picked up by half wits who attack anyone with a turban on as being Muslim. You do not overtly tell them to do so but your brand of spin is used to justify it  by the simple.  You do this to pretend to be above the fray while spreading counter productive spin that does not help anyone.  
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  20297. Enemy Sub They are not the same thing, one is an act of overt omission that tacitly asserts some form of obfuscation and the other is not because it makes no difference to my point.   In my case it is the latter and you have not shown I have changed the meaning of what you said by not including it,.  You are full of shit in saying i misrepresented you by not including a set of punctuation and I have explained why this was the case while you have simply ignored it.   You are the dishonest one in continuing this nonsense claim after I explained myself.   BULLSHIT on the text thing.,  Christianity has  been just as violent, just as dangerous, just as repressive as Islam is today the key difference is secularism has pulled its teeth and broke its ability to force its rank barbarity down our throats.  In the places secularism still has no hold Christianity is regularly as barbarous and backwards as Islam is.  Giving bible any credit for the moderate Christians today ignores it's history and that the litteralists share many ideals with Islam even today and would be just as bad if given power. There are prosperity gospel Christians who literally ignore the written word of the bible decrying wealth to promote nonsense spin that makes the mega church pastors rich by them promising wealth for worship and financial support,  This is directly counter to the teachings of the new testament but it does not make the group and less popular or real. The written text has little to do with how backwards and monstrous the religion is and the new testament was around for a long time while Christianity was no better than Islam is today before secularism pulled its teeth.  The same process happens to Muslims in the first world and there are plenty that are as moderate as any christian because they are free to be.
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  20310. Seth N Uganda a christian country in 2014 passed a law with american evangelical support that made being gay punishable with a death sentence. Their law also treats male and female infidelity completely differently making cheating a crime for woman. Saying christianity does not do these things when a short time ago all christian countries did and some still do is pretty myopic. As to your second post, they are a problem because we still have them trying to pass idiot laws and replace our secular constation with nonsense. We are protected from them but if we are insulated from their madness any fear of sharia law is a joke. The fact is none of these fact free clowns has the power to make law here so the anti sharia spin is just fodder for t he ignorant and bigots. The real problem is not muslims but fundamentalists in general and religious law as a whole. All fundamentalists have values that counter our modern democracy. None of them value individual freedom or the rights of minorities or any others not like them. They are all innately anti western but that is no reason to ban them as they have no chance of winning this war. If we want to deal with the rise of islam we first need to stop arming and supplying religious fanatics and dictators to get resources. We need to stop bombing people a world away and destabilizing the entire region to enrich some assholes and empower warlords. We need to promote secularism and freedom in those regions not religious dictators. The laws against attacking immigrants for being immigrants in europe are based on some really bad historical events you may or may not have read about. That being said I am a free speech absolutist and think no matter how heinous what you say and think is or how wrong you are you should have the right to say it. I personally do not think they are going the right way on banning speech. As far as I know they are not stopping you from saying someone who committed a crime is muslim, the law is focused on the demagogues who pain the whole religion for the actions of an individual. The fact is it is no more valid to attack all muslims for a given rape than it is cool to attack all christians for an abortion bombing. I am not sure how the cops fingering all muslims in the press would help anyway. The number of crimes in europe has not gone up by more than the corresponding population growth. This crime explosion the right goes on about is fiction. We have successfully dragged chrsitianty kicking and screaming out of barbarism and we can do so with Isam as well with the power of secularism. That does not mean all the crazies go away but we can push them back into the corner where they belong and have no power. This does mean we have to deal with is the periodic abortion bombings or night club shootings driven by faith but that is what law enforcement is for.
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  20323. kommisar It is not an act of coercion it is a n act grave indifference to their life, it is not coercive at all and simply you dismiss that person right to live and take it from them. You can can commit murder through your own actions or through an act of inaction to save them why you have the power to. You are guilty of murder of the second type or at best are guilty of being an accessory though inaction. You let them die to save some property and your are far worse than the person who "steals" from you because you step over bodies as you walk through life. The fact is your bullshit spin is hyperbolic emotional bullshit and that is why you use it. It is not "literally stealing" to contributed to the common good. Call it theft if you want to but it is empty bullshit meant to pull at the heart strings of a specific mindset and by the contemporary meaning of the world does not apply. You have options, you can leave and live somewhere else. Health care is oxygen and we will all need it someday. "Not wanting insurance" is a path to certain death or bankruptcy and the ONLY way you avoid one of those fates is to die suddenly. No one sane opts out of health care and that you would deliver it on the basis of how much money is in your wallet ensures children through no fault of their own will die because of your bizarre demand to fly with no health care as freedom. You are arguing to pay double what the rest of the first world pays while letting children die without care and it is empty bullshit. You are killing them through your inaction and in defense of greed and a unwillingness to demand we enrich the vampires in the insurance companies simply so you can opt out. The only ones doing so are those who do can not afford it and your spin is empty sophistry. Of insurance companies choose if you live or die at the point you are ill and need to rely on them paying out. They fight to exclude paying because of "preexisting conditions" or cut you off when you hit your life time cap. They actually had whole departments focused on getting out of their contracts through loop holes to make another buck and were signing the bankruptcy or death warrens of 10 of thousands of american citizens all of whom were paying for insurance. The death panels are the groups who decide to exclude your care for cancer because you had acne when you were child, the murder people to pump up the bottom line and you ignoring that marks you are immoral.
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  20326. kommisar It is not a false dichotomy on my part because I am comparing it to what we have today. There is no meaningful or complete proposal even on the table, forget about a working example from your side of the debate. There is no reason to believe in a captive market like health care the insurers will continue to be incentivized to do anything but continue to maximize their profits. The free market is not a magic bullet and does particularly badly in delivering critical services like health care that are needed by both those who have money and those who do not. It is not a commodity whose need is not driven by desire but it is consistently demanded by necessity as a matter of life or death. There has to be some part of you that understands making money is not a good incentive if your service is to provide critical health care and you make more by finding reasons and setting up loop holes in the policy to deny coverage. The choice to pay others health care or not is meaningless if my system is too expensive for a calculated segment of the market to ever join. The system you describe leaves behind the most vulnerable, the very young and the very old to include a profit motive that does nothing but add to the cost of the product while offering no value. The issue of force as you libertarians describe it is meaningless as Americans die or are bankrupted every day for lack of care and I pay double what everyone else who has a public system does. I see no reason and have no examples to point as that makes me believe your imagined/imaginary system would do any better than ours. It is easy spot key areas where it would be worse. Sorry about messing up and pasting my own name in somehow on the last post, it has been corrected. Thanks.
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  20327. kommisar Your opposition is empty as you do not have an actual proposal of your own. Until you have an answer that is something other than a pipe dream and more substantial than vapor your can forgive others overlooking you baseless claims. You can not expect to be taken seriously until your proposal is more than a pipe dream, it should at least be embryonic. The profit motive as a corrupting element is a key issue in our system. Unless you have a proposal to mitigate the negative effects then your system is faulty and doomed to fail from the start. The free market which is great for driving down the cost of manufactured goods does not work that way inside captive markets like health care. The insurance companies do not make money by providing care but by not providing it. Their incentive will always be to pay out as little as possible no matter what the cost to the lives of their customers is. When all the companies do the same thing the idea of choice for the consumer evaporates. The argument completion will solve the problem is this case is not based on anything but hopeful fantasy. There is no reason to expect prices will fall and we can expect them to rise to a point a certain percentage of can not afford it then to hold as high as they can keep it. There is no incentive to lower costs. Your system has no means of cost control and as it is not concerned with costs because the insurance companies simply raise the rates as prices increase. Higher prices mean higher rates and more profit. They have no incentive to keep health care costs low and the market will charge what it can bear no less. There are plenty of examples where the free market work well but the idea it is a cure all for every problem is empty poorly thought out nonsense. You make this assertion with basically a religious like credulity and empty assertions of your concepts validity. There is no literally no data to back up your claims. As I explained before it much more expensive here because it is treated like a commodity. Doubling down on a failed strategy expecting better results simply does not make sense. We have them most free market profit driven system in the free world but we also have the most expensive and the only one that does not cover all it's citizens while making health care the single our largest reason for bankruptcy. Your proposal does not reduce costs, we know what does and that you hate the answer does not change it. People go bankrupt and die in our country specifically because of our shitty version of for profit private insurance empowering health care. We already pay massive sums of public money to take care of a segment of our population that insurance companies do not even want to talk to and happily dump onto us. The poor and the old. Insurance companies have socialized the costs of the elderly and poor while scooping up the premiums of the young which if in a public system would mitigate those making the cost of care we already pay for go down. The freedom you fight for is the freedom to be slaves to an insurance company greed which will attempt to deny you care while killing and bankrupting Americans. That would not change under any system you propose and in fact would probably be far worse for most of the old and the poor cut off from aid would not be able to afford coverage at all. You go ahead and fight for your freedom to step over bodies on the streets. I would rather live in a society that cares about its citizens lives and takes that roll seriously. In the end we will win this war of ideas because our policy is based on facts/what works and not just empty rhetoric about force/theoretical pipe dreams.
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  20409. Devin Morales Has it ever occurred to you that we already have a legal system to stamp on illegal behavior and we do not need vigilante volunteers to incite violence and make the situation worse.  The fact is in this country protesting is a protected right and you authoritarians may not like that but it does not change the fact.  Peaceful opposition is the right of every american and the only places that do not allow it are totalitarian hell holes. You need to stop pretending I am supporting anyone committing violence.  I universally condemn it not just when the opposition uses it but when people "on my side" do too.  The fact is the predominance of violence is being perpetrated by trump supporters time and again and not his opposition.  I hear not a peep about that from the likes of you.   You also need to stop pretending you value "public safety" as the path you would take would undeniably ensure there is more violence. The "trump militia" is about silencing decent not about safety or valuing anyone's rights.  It is exactly what Hitlers brown shirts were used for and offers NO value to the democratic process.  Advocating for unregulated untrained vigilantes when we already have a means to control illegal activity is nothing more than a backward slide to what we saw in Nazi Germany and should be correctly opposed.  I believe in the rule of law and not mob rule like you seem to, if protesters are breaking the law we already have a means of dealing with them. When I say the right is "most murderous" I mean they kill the most number of people in defense of their ideology than the radicals on the left do. I say it to your because of your characterization of your opposition as dangerous and that you need protection from them.  The fact is it has been shown time an again trump supporters have been the ones to instigate violence and we have multiple documented cases of them being the root of it simply because a someone chose to protest their fuhrer.  The data is on my side "bozo", you can not counter it and have not even tried.
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  20586. doug c Your assertions about their mental state are not scientific but bigoted. They are a shield you use to hide from the responsibility of your own claims to the problem.  Suicide in this group is driven by marginalization and the fact they do not fit into "traditional' society. This is shown by the fact specific cultures that are more welcoming to trans individuals and do not consider them as having "mental problems" have lower suicide rates.  It is attitudes like yours that are the driving force of the their treatment in "typical society" and how they react to it.  I have given you the numbers of surgeries performed in the US and they do not account for the high suicide rate in the rest of the community.  It is time you take a hard look at the way people like you treat them and how you classify them if you really want to help avoid the deaths you pretend to care about.    You are patently wrong about the surgery being a treatment for mental problems. The surgery is a well considered tightly administered process that gradually allows individuals to transition to the sex they feel they are.  Your spin that it is considered a treatment for "mental condition" is fact free. A small percentage regret the process and sometimes even reverse it but the vast majority report they are happier after.  Your spin would deny them that option and it is a both incorrect and a viscous attack on the solidarity of the entire community.  That you would advocate their right to make that choice be taken away does no one any good and furthers your own social and political outlook while not addressing the root issues facing the community you demonize as having "mental issues". Unless you have something other than the nonsense you have stuck to you are running out of things to say.  That is the problem with not having ideas of your own,  when your talking points are dismantled it leaves you little place to go,
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  20588. doug c The suicide rate for the entire community is astronomical, your painfully myopic attempt to blame that on surgery has already been dismantled before your eyes. The entire group is at a high risk for suicide because people like you describe them as having mental problems and reject who they assert they are.   This is proven by the fact that communities that accept them more readily have the lowest rate of suicide among their trans members. I have already given you the stats backing my assertions on trans members going through the surgery as reporting they are happier after. As usual you choose to ignore anything that does not support your silly narrative.  It is you who backs your idiocy with vapor that ignores the big picture that the entire community including those who never get surgery are at a high risk for suicide.   Actually I do listen to myself it is you who does not pay attention and this is made clear when you do not even try to address my points.  I care about these people it is you who demonizes them and would deny them the right to be who they are to support your own backwards faux moral spin. Your simple minded solution for them to "feel better" is for them to conform to your narrow band of what is acceptable, that is a path that helps you and no one else. It solves absolutely nothing as long as you continue to marginalize who they really are. I am winning and will continue to, as people like you have been on the wrong side of every single rights issue you are here too.  Your views are destined for the trash heap of history where all bigoted ideas eventually go to die.  
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  20652. ファビオ魔王 "Drug trafics"? That is only because of our stupid drug war that is poorly focused and costing us billions. In the same way organized crime did well and was violent in the time of prohibition an unregulated market offering trillions will always be satisfied. Our failed polices are the direct result of anything do to with "drug traffics" and we have better ways of dealing with that issue than demonizing spanish speaking people. If we kept every single one out the drugs would still flow because there is lots of money in it. Your solution is idiotic and ignores the root problem. "illegals" as you put them do not suck up money or jobs any american wants. They do the jobs no one wants and contribute to the country by buying goods and service paying taxes while getting nothing for it. "illegals" as you put it does not get welfare, you need to get your facts strait. again this "Muslim FROM EASTERN Countries" nonsense does not mean they are all criminals or dangerous in spite of your simple minded assertion. I would say that fundamentalist christians who want to ban gay marriage and loathe the idea of freedom are counter western values too. They are the same brand of fail and if you are going to tar all muslim fundamentalists with a simple minded brush please look at your allies too as they share many identical beliefs. The idea is brain dead and solves nothing. It is not only not the best option but is useless and is hardly different than the set of reasons hitler used to justify jews sewing a star of david on their clothing. He is bigoted and does think he is above their ideology. What does he say that indicates this idea he is not to you? He is selling this idea of useless ban to appeal to ignorant bigots and nothing more. There is no practical reason for it and your spin marks you as part of the low information voter base his nonsense is built to appeal to. All talking points with no substance or an idea what the real issues we face are or how to deal with them.
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  20799. ***** We do not agree on the definition of "someone" and only by the grace and sacrifice of the mother is anyone born. You can not force a woman to carry a child she does not want to have.  The statistics show that most woman who get abortions go on later to have children.  It makes this an issue of when they have children not if.  It is a responsible decision to decide not to have a child.  It is a hard decision for any woman and to pretend it is done on a whim or because of laziness is sickening misrepresentation. When I say clump of cells and then you come back with "we are all a clump of cells" you miss the point.  A fetus is not a human, it is potential human the same way an egg is the first time it divides after fertilization.  Many pregnancies fail early naturally all the time, is the woman responsible for those lives too? A zygote and a baby that can exist outside the mother are radically different things and are labeled as such for a reason by medicine. That you want to equate a group of parasitic cells that have the potential to grow into a human with the same rights as a thinking breathing human is nonsense personified.   I place value on all life, including the unborn. Children deserve parents who want them and forcing mothers to have unwanted children does nothing but harm to society. Not to mention it slaves her to the reproductive process and takes away her medical rights. It does this in support of nothing but an ideology that simply does not make sense outside whatever dishonest framing you happen to base it one. No one is pro abortion, the people you oppose are pro choice. The choice of the mother is paramount as it is her body, her health and here life that is in play.  Taking away that right does nothing but increase poverty and the ranks of unwanted children as well as force abortions underground.   If you really want to impact abortion numbers fight for good sex education in schools, it consistently encourages behavior that sees fewer children get pregnant.  There are ways to decrease the incidence of abortion, if you are like your fellows you oppose those too.
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  20800. ***** You can call it irreverent but it clearly is not.  Denying and dismissing an argument is not the same as making one yourself. I think it is key to point out  you are arbitrarily denying the lives of the future children by forcing them on the mothers earlier.  It is a hypocritical position that bares no concern for children she may not have in the future based on choices you make for her. Your personal experience is of no bearing in this discussion.  It is the invalid characterization of those who choose to get an abortion as irresponsible that I take issue with.  It is lie and total bullshit no matter what the clowns you personally know are like.     Your position is untenable and strips all rights away from a woman in favor of fetus that may or mat not make it.   Red herrings?  There you go blindly dismissing arguments that are key drives behind the idea of being pro choice.  It is about quality of life and the right of a mother to choose if she is ready to bear a child or not.  There no baby until it is a baby and your painfully weak attempt to label cells a human marks you as fringe even in your camp.   I actually care about lives and quality of life for the mother and the child.  This is where we part ways because that is zero concern to you.  You have climbed on a position with zero nuance and your attempt to stamp black and white on world of grey is what is expected of totalitarians.   I frankly do not believe you were ever pro choice and if you were you never did any research about it.  If you did you would not be making the simple and heartless arguments you do.   People with your spin who care nothing for quality of life or the idea a woman should not be able to choose when to have a child often have the same motivations.  It is not about the quality of the life of the child (as you said this is "red herring" issue it is about punishing woman for having sex.  You said as much in your no responsibility bullshit.  If you have sex and get pregnant, too bad you should have it or even better from your perspective do not have sex unless you want a child.   I do not see embryo's or pre-gestation fetus's as people because they are not. You predicate everything you say on the assumption we all should agree every egg cell that has divided twice is a citizen.   My position has more merit and that is why it is law in a country that values freedom and equality for all citizens under law.   Mothers are the one who need to choose the circumstances they take on the monumental task of motherhood on their own schedule and when they decide to.  It should not be left to fate or the rule of laws that can only apply to them.  
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  20801. ***** Actually it does it if turns out she is burdened by the child you chose her to have and she does not complete her education.  Woman who have children early tend to have lower earning potential and a lower quality of life than those who get educated and have them later.  This is a fact that you simply do not care about.  You even stated that my concern was a red herring when in fact it was just an truth inconvenient to your all spin narrative.   Your assertion should could put it up for adoption blindly ignores the damage that does to the mother and the permanent changes irreversible body changes caused by carrying a child.  My point is not moot and your blithe claim she should be forced to carry it so that she can give it away to worry about it for the rest of her life shows your care for actual living breathing human beings.   It is your characterization of woman getting abortions as irresponsible.  You did not intimate it was a minority but sought to tar all woman who make this choice with that brush.  It is dishonest and incorrect.   I would say to your face I do not care about fetus's as much as the mothers that carry them.   Pregnancies come and go but the more stable the more ready a mother is to have a child the better that child will do.  That she is in a relationship with a father that or has the means to support her child is a critically important she should be free to choose.  I care about the fact most of the woman who elect to get abortions do so because they can not support a child.  That you would force these woman to choose to go the back ally route or step on a conveyor belt that often leads to impoverishment and poor environments for the child you purport to care about.   There are medical reasons that mark them as distinct form a functioning human. The stages of development remark on physiological changes that are occurring.  Unless you really loosely define person (and I choose not to) they could be people but missing the ability to live outside the woman they literally can not exist without.   It is not a sovereign entity and is not person by any non anti choice spin. The conservative rules we have in place are based around these stages of development.  The fact is 95% of all abortions happen very very early in pregnancy.   With in the first 3 months when typically new parents are told to keep it quiet for a bit just in case.   The rules are clear on killing a baby because they are a person, a fetus is not or an embryo is not.   You imagining I condone infanticide because I support the right to let woman choose to abort a pregnancy early in its term is a prime example of the kind of hideous straw man you are addicted to. You think they are people, perhaps you should start by explaining that position.  How are they people in your mind? To me they are people in the same way a few eggs, 2 cups of flower and a cup of sugar is a cake. 
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  20802. ***** You have no more validated your assertion than I have mine.  The difference is the preponderance of the first world agrees' with my spin while you are relegated to support from fundamentalists that look to the bronze age for morality lessons.  The fact is your claim they are people is not validated by anything than your demand it is so.  In the same way a bunch of uncooked ingredients is not a meal a fetus is not a person and it is that simple.  There is no reason to force a mother to have the child. If we were rare or endangered you might have a point but the fact is I see zero upside in forcing woman to have a child they do not want and do not think they are prepared to carry and raise. Infants are stand alone entities protected under law as people.  It is not about infirmity or how helpless they are but is about the individuals ability to exist outside the womb.  That you can not see the difference between a baby and a clump of patristic cells that can not exist outside the mother is a myopic perspective that does not validate you like you imagine it does.  It is like calling a half dozen eggs and a block of cheese an omelet. Your absolutist position is not backed by anything but a totalitarian need to enforce your spin on single segment of the population which under your spin ad downgraded to baby making slaves.  Your arguments are bit compelling and you have not convinced me your position has merit as you have not made a case validating it.  By ignoring the results and fallout of your what enacting your spin would do you shows what you really value and it is not anyone's life.
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  20803. ***** It is you who is on the bandwagon hanging onto religious spin that is not attached to reality.  The justification for my logic is legion and that you call every point I make irrelevant does not invalidate my what I am saying like you imagine it does. You have not addressed this argument and I have stated where the cut off is and why it is set there.  That you continue to ignore or dismiss that line does not change it is there and accepted by the majority over your spin.  Accusing others of group think while engaging in it yourself is not compelling.  A baby is a person under the law and by EVERONE's estimation.  The fact is at one time when infant mortality was higher some cultures did not even name children until they were likely to live.   This concept is an extension of the same idea and is a pragmatic view.  As it stands saying a baby is the same as a fetus is not an argument you have successfully made. I have explained, you have clearly just ignored me as you keep asking the same question already answered.  Babies are stand alone living breathing entities, a fetus does not meet that criteria.  It is not about helplessness it is about viability.  A fetus literally can not exist outside the mother, it lacks all the basic components for life including a working brain or the basic ability to regulate it's body functions or take in nourishment to survive.  It not a separate entity and is not an individual under any definition.  You are the only one who is pretending their view point is better.  So much so that you would deny half the populations rights to control their own heath and well being in favor of uncooked ingredients you call a meal.  You denial is not an argument,  it is a position that you have to justify better than you have if you expect support in denying a segments of our populations right to control their life, heath care and when they have children.  You call what I say about your views slander but the fact is your spin leads exactly woman to be treated differently under the law than men setting up special rules that only apply to them them.  It is not slander to point out what your policy positions would mean for woman. I don't care if you like it or not but you do hold a view point that would be brick on the road of relegating woman into baby making machines they once were.  You would force woman to have children given a chance,  many in your camp who would take the exact step you are talking about want to limit access to birth control and sex in general.
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  20804. ***** You error on the side of tyranny over the woman you would turn into baby making machines as punishment for having sex.   You are on a side of this debate of those who also vehemently fight against universal access to birth control being or sex education. Both would fundamentally reduce abortions if universally adopted.  Know that in the "pro life" states both of the polices that would do the most good are flatly rejected.   It is easy to conclude your side of the debate does not really care about reducing abortions at all, they care punishing woman for having sex. My views are better as they error on the side of the mother being able to choose when she has a child.  My effort encourages we have children who can be cared for and are wanted.  It gives woman control of their life and lets them get established and ready before having a child instead of having it thrust upon her.  This is what matters and I do not care about potential children over the lives of actual living breathing people. You claim to care about fetus's but then belong to a group who has no concern for the children once born and regularly demonizes them if poor.  As your response is "be celebrate" it clearly shows a thinly veiled attack on woman who choose to have sex. It makes them wholly responsible every time they have sex.  Forcing them to have the child demands a discriminatory law. Your spin criminalizes them controlling their bodies and makes them into baby make slaves mandated by the state. I will pass on your "moral stand" thanks.
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  20805. ***** The issue is there are no other options, you are making them defacto slaves to reproduction with your policy.  Any other characterization you dress it up with does not change that fact.  I do not ignore there are other things they can do and I actually addressed many of the most effective in the last post.  What you ignore is unwanted pregnancy is a reality and the moment you put reproduction above the rights of the mother you make her a slave to that process.   I have every right and am correct to say the laws you advocate for take away her rights to control her body and make her womb regulated by the state.  That you imagine you should be able decide for her if she should if she can even make the choice is your failure.  I count only the voice of the perspective mother in this vote as it is her body and life this effects.   You have now admitted that in some cases abortion makes sense.  Now our positions simply differ on when.   The self defense analogy can be further extended to abortion to show my point.  In your home invasion it is not a certainty the intruder will cause you harm that gives you the right to use your weapon,  you can kill him for simply being in your house out of fear of what he may do.  Your fear of what will happen if the intruder is left to go about his business empowers you to shoot him.  Elective abortions could also be thought of as self defense if the fear or potential harm going through with the pregnancy could justify it. The same can be said of woman's who are too young or the if child would be grave burden.  In the same way you could shoot an intruder because you are frightened even if they would actually never hurt you a mother should be able to walk away from a pregnancy that might have caused "no harm" if she fears what the process will mean. Her concerns justify the action.   In the end you simply do not think most woman should have the right to decide. It would seem to me your limitations on who has rights and who does not are intimately tied to protecting an idea over actual people. I will choose to error on the side of freedom because I simply do not trust government to draw that line in any way that fundamentally limits half the populations freedom.
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  20806. ***** Once pregnant they are the state slaves, no longer able to make health care or life choices.  Their importance as baby makers raised above their rights of self determination.  They are made slaves to your ideas and what you think is right.  They are slaves to a biological function that fundamentally irrevocably changes their bodies and their opportunities. It takes choices off the table and condemns those who do not want to be pregnant to being so. It is not wrong to say you are declaring them baby making machines when in fact that is the logical conclusion of your asserted policy.    Dance around that issue all you want but that is exactly what your position means like it or not.  If that is distasteful perhaps you need to move the goal posts a little further toward me.   You have argued they should not be able to have abortions, that means you are forcing them to have the baby.  Please tell me how this statement is incorrect or how it "misrepresents" you?  If you force them then it is fair to characterize them as baby making machines once impregnated under your scenario.   As we discuss this you have moved the bar closer to me.  That is because to absolutist claim you made to start off with is untenable if you value freedom.  We all set laws that limit freedom and the discussion if there is any to be had is how much freedom we are extended and when it is curtailed.   You are on the same slippery slope all honest people stand on with this issue.   You believe in freedom but do not support the abortion and think there should be a better answer.  On these two things we completely agree the main difference between our stances is that you think there is some point we should take away the rights of woman to control their bodies.  I suspect this is based on the caricature of woman who use this procedure like birth control, please know the vast majority of woman who do so do not match it.  The image of woman thoughtless getting abortion represents very few actual people and we should be legislating on the majority not the exceptions.  Because we have a moderate system that weeds out the worst of the excesses of abortion I choose to error on the side of freedom for these woman to choose.  It is their life their body and there is no other human to consider until there is one.  I would work to help woman make the best choice for her and the baby but sometimes that will mean she does not have it.  I should not hope to push my views down anyone's throat as these are not my decisions to make.   Your spin on the analogy is not correct as most of these woman did not invite a baby into their womb. To continue it again, if said person snuck in and you did not invite them you could shoot them.  These woman are not inviting in a guest and killing them, they are dealing with an unwanted invader.  You have no problem dealing with any invader harshly even systematically and they are most certainly people,  this is no different.   The law does allow you to kill anyone who threatens you or makes you fear for your life or property in your home.  I would argue abortion is not asking for the right to kill just anyone,  just a specific element that is a threat to life and liberty and potential health of the perspective mother.  
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  20807. ***** I do not have to do any thing of the kind.   Blaming them for having sex is puritanical bullshit and is burying your head in the sand as it ignores the fact people fuck no matter what.  Notice I say people even as there is only one person attached to these actions who whose body is being usurped by law if they do.  The fact the law you propose only applies to one party of the two that had sex should be your clue it is innately unequal. Forcing pregnant woman to have children is turning them into baby making slaves under penalty of law no matter how much you do not like the characterization.   You can say it over simplifies the situation but it does not change you are forcibly taking control of their body and life to serve a potential entity you have deemed as human and to have greater rights than her.  As I have said before getting an abortion can be seen as taking responsibility for your actions.  If you know you can not care for the child it is one of the options that should be on the table.  Men should pay child support for children they fathered,  just as mothers should if the child is alive and the father cares for them   That is a different issue as we are dealing with living breathing entitles that consume food and costs some amount of money to care for, the same can not be said for pregnant mothers before a baby even exists.  Again you conflate a bundle of cells with a human who has a name and is a recognized member of society.  If that person was forced into your home by the state at the cost of your health that would make long term changes in your body and make you eternally responsible for them that would be wrong too.   As I have said many times we have a great deal of regulation around abortion and it is no where near anarchy. I am not advocating for anarchy and you are being dishonest pretending I am.  Your view "it is just selfish" or that you deem the reasons not good enough is your spin not theirs and has little value.  That you have made this judgement call on them is root of your failure.  You do not have that right and I do not trust you or anyone else for that  matter to making these calls for anyone else but themselves.  Your views are totalitarian and anti freedom,  take a look at the people you are in bed with. They do not value freedom either.  They basically did not unless you believe the only reason to have sex is to have a child.  That pregnancy can result from sex does not mean it has to.  We have plenty of humans and do not need to force woman who do not want the child to have it.   There is no reason to crush their personal rights to satisfy a defacto punishment for the woman having sex when she did not want a baby.  You saying they do not care amounts to they have it coming and I flatly reject that bullshit spin. The law also allows you to kill unwanted individuals in your home when you are scared even if you do not know your life is in danger.   If that is the standard then you have to support abortions for anyone who is simply scared of getting pregnant, not just when it directly threatens their life.
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  20808. ***** But it only punished woman .. not the men.  I see no merit for drawing it further in your direction as it clearly promotes law that treats some individuals in our society differently.  The original supreme court judgement was found based on this fact.  That you would choose to make woman into baby making factories under certain conditions that you define as making them "responsible' does not change the fact you want the state to force woman to be incubators for children they do not want.   I argue the the fetus is uninvited as evidenced by their mothers actions to evict them,.   If the child is an "intruder" as you put it then they are subject to termination by your own logic. You imagine anyone who has unprotected sex should be subject to these rules is mitigated by several extenuating circumstances you have kindly deemed as acceptable reasons.  The difference between our two positions is where that line is drawn.   The analogy of them being invaded is a very apt comparison as for many of these woman pregnancy will tear apart their lives if they go through with it.  They are have more of a real threat to their lives and future than you do with the average group of kids breaking in to steal your booze.  She did not invite the child in,  if she planned to get pregnant and then got an abortion then you would have a point.  Any unplanned unwanted pregnancy is an invasion in the minds of the woman involved no matter how you feel about it.   One does forcibly evict a house guest you invited in.
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  20810. ***** That you argue for laws that apply to one sex and not the other is a failure on your part.  I do not disagree that men and woman are different but under the eyes of the law they should not be.  I support no law that applies to one sex alone and never will.  That you advocate for gender based law is not my problem and does not make it right or fair to the sex in question. We have the option of not making laws that criminalize heath care and life choices for half of our population and that is path I choose.   It is not the majority I am worried about,  it is the exceptions.  The fact is most woman never have to go through the trauma of choosing to abort or not but the ones that have to should have that choice.  It is not up to you or me or anyone else to decide outside the existing very conservative frame work we already have in place who can and can not have one.   The unborn child's life is secondary to the mothers even by your standard as evidenced by the fact you are willing to allow abortions if the life of the mother is in danger or she was raped.   An unwanted fetus is not a guest, they are most certainty an intruder.  If someone sneaks into your home and takes up residence you have options to evict them, this is no different.  Forget about the idea we should be punishing woman for having sex "raw" when that is not the only case they get pregnant.  So if they were using a condom should they have the option?  If they were not supposed to be able to have children but get pregnant anyway?  If the guy lies and says he had a vasectomy? How far does your slippery slope go?   Almost all of the pregnancies that result in termination are completely unplanned, there is no invitation to the child at all.   Asserting they are invited guests is a fundamentally flawed claim.   Of course the argument applies, the fetus is very arguably breaking in. They are certainly not invited and not wanted in the case of woman who seek an abortion. Any pregnancy where a child is not desired can be classified as a break in.  That you want to call most of them invited is your bullshit claim and it is not attached to reality.  Your spin is akin to that because you left your door unlocked you do not have any right to protect your home as it was your fault for not bolting the door. Leaving the door unlocked would be the same as inviting the invader under your spin and we both know that is nonsense. 
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  20811. ***** We are not slaves to acts of nature and curb her hand all the time.  We do not have to work on that schedule and for the most part do not in any other part of our lives.   I do not defer to nature in anything and we regularly circumvent its path when ever it is inconvenient or would harm us, this is no different.   The answer to your dilemma is do not restrict the rights of woman at all based on your spin.  Promote safe sex and education and you will be doing actual good in stopping abortions as opposed to grave harm your spin would and has caused.    Of course your logic makes them secondary, you have made the life of the child secondary in the case of rape or harm to the mother.  In both those cases you have relegated them from the status of normal pregnancies which you believe deserve protection by law.   Where you miss the point about defending ones life  is where it is not just about the certainty of physical threat but the fear of that threat.  Just the fear of harm justifies you to defend yourself,  this should be no different. An fetus could be considered an invader if they show up uninvited and unwelcome,  ou have to ignore they were NEVER welcome in the first place to say they were invited. So the answers to my questions are all no. You need to stop fucking talking about them being responsible.because lump all woman in the same boat.   Your no nuance bullshit spin is as bad as those who demand children carry their rapists baby.  You are only marginally better and not really because you actually understand there is a place for it but are too myopic to see the many shades of grey in the whole question or that your views on other kinds of "killings" have much more latitude.   You can never trust birth control to be 100%,  you can not sue the doctor for that,  I would not say anyone could force abortion for the same reason I say they should be able choose to have one.  The point is three are lots of cases where the woman is not responsible and you want to see her life potentially ruined for an ideal as well.   This is not principled is is shortsighted and does not value anyone's life in the equation.   There is no way for your to spin a baby is invited unless they are.   That is in the desire of the individual and you can not speak to that.  That is why they should choose if they carry or not and it is up to them alone.  This is how it is and how it should be in a society that values freedom.   They is exactly the same,  when you have sex you do not "know" you will get pregnant in the same why you do not "know "you will be invaded. You argue sex is the invitation in the same way I point out leaving the door unlocked is one "invites" thieves to drop by.   If you had have just locked the door they would not have come in so you can not now shoot them if they do.   Sorry, be sure to lock up next time. 
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  20838. Charles Thompson The votes are not remotely comparable in the scope of the failure or clear focus of the two candidates. It is literally his only weakness in this regard if I was really concerned about the vote in question.  To be honest this is not a primary issue for me and I can respect there was more than one way to look at the vote in question even if did not agree.  Hillary can not say the same.  There is any number of polices she supported or flip flopped on that I did not agree with her on and have a harder time ignoring them than you.   The attacks on Bernie like he is akin to the GOP on gun control is mud.  It is meant to scare those whose primary focus is gun control into voting for a candidate who has toed the status quo for a long time. Hillary has been on the wrong side of many issues and only changes to align with progressives when the fight has already been won.  I see nothing in your spin acknowledging this. I am not trying to attack you for disagreeing. I know we share a great many ideals and both seek what is best for the country with our votes.  After Obama sunshine and rainbows is not what I am expecting and my cynicism held me back from my support for Bernie for a long time.  But the longer I watch the less reservations I have in supporting him.  I see him as representing a liberal vision in a much more profound way than I do Hillary. We have had an establishment candidate in Obama for the last 8 years and my chief complaint about him is as the gop ran further right he chased them and got no credit for the effort.  I see Hillary as a continuation of the same policy.   If we are going to fight we need to fight to win and the half measures we have been made to accept without a fight have to be pushed back against.   It is time to elect a candidate that steps outside the system.  Look at every poll and kicking the establishment is an idea that many Americans crave.  There is only one leader that brings that shine on the democratic side.  You know who he is.
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  20849. Travis Walls The right owns racism and you attempting to turn it is around is idiocy personified.  There is a reason almost every hate group is right wing.   I did not call you a bigot you dim wit check your reading skills.  I said you are in the same camp as actual racists and this betrays your faux concern over the issue.  Your entire argument on racism is projection and that you do not see your own faults while blathering about the left being racist is a joke that only flies in your fact free bubble. They are not racists by any standard except for yours.   Being concerned about inequity is not being a bigot and no matter how many times you pretend it is nothing changes that fact.  Putting them in the same camp as the KKK is simply ludicrous and without merit but that would never stop someone as fact free as you appear to be.   Morally challenged?  I would put my morality against your greedy self focused reactionary one driven by fear any day.   In this venue I put people where they belong based on the what they say as that is all I have to go on. You belong in the camp I put you in and if I am wrong it is only because you showed me a single right wing face in this forum.   I am not denying truth I am denying you are correctly using the term fear mongering in regards to this vid.  He exaggerated nothing and was simply pointing out real stats that you do not even try to counter. Pointing out facts is not fear mongering and the fact the number of gun deaths and mass shootings we suffer as a country is unacceptable to many of us even as you clearly do not care.  Get this through your head doofis, you do not get to make up what anyone means when the say something.  When Cenk hacks on the NRA he hacks on the lobbyist arm of the gun manufactures and is not attacking gun owners in the least.  You are literally making up what he says and it is total bullshit.  You pointed out no lie and have shown you do not listen to what they say and instead replace the meaning of words to create your idiot narrative.  Defending our lack of gun regulation is a losing battle that has no merit.  As you do so you work for the gun manufactures who see every mass shooting as an opportunity to make more cash.  The camp you sit in is drenched in blood, have at it hoss.  
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  20852. Travis Walls I just simply call out assholes who use the boy, child bullshit in an attempt to invalidate those they disagree with when it is based on bad smelling vapor.  It is universally used by those without an argument and is the weakest of ad homs.  I have no idea why you think I am short or a child but you opinion means nothing and does not change or counter anything I am saying.  It real weak base stupid shit.  I could not care less about how tall you are simpleton and it is entirely irrelevant to the debate.   Freaks at black lives matter?  Ya hard core racists asking that young black men are no longer arbitrarily executed by the cops.  You saying the left is racist based on them is literally the dumbest thing anyone has said to me today,  nice.  That you do this while sitting beside neo nazi's undermines the value of your concern about racism. I do not not defend anyone creating segregated areas (even if it is to feel safe) and TYT has not supported this either.  If you think they have please point out the vid where they did, we both know you can not.   You are simple empty bag of shit.  You are sharing stupid spin as you lump all the left as supporting everything black lives matter says and does when that is not remotely the case.   You do not respond because can not respond to what I say with out resorting to bullshit, straw men and ad homs.  You do not care about the truth and turn your face from anything that steps on your views as evidenced by your response. This is business as usual from the fact free right..  At least you are consistent throwback
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  20853. Travis Walls We have endemic racial problems in our justice system based on a few factors.  Police training, unequal application of law and the fact the community in question is far poorer than average.   Of course we arrest murder's and we put dangerous clowns in prison, this does not make your point or invalidate mine.  We can have systemic historically based inequity and also lock away psyco's, there is no contradiction in this you simpleton.   I do not deny they said stupid things but as far as I know they killed NO ONE.  I do not like what they said but it is in no way murder and does not represent anything I stand for in the same way the KKK does not speak for you. (unless it does).  There are black racists (oddly often conservative in view point) and I happily call them out too that does not mean the problems highlighted here do not exist.  The left is not being taken over by anyone. That there are loud clowns on either end of the fringe does not define the whole.  I publicly disavow anyone who holds racist views or advocates for segregation.  This finds me opposing right wingers far more often than those on the left.  Your spin is myopic and ignores the cancer that is the root of your own viewpoint.   Enough with the little boy bullshit it is weak and pointless and shows you to be self important and lacking a real argument.  Any answer I give you on this nonsense will be disregarded anyway so responding to any questions on this boy/short fact free idiocy is useless. 
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  20854. Travis Walls No they are not trained to go after black people but they are not trained to deescalate problems or tread specific communities differently than others..  They police inner cities differently than they do rural suburbs and get more arrests in specific regions as a result.  It is not overt racism that drives this but a tacit form that is endemic to the way we have done things in the past. Nothing is as simple as you paint it.  It should be impossible for anyone to defend cops regularly killing unarmed citizens and yet someone people in your sick camp manage to do it.   Of course you can't take anything I say seriously or you might reevaluate the fucked up way you look at the world and we can not have that.   The system is racist and you have not shown otherwise.  Your fact free declaration and rejection of my points with out your own is not an argument.   Like I said you are an empty bag of shit and have another thing coming if you expect anyone like me to be wussy when push comes  to shove.  You have no idea who I am and paste a fact free imagine you have of people who disagree with you over me that does not resemble reality.   You are not a tough guy or a realist,  you are a simpleton that buys bad spin either because you are stupid or just an asshole.  In either case you never messed with me or cost me anything.   You are full of shit on where actual racists live. The KKK and all those assholes that openly racist are right wing and your spin is so stupid it hurts my head to read it.  But then to hold your idiot opinions you would need your own version of reality to back it up.  
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  20939.  @robertmcelwaine7024  It is not a conundrum at all. Making business's serve everyone does not effect anyone's rights and ensuring all business apply the same standard is not remotely repressive. The rules attached to business licences have nothing to do with morality and everything to do with equal access to public goods and services. The government has a definitive and established interest to see all it's citizens have access to the same options when it comes to the public market it regulates through business licences. These rules may inform people on the job they take, but they are free to make whatever choice they want to. Their snowflake feelings should not effect anyone's else's options in the public square, only their own. A Mennonite should not apply to drive a bus because of their deeply held beliefs. People who can not serve everyone because of feelings should not sign a business licence that demands they do. The baker choosing to ignore his contractual obligations can not do his job because of his faith. Just like the Mennonite should not take a bus driving job if they refuse to drive for religious reasons the baker should find other work. Their respective feeling or faith based choices should only effect them.. There is no reasonable argument that one should be tolerant of overt intolerance. The idea we should be treat people who demand to be intolerant of others with respect and support, backed by the law is a bizarre thing to ask for. It underlines a severe cognitive dissonance people speaking on behalf of gut based intolerance start this conversation drowning in. You are not defending anyone's rights, you are defending the government supporting bigotry with the rule of law. It is definitively choosing to promote a non existent right for a bigot to marginalize others over right to commerce of people they arbitrarily persecute. We know what that looks like, it is a Jim Crow shit show of no value. Making the exact same arguments segregationists did 60 years ago is consistently a bad look . Your spin is old and sorry to inform you, badly beaten. It says a great deal about you, not much of it good. You are not being open minded or fair, you are defending feelings based repression.
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  20940.  @robertmcelwaine7024  Again the governments position is not about morality. It is religious bigots who are asserting are doing it for"moral" reasons. The government does what it does to promote public commerce and equal treatment under law, not morality. What you are asking for is the government to enforce the bigot's morality. As you stated earlier the government should not be in that business. It is promoting public commence, our current law puts all "morality" aside as you said it should be. Supporting the bigots would be the government legislating morality,. Rules that say all business's need to treat everyone the same is simply ensuring all citizens have equal access to commerce. It is a commercial and business thing, nothing to do with morality. These rules do not change your right to choose whatever profession at all. A Mennonite who dreams of driving a bus can ignore that part of his faith and take the job. The people who can not serve everyone literally can not do the job they contractually agree to because of an asserted tenet of their faith. That choice, like the Mennonite should effect them. I fully support their rights to choose to do whatever their heart desires. But the effects of their choices should be limited to them. There is no reason to promote their right to be a bigot in the public market over the right of equal access to commerce for all citizens. Supporting one groups bigotry is not promoting anyone's freedom. You are simply coddling the feelings an group you identify with at the cost of other people that do not seem to matter in your bizarrely one sided argument for human rights. Tolerating someones religious beliefs is not the same as allowing them to marginalize other citizens by limiting access to the public square using the rule of law. The people you defend have every right to think and practice whatever they want. They do not have a right to the governments support as they do so. There is no reason to make an exception in the public commerce rules for them besides to promote their morality over another citizens commercial rights. As you made it clear you think that the government has no interest in promoting anyone's morality. If you are consistent that means they should not be giving power to bigots morality either. Our commerce rules should be based on equity of access, not some arbitrary morality.
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  20944.  @robertmcelwaine7024  I called them bigots because thier actions represent the text book definition of the word as you presented it. Waffling on what unreasonable means does not validate you as the actual litteral definiion applies. Every act of bigotry is unreasonable from the perspective of the persecuted, they had valid standing to being the suits they won. You are demanding the right to discriminate against people we have expressly fobidden them to in the arena of public commerce. We applied.these rules to combat historic once entirely systemic bigotry countrywide. How they justify thier bigotry is irrelevant. If they think they are bigots is irrelevant. Thier actions are bigoted, no reason they can give changes that. They are using thier religion as shield to hide behind, it does not change the nature of thier actions or that thier specific version of religion promotes bigotry under the guise of being moral. Theiy are free to feel how they want, they have no claim or expectation of forcing the law to resend or change the rules ensuring an equity of commerce over that feeling. The concept of freedom religion not being absolute is well established law, when it comes to other religious demands. You can not legally marry multiple people despite the fact some religions encourage and promote it. You can not legally marry pre teen children despite some religions pushing that. We have not set aside the laws against polygamiy or child marrage. I see no reason to do so for anyone's justification for being a bigot. Your religious freedom does not and should not circumvent regulaton to promote common universal rights or public health concerns. There is no freedom in allowing for whites only restaurants, hospitals that turn away gay people or an ambulance service that does pick up non nationals all based on what the local owner class's feels are. This is what you argue for under the empty guise of freedom even as you empower bigots to marginalize people, This perspective entirely ignores all consumers rights on behalf of the more powerful owener class group, how typical of the fringe you represent. I call these people tiny minded morons because that is how I feel about dummies who demand tolerance of intolerance. Oddly you seem totally fine with the superiority complex of the bigots who judge gay people on narrow ignorant standards justified by the repressive ideas of a bronze age text. Interesting and telling choice when evaluating your high minded faux outrage at name calling given the hateful totalitarian clowns you defend. Going back to the 1950's has no value, it is not principled or moral. It is the path to encourage bigotry and isolation on behalf of a minority who what to exercise control of the lives of other people they dislike. It is regressive throwback that makes us less first world and more Suadi Arabia. When you agree with those backwards barbarians on anything you are very likely going the wrong way. You stand against freedom for anyone but those you like. Your posturing about what is fair Is myopicly one sided. It empowers an elite to pick winners and losers by arbitrary and unreasonable, bigoted grounds. We know what that looks like, it is the reason the laws you hate exist. No matter which side you are on someone's rights will be infringed. You pick the side of business owners who choose to be bigots, I stand for the rights of everyone else who does not get to pick who they are.
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  20945.  @robertmcelwaine7024  Literally by the standard of unreasonable persecution they qualify because despite how the bigots (or you) see their actions, it is the evaluation from the victims perspective that determines if something is bigoted. Because you do not feel their actions are unreasonable does not mean they are not bigoted. It may not be bigoted to you, but since you are not the injured party your feelings on the matter are largely irrelevant in this context. By your silly standard all one has to do is come up with an arbitrary reason to declare any bigoted action as not bigoted These people own the business's but must follow labour and trade laws. They have regulations they must follow when running their business in our country. Since the days of breaking segregation, they also much serve everyone. The limits have been in place for over half a century and you are the one who begging to change things now. These rules are not new even as they are being applied now as they work their way through the courts. There is no enshrined right to be bigoted and to treat any of your fellow Americans as second class citizens. It is not a right you have that is enshrined in the constitution or anywhere else. You literally do not stand for the freedom of everyone! You are defending only the owner class's right to discriminate, nothing more. You do not care about the people they marginalize and limit, you do not care about anyone's rights except these bigots. You stand for promoting more power to Business's, not humans. Business rights maybe? Human rights, you spit on them. You wish to empower legal fictions and the rich to pick and choose winners and losers in the market place. To choose who and who can not buy a product based owners fragile feelings and empty prejudice. You are promoting literal tyranny of the owner class as freedom and laughably human rights. You do this while spitting on the freedom of those they marginalize. We should promote equal access to markets for all to be a pillar of capitalism, not the feelings of the fanatical to deny them service. Good thing the law of the land is with me.
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  20946.  @robertmcelwaine7024 Good thing the law does not agree with your myopic and narrow defining of fair that primarily empowers the powerful and crushes normal people. The government DOES get to pass laws against persecution of their citizen's. They are supposed to work for everyone and not the just bigots with a business licence or monsters that hand them donations. At least you go full mask off in arguing for laws that protect bigoted business owners over your fellow citizens. That has no value to a country though. Unless you are a third world hell hole no one has the policy you crave in the modern era. You are in not way principled, you just crave the ability to crush others. I do not give a flying fuck about empowering bigoted business owners over the rights of people. I see no upside in making the already powerful more powerful in that they get to pick winners and losers of their local market with feelings. There is a great deal of value in telling to them to serve everyone or find new work. Giving everyone equal access to markets is in no way tyranny. Tyranny is the power of the strong to dominate the weak with the power of law, that is what you literally demand. The owner class chooses to sign a businesses licence compelling them to treat every citizen as a potential customer, that is in no way tyrannical. Banning access to markets over what your sky daddy says most certainty is Your privately owned business exist in a society and has to follow plenty of rules to stay in business. Some rules are in the interest of safety, some worker fairness, some of them promote customer access. None of them should be optional because you say your god does not like them. The people turning away customers because of their feelings are not pro capitalism at all. They are about controlling the lives of other people over feelings while losing money to do so. That has no value in a capitalist system, no actual capitalist should support should support your wasteful and profit damaging spin. Leave that for communist's and theocrat's. There is no profit in your form of bigotry.
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  21031. ***** I appreciate you bringing up my that tone was unpleasant and apologize if it was.  I fear that it is too easy to fall into a combative frame of reference in this format sometimes.   When it happens it does nothing but make it harder to explain ones point of view.  The why wait until now question may seem valid until you look at the incidence of late and non reporting of crimes of this nature.  It is not uncommon for many victims of an attack to feel shame in coming forward this often delays it for sometimes years until they feel somehow empowered to do so.   There is also the issue that the accusation would have been made at someone who had power over their carriers and lives, at least tangentially so.  I do not see the issue that these allegations have gone long unsaid as necessarily tarnishing their validity.  Each should be evaluated on a case by case basis on their own merits to attempt to validate them but the volume even unverified should raise concern.  I personally have always liked Cosby and would not want these allegations to be true.  But with the information we have coupled with the way he has responded it does not make him look like a man with nothing to hide.  He has been convicted of nothing but I think it is valid that one can be concerned and perhaps believe he is guilty of these crimes.  Our ability to do this is not something foreign or failing in our nature,  it is just a way of assessing probabilities.  I can't say this happening to Bill changes my life one way or the other so my bias in this not high and am calling it like I see it. If it is ok for me to have an opinion on this subject based on what I know then it logically follows media will be interested in the trend that opinion creates.   Any fall out you see happening to Cosby is not legal or even social it is financial.  This is because the media companies images are tied to those they feature.  It is only natural many will want to distance themselves from him at this time.  This is all occurring because we each are entitled to our own opinion for better or worse.  Opinion does matter even if it is not a court of law or a trial. 
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  21032. ***** The way I think people should approach being a victim of this crime is the same as yours.  This is not about saying what they did was what was best or attempting to justify their decision to not come forward.  For me it is about attempting to understand it,  looking at the motivations that may have drove it.  I suspect that the assertion of personal sovereignty is an issue that has been improving especially among young woman. But the alleged victims we are talking about are from an era where it was not as common for woman to do so.  This may be another contributing factor in why they remained silent so long.  I understand your frustration with the media. It's focus is no longer to convey information but instead it is to grab ratings and viewers.  Sensationalism drives the format now and there is no balanced or thoughtful approach to anything.  Combine this with the kind of media companies that make Bill Cosby events run from this kind of accusation like the plague and it makes it a bad situation for the accused.    That being said if he did do it we should be hearing it.  That he has been accused by so many is justification to tarnish his image even if it does not go to court.   To gloss over it because a prosecutor does not think they have enough for trial does not mean they should not share their stories. We should not be advocating that we stop alleged victims like this from coming forward.  These woman have a right to come forward with these allegations even if they are old.  In a perfect world we would see a court case to determine their veracity,  alas we do not live in one.
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  21047. Chris Hollier Not your job nanny state guy. You should not expect the government to set up good rules for people managing their finances when they can not manage their own books. Having them set up good budgeting rules is like getting diet advice from a guy who weighs 500 pounds. The idea that anyone is starving because they go to the casino is nonsense. Please explain why the children of these families should not be able to use a public pool because their parents are poor? These rules are being set by hypocrites as a punishment for people who use these services and it is not to help them at all. The leaders in question are not champions of the poor and are not acting in that capacity now, stop pretending they are. You assert what I say about the drug testing is not true but it is. It is not irrelevant because it is part of the same mindset that punishes those who take aid. It is turning them into second class citizens without merit and is not saving us money in the same breath. No one gives a fuck what you think they should use the money for. Just like the 50 you gave to the food bank you do not get to tell them how that money will be spent, you just don't. There is no straw man when you complain about people getting cell phones like it is some kind of luxury when in fact it is fast becoming the way most people get their phone service and it is no more expensive than an old school phone. Cell phone no longer = luxury and any spin that it does is out of date and out of touch. You are not paying for anything. We are as a whole are and the couple of dollars you contribute to the fund does not give you the right so say how the money is spent here either. That you imagine anyone on these services is living high on the hog is just more out of touch nonsense. No one who makes the kind of cash that allows you to qualify for these programs has much in the way to spend on anything but food. Taking away the very very few "luxuries" they have is nothing but mean spirited and wholly tyrannical, But then you guys are cool with that as long as the tyranny is directed at someone you do not like. People like you prove that every time you post.
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  21049. Chris Hollier Why are they not paying?  The idea they pay nothing is not attached to reality. They do not pay federal income tax because THEY HAVE NO MONEY!! They do not have enough to live (see the definition of poverty) but you think they should have less. They actually pay a much larger share of their income to sales and usage taxes than people who do not qualify for aid.  This garbage that they need to pay more is an old and idiotic right wing trope. Taxing them more will solve no problems and exacerbate the ones we have.   The middle class is not "doing fine" as you so ignorantly assert.  We are shrinking at an alarming rate and have had basically flat wages for the last 30 years.  Income inequity growth is a direct result of the shrinking of the middle class as money is all transferred up to the top.   You randomly brought up income inequality and I simply explained why it is occurring,.   The idea that if you are not paying income taxes you are not contributing is bullshit. Many people that require aid work full time and are most certainly contributing with their time and effort even if they are not being well remunerated.  They all pay sales and us usage taxes and spend all of their money in their community.  They most certainly contribute and your spin is another fact free right wing trope. Pointing out that enacting your spin would be horrible is not a straw man.  You do not have anything but a faith based assertion your ideas would do anything positive to back you up.  You calling what I said a logical fallacy does not make it one and I suspect you really need to look up what the term means.  That you imagine no one proposes tax free status for business's means you do not know what people like you say all the time. 
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  21086. thuzan117 I would call them hideous.  By any first world standard most of them are or were.  Keep in mind that Saddam was a success story before they through him under the bus.  We did this for economic reasons that had nothing to do with his actions.  We did this to a secular society where woman were highly educated and extremism was controlled.   If he was success then we need to wash our hands of being part of it going forward as he was still an ass hat by most standards.  Mubarak is probably the best example of a success story and even he had a dark side.  The fact is many states that are our closest "friends" are among the most totalitarian backwards in the world.   Things get worse when they lose a dictator because the radical thugs that take power have no link to good governance. They come to power because they are the most willing to shed blood be it theirs or others. You will see the same thing in places like Africa and is pretty common.  A revolution there does not mean prosperity and being they are generally fighting leaders we support our relationship with them by default negative. If the new regime does not tow the trade line with the US then they expect prosperity is out of reach as we will cut off from trade.  The enemies of our enemies are not even our friends there and it makes it impossible to solve the issue.   For many reasons the region should be policing themselves.  Even as we try to help now some of those "on our side" against ISIS are talking about fighting us.  We have to accept that there is no winning for us in the region.  Our only hope to building a bridge back is to stop pretending we can solve anything there.  
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  21125. Global Warming Skeptic She was DNC royalty and very high profile and Bernie was essentially unknown.  Through the early states when she did well the emails showing the establishment DNC was entirely corrupt were not out yet either. The democratic base was woken to something this cycle they should have seen back in the Clinton days. The establishment democrats became the weak copies of the kind of corporate shilling the GOP mastered in the era before Bill.  When people realized the truth there are a great many Hillary voters who voted early in the cycle before when they did not even knew who Bernie and had buyers remorse or did so ignorantly assuming she was not a shill.  That ignorance cost Bernie the win by the small margin he lost by.  At the start she was not the hated figure on the left  that she is now.  But by voting day the only good thing to say about her was she was not trump.  She beat Bernie by being crooked and tipping the scales while starting up with a 60 to nothing head start and then barely won.  She started the race 10 feet from the finish line and then just squeaked out the win.  There is no way to paint Bernie's effort to be a failure and it may yet be transformative.  Bernie did run on what people want if you look at actual opinion polls.  He may not have been fighting for what you believe in but he was representing the American people and that he did so is the reason he did so well.  You are projecting and as you say " they" you really mean you. Speaking for the American people is not something you are qualified to do.
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  21215. ***** Nonsense, it is you and those like you who march us into being destitute with think tank talking points on  your lips.  You can not claim to have an understanding of economics with the nonsense assertions you make and I do not cede you have a clue.   Rich people own a vast majority of all the resources we have and the polices you support have seen a massive transfer of wealth from the middle class and working people into their hands.   The solutions Bernie proposes are as much about spending money in the right places as it is taking money from rich people.  It is about policy that allows for much cheaper solutions to health care than the mess we face now where we pay the most by a long shot and see us ranked 37th in quality.  The investment in infrastructure is necessary regardless and we can only kick this problem down the road for so long.   We have spent trillions on foreign wars, bank give always and general corporate welfare and as the richest country in the world have money but choose to spend it badly.  Additional taxes for the richest of us not only make sense but are the only way forward unless we want to continue to spiral off on the dark path we are on. The increases he talks about are paid for without raising one dime on the vast majority of us.  Your are either purposely lying or misinformed with this half wit raise taxes spin.  What I want is my tax dollars to pay for services the rest of the first world takes for granted at a cheaper prices than what I pay now when I factor taxes and insurance costs. The idea we can not do this is betrayed by the fact the rest of the first world already has and is leaving us behind.
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  21242. magottyk As it turns out bad etiquette can get you in trouble.  If there is any doubt either party can not give consent then both  should error on the side of caution. You are talking like the crime of woman who were drunk accusing guys with rape because of  "buyers remorse" is some kind of epidemic.  The bottom line is if one has sex with someone else and they can not or did not give consent then act is then by definition rape.  Bad judgment can get you in trouble in a lot of cases when intoxicated,  why should this be any different.   Having sex while drunk is not a crime but doing it with someone who is not in a position to give consent because of severe impairment clearly is. Just like for all contracts when challenged the level of intoxication of the signing party is always factored in when determining if it is valid.  If it can be been ruled the person gave consent (even if they claim not to remember) within a reasonable doubt then the charges will fall through, otherwise ... Is this not how it is supposed work?  I find it odd you consider this particular crime to be of special interest when compared to actual rapes the number of these issues have to be very small.  It is only your assertion that buyers remorse motivates any victim,  there is nothing to substantiate that at all and each case is unique.  If the accuser honestly does not remember giving consent and can not imagine they would have then they have every right to feel violated.  For example if you were drinking with a friend after work.  You really tie one on and wake up in the morning sleeping beside buddy naked.  Is it fair for him to say you gave consent and there for what occurred was not rape?   This is exactly the kind of case that must be investigated and prosecuted or would you disagree? So what are you asking for here? Are you proposing that these people who feel like they have been violated have no legal recourse?  What is the system you would like to see and how do you imagine it would serve both alleged perpetrator and victim?
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  21252. magottyk Ya I understand and those are the only cases we can talk about.  Of those 5% about 10% of those are successfully prosecutable.   You freak me out focusing on the 1 out of 20 that MIGHT be called out as false.  Any false charges will mess you up and are bad and this is not limited to rape.  We have a significant number of people on death row that were innocent.  This is something our justice system does all the time and that you think it is particularly bad with rape is odd.  Consider the hysteria around murder or theft, should be protecting the identity of the people accused of these crimes too.  Or is it just accused rapists you fight for and are concerned about.  Any false accusations will cost the one who they are leveled at.  That is why there are civil remedies if you can show a claim was false or made in malice. No one is doggedly pursued without evidence and an accusation of rape has to be enough for the authorities to act.  False claims need to be dealt with in accordance to law but I do not see this as a fundamental problem that does not exist throughout our justice system.  This is not a special case that need attention.  It is you who are suggesting they be treated like a potential criminal for just coming forward.  That is what your suggestion means,  if we were to enact your spin everyone who claimed rape would be subject to a full investigation just like they did commit a crime on the off chance they did.  I make this distinction because you dance around what rules like yours would mean to anyone that ever considered reporting that they got raped. 
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  21253. magottyk Of course there is.  Get accused of theft or murder and then look for a job.  How is getting accused of rape worse than either of those.  If you want a crime even more loaded look a child abuse and that is a crime that makes rape look like you are baking a cake hate wise.  A missing person is not evidence of murder per se.  Without additional evidence that is a crime that will not be charged.  Any false charges of any major crime has severe ramifications in ones life.  Not just for those who are charged with rape but any major offense tars you with the brush of criminal guilty or not.   This is just the way it is, the idea that rape is particularly despised does not seem well attached to reality.  Having charges dismissed does not mean one is "innocent".  It simply means there is not enough evidence to proceed to trial.   When you pull out these anecdotes you have to understand that these individual cases scattered around the world do not support a need for change in the law.  The article you cited quotes a defense lawyer whose job it is to spin the accuser as the criminal.  I saw no presented evidence on his behalf and the claims of a lawyer spinning for his client are not that compelling as proof of anything. The idea this is a major concern over any other miscarriage of justice is not attached to reality. I have news for you the moment the police investigate you for anything they proceed with the assumption you are guilty.  This goes if you are accused of rape or lying.  You proposition would make all woman who charge someone with rape into a suspect, that is hardly acceptable.  Being called a "fuckwit" by a rapist defending MRA clown means less than nothing to me. 
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  21255. magottyk They do here but you are talking about freeken India and that is not the standard there.  They have 25% in the west we range from 45 to 75% .. they suck do not use anything they say as it makes it look like you are pro rape.   Hey you are the one arguing for a vigorous trial to defend the rapists.   Why would the quality of that trial be any more less important than the innocent until proven guilty purgers.  I am pointing out the other 19 people in the list are certainty victims and the 1 is only an alleged purger.  I know where my focus lies.  If you fuck deeply drunk woman that have any chance of charging you I have zero sympathy for what occurs to you after.   It marks you as stupid and sets yourself for trouble.  If this is the constituency you care about then perhaps you should find a new group more worthy of you defending them.  Your spin on men being painted as evil perpetrators is stupid.  We not only hold the balance of power the world round but are not disempowered by this spin in any way.   How does this image you imagine we all suffer from hurt you in your daily life?  How does it change anything for you?  That being said the spin is weak because it does not hold water and the vast majority do not see it that way at all.  I buy the bullshit slung by man hating feminists the same way I buy the nonsense spin put out by the MRA.   They are two sides of the same coin and both have valid points to anchor their horrible garbage.  They both go so far off the rails as to be useless in solving the real concrete issues we all face as men and woman they pay lip service to but never deal with.  Attacking all woman who fight for equal rights as emasculating man hating harpies is as stupid as attacking all men as thoughtless misogynistic brutes.  Both ideas miss the mark completely as they focus on blaming the other group as opposed to the issues at hand. The moment we start dealing with these issues on a case by case basis instead of through the lens of gender real progress can be made.
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  21256. magottyk The facts you present do not strike me as a grave concern.  A very specific constituency of people are even affected by this issue.  We frankly have bigger fish to fry and actual rape is one of them.   I do not care about your pet concern compared to the actual rapes you seem happy to gloss over and not even see convicted. I am saying you have not come up with anything that is going to actually mitigate or handle "false rape claims" in a better way.  The greater punishment spin is a failure as perjury is already serious.  Throwing all cases out of court with the smallest hint of doubt in a he said she said situation does not seem the way forward.  So come up with some real policy changes or you will continue to look like you are blowing hot air. No one should be believed without evidence and a claim is not enough to convict you of murder or rape here.  Even if some accusers do lie and cops sometimes fake evidence for murder trials it does not mean either represent any significant % of the total events.  Going through a rape trial is not a soft and fluffy thing and that you imagine it is and the half wits who think it is a good idea to try to fake a rape have a lot more to lose than they gain.  This issue is never going to be anything more than an anomaly. By your own account few men are affected. I can not see how they are worse off than those who are falsely accused of murder or arson or child molestation.   I do not see the group you highlight as special or different than others and you have failed to distinguish them.  Historical issues are what set the kind of policy you are talking about and even if I do not think it right it is a trend on the decline not on the rise.  There was a time that kindergarten teachers that were men were considered strange.  It is all part of the same bullshit built on images of the past most without any merit.  That we have things to fix is beyond question and gender rights and actual equality for both sexes is something that needs to be fought for.  Looking out for accused rapists before the raped is not one of them in my book.  Like I said we have bigger fish to fry and I would me more concerned about a senseless seating policy than anything else you have shared.
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  21318. Mr. Meeseeks  I do not think they are evil,  I think they are men who crave power and have instituted a system where they have it and we support them because they sell us cheap oil.   The only way to perpetuate a system like the Saudi's have is to crush freedom and education that leads to more moderate ways of thought.  It was not long ago historically Christian societies suffered many of the exact same failures we see in the Saudi's and it was the advent of secularism and the leaders of the time wanting to divorce themselves from church control that saw the rise of moderates in the west.  Over time when not under control of laws written by the church to enforce dogma we became less and less religious and the version of faith still practiced more and more moderate until the liberal forms of Christianity came to represent the majority of those who still worshiped in the west.  The Saudi leadership literally perpetuates the society that would "murder them" and they have no intention of giving up power.   They made the laws and perpetuated the culture that you speak of.   It was not long ago historically woman could not vote here too and before we enacted the changes there was no shortage of people saying it was impossible.  I propose we universally condemn these clowns and force them to reform, hit them where their wallet is and they will change or they will do without.  Supporting the backward yahoos like this who spread the cancer of radicalism is at the root of the problems we have with extremism today and we need to stop as there are few upsides and many downsides to continuing it. At some point we need to stop pretending these people are our allies or even friends if we are going say we value human rights and freedom until they change.
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  21413. Santos D "He's your standard leader of a world power" .. is a defense of him and the fact is he is not. That they took Crimea is not understandable from any perspective and that trope they are under threat by an nato invasion is nonsense personified. They annexed a part of a sovereign nation at the barrel of a gun and that you see it as justified does not make it so. NATO is responding to Russian aggression as they are the only ones who have taken territory from anyone. All the former Soviet states should be concerned as Putin has the exact same legitimacy in annexing them as he did in Ukraine, meaning none at all. His taking of Crimea would have the same legitimacy as France dropping several thousand troops in Quebec to bring it back into the homeland from Canada. Even if the people who lived there wanted to go there would be a process that should be followed that has nothing to do with France sending troops in and taking over and most certainly not facilitating the vote I do not burst into tears about anything but point out he is a cancer as I do all dictators. That you wave his flag as business as usual only speaks to how business has gotten. It does not make Putin any better than I paint him and your spin damns with faint praise. I do not have to defend the actions of anyone else to condemn Putin for his backward totalitarian regressive way of governance. That you defend him and critique my leadership for the failures (that I also call them out on) does not make Putin's failures any less acute.
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  21614. ***** Two key points for you, this is not censorship and to pretend only liberals do this is to have your head in the sand, In the case of Chick-Fil-A people were just voting with their dollars, they did not try to pass legislation to get them shut down. Conservatives do this all the time they are just really bad at it.  The catholic league threatens businesses every other week for things they want changed,  That they are ignored is only because no one cares what they do.  You are free to say whatever you want and that is protected free speech, this does not mean saying stupid things people disagree with does not have consequences. The owner of chick-Fil-A is free to say what ever stupid thing he wants to but everyone else is free to say he lets not go to his restaurants because the owner is a douche. If your christian Taliban buddy from duck dynasty says things that alienates viewers the channel he works for may decide to end his contract. This is a business decision and has nothing to do with censorship.  If the owners of his show thought it would hurt their bottom line to associate with a host they have a fiduciary responsibility to sever ties. This is especially true if you work in media where your views directly reflect on your employers. Firing you because you said something stupid does not impinge on your free speech. The fact is saying stupid things in public sometimes has consequences as your half wit hero learned.   . Every example you pointed out had nothing to do with censorship. It is about making people responsible for what they say using your own free speech.  Know that if you say idiotic despicable things it just may cost you..  
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  21624. John DOH If you think the only fight for rights is on behalf of men you are juiced and completely out of touch with reality.  I fight for equality not the equality of the 1950's you seem to prefer.  All real femisists want equality and that is exactly what mrm people should be fighting for too.  Not the brand of equality that only works for me or demonizes the other but the kind that gives everyone options with their sex restricting them.  We have come a long way in that respect but still have a long way to go.  This process is driven by neither "men" or "woman" but society as a whole.  People get herded into the limitations set on them by those around them and the community. This occurs to men just like it does woman and it should be everyone's job to combat the stasis of social advancement.  Feminism has taken woman a long way but the fight that stated long ago is not over as you ignorantly assert it is.  It is people like you that fought against them ever stepping up in the first place and in the your perfect world they would be pushed back to lose ever single advancement they ever made.  From my perspective this moment has freed men from the shackles of convention from men as well, iy has given men options that were unacceptable just 40 years ago.  I correctly fight the radical fringe of both sides loathe the man hating feminists with the save verve you do.  I no more support them than I back up your ilk.  In your passion to  see things enacted you both miss the point in the exact same way only on opposite sides of the fence and are far more alike than different. The answer is not in the divisive rhetoric of both you spit but in understanding equality will only be achieved when we fight for it on behalf of everyone not just one sex or the other.
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  21741. No they are shills because of the policy they support and the fact they are among the influences which are corrupting our system. I am not like conservatives these days I am more than willing to give leaders I generally disagree with credit when they do something right. I loathe cruze for a bunch of good reasons but I applaud his efforts at term limits because they would be a big help for everyone. I am pleasantly surprised at trumps crushing of the TPP but half expect a new version in the future he endorses. I am more than happy to give credit where credit is due. The problem is not that they are CEO's but that are consistently unqualified or actually the antithesis of what their post are supposed to be. A billionaire charter school lobbyist who believes in accountability but fought to ensure federally funded charter schools are not measured by the same standard as public schools. A clown to run the EPA who does not believe in it and has regularly been on the wrong side of its judgments An oil company ceo who as zero state department, government or public leadership experience given one of the most important posts in the cabinet. A former surgeon who can not assure the questioners the money from his department will not end up in trumps pocket. These clowns are not draining the swamp, they were the kind of people who built it. This is not about them being rich it is about them being wholly unsuitable for the jobs they were handed Our system is corrupt, it was not corrupted by politicians but by the cast of characters like the ones he chose who buy them.
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  21769. Global Warming Skeptic We have better uses for our fossil fuels than burning them when we have better safer cleaner renewable options.   We are using 100 year old tech as the first world countries switch away from it.    The costs are coming down and will continue to as the tech continues to get cheaper.  That is the great thing about tech it always gets more cost effective as we mas produce it.  We are talking about resources we will NEVER run out of and it high time we started to switch too so we are not left with the third world.  There are plenty of things to use oil and even coal for besides burning it and we would be better to preserve it for those uses if we have other options.   "We produce energy more effectively than European countries."  We currently buy  $2.38 billion of electricity from green Canada who have very few coal plants and export almost exclusively green energy.  If they can make it an sell it to us then there is no reason we can not produce it.   The coal burning tech is old and very very very inefficient and dirty.  The idea we hang onto hundred year old power production and distribution methods because they are efficient is bullshit.  The powers that be own our leaders and the resources we use to generate power do not want change and you sing their nonsense.   They do not want to kill the golden goose and it has nothing to do with markets or efficiency or the consumer. We are not being driven by a democratic desire to burn coal but a political one sold to our leaders with campaign donations.  Your silly claims are nonsense personified and mark your spin is fossil fuel shill or a moron. I am not sure what you are talking about when you say Europe is behind us.  It is a phrase with no meaning.  By many many stats they are way ahead of us.  We are not on top anymore and can not hope to be as long as we are behind the curve on innovation and the desire to move forward and not keep doing what we did 5 decades ago.  The world is changing and we need to change with it.  Cons hate this concept but then you value stasis in every single case. 
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  21770. Global Warming Skeptic We have to drill deeper because the cheap easy to get fuel is being used up.  The technology I am talking about is attached to energy generation not procurement.   Your spin does not address that fact. Costs for renewables are coming down but not fast enough because the volumes purchased are still low as we have barely bought in.   Like all technology it starts expensive and gets cheaper as production methods and availability increases.  There is no reason that solar power can not be very cheap and that it is renewable means the cost is up front does not have any of the additional costs assorted with it in terms of lives, pollution or security that oil does.   It is worth noteing that oil is very expensive in Germany and Europe as well and the extra costs have nothing to do with renewable tech but the way they choose to manage their energy and the cost of sources and future investment we ignore.  They pay more for all energy because their policy is forward thinking and they are planning for more than the next fiscal quarter as it correct. We pay little for power but there are additional costs associated with our choices and those have to be factored in.   Not the least of which is the fact we are falling behind the curve when compared to other modern counties who are making the investment now we are eventually going to have make as well.  Pushing it down the road is business as usual for you but is not a well thought out policy. Not just new, but renewable, clean, creates a new manufacturing base for jobs and phases out old tech like the rest of the first world.  Your voice is does not serve the poor it servers the very richest of us.   It serves stasis and the status quo over advancement. This is not a surprise because you belong to a group who opposes change no matter what especially if it steps on your billionaire masters toes. The only reason we are ahead is because of the stimulus we enacted when Europe picked austerity after the crash.  If we had  it your way and the gop was in charge through the crash we would have recovered just as slowly as Europe.  To make the claim we bounced back because of cheap power is fact free when Oil prices were at near record highs for us through most of the recovery. Your policy does not get credit for our success even as you people demonized all the actual efforts that made it happen.  
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  21771. Global Warming Skeptic let me make this very clear for you, I DO NOT CARE WE PAY LESS!   Our energy policy is short sighted and will cost us far more down the road if we ignore where the rest of the planet is going.   We pay less for everything including fossil fuel because our policy is short sighted and the extra taxes attached to power in other places that go to infrastructure and transit development for the rest of the planet go uncollected by us.  We pay less because we operate using 100 year old tech when the rest of the planet is upgrading not to mention we are the fathers of oil use.    In the same way Germany will be the owners of the new tech we ignore.  The only ones this short sighted approach really helps are those who control the status quo and arguing for stasis will always be an uphill climb that people like you will make.  All technology including oil and coal was expensive when new.  Technology always gets cheaper and better with time and so it is with anything we have ever mass produced.  The costs of oil are not negligible.  It drew us into a 2 trillion dollar war and has us allies with some of the most regressive and backwards countries on the planet.  It has costs us many lives taken by the pollution it generates.   It costs us jobs as we ignore whole new seconds of manufacturing that are opening up in other parts of the world.  It costs us innovation as we will be forced to buy others designs instead of being the leader and doing it ourselves.  It puts us behind the curve and beholden to groups we do not agree with on anything.  It empowers dictators and some of the worst actors on the public stage as we pour money into their hands for a product we could do without if we h ad the will.  The costs are not negligible and it is myopic to say so. We are not far ahead in quality of life,  in the development technology anymore,  our manufacturing is on the decline and you regularly hear how china and even India is kicking our ass on economic indicators.  We are not far ahead and hitching our wagon to a resource whose price is determined by what happens in the chaotic middle east is a licence to have trouble.   I say great about our reserves and argue we  should be saving them for things we can only get from oil.  Power is not one of  those things and the oil will not get less valuable or useful as time goes on and it gets even more costly.   There is no reason to burn such a valuable resource when we have other options if one is forward looking.   You are dead wrong they recovered better or more quickly.   They languished behind us the whole time and have stayed there.  Both Canada and the States did stimulus and both recovered far more quickly than Europe did.  They did nothing well and their current state is a direct reflection of what they did.   You can not say they are behind us and did a better job with their economic plans, the ideas are mutually exclusive. 
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  21775. GenBloodLust It is an apt argument and they are not equally sickening does not mean that at least to segment of the population they represented policy at least as onerous to them.  Of course the people are separate from the nation and I am not arguing otherwise.  But the flag most certainly does become associated with the policies of the leadership in question. The swastika has it's baggage and so does the the good ol stars and bars.  I am not saying they are equal but there is absolutely no reason for anyone who fought for the north to venerate this symbol for any reason any more respect is payed to fallen member of the Wehrmacht by flying a Nazi flag.  These two are not the same but share a direct parallel that I am applying here but the principle of how a symbol can inherit characteristics of the regime it represented.  That it represents a culture that declared war over the right to enslave a portion of the residence based on a specific skin color ties that regime to a group to be feared and loathed because they would enslave you and your children's children given a chance.. This has nothing to do with pre us takeover and everything the flag came to represent.  It is battle flag of those who fought a country spitting war to preserve slavery. You may think glorifying the flag of failed traitor slavers is something to be done on public soil but you have not made a compelling case why we should. Put it up in museums, sell it in the every civil war store but it should not be flying on state grounds.  
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  21801. Goobzor So? The age of the stories are inconsequential.   There is no guarantee the court will trust lies and any assertion they would do so automatically is not attached to reality.  People are afraid to take the stand in rape cases for good reason, a vigorous defense often pulls the accuser apart even if their accusation is valid.   No one gets a free pass in our system. It is on the accuser to prove the case if the prosecution elects to go to court.  If the prosecutor decides not to proceed that has nothing to do with the victims and everything to do with beating the reasonable doubt standard.  It is up the victims to come forward with their claims and that they are old does not make the accusation less valid just harder to prosecute. If Cosby says nothing about these stories then it will be left to the imagination of everyone if they are true or not.  That is where we are, we are not at the stage anyone is being asked to prove anything.  That you imagine people should only be able to accuse others using the same standard as a prosecutor does when taking a case is not correct.  They may need proof to convict him but they need no physical evidence to come out and accuse him of doing it.   If you want to call them liars the burden of proof is shifted to you.   You will notice Cosby says nothing and so he has no burden to fulfill, he makes no assertions because they could used as lines of questioning in his possible prosecution. The path he has chosen on the advice of his lawyers does not make him look good in this case.
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  21866. Paul Wood If you say so.  Jews are white people too as their skin is white, just so you know. White privilege does not mean others can not succeed you moron.  It means to be white gives you advantages,  This has slowly been changing but is most certainly a thing.  Yelling fake fake fake is simple minded and not an argument.  I do not blame white people for anything and you need to stop saying I do as it is fact free.  The only reason "white privilege" exists is because for a long time white people were the majority and this kind of thing exists in every single society where the racial mixture is skewed one way.  It says nothing about white people and everything about human nature.  I have already said that many people are over racism today but that does not mean that many are not.  People like you and your ilk are just as broken as we were 50 years ago and have the exact same failure spin as the racists of old.  That you imagine anyone blames whites is simple minded nonsense and anyone when I encounter anyone who does I shout then down as the exact same kind of bigot you are.  Cenk has pointed out the failures of turkey many times and does not remotely shy away from it.  You are projection your own failures on to him as you would never say anything negative about anything you were associated with.  To do so in your mind implicates you.  This is your failure and not ours.  White people get killed all the time as do people of all races.  When someone is unarmed is killed by the ones who are supposed to be protecting us then everyone should be concerned no matter what fucking color they are.  That the only one you concerned about is a person who shares your skin color is very telling.  Empty sacks of shit like you are far too common but happily you are fewer and fewer every day. 
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  21882. Titus Orelius You are not you are a woman hating troll and I have not seen you stand for equity.  I have seen only seen what you are against and that is a blanket hatred for feminism and by extension woman.  That you mouth platitudes about being in favor of feminism is betrayed by your unrestricted loathing of it.  Domestic violence is not "more or less equal" and we do not have beaten men shelters or an epidemic of beaten husbands for good reasons that if for nothing else have to do with the relative size of men and woman.  Your assertion is just more nonsense.  If there is a stat that should interest you about domestic violence it is that woman are now being charged with it when at one time they almost never were.  If you are actually concerned about "male victims" you need to be on the front line lobbying for them to get the funding to support them.  You are going to have to do better than assert the problem is equal to get that funding and I wish the best if your assertions are not just the bullshit they appear to be on the face.  Not true.  One directly opposes racism when you encounter it.  What you should not do is generalize a whole group of non homogenous people you target is guilty because some fringe members are.  Those who attack being male are idiots and I am more than happy to tell them so to their face.  I feel the same way about clowns who generically attack woman though.  The demonization of men is not a real issue and certainly nothing to whine about.  Most of us have to deal with and it is a pretty easy set of nonsense to shout down if we do.   But go ahead and cry about some goofs on the fringe misrepresenting you us if you want.  I dislike the radicals the same way you do and perhaps more as I am consistent in my loathing of those who step on others in a quest to advance themselves.  That you want to paint all feminism with that same brush is your biggest fail.   You will NEVER see me defending the radical fems just like you will NEVER see me align with the MRA as they are different sides of the exact same fail.  Issues of equality are too important to be left in the hands of the fringe of either movement.  They are fringe for a good reason.
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  21932. magottyk Spend some time reading MRA comments on here then and you will be familiar very quickly.   I have already noted a common blind spot in your spin in which you lament the up to 5% false accusations while completely dismissing the 95% of real ones like they do not even exist.  I have never seen anything surprising or better explained by looking past your spin from MRA spin.  The statistics are only ever poorly linked to clams made on the basis of what you share. Your spin is honest confusion at best and willful misinterpretation at worst.   You have an agenda that has very poor focus that does nothing but slow down the march of actual equality. You do not interfere with anything. Your organization is simply a lightning rod for misplaced and sometime justified anger and nothing more.  You attack the wrong parties almost all the time as you fail to grasp that most every issue you have is linked to the old way law and especially family law applied.  The reason laws are so skewed harder against men is historical and has NOTHING to do with feminism.  The reason criminal and family law is so unevenly applied is based on outdated family rolls and standards that no longer always apply.  Almost all of your valid concerns can be laid at the feet of tradition and that you want to blame "feminists" for it is idiocy. Anyone who knows history knows that men got the vote first.  This is nothing but a fact of history and makes no statements about the men of today.  One can stand in the way of rewriting history and still not see the point of the path you have chosen. I call it crying because you talk about all of these issues like your opposition is remotely successful in the perpetration of their fringe ideas on a large scale.  The people you point to may be called "feminists" but they do not represent the bulk of the movement and are nothing but a loud hateful minority.  Anytime someone who is advocating for rights throws someone else under the bus to do it they need to be told to be silent and let the adults speak.  Both you and the "man hating fems" have the same problem and are useless to the solution until you get over it.
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  21933. Loathomar There is nothing wrong with pointing out pay inequity and I literally see no downside to it or why you think you are on the right side of this concern.   This can only mean better pay for working people and their families and arguing against it has no point unless you are getting kick backs from the board of commerce.  If the problem does not exist and rules are put in place to enforce equity then nothing will happen anyway.   If you are wrong and there is inequity working people will take home more.  There is no reason to take your position on this issue.  An increased concern about rape is a very positive thing and anyone who is concerned about a loved one being raped should agree.  You somehow see an attack on rape as an attack on men but to be honest I do not find it the least bit threatening.  Western Feminism is about gender equity and you have not shared anything that counters this.  That you point to the fringe I was talking about before in issues like Gamer gate does not validate your spin or counter my assertions.  I will say this one more time for you Skippy, men have longer jail times because in the past woman got a free pass due to enforced inequity.  That we still have a remnant of the old way to doing things is not feminism's fault no matter how hard you want to blame them.  On contraception nothing is free and is provided by their insurance the woman pay for.  The insurance companies went along with it because they expected it to save them money.  By the way, Viagra was already covered for men.  Your argument is idiotic and if anything insurance coverage was previously tilted toward men who were the only ones getting anything for "free".  Your kind get classified as whiny because you blame feminists for things they have nothing to do with.  You make complaints like someone other than history and stasis is on the other side of most of the issues you moan about.  You have created a fake boogie man to blame valid and your imaginary problems on and will never solve anything as you attack the wrong targets. 
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  21937. Nicolette Langdon Of course and as soon as I see a implementable or even viable strategy associated with your concerns I will be happy to evaluate it.  I would hope we want the same things but you need to stop pretending those who share Kyles perspective do not acknowledge and understand the issues you are concerned about.  They and I simply see the Justice Democrats as a possible solution to this issue as well as the host of other things we all need. We can do it as long as we all pull in one direction. The corruption of legal bribery that drives these clowns to try to fix districts and purge voter rolls and commit outright fraud is the root of this issue like so many.  We change the rules by changing the leadership, Leaders who work for us . We can get them elected and by choosing good candidates from outside the box we have credibility unearned they can never buy.  Bernie and even laughably Trump have proven the popular support exists to crush the status quo no matter how hard they push down on the scales.  Hillary barely won, Trump crushed his "establishment" rivals while the establishment on both sides did their level best to stop Trump and promote Hillary.  It is arguable they both failed and the establishment democrats especially are the true losers.  There is a real taste for change and a group like this is exactly what is needed to break the deadlock of corruption that grips us.  We can not leave the establishment democrats at our backs and they need to go.  We have one major advantage they can not buy, their ideas are not popular and pushing the status quo will be a losing message going forward.
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  21975. fouroverseven Saying anyone is intellectually dishonest is not a claim you should be making as you have egg all over your face.  You make emotional fact free appeals all the time and call it murder when the truth is no one but people with your spin think it is and the law is not on your side.   The argument if a fetus is a person is settled. This is a non issue outside the purview of the ignorant with an agenda to dominate woman and with the ultimate goal of controlling and punishing sexuality.  This is about rights like I have said before but a parasitic clump cells that can not survive on its own does not and never will have the same rights as a living breathing person.  A pre 20 week fetus is nothing without the mother to carry it, it is certainly not a person that has the same rights and privileges we accord to all.   You can go over it all you want but your assertion is not borne out by learned definitions of what a person is what law defines it as.   To liken our conservative abortion law to slavery is a joke and is dismissed as the nonsense by all who understand the ramification of slavery and who advocated for it.   The bottom line is everyone like me rejects your murder spin and I see no reason why anyone should pay attention to it.  We reject it because we have had this argument and you have lost a long time ago.  This not about you, this is about an attempt  o shove your views down others throats.  That you keep yelling it over and over it does not make it more valid or change anything.   Real slavery is taking away important choices from living breathing adults and getting right into their uterus making heath care choices for them.  The real joke is that once a child is born you and those like you will be calling the child a parasite and freeloader if they need help when a young uneducated no options mother you forced they child on can not properly care for it spinning off loads of other societal issues you will then blame on lazy poor people.  
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  21976. fouroverseven Follow along, a pre 20 week fetus is a potential human not a human. Potential humans do not have the same established rights as humans do.  This is why the US has taken the step that many other places that allow unfettered abortion right up to the end have not.  Fetal viability and fetal pain have both been factored in our well measured laws.  We have determined a place for woman to make the choice if she is going to carry withing certain strict guidelines.  We did this because it is a matter of her health and life and she should have a say.  In our policy we show a compassion for both the unborn and the woman who carries them as it should be.   Your assertion this is as slavery is a fail no matter how many times you make it for what reasons.  Just because you despise something does not mean you get to mischaractize it. When you do it this blatantly it makes you look disingenuous and lost for a good argument. Person hood is a man made construction that is tied into man made laws.  The same man made laws that you would attempt to usurp to curtail the heath care choices for woman. The meaning of these words in a legal sense can change but lucky for america that has always meant more freedom not less.  You would walk us backwards to impose your views on everyone even as many do not share them. You can claim no high ground as you ignore the real social devastation associated with what your policy enacted means.   That the church spends a tiny amount of its budget donated to them on the poor while holding massive amounts of back is not so compelling an argument in their favor.   Shhhhh about Bill and Malinda gates, nothing about what they do validates your spin or speaks to the point I am making.  The people who demonize the pro choice movement are the same ones who want to cut social programs and help for the poor.  This is the constituency who will be primarily impacted by the enactment of your changes.
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  21977. fouroverseven We have made a distinction and that you want to ignore that changes nothing.  We are talking about a clump of cells that is nothing without the mother to take it the rest of the way and it is not an independent life form let alone person by any reasonable definition.   I am taking nothing away from anyone and am assigning rights to the only person in the pre 20 week equation.  There is no slippery slope here and as I have already shown we have taken reasonable steps to curb the worst excesses and concerns about late term procedures.   I will always be on the side of woman to make this call for themselves.   Your desire to strip them of rights and turn them into involuntary baby making machines is not moral at all.   You would be charged with murder because in that case it was you who made a choice for her and in attacking her in a vulnerable state you should be marked as despicable. You fail to see the distinction between you making that choice and the woman making a heath care choice she has the right to within a given time frame.  To say they are the same is disingenuous at best.  If you going to quote stats you might want to use a more recent one as it more honest reflects the reality today.   http://www.gallup.com/poll/170249/split-abortion-pro-choice-pro-life.aspx Your most Americans assertion is bullshit, you might want to stop using that old poll if you do not want to be called dishonest. I believe living people have more value and rights than clumps of cells that can not survive without the mothers umbilical life support system.   You do not value the lives you would "save" or the right would not hold the social policy decisions it does.  It is a sad twist of irony the pro life crowed are the same ones that advocate for more guns, more war and capital punishment. The social contract changes "anti choice" consistently fight for directly cut from the very people law changes like yours would affect most. Prove the average pro lifer wants to cut social programs?  Look GOP platform and who the vast majority of "pro life" people vote for and get back to me.  
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  22017. engelmohr2006 I am not wrong, you are. If the people hurt no one else they are free to do what they want to. To label a huge chunk of worlds population as unable to live in a modern society is simple stupid nonsense. The facts is Muslims already live among us and they will be our chief ally in any fight against extremists that come from their rank. I am not talking about bringing in people from the lost tribe of bornio, simply people from a different place who worship a different flavor of the same god most do here. To say they can not integrate is objectively and factually incorrect. Those who belong to fundamentalist Islam are the same brand of cancer as fundamentalist Christians. They agree on almost everything policy wise be it on gay rights, abortion, contraception, free speech, a woman's place, science, etc, etc, etc. The key difference between them is the Muslim fundamentalists have the power to write law and the christian being they are in a secular societies do not. There will always be fringe dwelling fundamentalists no matter what faith they belong to no matter how free the society is. Christianity proves that in the west. But freedom from religious law has saw the decline of christian extremists or the worst excesses we see perpetrated by groups like Isis. If we were to hand power to our christian fundamentalists we could expect them to be very much like their counter part in ISIS. Anti education, anti freedom, backers of society wide ignorance supported by the power of law. In the same way christian fundamentalists have not taken over her there is no fear that Muslims will EVER enact sharia law in our system. They have no power and never will and even if they ever got the kind of 25% backing the religious right does our constitution still prevents them from enacting their brand of nonsense. You have to know that the fundamentalist Christians would love to if they could but have been push back by the fact they can not.
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  22076. kay jay She consistently does not do as nearly as well with independents and states like New York with their super closed primary limited the number of voters who could even vote for Bernie. We were talking about votes missed by Sanders not who won more primaries and my point is valid and not countered by your spin. Any limitation of open primaries serves both her and the establishments goals and will keep non establishment incumbent numbers lower. This is the reason the republicans are considering having fewer of them. They see how it helped the democratic establishment. She deserves the the attacks form the left and unlike those from the right they are 100% substantive. What is really disgusting is liberals turning their heads to serve corporate sponsorship and greed because of the bizarre illiberal concept of unflinching party loyalty. The republicans are worse on social issues but are basicly the same on many others as establishment dems who are paid to lose. Hillary is a 90's republican with recently evolved sensibility on social issues and anyone that ignores this is blind. After this cycle the establishment democrats will not have name recognition and giant head start to fall back on. The next actual progressive candidate will crush their shill and anyone the establishment picks. The GOP voters have had 3 elections of voting for the tea party in a misguided attempt to yank the controls from the hands of the elite. Even though they failed because those candidates are also corrupt it primed them and this is why all the establishment candidates on the right failed this time. If you imagine this anti corruption anti establishment fervor is going away on the left or right you are gravely incorrect. Many many on the left are learning in this cycle for the first time just how corrupt the establishment dems are. This may be the last time they will be able to pull the Hillary shenanigans. Cutting your party in half to serve some corporate overlords may seem like a good strategy to you but I see it as a fail. The people who are fired up about Bernie are not going away and your establishment shills need to find a way address our concerns or the dems will not be winning elections for a long time otherwise keep your party that is paid to lose by the same donors who own the GOP..
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  22082. You are not honestly trying to compare the economic conditions of 250 years ago to now are you?  Don't call me uninformed as you apply this spin.  In those days we did not operate as a country in the sense we do today,  no country did.  There is no country in the history of humanity that did what we did in the mid 1900's with our statist ways and we changed the standard of societies forever in that period.  Pretending that fact does not exist and we can go back to how we ran things in the late 1700's is ridiculously out of touch.   We already have things that govern themselves and we call them countries.  You still want to hand power to the state only this makes you different from what I want by  single level of government meaning your "country" is much smaller and therefor has less resources than mine with no other advantage.  The power house blue states cover the red ones anyway and so if we were to go it on your own the red states would look like good old Somalia much faster.   If you think 50 little countries would work better than one big one then I do not know how to help you.  That you do not understand ideas like economies of scale  and the many critical things federal government does reduces the weight of your argument.  The federal government does send resources from state to state,  it is telling the 10 poorest states that take more than they gave are all red.   So much for the success of free market principles your ideas you are based on.
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  22183. Logical Lion That there are currently few nearly "lawless" areas predominated by white people is a function of how our society has shook out.  This is not an issue of color but circumstance.   It was not long ago that Italian gangs rules specific areas and owners payed protection money to "gangs" to keep them safe.  The spin this is an exclusively black phenomena is a false narrative as there have been Italians, Jews the Irish who have all had the same kind of structure. The common denominator was they were all poor and marginalized because they were a minority community on the outside.   In your example the spin that it is just about knowing the father seems pretty weak. The fact is one of the children has backing and parents that can afford to pay bail and is treated as a default differently than the other who is a child of single mother who has nothing and can do nothing about the issue. They two groups are simply not treated the same even if the arrested person is white. This is often because the application of law is different in the different regions.  In the case of the Urban cops it is just another arrest and they are charged with making them and do so at a higher rate than in the burbs.  There is no overt directive that drives this but it is about how the regions officers attack the problem that is different.  White people use drugs as the same rate as black people and go to jail far more often for the exact same offense. This issue is shown as stark in the case of Tamir Rice a 12 year old who was shot for holding a toy gun in the park.  The cops drove up on the lawn and shot him dead without so much as a drop the gun.  That simply does not happen to white kids in the park and the chance of being shot in a confrontation with police is much higher if you are black.  You will hear the detractors to the observation tell you they make the police do this.  But time and again with video footage of the shootings the cops are shown to shoot first and ask questions later in a great many of these cases.    White people use and sell drugs at the same rate as black people.  The key difference is white people tend to sell to a group of associates while black people sell it on the street to strangers.  It is more a matter of custom within the communities and it means that blacks get arrested for the same crime much more often.  There are a lot more white "drug dealers" than black ones but that fact is not reflected in the arrest or incarceration statistics.   The fact they are ruining lives and setting up a whole community to fail is the reason they should be more concerned.  1 and 3 black men will go to prison at some time in their lives and this is a direct reflection of their communities structure, their schooling, their opportunities/options and how laws are enforced in their community compared to white people.   The nuclear family issues is a directly tied to economic opportunity as well.  In the 60's before the manufacturing collapse happened in the bigger cities where the black population is centered nuclear families were the standard.  The collapse of opportunity and jobs has put a strain on families throughout the entire sector that once relied on those jobs.  The whole cycle of poverty and poor education was intensified over the years as funds dried up for education and opportunity redoubling the issues in the community.  I argue this is a not a problem caused by skin color but is just another effect of a the community being poor and marginalized.   Everything I have shared is based on statistics and historical fact as well.  For 200 years we had institutionalized racism as a feature of our system.  A short 50 years ago that was overturned by law.  We are still dealing with the fall out of a time when black people were second class citizens and their regional dispersion and the wealth in their community is directly attached to that legacy. I do not say this to lay blame or remove responsibility of those who step across the line but understanding these historical truths and how they effect the modern day can give us an idea how to attack the problems facing these communities.   I do not believe the racism is overt but it is most certainly systemic.  It is born from the fact we are not talking about apples and apples when we compare two police departments one who works in the inner city and one who works in the burbs.  They have a different focus for community policing and their arrest records and how they do their jobs reflects this.  Better training and policy for our police needs to be in place to address these issues.  We need to attack the underlying problems of poverty and many of these issue will go away as the focus of the police will shift to become more like how they act in more affluent areas.   For the moment it is easy to see that how as a black person you might feel marginalized because of your skin color.  As long as there is a perceived and actual imbalance in the way respective areas are policed and how individuals are treated in each community the perception of racism will be promoted by he actions of the officers.  
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  22185. Douglas IRL You do not have to tell them that they will lose benefits if the other side wins because they openly advocate for cutting them.  The fact is these benefits are not new and that they are more heavily used now is because the decent paying jobs that people once had when the program was implemented simply do not exist any more.  The min wage now qualifies you for food stamps because one can not live on that amount of money.  It means we are supporting companies like walmart with subsidized labor we all pay for raising costs of the programs.   That one party wants to preserve a system that is the thin line between us and 3rd world when dealing with the poor does not make them what you say the are.  The entire first world takes care of their poor and that you pretend there is better way to handle this problem that the right is proposing is nonsense.    Every time the GOP talks in public they hack on social security and medicare.  If they had their way as recently as Bushes term and were able "privatize' it we would have seen that money evaporate in the economic crash of 08.  There is no way to pretend a group who openly advocates for gutting these programs as a plank in their policy cares about them or how people would hurt if they went away. There is no way to pretend the GOP is champion of these programs and anyone who looks at the record sees this.   I do not trust to the GOP to serve anyone but their donors and their clearly stated policy leads to economic ruin for the majority as history has shown time and again.  At this point it is becoming impossible to trust the dems either as they are in someones pocket too but they at least pay lip service to the ideas required for membership in the 1st world. There is no enslavement.  For decades the GOP employed the southern strategy that swept up the racists as they fled the dems after the civil rights act.  They have openly campaigned for polices that directly hurt the poor and often demonize them as somehow deserving where they are while those at the top are there by virtue of merit.  They have estranged themselves from the black voter with these actions and have done nothing since then to bring them back.  The spin "they want free stuff" plays well to the right wing base but anyone who looks at the situation more closely can see why the GOP gets the level of support from the Black community that they do.  
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  22191. genie0390 Because your rights end at the tip of your fingers just like mine do.  I can not restrict your rights because we disagree the same way you can not.  What you are asking for is not rights but a demand you can be bigoted and restrict others rights.  In our country you are free to be a bigot all day long, you are not free to withhold service that is offered to the general public based on it.  Your religion and right to choose a faith is protected, your right to to openly discriminate against others in the public sphere is not.  If you do not think you can serve the general public because of your views that is your choice but your short comings are your own and should have zero impact on others.  In the same way a Mennonite can not be a bus driver because of his religious beliefs you should probably not own a store or business where you will encounter people you object to.  We know what the face of religion looks like when it has total control and it is clear from the examples freedom is not a value it promotes. It is you who demands you have the answers we just demand everyone gets to choose their own answer.  If you do not like gay marriage, do not get gay married.  If you do not like black people do not invite any over for dinner but you can not ban them from your store. You assert that removing your right to discriminate and be bigoted restricts your religious freedom but nothing could be further from the truth.   You have lost nothing but the support of society to be closed minded and backward.  You are free to continue your stone age thinking but you are not free to impose it on others. 
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  22240. ***** The only reason Iran was remotely empowered is because of his support.  It is easy to be the hero when you are the one pulling the strings from behind.  I am happy to see the escalation toned down but without a backer like Russia Iran would have never taken the stand or had the resources they did.  Putin gets all the credit for deescalation with the caveat that he was a big part of the problem in any case. That he pardoned pussy riot and freed Mikhail Khodorkovsky is part of a an re-branding of a man who was architect of the policies that put them in jail.  It does not change the fact his polices have not changed or if they have are getting  more draconian. I hope Russia continues to act as an agent for peace in the region even if for no other reason then it further forwards their own economic benefit in the long term. His over all policy is very nationalistic, has chosen a minority to demonize, has set one leader up who has end run the Constitution to remain in power.  All the while viciously attacked and silenced his opponents with the power of the state.  He has allied with the church and attracted a contained but fanatical base of support by enacting discriminatory polices that have seen a spike in anti homosexual violence. He is a dangerous man.  The direction he is taking his country in with the seizing of control of the public  media is a damning trend.   Sing his praises at with caution. It was not too long ago another charismatic xenophobic dictator rose to power  on nationalism, charisma, control of media and a target to demonize as the other.  I understand he  was the root of some real problems if  not for the world but elements of their own population,
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  22253. Jononutoob It is a misnomer that it is primarily small business that take advantage of min wage when in fact the biggest benefactors are places like walmart and McDonalds.   It is your assertion that it crush's small business when in fact the actaul numbers we have show the opposite.  Calling the min wage fascist is a joke as it is your spin the real corporate fascists and think tanks fight for.   You are talking like you are some kind of populist when in fact you are fighting for the very richest to be richer.  You really should cite one place on the planet that has got it right as your ideas have never survived contact with reality as a beneficial concept. Slave wage is a valid term and even if it offends your sensibilities it is more than valid.  When you require government assistance just to get by while working full time you are working a virtual slave wage.  It is in fact your policy of fighting the min wage that has kept them at borderline poverty and that you imagine it has nothing do with how people are paid by the greediest is myopic at best and plain blind at worst.  That you excuse the cuase of the problem and blame the workers is typical.  You are the kind that sees a group who has got exponentially richer as the rest of us had flat wage increases all the while we have improved productive and still fight for the richest. Your question of which is worse is a non starter as the company making a billion a year will make 980 and that is better than the zero they make with no workers too.  The companies in question rely on their workers to make their profits and that you imagine they should have no social responsibility while you call 1/3 of the work force lazy is a sickening outlook.   The choice is not between 8 and 0 and that has been shown again and again by real world examples.  There is no need to trust your gut or the think tank propiganda on this subject.  You can say it is kicking the can down the road but that is just another talking point from the derange right and has no basis in reality.  You really need to find out what that term means as it refers to borrowing money and in the case of min wage it makes no sense. I don't blame walmart but then I do not think we have to let them run over the poor because they can.  We have options and one of them to raise the min wage as it has been shown to be a positive thing and while none of your spin has been validated mine has by example.
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  22263. Red Lion You do not know what the term means.  He does not support their policy positions or any of the fact free nonsense they say.  He supports their right to say it and does not define them as terrorists as they do. This is not a regressive position and there is nothing regressive in doing so even as the people he speaks for most certainly are regressive and would not return the favor.  To say the defense of the right of idiots to be idiots is regressive is flat out wrong and for you to be correct he would have to defend their position and not their right to say it.   Regressive actually already has meaning and you do not get to make one up.  In doing so you are misrepresenting someone else's position and are doing exactly what Harris objects to so strongly when others do it to him.  As you accuse Cenk of being narrow minded and immoral I challenge you to look at your own views which are simplistic and sweep with too broad a brush.    I stand in direct opposition to all fundamentalists of all types but I do not pretend the all are synonymous with the worst elements that spring from their ranks.   Your spin directly attacks a single religion with an effort to marginalize it.  As you attack anyone's right to choose a faith you empower those who would choose yours for you.  As you lump the majority of any community in with the worst element you alienate those who can do not most good in marginalizing the worst assholes we universally loath.   You are not describing your opponents very well as it is you who is taking an anti progressive absolutist authoritarian supporting stance in labeling all Muslims as the same brand of cancer.
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  22264. Red Lion I never called you regressive, I will not until you say something that is.   You misstate my position much like you do all you oppose.   I think all fundamentalists are cancer and Muslims are not excepted from that characterization.  I universally oppose most all they stand for and believe they are inherently tyrannical conformists who damage any society they are part of. Muslim societies today are especially hard hit by this as in many cases they have the power to enact law and this makes them especially dangerous.  That being said I would not expect a unfettered fundamentalist christian leadership to be be any better. It is not when you make distinctions that your rhetoric is a concern but when you do not. When you tap into the innate distrust of the other, or the foreigner that paves the way for your sharing rhetoric with fact free christian fundamentalists that you should be concerned.   Looking at much of the spin I see from your side starts the demonize all Muslims trope for the sins for the terrorists.  It then maps fundamentalist failings that are universally repulsive as innately part of Islam when it is not hard to see the mirror image in Christianity suppressed by law.  When I see talk about banning mosques and kicking out immigrants that plays into a wholly unproductive hysteria that has little to the with the people you are actually targeting. I defend no theocrats and NEVER will, to say I do is dishonest.  That does not mean I pretend that the worst elements among them are the same as the terrorists that spring from their ranks.  I loathe a clown like Huckabee but I would never pretend he was the same an abortion bomber even as they agree on almost everything.   I consistently and thoroughly condemn them every time I get a chance and am in direct unswerving opposition to them, all of them.   I stand on the side of freedom of religion because if they can limit one faith that means they can turn their guns on anyone. I do not trust anyone with that power as I value my freedom too much. I will fight for the right of people to be fact free even if they would not do the same for me.  Defending religious and personal freedom is more important than promoting my ideology because without it my view point may be crushed too.  
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  22265. Red Lion They are all equally fact free and devoted to dogma over reason,  They all would see others conform to their fact free way of thinking and are universally authoritarian lemmings. Please give me the example of a benign fundamentalist because those identified as such share common failures.    I do not care about violence on the other side of the world the same way you do.  The reason for violence in the places we both know you are talking about is linked to more than an innate failure of one religion and you know it. If Islam was innately the problem we should have always expected the kind of violence we see now from them.  The fact is Muslim extremists a pretty new actor on the field suggests to me something more than an innate failure of a faith I never agreed with but do not tar with the same brush you do.  I see the violence in fundamentalists of Christianity as well in here in the US they are a much bigger threat to my sovereignty and safety than Muslims are. This does not cede any of my loathing for the assholes in the middle east but it is hard to ignore Christianity as they oppose progress here at home and not in a bombed out hell hole. The reformation you talk about had nothing to do with modernizing Christianity.  It severed it from the yoke of Catholicism and nothing more. The reason Christianity is recently hobbled as a tool of regression is our severing it's ability to make law.  Every time we have taken a step forward against the elements universally attached to all fundamentalists it was Christianity who has said no and held us back. A quick look at what fundamentalists advocate for "reformed" or not shows their desires to be remarkably similar to their Muslim breathern. I believe in freedom I will not sacrifice that because I face an intractable foe that does not. In this fight I stand against all fundamentalists and will continue to going forward.  I will not spare one group of them as they are all the exact same flavor of cancer. I will not join into a theist witch hunt that serves the narratives of many I oppose and who would gladly see me outlawed just like they want to demonize all Muslims for the crimes of a few. 
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  22505. Total nonsense, your major problem is it is always men who draw "gods borderlines" and no one can claim to have the definitive version. You all can't be right and that you think you have the only answer is simple hubris. This means that no one gets to pick gods laws we all live by in a free society that values freedom of and therefor from religion. That you say your god defines anything has all the validity for others as saying that the flying spaghetti monster demands everyone should gay sex with the power of his noodlely appendage. No one is compelled to follow your vision of what your god wants but that is a good thing for you if my imaginary gay converting pastapharians seek getting more popular. Your list of gods rules are arbitrary and includes garbage no one is compelled to follow in a free society while skipping over real problems that your god apparently ignores entirely. That you include "idol worshiping" before murder speaks to how messed up your or your god's priorities are. That you think he wants to police how adults have sex and that orphans are specially protected from robbery is also bazaar. I do not live in Saudi Arabia and my constitution ensures laws are not written to promote any churches views. This gives me and anyone like me choice to ignore your bronze age rules and choose ours based on freedom and equality rather than just empty tradition. You may let fear and credulity rule you as cringe in subservience to a celestial dictator who cares how you have sex and who you have sex with but many have moved beyond your limitations and reject the bizarre bronze age sadomasochistic nonsense you buy.
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  22585.  @Misesian86  We had 50 years with no bust's. It took corporate america buying out both parties in the late 90's to roll back protections and cause another after crash at the end of bush2. We fixed nothing since then and the same failures have been compounded by further roll backs that kept banks and wall street in check for half a century. Rules that protected capitalism from itself once remove started the boom bust cycles we had not seen in a generation. Of course you would be ok ruling social security as unconstitutional, you want to live in a backward third world country because you have your identity wrapped up in this small government nonsense that would do nothing for you or yours in any way. The assertion governments do too much is an ignorant talking point that does not make sense. It speaks to your lack of understanding of economics, history, economy of scale or what actually works in the real world. Our failure is directly attached to the fact our leadership is for sale and does not even pretend otherwise. This claim is validated if you look at what they do and do not pass. Many democracies the world over do a better job at stopping monied interests from buying leadership but ours has simply stopped trying. Single payer would most effective and cheapest at a federal level. Having 50 agencies doing what one could is waste of money has no advantages at all. The larger any insurance pool the better it does at mitigating costs and remaining solvent. Having federal standards for pollution makes sense at all levels of government. The idea we as normal people should be pushing back against them is incomprehensible to me. There is no amount of oligarch rolling in cash that makes me side with them over my families health. Texas is deeply gerrymandered state that is anti democratic. The will of the people is largely ignored and cities are stripped of power to hand it to the state when they fight for their people. The GOP does not win by popular majorities and it is only because the will of the people in cities is suppressed do they ever win. What you want is a fallacy that has not existed in the modern era. There is no working example of it on the planet for you to point at as a success. This is because it is an empty pipe dream sold to you as an identity for rich assholes to rob everyone around you as they point at the federal government they bought as the problem.
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  22733. You tried to make the claim it is unfair to make them pay more and that is countered by the argument it is unfair for them not to because they get far more from the society than those who make less. That at one time we did not have this facility for tax collection does not mean it is immoral or wrong that we have it now. Even bringing up that we did not have it at one time is now meaningless. In my worker example they are same the only factor that is different is one guy has been there longer. So it is with someone having a higher wage, they are different because one makes more and therefor they not in the same group. You can not say it is ok for the one guy to be paid more and not ok to charge the higher earner more, additionally you can not dismiss the point with a wave of your hand because this example is in the private sector. There are innumerable qualifications for any number of government programs. You as a smaller farm do not qualify for the exact same subsidies as a larger one, nor are you bound by the same regulations, etc. You as an American qualify for legal aid or not based on income. Most normal tax payers can not take advantage of the built in tax loop holes because it takes a certain amount of money invested many will never have so they work. Most citizens are not in a position to take advantage of paying income as a corporation with it's requisite advantages even as some are. You are equal but effectively different as a low earner by design, why not a higher earner? There are all kinds of things that make you the same but different depending on if you qualify any given program or responsibility. Paying a higher rate of taxes based on your reported income for that year is simply one of them. There is nothing unfair or uneven about this as it is universally applied and one year you may pay more and another you pay less. It is based on your level of success and what you gathered from within our shared system. Taxing income progressively is by far the most equitable way to determine how much tax to pay. A progressive tax system is eminently more fair than a regressive one especially if delivers a free stable productive frame work for society and earning to exist and prosper in.
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  22921.  @MrJjjd1  I am not wrong .. i said most free market system. And we are. There is literally no analog of your working system anywhere. The ACA was a weak half measure republican plan that they now hate. It did decrease how quickly costs were rising but made it a central plank to empower the middle man insurance corps that have zero value and are perversely incentivized to increase costs. Drug costs are another big problem that need to be resolved. Big pharma charges us more than anywhere else for the same drugs because of policy their lobbyists wrote and got passed against the interest of Americans. Complaining about the regulation written by Republicans on behalf of the people who own them as a failure of a single payer is silly and empty. What makes you so certain your asserted system works when in fact I see no reason for providers to cut cost at all, ever? Even in a totally free market prices rising push many of the more undesirable customers out of the market and insurance companies make more money by shutting out these people as costs on payouts go down and premiums for everyone else go up covering the difference. Your monopoly bullshit is empty, our government policy is to blame. But that blame rests on giving insurance companies control of our markets while we as tax payers cover the most expensive people in our system. They have downloaded the costs for the aged onto us while they skim off billions in operational costs and profit at the expense of american lives. When you quote a think tank that fights to preserve the status quo as a standard and never does anything but argue for policy to make their benefactors even richer it undermines your non existent credibility.
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  22922.  @MrJjjd1  I never contradicted myself at all, and I was not wrong. All your assertions attached to a free market helping us are entirely empty and not based on ANY DATA at all. You miss the context of everything you shared and the fact is everyone everywhere added new health care regulations during that period. No one else ended up paying the costs we do. Can you explain that outside a bubble you seem to have created? So the issue is not that government was too involved but how it was involved and who it was serving when the policy was enacted. I acknowledge that many of the policies enacted did increase costs. They were put in place at behest of a lobby that exists in no other system and that is the root of the problem, not that government made rules. It is why our rules drove costs up as cost control was not a concern to those who wrote them. I never made the assertion that a monopoly is the problem, that is your claim. Your argument is undermined by the fact in every other first world country they all have very defined health insurance monopolies and yet everyone of them pays less than us. It is how these polices are enacted that matter and who they are written to serve. I do not have a problem with facts, I have problems with the silly counter factual assertions you draw from them. You are literally stating a faith based (never proven) assertion that "open completion" and no involvement from the state at all would have been better with nothing to back it up. Blaming regulations seems silly when everyone else wrote regulations too and ended up in a different place.
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  22923.  @MrJjjd1  I have a business so I do understand why people create them. But as a business person I look at models that work and those that do not to understand what to invest in. Health care is a special market and has the same kind of demand the need for a fire department or police department does. You could create private police forces and fire departments and collect payments from everyone that can afford it and leave others to burn/be robbed. By paying for the service in this way the providers would be perversely insensitivized on the roll of providing the service to the whole society. When you sell oxygen (something people can not do without) controlling costs is not a driving factor as there is consistently no choice if you need the service or not. It is not a commercial good in the same way a toaster is. Insurance costs are mitigated by having the very biggest pool and controlling operational costs like any business. Our system absorbs the most expensive group and then breaks it into many small pools all of which have overhead to maintain. The model is destined to be more expensive than all the single payer models and no amount of competition changes that as we still need to cover those who can not afford it and those who are too old to buy it. The answer from a business perspective is to consolidate overhead and create the biggest pool we can so the costs of the old are offset by the premiums of the healthy. We save billions by cutting out unneeded head office staff of multiple billion dollar firms and consolidating it a more efficient structure. Medicare for all has a much lower cost on delivery than any for profit provider. Consolidation of costs is a primary reason for mergers and accusations of top corporations. The idea that if the government does it then that is "bad business" is empty nonsense that is not borne out by the many models we can look at in the field right now. We do not have to guess what happens, we have living breathing examples to study. There is a good reason there is no version of a free market health care system on the planet. It would not and does not work and you need some kind of insurance system to fund it. It is just a matter of what form that system takes and the argument deregulation is the answer is not borne out by anything but an empty claim.
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  22924.  @MrJjjd1  I have a software firm and have had my hand in a few other business's as well over the years. I would value an opportunity to draw from a workforce where I did not have to worry about their health care and investing in people who do not have it and have to pick up the slack. I spend a great deal on my employees getting them to where thy are productive and it makes sense I provide health care to ensure they are healthy and can work. I would save a lot on administration and effort if I did not have to worry about that and was able to focus on what I do to make money instead of messing around with insurance companies. Of course there is something special about health care. Everyone needs it at some point and you are literally taking your life in your hands not being covered. How is this remotely analogous to buying a toaster. Like a fire department you do not need it until you do and if you have to buy it on need it will be too expensive and too late. The idea our police and fire departments are ineffective because they have no duty to serve us is entirely fallacious. First responders are known as heroes almost universally. There is a good reason these services are public every where that could be considered civilized. The assertion the programs would be better served with a profit motive is entirely unfounded. In the modern era you can point to no modern civilization that makes a for profit system work in any of these arenas for a good reason. If I did not pay taxes I imagine It would be shit like Somalia or some other tax less third world hell hole. My workers would be uneducated, my power unstable, my water dirty and my roads patchy and ineffective. My air travel would be riskier, my food and drugs more problematic, security costly, etc, ect, ect. I am successful because of the society my business exists in. My taxes pay for many critical services that we do not ever think about. If I had to go buy all of them piecemeal from many suppliers I can not see how this would save me money because as with everything buying in volume is always cheaper than buying a one off. It would also cut my access to key services only giants could afford. In certain situation I can and do charge much higher rates. Need service over the weekend or holiday I crank up the rates and that is laid out before you do business and elect not to buy a service plan. This is pretty standard and business's understand they need to pay more if they do not buy in and because this is a standard practice it is acceptable. So the answer is yes, sometimes. Mostly when they are over a barrel and have no choice, most will only have one or two of these issues uncovered before buying a service plan and mitigating their cost risk. That they pay monthly means I can budget for the staff to cover their needs and if they pay as they go I have to charge more because I can not plan the work. When you are selling something that means the life or death of your child charging too much is only problematic if you put it out of range for your market. The fact is they are, millions of Americans are uncovered because our system is too expensive and 30k a year die do lack of care when that number is zero in the rest of the free world. The spin you cited is consistently shared to maintain the status quo along with all their other statements and "studies". The is no proposed policy that goes along with this these assertions just a half baked data free claim it would be better and cheaper if there were no rules.
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  22925.  @MrJjjd1  You say i am making unfound assuptions. The fact is there is no moden country you can point at with no taxes. Anyone asserting we do not need to pay them and still live a moden life is actually entirly unfouded and i charge you with what you pretend i am doing. My assumptions are founded in real wold examples yous in an imaginary systrm that will never survive contact with reality intact. Your assertuion that anyone is better statless is entirly unfounded and is faith based idea you have bought into like a religon. Your history on education here is empty. We have had public school's that I will put againt any no tax state any day. You can pretend adding a profit motive to schools makes them better but all the best edcation system in the world are pubic. If our system is suffering it is the charter school thieves and the leaders that that are to blame as they actively defund it. You can find people who scoff at public education and critque is as not necessaripy ideal but you need to take a look at their motivations and conclusionof these people. not just the sound nites you gave that do not undermine the value i take in our education system as an employef. The concerns you raise are not solved by getting rid of public education. Most of our educatiom systems issues could be addressed by disallowing our leaders from being for sale to the highest biddrr. When you spit the same talking points as the group who is breaking our education system complaiming about the quality seems pretty disingenuous... In any case i have no problem finding qualified people that are graduates of our system. I imagine i would have bigger issue anwhere that does not have a public school system. I am aware of out education systems issues and concerns but attacking it as useless now is stupid and counter productie.
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  22926.  @MrJjjd1  That we have failures in our system (primarily because of 3 trillion dollars in unfunded wars an that our leaders are for sale) does not speak to the idea we would be better off without any system. Making the entire country like flint does not seem like much of a solution. I do not live in flint, pointing at the overt failures in our system does not validate your ideas. The fact is it is people exactly like you who cut testing and deregulated corporations to let them poison our water and air in the name of profit, that is the root of our problem. Our leadership is bought by the people who are the polluters and the idea if we had no government there would be no pollution seems very poorly thought out. Our problems like flint are a travesty that need to be addressed but there is no way to argue that we would be better off without a government to achieve clean up. I expect the problem would be far worse an far more widespread without any kind of regulation. You can pretend people should be doing these government jobs for free all you want but this is empty spin of zero value. Asserting that government workers do not provide a valuable service is nonsense and speaks to nothing but ignorance. For every bad thing associated with the FDA (which is prone to corruption in a system where leadership can be openly bought) we could expect the problems to be exponentially worse without it. Getting rid of regulation does not get rid of malfeasance, it rewards it without risk. Your spin has no analogue in the real world because like a Communist your ideas would never survive contact with reality intact. Both very different systems of suffer from the exact same problem in that they do not address the nature of corruption that destroys these them even if theoretically they should be better but in practice they never ever are, and never will be.
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  22940. This is a tempest in a tea pot and not a big deal for the handful of people ever negatively effected by it. Depending on the level of sport the legitimacy of this discussion changes, most people deeply against it have no dog in this fight and are painting their ignorance of the larger subject based on personal feelings and limited information often spun to engage them by trigging their anger. The idea this is a matter of safety is empty as outliers in size and strength even within the traditional standards already exist in all sport. There is not a lot of valid arguments for integration and few very strong ones against it. This assertion is especially true in kids sports where size and power of individual children vary widely even within a single biological sex. As long as we are not excluding boys who are too small or girls who are bigger than their contemporaries the safety argument we are ignoring the safety argument already. No reasons to start coddling kids who want to compete in sports more than we already do. At higher levels of sport the argument becomes less clear. As I look at it, the actual problems it causes it seems to be of little concern. To demand a dedicated professional athlete stop competing over an concern that is less about fairness and more about a preservation of a status quo is a tough sell. In woman's sport the status quo means they will continue to be unfortunately as second rate and uninteresting compared to men's sports. I personally see very little upside in being draconian about it, professionals are beat by other professionals all the time. They are used to it. This is an issue that affects almost no one, many who never bother to ever even follow woman's sports oddly now seem very concerned about fairness of contests they never watched. If you were not engaged in woman's sport before and still have a strong opinion on this it is because you have been led to it by your chosen media. You do not have the whole picture and are buying into an strong identity based argument over an issue that does not and will not change your life. It is another blatant empty policy distraction to make you look the other way as clowns at the top rob us all
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  23075.  @1717-c1l  That you do not care about deaths is why many people are morally superior to you. That you care about name calling more is pretty sad. Hopefully the days of heavy restrictions are behind us but the hardship caused by imposing them is not owned by science or left but by our billionaire owned leaders that did not give people the resources to properly isolate. It was Trump and his do nothing hateful goons that made our pandemic much much worse. It was only after they were tossed from office did anyone think to make a national vaccine distribution plan we desperately needed. Masks are incredibly effective in preventing spread inside closed areas compared to taking no precautions. We have been using them to protect those in surgery for over 100 years. There is literally no downside to wearing one because if infected it most certainly reduces your chances of spreading it. The idea this virus was meant to target Trump's continuation of the Obama's economic legacy of low paying jobs and the rich getting richer is entirely mindless. This was a world wide pandemic and it only hurt us they way it did is because at first Trump decided to ignore it and then later to only bail out wall street and the ultra rich instead of helping real americans. Trump is a laughing stock that only you and your fellow cultists do not consider a halfwit joke. The planet over they consider the tiny narcissistic silver spoon man child you worship a clueless idiot. I know him far better than they do and because of my knowledge I consider him a entitled criminal stain who is below my contempt. Trump simps call people hateful deeply ignorant names daily. The idea you are above the fray on this issue is hilarious as both Trump and the media you love to consume slander people as a matter of standard practice. You stand with actual monsters who have definitively proved they do not care if your family lives or dies. You carry their flag and use their ridiculous talking points to prop up a broken ignorant identity cutting off your nose to spite your face as you do.
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  23076.  @1717-c1l  Unnatural death at the hands of a plague is universally despised and avoided at all costs by sane members of most societies. Being a death cult is does not make your lack of concern for others look any more noble. Ignoring science for superstition is what tribal throw backs focus on and they are stones around the neck of humanity. I do not care what you think your god does or what you think he wants. It is entirely irrelevant to me. You are judged by others on how you treat and look out for your fellow man. Not how you self evaluate against your custom selected theology to prop a regressive identity. Rule of thumb, when you ever agree with the Taliban on almost anything you are going the wrong way. One on one most Trump supporters are fine people. They love their families, give to charity and care for those they see as in their community. I know they are good people but they have been blinded by identity based nonsense to become tools of regressive harm by repugnant and unrepentant liars. They ape monsters because they have had their justifiable anger at the unfairness we all face focused back against their own interests. Most have no idea who they actually hate and attack a naked straw man while supporting the most overtly corrupt and repugnant even by their own perported standards. They are blinded by appeals to targeted cultural preconceptions and the overt lies they like the sound of. Inside this bubble they are fed overt nonsense ginning up anger against the "other" to the point of having a separate, unhinged and partisan manufactured reality separate from anyone outside it. Putin is a totalitarian killer, no worse than Bush, Obama or Trump though. He just has more power to act like a dictator than our president legally does.
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  23077.  @1717-c1l  Millions of people wear a mask daily as part of their job even before the pandemic. If the cost of everyone's safety is wearing a mask in specific locations while I am there I have no issue with it. Now outside the pandemic there is no real upside to mask use so I do not expect them to be in regular use long term and in the near future you can expect mask mandiates to drop as number of vaccinated rises. The masks stop people from spitting aerosolized particles when talking or coughing. No one asserts they stop virus's directly but they stop the spreading of spit particles potentially containing the virus around in closed public areas. There is no correlation with infection and mask use. That is an overt lie when there is direct and proven correlation with infection case spikes in unmasked over masked public indoor gatherings. Your assertion is 100% backwards and the kind of misinformation the liars you parrot use to misrepresent reality. Yes we have survived 100,000's of thousands of years. In our bygone era's some plagues killed up to 60% of the population. In those days we laid it at the feet of gods and attempted to pray ourselves to safety. We took the advice of carnival barkers and drank bath tub remedies dreamed up by hucksters. Now we have medicine and understand the nature of the challenge we fight. We no longer need a god or a magic potion to attack the problem. We can pay attention to science and save 100's of millions of lives over the decades. Over the last 50 years through inoculation we destroyed several deadly and crippling pathogens by our collective effort and civic will. This should be no different.
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  23098.  @Coonazz791  Me? Why would I be in fear? See me arming up to go shopping? That is the sign of fear, not scoffing at the shivering clowns hiding behind guns. Pretending fear is my problem is pretty stupid given what you defend. As I said, I am a gun owner. It is tool I respect and understand. I just see the people who for some reason feel the need to walk around armed as useless and sad. I am not ignorant on this subject. I just do not trust most clowns who think they need to be armed in their daily life. They represent a tiny cross section of gun owners so stop lumping us all together. Pretending all gun owenrs have a gun fetisish is silly. I see no reason to trust a bunch of npc's that live in a bubble of fear so acute they feel the need to have deadly force with them at all times. Unless you can expect armed assailants to be attacking you there is no upside to carrying a weapon. I barely trust the police, but at least they are trained. They are held to a basic standard of competence I can not expect from a random citizen. I do not understand why you would put any faith in any of these random clowns. I am not about banning guns. I just do not want to live in a place where the going standard is to walk around armed. Where I live practically no one is armed, not the criminals not the families shopping. That is how I would have it. A gun is a tool used to hunt, it is not a smart watch or a new gadget to show off to your friends to make you look cool. Do you know where is safer than a gun rally? Almost any place there are no guns and almost no one carries them. It greatly decreases your chances of ever being accidentally shot.
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  23175.  Cory Ad  Trump cut rich peoples taxes and gave you temporary cuts while he made the richest most expensive cuts permanent. 80% of 2 trillion dollars of the cut went to the top 1%. You cheering for that hurts my ears unless you were at least one of them. Good for you on your return, that does not seem to be typical and I can find nothing supporting the numbers you cite. Everything is advertised between 5 and 7 percent. Unless you were heavily invested in companies that did stock buy backs with tax cuts and gained the advantage of them pumping stock prices the cuts did absolutely nothing for you. To get the kind of return you did it is clear you do not have a balanced 401k containing bonds, treasury bills and other more stable investment vehicles which were not affected by his cut. That is not true for most. Obama failed on health care because he enacted the republican health care plan Mitt Romney passed when governor. If was written by a right wing think tank called the Heritage foundation. It failed because it left the insurance companies intact and did not even create a public option to force them to compete. It was a lousy plan that was only an improvement because what we have before was actually way worse in the power it handed to insurance companies the power to kill citizens just to make extra money. That the democrats were ever forced to defend that garbage speaks to the fact they are working for someone else other than the people who demand medicare for all as the only affordable solution.
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  23249.  @Shooting_Star-v2e  I do not support the status quo. I support the best candidate in my set of options while also supporting the promotion of new ones that buck the status quo. We do not achieve anything by leaving the power in the hands of monsters. That is all you do by pretending the efforts of small dollar candidates do not effect any change, when it is undeniable they do. That what I want (an overthrow of the corporate dems) has not been achieved in a short 6 years is not the failure you pretend it is. We face a rich, entrenched establishment body who once controlled all access to power. Changing the conversation and moving what is standard and acceptable is what candidates like Fetterman do. These are the people who make the electorate aware that business does not have to be as usual. The unpopular talking points adopted by the paid to lose corporate democrats do not have to be the status quo. Polling has radically shifted on issues like medicare and the min wage even as the corporate democrat's ignore their base for donor cash. That is no reason to hand them keys and give up. It is the basis to make a solid and ever more popular argument to tear power from their corrupt hands. It is the trend that is reflected in the primaries won by progressive leaning democrats unbeholden to corporate cash. Every single one that wins changes the conversation in the correct direction, even if none of them are a silver bullet. We are fighting a giant corrupt machine, it will not be dismantled in a single blow. What you fight for and propose would leave the status quo intact. You are not a fighter for anything but stasis and getting nothing done. I sympathize with your frustration, but could not disagree with your spin more.
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  23251. ​ @Shooting_Star-v2e  The far left has not shifted the Overton window at all. Common decency of American's has overseen a change, I would argue the changes are in favor of individual liberty and personal freedom as the right fights viscously to go backwards. The build back better plan would have been a giant step forward if it had been allowed to pass by the conservatives in both the GOP and the democratic elite. Your spin from monsters that opposed it is total nonsense, using their talking points is an empty service to their paid to play fail. Amnesty for long term residents that have american families and business here makes sense. The arguments against it fall really mindlessly flat as we sit in the middle of literal labour shortage. Supporting this policy does not mean support for open borders by any reasonable definition of the words. If either party wanted to end the flood of undocumented workers they could. It would not be by demonizing the dirt poor people coming here to work their asses off doing shitty jobs while getting none of the merger benefits of citizenship. They would go after the business's that lure them here by the millions and benefit from the cheap unregulated labor. It is very telling that neither party ever talks about the root of this problem. Discussing better immigration and work visa policy should be on the table as a long term solution to the issue of undocumented workers. Demonizing the ones already here for a long time who made a life and are contributing to our economy does not make any sense if you want to solve the problem. Offering amnesty to select established and vetted candidates has little downside. Especially as we sit in the middle of a historic labor shortage caused by mass resignations and over a million extra deaths due to the pandemic. Pretending all amnesty policy is extreme is an ever harder argument to make outside a reactive dislike of these people who been here for a long time. Biden exceeded my expectations too. But to be fair, they were very very low.
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  23414.  @blkhemi3925  It literally means you support WS now. This is how these signs become things, a symbol is started somehow and gets picked up and popularized. If you flash that sign now you are not owning anyone, you are saying "i am a bigot". If it was a trick it has long morphed into the declaration of a real thing. What kind of asshole thinks it is funny to make a white power sign as a joke to make someone else look stupid? This spin is especially problematic as you ideologically sit beside self declared bigots. It is some bizarre self owning shit even if what you are saying is true. The meme may have started as a joke like you said. It was then picked up and used. It since has adopted by actual self declared bigots (like the assholes partying with Kyle) who now use it publicly and consistently. It is no longer just a meme and is regularly used by the white power community that Kyle now is denying he belongs to after identifying and partying with them. Apparently the makers of your meme tricked not only libs but the bigots too, they use it just like Kyle did. Pretending that white supremacy is not a thing is mindless. Pretending the right does not openly and regularly embrace overt bigots is entirely mindless. Asserting that Kyle was telling some kind of inside fringe right wing joke as he sat with self decarded racists is brain dead. No matter how the meme started, if you flash it today you are literally supporting overt bigotry and you are owning no one but your dumbass self. But go ahead and flash away, it correctly paints you in shitty light, as a shitty person. Own that.
    1
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  23715.  @justicewalking  She is not standing up for the other progressive non corporate democrats either and is buying into right wing framing on this issue. She is giving tacit support to dishonest spin by not objecting to it allowing liars like Rubin to frame the everyone running with fringe views backed by no one running. At best it is ignorant at worst dishonest. Her lying about opponents is no better than them lying about her and your one sided view point makes you seem like a con to me. There is no internal consistency to your objections as you defend her smearing anyone. I generally like Tulsi with a few objections but she really stepped off the cliff here. If one can not stand up and speak the truth when being told an overt lie then it directly undermines their credibility with me. I get her going on Rubin's show, but not taking over and re-framing the debate like when Bernie went on fox is a fail and only empowers Rubin's fact free narrative she never bothered pushing back on, worse yet she double downed on it appearing to disagree with what Rubin framed as her opposition when literally no one holds those views. Maybe she was silent on this because she is chasing right leaning votes she is unlikely to get anyway, maybe it is because she actually buys the talking point too. Either way I see no reason to ignore it. Like I said before I like Tulsi as a rule but when you go into the lions den you have to be sure not to let them take bites out of you. That is the risk you take making the call to take an interview with a clown like Rubin. I did watch the rest of the interview and generally liked what she said. I do not like her spin on border security or terrorism in general which seems to be framed toward a right wing audience. She uses their spin and talking points which does not make sense to me. I see her as already done in this cycle even if I had high hopes for in the past. Good thing is she is not going away and is young and has other cycles in her yet. She needs to figure out how to avoid the miss steps that annoy her base while courting the voters who primarily like her for her foreign policy stand to break through.
    1
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  24384.  @Xarlithion  Why stop anyone from giving out water? The poll officers can give out water but given the way the administration has blown up waiting times I do not expect that to be a priority as they are not required to do so. Getting rid of drop boxes is nothing but a lame attempt to make it harder for specific communities to vote, there is literally no upside. Forcing voters boxes to be placed incovenitely and limiting the number has no reasonable upside compared the the dark downside for millions of voters who strangely do not tend to vote republican. The "expansions" primarily target rural voters where the GOP holds power. They punish high density arears where they do not. It shrinks the amount of time voters can request early ballots to limit access from 6 months to just over 1. There is no upside to making it harder to vote unless you wish to discourage voting. Voter ID change is an open attack on communities that disproportionately do not have it. This is an old school GOP trick used to marginalize poorer voters for decades. Replacing the working system with this is only intended to suppress the votes of specific targeted constituencies. State law makers talking over control of local voting districts is to allow partisan law makers in power to control the result of elections more directly. These are all indefensible changes, I know that because I seen no one successfully defending them without misrepresenting the facts. It is pretty clear who is getting their take on the Georgia law from overt dishonest partisans. A hint, it is not me.
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  24451. BikeLion You like the right wingers miss the point that education in itself has value no matter what you take. That you have deem "gender studies" or "art history" as useless does not mean they are. The fact is these courses all have practical applications and have value in the experience and the contacts that are built while in school and hard to build outside it. We do not have to pick and choose what people can take. Even gender studies people end up earning more than average non post secondary education worker. The collage experience itself has value it brings outside what is studied, it creates contacts and networks that are consistently beneficial to those who have them. Entry requirements make a great deal of sense and demanding applicants show a level a commitment to education by haveing good marks and maintaining them is the best way to determine if someone deserves public support. Everyone who has xx% after high school should qualify and as long as they maintain their marks they should continue to be covered. We need to reward hard work, discipline and intelligence and ensure our best and brightest are not limited by who their parents are or their access to resources in order to get educated to their potential. Going to school does never guarantees you a job but if you do go then it is much less likely you end up a "working at star bucks" than if you don't. In the long term people who get a higher education (no matter what it is) consistently out earn over a lifetime those who do not, facts are facts.
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  24452. BikeLion Value is in the eye of the beholder and that is why your arbitrary standard excluding it does not make sense. If a college offers it then it should be open to be taken. If we as a society are concerned about specific subjects not being of value to society then perhaps remove them from the public colleges and force those interested into the universities where they are offered. That being said I would rather politics be kept out of what is offered as one group deciding what is and is not valuable based on their sensitivities does not reflect the views of others who do not agree. Any subject offered should be open to the students and no matter what they take as history shows they will bring more value back than what is invested on the whole. I do not think we should be waiting until after ending our homeless problem, destitution and poverty because the fact is access to education plays a huge roll in every one of those issues and the people you seem to want help are the ones who benefit from the program the most. You can not argue to deny access to collage based on resources and then pretend to care about the poor and solving that issue. The path to doing better with our poor is to improve and expand our education system and it is a first step to any plan that attacks poverty. Your excuse why the people with this education are doing better is nonsensical. You clearly do not have any clue what a person who studies this subject does for a living. Many go on to take jobs in business and liberal arts degrees are not the dead end many pretend they are even if they are less directly practical they consistently see their holders earn more than those without that education. It is not because of made up positions but because they have shown they can learn and have the basic skills of study and communication that many higher paying jobs require. The GI bill is an example of the results this kind of program can offer. They did not restrict what was taken and the program is considered a social and economic success after much study. The concerns that people are going to take courses you think are useless should not stop us from offering a program which is a logical extension of the education system we have today which is necessary in our modern era.
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  24453. BikeLion You miss my point as you mark the value of a "art history degree" as subjective. Getting a education on this subject does not have to have anything to do with enriching ones life and is training necessary to move into specific fields you may not value but have value none the less. My argument is that education does not have to have a definitive "measurable results" by your standards to have value to the individual or their future carrier no matter what they end up doing. These degrees get people jobs and your tacit assertion they of not is not remotely attached to reality. Your assertion of the value of a liberal arts degree was true in the 1960's is fact free. As a matter of fact you need some kind of degree (really does not matter what it is) to move up in most fortune 500 companies who value the process of higher education as a standard and they to this day hire the bulk of liberal arts graduates. "then surely we have enough money to make sure that all of the homeless are housed" The fact is we do have the money to do that but I would put the priority on education because one program is focused on teaching people to fish instead of just dumping a pile of fish at their door. I would rather empower people to their potential and undermine future homelessness and poverty than spend our capital pouring money down a hole that will never close until we address our education systems. There need be nothing subjective in the value of education as it has proven economic value to the society and it is an investment that has been proven to pay dividends to the society that focus's on it. I disagree with your assessment of the GI bill. It was a bill that allowed free college and tuition to many that would not have been able to afford that education otherwise. It was as significant contributor to our success in the years afterwards and is credited as such. The fact it was strongly undermines your assertion we need to restrict what is offered and you going to have to do better than wave away the example to dismiss it. The fact is not everyone would be able to get this if you enacted restrictions based on merit and test scores. The argument that if everyone gets education it twill b e useless is the same kind of argument used against all public education since day one. Again I point to the GI bill not everyone who could took advantage of but those who did ended up earning far more over their lifetime on average than the ones who did not. Arguing people getting education devalues education and therefore we should not offer it is undermined by the fact that more people in the stem fields would do the exact same thing. The better educated our population the better prepared we will be as we move into the future market place where our choices are a race to the bottom to become like third world countries or a charge to continue to be leaders. Again you are going to have to cite sources showing that liberal arts degrees have not value in industry today. Some kind of non affiliated degree is necessary for many jobs as a prerequisite in some cases because there is no direct training or that the skills learned in the process of getting the degree translate. Communication, research and the contacts gain through education are skill translated to almost any profession the graduate goes into and business understands this and hires based on it. Back ground is attached to access and connections many of which are not attached to family are built in the process of collage. Being a graduate makes you like other graduates and opens the door for you in ways it would not if you did not have it. It is totally casual and your argument is not is not well backed up. My argument is people get jobs with these "useless" degrees get jobs all the time. The people who graduate collage consistently get better paying jobs and make more over their lifetime than people who do not. This has been true for a long time and continues to be. Your assertion that a kid from a poor family has no chance of getting the alumni yale job may be true but they will get the job in fortune 500 companies hiring people with the requirement for a degree. The fact is most employers do not care what your degree was in because in almost every case as most jobs require almost complete training for new graduates once starting the job anyway. What the degree is in is not the most important thing, the value to the employer is the applicant has shown they understand can communicate to a certain standard and are trainable.
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  24454. BikeLion I never implied you said the GI bill was useless. I said that your point dismissing its use as a reference was empty. The scarcity of the degrees was more valuable at the time of the GI bill but that does not mean they are not valuable today or more importantly in the future. Your tacit unsaid assertion that the people with liberal arts degrees are not getting jobs compared to thier contemporaries without them is unfounded. If you have a degree you have more options than if you do not no matter what it is in. The fact is we have a youth unemployment problem in our country, the individuals who have a basic generic college education in this market have many more options than those who do not. The rate of college educated americans unemployed is a full percentage point lower than those who do not have one. They currently compete in a market with a top heavy segment of the population who has experience that trumps thier degrees but that does not make those degrees useless unless it also ties a financial chain around your neck like it does now. The unemployment numbers have very little to do with the value of degrees and more to do with the types of jobs available to the students in this particular market in this moment of time. The recession saw massive numbers of jobs cut and the people who bore the brunt of this were the most junior as is to be expected. As that corrects itself it will be the youth with an education who will be filled back in before others. It is very arguable depending on what you want to do a liberal arts degree gives you much more flexibility in your carrier. Specifically if you are targeting future administrative and leadership roles there are many more options for a more generic education than a specific ones because there are many more generic jobs than ones that require specific specialization and training, especially in business. So the spin that getting some kind of degree is not a guarantee of a job does not change the value of it especially when compared to those without them. The issue with liberal arts degrees in this environment is offsetting factor of the raw cost of education. Under the current paradigm the value to the individual will be always be diminished by the massive debt anyone without external support has to take on to get one. The fact is whatever your liberal arts major they all have more or less the same actual practical value yet they are still required for many positions as a standard. A person who specialized in music or history may appeal to some kinds of business but if for most jobs the item studied in school will not be directly applicable. It is the value of the education process itself that has value to the employers and many jobs require communications skills an ability to learn proven by the qualification of a degree no matter what it was in. I would tackle homelessness in a different way than we have in the past and any program that does so has to go hand in hand with on focus on education if it is going to be viable and create the options required to be successful and break the cycle of poverty gripping a segment of our population. Concepts like basic income would go a long way to addressing many of these concerns but it is not an achievable goal for the moment so instead of doing nothing I am advocating for a policy that is conceivably achievable in the near term. I find taking the massive burden of education off the youth and thier families wholly moral and the idea we deride concepts like public colleges to argue for to "help the homeless" misses the mark by a mile as they do not have to be mutually exclusive and are not in competition. Public college is an easier political sell right now and if you call that right wing so be it but I see it as simple pragmatism, a sort of political triage. I will not kill the good to get the perfect when what we have now is rotten. If this program was in place I would expect the vast majority to not take music history or women's studies but an education that suits them whatever that is. I do not want any administration to pick and choose what courses are taken because that is just a limiter on those who can not afford to go pay for a univeristy themselves and I see no value in it. We spend ridiculous sums of money on nonsensical things and just recently increased our already bloated military budget by an amount that would completely pay for the program proposed which does not have your limitations. We can afford this right now now and it would be infinitely more moral than what we are spending that money on currently.
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  24455. BikeLion Getting a bachelor degree is a qualification in itself no matter what it is in. Many get "liberal arts" degrees and it is the bachelor qualification that employers look at not necessarily what the degree is in. This should not be a tough concept and getting one has as much value as any vocational education because employers seek out this qualification and if you do not have it then you have fewer options. If you have a bachelor in history you are still qualified to apply your bachelor degree to work in insurance, sales, ect, ect, ect. Any job that has a bachelor degree as a qualification is open to you if you have one. That it is in history or woman's studies or even business does not change the fact your employer will have to train you for the specific job anyway. As far as the citation and employment and education level I did not pull the number out of my ass and if you think it is false I strongly suggest you look into this yourself and get yourself informed if you going to argue it is not true or dismiss it. One percentage point represents a lot of people your dismissal is empty. The people who have an education an unemployment rate below the national average and the ones who do not are over it. Couple this concept with the crippling debt we are forcing on student today just so they have an opportunity to compete in the future is indefensible. It would be the administration to directs the appoints leadership to the respective agency that oversee this service. To say it is not the administration is a distinction without a difference. This is about education not filling quota's laid out by industry to supply them with workers. You miss the point of the value of choosing education or extending post secondary to everyone . You are trying to treating it like a man power program when it should just be an extension of our existing public education process, a final step after high school for those who have the capacity to take advantage of it based on merit not who their parents are. Comprehensive education and mental health care reform has to be part of any serious attempt to deal with the homeless problem if you ever want to stem the tide of homelessness. Arguing we should not deal with a huge problem cause by the catch 22 of collage tuition that is crushing todays students and their need to get one to be competitive to attack a problem no one even has a realistic proposal solving it rings as nothing more than an appeal to do nothing. Your concern about what people choose to take is noted and I am sure you feel the same way about the choices those in high school make too. Are there any courses you would like to see eliminated as useless from high school program? What you find reprehensible about this rings as an attempt to make mountains out of mole hills and I will side with peoples right to take the courses they want and are interested in over faux demands for fiscal responsibility over an issues you do not even know are a problem. There is no proposal from anyone to stop people sleeping on the streets and you would be better to protest money poured down the drain of unwinnable wars, every growing military budgets, tax cuts and corporate giveaways before you try to trim fat by eliminating choices for students . I have news for you, the idea as it stands is already palatable and even more republicans agree with it than disagree. I do not see cutting it up to appease people who do not want it or want to minimize it as much as possible as a winning strategy. This policy is more popular today than it was 6 months ago and in 6 months it will be even more so. It is always wrong to come to any proposal to the table already paring back your offer to what you imagine they will accept. It leaves you absolutely no room to negotiate. This is what happened to the health care debate and the democrats initially proposed the GOP's version of health care while ignoring the public option to get them on board. The dems unilaterally surrendered before negotiations and ended up getting zero GOP votes anyway while watering down their own bill to get votes they never saw. This is the same path you propose. If in the end it is necessary to put the limits you want on the program to get the votes needed to pass those changes could be put on the table but handing it over as an unasked for concession of the bat is a failure. The answer to your last question is no, it is not better to surrender before a shot is fired especially as the tide appears to be in our favour.
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  24456. BikeLion I am sorry if I am coming off as hostile and it is an issue associated with nature of the venue and does not and should not directly reflect on you or what you shared. Thanks for bringing it to my attention. The fact is the people I speak to who make your objections or defer a program like this in favour of others while advocating for a conservative approach in limiting access to specific courses are generally unconcerned with other spending. If I tarred you with that brush and it is incorrect I again apologize but making those kind of assumptions are an expected hazard in this kind of venue. The fact is we can afford to do this program as evidenced by our increase in military spending in this cycle alone that would pay for it. The idea we unilaterally disarm to get elements on board who are not likely to budge no matter how much we cut out does not seem well founded as a strategy. We have numerous other places to get the money necessary for a program like this without having to take a push to solve homelessness off the table which does not even have a comprehensive policy proposal yet attached to it yet. As far as the data on the subject is concerned finding information correlated with different level of education is spotty and I could only find a few examples. I spent some more time and found an article breaking out the data in an interesting way. https://www.brookings.edu/research/employment-and-disconnection-among-teens-and-young-adults-the-role-of-place-race-and-education/ There is a chart about half way down that illustrates my point pretty dramatically. It does not break out different types of college degrees but shows a distinct and significant difference in employment percentages between those with a degree and those they who not. Under the current system the value of those jobs is mitigated by the debt incurred by the students who went and got loans to cover the post secondary education that increased thier chances for gainful employment. . As far as a limitation on programs I would rather if they were going to be limited at all it would be by what any respective college in the program offers and no more than that not by any administration. This could be achieved by laying out that stipulation as part of the bill. I do not want it to be a workers comp program and it should not be considered any more of an entitlement than universal public education is if we want it to be both successful and have the longevity to survive future cuts. "Entitlements" that everyone gets are much harder to cut than ones that only specific less powerful groups qualify for. By targeting it specifically at the poor instead of making it a universal program it makes it easier to cut and scale back in the future. That kind of jobs that require a bachelor degree are only in short supply right now because of a top heavy older demographic that is holding onto the jobs now but by the nature of reality are running out of time. As those people retire over the next decade, decade and a half there will be a surplus of these jobs coming available again and it is to our advantage to make available the training to get them without forcing the student to sell thier economic soul and start thier foray into the job market deeply in a debt they can not escape. The abundance of qualified youth in our job market is not a statement asserting that we have too many or thier education is useless. It is much statement on the kinds of jobs that are being created under the current economic spin. If we were to train for the kind of jobs youth are getting then we need not train them at all as they are typically getting low paid jobs and if you do not have an education. We agree that college is not for everyone or that it is any kind of silver bullet. Public collage addresses two major concerns, the crushing cost for those who can not afford it being left behind not because of aptitude or skill but because of who thier parents are and the brutal unprecedented amount debt incurred asscoated with getting educated these days. Opening the program to all who work hard and qualify and having them graduate not deeply mired in debt opens the door for a lot of people to pursue options that would otherwise be denied them. It has intrinsic value to our entire society as these people will be able to contribute in more meaningful way than if they did not have that access. Again we are on the same page on what kind of economic actions need to be take as a more comprehensive solution. I have been saying for a long time there has been a war on working people in our country for the last 3 or 4 decades. It was recent memory where families easily achieved a middle class lifestyle with a single member of the family doing honest blue collar work. That has been eroded and we have been in race to the bottom driven by policy paid for by "donors" that has driven income inequality to the record levels we see today. The fact is state colleges will only be offering a finite number of programs even if they are "free". There is room for discussion on the courses are to be promoted but i stand by my feeling that the students should be free to take what interests them as long as it is available. I understand your point and we should be encouraging the institutions to be offering the most valuable and current programs that will ensure the best chance for the students success as they enter the job market while being not buried in debt.
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  24466. ​ @jasper9291  Trump only lies when his lips move. Trump is still lying about the election as we speak and he is the worst cry baby whine to the refs loser I have ever seen. I loath that Biden is acting like a republican and not passing the $15 min wage but electing republican's who only serve the corporations and would lower wages given a chance is silly. That Biden is not forgiving all student debt is another fail that we both agree sucks. That being said, this does not make him the worst president as the other clowns including trump would be far darker on this issue. Biden is still getting some relief to students even if it is not enough. Trump would do nothing for them. Biden not recommitting to the Iran deal is bad. But how could that possibly worse than Trump who pulled out of it in the first place? That the orange draft dodger then unilaterally assassinated an Iranian general on allied land should put him on a much higher level of fail about Iran. These are all good reasons to dislike Biden, I share them. That being said pretending they make him the worse than either Trump or Bush is silly. All of your stated concerns are built on the fact that Biden acting too republican. Not sure how supporting republicans fixes that problem. The GOP is floating the idea of rolling back interracial marriage. Not sure how electing the party of bigots who live in a different era in their heads is the soliton to Biden acting far too right wing to lead the democratic party. Right now the GOP is openly spiting on our democracy. This directly undermines the veracity of your concern about Biden being the worst. Trump was far far worse on every single item that you say you care about here.
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  24644. Crypto Kon You are the clowns bent on obedience. Your base is the religious right which is built on mindless obedience as a foundational element. Every policy the Bernie left pushes spends our tax payer money we already collect in better ways that empower Americans and not just the donors. Ignoring you sit beside people who call themselves nazi's while you babble about your opposition being nazi's is a stupid tone deaf talking point. Policy is not about obedience, or empowering the government. It is a statement of how our government will work. Not wanting a government may be your plan but please know it is not and never will be a remotely popular one. We pay taxes and instead of them wasted on foreign wars and giveaways the very richest perhaps they should be spent to fix our crumbling roads. Instead of building schools in Fallujah we should be building them in Kansas. Instead of give aways to big banks, we should empower actual small business that employs Americans by removing the burden of providing health care from employers. Like in the rest of the free world we should let job creators focus on producing their product not the bureaucracy of providing insurance. Your spin about the left "taking" is a lie to cover the fact the establishment that you shill for robs us every single day. Every single talking point you use is naked projection as I have clearly shown. You keep saying the same thing about his supporters and it is wishful fact free thinking. You are simply lying to yourself, have at it. It changes nothing.
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  24650. Crypto The right pays lip service to small government while only ever increasing it or robbing it to hand more to their rich donors who own them. A solution for both sides would be for you Union wreckers to move to your favorite third world country you would like us to emulate. A government that is not built on bribes works better. Not to mention it focuses their effort on the voters and not the handful who dump cash on them. It is not the size of our government that is the problem, it is the that it is for sale by its very nature now. The left wants nothing of the kind. We want to spend our existing tax dollars on Americans and not the industrial military complex's next war or to enrich multi nationals with shitty deals for consumers bought with donor money. It is the right who blows out the deficit funding pet projects that have nothing to do with working people who pay for it. You no longer get to pretend to care about tax payer money while supporting the robbers you do. The GOP always increases not decreases spending. Every single GOP leadership has exploded the debt since Reagan. Just stop with smaller government which just a euphemism for becoming more like the third world paid for by the likes of he Koch's. When they advocate for small government it is an empty taking point for the clueless who apparently do not pay attention, what they do is a matter of record. It has nothing to do with small government, it has to do with making their buddies richer and rigging the system. Your assertion about what the government should do is yours to have but has no place in a modern nation and has nothing to do with our system. You are free to do what you want but do not expect you will steal any of our resources or cities built up through a system you despise to do it. You look stupid using the term Nazi incorrectly as you vote for the same assholes as actual Nazi's do. Find a better slam as this one is dumb and points at you.
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  24749. HiSpeedDrifter You are incorrect, I think all ethno-states are backward and counterproductive. Again history has shown time and again withdrawing into yourself hurts your society in the long run. I do not support one single "ethno-state" and can list the many problems every single one has which will only be solved by opening up to the rest of the world and letting go of the bullshit failure you promote. Holland, Italy, England all have large immigrant communities and the spin they do not is empty bullshit. The safe zones you demand are of zero value. I do not give flying fuck what my neighbors skin tone is and understand that we are all people despite what you barbaric fucks painfully stupid claims are. Cultures always blend and always have, your spin they can not is betrayed by the fact you clowns have been recycling the same failed arguments for centuries. It is painfully myopic as you move the goal posts and picking new groups to attack while formerly demonized groups are consistently integrated and forgotten about. The more you talk the more you look fucking clueless. Pretending the bankers hate white people may point you bigots in the right direction if you want to identify the root of our problems but the reasons you imagine they are doing it are fact free. These are assholes who would step over bodies of any color to make more money no matter who they are and the idea they are targeting white people is base stupid as white people in fact have a vast majority of the wealth on the planet. Your spin is nothing more than a call to violence against those you imagine disagree with you politically. It is garbage spin for the stupid and the small who like the idea of an appeal to racial pride because they have nothing to be proud of personally.
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  25118. Joe Doe The asshole the people of Ukraine removed in the "coup" was no better than any Nazi and was openly threatening to murder his citizens for protesting and then fled to Russia after he was booted to the curb for being a criminal. That you pretend Russia is any bulwark against fascism when they act openly fascist seems pretty stupid. Anytime a leader is going to kill his citizens for speaking out I think there should be a coup no matter who backs it. The vicious Russian lap dog was booted for threatening to kill protesters, ignoring history and pretending the Russian owned pawn valued democracy or freedom in general is base stupid when you look at what happened. He was booted after those crimes and fled to hide in his masters house when his criminal actions made his rule untenable. Everything I have shared is on record and your dishonesty or ignorance changes nothing. Before WW2 Russia was a brutal totalitarian state and was an open ally of Hitlers before he turned on them. They were fine with Nazi's before they surprise attacked them. They killed millions of their own people under Stalin before the war and Russia is no stranger to worshiping a brutal dictator and being friendly with fascists. They have since replaced their communist dictator with a fascist one and they are arguably the closest analog to Hitlers Germany on the planet today with many parallels in rule and policy. In any case it makes no sense to give them a pass when they blow up air liners. Stop pretending to value reason, you do not as you suck off Putin who is a giant asshole who does not value freedom any more than the Nazi's did. I generally do not respect the way the Americans handle foreign policy and often disagree with what they do. But not in this case and if they helped I am in favor of it, the defender of democracy spin you have going with Russia is total nonsense. You really are just a dishonest dick rider, you are the only one here tonguing anything.
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  25560.  @captinbeyond You sound otherwise pleasant but have bought into terrible silly spin. I am not sure what you "do not believe" but I see nothing to disagree with Bernie on. Going with the crowd has never been my thing and I have gone from being much more conservative in my youth than I am now. The older I have gotten the clearer I see things. I changed as I saw how supporting the status quo empowered a handful at the top at the expense of the many. I recognized the empty wedge issues that divide right and left as simple cover for corruption in both parties. Working people everywhere have been robbed at the behest of the donor class who buy all establishment politicians. Their policy has seen our country visibly slip backwards while the rich have gotten exponentially richer over my lifetime and our debt exploded. Bernie does not "bash" millionaires (as you point out he is one). He demands they pay their fair share. Your attempt to paint him as a hypocrite is counterfactual. The truth is he is probably the most consistent leader we have currently elected and the least affluent senator in power. Like him or hate him Bernie is principled unlike every other leader I have been forced to vote for over the last 30+ years. Pretending he is just another politician means you have bought in dishonest self serving media framing. As it stands you are lost and part of the problem that empowers the corruption. That in good conscience you still vote GOP after seeing their policy calls into question your character or your awareness of what is going on. The establishment democrats have been little better than the cancerous GOP but you spit their spin too. Bernie is not of either and is an entirely new thing we have never had the option to vote for before last primary. As you attack the only principled leaders to support sellouts you lose all the credibility you think you earned with your "rational choices". You are on the wrong side of history sir and have become what you once despised, own that. The lessor to two evils has corrupted our vote our whole lives. Stupid wedge issues over policy we care about is consistently pushed disenchanting us from our youthful hope for change, not a good thing. This time I am voting for someone that works for me and not the highest bidder.
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  25844. Ruddskies It was 20 years ago but I have no confidence anything has changed with regard to conservative priorities. I am angry at the liberals for selling off your legacy for the same reason I am angry at the cons. The fact is selling off hydro was originally a conservative proposal and there is NO REASON to think they would not have done the same. The 407 is costing Canadians lots of money too that should all be flowing back into public coffers to offset other costs instead of being poured into the pockets of a handful of people while Ontarians pay for their debt collection. The failure of the liberals in this case is they are acting exactly like the establishment shills that wholly own the cons. The min wage going up was inevitable and I understand a concern about raising it too fast but there is no reason to expect it would have EVER been raised under a conservative government. That should be unacceptable small business owner or not. The spin we hear about the min wage on the corporate media is deeply skewed. The 60k number you quote is not losses but projected losses from overt shills who have zero interest in the policy and want to demonize it, it has practically no value. Historically these predictions are not borne out and in some cases more jobs are created as workers have more money to spend. I have friends with small business's too and they also feel the pinch of the rise but all of them have taken measures to deal with it and do not expect it to change much in the end. As a business owner you know you hire only those who you need to hire anyway and no more. No one hires extra people because they are cheap. The spin this will mean jobs loss's is not born out in other constituencies that have done the same thing. The same job loss predictions were made there by the same type of crowd who made these and there is no reason to expect these assertions will be any better. I am no a fan of these liberals.. but the cons are NEVER better and are the exact same failure magnified several times.
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  25893. ​ @thefreestofspeech6951  Your assertion it has nothing to do with woman's health care is ridiculous. Roe v wade was not about woman dying because of abortion but it was about setting a standard that half the population could not have their health choices determined by the government. Laws against abortion laws are targeted only on woman and are by their very nature innately discriminatory and that is the root of the judgment. Our very conservative abortion laws were an attempt to balance concerns of the fetus to mitigate suffering against the innate right of the woman to control her body. The fact is there is not even any religious basis for banning abortion at all as the only place the bible talks about abortion it explains when it was sanctioned and how to do it. This bullshit is a stupid repressive anti freedom wedge issue sold by the right to trick people into voting against their own interests by supporting overt corporate sellouts. Your imagined standard is a actually pretty new phenomena in it's current form and is not historical in any sense. The "pro life" asserted concern for life is contrary to the rest of the policy anti choice voters consistently support. The same people supposedly outraged about the "loss of life" due to abortions support capital punishment, signature drone strikes that kill arbitrarily, unending offensive wars that kill hundreds of thousands of non combatants and the right of our cops or those who feel threatened to shoot other citizens without question. Even if the idea of banning abortion was historical, Slavery was traditional, beatings for woman who talk back was traditional, imprisonment or death for religious unbelief was standard. Because we did stupid things in the past is no reason to do them now Mr. Free speech. Please note your free speech love was not valued by the societies of the past and had to be won against people exactly like you who appeal to tradition to write law.
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  25894.  @thefreestofspeech6951  The idea that anything traditional is what we should be doing because it was tradition is empty, laws change and the courts are not in a peculiar position at all. The laws as they are stand are very clear cut and if one can not make a distinction between an assault and a medical procedure you are trying really hard to be confused. They have no role in acknowledging a double stranded because you have to squint real hard and ignore supreme court rulings to do so. The assertion of pro choice people is not the a fetus is nothing, it is that it is the woman's choice to carry it to term or not. Assaulting a woman, hurting her and taking away that choice warrants extra punishment to those who would so. Both male and females who are anti choice represent a minority, in that group woman only slightly outnumber men. The key determining factor is not their sex but their religious and political affiliation and it is inconsequential to what their sex is as I never made the argument men can not discuss this issue. Almost all anti choice single issue votes are deeply religious and a it is a religious spin that drives the movement. The woman in that group will never have to get an abortion if they don't want one and the men in that group should h ave nothing to say about how woman manage their health. You treasure free speech but stand beside assholes who would step on it the second they could, the moment you said anything the disliked. It has been the left that has fought and won our free speech rights from the right who has never valued anything but the establishment spin. The right has lost every single fight to restrict our speech and the only reason we have the freedom we do today is because we (the left) fought and won it. Loser kids on campus are acting like right wingers as they foolishly try to silence speech they dislike and we call them regressive because they are acting like cons. The left has fought for the free speech and it is a fundamental liberal principle while the right only ever stands for free speech for those they agree with. Your spin is myopic and ignores history.
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  25896.  @thefreestofspeech6951  Yep and attempting to conflate them with legal medical procedures is not remotely valid as they are prosecuting assault. I do accept they exist but I do not acknowledge that an abortion qualifies in he same way getting a wart cut off at the hospital is not the same as when 4 guys holding you down and cutting it off against your will. They are attempting to extend the laws to overrun supreme court precedent but so far it is nothing more than an untested attempt to end run the existing interpretation of the ruling. The distinction I am making still exists despite your claims and has not been addressed by this lame regressive change. I have not been told abortion is a right, I am simply telling you what the established law already is and why it was ruled on the way it was. No one is defending anything but their own feelings as they attempt to extend these laws to valid legal medical procedures. This is not a principled position and is a naked attempt for the religious to assert their views on the vast majority of Americans who do not agree with them. They may get their way but I expect they will pay for it dearly in a backlash as theses fringe religious leaders spit in the faces of the american voters and go directly against public opinion instead of dealing with real issues people care about. . Americans dearly want change, if this is the lame regressive change is forced on them by this radical minority I expect the GOP will pay for it baldly at ballot box.
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  26052.  @klappkan  We now elect the senate and they have been able to hang onto power for a long time because they have made it seem like they were serving us. Nothing tears a mask off like the death of children ignored. The harder they shill for monsters the more likely it is people wake up and smell the innate corruption they are dripping and sits at the base of the policy they advocate for. This is a group of assholes who have shown over and over they do not care about anyone's rights and almost never fight on behalf of anyone but who pays them. Framing gun anarchy as freedom by the same party so small government it fits into every woman's uterus is an ever harder argument to make. The only ones still nodding along are lost lost in a putrid identity bubble meant to distract the public from the fact they do not care about us at all. Supreme court rules used to be the end of the discussion. That is clearly no longer true. Once this door opens it will not be closed again. All money buying policy is corruption, even if you like that policy it is still corruption. If your ideas can stand on their merit they do not have to be forced into place with corporate buying of votes. It is a safe bet you are a hypocrite on the issue of corruption as you and yours cry about anyone on the "left" doing the same thing as evil. Your inconsistency highlights the dishonesty of your spin. I universally decry the corporations or the rich buying policy or our leaders. I unlike you am comfortable with the policy I support being debated on merits and not being driven by the highest bidder. This is because I know my ideas win toe to toe and are widely popular for good reasons.
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  26138. Abigail Slaughter Fair enough, I humbly retract my suggestion as you can clearly read. I have spent a great deal of time trying to understand the perspective of the people who continue to support him. They do so because of a sort of stock home syndrome the media has created by herding us into camps that are diametrical but built on wedge issues (especially on the right) to distract us from the fact that both parties are robbing us. The electorate is not holding him responsible because they think the policy does not effect them personally, or see what it is (tough on crime) lock up children in camps, (Free the internet) hand it over the ISP's as good. Now that is an overtly ignorant position but it is a blind spot created by an us against them mentality that as been constructed so they are immune to any perspective besides their own. The phenomena of these kinds of people suddenly becoming pro gay rights after their child comes out as gay is common. They have created a self fulling narrative and do not even try to see any perspective besides their own. They are so diametrical in their hatred the other side they reason since what trump is doing is making the "libs" mad then what he is doing is good. What is really interesting when you strip away the racist jingoism and ignorance any subject you choose to chat about their anger flows from the same place as that of those on the left. That is the underlying recognition that there is systemic failure in our system and we are being fucked over. When you get past the propaganda of the Illuminati, Soro's, new world order garbage it becomes clear they recognize there is a powerful group of people who do not have our interests at heart in control. How that concern is manifested is radically different and their nature of passing over control to those with authority means they hand that problem expecting those they support are not part of it. You can fool some of the people some of the time and 35% of the population most of the time but Trump proved that the GOP establishment candidates were not popular either. People on both sides know the problem is our leaders, the issue is the media wall between us and the finite will for many to dive into the sewage that is modern politics.
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  26350. Queenie  2 years .. he barely passed the republican health care plan without the republicans, he continued Bush's wars, he filled his cabinet with Goldmen sachs lackeys .. he did not prosecute Bush or his cronies or ensure any recovery from the crash went to working people. It is you who does not appear informed. The spin he did the ACA to get GOP support is betrayed by the fact he got NONE! He capitulated to them and chose their plan only to have them demonize it and attempt to repeal it over and over after his whole second term. What kind of three dimensional chess are you playing when the group you attempting to appease by supporting their policy kicks you in the balls and pretends their own plan is communism? He lost seats in the second term because he promised change and gave practically none. The hope engendered by his first campaign (that I shared) was dead by his second and he only won that because the GOP put up a stiff loser establishment shill even worse than him. Right now the GOP is passing all kinds of partisan nonsense with 40 seats in the senate and the dems got nothing done except the republicans health care plan and business as usual with 60. I do not give the GOP a pass ever, but I do not give one to neo-liberal corporate dems either. Obama was a big disappointment and continues to be as he still supports the corperatists and sellouts which are destroying the party by being republican light to this day. Please try to explain how anything I said was wrong. You appear to be team democrat like the trumpists are team Trump. You are both equally deluded in your desire to cheer for bought and paid for assholes who do not give a fuck about you.
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  26709.  @MrCareaboutyou  I do not believe we pop up from nothing, but that is not what evolution postulates either. My brain works as it does because there was an evolutionary advantage for it to develop over time. Our brain did not just pop into existence and you may think pointing to invisible magic sky daddies makes more "sense" than the science but your spin has been shown to have zero value. There is no evidence anything natural was "designed" and if so the "designer" sure made it look like families of animals came from common ancestors based on everything we look at. With our understanding of DNA growing the idea of evolution, mutation mitigated by natural selection is no longer in doubt for any but the religious who need to ignore science and buy into naked 2000 year old bronze age hokum they believe. Creationism has no value except to make people like you feel better about a subject you poorly understand. You are free to assert I will be punished in your imaginary after life for following the data and disagreeing with you. This sick spin marks you the same kind of monster as your god which should not be surprising. You do model yourself on what is your interpretation of his unacceptable, unjust set of rules as measured by any rational human standard. Even If it turns out you are right I will still be against the bizarre self centered celestial dictator you worship as I am principled and dislike needy bullies as a default. That being said you are actually ignorant in the here and now. The way I see it you get the short end of the stick.
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  26904.  Minecart  Total nonsense, that was coming anyway and they did not need a pandemic to do it. They have been systematically butchering the middle class for decades. Mandatory vaccines are not a problem. As shown in the past getting most people to sign on and the percentage that hold out in the end will be so tiny as to be unproblematic. This is how the un-vaxed community in the past effected us. As it stands now they are extending the pandemic and overflowing the hospitals we all pay for. Some of these jobs may be replaced with automation but others may gain the ancillary benefit of it reducing the labor available and forcing the wages up to draw workers as they already have in some industries. This is not an attack on the poor, the number of people this effects is small and will get smaller as mandates come into place. That business is indeed driving the mandates does not make them nefarious even if their reasons for forcing are not the same as public health experts who also urge it. Covid is a just pervasive virus made more challenging by an element of society that wants to ignore the common good over empty fear. I do not see continuing to pander to overt and unrepentant ignorance on a health care issue as having any merit Their freedom to fill our hospitals over empty fear of a drug taken by uncounted people already is fucking everyone over. Their choices should have additional consequences besides accounting for most of the deaths. If they were living in a hermetic bubble i would likely agree with you. As it stands I can not.
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  27107. When you say the left being more racist is "established" you mean by a bunch of clueless overt bigots say it all the time ... only in a the bubble of the ultra stupid and consistently racist is what you say true as the right still own the racists and do not even pretend otherwise. The idea gender identity is linked to mental illness is old and debunked spin that has nothing to do with what modern science or mental health professionals stand for. It deeply fringe conservative spin that you should care at all how another adult identifies. The idea we should censuring these people because of who they are ever more less popular position in places that value freedom. Your views are very similar to the paragons of virtue like Saudi Arabia who hate western values as you point out, you fundamentalist clowns are not and never have been remotely "scientific". What is not compatible with the west is any fundamentalist strain of thought be it christian or Islamic. Thankfully secularism pulls the teeth of both of these failed sets of ideas by promoting freedom for people to choose to ignore it. It is proven when given a choice over time less and less people buy into the dangerous fundamentalist strains of these faiths and we are protected from their policy by a separation of church an state which prevents them from writing of shitty laws that banning trans people like they have in the middle east. In the end we have far less to fear from fundamentalist Islam than we do fundamentalist Christians as the Islamist's have no power and although neutered by our constitution the Christians brand of cancer does.
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  27110.  @micksc1 According to any kind of professional evaluation the process of getting as sex change is not considered a mental illness. The process of transitioning from one sex to another is a medical procedure that has safe guards built into it to make sure the patient understands the ramifications of the change. They dress and live as their chosen sex for a measured period of time before any surgery is done and psychological evaluations are part of the process. The only ones calling it a mental illness are bigots who never valued these people from the start and trope is transparent cover for their own problems in that they want to marginalize them. No one on your side of the debate should pretend to care about the quality of life for any trans person as you don't. You appear to be concern trolling as you talk about caring about these people "mutilating themselves". You should be able to take great comfort now that you know there is deep concern for patient's psychology and state of mind as they seek this change. It is mitigated by mandatory counseling for everyone that goes through it, Imaginary problem solved. I think it should be established no one should be taking your medical advice on these issues. That you have a strong opinion on if these people should even be able to transition at all is very odd to me. You really do have the exact same arguments fund's have switched to because saying god hates something is now a dead argument in a country where no one has to follow his stupid rules.
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  27116. ​ greg butts  Even if natural immunity is marginally better (not automatically granting that) than acquired immunity the respective risk of both choices are not remotely the same. Getting the virus naturally opens you up to be a vector and the inoculation does not. This may be the most altruistic reason to get the shot. But if you need a more personal one, getting the virus does open you up to potential death. But as you pointed out the chance is pretty low unless you are in a high risk group. Like some of your family or friends perhaps? Of even greater personal concern should be the 20% of all people who end up with permanent long term damage. Permanent loss of smell, taste, long term fatigue, damage to lungs, heart, kidneys have been reported. A long list of ongoing symptoms that have no corresponding match for those that take vaccine makes your choice hard to defend. "If asymptomatic without your knowledge and wearing a mask, you will inadvertently make your symptoms worse by way of increased viral load re inhalation." So you suggest they should just spread it around? The chance you might be asymptomatic is the best reason to even wear a mask to protect others around you in enclosed areas. Masks have been used in this exact manner for over 100 years as a goto move when attempting to stop people from either contracting or spreading contagions. They have been widely used in asia to prevent the spread of flu's for decades in their highly dense cities. When wearing a mask I know for certain where the particles do not go. Into the mouths and mucus membranes of others around me. The best reason to wear one.
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  27147. All slavery was bad, no one sane should ever support it. Remembering history has value and covering it up it over your feelings is abjectly weak. You and the monsters you stand beside are literally dividing us as you crave division, you openly hate the other! CRT is university level concept that you and the rest of the morons misusing the term do not understand. That slavery was common in other places is largely irrelevant to our history, that truth changes nothing That slaves were purchased form black slavers is also irrelevant to the nature of slavery in the US Black slavers were primarily serving the American and European market, they were middle men we made rich. We (Americans) exploded the slave trade in africa on behalf of our landowners We ended slavery way later than everyone else, we dragged our feet and had to fight a war over it. That we had to physically fight to end slavery is not the giant win you pretend it is, others did it bloodlessly Slavery sucks, that it still tragically exists today is no reason to cover up actual history It appears you have no idea what a Marxist is, you appear to be clueless how to correctly use the term It makes you look like a stamped out product of a self chosen and specific fact free media bubble There are no Marxists in power here you ridiculous NPC This is not 1968 and red scare bullshit should make you laugh, not piss your pants Pretending that imaginary "Marxists" not only are powerful but seeking to divide us while you spit overtly divisive rhetoric is idiotic Your "update about racism" is irrelevant misdirection to make bigots feel better about our history of slavery that changes NOTHING The stinking bigot promoting propaganda bubble has corrupted your brain and you left you constantly triggered A seething untreated victim complex seems to have done the rest.
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  27184.  @michaeltaddeo3242  Equal rights under the law is an easy concept for a modern person. A hard one when your mind is in the in the stone age. I see no right a woman does not deserve and no social responsibility a female can not handle that a man can. That we did something in the past does not mean it is necessarily the best idea. I have shown that abandonment of "traditional" government systems and the rule of law by the church advanced the societies that did so. Just saying we always did a thing does not mean we always should. Equal in the eyes of law should be our goal, we have a legacy of uneven treatment and that takes time to undo. History has proven the more free we are the more productive we were. Abandonment of your feudal control mechanisms better utilizes human potential. The divorce statistics you point too are legacy of system YOU own. Unequal treatment under law. The fact is more men are getting custody than ever before. We are moving to apply equal treatment in family law because of the abandonment of static roles you crave. The privilege you cite was an initial backlash against old rules where men had total control and woman had none. If you look at family law now in the west, shared custody is ever more popular as woman no longer automatically get the child. If push comes to shove the primary care give gets custody. In this day and age that is often a man. This is possible because some have chosen to abandon your old school ridged role standard. You talk like a grandpa who does not know what is going on outside your bubble.
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  27185.  @michaeltaddeo3242  That is based on a rules from time all laws were unevenly applied. The stat you cite is changing rapidly and men have have an ever better chance at custody if they choose to go for it. This is because we are changing the old static way of thinking. A woman is no longer automatically the care giver and no longer automatically gets the children. Joint custody has never been more popular as men take responsibility for raising their children too when in my grandparents day only the mother did. Men traditionally fought wars, So what? There is no reason in this modern era woman should fight in the war. Israel has very effective female soldiers and it has been proven time and again one does not need to be 6 feet tall to push a button or fly a plane. We no longer swing swords and it turns out woman dutifully and capably perform many critical combat rolls. This is not up for debate. No one should care what you think god did when it comes to public policy. When you start making absolute statements based on your particular flavor of god they should only effect you and your choices. No one else's. Your empty black and white generalizations about parental roles are ridiculous, they are product of your limited perspective and experience. Men are equally capable as woman in providing emotional support and woman are as capable as men earning a living. The world has proven you wrong, your claims are right out of a 1950's tv show that builds on now outdated tradition. Some woman will choose to be housewives and mothers, others leaders and scientists. Give people the option to be what they want to is the only path forward. Arguing against individual freedom in favor of now long outdated traditions always puts you on the wrong side of history.
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  27636.  @bherber  Well I think we have already proven your strategy was a failure. I would argue Obama who turned out to be a centrist in power won the house and the senate by acting progressive and promising us change. Once voters saw him in action the party collapsed in power losing the house, the senate and then the presidency under centrist policy and leadership. They lost over 1000 seats under Obama and ignoring that failure after his high mark of promising change and winning by a landslide seems a poor choice. Being GOP light is no longer a winning strategy and their running after the donors away from popular policy is a hard fail that now costs you. Toe to toe without any answers to what half his base wants Joe will crumble. Everyone is against Nazi's Joe, you will have to do much much better. People want change, offering the same old same old is not going to cut it anymore. You should have learned that by a freak show Trump kicking in the establishment republican and democrat door and setting up shop. The establishment loser barely won the primary against Bernie when he was a no one and had she still had to cheat to do it. These genius's went on to lose to a hideous but populist candidate who also destroyed the GOP establishment even if he did not mean a populist thing he said. Biden and his centrist cast of losers have nothing to offer and are beaten before fighting because they offer nothing. There is a good reason there are a handful of fake progressives aping Bernie's policy. They are failing because everyone see's through it already. Joe does not even have that. Joe has every weakness Hillary had for trump to exploit. Bernie is popular where democrats are not popular, he is really popular where they are already. He is the logical choice over the VP of an administration that saw the democratic party go from giddy heights to irrelevance up-to and including the giving away a supreme court seat. On the put money on it thing, damn me too.
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  27637.  @bherber  Obama care was the republican health care plan with no public option that he got absolutely no republican support for. The centrists murdered the promise of change and the voters made them pay for it, He folded before fighting with his own super majority. This was among his first centrist failures after supporting a public option during his campaign and for about 5 minutes after. This continued through his entire term enabled by the weak centrists who ran right as the republicans ran off a cliff hating on their own ideas with none of their own forcing democrats to defend heritage foundation half measures. The loss at the mid terms was directly influenced by his cabinet choices, his decision to leave Guantanamo open, to ignore occupy, to not go after the banks, to not pass meaningful bank legislation, etc, etc. I would argue he did not exercise his power so they responded by not showing up in massive swelling crowds because the magic, the hope was broken by reality. They passed a health care plan that was not really popular with their base and not super popular with the GOP's base either. The donors did like it and the health care lobby was very involved in writing it, this helps explain the trajectory democrats popularity over the next few years. Hillary won the early states only because of name recognition. Bernie came from 0% in the polls as a relative unknown. Driven by an entirely policy centric campaign an older guy with bad hair he closed a lot of points not by being a rock star but by being honest and genuine. Biden is not starting way ahead like hillary, no where close. Look at a chart of her popularity from the start of the campaign and after. You may not want to put much money on Joe after all. I will put Bernie's authenticity against Joe's likability any day with that crowd. They can smell BS a mile away and are not fans of the stink when it is from a politician. Seems like faint hope on your part that Joe is more popular there but hey you may be right, time will tell. Cheers
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  27802.  @SuperNeospace  As it turns out the legal part is all that maters. We did not make it separate but equal, they now have normal marriage full stop. It was the legal requirement for equal treatment of all citizens that pushed it through. The separate but equal bullshit was proposed by handful of theists who should have NO power to enforce their religious dogma here on others. It created a type of second class citizen to make a specific community happy at the expense of another. Eventually the idea was rejected as unconstitutional. The customs and traditions are essentially unimportant as they are entirely transitory and tied to a time not any objective standard. The marriage of today is not the same as the one 50 years ago, or a 100. Because these social standards constantly change anyway demanding the stay the same is silly. Civil union was not enough as the demand was to be entirely equal in the eyes of the law, entirely equal not distinct and different. A civil union would not grant that only full marriage would. The cultural part of marriage that is still widely popular today is based around the idea it is the foundational element of a family. This is why marriage was demanded for gay people so they could start their own families buttressed by marriage like everyone else. No matter how you cut it marriage today is a primarily contract and does not have to have any connection to any church. Most weddings today no longer take place in a church and religion has an ever smaller part to play in the institution. The faithful divorce at higher rates than the non religious and you have to see how that undermines your claim the faithful have a lock institution and understand it in a way others do not.
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  27891.  @ana-vi4ok  I have seen both video''s before you referred me to them, that you think either proves your point speaks to your bias and the fact you do not understand what she is even fighting for and nothing else. Neither remotely proves your assertions and quibbling over numbers and percentages does not undermine her root point or make her clueless as you assert. I could give you lists of things republicans misquote and outright deceive you on including the root of the garbage Peter sells but it is pretty clear you have an agenda that is counter factual and are in some kind of bubble that makes you ignore what she is saying to buy in the weak counter spin these clowns pedal specifically to people like you. The garbage in the first video does not undermine her in the way you think it does and it does not invalidate her root points at all. That you call her clueless because she misquoted some stats does not make her underlying point invalid no matter how much you want it to. Peter is a shill and always has been. The stupid spin he spits in that video would be crushed by anyone prepared to deal with the innate straw man nature of what he even charges. The real opposition to the people he blindly backs is based on the fact that they are gaming the system rand have paid for policy that does wealth redistribution from the poor and middle class to the ultra rich for decades. Go ahead and defend the overt greed that has systematically transferred wealth from the middle class to the ultra rich on behalf of the donor class. In that video he is not opposing even what AOC fights for and is doing nothing but making up straw men to kick over , he is not attacking her positions at all. No one employs people as a service and they ONLY do so to make money. Pretending they are acting as benefactor as they directly remove the cost of those workers from their income before they ever pay taxes is silly establishment spin that ignores they would make NOTHING without them and will cut and slash those jobs the first second they get a chance if it means they make another nickle.
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  27922. sheldonspider86  The war was a poorly thought out money pit that has not made us more secure and when coupled with the pointless Iraq invasion ensured we did not have the resources to do what would need to be done to secure it.  It was always "unwinnable" from the start because we never bothered to define what a "victory" would look like  in the grave yard of armies that is Afghanistan. The spin "we pulled out of Iraq" is undermined by the fact we were kicked out by the democratically elected government we helped put in place. Because of litigation issues the negotiation for our military access broke down and the deal that allowed our legal right to be there expired without renewal. We were forced to leave by the government of Iraq and the claim we pulled out is empty as Obama's government against the wishes of its base fought to stay but in the end had no choice.    The issues of the region and consistent fighting in places like Iraq are partly based on the arbitrary nature of its borders pressing multiple historical enemies into one country ruled by  a single element of that group.  If you want peace in places like Iraq break it into 4 slices and hand the power to the respective groups.  Banish arbitrary boarders written up by Britain after the  war.   The reason this is not done is because there is a fiduciary interest for some in an extension of the status quo with regards to resource extraction and sale.  This is the same reason we have supported tyrannical dictators and armed and trained religious zealots as our proxies in the region for half a century.   We are not really concerned about solving the problems with extremism in the middle east if you look at our policy and its results.  90% of the problems are attached to external medaling/training/funding historically or currently supported at the root of it.
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  27958. A Alvarez I am american first too but Trump has done nothing about that and we outsourced more this year than last. His tax policy will give many the cash reserves they need to out source further and nothing in this bill that has massive giveaways to the very richest does anything about keeping jobs in America. The DEA has to be deeply scaled back. It does nothing but prop up the same eternally crumbling damn prohibition was and is an abject failure if it's goal was to reduce and control drug use. Promotion of the drug war has no value to anyone unless you are invested in the industrial prison complex we pay for as tax payers to incarcerate the largest prison population per capita on the planet. Our leadership has been deeply involved with the drug and weapon trade in every single administration. We have been trading in both for a long time in a bid for power, if true the Obama example you cite is not unique or even as egregious compared to other more well known examples such as the Ollie North charges. To this day this effort garners the deep state allies, we support or are aligned 73% of all dictatorships. ISIS was born from the vacuum left in Iraq after overthrowing the ruling Basks and sending them home with their weapons and no solid plan on what to do next or how to stabilize the region. ISIS was primary successful because of American trained leadership from back in the Saddam days, a group of basically secular leadership sent packing after the invasion because they belonged to the wrong tribe. It had nothing to do with a failure of Obama and ISIS was destined to be borne the moment we unilaterally attacked Iraq with no plan for what to do after. Trump actually attacked and destroyed Russian air craft on the ground in Syria. The idea he has been any better on Russia or Syria is undermined by the fact he is the first president to ever do so. The establishment democrats have a history of going along with the wars the neo cons want. The GOP and so far trump are wholly owned by them and continue policy that escalates war and conflict. He has increased drone strikes by 400% over Obama's record numbers. We are abdicating our role of leadership on the foreign stage. No matter how you feel about the Jerusalem announcement it only hurts us. In talking a public stand on it against the will of almost the entire world Trump has abdicated any roll we might have had in mediating a peace and instead has made us a satellite of Israeli foreign policy in the region. Hillary is a total mess and a clear sell out in a 1000 ways. That being said she would not have at the brink of nuclear war via Twitter with a psycho who cares so little for life he starves and murders his own people randomly
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  27960. A Alvarez I am not rationalizing anything. I am looking at the raw job creation numbers and Trump has not created more jobs. In Trumps defense his policies are not in effect yet but you have no data to back the claim he is doing better than Obama because by any objective standard he is NOT. Cutting corporate taxes does nothing but line the pockets of CEO's and investors This is proven by history when we did it before, the fact is our effective (after deductions) corporate tax rates were already very low. The recovery you have talked about was complete when Trump took office but people are still hurting because the repair was done at behest of the same people hold trumps leash as well as the faux progressive Obama's. Do not expect anything to improve for working people because no part of the GOP economic plan does anything for them. In fact you can expect it to get far worse as the entire focus of the administration is making the rich far richer at the expense of those who work for a living. What regulations that he cut do you imagine helped us? What stat makes you think anything is better under trump? He created less jobs in his first year than Obama did in his last 6, how is that a win in your head? I am not against cutting regs but what we cut and who the cuts help matters. For all the 1000's of pages of cuts you laud as a win we literally created less jobs this year than the year before, how do you spin this as successful? The stock market has been awesome under Obama too and that reflects why the donor class is doing well, it has not translated into better economic opportunity for most Americans and will not going forward either. All the tax cuts for those making under 70k will expire leaving them to pay more while those for the richest go on forever leaving us a giant debt. I am not unhappy unemployment is low but I am much more concerned about growing income inequality and increasing rolls of the uninsured that will cost tax payers dearly. Even in the Obama presidency it was a fact many of the jobs created were lower paying and did not replace the ones lost. The employment numbers were stabilized under the last president, under Trump job creation has literally slowed down if you look at the stats I provided. Trump gets no credit for coasting on Obama's success and if you try to give Trump any credit for the employment numbers you have to be fair and admit Obama did better even if you hate him. That is not a feeling or because I like Obama who i have many issues with, it is because that is what the numbers actually say. Obama did start by losing millions of jobs when he took over as inherited from Bush. I do give him credit for turning that nightmare around. Trump does not get credit for doing worse in job creation than the last 6 years of his predecessor, attempting to spin Trumps lower numbers as good simply does not make any sense.
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  27962. A Alvarez Any success you can point out is undermined by the fact fewer and fewer Americans are achieving it. Many kids today are graduating with the same education you did and can not find good paying jobs in the market as they have no experience. Our system is rigged and people are paying ever more to go to school (much more then when you went) and there objectively fewer jobs real full time jobs to be had when they graduate. We are not a meritocracy if you look at the trend of he shrinking middle class as we all work record number of hours and have never been more productive. I do not think you are sheltered but the fact your story is not remotely typical in this day and age and the number of people that can climb on the path that brought you to were you are is ever smaller. Upward mobility is the worst it has ever been and fewer and fewer people are achieving it as the middle class shrinks. That you made it does not mean your experience is that of the vast bulk of american citizens. It was arguably damn amazing before, you could get a job anywhere and raise a family comfortably on a single income. In my dads day and age as a basically untrained worker he got a good job with full benefits that he expected to stay at until he retired (and he did) with a full pension. Now to get the same job you need a degree that sets you back 60k and you start in a hole even if you get the job. People are happy to have a good job let alone one that allows your family to be a single income home which is the now exception not the rule. There is no such thing as a cheap loan that hangs around your neck like a mill stone for the rest of your life no matter how much you make. Students start withe debt that is exponentially higher than what we had in the time we went to school even with the prospect of few good jobs when they graduate and they are forced to take it on just to have a chance at getting a job. The treadmill we are on is nothing but modified slavery where everyone starts in a financial hole no other generation had to face while entering a job market that is creating more fast food jobs than carrier opportunities.
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  28227. A54321 If we want to talk about who the voters do not like it is pretty clear establishment democrats have nothing to brag about. The idea they want to vote for those loses is betrayed by the election and the fact the democrats had their ass handed to them. Progressives have barely started competing in the primaries, you can list progressives that lost on one hand. That the establishment still owns the mechanism and is using every dirty trick to hold onto power speaks to their fear of a political movement you dismiss with what appears ton be an ignorant wave of your hand. The sample size you base your empty assertion on is minuscule and the polling does not indicate there is no interest in this movement or these candidates. Bernie Sanders is the most popular politician in the country by a wide margin, your assertion that progressives are not popular is empty nonsense. Not one of those examples you may point to preclude the fact there is no reason to listen to the strategy that saw Hillary crushed by a loser. The democrats in their current form face perpetual losses as they spit on half their base to sell out to assholes with unpopular policy that further estranges their voters. You have no credibility as you ignore the non progressive wing of the democratic party are huge failures and we could barely do any worse than they already have. Saying progressives can not win ignores the fact that democrats can not either and the reason they can't is the establishment is putting forth candidates many can no longer support as a lessor of two evils.
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  28306.  @adlucem9845  Most people can not afford land, people in cities that mostly vote democrat are less likely than those who live outside them to own land because land in rural areas is far cheaper. The idea that the GOP does not push for more control is empty nonsense. They want a government so big it has access to every woman's uterus as they argue they need to track how people pee in stalls and fight to continue the failed and repressive drug war to fill our prisons for cronies. The right contains the most autocratic and totalitarian elements in our society. They have proved over and over they would crush the rights of anyone they dislike for good feels. The only freedom the right values is the freedom to agree with them. The GOP has expanded government to it's cronies everytime they have been in power for 50 years. The small government talking points spit by their dupes is a tool crafted to rob us all. This is proved by the fact their leadership consistently blows up the deficit to hand more money to the ultra rich that buy them. The plantations talking point is silly when made by any right winger. You do know that plantations were always owned by the rich and powerful? The establishment controlled slavery meaning it is has always been defended by conservatives and the rich who own the media. It is not a coincidence that the entire south has always been deeply conservative and is so to this day. Abolitionists were and have always been liberals seeking to change the status quo. The right fights for business as usual no matter how toxic it is. This is true to this very day. You need to own that sparky.
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  28307.  @adlucem9845  The GOP has owned the racists since they enacted the southern strategy to lure them to the party. In the late 60's they adopted a plan to take the south from the democrats by fighting against the ERA and took it by opposing integration in the south. The white power clowns are and always were deeply conservative. A quick look at who the KKK vote for today confirms this. The GOP OWNS the kkk and has vera very very long time now. Byrd an ultra conservative southern democrat who died in office back in 2010 at 92. He was a self declared "race reformed" legacy from a long gone era before the GOP took over the racist south which was once entirely democratic. I recognize the establishment democrats today for exactly what they are, corporate sellouts owned by the same monsters as the GOP. They are marginally better on social policy and individual freedoms but vote with the GOP on all their tax cuts. They both chase the same donor cash and enact the same donor centric economic policy. They are much the same while pandering to entirely different bases by focusing on wedge issues that make the donors cash or cost them nothing. The leadership of both parties love war and endless expansion of the military. It can be traced directly back to who their donors are. I see the key difference between the parties is in what their respective voters fight for. The dem base is actually anti war as a standard. Fully half of them reject the corporate corruption strangling us while the gop base does not have a measurable analogue on either issue.
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  28348. whyamimrpink78 You are incorrect and misquoted me by attempting to reframe the context of my point, the fact is they did not lack access to the care. The region they happened to be in could not deliver it in a timely enough manner. That is not the same thing, no one was turned away because of an arbitrary reason like they could not pay, no one went bankrupt trying to pay medical bills. There is no reason to expect the same people in for profit system would fare any better in remote areas that are universally poorly serviced for specialized treatments if they could not afford to move out and get their care somewhere else. Our system would fail in the exact same way and it is not socialized medicine that is failing there but the challenge of delivering comprehensive through treatment options in low and poorly funded regions. We have our version of the same problem here and pretending it is not a feature of every single health care system including ours is empty. People being turned away and openly denied care or being given substandard treatment based on if they can pay or not is unique to us. As is ones ability to jump the line and get a knee surgery quickly while we let the poor die in their homes untreated. The answer to why these people did not go with a private option is there is no private option in Canada. Very few Canadians or Americans can afford to go to the US and pay to get to the front of the line out of pocket anyway and to do so is only an option of a fraction of the population in either country. The cases where the Canadian system has failed individuals is consistently based on region and or a lack of temporary government will to properly fund health care do to changing economic priorities. The benefit for Canadians is they have the advantage of replacing their leadership with those who have a deep commitment to delivering health care and have, sadly we have no such option here to replace our administrators. They have seen wait times drop drastically in recent years because of this mechanism. Quit laying out a pretence of wanting to have a conversation or that I am not willing to have one as you have done nothing but spin what I shared and attempt to misrepresent at a base what I am saying. I am not pretending the Canadian system is perfect or without flaws but their issues pale in comparison to ours as I have shown. You are correct on one thing at least, covering everyone is a very low standard and it is telling that we do not even do that.
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  28349. whyamimrpink78 Your spin is just that, it does not show you want to have an intellectual discussion and you are citing a court case that has not shook out and changed anything yet. This does not exactly validate your assertion nor is it step toward "an intellectual conversation". It is not a very good argument that counters the nature of my claim. For all intents and purposes in the real world they are still tier. That there are people clamouring for other options (primarily insurance companies) does not change the fact that two tier initiatives are still actively being blocked in most constituencies. I am inclined to agree with them and base my view the valid argument a two tier system does little but detract from the primary system most people rely on. I would advocate improving the system they have rather than a move toward a private for profit system which only helps the wealthy. Officially according Canada they still publicly state that they have a one-tier health care system. Unless you can show that has changed because of this ruling yet I am not sure how I am stopping the discussion by my assertions. At the very least the vast majority of care is provided by the public system there to this date if not all of care outside some specialized clinics. If you want to continue this intellectual discussion you should probably acknowledge this truth. Perhaps while you do this you can explain how the point they have at the very best a tangential attempt at a two tier system is even relevant to an argument you are trying to make. In the interest of informing you perhaps you should read the following article. http://canadiandoctorsformedicare.ca/the-chaoulli-decision.html
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  28350. whyamimrpink78 At least you are consistent in the dishonest way you attempt to frame the conversation. Yes I am literally saying Canadians can not afford to go pay for private care just like us in our for profit system which is why they should rely on their own and not ours, especially if it means life or death. In any case they are no further behind us and the few that fall through their system because they are poor are a drop in the bucket compared the water fall of forgotten by ours. This is because their care is not distributed based on their wealth but on need and the resources of the region you choose to get care in. Even if it was a significant issue for them (and you have not shown it is as far is in compassion to our numbers) there is nothing you advocate for that would mitigate this issue in their system and it is not addressed at all in ours. Critical care is not even a problem as far as wait times are concerned and it marks your cant afford it = death spin as totally empty. The decision to go outside their system when they do is not about life or death for them but about expediency. No one dies because they can not afford care even as tiny number fall through the cracks when their system fails. This is contrasted by our system which deeply fails to address's it in a half hearted begrudging way in the form of Medicaid which sees 10's of thousands die a year and millions go without care because they can not afford deductibles even if they have private insurance.. The spin that they can not afford health care is dishonest at best and ignores the fact most of us can not afford it either and that is why our number one reason for bankruptcy is due to medical costs. They are no different than us in their inability to pay for profit prices except they have the option to get first class critical care at no extra cost while paying half the price for access to a comparable but more highly rated service. I continue to reject your claims about wait times because it is clear you are ignoring we have the same issues to a lessor degree and do not acknowledge that at least some wait times are inherent to any system with finite ability to meet demand coupled with how many resources the population can support to deliver it. Some of their wait times are problematic but are actually only marginally worse than ours and do not result in a decrease in quality for most users of the system. There is a good reason their system is widely popular and ours is not. Please read what you send, the link you attached validates me not you. The fact is any care delivered by the province can not be delivered through private insurance, this is by definition single tier. Upgrades and physio therapy. etc can be covered by insurance and that accounts for the money spent outside the system and is not attached to primary care. From your own documentation there can literally be no service covered by the medical program offered by insurance companies. Your spin continues to be empty. I am not wrong and your spin as usual is devoid of an actual argument. Even if I agreed Canada was two tier (and it clearly is not) it still does not make your assertion Canadians die because they can not afford care true in anything but a semantic symbolic way. The fact is the care they need as a community is as readily available to all despite income, is comparably effective and rated more highly at half the cost than ours is.
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  28587.  @MusaMansu  Buddy who we were discussing was INSIDE. No one is advocating for those outside to be charged. I think the shaman loser and everyone who broke in with him should be prosecuted. Chanting is not illegal in this country but if you wanted to arrest those people for threatening violence you must be livid about the Jan 6th guys. As opposed to the hang Mike chants defended by Donald the fry them like bacon chant was decried as wrong by almost everyone. It was a stupid chant but did not represent the movement. Instead it was one event in 1000's of protests on the same issue. It was fringe right distraction spin you parrot meant to make 93% of peaceful BLM protests seem scary to the ignorant. Unlike the right the left actually stands against violence. That is why we do not have left wing "militias". Instead of embracing the violent chants of those specific protesters the chant widely rejected and decried by left. The fact is the chant had nothing to do with BLM which was about justice not mob violence despite what fox has pumped int your head. The chant was extra stupid because it was used to garner sympathy for the police they did not deserve. This is why every right wing media source relentlessly talked about this one event to the exclusion of the fact almost all the BLM protests were peaceful. Even the protests that were not were often the fault of the police or outside agitators and counter protesters both of whom love violence. That a some individuals chanted some slogan somewhere does not reflect on the entire movement. Even as they did so they literally did not break the law. If they did break some imagined up law then the hang Mike Pence crew is WAY worse theirs specifically threatened violence to the VP. Your spin comparing this tiny one off group at one protest to the assholes that smashed windows, attacked cops and battled to stop the certification of our election is assign. It is as dishonest as media you parrot.
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  28611.  @MegaDavyk  I literally did. I just read more than one article. I actually linked a pointent one above for anyone who is interested and can read. You have a MUCH MUCH higher chance of getting covid than the number you pulled out of ass would suggest. That chance of contracting the virus varies wildly based on how many people you contact, in what conditions and how many they contacted and those conditions. If you have any immuno problems or a range of conditions including obesity that high number goes up even more. Death is not the only concern when contracting this virus. 18 to 20% of people who contract covid have long term side effects that have persisted until now over a year after contracting it and recovering. There is also the issue that being unvaccinated you are fertile ground and are much more likely to get the virus than someone unvaccinated and if you do the chances it will be serious compared to them are exponentially higher. The community you represent are now the breading ground for new ever more deadly and contagious variants as we speak. Don't trust these anti vax throwback cultists. We have beaten back virus's before. We have literally wiped out several and many others that were once common are rarely seen because in the last 50 years we have successfully vaccinated against them. The idea this technology is evil is conspiracy nonsense that has real world implications. For these people this is more like a religion or and an identity rather than an actual connection with reality or science. Never take medical advice from someone with talking points easily destroyed after a quick google search on your own.
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  28766.  @whyamimrpink78  Those survival rates do not erase the fact huge swaths of the country simply can not afford or do not have access to the care you point at. The cap thing exists here at the behest of the insurance companies and no where else. No one else has a treatment cap, let a lone a lower one. Many things impact infant mortality. Prenatal and Postnatal care does influence these numbers. Again our system fails because it leaves a large percentage of our population out in the cold to serve the insurance lobby because that care is un-affordable or inaccessible to many. Your assertion about being dead would indicate you think we have better survival rates on most medical metrics, we do simply do not. Even your lauded stat that you keep pointing to is only marginally higher than other comparable states. The fact is our system is far more likely to kill you simply because you are can not afford the available care. No one else lets them die to serve a profit motive. We alone hold that distinction as we allow Insurance companies employ recidivism to avoid paying out on policies to increase profit. We alone overtly put corporate profits over citizens lives by empowering their useless third party profit motive that inversely insentiveizes them to deliver care. You are misrepresenting the other systems wait times. Canada and Australia for example have very comparable wait times to us on critical care (life threatening) issues. Elective issues like knee surgeries and non critical MRI's you are forced wait longer for. The fact is we both ration care. They ration it based on how critical the issue is, we ration it based on wallet size. Everyone has problems, their rankings reflect that. As does ours.
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  28892.  @limitisillusion7 Pete is the new threat for now, but that does not mean he is a more meaningful threat than Biden was. Biden could drop out now and at this point it might even help Bernie Pete only got his bump because the DNC cheated by their slow drip of bungled results from the first primary where as the media clearly purposely twisted them. Bernie has comfortably won the popular vote in both states and leads in almost every single metric there is. If Pete was leading national polls, had raised the most money, won both contests popular support and had the massive minority support that Bernie does the media would be declaring this over. He in fact has not taken Biden's spot, Bernie has. Amy is going nowhere after her tie with Pete in NH. Biden is less relevant daily as most of his transferable support has already fled. I do not know where Warren lands but it is a safe bet she will not back Pete. If she does not endorse Bernie she will push for Amy who has weakness's unspoken. Amy has not been scrutinized yet because of her early irrelevance. Couple that with her almost non existent minority support coming into super Tuesday and things look good for Sanders. To date Pete has been propped up by media lies, spin and misinformation as well as the DNC's incompetence or cheating. His big bump from Iowa collapsed after his last debate as his temporary support fled to Amy. Where Bernie supporters are deeply committed Pete's are not. Mark my words between here and super Tuesday is not going to be the best moments for platitude Pete. Please note I do not "trust" the polls but they are an indication of the flow. The fact is polls are the only data we have to go on for these future races and ignoring them does not add anything to anyone's analysis. In 2016 everyone but the mainstream media saw a weakness in Hillary's campaign and the data had strong indications of her problems if you looked at it with honest eyes.
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  29228.  @markhunsaker7521  There is no evidence any of them are criminals. One can not assume they are and that is why we have a very thorough process to vet them. It is not clear you understand the process you are babbling about. They were locked out, the border crossing was closed effectively preventing them from applying. Locking thousands of people on the other side of the border and not even giving them a chance to apply is the definition of mistreating them. You walk 2000 miles with your children seeking a safe place to lay your head and then be told to fuck off and see how you react. Even so it was a tiny minority you that did anything and it does not reflect the group as a whole. You can say "wrong" but the fact is people come from much further than these people and there is no standard you have to stop and apply at the first place you come to. There is no rule that says you need to go to the closest country. See my previous comment as your entire assertion is unfounded. When you seek asylum you may look apply to many countries and have one you prefer above the others. Distance or your mode of travel is irrelevant to your application. You assert there is a problem but our issues problems with asylum seekers are negligible as we take in so few compared to our size. There are issues but nothing that effects our economy or any other aspect of our country and we are big enough we could absorb many more than we do before we even noticed. You may not consider it a competition but as you whine about them coming and us not being able handle more people it makes us out as pathetic as places much smaller than us take many more with no issue. The policy you advocate for undermines the very concept of why these people seek asylum. They are not just seeking immigration but to escape the location they are in. You are either forcing them to stay in the places they are escaping from or putting the problem onto someone else who is very likely less able to handle their residency increasing the danger and forcing people who are already escaping horrible condition into equally bad places to wait. It is not a loop hole, you want to change policy because you do not see the value of asylum at all and are too wrapped up in your pants shitting fear to see the only thing you are doing is punching down at people who have no defense instead of blaming the leadership and the owner class who commands them for our many real issues.
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  29299. ThE DuCk Fuck you condescending sack of dishonest shit. I know how they work and in this case the dnc decided hillary won before one vote was cast. They cheated and were exposed as cheaters. The entire democratic machine and the media were entirely focused on handing the crown to their chosen sellout. You are either deeply ignorant or entirely dishonest as you pretend this is not the truth. They did not force anyone, that is not even the contention. They cheated by denying coverage, kicking off voters, manipulating polling stations and lying about what he stood for, they put their finger on the scales in undemocratic way and were exposed to the countries benefit. The only fake popularity is that of your favorite neo-con shill. Bernie is the still the most popular leader in the county by a mile and crushes the base loser you supported. Bernie is progressive and pretending the Russians want him over a trump or hillary is pretty stupid. The fact is hillary has deep ties to Russia too so the spin that Bernie's popularity is fake and generated by Russians is empty and silly on the face. You are about to find that out how popular he is , the shills you support are STILL exposed/unliked and establishment donor loving wing of the party has no candidate that has a snowballs chance against Bernie this time. It seems you do not know what misogynist means as you call me that and it makes you look simple to throw a word around that does not apply. At least you assholes are consistent, I will give you that.
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  29549.  @cryopz  Their feelings are based on overt nonsense, there was a time all these questions were up for grabs before he actually won and showed his true colors. They see him strong on the border because their media lies to them as Biden has largely the exact same polices (much to his bases concern) as Trump did on the border. Biden was ready to pass a republican written boarder plan which Trump kyboshed from the sidelines. The president has nothing to do with local bathroom policy, how schools work or any of the many things these people like Trump better on. Every single social issue you cite is an empty distraction that is handled locally and is not attached to presidential duties. On the economy Biden beats Trump on any metric the GOP usually uses and pretends to cares about until Biden's numbers are better. By the republicans own standards Biden is kicking ass, there is not a single number Trump is better on. The idea Trump was better on the economy is all feeling based. Internationally Trump is a joke and no one respects, let alone fears him any more than they fear anyone who is deranged and in power. Trump is an incurious self important simp with no principles that agrees with whoever talked with him last. Among the other leaders he is laughing stock, he makes us all look simple The fact trump could not stop doing crimes, put the economy in a ditch before being booted from office, has no effective plan to make anyone's life better and tried to end our democracy are all good reasons to reject him again. If the democrats just stopped spitting on their base and applied a few wildly popular policies that both parties are paid to ignore, the republicans would be wiped out. They risk losing to Trump because they are to chasing the same regressive billionaire donors that entirely own the GOP.
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  29609.  @samdg1234 Thank you for your well thought out response. I do appreciate it. I have given a great deal of thought to my purpose over the last few decades and see it slightly differently than you do as you can probably guess. If we are to look for our purpose as designed we have a few steps to take. First is to pick out a builder from a myriad of options, the second major challenge is to divine the will of the builder to know your place in his creation. The last major challenge in the set is a to take the manual written as hearsay from the said builder, play telephone with it for 2000 years translating and updating many times and becomes questionable if you are actually doing your chosen builders will at all. I would say one could waste ones life and take away much real real joy from it in perusing any number of religious offering as focused as yours. Many are designed as tools of control not enlightenment, the master on a throne god you worship lends itself toward that end. I am not one to take away what makes you happy, if you want to live your life in service to a builder you select mostly because he is your local version I guess that is your choice. It is the trappings and the nonsense wrapped around belonging to many of these religious groups I question as less than valuable and see as sometimes deeply problematic. Unfounded certainty as comfort seems a poor focus as a basis for your life to me. A being so powerful as to be able to create a universe should not crave my worship or need my praise. They most certainty do not need me as a fawning servant and I can not imagine that is what I was built for. Eternal service to said being feels like slavery or being a pet. It seems exactly like piano burning or using a violin as a hammer in my eyes. Living your life in service to your community and ideals is a noble goal. I am no longer convinced that many religious groups have this as a primary focus and have twisted faith into a tool of control not empowerment. I know that there are great examples of religious ideals enacted in play. Even so I have found most people who evangelize as you do are wrapped in regressive restrictive arbitrary dogma. It is this dogma that makes many of these religious groups problematic while being the glue that holds them together. Service to family, community or your fellow man has great value, service to ancient dogma or conformity for conformities sake far less so.
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  29748.  @bonchidude  I am not voting for the lessor of two evils. I am voting for one of two choices. I am picking the one I wish to oppose, my choice is entirely tactical not emotional. If I was not in a contested state I would be voteing 3rd party. I am, so I will be voting for one of the two candidates who can actually win instead of spending it on a protest vote no one will care about. I am tactically choosing my opponent instead of supporting one, the bottom line is neither represents me and I count on being in opposition either way. This is a cycle where empowering another Trump election is not something I can be part of knowing what a total fail in every way that matters to me he is. Biden is shit too but he is the best target to oppose as I have like minded allies in his base and none in the GOP. Bernie is the ONLY reason the progressive agenda even exists. Pretending he killed it is not only counterfactual it is bizarrely opposite world. He literally created the template that will see it rise. The DNC loathes Bernie and always will. The idea he is a water carrier simple nonsense. Because he was never as militant as or aggressive as you would like does not mean he was in the tank for the other side. He is the only reason there is any chance of change going forward. He literally wrote the template on how to crush the establishment which had an completely uncontested strangle hold on power before him. We owe the entire future of the progressive-3rd party movement to Bernie. Even if he did not win he inspired the movement and proved out a str I ng effective non-corrupting funding mechanism that is already changing the landscape. Your spin is counter factual misdirection crafted to empower establishment stasis. You can hear the Hillary branded hate in your dishonest silly trope that purposely walks us back from the progress we have already made.
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  29996. McLean Burlock The spin they are men of the people is marketing and not attached to the facts. They are silver spoon trust fund babies who inherited their wealth from their dad. They literally have nothing in common with the "average Canadian" except some shared prejudice. Conservatives have NEVER balanced the budget and consistently run up huge deficits every time they are in power. Jobs are created by demand and no demand is created by handing out tax cuts to the rich that go onto a pile or are invested in automation, foreign production or stock buy backs. When you put money in the hands of people who spend it here that increases demand and servicing the rich does nothing but increase income inequality and create a larger divide between the rich and everyone else. The problem is we are not getting the quality of jobs we did even 20 years ago as we upload all the wealth into the hands of the owner class who do not invest it back in Canada.. The people serviced by the fords are not normal working men and woman. Job creation is never higher under cons compared to other parties. What they do is make the rich richer and that serves no one but them. Increasing the minimum wage puts more money in the hands of working people and a study released this week has shown it has costed no jobs and had no measurable negative impact while putting money into local markets. Being taxed more and making more go hand in hand. Anyone who takes a lower salary to stay in a lower tax bracket is a poor planner and is not very clever. I do not want to hear any more Conservative ideas on how to handle toll roads as the last time they had the power to they gave away the 407 to their buddies for 99 years and and left us holding the tab for patrolling it and collecting their fees. We might have had the money to expand the roadway to 5 lanes or even build a 408 but instead we gave that revenue to a bunch of insiders who swim in money from your road. Forget about the fact whatever party puts in toll highways downtown they will pay for it dearly next election. The spin the LRT was going to bankrupt the city is total nonsense. What he did was fuck a totally funded program for something no one committed to and never got off the ground. Fords plan was a pipe dream no one ever said they would fund despite his promises and if enacted might actually bankrupt the city as it did not have federal or provincial support. I can tell you I would not trust them with a 5 dollar bill and you have been bamboozled into being a fan by clowns who offer simple solutions to complex problems wrapped in slogans you like. Forget about the fact Ford never decreased the budget or got it under control short of great ideas like cutting back on emergency services and the libraries. The Fords have a persona they have sold to target audience that covers up who they really are and what they actually fight for.
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  30209. @Obelix You are attacking the messenger. That Bernie was not as aggressive as I would have liked is a failure of tactics and does not validly implicate him the way you insist. He wielded his power post 2016 and that you do not know what was achieved is not possible to substantiate. He manged managed to single handedly create a movement and a policy set to combat the establishment. His campaign highlighted who they were and ensured it is not a if but when they are beaten The game was always rigged, before him no one had ever seen it so plainly. If Bernie is guilty of anything it is that he imagined democracy and the power of his ideas would carry the day alone. He literally created a new way to fund campaigns and set a standard of transparency and policy that gives us a road map to beating the establishment. An establishment which is has to at least pretend to value the policy we fight for or face ever greater risk. No dem candidate who ran on M4A lost their seat last election. That trend is only getting more pronounced. I understand Bernie was flawed in so much as we now know he would never go for the jugular as you or I would have. That being said he is a lighted torch in otherwise blacked room. He forced the establishment to fight sound now widely popular policy even as they demonize their own base to chase donor cash. He cut a trail others more tactically focused will follow There is no value to Bernie bashing unless you love the status quo. As you bash him you only serve it, you need to own that. If that is cool, by all means you do you.
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  30369.  @donttreadonme1423  I will defend it because your arguments are not yours. You are regurgitating spin. These ideas have been debated by people with far more specific experience interpreting law than we have. The fact is those in power who share your views are universally deeply corrupt. They are overtly funded by the same clowns who write your spin and this directly undermines the value of it to me. Your opinion on this may be principled for you, but for them it is about profit. You can share whatever compelling spin you find, that does not mean it is relevant to the points I was making. You are no expert on this and much like a funementalist clearly start with your conclusion and work backwards. Like them you consistently defend points and make counters to arguments not made. If I was to debate the finer points with you it would simply be a rehash over long settled issues you simply reject out of principle with no regard to social value. You do this in order to prop up a chosen identity defined by your "principled" stands. As stated by one of the other posters debating with someone like you is largely useless. I have read your same hyperbolic spin that the gun lobby has written for you over and over. I learn nothing new from your take and none of it actually counters my assertions. That these arguments are compelling to you does not change they put people in danger and bring little if no value to the public at large. This is a factor that must be included when interpreting amendments, the arguments that you posit do not reference this concept at all! I know exactly how a "debate" with you would go, this is not my first encounter with a self appointed expert attempting to teach me using gun lobby dogma.
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  30372.  @donttreadonme1423  You are a cultist who is full of shit. There are plenty of ways to get to where I am on this issue. You are not objectively correct and consistantly misreprent those you oppose. You have to. I of couse was manipulating the language. I did not want you do so alone, it was good enough for you then it is for me too. I took the effort to explain how you do so. That you myopicly ignore most of what I say makes our converstaion far less than valuable. Pretending there is no argumet on my side is deeply ignorant, head in the sand nonsense. I acknolaged your argumet and took the time to counter it, you have nothing but dismissal and empty unearned superiority. That you are certain of this issue that has already been lomg settled the other way does not give you crediblity, it makes you look like a feelings based loon. Logic is not really your thing guy, you are clearly more about feels. No matter how you paint it, the policy and very modern interpretation of the amendment you support is also a demand for gun anarchy. I challenge you to explain how what you want is not an elimination of most gun regulation. What you call 'natural rights' us non cultists and the rest of the civilized world calls gun anarchy After that you need to explain why the rich land owners wanted every poor tenet farmer,, criminal and child armed. Would they want each individual rando to have the fire power of their contemporary militia firing line? Intent matters and in this case you plainly ignore that.
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  30467.  @joeylane2408  Canada, Canada, Canada If the imagined "poor black male" chose to live in a metropolitan area, he would have the same options as anyone else and enjoy a wide range of friends of all ethnicities and backgrounds as a common standard. If they move to the a rural area they would have the same options in housing, work and fitting in to the community anyone else. Their schools are world class too and cheaper, just saying. If being president is part of your question; there is only one answer by default so just leaving it out. In Canada his health care would taken care of at the same level as the richest citizen as he was gaining experience in his chosen field , it would mean he would start with 12 paid days off a year aside from any holidays of which 2 weeks are required by law. He would have a higher minimum wage ensuring his start was easier. This is true of most first world countries. They all have better health care, min wages, stat holidays, paid family leave, etc, etc than america does. Obama's rags to riches story has serious caveats and asides and does not reflect the lived experience most black citizens living in the US. Probably should not be pretending 100's of years of entrenched racism is gone because they found a establishment guy with charisma to waste the mandate handed to him in service to a broken status quo he was elected to change. We have become the land of the opportunity for the rich, for everyone else it is ever being pulled away. Anyone starting poor here (especially while not lily white) would be probably better off in any number of other places unless they relish the unvarnished stratification and growing polarization based on identity nonsense that is ever more innate our society .
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  30866.  @brianmatthews4323  You have no clue, even the "left wing" establishment media is still economically right wing and owned by the rich clowns that write gop tax law. The corporate media that is "left" is just superficially chasing a market. Actually they are corporatist and entablement focused. Not one of this insanely wealthy corporations are remotely "far left" When it comes to anyone making left wing economic arguments all corporate media is innately and completely hostile. They will ask how to pay for it as they ignore multi billion dollar tax cuts for the right or payouts to defense contractors. The actual left has no power and no money, they are not captains of industry or billionaires. The right and more importantly establishment maintain our broken status quo with changes at the edges that do not cost the rich owner class you worship a dime. The democrats led by Biden are at best center right, but are basicly 90's republicans that follow the majority of the population on social issues. Hillary was still famously anti gay marriage back in 2014. Obama passed the heritage foundation right wing think tank health care plan. The "radical left" has zero power, none. The only power the left has is on social issues that do not cost owner class anything and are widely popular. Literally everything else is shut down. As far as this show being far left? You clearly have no idea what that means. Cenk is a capitalist, a democratic socialist. There is a million miles to the far left for him.
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  30868. So what is funny? He is the most popular politician in the country and if he runs in the primary he is the only one who has put their hat in the ring as of now that can win. The neo liberals are really really bad at winning elections if you have not noticed. They barely got hillary in last time and she had a giant head start and EVERY advantage. The idea who they want is the driving force now is not attached to reality. They will not be picking the next leader and backing of the DNC right now is death sentence for any candidate to half their base. Every argument you have is old school thinking that ignores the facts. Your analysis is deeply flawed and full of bad talking points that do not matter. He is popular in red states forget about the rust belt where trump only stole the vote from hillary because she did not even visit them. Actual voters do not care about his gun votes or if he is from New York, they simply do not care. You are completely wrong in about the popularity of progressive ideas. Obama won because he pretended to be progressive, the only time the dems have done well in the last 5 cycles is when they ran as progressives. Obama lost seats his second term because people figured out who they really were, that same group knows Bernie is the real thing. The democrats have been putting pro business democrats up forever and are always losing because of it. The democrats playing at being republican light is not a good plan if you look at history. The idea they need to go right to win is betrayed by the fact they have been losing seats ever since they moved in that direction post Clinton except for a brief moment when they pretended to be progressive and won big. People like and trust what Bernie says in debates and people know enough of trump that nothing he says will be trusted by well over 70% of the country. Bernie will crush the orange clown with a flick of his wrist by pointing out how he has sold out. Trump is done against him. Saying Bernie's style is dying when it is literally a brand new thing is pretty stupid ..
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  30925. MrRicardo11 What I am saying is not an open question and pretending your hero is better is empty. You can not see another leader there because Putin has murdered or imprisoned anyone who could compete with him. The assertion there is no one else for the job is simple nonsense. I want leaders who work for their people both here and there and he does not quality. My flawed system which I am fighting to change does not have to be perfect for me to see Russia is broken too. I use the term democracy in the way it is meant to be used and do not promote neo-liberal rule for anyone including Russia or anywhere else. The system Russia pushes demands group think and does not value critical thinking skills or personal freedom at all. There is no room for that in their system or for free thought unless it all serves the dear leader. Putin represents the exact same group of clowns you complain about here the key difference is he had decided to keep the power in house by handing it to local friends. He is by definition part of the 1% and that he did not play ball with the foreigners and does not make him any better in any way. We have nothing to learn from Russia politically except what not to do. Being honest and being good are not the same thing. The GOP is pretty honest in what they want to achieve and none of their policy is anything but a sloppy blowjob for the donors. The spin that Ukraine is better for being annexed by a foreign power after throwing out a Russian puppet is empty bullshit. To say otherwise is nothing but Russian propaganda covering for a crime and an authoritarian strong man who has disconcertingly seized the government of a major world power.
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  31859. I hope you cut and pasted that ream of nonsense disguised as rational thought. Many of the things you cite are true but do not merit your conclusions. Like many who sell pseudo science nonsense you tell half truths leading to false assertions based on them. That vaccines have side effects is not and never was in contention. The severity and the commonality of the side effects is inflated to be baseless attack, additionally make it seem the risk in each vaccine is the same. We do not even have a vaccine yet you have already declared it dangerous and not worth taking. This is all based on empty propaganda from an identity based Luddite movement that gets things wrong on purpose to suit an empty narrative that does not pass a sniff test or if you bother to apply Occham's razor to their claims. You are the victim of group think here. That you think yourself above it is part of the appeal of the religious like identity movement you belong to. Like theists you pick and choose the data you want to believe in and ignore all other arguments or the rationality you apply to other aspects of your life. The faith like nature of your claims makes it impossible to discuss the issue with you rationally because the normal tools of logic and assimilation of data are dismissed with a flick of your hand if they in any way counter the narrative you are bought into. As an example, Covid death rates are actually greatly understated in the US. To get be classified as a Covid death you have to test positive for the virus to start with and been suffering symptoms attached to the affliction. Trump's CDC has no interest in inflating numbers just before an election. If there is no test available and it is only suspected you died of covid that number is not included. The fact is where we have had shortages of tests we have lost whole nursing homes with none of their numbers included. The numbers of people who die of other things while they have covid is not the large number you imagine it is, regardless of final reason covid is invasive enough to exacerbate and trigger other conditions contributing to the death. The number of deaths that would have died anyway but get blamed on covid's are a drop in the bucket of those who were untested and never included in the counts.
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  31905. @soul seeker My point is pretending Trump is anti war or better than the dems on this issue is silly. He is a member of the GOP who never saw a war they did not like. They are the party of Iraq and Afghanistan who has been hungry to start a war in Iran for decades. Trump ran on being better than Hillary but after getting in office has proved to be just as war centric as any GOP who has ever held the office even as he mouths anti war platitudes everyone should now laugh at. If at this point if you need more data to show the GOP are war mongers I am not sure anything I share will change your mind. Can you prove he brought home lots of troops? It should be easy. The fact is he did not, he expanded our military foot print in to new places we never had boots on the ground before. He did increase our military budget by over 100 billion, what did he spend that on pop guns? He increased already record drone strikes which are undeclared acts of war still not war. He assassinated foreign leaders on foreign soil, is that an act of peace? He blew up Russian fighter jets while punishing another country, does that make war more likely or less? Is that the act of a pro peace president? Obama did not start any new wars by your silly standard either. So by your spin because Obama did not do any of the things above and had less drone strikes than Trump so he was a better pro peace president? The fact is Trump escalated what Obama did. He is more a pro war president than Barry was, if you cede that truth I will let you wallow in your delusion un-challenged because at least you will be consistent.
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  31987.  @mrshittles9424  There are no communists running. None. Even bernie who is too "too left-leaning for those fiscal conservatives" is a basic moderate outside the US. I honestly think that "too left-leaning" narrative is a dishonest one spread by conservative corporately owned media and establishment democrat's. They only win elections by not being republicans, holding the institutional power and the massive amount of cash a tiny minority spends propping them up, their ideas are not popular. Ranked choice is a great way to go but will not happen as long as the leaders we can choose from are picked from two pools entirely owned by corporate interests. Both oh whom have no interest in ceding power. Both parties are shockingly the same on issues tax and foreign policy as well as military spending. The GOP super serves it's base by playing to wedge issues while blaming every problem on democrats. The Corporate dem's spit on their base by ignoring wildly popular policy for donor cash while being marginally better on some domestic issues than the slash and burn GOP. The key difference between the parties from my perspective is the voters and the each bases priorities. One base has a focus on a higher min wage, affordable education and universal health care. The other is focused on immigrants as a problem, restriction of woman's health care and that we have no regulation around guns. We all need to start ignoring the labels sold by the main stream media. We need to look at the respective popularity of the polices each leader stands behind and how they benefit those around us. When you do that you will be directed to vote for someone like Bernie. The corporate dems and the entire GOP at best offer incrementalism and at worst giant steps backwards. We need to stop voting on identity/wedge issues and empty dishonest fear mongering. Our elected leaders should serve us and not just the minority who pays their way into power.
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  32596.  @hollybotw5460  As I stated you hate them for nonsense reasons. 1. They do not have an open border policy. They have the same policy we have had for decades and pretending otherwise does not change that. Your entire screed is ignorant nonsense that has more to do with your feelings than any law. Biden against his bases wishes has continued most of Trumps policies including using the pandemic to kick out asylum seekers. 2. You stand beside clowns literally defending looting and busting into the capitol chanting hang the VP. You do not get to larp about caring about riots anymore. You actually stand with rioter's. You hate all BLM but should only dislike the opportunists and instigators that showed their face at only 7% of the BLM rallies. The "rioters" were criminals in each case, no one backed them. The "violence" you saw which was over represented in your media was mostly caused by cops and instigators not protesters. 3. Your bullshit spin on the last one is so fucking crazy I had to dig around to even figure out what you were talking about. ALL The CRT garbage is total idoicy, it does not go into normal curriculum and is college level masters course. It speaks to the horrible quality of fringe nonsense you watch to pump up your very poorly focused and misdirected anger, to justify it. They are lying to you, weaponizing you against yourself. Your spin as it stands serves real life monsters to make you feel better about a shitty situation. You are very likely TFG to be helped, good luck with all that.
    1
  32597.  @hollybotw5460  The whole border bullshit is nonsense created to make you mad as they fucking rob you over and over. Biden is owned by the same monsters that own the GOP and he promised and delivered no real change. Stop talking about my bias as you swim in a sea of it and share total imagined up nonsense to attack them as you ignore actual failures the GOP is complicit with. If you serve one of these monsters, the establishment Dems or the GOP you serve the same master. We have less illegals today than we have in the last couple decade. Both Biden and Obama put deportations on steroids. If your media actually told you what they did you would cheer it. I see the whole thing as a set of distractions meant to make us all look away from the immigration problem no one in government cares to solve because they are only paid to pay lip service and never solve the issue. Both Trump or Biden could have solved the illegal problem with a stoke of a pen. They do not do it because the solution is to go after the goofs who lure them here, who hire them and no one is willing to do that. No jobs, no illegals coming. No one wants to actually solve the issue. There was a riot on Jan 6th. Standing up and acting as a Stan for rioters makes you as bad as you pretend the democrats you hate are. That you agree with their violent and hateful anti american rhetoric does not change you stand with terrorists. You will never ever see me do the same with looters. Your side is the only one apologizing for and dismissing criminal actions. I do have Kids. They are doing nothing to our kids in school, you are being lied to. You have been duped by overt liars who play on your emotions and are manipulating you into being angry about an issue that DOES NOT EXIST. My kids are not in college and unless yours are then you have literally nothing to cry about. Communism is not just a group you dislike. The term has a specific meaning and as you use it incorrectly it undermines any unearned credibility you did not have in the first place Nothing about this subject is remotely similar to communism, communism has nothing to do with talking about history. I would argue if you are talking about the government being restrictive, that is what you demand. As normal the right is prone try to ban ideas you do not like, this time even if it is only at the collage level. That is not communist, but it is totalitarian and anti american.
    1
  32598.  @hollybotw5460  I base it on the stats associated with border crossings and the number of people getting access and staying here. These numbers are very low lately, primarily because of covid. The migrant numbers are so low many industries that traditionally have relied on foreign workers are facing labour shortages. This has exacerbated supply chain and food production issues as the industries are lacking the workers they have normally counted on. I do not have masters like you do, I am not beholden to a broken narrative or a corrupt party like you are. I loathe the dems as much as you do, only I hate them for actual valid reasons. The key difference in our respective hatred is I also see the GOP as cancerously corrupt while you blithely ignore it to coddle your feelings. The "crisis" at the border is fake nonsense meant to make you look away from real issues that you should actually care about. Even as the GOP does literally nothing for any voters and are running us toward authoritarian anti american rule. You think you are right based on your feelings and poor self validating media choices, nothing else. As you pretend my one liners do not land you have literally nothing and no arguments at all. You are spitting wedge issue distractions that are intended to get a specific class of poorly focused NPC to take your eye off real issues and direct your base valid anger away from the real cause of it. I have seen the sub 80 IQ parents babbling about issues they at best poorly understand. Their nonsense claims are not exactly validation for your point of view. These people are drunk on fake outrage like you are. That they have chosen the same narrative as you marks them dupes too. That they say stupid things that make you angry does not back your spin's veracity like you imagine it does. You clowns on the right never took the high road, you have been racing to the bottom after the monsters who lie you into a rage and blatantly play to your false preconceptions. You are mad about fake issues as you ignore real ones that are literally killing your families as we speak. Your brand of over self important ignorance is below contempt. Like I said you are very likely TFG. You are a tribal NPC, too lost in your stinking bubble to even talk to. That you think your side was ever reasonable is hilariously out of touch with anyone outside your invisible fact free self isolation sphere. Your ilk have been ignorant hate machines since Bush, your threat to continue doing that is meaningless now. I actually revel in the hatred from people such as you. Even as I know you hate me for stupid things spun to misrepresent what I actually think. Your hatred matches how the Taliban and Nazi's feel about me and everyone that stands against rank tribalism and self promoting authoritarianism. It means I am doing something right.
    1
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  33163.  @hross1201  Not first, maybe second, maybe third not first. First should have been the tens of millions left with no income because of the necessary stay at home policy they had no control over. If these corporations are still selling things and employing people let the free market take care of that. Cover the people first, these people will put all that money back into the economy. It will give them the option to stay home instead of just draining their meager resources while cutting of small business from their life blood. Second help out small business with rent suspension and wage support, their land lords with tax and mortgage suspension. Next give large business support with strict employment rules and pension protections. Put the economy on pause. None of this was suggested by any of the do nothing leadership in power because they are beholden to the clowns we are handing 4 trillion to/ The owner class who benefited from this are getting exponentially richer as we speak, the stock market no measure of misery for Americans is spiking. The last bailout had a provision for freeken lobbyists. All of this has been done successfully in other places where they are not desperate to open like we now are. They can still afford to listen to doctors. The places like Sweden who did not shut down as fully had frequent testing and hard core contract tracing and support for those who had to quarantine in place. Please spare me the hand wringing for the vaunted rich as 40 million Americans are out of work. Now their only option is to go out and look for a job during a pandemic, what could go wrong?
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  33241. Assuming I am going to fight who ever wins, which admin has a base that supports my Ideas? Which has a base I can rally against ? Nothing you said is a surprise to me and I see the dem establishment for what they are. The gop does not care about me either. I am not endorsing them, I am making a terrible choice. My only other choice this cycle is do nothing as there are NO OPTIONS which we'll achieve anything. Your attempt to voter shame me like you are hillary is counter productive and I am not doing the same to you as I see it as counter productive. I really do understand your perspective and dislike the lessor evil spin too. That being said I am very pragmatic and practical. I am not saying you should vote for Biden, I am explaining why I likely will. If I was to be contrary I would question how exactly you are planning to fight besides to vote on principle even if doing so stabs your eye. To extend your analogy you are going to a car dealer and leaving without buying a car forcing you to walk everywhere. I am not giving anyone blanket support. That being said throwing away my vote will get me no closer to where I want to be. Like I said I plan to fight them as I have been doing. Biden getting elected means I have a president with a base which agrees with me to engage and put pressure on him. If Trump wins I have no allies to work with and will be as helpless as we have been over the last three years.. Give me a better plan than just throwing my vote away out of principle and there by tacitly empowering trump, I am open to it.
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  33284.  @tdmc123  You spit a pile of empty shit identity shit and then drop the mike. Let us discuss your critiques. The spin they had on "Russia gate" was not hyperbolic. If you wanted to criticize them on it you could. They gave impeachment too high a chance than they should have, given who ran the senate and how weak the democratic leadership is. But what they stood for was essentially proven correct even if the senate failed in their duty. The identity politics thing is bullshit. They stand up for ideas they believe in. That right wingers who are burried in their own identity do not like it does not make their progressive positions a fail. They called out Trump on his failures that the main stream media ignored. That they reported on some of the same idiotic bullshit does not mean they were lost in an establishment narrative. The main stream media focused exclusively on stupid things to distract from the robbery they turned a blind eye to. I am not sure what subjects they go against their viewers for "to put cash in their pockets". I would be interested in you elaborating on that. They may get specific issues wrong but opposing Trump is a no brainer on virtually everything he did. When Trump did the few good things he managed to do they praised him for it, getting out of the TPP is an example. To address your list: - They support the freeing of Julian Assange, you need to catch up. - They also called out our attempted coup's and are not on side with the corporatists ousting their government even as they point out Madero is no saint. - They do not support the censorship but are bound by a TOS and expect others to adhere to it as well. One can not yell fire in a crowded theater and you have no right to use my back yard to spit garbage I see as nonsense. As long as these sites are treated as private entities the rules in place will be made by the market. We may want to change that but that is the way it is. -M4A, can not pass. It does not matter if you think it is the right time, can't pass. - Russia Gate,: It appears much of it was true even if the GOP senate chose to ignore the Muller report. That it does not result in trumps impeachment means the way the establishment chased it was weak, little else. It still put 5 guys in jail several of which Trump pardoned. -Republicans do have to be stopped, this is an objective truth. The problems with the Biden's and the Nancy's for the democrat's is burnt into the fact they both chase donor cash and are owned. The entire GOP has the same issue on steroids'. You do not fight cancer by getting more cancer. -Sadly the dems are the lessor of 2 evils. They vote for the same bullshit tax cuts and wars as the GOP does but at least they seem to care about Americans dyeing in a pandemic. They have a base that believes in science and are not hard core cultists. I personally voted for Biden as the one of the two of the losers I had a choice of I would oppose. None of your points add up to them being MNBC light. There is no way to call themselves progressive without holding most of the positions they do. I do accuse you of having wrongheaded and often dishonest spin. This is classic old school nonsense picked up from one of few sources you apparently like. That does not make ideas valid or compelling to anyone who has looked at any of these assertions closely. You are not as convincing or validated as you imagine you are.
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  33376.  @mikem2132  I have come to understand that any real populist movement that succeeds needs to get buy in from people who think of themselves as right wing. This is because they contain some of the most dedicated, concerned and invested people in our country. I think it is a matter of finding new way to talk about old issues. About finding the common ground first on the things we all deeply dislike and then on the things we can see eye to eye on. We do so with the understanding we are speaking to each other on the up and up and are not doing one thing as a cover for another. The illegal immigrants getting health care problem is not the huge issue it has been made out to be. First off we already give them emergency room care if they show up now. This is by far the most expensive way to deliver anyone care. The fact we already cover them should make this concern moot but the fact is they will not get free health care either unless they qualify to do so. In places like Canada outsides do not automatically get free health care. All citizens and landed immigrants going through the system do. "Illegals" and others just visiting do not. They are billed. The whole concern seems empty to me and is a half true talking point drummed up to put people who are focused on immigration issues on the wrong side of this economic issue against their own interest. This is a great example of how the corporate system misrepresents issues to serve their own interest with no care for yours. Breaking out policies and finding common ground on them is exactly what we should be doing. The fact is we are actually in opposition to the exact same people who drive the narrative from either side to enrage the other. They want us at our throats, but I honestly am starting to see that break down. I see it more and more.
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  33783.  @ArturoGarzaID  It has nothing to do with men "working longer". The reason is historic, historically woman were not offered or granted power. Our societal standards precluded them from holding those positions and that has been changing. It has changed very quickly by historic speeds but very slowly for all who do not see the existing bias and traditional restrictive/double standards as valuable. The elected officials you point to as an example there is no problem did so against the best efforts of the establishment they continue to oppose. It is not "men" keeping them down but tradition, the very thing conservatives value most. She is correct to oppose them from her perspective and the GOP should get no credit for any advances in rights and access to leadership woman have gained. . She is correctly pointing out that the republicans are bunch of throw back dinosaurs. They are the exact same kind of leaders who would have been against woman's suffrage, they are mired in the past. They fight to preserve the status quo which traditionally does include the empowerment of woman. She does not have to engage in the weak brand of attack you say she does. She can attack their anti woman polices directly without jumping through the SJW hoops you pretend she does. All you need is a set of eyes to see it. The republicans and the establishment democratic party would dearly love to see the first Muslim woman congressmen crushed. If you think either of these groups love AOC or what she represents you are deluded. Both of these woman got in because they are anti status quo, which among other things is default anti republican. If you do not like her calling them out, too bad.
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  33955. Your assertions are all based on your understanding of technology we use now and the limits you outline may not exist in the future for us let alone in a system as complex as the one that could be simulating our reality for us. You are projecting our systems limitations onto this proposed one. We have no analogue to a system that could do a fraction of what this proposed simulator would need to be able to do. The bugs and errors which you assert make the system impossible may exist. The fix would a simple matter effective and instant error handling and a filter so we do not perceive the errors occur. Without access to the back end the software running even modern programs with proper error handling have no idea they hit a bug after the error is handled. One would need to go to the logs to see what occurred and we may not have access to those here. The simulation does not need to be perfect code, it would require excellent seamless error handling to make it work. I have a degree in software engineering too, no one has tried to write anything like this and our expertise would make us like babies in the face of a system complex enough to do what the simulation theory proposes. That is to say your professional take on this not as valuable as you pretend it is. If we were to ever write simulations of this complexity it will not be you or I writing that base code, it will be written by AI's directed to write a tool which will write a more complex tool etc. We as engineers will only be working on the very earliest iterations of the system. Comparing the something like shuttles software to this proposed simulation is like comparing a Ruko Toy to commander Data of StarTrek. We have many server options provide 24/7 uptime with redundancy , fail over and multiple sites. There is no reason why this kind of simulation could not have a more advanced version of the same thing with fewer errors or issues. Problems that get covered up as soon as they happen without the user even noticing. This is not proof we are in a simulation, just that your spin is not as definitive as you think it is.
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  33956.  @enumclaw79  Our eventual advanced simulations will not likely be "man made". They will be constructed by specially created ai tools to write better tools to write this kind of application. The system would be designed to not be prone to the errors or would be able to correct and adjust them in real time. The idea no system could do this does not strike me as well thought out. I see no reason why something like this could not exist given time and resources applied. With the expansion of technology and AI, I expect we will be creating highly detailed simulations ourselves within the imaginable future . You do not seem to understand that zero down time systems that manage up time with parallel processing on distributed machines run all the time, this is despite the bugs inherent in our code. We write durable very complex code all the time, bugs are not the inherent problem you are pretending they are. By the very nature of any working system they are manageable and most systems work within a specific operational range as dictated by the demands of the service All errors can be managed, hardware can be configured to be parallel and redundant. With the proper application of focus and resources there does not ever have to be an unhandled error and post submit audits to confirm smooth running can check for badly generated data within a specified margin. That is now. This will be even more so in the case when we have a flexible, fast and hyper intelligent utility to monitor and react appropriately to each in real time. The limits you are discussing are not eternal and are largely based on the way code is written and the tools we have to do it now. The idea we will never move into a place a system like this can be created does not seem certain at all. We can not do so with with our current software and tech, but no one said we can. The idea no one could ever create a system like this at all because of your bug concern seems short sighted. It is the kind of thing a 1990's programmer would say about a computer that sits in the palm of your hand but with more processing power than the space shuttle. The best scientific evidence of simulation theory may be an example of us finding a bug. That photons do not act the same way when observed and not observed in a double slit experiment might very well be an oversight in the logic of the simulation. You are correct that bugs exist even in advanced code, but they do not necessarily break it.
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  33958.  @enumclaw79  I never said we could write these systems today and it is a silly strawman that anyone asserts we can. I have laid out the rudiments of the kind of tech and processes that will be required to build a system like this. I disagree that that this system could not be written for the reasons you cite. A 1970's assertion that assumes we do not move past or mitigate your stated limitations is not well supported. It does not seem insurmountable to me given extra resources, topologies and tools these issues can not be addressed. You are not making a scientific assertion when you say this can't be done. This is not hard science we are discussing, but potentials and concepts. You reject the idea based on limitations of tech and systems we are now currently handcuffed by, that does not seem apt here. Many of your concerns are conceivably mitigatable by processes I have outlined earlier. I can think of ways this may be done, I can imagine another mind solving this. This is a science that is rapidly changing. Many hard and fast rules about the system design from the 1970's are no longer true today. They were solved by next gen languages, raw horse power and topology innovation. It may be far fetched, but is most certainly a hypothesis. That you do not think it likely does not change it's nature. It may be a failed hypothesis but it is based on data and observations that demand speculation. Physicists have no mandate to explain the nature of this system to make this particular hypothesis. At this stage in the investigation on this subject our expertise as system engineers is largely irrelevant. We would be cave dwellers looking at a rocket to the moon on a system of this complexity. I do not expect our experts to be able to design a system of this complexity and demand, today. That does not mean it can't be done. If I can imagine ways to mitigate some of your concerns using contemporary concepts (as we do now) then I see no reason to wave away the idea these issues could be addressed. We are not talking about making anti grav here, the idea no one could build a fault management system for this process is not the same thing. The error issue you highlight is conceivably solvable with horse power, redundant parallel processes and filters to mitigate the fallout of the concerns. Now give me your actual road map solution for anti grav and I will accede your point. Arguments from authority are fallacies for a reason, your claims it can't be done are as empty as mine it is conceivable it is true That we do not understand how to build this kind of process does not change the nature of the hypothesis you reject out of limitations of our current tech, not the base concept.
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  33959.  @enumclaw79 I reject your spin too, the idea this can not be done is not a widely accepted concept even among your peers. That you are pretty alone in making a definitive statement on this does not give you the unearned cred you seem to demand. You saying it can't be done because because we can not mitigate errors seems silly on the face. The fact you can not imagine how to deal with the concerns faced does not mean they can't be dealt with. Your reasons for flatly rejecting the idea are shortsighted and somewhat myopic. Your overly definitive assertions are empty in context. The issues that are stopping us from creating this system are simply not eternal or un-addressable like the production of grav plating given our current understanding of both sets of subject matter. You are just saying nuh uh because you correctly recognize a technical problem we have not yet solved. As I stated earlier your desire to inject your expertise on this issue is largely pointless. Your arguments are only definitive in the context of your own experience/current tech limitations and prove literally nothing. Hand wave these objections away at your leisure, you do seem deeply invested in this subject in a personal way that seems to bias you. None of the claims here are definitive, nor do they have the data backing them to make the idea "hard science". But calling on a modern software engineer's skills to effectively say the simulation can't be done because we can't do it now is not compelling in debunking the concept. Am no giant proponent of the SH myself, it is mostly interesting. There is not enough info for me to make any kind of definitive assertions about it's veracity. There are a few compelling augments countering it, I just do not find yours to be very effective or convincing. If indeed we are living in a simulation featuring literally trillions of animal minds, it is not crazy to assume the writers beat your 1970's limitation as a truism. Software issues are mitigated with redundancy and resources applied to the issue allowing all usable systems to work within an acceptable tolerance of errors. In this context it is hard to imagine the requirements necessary to deal with your specific concern. That is not remotely the same as our total lack of understanding about the nature of gravity on command.
    1
  33960.  @enumclaw79 There are several plausible ways it can be done. That we do not have a reasonable way to do it now does not mean your expertise as a computer engineer who can not imagine how it is done is critical to the discussion. Perfect code does not exist and does not need to in order to design the construct. All that is needed is correct error handling and or an external auditing of the process along with data fixing. The idea this is impossible or the basic structure that will be the core of these systems is not already written is asserted ignorance. AI Generated code will be used as a tool to create and manage interactions between tools in a way a person would not be able to. It will enable the creation of processes that would be conventionally impossible extending our ability to innovate the sub subsystem integration which will be integral to a process this complex. AI use in development will give an advanced generation of tools opening up options currently not at our finger times. One does not need to predict every outcome, one needs to create the basic structure and include an algorithm that allows a fail over into a self learning corrective process that will iteratively corrects the issue or gently fail until corrected externally. Patching data retro-actively would undo any damage the errors may cause going forward rolling back concerns on error stacking issues. One could conceivably brute force fix these issues if you had the cycles to do so I agree on your assessment of what these tools do will do in the short term. I continue to disagree with you on the simulation thing for many the reasons cited. That we do have not the technology or topologies to make such a thing now does not mean it is unimaginable even from a technical perspective. As a final note on your error concerns, we may be facing the errors you cite all the time in this simulation. In business today we have bugs that cause damage, we fix them and then fix the data so the issue goes away entirely. As long as this proposed system can patch the data and put things right after a bug, we as participants would not need to know it happened. If this was true it would flatly undermine any of the questionable value your expertise has on the validating or refuting this concept. As entities in this imagined box, we may not be equipped to understand how to actually build this. That truth would not preclude it being real.
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  33980.  @chillchi49  It litteraly does not matter what you think it means, to an atheist it is a tepid expletive and nothing more. You have no ability to understand what it means to someone without any faith. It is cultural not relious in nature, Like putting up a stocking even though you know there is no Santa, it is a habit. As an atheist I do not belive everything came from nothing, I simply do not think making up an invisible dictator solves any problems or explains it very well. There may be some kind of deity that made the universe but I do not see any evidence that anyone's claims about his nature are better than anyone else's. They are all equally valid, meaning not at all. I am an atheist because I have no belief in any of the gods in thier many forms as presented. By my values the most popular modern gods, based on bronze age texts are plagued with the worst of human failings. Many of these faith's stated image of god is impossible respect, let alone join them in worship. Even the ones that are not regressive and repressive are still just largely a social clubs that are not for me. I do not need your certainty about what is not yet fully understood. I am comfortable saying I do not know and will instigate useful answers based on our current evidence. The relious start with an answer that props up a preconception and then tries to work backward. Your kind will keep moving the goal posts because you have to. The need for simple answers to complex questions is the providence of a specific kind of personality, I am not counted amoung them.
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  34017.  @youknow9092  I did not delete my comment. Mr Trump courted bigots from day one of his campaign announcement. He pushed the narrative through his entire administration. I do not care about him disavowing monsters he empowers with his rhetoric and choosen policy. It is not clear at all his views vear from the bigots and that is why they support him with full throated voice. They do not do that for anyone that clearly hates them. To call a policy racist it has to disproportionally effect a single race. The stated motivation of the effort is irrelevant, it is the action of the effort which is innately racist because it targets by race. I do not have to show what is in anyone's heart to declare an action against one race as racist. Global bans based on religion, labeling peaceful protest against literal tyranny rioting and anti american. Immigration bans and demonizing of immigrants as a nazi throw back tactic. Your Mr Trump and his family have long been racist, a brief look into their history hammers that point home. There many many differences between what Antifa is and what the brown shirts were. First off they are not politically affiliated nor are they recognized or supported by any political party. In fact they are a unfunded, unorganized group of people who dislike fascists' and want to stand up to their brutality with like brutality. To call them fascist is to ignore what the word means. They are violent and potentially problematic if you are brownshirted fascist waving his freak flag but no one else is threatened. I go by the dictionary definition of fascism and socialism. Most people on the right I speak to have no idea what they mean and emptily equate both with bad even while they at least tacitly support one. The white power freaks do stand with you, they vote for the same Mr Trump you do for reasons you apparently choose not to see. These facts are not up for debate, ignoring them does not make them go away. I understand your concern and motivation, I would distance myself from those monsters if I were you too.
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  34118.  @Vanderearden  So they should not have voted for the cares act and that would help how? Do tell how they voting for the only from of stimulus (even if pathetic and weak) that was going to be passed when it was going to pass anyway is some kind of fail. As you talk about them re-upping the patriot act you ignore the fact it was crammed inside the budget and not only did the squad fight it they were one of the ten who voted against the resolution adding it. They fought it's inclusion and opposed the measure. It passed because they did not have enough support to remove it. The failure was not theirs and there was nothing they could have done to stop it. To say they voted for re-uping it is technically true but they represented the only opposition to the blanket support for the measure form corporate democrats. I have a hard time seeing that as anything but a numbers fail, it was not an abdication of what they said they would do. The issue is not they have the same problem as the establishment democrats as you tacitly assert with your spin. It is that the shills and sellouts still control the process and dump whatever they want into bills and their agenda has little to do with ours. Do you honestly think if the squad or Bernie was driving the patriot act would have been included? We would have passed such a weak and pathetic stimulus? The squad has not sold out they just do not have enough power to drive the bus as you seem to expect them to. I do not support bad votes but I look at them in context and attempt to see where they come from instead of choosing the most hyperbolic and defeatist spin out there. Like I said earlier, I never questioned your "facts", just your interpretation of them. Your characterization of the squad enthusiastically embracing establishment is empty from what I can see. They still seem the be hated and and all were primarieried with big donor money and none are speaking at the convention. So much for endorsement that does not exist. When you say silly stuff like they are carrier politicians you are using republican talking points and that is almost never a good thing. This spin ignores the many good polices they push or how they have moved the overton window back from the edge of a right wing cliff in a very short time. You are pointing at problems whose real focus is built on the total lack of control the progressives have in government. That they are forced to vote for bills set by leaders who do not and never will share our values will mean garbage gets pushed in. That being said you are treating them like they are all Joe Manson or queen Nancy herself and I see it as unfounded and border line dishonest spin. Happy to stay in touch, I find your brand cynicism honest and refreshing. It comes from the right place, but I no longer share it.
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  34536.  @napoleonruss1528  It is not worth ruining all the trans athlete lives (a dozen or so country wide) so a handful of bench warmers can bench warm. The best players will all still play. The idea that some biological male is going to run away with all the highly treasured and lucrative female sporting awards is poorly thought out and not a real problem. If the individuals you are concerned about are great they will compete as a great athlete, but their effort does not take away the efforts of anyone else involved. Star players raise the quality of others play, it is what they do. There is no upside that is promoted by your spin, there is a great deal of harm done as you ignore the clear damage and marginalize youths you do not care about simply because of who they are. You are climbing on a political prosecution bandwagon with clowns who share your talking points. They are literally stripping rights from woman while pretending that they value their agency and rights as woman when it comes to sport. It makes a lie of the entire argument you make which is little more than trumped up snowflake bigotry based on nonsense spin, that you happen to buy into. The fake outrage you are engaging in hurts far more people than it protects, as designed. The whole trans athlete bruhaha is faux outrage, dishonest spin Invented by a group of repressive assholes who are actively stripping actual rights from woman. They do this as they pretend to protect them in this very narrow fake moral panic issue. They are defending them from the grave and terrifying hazard of a girl not making a team because there is a better player. Getting the last bench warmer place on the team is not and should not be a protected right. Being able to try out, should be.
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  34647.  @glennjohn3824  You just listed observations in the context of our environment not objective truths. You misunderstand what the term means even as you display bizarre unfounded superiority. Our numbering system works the way it does because we designed it that way. If our numbering system was 2, 1, 3, 5, 4 then 2 + 2 = 1. Our interpretation and needs determine math rules not some objective truth. In a hand glider or wind tunnel humans can fly. With the correct technology we would not need a woman to give birth. Sugar was once treated as medicinal and we thought the sun went round of us for most of history. Depending on when you assert them your truths are a not truths at all. These truths of yours are bound to the moment you claim them true. They are only really true for now but are all subject to change. That means they can not be objective. Heliocentrism is now a predominant theory in science. It is based on observation and experiment to verify it giving it the honored title in science of theory. Science never makes claims of objective truth. They have laws based on repeated observation and postulations that with enough validation become theories. Listing the earth going around the sun as an objective truth is a religious statement and would never be made by a scientist. It is odd you choose this one because for most of history religion forced us to be geocentric out of hubris and ignorance based on a bronze age text. It took science and not an appeal universal rules to silence the churches claim geo-centrism is an objective truth I would be interested what truth you claim to disparage gay people, their rights or that being gay is not really a thing. What universal truth justifies you making such ignorant and fact free statements about them?
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  34862.  @randyrogers8201  They should hate rich liberal elites for the same reason they hate rich conservative elites. Instead they have been brainwashed into being mad about the same nonsense you seem to care about. Actual people demanded gender pronouns, the establishment media went along because it did not cost the owner class any cash. The "liberal leadership" is largely silent on the trans issue. This is while the right wing elites (that people apparently like) openly cry for bigotry, application of religious precepts in law and a fast march toward fascism. Gay marriage was legalized in the US a decade after the rest of the free world did the same. The right pivoted to pretending talking about the existence of gay parents or people was "grooming". The right is the only one making a federal case about this, it is as a naked distraction from the dumpster fire that is their economic policy. The whole evil elite woke liberals schtick completely ignores all the elites real issues. Elites on the right and left sell us out as they pander to partisan wedge issues to distract their bases. The GOP has gone full dark side, anti sex , anti freedom, a government so small it fits in every woman's uterus while the dems stick to poll tested largely popular ideas that they even then only give tepid support to. The GOP super serves its base with idiot identity wedge issues. The democrats only do so once virtually the whole country is on board already and even then only with half measures. They are paid to ignore the issues you really care about, the problem has nothing to do with the "woke" taking these losers off message. The democrat's are ostensibly on the side of freedom in these cases. Even so they still only tepidly support their base, even on easy popular wedge issues like gay marriage. It took the supreme court to fix that, the chicken shit liberal elites do not get credit. The current "left wing" leadership acts like 90's republican's and pretending they are psychotically woke ignores what they have passed or even fought for. I can list numerous snowflake laws passed by the right to defend their voters feelings, I can't think of one done by the dems. Your outrage meter appears to be broken, you are angry at the wrong things. It is not left wing people talking about gay or trans rights issues (like this show) that is killing us or slowing progress. The problem is the elected leadership of both parties is bought and paid for by an ultra rich owner class. The establishment democrats have many many problems, being too reactionary and connected to the demands of their base is most certainty not one of them.
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  34914.  @isaacazminov8733  Total bullshit. TYT did not make any "anti cop videos" and to say otherwise is naked unvarnished dishonesty. Pretending they incited anyone to hurt anyone is an overt lie told by clowns who consistently support actual violent rhetoric from their chosen fringe sources. Your assertion it had to do with them being a TYT fan is nonsense flung like monkeys throwing shit and has no basis outside your hate filled fact free bubble. Tucker is literally playing to a proven armed violent base and making shit up to drive wedge issues that promote his support for the overtly corrupt and the regressive. His dishonest spin is the kind of garbage that gets already unstable armed yahoo's pointing guns at cops who are enforcing the law. Tucker Carlson dog whistles to a group of armed clowns who are already paranoid and terrified of the government. He makes a tense situation worse and empowers ignorance on the subject to drive political division as that is his goal. If more people get killed than that is the price these assholes have shown they are willing to pay as they plainly ignore all gun issues to make the gun lobby money. They use it to drive a wedge fear based spin that gets their corrupt leaders elected over and over. Tucker is not reporting anything he is spitting dishonest misleading nonsense toward a political goal. Pretending that is what TYT was doing in their case is either ignorant or also dishonest. Tucker may not be actually responsible for any deaths but he is certainly acting as a media cancer on this issue and he should be called out. TYT has never been guilty of the same thing as cops murdering unarmed citizens is news.
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  34954.  @drstone3418  Not just fair pay, but an ability to have a voice in what the company offers. What benefits they will provide , what seniority means, safety and overtime standards. I see the corporate environment as totalitarian in nature. Without a voice to counteract that power and speak on behalf of workers it is a historical truth that worker remuneration and safety stagnated and suffered. The greed of poor people is far less problematic than that of the rich. The poor have power over virtually no ones life, they need to be in large groups to have any say at all. Even then they are largely ignored, if possible. A rich greedy owner holds many lives in his hand and can do far more damage all by themselves. Unions are not fit for all industries. Jobs where workers are considered a utility by the employer are good candidates for a union. The union brings value by being able to demand employer concessions that an individual could not, on their own. Unions at their core are the basic allowance for some democratization of what would otherwise be an entirely authoritarian structure. When there were no unions, workers had no voice at the table at all. Giving people a voice in an otherwise voiceless system has value. The efforts of unions have secured working standards that everyone, even the unionized consider normal today. The spin that unions are about defending the lazy is naked propaganda. From powers that have a direct fiduciary interest in misrepresenting what unions mean to all workers or the labour market in general. The same monsters that control all establishment media and have been shitting on unions for decades.
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  35016.  @scotthullinger4684  Inflation had already started to rapidly rise, long before Biden took office. It is a world wide phenomena, meaning it is not driven by our economy. Biden never had control of it, he inherited the issue. Biden continued trumps policy at the boarders including work on Trumps uncompleted/unpaid for wall! He continued trumps policy of holding refugee claimants in mexico, much to his own voters anger. The idea he widely opened the border is counter factual nonsense not attached to reality. Texas taxes are higher for working people than they are in California because of brutal property taxes there. The only people fleeing to the states you mention are rich assholes looking for another tax cut from a deeply sympathetic sold out leader. Employment under Biden was down at near record low numbers, I see no one like you even mention that. How odd. Housing costs have been on a rise the entire Trump presidency. That trend only continued under Biden. This is due to polices that both the GOP and the establishment Democrats are bipartisanly complicit on that empower wall street vultures. Your outrage about your quoted stats seems very mono dimensional and applied like you have only been told half the story. I have been hearing these same complaints the whole Trump presidency, that you have transferred them all to Biden speaks to the news bubble you are lost in. Get this strait! I am NOT A FAN of Biden. He is largely the same fail Trump is without the mean tweets and weekly sacking of some staff member. Biden is a 90's republican! The only reason you can not see it is you have been bizarrely convinced he is a communist. Even a 90's republican is better than the bat shit crazy, anti-democratic version represented by Trump or cronies that are complicit in his lies.
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  35017.  @scotthullinger4684 You miss the point pretty badly. Biden is not wonderful, he is establishment business as usual, just like Trump proved he was when being led by the nose when in office. Biden inherited a collapsing shit show from Trump. Funny thing, just like Obama did from Bush. As stated he DOES NOT ignore illegal immigration. His polices are basicly the same as Trump as he rolled back almost NOTHING. On immigration: If either party wanted to attack illegal immigration they would hit the people who give them Jobs and lure them here. The fact neither party does speaks volumes about them wanting to "solve" the problem. Take away the Jobs and those people go home. Biden's presidency is hallmarked by the fact he has done almost nothing. That means all the failures you pile at his feet do not make sense in any way. As stated he barely had press conference, your list of his accused failures do not line up with his do nothing actions. I would challenge you to explain how his polices are different than that of trump on most things? Even trump once said we should bring everyone home from Afghanistan, that is before the neo-cons who started the war got in his ear. There is a party today who is literally Anti-American. Their leader, much of the party and a handful of now convicted voters attempted to overturn our democracy illegally. You do not get to larp as pro american and then try to spit on our constitution and democratic will by supporting these clowns. You are right about one thing, there are people calling evil, good. It is you and those like you who have changed the definitions. The idea of overturning our democracy through violence would have been unthinkable to a Conservative 20 years ago. Now you call it good, you have turned your world upside down and that is why you see the other side as evil. Dude it is the red states that have the worst numbers, it is not even close! From violent crime per capita, to child mortality, to teen pregnancy, to poorest populations, to worst education outcomes the right owns them all! The 10 poorest states in the union are all deep red. They are the welfare queens who take more than they give back. California alone is the 4th largest economy in the world. You look silly and out of touch painting it as a failure. The establishment democrats you call Marxists are actually conservative corporatists that lean left on well established social issues. They are owned by the same donors as own the GOP. They are in NO WAY Marxist! You can't call them that without radically redefining the word. Just stop! Perhaps get some help. You are so lost in a hyper partisan, zero grey bubble that your identity is blinding you. You are spitting nonsense that one day you will see as silly, when the fever finally breaks.
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  35125.  @CurtisSmale  I know what radical means. These corporate leaders are radically out of step with what their voters want. That is the definition that should matter in democracy. Nothing radical about M4A unless you are a insurance exec. What should be considered radical is an acceptance we kill and bankrupt americans to prop up a broken system focused on making a handful of parasites profit. The entire rest of the developed world has moved beyond this backward singlar fail that is our heath care system. Radical by any measure. When you call a $15 min wage radical you are forced to ignore the context of your assertion. That fact is again this wage is not radical unless you are comparing it to our broken status quo or perhaps the third world the chamber of commerce types seem to aspire to. These wages have been tried and caused no harm to the system or the local economy. They actually ensure local proprietors get more business as more is spent locally. Shifting where the money is in our economy is literally part of the goal as it has been only shiting into the hands of the richest under our current policy that see's many work full time but still not have enough to live. Nothing radical about taxing the ultra rich on holdings over a certain value. They way you talk about it implies it would inflict great hardship when it would not. Paying a couple points on the wealth you have over a certain threshold makes sense and affects only the tiny number of people blessed with that much. They can most certainly afford it. The idea that taxing them is radical is a silly assertion shared by almost no one except the rich who are to be taxed in order to contribute back to the society that afforded them such wealth. What should be considered radical is that they should pay nothing and their burden should be transferred to us in the form of more tax cuts for them that corporatists constantly push. I am not fundamentally opposed to your ideas either., They are going to call any solution radical so you better get used to the idea. The green new deal is not radical, there is established precedent for this kind of broad infrastructure and jobs program in our system. I would argue the only way to address environmental issues is in combination with addressing economic concerns. Huge problems require big solutions and the idea that facing them head on is radical is mealy mouth loser talk to get us to do nothing to preserve a broken status quo for a handful of assholes, that is the actual radical position. It is radical to risk american lives and livelihoods to preserve a status quo we know for a fact can't last. The only reason they have not legalized cannabis is that drug companies / prison industrial complex are lobbying for them not to. It has nothing to do with safety as they green light all kinds of questionable drugs and still treat canibus like is a black tar heroin for legal reasons. Again the corporately owned leaders are wildly out of step with americans in service to a donor class. That should correctly be called radical. The only places these ideas are not popular is a in the fact free fronteer of corporate right wing/establishment media that props up the status quo. Even with the media largely spitting your bankrupt spin all these policies enjoy majority support much of it bipartisan. The corporatocracy that owns both parties has no interest in what americans actually want and drive elections toward wedge issues and empty nonsense not these key polices people actually care about and would make a difference in their lives. The establishment once main stream is ever more radical. As the base of both parties wake up and reject the empty platitudes and rhetoric the sellouts drape themselves in it is ever more exposed. None of the spin you defend is popular, go back and take a look a the numbers on each one and then ask yourself who do you defend these ideas on behalf of. Let me give you a hint, it is not the american people and that should be considered radical. Policies that promote a tiny group at the top should not be called moderate, they are not.
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  35181. jefamdenkar Your spin that people who disagree with you do not believe in the constitution and personal freedom is a straw man not attached to reality in order make you feel better about yourself and your own position. The truth is regulating firearms to keep them out of the hands of criminals and the insane is not a breach of freedom and is not contrary to the constitution which frames a right to bear arms in the context of belonging to a well regulated militia not to fight the government but to protect the union. When it was written we had a need for ready citizen soldiers to defend against invasion, the spin it was to keep "tyrannical" government in check is not well founded and literally does not make sense in the context of the time. That Clinton chose a dubious stat does not undermine the common sense nature of the of pushing for a universal back ground check that it is both universally popular even with NRA members. Despite your tacit spin to the contrary the change would most certainly make it harder for those who should not have weapons or to get them easily. The "anti gun" debate as you dishonestly frame it is about common sense regulation and is not focused on banning access to for citizens use. Expecting the government to pass laws that limit access to the people we all agree should not be armed in the interest of public safety is not the assault on freedom you pretend it is. One does not have to be anti gun to want to close the gun show loophole that I as gun owner myself do not value and see as nothing but a service to criminals and the crazies to get guns when they should not be able to do so without breaking the law. The NRA have completely corrupted the political process and the buy votes of our leaders with industry money to promote sales. They consistently oppose measures that even NRA members favour on the gun lobbies behalf in the name of profits and they do not value freedom unless it is freedom for criminals and psycho's to get weapons to increase fear and therefor sales. They are just as bad as big pharma and when you oppose simple measures like a back ground check that even most NRA members want it is clear "freedom" or the rights of gun owners is not your goal. The NRA once supported universal back ground checks and did not change positions on that issue until they were totally taken over by the corporate lobby and stopped representing responsible gun ownership at all. This should not be a tough concept for you or anyone, NO LOBBIEST should not be able to buy our leaders unless you are pro crony capitalism or rich special interests driving policy. One should never defend lobbyists because if you follow where the money is coming from it is invariably attached to making the ones who pay for it more cash than they put in. Giving money to politicians to get them to vote the way you want them to was once called what it actually is, bribery. Banning the buying of our leaders should be a no brainer to everyone and the fact it is actually encouraged in our system is the reason we have the mess we do now in both parties. These lobbyists are not fighting for your rights but are working for those who pay them. The polices they push only serve a manufactured status quo that does not align with public sentient, they are crafted to increase gun sales. I have listened to empty shill no regulation arguments for years and have not heard a single compelling reason why we should not make some common sense reform. Throughout your reply you come across as confident but your spin is no more compelling than any I have seen before. Your tone has an air of superiority but I see it as built on vapour based on what you shard. You straw manned and misrepresented the "anti gun lobby" as ignorant and overreaching in an attempt to hold a high moral ground that simply does not exist. Your post is made up of a string of lobbyist in the bubble talking points coupled with blatant misrepresentation of those who hold positions you oppose, it is not good start to the discussion you claim to want to have.
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  35204.  @dre6680  I appreciate we are largely on the same page. I happen to disagree with Bill on the woke thing as i see it as fabrication contrived by an establishment seeking to halt all actual change. it is a distraction, a bru ha ha meant to be outraged about and distract right wing voters from the fact the GOP is doing absolutely NOTHING for them economically except robbing them blind. If you dig into what right wing leadership and media are "concerned" with when it comes to the "woke", you will find the outrage to be based on total nonsense or overt misrepresentation of reality. As we have established, the progressives have no real pollical power. Any of the valid woke criticism is generally attached to how corporate america attempts to panders to it because they wish to appeal to a percivied market. The progressives do not drive that bus. On the whole trans debacle, it is born of a near total lie. There are no children getting sex change surgery, they do not teach kids sexuality. What they were teaching kids is the recognition that some people are different, and that is ok. The grooming spin is an overt lie about teaching the children get along with fellow classmates that are not the same as them, no one was ever selling sexuality. The woke outrage is nonsense, it is primarily driven by marketing firms trying to sell products and overt partisan lies about educators to roll back treating gay people or trans people as human. I would argue the right has ALWAYS been about cancel culture. They even do it internally all the time, it is why they have been so cohesive a block. They wanted to ban all kinds of things they dislike and to this day are banning books from libraries over their feelings. Only the establishment can cancel you, so it has ever been. The media once canceled people for coming out as gay not too long ago. Now they are canceling Nazi's, it is not because they have radically changed their view point to become "woke". They never had a moral compass, they were always chasing what they thought was their market, it is why it is done so poorly.
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  35268.  @Jfre2  Ya they are, you may agree with them but it does not make them any less bigoted. The definition of the word has nothing to do with left or right in English! I am no where near far left even as you clearly show your tendency towards fringe right. Your stated ideology is intolerant and bigoted by definition, you hide it behind a demand the world does not change around you. You should own where you stand if you believe in what you say. Don't hide from it and pretend some imaginary enemy is mispresenting you. The people who are not enraged by trans people or do not care if someone is gay are not far left, they are now pretty normal. No one is asking you to call yourself woman, what the hell do you care if people that don't effect you, call themselves a woman? or a turnup? or whatever they want to? It literally costs you nothing. That it is strange to you and does not make sense does not mean it is "far left". You would love thought control if the media did not see the economic value of being inclusive as a public face. You would be perfectly happy back in the day when they did not put black people on TV unless they were drug dealers or they canceled actors who came out as gay. They have always curated a version of what was acceptable to appeal to sponsors. That they are marginalizing groups you identify with now is the difference. The market has changed, they have simply followed it like hungry grazing animals. Corporate media, including this venue chases market's and always has. They have no ideology outside seeking more profit. Their programing follows the market they are focused on, greed and profit is the only motivation behind anything they do. No one is dictating how you or beard boy should think, you are free to be outraged over nonsense fed to you by your chosen outrage machine. But as a business they have an innate right to regulate what is on their platform. They have to in order meet a standard demanded by advertisers. You are free to do what you want at home or to a lessor extent in public, when in someones home you can expect to follow the house rules or go home. If you can't do that, they are free to kick you out. In this case they did not kick Matt out. They simply demonetized there by de-incentivizing his speech do to his contractual breech. If you can't follow the rules of the house you can expect consequences, Matt ran into them. Contracts have value in the US. This is not about ideology, left or right. It is about the fact we have always given the corporations power to do this very thing. You are just outraged because it effects you now.
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  35360.  @tmanmadison5204  I think you are missing there is a large constituency who rarely votes and is directly attracted to the fact Bernie has credibility no other politician running has. Trump barely beat hillary and actually lost the popular vote to her and still won because of key states she did poorly in that she just expected to win. She did not even campaign in the rust belt which lost her the election. Bernie has none of those weakness's and does very well in the states hillary lost handing control to Trump. He is fundamentally more popular than Hillary and is not spitting on half his base while attracting huge swaths of new voters who do not bother to turn up for any establishment shill. The fact is this election will be about turn out and I argue Bernie will draw out voters that normally stay home as he is a different kind of politician who has credibility earned over decades of consistency. His message that is hated by the main stream media is loved on main street and consistently polls very high among all voters. The polls that reflect likely voters greatly underestimate his support because they ignore a large percentage of it. Trump and his ideas are not popular. He has a very dedicated base but has large unfavorably numbers Bernie does not share. Bernie has all trumps strengths and none of his weakness's. He is an outsider who is actually populist and hated by the establishment party. He in effect is the anti trump and Trump has nothing to attack him on but tired clear nonsense that only flies if you are in particular very small bubble. I do not see this fight as close as you do and Bernie's chief challenge will be winning the primary and getting past the democratic super delegates. If he does he will have no issue beating Trump, mark my words.
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  35377. Ian Alan Your technique is both empty and useless and being an anti SJW makes you no better as you are the polar opposite as you fight for anti justice. Your attempt was was weak and transparent not to mention no more valid than anyone who argues based on how something makes them feel. You are not seeking fairness as you empower business to exclude and marginalize Americans based on arbitrary standards you are only empowering bigotry and pointless division at the cost of the people persecuted for no reason. I agree that people right to have unpopular opinion has to be protected. That does not extend into a business licenses as there is no public value in empowering their ability to marginalize consumers for random reasons. The people in question have the right to closely held beliefs but they have no right to extend those into business and limit the options of those around them. If they feel they can not sell to a gay person or a black person then that is on them and any limits should be on them not the people they arbitrarily dislike. I do not care if they change or ever feel good about it. People can identify however they want to as as long as they step on no one else they can call themselves chicken people for all I care. Mennonites do not take jobs driving a bus because they have an objection to technology I do not see you advocating the banning of cars to make them happy. If bigots can object providing universal service then that is their problem and they can pay for that issue themselves I see no reason society has to take the hit and empower them. This is not new, we made this call 60 years ago to end segregation in the south. Going back to pre civil rights policy is nothing more than a giant step backward to no value you or anyone in favor of rolling back time has shared. There is as much merit in the concept of protecting the right to free commerce for all Americans as empowering bigots to marginalize some them . This has nothing to do with your feelings or anyone else's and is attached to a demand that all business's here serve all Americans. The only slippery slope is on your side of the debate and the danger lives not in some stoneage assholes refusing to bake a cake for gay people but when hospitals start closing their doors because of the color of your skin or who you love. That is not and never will be acceptable.
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  35482.  @adlucem9845  No conspiracy, they openly are owned and corrupt. They work for the donors alone. The corporations or "business" are super served by cons because they pay them to do so. The establishment democrats and their consultants saw all that sweet donor cash and have been chasing the same money off a right wing cliff for a long long time. They are the washington generals to the GOP's harlem globetrotters of corruption. The "left" has zero power in our system. The left you speak of is corporate in nature and loathes left wing economic policy but pushes the SJW stuff you babble about because it is popular and costs them nothing. Media is a reflection of society's standards and they are not left or right, they are corporate. They chase a market they seek. 20 years ago you got canceled for coming out as gay, now you get the same treatment for saying bigoted things. The media has been canceling people forever and consistently do it according for cash never ideology. Pretending it is the left that is owned by the corporate elites is stupid. They spit on any left wing idea that would cost them a dime. They are right wing economically and a quick look at how they treat Bernie or any left wing economic ideas should banish your silly spin. The left has never had power. Now the fringe social right is getting the same treatment the entire left always has. The media does not serve the left or right, they serve a profit motive alone. That the majority of people are no longer anti gay is why the media no longer shits on them. That the majority of people are no longer openly bigoted is why bigots get shat on now. The actual left opposes the corporate tyranny you generally support. You are only crying now because it is finally stepping on you. This is while you ignore the fact that they still spit your fact free economic spin. The GOP is promoting fascism, actual fascism where the state crushes journalists they do not like, where free speech is only for those they support. There is no kind of fascist I will ever back. News flash: fascists are deeply authoritarian and hard right wing.
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  35771.  @stephj9378  It appears you can not read as I gave you multiple solutions in my last post not the least of which is using modern security and not counting on a static wall like they did in midi-eivil times. The wall is not effective at stopping any of the stuff you are concerned about and it does not address the problems you say you care about effectively. Pretending this is about child trafficking is transparently lame and is empty virtue signaling to cover your pants shitting fear. The solutions are effective border patrol using satellites and drones equipped with thermal sensors and an array of fast reaction teams to get out to inaccessible areas when people are spotted. Another is enforcing our law against employers that hire undocumented workers luring millions to come and live here. Idiots never bother to think outside the box they live in and that is you follower, quit pretending you are anything but sniveling yes man who is easily frightened, You are no kind of alpha. I have answers you do not. Pretending you are being opposed by organized groups who are doing child trafficking marks you as a sub moron who does not care what he says is nonsense. It knocks you out of contention of being an adult in any conversation on this subject. Anyone that buys that garbage is TFG and it is a waste of time talking to you as you have no fucking clue what you babble about any large group in power that support pedo's. When you have to make up what those you oppose stand for you have no arguments. Point of note there is a leader in power who has been accursed of actually being a pedo and sexual assaulter, you voted for him. Hypocrite.
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  36017. AndyB Total fucking nonsense, I am most certainty progressive and some absolutist clown who has an attitude more akin to a gop voter than person who understands the concept of nuance is not going to define me. I know exactly what she was and by your standard we should not vote and instead let the party who does best on low voter turn outs win. That would be the republicans ... nice losing strategy you have there. You sure show them. The democrats are failures because they play the same wedge issues the GOP does. They are establishment shills and the economic issues they press are about their donors not the voters. Both parties play good cop/bad cop to appeal to different sides of wedge issues like abortion while agreeing on wars and poor trading/economic policy supporting corporations over people. I have no illusions what the establishment democrats are and that is why I fight them remembering I also fight the gop too and refuse to cut off my nose to spite my face before they can be replaced. Hillary no matter how bad she is was still far better than Trump turned out to be. When choosing poison that is going to put in my food no matter what I will take the one that causes the least pain and coughing up of blood. Now I am part of the fight to replace the Hillary's of the this world with candidates that work for us but in the last election staying home in my district was a vote for Trump. You are a poorly focused if you say you are both progressive and ok with that. I reject your stupid assertions about me as worse than wrong, it is nothing counter productive voter shaming that will drive suppression of the vote even for people like Coretez and Bernie because they are not running third party. You are acting like the loser establishment you pretend to oppose by using the same weak failed shaming tactics they do, own that.
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  36032. Ryan Nurmi People do not call him a baby killer, to murder a baby makes one like a mad dog that needs to be put down. The term baby killer defines what is arguably the ugliest most disgusting type of murderer and engenders a common strong desire to see justice carried out on them regardless of the circumstances. While calling someone a murderer is heavy it is not nearly as bad as saying you murder babies. You know this though, stop with the dishonest denial and false equivalency to a nonsense narrative meant to make right wingers feel better about the sacks of shit they support. Outside that fact you miss the point about context again, OJ's wife (a human in its 96th trimester) was murdered and OJ was charged with doing it. Calling him a murder is not like saying he is a child killer or rapist. Those that murder or harm children are pariahs even in prison where the hardest core criminals call them deviants an make life hard or short for them. Calling him a murderer is not a call for violence against him, it is a simple call for justice for an act that is clearly a crime in every sense of the word. Calling an abortion doctor a baby killer is at best dishonest and from a legal and biological stand point the talking point is not remotely valid. It is a an attack meant to engender an emotional response to push a political stance and is not honest or valid in any way. It is a slander meant to make people think of him as a baby killer, one the worst sickest brands of murder we have and he was actaully murdered directly because of the label.
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  36033. Ryam Mirmi This has nothing to do with your feelings, reporting on charges of the literal murder of our citizens without anyone being held responsible is not like calling a doctor a baby killer because you want to impose your morality on someone else and control their lives. One side openly says there needs to be non violent change to a systemic problem of our public servants murdering citizens and the other calls a doctor the worst kind of murder in service to partisan authoritarian bullshit. You do not get to ignore root level differences in your comparison and pretend they are the same thing. It is the very definition of false equivalency and that they have some similarities does not change they are fundamentally different in message and context. BLM is a group that fights against the that disproportionately high number of killings of black citizens, supporting what they are protesting for is not supporting the death of cops but arguing to save lives of living breathing people by a group who also cares about when they are alive and not just in the womb with other policy. This is unlike the anti choice movement who only cares about life before it is born then after throw them to the wolves without health care or support after. I would argue BLM's message should be "cops kill far too many of citizens and their training needs to be updated" with no racial component. Their unilateral focus on black people costs them support, that does not change the fact their protest if valid and should have the support of everyone who is not cool with cops and the government acting as no trial executioners. TYT's message is innately anti violent and you will never find anywhere they even imply the cops should be harmed forget about specific people. They do not have to misrepresent the events or our legal policy to effectively protest when a cop shoots a kid with no fallout while it is the go to move of the anti choice crowd. Get better less empty spin, you are just repeating yourself without addressing my points.
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  36034. Ya, that does not incite violence against all cops like it incites violence against your person when I publicly shame you as a baby killer. By your argument boils down to a claim that every time they talk about terrorism the news is guilty of inciting violence against whatever group did it? If they talked about IRA bombers is the news show responsible for inciting violence against the Irish? If they report it as an attack that murdered 20 people is it the same as calling the entire group baby killers? If they call them baby killers what do you imagine the motivation of using such rhetoric is? I would never advocate leaving out the identity of the terrorist, neither does TYT. I would point out that they are all hard core fundamentalists who never value anyone's rights but their own. Fundamentalists consistently are against the freedom of others even when they murder no one. I would call on their associated fundamentalists of all stripes to decry them and that is what the Muslim community in the US does. That bigots ignorantly attack people who a brown because they think they are Muslim because of news reports on them is on the the idiots who attack not the news that inspired them by reporting facts. The spin that reporting on murders is the same as calling someone a baby killer when they committed no crime is really weak. The key difference in the baby killer case is the "news program" was purposely misinforming their viewers and trying to incite hatred against an individual. There is one thing everyone wants to do a baby killer and it has nothing to do with a fair trial and reform. That is not that same as what happens when a show reports on cop murders or terrorist bombings, your spin lacks all nuance and context. After going back and forth I acknowledge it is possible you honestly do not have the capacity to understand the difference.
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  36035. Ryan Nurmi Picking specific stories is what every single media enterprise does and that is not the same as misrepresenting an individual as the worst kind of murderer for an overtly partisan reason when they have done nothing illegal. They do not only report one thing but even if they did as long as they were not propagating violence against an individual or group by calling them a baby killer or something equivalent then they are not doing the same thing by definition. We agree if you call OJ a murder, that is not inciting violence against him. If you call a specific man tiller the baby killer you are inciting violence against him. You do not have to overtly say kill him to incite violence against an individual and demonizing him as the worst kind of killer when he has committed no crime makes you at least tacitly responsible when someone who listened to your show kills him. I know that crazy killed him but all I did was call him a baby killer over and over .. I do not agree with your spin. His opinion is in fact a tacit call to violence because what he is accusing him of is arguably one the most heinous of unforgivable crimes, he does that for emotional effect but in doing so incites the crazies in his audience to violence against a specific target he points at. We both know there is little discussion what humans should do with baby killers. The idea it is the left who censors ideas is a joke. The right OWNS censorship and those on the left who advocate for it are called regressive because they act like cons and not liberals. The right and the establishment control in general has always tried to censor speech and we literally had to force our freedom from their restrictive laws, to this day from the president down they do not value it. I never advocated for Bill to be censored but he should be called out for what he is responsible for and that is what I do. No where did I say we should be banning anyone's speech and that is conservative go to move I do not support. You are overtly projecting as you paint the left with this failure when the ONLY time you hear the right complain about it is when it directly effects them when in fact they own the tactic of attempting to silence critics.
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  36036. Ryan Nurmi His opinion is hate driving slander to serve a political end directly contributing to the cost of a mans life. Like it o not, defend it or not, it is what it is. He is not responsible for what his audience does with his opinion but saying what he did is the same as what TYT does when they talk about an issue and demand peaceful change is myopic. These two are nothing but superficially similar because as I have shared over and over the context and what they advocate for are not remotely the same. Theoretically if bill went to your neighborhood and posted 1000's of signs with your picture labeling you serial baby killer who could not be targeted by the law, would that be him just sharing his opinion? If I was to point at anyone in a given closed community as a baby killer, say in a village with no policemen. What would I be pushing the community to do? Ignoring the tacit assertion this claim comes with a "we should do something about this" is to miss my point. It makes me ask why paint him as a baby killer in the first place if you do not want action. If nothing else Bills spin is a tacit claim to want to see the "baby killer" removed from society, if not why share it this way? TYT shares their views about the shootings of black citizens (which happen with an alarming disproportionality) with a goal of reducing police violence against our citizens through better public policy, advocacy for better police training and raising awareness of the issue. What was Bills goal?
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  36340.  @joeybrackets123  This posting in schools is the state promoting one set of rules, one brand of faith over others when it is literally forbidden to do so. That is why the supreme court precedent you ignore exists. You are arguing the way you want it to be, I am telling you the way our courts have adjudicated our first amendment. They do allow services in side the building, that is because it is public space people are allowed to use it as they choose. People then get to elect to go or not and their freedom of religion is so preserved. Citizens using a government building to meet for religious reason does not contradict the first. Stopping it would, because it removes personal religious agency or their right to assemble and worship as they choose. Holding a service is not like putting up the 10 commandments, you attend the service at your option and no one is forcing it. Any faith could do the same thing. Using government funds and property to promote and display religious iconography or dogma is not elective and pushes religion onto people. In this case kids, whose parents may or may not subscribe to your faith. The freedom to raise their children religiously as they choose is an innate American right. They should not be forced to pay tax money to promote your religion or have it taught to their children. You spit on their 1st amendment rights as you do. Allowing people to meet in public places and a posting a specific faiths religious document in every class room are not the same thing. I am shocked can't see that.
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  36413. The economy by this standard has been booming since Obama took over after Bush put the economy in the ditch. Less jobs have been created in this year than the last 7 and we have outsourced more jobs too. How do you square that circle with your narrative while ignoring things were great under Obama (in this respect) too? It would have been great if Obama was the kind of guy to raise taxes on corporations which are massively profitable but paying none. But that is not the case because he turned out to be a neo liberal shill who likes tax cuts and favoring the big banks as much as you do. The same problems with growing wealth inequality we see now are the product of both parties being owned by the same people as they set policy that fucks us over to make the richest even richer. The stock market is booming but there are other indicators that do not paint such a rosy picture. The value of the jobs being created are ever less. Whole segments of the population are under employed and have no prospects for better jobs. 40% of the country is a 400 dollar emergency from being insolvent and most of the county is not doing better under the narcissist policy of trump. Under trumps giveaways to the rich that number will only grow as our deficit sky rockets necessitating more cuts, driving more poverty. If poop on the sidewalks is the big issue you care about then you are very poorly focused. It is you who appears to be delusional as you spit fact free right wing talking points like they are not discredited garbage they are. Stop loling and ha haing to start every post, it makes you look crazy.
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  36414. Red Shied He took over when we were losing 600k a month .. Factories closed before he even took office and there fucking great recession. Blaming him for that shit pile is stupid. He created more jobs in every one of his last 7 years in office than trump did in his first. Trump created less jobs .. get it less. That is nothing to brag about and the fact we have outsourced more is bad news too. I have no problem with people making money, I do have a problem with them buying leaders to pass tax cuts they do not need to defund our government to give them more money to throw on a pile or invest overseas. The economy for the wealthy has been put on steroids with these tax cuts which will crush the middle class further and enrich the very richest in our country. Pretending this administration gives a flying fuck about the working people and not just those with the best funded lobbyists shows you are not paying attention or are overtly dishonest. The middle class shrinking is continuing under Donald and has been sped up by his disastrous tax cuts that do nothing but hand cash to people who already swim in it. That you imagine trump is ANY BETTER on any issue you just pointed out then you are delusional. I don't like Obama, I am not his fan and knew every stat you shared. But when you pretend the GOP who is a more virulent version of the same cancer is any better you look clueless. Obama failed because he ignored his base and acted like a republican. He lost seats every election after coming to power because he proved to be a neo liberal shill and was in the pocket of the banks and the war machine just like the GOP is. Stop pretending to care about the middle class as you drop to your knees before the silver spoon trust fund baby Donald, king of selling out.
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  36704.  @c.j.giordano2129  It was a simple question that Peterson attempted to confuse by pretending the question itself was unsound or he did not understand it. He was purposely confusing the issue by asking what basic and understood concepts attached to the question even mean. He is either a moron because he does not understand normal contextual speech on a question he has fielded many times or a he is an asshole for trying to confuse the issue and dodge it. I really appreciate your reply but none of the information outlined in your essay was attached to the simple question asked of Jorden. It makes your post largely irrelevant to my point. Any definitive theistic assertion about god or the nature of another's faith is the same kind of bullshit. When people say they do not believe in god that is often exactly what they mean. I do not need an invisible guy out there for the world to make sense to me. When it comes to anyone making definitive claims about the nature of an unknowable invisible god those assertions always easily dismissed. The question if there is a god or not is largely an irrelevant one except to the faithful and those they would repress as a matter of faith. No one gets to hang out with the God guy anyway. He is not exactly deeply involved in day to day life outside some peoples feelings. Asserting that everyone believes in God is just an empty silly statement that is easy to sell to a specific kind of mind. The society I am in frames my world view, not a god. The legacy of various religions set the standards of the society I belong to, not a god. His claim that atheist's do not understand their position is an empty slur of the kind I expect from theists. It is part of the reason I laugh at this man's silly spin that he attempts to generalize nonsense about atheist's that at best theoretically applies only in specific cases. His generalization about atheists is ignorant or dishonest and sells a marketable narrative theist's gobble up. Jordon does a good job of selling feelings based theism as logical and attached to "philosophy" and logic based atheism as a faith. Jorden is dodges the question because he is courting theist's but does not want to be called one because it undermines his brand as a thinker. There is a good market for people who sound smart but agree with fact free cultists. Jordon has that wrapped up.
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  36705.  @c.j.giordano2129  Unless you are an alien the concepts associated with the question have a common colloquial meanings. I completely understand the question myself and so should anyone that is reasonably able to communicate in English. If you want to be a goof there is room to pretend it is a esoteric or complex question. The premises you insist are necessary do exist and are well understood by anyone that discusses these issues. Your assertion that I act like there is a god is entirely fact free. I do not need one to understand the world around me. I get my morality from social standards passed down built maxims and ideas that predated my society. The idea they came from god is nonsense. Everyone had them and god most certainly did not make 1000 flavors of morality key to each cultures history and needs. There is nothing objective about morality, it is entirely societal and not divine in anyway. Your assertion that psychologists agree all morality comes from faith is nonsense. Morality is the underpinning of the unwritten social contract required to have a society or even a tiny group. Without it we could not exist as a community or even a family. The idea one we get our morality from GOD is betrayed by the fact no one ever see's the guy and morality changes from decade to decade from region to region. You very loosely use the word faith over and over. I do not rely on faith, I make extrapolations of what will happen based on my experience. I have built up my belief system adapted from one handed to me as a child. I have evolved it to reflect my views and It is not remotely based on faith in any supernatural entity. It is based on the kind of person I choose to be. The face I choose to present to the world. Your god or a god has literally nothing to do with it. I do not value faith in anything except the people who have earned it from me. I trust my ability to evaluate a given situation and honestly apply my standards outside the influence of deity. Suffering is a problem to avoided if possible, not a learning situation that engenders enlightenment. There is no innate value in suffering other than learning to avoid it by making decisions that further that goal. I see the idea of eternal bliss as a pipe dream as is eternal punishment. I can not see how the idea is meaningful or achievable. If it is the greatest virtue it is a virtue no living human can ever achieve. This limits limiting it's practical value. The ideas of heaven and hell are nothing more than stories sold to children and people who need simple definitive answers to unknowable questions. The people who have entered their own personal heaven or hell have nothing on the way the real things are sold. Outside an opium binge heaven is pretty rare on earth. Hell even more so, even if found it could only inflect pain for a fraction of a second before one burned up in a lake of fire. There is no standard answer to what heaven is, every single faith, every culture spins it differently. I see no reason to imagine any of them have the real story and even if one does how could one know which to choose? As a fyi if you chose your local faith then you did not so much choose it but defaulted in. Any attempt to pat yourself on the back for making that choice ignores you just picked the local flavor and would have worshiped a goat if they did that were you were born.
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  36708.  @c.j.giordano2129  The base ideas often ascribed to mortality to most societies ancient or modern do not require a devine law giver to explain them. Every deity that has laws attached to it gets credit for them from their followers. But thier faith based claims make no sense outside thier particular religous context. Because you declare something universal and attached to your unverifiable deity does not make it so. This is as true for you as any other devout member of another religon. Morality is an ever evolving social contract that societies adopt to function. It changes from place to place and time to time becuase it is directly attached to the culture of the moment adapted from the culture of the past. It has nothing more to do with God other than what people randomly and arbitrarly assign him. He always gets all the credit with no actual contact. The fact is all societies encountered have some form of morality adapted to thier needs and experience. Many of them with no contact with your idea of God or a law giver. This undermines your root assertion. How do you explain morality of these other groups that have no concept of your God? I can, you can not. We split the atom and base level modify DNA. Why is it so hard for you to imagine we made morality and evolve it over time? Why do you see it as impossible that we over time crated and then adapted morality to our needs. Why is it inconceivable to you we came to the common conclusion that random murder is wrong without devine aid? We have always been this clever. I see no reason to imagine the same species that went to the moon and now flies through the sky every day in machines unimaginable 100 years ago could not first figure out how to live in groups without a gods help.
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  36711.  @c.j.giordano2129  Sociopaths are an issue only in context of thier society and the values of said society. Depends on what they do, who they do it to and the era they are in if it considered immoral. 4 centuries ago using natives for target practice was just fine. 2 centuries ago it was OK to kill a disobedient slave. One century ago it was perfectly fine to beat your wife. Things have changed a great deal and sociopath in each era would find a place to fit in and be considered entiely moral at the time. You do not possess an objective lens, you only have your own which I assure you is subjective. Religion makes claims elements of their standard morality are objective as dogma. But they can be no more aasuedly correct than someone of a different faith making the same claim on a contesting issue. The point is even if you frame it using religous edicts those items.s are pulled from a list filtered by a human mind making human choices. That is definition of subjective. Don't worry, just because your morality is not objective it does not mean it is not real. The standard is just transitory and subject to change going forward. Empathy has been selected in our species as it brings advantages. Empathy is a common trait like any other and it is built with understanding and perspective. Sociopaths are malformed socially and are missing the ability to identify with others most people take for granted. Most are high functioning and find a way to blend in with challenges for those around them. They are not necessarily immoral unless they commit an act considered moral at the time. The world would be just fine without the standard claimed by faith based self righteousness. If I can find a moral center based on values I cherish that better my community you can make one too. It is worth doing even if I have no sky daddy watching me. I am an adult who can make good choices free of threats, you can do the same. I have no need and would take no comfort in celestial dictator that loves me but would burn me forever for stepping out of line. We have no need.of God or eternal proclamations to be moral If you want to lay the idea of morality at the feet of your God so be it. Know in every era in every society it was never a God but a person making moral choices. Moral in one era totally immoral in another.
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  36869.  @josejaquez4100  If you say so. I just do not see his sentence as a manifestation of the problems of over sentencing we both agree are endemic and deeply problematic in our system. The charge he was convicted and sentenced on is a very serious one. I would argue he was guilty of that crime. The charge has a maximum sentence of 20 years, that fact he got the minimum highlights this is not an example of over prosecution. I actually see this as another example of the fact our justice system is consistently unequally applied. I would expect if he was not part of a privileged group we could have expected the sentence to be much higher, not lower. I object to the spin he was over punished. When you get the minimum sentence for a crime that can put you in jail for 20 years, it is hard to say that is unfair. Complaining about the sentence being too harsh in this case is at best tacit unintended appologism for the convicted criminals actions. I see no value in that for anyone. I am not ignoring the ones that caused this, the fact is the broken justice system is very very slow to do anything to that entire group. That this shaman clown got slightly more than a slap on the wrist is what is surprising. I still think think the leaders, the real criminals that caused this event should be brought to justice. You apparently do not know this, I would see Donald and his fellow insurrectionist traitors to democracy charged too. I would be fine if they spent even more time in prison than this shaman moron who is a pure manifestation of what they wanted. It does not have to be an either or.
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  36958. mashroob You are incorrect, I call it what it is. To deny services to someone based on the fact they are gay or not is a text book definition of bigotry. However the bigot tries to justify their actions and the give reasons for it does not change what they represent. Having a reason to be a bigot does not make what they are go away. It is not bigoted to support inclusive laws and the choice of the religious to sell the cake or not is their own and should not step on anyone else. If they feel that they can not sell a cake to a gay person then like a Mennonite should not apply to drive a bus they should not take that job due to the limitations of their chosen faith. Worse this really goes beyond gay people to black people and any other minority, it jumps from bakers and cakes you can get anywhere to hospitals. As a gay man are you comfortable with private hospitals deciding they can not take your emergency case because they do not serve gay people? Are you cool with whites only restaurants and towns or standardized bigotry against others like you in small communities where they may be no other choices to protect the right of religious bigots to marginalize you because of who you love? Our law is simple, all Americans have access to goods and services. We do not limit your right to free commerce based on the color or your skin, who you worship, or you who love. This is because bigots once fought to deny services to a whole segment of the population based on empty bigotry and we correctly stripped that power from them to our common good. The only snowflakes in this story are the people who think laws of inclusiveness and equal access should not apply to them because they have decided to wave a bigot flag and blame it on their god. You need to stop pretending these rules are new or onerous. The gay cake thing is a new "problem" because before that the very kind of people who want to not make cakes fought to deny you any marriage rights at all. Equal access to goods and services though is not a new idea at all and our system has existed for half a century just fine with it in place. There is not one single reason to support anyone to denying services based on bigoted standard and millions of lives including potentially yours against it.
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  37112.  @spencerborkowski2176  You don't understand what it means to say economics is the driving force? It is not complex, they can't afford it. That everyone should have "trad relationship" is a pipe dream sold by the entitled who are already rich. It is not the 1970's were you could afford to be a single income family and still have a reasonable standard of living. With the necessity of both getting education and then jobs, it puts off marriage. Only in places where woman are not educated members of the workforce do they get married early, they have no choice. I don't care if anyone thinks I am "one of the good ones" as it won't change my life either way. I am just saying the way I see it and if that makes you feel bad that is all on you. I can't be responsible for how my spin makes you feel about your choices. The research you cite is cherry picked by freaks that want it to be the 1890's again. The fact is couples who marry young break up at a higher rates than those who marry older. Youth and ignorance is not a good recipe for a marriage where either partner can leave at any time. Woman who have no idea what they are getting into when they marry are the ones who break up 7 years later when they work out you are not remotely compatible sexually. The idea more ignorance creates a better lasting bond is empty and does not make sense on the face of it The body count thing has NO MERIT! It is a silly take that is meant to sooth the feels of guys who do not have the confidence or d skills to compete with anyone, a real self own. Anyone that treats sex like a finite resource is poking their own eye over stunted feelings. I feel bad for any woman caught in a relationship with such a small and fragile mind You need to stop talking on behalf of men, you don't represent them and I damn sure would not have voted for you. Simple, small, controlling men want young ignorant woman, this is not the 3rd world or 1920 and I see no value in the spin if what you seek is a long term partner in the modern world A clever, experienced man that has his shit together wants someone that already knows who she is and ideally loves sex as much as he does. Her body count should be part of her value, experience is hard to paint as a failure unless you value ignorance.
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  37214.  @daftwod  Ya I do think they are awful. They are awful in the exact same way the Taliban is. The "hillbilly's" are part of the same problem and secularism is what breaks down the authoritarian nonsense they buy into. The fear of losing against the Muslims is a fundamentalist failing because they have only lost ground in the last 50 years and expect failure. In every place secularism exists the country gets less and less fundamentalist religious over time. It is freedom from religion that allows people form new more moderate forms. This does not happen in places where the fundamentalists control the gears of power with out the religious constitutional protections. The most radically devout want to control everyone and do not believe in freedom at all. This includes your allies, the fundi christens would gladly crush anyone not like them. They are as bad as the Muslims and will come for everyone else if they ever get the chance. We should not surrender to their brand of nonsense because we were scared of another group of fact free losers. An interesting fact for you, Muslims in the US support gay marriage at higher rates than evangelicals do. Given a choice most choose a moderate version of their faith just like christens do. Secularism is our shield against radical Islam and Christianity not other fundamentalists who hate freedom too, The idea these asshole Gomer's are anything but a different brand of the cancer is silly and dismissable on its face. The only thing that breaks them out from the Muslim fundie is they live in country where they can not legally force their nonsense on anyone.
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  37283.  @adrianlouw2499  Exactly, I know they are capitalist countries with socialistic ideas on health care, education and other key polices being promoted. They better mitigate the worst aspects of capitalism by socializing key elements of their system while still retaining it's benefits. They do not have a min wage because of large buy in by labor unions that act as a balance against corporate action against wages. They do not effectively need a min wage and if you are proposing we do the same thing I am fine with greater democratization of the work force but I get the feeling you hate organized labor as communist too. Small populations are actually a hindrance to effective high quality health care as a smaller pool greatly increases insurance cost per person. Like all insurance systems the more people in the pool the better the cost mitigated. No one who understands how insurance or economy of scale works ever makes the too big argument. The small population syndrome is what our system suffers from now as we are broken into many small pools to their larger communal public one they use. Our system with it's many small pools on top of a pointless insurance profit margin, their massive overhead and many times redundant bureaucracy contributes the fact we pay double what the rest of the rest of the first world does. For this privilege while we allow forty five thousand Americans die do to lack of care a year while hundreds of thousands are bankrupted. No one else has this issue and. No one outside the insurance lobby or those sold on their propaganda honestly promotes our failed system as good or a model for anyone else. The "socialism" being proposed here is a a graft on top of capitalism just as they have. The spin that there are any serious proposals to take us away from being primarily capitalistic is fear mongering nonsense not attached to reality. Look at what the left in america is actually proposing before telling me it is not progressive. Give me one anti progressive policy in their platform. There is nothing of the authoritarian nonsense you pretend is in it. All we are proposing is we do what the first world already does and you misrepresent that as hard core Stalinist. Your spin is defense of unfettered crony capitalism without any of the socialized functions that raise the quality of life in Scandinavian region rings empty. Your straw man attacking what progressives even fight for is blatant.
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  37284.  @adrianlouw2499  Every single developed nation on the planet has some form of single payer system. The idea we can not because we are too fat or too addicted or too diverse or any other number of empty excuses does not hold any water. These are all empty reasons pushed over with a moment of thought. Please explain how having an ultra expensive third party parasitic for profit insurance helps us deal with any of the issues you are inclined to list as reason they are allowed to rip us all off? For the last time no one is advocating for socialism as you fear monger it. Every single policy presented is in the frame work of our capitalist one. Every policy is modeled on other capitalist countries and none of them are socialist any more than the police/fire departments or the army which are examples of socialized services here. Before we had government sponsored fire departments you would me making the argument implementing that policy would be a slippery slope to communism. My side is barely represented and you never heard a peep from us before 2016. Bernie is villainized and lied about constantly by both Democrats and Republicans because they are both owned by the same masters. Neither of the corporate owned leaderships have any interest in framing the debate in a honest way. The main stream media is complicit as they too promote the status quo and donor perspective too. You do not hear it framed this way because I barely have a voice, but that is changing. History shows that when the rich are taxed at reasonable rates the country does better. Our times of largest growth of the middle class were when taxes on the rich were highest. Rich people with low taxes do not create jobs or prosperity spending does. High taxes actually incentivize investment in the business, profit is put back into the company to avoid paying them. Low taxes come out and go into buddies pocket who does not have to spend locally at all. Jobs are only created by demand and no matter how big a tax cut some fat cat gets unless many people are buying his product there is no reason to invest more. History as far as I can see does not agree with your low taxes for the rich assessment, I would be interested in the references you draw from. The rich are the rich because of the working class, they make their wealth because they built their business here. They are beholden to the system around them and should expect to pay more when they make more as they take larger benefits from our communal investment in schools, roads and our access to our market. We should tax them and if they leave others will step in to take the income they will leave behind. I call you a crony capitalist because that is the system you support. It is their dishonest and misleading talking points you share. I do not think anyone is intrinsically better than us but their systems are empirically better than ours. I am going no where because I am a proud american. I do not run from a fight and never will nor will I back down from standing up for what I see as right. What could be more american than that? I want us to lead and not just follow and lose ground like we have for decades. You may think it is patriotic bowing to the status quo but all my hero's all stood up and made our union more perfect by changing it for the better.
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  37289. Judd Pickell My lifestyle is fine and has gotten better but that is not the objective experience of the american worker whose income has declined and taxes have gone up while the donor class has gotten exponentially richer. By every objective standard most Americans are making less and paying more. Most american workers are worse off than we were 30 years ago as they work more and are paid less for it, it is you who is ignorant if you pretend otherwise. Our "modern" living standards are fast falling behind the rest of the developed world because of policies the people like you advocate for and we have created record levels of income inequality while maintaining flat wages while all the growth goes to a handful at the top who have never been richer. In spite of this face those with your spin argue it is good they still get the lions share of the tax cuts that have been shown to only benefit them over the long term. Giving more money to the super rich at the expense of working people can not do anything but exacerbate the problem. There is no shortage of data on this subject if you care to look. It is clear you never have. I did not make you wait too long I hope: https://academic.oup.com/qje/article-abstract/118/1/1/1917000 http://www.frbsf.org/our-district/files/061106.pdf https://academic.oup.com/qje/article/131/2/519/2607097 A less scholarly source: https://www.salon.com/2013/12/10/look_at_the_stats_america_resembles_a_poor_country_partner/ The idea that the vast majority of Americans feel they are doing well is betrayed by the general consensus who feel squeezed and less well off than they self reported a couple decades long ago. This is because wages are flat and all the growth and profit generated through efficiency is going to the very people who paid for and got this tax cut which is going to rob working people even more to give those with the most more money they are going to throw on a pile, spend on automation to cut jobs or invest overseas. Merry Christmas.
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  37326. @Shawn Brink I do not blame the police for everything. But there is a group who blames them for nothing even as they murder unarmed citizens out of pants shitting fear. That is indefensible. The number of people who say we deserved 911 can be counted on a hand. One guy here said it and then walked it back appropriately. This fact undermines your dishonest spin. That being said looking for context to see why those monsters attacked us makes sense. Taking responsibility for our shitty corporate driven foreign policy that originally trained the same assholes who attacked us makes sense to me. Ignoring history and buying liars spin to demonize and straw man those on the 'other side' marks you as a useful idiot that perpetuates the problem. The Christian conservative generosity talking point is stupid. They give to their mega church's but do that not out goodness but duty. Giving to televangelists in search of 'prosperity' should be considered like buying a self serving lottery ticket and not charity. Your whining about white people is fucking pathetic and tone deaf. Our system has been bigoted for decades and white people in general still enjoy advantages minorities do not. We value equity while assholes like you never have and never will. We are the only ones standing against judicial injustice period while you overtly support it for anyone who is poor regardless of of race and double down if the one charged is a minority. Your tough on crime bullshit fills prisons with poor people of all colors and that you only pretend to care about the whites is telling. you would defend cops murdering white people too as long as they were poor so just stop. Truth is not your thing as you defend racists, thieves, liars and murders with bankrupt spin. You saying anyone is misrepresenting reality is a bad joke.
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  37620. ​ @quijybojanklebits8750  Hey if you want to set up a 1776 militia with muskets to oppose the british have at it. That is what amendment protects. Training requires a standard, especially if you want to be "top notch". In your world that standard is totally arbitrary and entirely unenforceable anyway as it has no power to compel anyone involved to follow it. The only group that sets the standard of top notch military training is and always has been the state. Ignoring that truth while trying to say they wanted armed posse's doing whatever they want as long as their gun was clean and loaded and they could shoot strait is a poorly thought out concept. Military training is about working within a team, use of your weapons and the importance of following chain of command. Any chain of command has to derive authority from somewhere, where would you posit modern militia leaders get it? How do you personally evaluate if any of them are well regulated or not? You appear to think the amendment was meant to create some unelected lawless shadow military force that has no accountability within our system. You argue it was meant to create gun anarchy. I can not think of a single reason any responsible leader would do this for any society as the results of that policy are very predictable. In your framework you imagine the 2nd to be some kind of authorization to create many armed groups who have no responsibility to anything but what they want to do. Any actions they take that broke any law without state sanction would see them arrested as criminals. Is it really your claim the government's goal was to create militia's while giving them no legal framework to protect them when acting with those weapons? If so what was the point? Creating many independent armed groups who have no responsibility but to their whims is a recipe for societal anarchy. I find looking at the entomology of words very interesting as well. In this case there has been no major shift in the understanding of the word as used in context. Well regulated means organized, equipped, trained and under command. Ignoring the last part is the root problem with your interpretation because it conveniently partially ignores how the word was used historically.
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  37622.  @quijybojanklebits8750  There is no mandate to create a lawless unregulated militia in our system now or any time in our past.. The militia you are talking about are not well regulated in any way but the most superficial. The assertion they should only be answerable to themselves creates a class of citizens that are above the law in their use of lethal force if they act in a militia capacity. I never said the national guard are militia, The national guard is what the well regulated milita in the 2nd evolved from. The 2nd was put in place to make it easy for local major land owners to raise forces in their region on behalf of the state as was regularly done in the era. They wanted to ensure the populace was properly armed if a militia needed to be raised It was not to give anti social mouth breathers uimited access to modern weapons. All this is Moot, the Supreme Court has not struck down gun laws and has upheld them multiple times. Your desire to create well armed ganges of criminals is noted. Not one of those social clubs for halfwits are authorized to use weapons as a group. Even as they can legally bear them they can not fire them in anger. If your useless militias shoot anyone they face criminal charges and do not enjoy the protections of soldiers or authorized militia. What good is a toothless military force like that anyway? Are they just wanna be criminals aching to break the law? because they have no authorization to use the business end of their weapons at anyone or even to act in a threatening manner that is the path they walk. They are at best pointless.
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  37695.  @Trivski  If you say so, it is bizarre hill to die on given it means nothing. I can not imagine voting for her because she said she was going to get a vote that could not pass. She has done a great deal to advance the policy, pretending she does not care about the issue or she lied about her goals is counterfactual. What new information do you imagine we get with a vote that will not pass? We get the same kind of investment we did on the sponsorship, weak information at best. This vote has no more value that the co-sponsor list did. She would happily replace Nancy, she does not have an option to. This is a simple matter of numbers. The only thing she could do to replaces her is vote in a con. I can't imagine anyone sane who voted for her that wants that. This vote may actually hurt the people you intend to help. It could and will be weaponized to demonize progressives and make it look like their ideas our outside main stream to the easily influence MSM crowd. No one who supports the policy is running for anything in the near future. Using it as an election tool seems very ill timed. I would argue going for the bump now give the corporate dems, the media and the insurance industry too much time to undo anything we gain. That is if we gain anything. There is plenty to lose and literally nothing tangible to gain. M4A will be a huge issue in the next cycle. All dems should deeply encouraged to run on M4A as it is a winning platform. We have work to do before then. I do not see a symbolic vote being any more valuable than t he info we already have. The time to promote it for the next primary is in the 6 to 10 months before it happens. The establishment has already chipped away at the majority we had a few months ago, the same will happen here.
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  37719. @The Market You are correct the polls consistantly unestimate populaity with non voters. The polls are just a measure to look at but do not pick up where bernie gets a good chunk of support. This is like trump 2016 only bernie is actually popular with a wide audance rather than trump's narrow one. Every advantage trump had over hillary bernie steals back. The 'culture' is not blanket support for trump but a reflection of a desire for change that has been driving the elections since 2008. The idea people do not want change is betrayed by evey election since Obama's first. If people wanted the status quo hillary would be president not Trump. America is hungry for change, the media and establishment are not. Ideas that are widely popular publicly are marginalized as stupid by an ever more unpopular establishment corporate media that drives false narritives propping up a failing status quo that empowers them. I disagee tulsi is even a contender. She might be in the future but is not even on the boards this cycle. The assertion otherwise is simply counter factual. I do have a preferance but that does not make me blind to simple math and numbers the exclude her as an option. She is a democrat so has every disadvantage bernie does, she has far lower name recogniton and has the same handicap that has slowed bernie in that tbe media hates her. She is not a contendèr this cycle no matter how much you like her. Stop with the silly estanlishmemt talking points, Obama was elected on a platform of change and then trump on promising to make america great againt. Both were 'radical' and drank the spinal fluid of those who were not. The status quo is a proven loser no matter what party it runs for and you need to recognize that and stop parroting wishful nonsense strait from media sources that always get it wrong Just like the media pushed cookie cutter establishment losers over trump they will push anyone but bernie. Trump crushed them because he represented a change the electorate craves and so will bernie. Bernie barely lost against hillary last time and she had a giant head start. The establishment does not have that this time and only bleeds support the more their candidate's are exposed and Pete has plenty to hide. The mayor has a peak that he is about to hit and Bernie's support is not abandoning him. Bernie is not of the democratic establishmet and this insulates him from the worst of the trump impeachment nonsense which i agree is deeply problematic. This is especially true for any establishment demoocrat running but not so much for bernie who even you point out is outside thier umbrella, He is not assoctated with thieir flaures like both Biden and Pete are .The only sticking downside for him is it will turn out trumps base. Bernie is not hillary looking to squeak by with a low voter turnoutt and inspires a strong base of his own which i argue is larger.
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  37881.  @LouisFGraham  I flatly reject your assertion that his polices are focused on "white problems" and would argue the min wage, health care affordability and access and the pressing of a new new deal help everyone regardless of color. Criminal justice reform is a major part of Bernie's platform that is distinctly missing in establishment candidates. The unequal application of the law against the African american community is but one of their problems. There are others as well tied to the massive out sourcing of the jobs that once employed who communities that disproportionally negatively effected communities of color. This is compounded by the Drug war which also hits the AE community harder while community facilities such as schools are underfunded and poorly supported. Criminal justice reform is a critical part of any path to attacking income inequality and that is why it is a significant plank in his policy. Pretending it is not there and he is only doing this for white people is ignorant at best but is pushing dishonest in it's framing. He is attacking your pet issue and I would argue he is one of the few that have in the last generation. It makes your condemnation of his policy a call to stasis as no one has done anything about his issue for decades and you dismissing Beanie's efforts as ineffective is a defacto call for more of the same. I fully admit poor communities are different and recognize the challenges you outline. I even agree with many of your proposals as adjunct policy. I do not expect to see any of them pressed under the other leaders no matter thier skin tone as no one is proposing them. It undermines your attacks on Bernie as an attempt to stop him from making the other critical reforms I outlined which would not only help the black community but everyone. You are siding against a group of people who agree's with you goals while pretending you are being specially ignored when you are not. We need to solve the big issues that effect everyone while at the same time as we tackle justice reform. I do not see anyone else offering the bold ideas we need not only to get things done but that will win elections so we can do them. Obama won by running a populist message and he gave people white and black hope for real change. What his got us was the status quo and the days of picking our leaders based on skin tone should be sliding into the past for everyone.
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  37882.  @LouisFGraham  He is focused on everyone's income inequality and that he is not primarily focused on a single group when it is bad and getting worse for all is a no brainier. It is well understood that African Americans face endemic and systematic challenges that need to be addressed. This is is a historical truth based on uneven application of justice combined with the unfair hiring bias and and the selling out of working people in general hitting them hardest. Perhaps the single biggest issue outside justice issues for the community was the flood of manufacturing leaving the country they counted on with nothing returning to replace it. . These changes are still devastating these communities today and no amount of justice reform will fix this base problem. Income inequality is is growing problem for all Americans. It needs to be addressed on that basis by promoting the easy win polices that benefit everyone like health care and better access to quality education from pre-school to free college unbound by our school local funding apparatus that disadvantages poor youth of all colors. These programs are not hand outs but create equality of opportunity that is sorrily lacking in black communities and frankly in the large one as well. He represents a whole state and as a long time progressive and civil rights marcher has always courted the most diverse community that can possibly be in any region he is in. This "diverse constituency" argument rings empty as his record on diversity and inclusion is sound. Justice reform is part of his platform and that you do not know that means I have just helped you out. Maybe have a look before making claims that are not valid. It feels like every single objection you make is a mountains out a mole hill that no other candidate qualifies on. That is a hard place place to start as I have not seen who you are supporting for president it not bernie.
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  37902.  @thepcenthusiastchannel2300  She proved otherwise over and and over. She has shown great skill in questioning people in the house and has shown that she can think on her feet when questioned and is parroting nothing. Your assertion is based on bad smelling air and overt propaganda driven ignorance. The fact is you have not shown yourself to be anything but the most abject follower as you parrot establishment spin crafted for morons. She did not want to stop an employer from setting up, she just objected to buying Bezos a helipad to do so. It is clear you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to her tax policy. The days of giveaways to billionaires have to end and these assholes should not be getting your tax dollars to set up shops they need anyway. You may feel getting on your belly and handing the already richest corporations billions with a vague and toothless promise of jobs is a great idea but it is not. Blaming her for standing with the grass roots movement in her community which opposed the give away which was based on a promises and projections they were not even obliged to meet is stupid. Your policy has nothing to do with leading and everything to do with capitulation and the promotion of the status quo of excusing the richest from the taxes rest of us pay transferring their costs onto working people or our collective debt. She is by definition leading and is doing so almost alone against the entire establishment who write your dumb talking points. You are the definition of a useful idiot, it is likely from your post that you are not clever either or at best are easily duped. It devalues your intelligence assessment.
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  37903.  @thepcenthusiastchannel2300  Terrible examples, I have explained how they were terrible. I understand your spin is but reject the premise as it lacks substance. The costs of Amazon coming and the fact they were not bound to any of the promises of jobs made makes the deal a give away. There were capital investment requirements by the state and it was not all just tax forgiveness. There are the ongoing costs associated with the business utilizing the facilitates of the city that would be a direct drain on the tax payer while they enjoyed their tax free status. The deal was much more complex than the sound bites you quote indicate. That someone could have another opinion than you does not make them "dumb" She has brilliantly cross examined multiple people one one and has dissected them like a pro as she has done so. The spin she is just spitting talking points is entirely empty and is devoid of substance. I would argue that her opponents are much more guilty of both being way more simple than she is and are consistently the worst kind of talking point machines. Those who blather against her intelligence never lead except perhaps backwards. By your standard we should call them all simple too. It seems you may be afflicted with the failure that you paint me as having, confirmation bias? You don't like her and jump on board with the talking points you think intellectually justifies that feeling. The fact it is all based on feels is the root of your problem because it lets you ignore objective fact. Like her or hate her calling her stupid is a loosing game as she will continue to show otherwise. Despite what the establishment press decides to spin as stupid. They do so while ignoring the Ghomert's the Bush's or even the Trump's of this world, this fact undermines their already nonexistent cred. They are seizing on this one non main stream movement she stood with and trying to paint it as idoicy, this is transparent nonsense.
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  37953. Avon Barksdale860 I have no problem having a conversation with you about literally anything. That being said If I believed the person I was speaking to was acting in bad faith it is beholden on me as honest actor to call them out and make that part of the discussion. I simply validly identified your spin as identical to the trolls who spit the same twist pretending a support of an open debate of ideas that is not portrayed in the content you defend. I honestly have a hard time taking anyone who calls Anna a dishonest actor and then pretends Dave is anything but seriously. I have watched him, that is why I do not bother anymore. I saw/see him selling out and lying to his audience. This is based on my personal assessment and I was one of his first 1000 subscribers when he started. Honestly I am shocked it took so long for TYT to call him out given how he has been misrepresenting them since he left. I am informed so stop with the Al Jazeera garbage, they had a distribution agreement with that group for a while and they retained editorial control the whole time and did not do any propaganda on behalf of the state at all. In fact their content was entirely unaffected and I challenge you to show how they betrayed their stated principles like Rubin has. The spin attacking them for a peripheral tertiary agreement to briefly distribute their show in 2014 as relevant has no place in any sane honest conversion. Personally I am not closed to speaking with even the most insane fringe of either end of the spectrum. What I do oppose is giving them a blank check to make assertions that are simply not true unchallenged. Dave and his ilk are nothing but marketed spin to a target audience to sell political ideas manufactured with billionaire money on false pretenses and misrepresentation. I am not the problem with any conversation. I would argue that the Shills like Rubin and the Main stream media are, you appear to be complicit.
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  38026.  @catalyst3713  Most of the country does not agree with him on very much. His ideas are all unpopular for good reasons. People are actually sick of overt corruption, fascism, white supremacy, embraced bigotry and regressive church ladies screaming how everyone else should live their lives. What you should be allowed to read, watch or do in your bed room with a consenting adult. The right wing's position on these issues activates an engaged minority of voters that supports this unpopular garbage because they appeal to their identity as bigots and fundamentalist religious freak shows. The vast majority of Americans do not agree with Denis's regressive identity focused antifreedom fundamentalist values. People like you are dark side SJW's way worse than anyone on the looney left crying about safe spaces. You fringe freak shows do the same annoying identity focused nonsense as they do only on behalf of bigotry and corruption. It is a shitty look, you really need to know you are not popular. Universal back ground checks popular. No one on the left is soft on crime, but the right is as they ignore white collar criminals as long as they like them. They openly put their own leaders above the law. There are no open borders in the US, no one in power supports the concept. Homelessness is a economic and mental health issue the right has no policy to fix and only makes worse. Complaining about cops murdering your community is not playing victim. The right has always loved censorship, they are likely burning books as we speak. The only white people being told they are racists are assholes saying racist things. Nobody but the most dopy and media identity blinded agree with you. Respecting others and kicking bigots in the teeth is popular, just not in your crowd apparently.
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  38181.  @christopherv431  The scientific definition of "life" might apply to a fetus, but that changes nothing. In terms of it being person, it is at best is a potential person. 20% of all pregnancies' self abort opening the door to charge woman who face that issue. We legally can not force a mother to donate a kidney to a living breathing child, a child who has a name and birth record has no innate right to it's mothers body. Extending that right to a thumb sized hunk of cells has no basis in law and is counter to standard medical ethics. Criminalising abortion which is what the forced birthers demand is the government forcing woman to have the child. Their demand to compel all woman to have every child because of propaganda generated feelings is overtly tyrannical. You argue on their behalf. Nothing is ignorant about my arguments, you just reject them with no reasons. I never argue the government should be between your doctor and you. Your claim I am ever on the other side of this is dishonest and stupid. In fact you can point to no repressive law of this kind that I support. You are one standing with unrepentant, blatant, mono dimensional, hypocrites who scream they value freedom and then try to take it from anyone they dislike or consider on the other side. It makes your strange projection pretty funny. There is no downside in letting a woman control her body. In fact allowing abortions for those not ready to have a child decreases poverty and increases the earning potential of young mothers who elect to have them instead giving birth. 80% of all woman who have abortions go on to have children in the future, children that they can support. It is not a matter of if they have the child, but when. I am not pro abortion, I am pro choice. I would like to see us attack the reasons people feel they need to get one. Increasing sex education and allowing easy to access contraption has been shown to be very effective. I would see ece funding increased to give young parents more support. None of these things are kind of policy you support making a lie of your concern for the anything but punishing sex. Being an advocate of forced birth while also opposing contraption and sex education is idiotic. It is a mask off moment that betrays shrew like, church lady, Karen nature.
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  38188.  @johncrighton4738  They are not. Medicare for all polls at 75% among the base, universal back ground checks at 95%, living wage 86%, ect, ect. Progressive policy's are universally popular among independent and democratic voters . It is a media lie propped up by their consistent twisted spin that progressive can not win and you have bought the nonsense. The fact is centrists have a shitty record when not in tilted primaries. Chasing after mythical "centrist" votes has seen the democrats lost over a 1000 seats and both houses and the states before turning it around based on the incompetence and sheer thuggery of the GOP not because they are better than when they lost. The only reason they are in the running is the GOP under trump has gone insane. I call them establishment because they are, they care about the existing power structure and bow to insurance companies, corporate lobbies and billionaire tax cuts as they spit on what their base demands for favor of donors. What else do you call someone that props up a broken status quo besides establishment? The asshole this who triggered this whole conversation is in a deep blue state but votes with trump most of the time including support for a genocide in Yemen. It is way past time we stop giving these republicans in democratic clothing the time of day. Imagine the GOP accepting anyone that voted with the democrats most of the time and you can see how the democrats are paid to lose. If you want to vote republican vote republican, we should have a choice between those bellying up to the corporate trough and those who wish to serve their voters. I can not see why we would not insist democratic leaders at least in deep blue states act like democrats and not republicans. Pretending you expect the modern GOP to compromise is silly and shows you have not been paying attention. Obama passed the republican health care plan with out one single republican vote. The only thing our parties now agree on is more money for our bloated military and tax cuts for the rich. Hillary is the reason trump was elected, her innate weakness betrays your entire centrist's win spin. I can no longer sit quietly by and let these losers run the show because they keep handing power to the GOP. I stand against them because I am tired of losing easily winnable races to overt cancer. Even when these sellouts win they act weak ensuring another trump like win because they chase the same donor money the GOP does. I do not look at you as the enemy, I look at the monsters that sell out their base for donor money as the enemy. If you are not selling us out to the highest bidder we are not in opposition. I see you as a potential unrealized ally. I treat these sellouts as the enemy because that is the way they treat me while still expecting my vote by default. Either way win or lose they serve their owners and that is why they have to go.
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  38461.  @ascendant95  Walker and the GOP is entirely owned and does not even pretend otherwise. Warnock is too conservative in his siding wih donor issues for me but he is not full rubber stamp for the religious fascists and authoritarian nut jobs. Ukraine is a drop in the bucket compared the the unaccounted for trillions we poured into the sand of the middle east. The GOP owns the whole debacle enabled by the donors that bought the dems who kept Radeon getting paid. Opposing funding Ukraine makes sense, voting for the GOP who never saw a potential war they did not like or military spending they would not vote for does not make sense. The whole silly trans freak out is an empty wedge issue to distract you from the fact these assholes vote against your personal interest on everything. Then entire issue is a cyclone of faux outrage to support common old school bigotry you find appealing. It an identity trap they use to manipulate a certain kind of person based on feelings, to distract you from what they do otherwise. They do this while handing uncounted tax dollars to the rich who have never been richer. Nothing they support materially improves your life, they only serve the donors that own them. Oil and gas are not ours no matter how much we pump, they are controlled by the oil companies who can sell our oil anywhere they want. More pumping means more to sell for them but does not mean our prices will drop or that we have any more for our own use. Spitting oil company talking points at this juncture in history is hard core NPC nonsense. Shilling for these vampires is hard core dopey. At this point the Orange bad man is on the Ropes and his numbers look worse daily. I am not sure he will even be on the ticket in 2024. If he manages to win the primary, he starts with a giant deficit as the majority of Americans disapprove of him from the jump. He ranks poorly with moderates and they are what makes and breaks elections. Your predictions would have been much more likely before the supreme court torpedoed Roe and activated a lot of previously inactive voters. The right has weaponized the issue of abortion for decades to turn out a loyal base. With the advent of this decision being struck down the democrat's for the first time since Roe was passed have the same If Trump even wins the primaries it will be because a great many people have very short memories. He lied his voters to get elected and managed to achieve nothing but tax cuts for the richest and a tiny cut that ends for everyone else. You have to live in a very specific news bubble to see Trump as anything but a joke while in office and an embarrassment that made the whole country look like morons. I would be inclined to agree the democrats are largely pathetic, especially the leadership. They do have to change their format, they have to stop pushing half measures and corporate giveaways and do what their base and most of the country actually demands. They need to tackle bread and butter issues and ensure visible material change for Americans. As long as they play the Washington generals to the to the GOP's Harlem globe trotters corruption they will look pathetic to anyone that dislikes clowns that are paid to lose.
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  39153. @Marcellus Aaron So they take their money, if there is a service they are providing someone else will who is willing to pay taxes will step and and fill it. We do not need the rich, they need us and make no money without our market. If you make your money in america pay american taxes, it is that simple. No one is suggesting everyone should make the same profit and you literally do not understand what the policy means as you pretend that is the case. The rates she proposes were in place at the height of the red scare when we never had better growth of the middle class. The policy she supports literally has nothing to do with communism and when you pretend it does you look like you do not know what you are talking about. High taxes encourage business to reinvest into it to offset how much they pay. It puts money back into and grows the business because if they do not do so they pay it in taxes anyway. When taxes are low what they do is stock buy backs and the build off shore production facilities. There is no incentive to put money back into a businesses because we give them a giant tax cut and history shows this over and over. They throw it on a pile or invest it overseas and there is no reason to expect any of it comes back to america or its workers these billionaires rely on to make their money, the lowering of corporate and top tax rates are root causes of the massive growth in income inequality and their policy's are at the heart of the shrinking of the middle class and the growth of the poor.. When you have to make up straw men to attack what you oppose you do so because have no actual arguments.
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  39481.  @johnadams2129  That is not what I am saying at all, you are missing my actual point. I am saying their perspective is progressive and that informs their bias. Fox news says they are fair and balanced but is actually deeply biased in a single direction. CNN plays they are neutral when in fact they have a strong establishment bias. TYT says up front what their perspective is and that is the best you can expect from any media source who often pretend to be neutral and unbiased when they most certainly never are. I am not sure why you think I am saying all progressive outlets should or do have the same opinion. The fact is most will have similar view points even if they are not identical. What I am saying is if the media outlet openly says where they stand you can take that bias into consideration when you evaluate what they say and if they do not you have to guess making their motivations clouded at best if not obscured. One can classify those motivations on their own but it is always better if the organization says what they are up front so those assertions can be evaluated against what they actually say. We are forced to look for the bias in all media we consume unless we want to blindly swallow the narratives fed to us. We need to put any given story into context and that is harder if they do not state what the presenters perspective is up front. If we understand what their view point and their general perspective is it helps us understand the context of any discussion they are engaging in. It gives insight on what drives their message and why they are sharing it in the way they choose to.
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  39732.  @ArmOr_of_the_Alpha_and_Omega  The fatherless homes talking points are silly,. the real issue with fatherless homes is not missing both parents, but is attached to the family being down one income. All families of low incomes have worse results than those with more resources. This is because of the way we fund our schools segregating people by region and attaching the schools funding to local taxes. Children of lower income have fewer options for recreation, socialization and exposure to the wider world. This process ensures that the poorest receive a substandard education, fewer external social groups and reduced set of growth experiences compared to the kids in better funded, more affluent regions. What we should be encouraging is not random two parent homes, they fail all the time. We need to encourage all aspiring parents to be able to feed and house themselves, to belong to supporting group of friends or family, ideally they should be employed or finically stable. I would couple that with systems that provide adequate affordable day care while funding schools evenly. These elements in union would allow even a single parent to work at a higher level and therefor better care for and offer opportunities to their children. The idea we need to force all pregnancies' to term when literally a 1/4 of them self terminate before gestation is poorly thought out. A woman deciding she is not in a position to have a child right now is an act of considered social responsibility. She is far more likely to be desperately poor and drain on the system if she has a child before establishing support for herself. The fact is most woman who have abortions go on later to have a child. This makes the choice of to have the child more a matter of when than if.
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  40142. ​ @indymarrow8050 The tea party was owned by the Koch's. That you were a "strict libertarian" does not recommend you and the fact you then switched to supporting overt crony capitalist/religious freak shows is quite a 180. I do not expect you to catch up as you seem to somehow pride yourself on ignorance but will attach the a whole bunch of information that is all independently verifiable if you follow the sources. Not that I expect you to even read it. The only reason you do not know this commonly known fact is you live in a bubble and did not look outside it. It pretty sad when you have to lie to yourself to hang onto your asserted nonsense. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/oct/13/tea-party-billionaire-koch-brothers https://www.huffingtonpost.com/brendan-demelle/study-confirms-tea-party-_b_2663125.html https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2010/08/30/covert-operations https://www.opensecrets.org/news/2018/10/the-koch-networks-integrated-strategy-for-social-transformation/ https://www.beaconbroadside.com/broadside/2017/12/the-rich-and-hidden-political-influence-of-the-koch-brothers.html http://zfacts.com/koch-brothers I got my "misinformation" by opening my eyes and paying attention to something other than fox news an other paid shills. I could have filled pages with a simple google search to verify what I have known the whole time. I am pretty sure you must live in a bubble and never have never bothered to look outside it. It is pretty funny being called idiotic by the likes of you.
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  40208. @A Hole Most drugs do not come across the border that would be protected by a wall. They are smuggled via monitored entry points and via the water. Again the wall is largely symbolic. The ONLY answer to the drug problem is to legalize it. These drugs are problematic only because they are illegal and have the exact same problem alcohol did when we handed control of it to the gangs during Prohibition. Drug use is higher today than a decade ago and by any standard the war on drugs is an overt failure that is costing us billions while failing worse each year. We should be legalizing taxing and regulating Cannabis. Keeping illegal will continue drive criminal empires just like when drinking alcohol did when it was briefly criminalized. If you are concerned about the violence associated with an underground drug market then legalize it and move the fights into court room and not on the streets. The existing policy empowers violent criminals and for profit prisons and no one else. Ending the drug war is what we should be doing. We are putting our finger in the dyke and criminalizing the consumption of substances. The drugs like heroin, cocaine and the others are problematic because they are addictive but their worst effects are mitigated not by prisons but by treatment. When Portugal decriminalized (not legalized) these drugs their use went down. They were able to focus funds on treatment and decreased to worst effects of the drugs that still effect us in our system which does nothing to stop them. What is "retarded" is advocating for the failed status quo polices based on a gut feeling, you obviously have not put much thought or research into this subject.
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  40210. @A Hole My answer is not that. For the areas more remote where we do not have a wall we should increase our drone surveillance of the region. We should make it so no one can walk through that area without us seeing them. We need to create fast action units that can be rapidly deployed to breaches. We can use existing hardware and facilities to support this by simply allocating or transferring them them to this task. This solution has several advantages. It does not require the government to invoke eminent domain and seize the land of citizens to build the wall and respects property rights. It is far cheaper and arguably more effective because it puts human eyes on the issue and does not rely on mindless concrete. And it is modern solution that will be harder to circumvent than a wall making it the better choice. That being said you have not shown our existing situation without a wall in some places problematic enough to call it an emergency. I think locking down those locations with drones makes sense but more because we can do it then there is real and driving reason reason to do it. On the issue of drugs we need to overhaul our policy if we are actually concerned about the issues we face. No wall, no drone surveillance team, no border crossing will be able to address the problem of drugs getting passed what are static defenses that can be circumvented. This will always be true as long as there is a dollar to be made. I agree with Trump when he is right, I unlike you disagree with him when he is wrong and just selling a line that a specific group likes even if it does nothing.
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  40382.  @jacobfromallstate4963  We are facing a few challenges not the least of which is our ideas do not make any billionaires projected next quarter profit increases. We need to draw lines between ourselves and the corporately inspired censorship and counter productive identity pandering in corporate media with the understanding they are not and never were allies. This week they are cancelling insurrectionists but a couple years ago it was anyone who came out as gay even as they still crush anyone left of McCarthy on economics. The media and establishment leadership are johnny come latelys to even left wing social policy. They only jump on board with any given social standard once it is a forgone conclusion with their target market. The left has never had real power and still does not have it, as always the power is in the hands of few elite. As progressives we need to target our pitch to the respective audience. We need to give them the upsides of policy we support in context of them. Our ideas are popular even as we have been painted as extremists as they literally ignore the vast majority who disagree with them on their empty rejection of progressive policy. It makes spreading this common sense message a slow process. Heaven knows the main stream media is not going to be helping as they continue to malign us. They cast us as loony by associating all of us with those over enamoured with a specific identity bubble at the cost of the support from people outside it. It is beholden on us to break apart that image as we can. Even as they try to stop us the popularity of the programs we recognize as making a real difference grows. They can straw man us but it is getting harder by the day to straw man our ideas.
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  40459.  @jimmoses6617  Context matters, so if the 2, 500 or 5000 were all physiologically and medically validated then I see no issue. The specific nature of each incident matters. To answer your question; The number is not really important (tiny anyway) to me, proper procedure is. I understand the world exists in shades of grey and is not black and white. Pretending this non issue is a problem is all about appealing to a targeted groups feelings. Your empty outrage is designed tacitly attack all people facing this issue. Your preconceptions are misused to trigger you. I do have children and will always and forever resent anyone getting between my child's doctor and I. On medical treatment in general; The experts opinion matters, the parents opinion matters, the subjects opinion matters, yours does not. No doctor is performing sex changes without parents consent for minors. In Oregon hormone therapy has been applied to handful of minors after due consultation with doctors. There is no reference to surgeries on minors. Fun fact, it is literally illegal to do surgery on any child without parental consent. You have been lied to by lumping in adult stats with children's stats. The state barely pays when you get cancer, the idea they are paying for underage sex changes is total nonsense. You need to stop pretending you care about anyone but yourself, this bizarre tantrum of yours is all about your purposely triggered feels. It is dark side SJW shit and makes you as bad as the blue haired college kids crying for a safe space. If what you were sharing was actually a thing the whole country would be up in arms. It is not a thing and no one supports children getting these operations without expert and parental buy in. Your pretending "the left" support doctors randomly mutilating children is yet another naked lie you are forced to sell over and over to paint this issue as something it is not. When you have to make up nonsense about what your opponents stand for, it underlines the weakness of your position
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  40472.  @sallyj4209  The ghouls are the ones pretending breaking unions is in the best interest of anyone but the owner class. The same clowns who want to pay nurses as little as possible. There is extorsion, the extortion of not being protected by a union and getting treated like wage slave for the privilege. Your spin is in the direct service to anti democratic authoritarian control of our lives in the interest of someone else's profit. A union in a hospital guarantees that nurse's there get paid better than non union shops. It sets safety, patient care and work rules that non union locations do not have have. They forgo them to save money for the owners and make the hospital more profitable, not to make the hospital safer or better or even cheaper. Of course I want labour unions to control hospitals much more than I want sharks and investors to. These people care only about profit and everything else including safety and patient care a distant second. They do not show any concern for workers health or livelihood above their own profit. No employer will talk to a nurse about how much they can get paid based on profit, unless they are part of a union. You want them to be forced to take take what the owners decide to give them and be happy about it with no recourse. Nurse's are highly trained professionals who do sometimes dangerous and always grueling work . You are defending the literally greedy by calling the heart and soul of the hospital greedy, just for wanting fair pay. There is an innate greed in our health care system. It is in the pharmaceutical companies, the vampiric for profit insurance scam and for profit hospital system. The people you seem to ignore even as they buy our leaders and write your silly talking points while offering no extra value to patients. You attack the people who actually save lives as the problem while ignoring the useless third party profiteers that are the actual reason our system is so expensive. It makes you look bought or simple.
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  40615.  @thinkharder9332  What you call cope is valid point of law in the rest of the world. Only in in our messed ammo sexual culture would proportionality in a case claiming justified violence as a defense be irrelevant. The judge instructed the jury to act is it did, he instructed them to ignore the circumstances leading to the conflict and focus on the event. No where else in the free world would Kyle have gotten off. . There is another perspective outside the fringe one you exist in. The rest of the world sees Kyle for the npc he is. They see him as a poster child of a specific political mindset and a dopy grifter. Your strange tacit respect for this hard fail is odd. We should all be able to agree that fox blinded, trigger happy children counter protesting while heavily armed is problematic. That you think it is fine speaks to a disconnect with normal thought process most people share. I see no value in what you promote. "Was he supposed to not be alarmed by a crowd calling to kill him" No he was not supposed to not be there if he could not handle his ship and keep his head strait, he had no training, no experience and was barely legally able to carry the weapon. The idea he had no personal responsibility for wandering into that crowd with a loaded weapon and a desire to shoot people before he eventually did is bizarre to the sane. He sought the crowd out, not the other way around. He is not a victim, no matter how much you love playing that card. That you think untrained teens with guns counter protesting and shooting up the place makes sense is bizarre, but it is your right. People are going to call the Kyle a criminal even if you are triggered by it. It is you who needs a big glass of cope.
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  40616.  @thinkharder9332  Nothing I said is a lie, I never made any assertions you could compare to video and I will talk about mace if you want. I have never defended a serial predator and never will. Misrepresenting me only makes you look dishonest. I have strong distain for anyone that shows up at protest with the intention of violence. That is the only reason to pick a gun and go to one. Pretending this child simp was there to protect property is at best dumb. His ignorance was weaponized and his incompetence cost lives. I am appealing to the laws of other nations that do not have regular shootings like this because they are nailing it on this issue and we are giant s-show. I would like to see our system to not be the worst, we should discourage teen vigilantes armed with a semi. "Proportionality really only exists as a buzzword to harass someone who defends themselves." There is no upside in a civilized society to promote lethally violent interactions with no responsibility of restraint. That specific legislators here have thrown out the concept does not change it is a key component in almost all most self defense evaluations except ours. I have no issue with actual self defense, even lethal self defense. But Kyle was was not attacked as he took a walk in the park or in his home. He actively went out and sought out the people he ended up shooting. He traveled across state lines to find a situation where he would be "forced" to use his weapon on protesters. It should not be self defense when it is clear you desired the conflict in the first place.
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  40677.  @rainphantom  You have not established it is nonsense at all. We did have a high level of growth through that period of high taxes and ignoring it does not make it go away. It has worked so it makes your claim it can not work is patently empty and poorly supported. Mass investment in common facilities in the building of roads, schools and contributed to that growth. That is only possible when the government is well funded. Markets are created when there is disposable income and our tax money invested in workers building and maintaining common facilities created the expansion of the markets that was typified by the period. Investment goes where markets are available and the consistent contraction of our markets is directly due to the transfer of wealth from those who spend it to those who throw it on a pile. The policy you support is directly responsible for the massive growth in income inequality and the collapse of the middle class as the "job creators" you defend have gotten exponentially richer while their share of the tax burden to GDP has shrunk. Their tax cuts are directly responsible for a massive part of our debt to no advantage. They are dividing us literally and are at the root of the left right divide which is based on a handful of wedge issues and identity politics tropes to distract both groups from the fact they are being robbed by both sets of leaders. Rich people are just citizens who have more resources and they should expected to higher rates of taxes on income over a certain value. They should be happy to pay it because they would make nothing without our system, workers and market around them. They should be beholden to us and not us to them.
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  40756. RizenLink On numerous key issues they are basically indistinguishable from a 90's republican. The fact they passed the GOP's version of health care reform while getting no GOP votes should speak to who they are. You can keep blaming progressives for recognizing and not choosing the lessor of two evils when they are both evil even though there are better options. If anyone is going to unify it should be behind the leader who has actual popular policy and does not just pay lip service to it in service of the highest bidder. Democrats are better but establishment democrats on numerous issues are just as bad as any member of the GOP and ignoring that fact does not make it go away nor does it address the increasingly hard to ignore problems spawned from the policy of leaders that work for their donors first. I am tired of the self riotous empty failure supporting spin of establishment die hards pretending they know how to win or should be in charge. Being called stupid by halfwits that do not recognize they are being played by a donor class that literally does not care if you live or die while telling us to unite behind their unpopular candidates is painfully weak and empty. It is time to cut off these assholes who have been selling out our country and our future to the highest bidder in both parties. The status quo offered by the establishment of either party is no longer acceptable to vast swath of the country and it is time you suck it up and unify behind an actual populist who cares about his voters instead of sellouts who are out of touch with reality and promise more of the same.
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  40890.  @mikegoliath8678  Ya I do talk to people outside my bubble. It is pretty clear you do not as you straw man and make up what we stand for as part of your standard spin. There is no serious division in the opposition of overt corruption. The democratic voters unlike the republicans have never been big on the policy the establishment consistently signs onto for the donors. It is why they are so deeply unpopular and lost over 1000 seats in federal and state elections since 2008 after winning huge while Obama pretended to be progressive. Every position Bernie has is popular if you look at the polling and you have to misrepresent the policy to get numbers that remotely serve your narrative. It is the establishment that is deeply unpopular and the democratic win/loss record in contested elections reflects this over the last few cycles. There is no real division in this primary outside a few elites who control the media and buy the current establishment sellouts. Democratic voters will all show up for Sanders when Hillary proved she was not popular as people stayed home rather than voting for her. You could not be more wrong about me being politically isolated. You accusing anyone of being in a bubble while you spit naked nonsense talking points about the "radical left" and "socialism" is pretty droll. You imitating anyone is stupid while saying stupid things is even more funny. It is you who spits news talking points not me sparky, physician heal thy sheeple self. Your defense of corruption is as weak as defense of corruption always is. You stand on the wrong side of history using spin designed to make normal people into useful idiots. You are not pragmatic, you are at best a dupe. Own that.
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  41418. @M A What solutions do you expect are better approached from the right? Shumer is a sellout who takes millions of dollars of lobbyist money to ignore his base. He does not have an ideology outside the fact he does what he is told. He is not ultra anything but an ultra sellout. He is ignoring what the vast majority of the country wants not out of "principle" or because he "centrist". it is because he serves his donors and not the voters at all. This is proven again and again and it is not his ideology that Kyle hacks on it is the fact he does not have one outside his marching orders. A wall is a useless waste of money and address's a problem we do not have in a time when we have plenty of things to spend money on. There is no assertion by anyone that Mexicans are coming across the border illegally by the millions. In fact the vast majority that do come cross legally and then stay. Net migration is lower than the number leaving these days and building a wall is nothing more than red meat for a hyper frightened base that does nothing to deal with our issues and is a do nothing look tough approach to a problem that is founded in the jobs offered not the people coming to get them. As long as there are jobs more will come. Planning to hold millions of people back with a wall is not well thought out if what they are fleeing is death, no wall will stop them. The problem these countries have is not that they have too many people. It is that they have been destabilized time again often because of policies our governments have championed to maintain economic control for the corporations that own our leaders. The failed drug war and empowering of the cartels is also another reason refugee's are being created and we have a hand in that policy too. This is not about these people failing and living in danger in vacuum, it is about real issues we have some responsibility for. The idea we can not handle the number of refugee's coming is betrayed by the fact we take far fewer than other countries much smaller than us who have no issues doing so. The spin we need to be afraid of refugee's is to share a sentiment with those who told the Irish coming after the potato famine to go home. If you are concerned about the environment as you should be it is time to stop defending the idea of centrism or even the right which is really corporatism, These people are the root of our problems as they do nothing to address these issues or to put window dressing on them as a matter of policy. Moving north seems a good idea.
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  41419. ​@M A Money When has the right ever been good with money unless you mean handing it to rich special interests? The last time they had power for 8 yeas they put us into the great recession and as a party have balanced the books even once. National security, you have to be shitting me? The last time they had power for eight years they lied us into two multi trillion dollar unpaid for wars. Right now they spit on our closest long term allies and save praise for autocratic dictators. Employment? Trump created fewer jobs this year than the last 6, when Obama took office we were bleeding 600k jobs a month. Like him or hate him (I am no fan) Obama was objectively a much better job creator than Trump. (jobs were still shitty) We have high employment but almost all of those new jobs are low paying or part time. This puts even a bigger burden on our social safety net and means we have less people paying in supporting as the rich get exponentially richer each day at working peoples expense. Couple that he is only building on the exact same thing Obama has been doing for the last half a decade only not as well and I find it hard to wave any flags. Trump outsourced more jobs this year than any time in the last 6. They are terrible on services and only seek to cut them to give more giant tax cuts that mostly go to an arlrady ultra rich elite who then use them to do stock buy backs making them even richer while offering zero value to anyone else. They wanted to get rid of the ACA and preexisting conditions support with nothing to replace it throwing 25 million people off health care, how is that "good on services"? As of their last multi trillion dollar cut they will attempt to use point at the deficit to justify cutting social security because of an unbalanced budget. The benefits of this tax went the richest people in the country disproportionally. 85% of the tax cut went to 1% of the population. You do the math, but if you think impoverishing yourself to give the ultra rich even more is fiscal responsibility, or attempting to gut programs that saves lives and lost production is good governance then you and I define the terms differently. National security is in no way owned by the GOP, they always do terrible jobs and Trump is no different. On things like the wall they talk tough about walls but ignore the real issue. The root of the problem (the employers that hire millions of undocumented workers and pay them peanuts) also owns the party and benefits from the status quo which is not changing under the rights policy. Our problem is not that poor people come to take millions of jobs, it is that instead of paying a valid rate for workers we have a group of billionaires who hire desperate people willing to work for nothing and lure them here with promises of the american dream while at the same time demonizing them to a base who supports looks the wrong way. If you want to attack the "illegal" problem, go after the employers and stop punching down at the powerless. Take away the jobs and very few "illegals"will come. Everything else to do with national security Trump is a dumpster fire, he spits on our allies, praises our enemies, has exponentially increased bombing, supports Saudi Arabia's current genocide in Yemen, ended the Iran deal even as they continue to abide by it, etc, etc. I do not understand how anybody ever says they are good on national security. The homogeneous argument is empty. It has no basis in reality and is not a thing statistically or otherwise. The fact is most of the homogeneous societies are also the most backward and insular and that is no recipe for being rich in the modern era unless you are also gifted land and total control of the oil of a region to run as a kingdom. Even then those places are nothing to emulate. Single payer would save us all money, we pay double what the rest of the first world pays to feed useless third party middle men who are insensitiveized to not deliver care in order to increase their profits at the cost of american lives. We need it because it makes sense to pay less for a service that covers everyone rather than pay more and let people die for the privilege. I am hard pressed to come up with any policy that the right pushes I agree with. I am no further toward that understanding today.
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  41420. @M A We all do better not when the rich make more but when everyone does. When you work for a living and make a good wage you spend most of it, when you get past being a certain level of rich you do not. The problem is there is no intensive in our system right now for the "rich' to invest their extra in our country and are instead doing buy backs with their stock and building new plants in other places impoverishing our country further. The country does not grow economically strong by making the rich richer, we are only doing so because both establishment parties are bought by the same people. It should be but easy but it is not. And the fact our costs for education and health insurance are much higher than our analogs because of the way we are delivering it and the fact that industry writes the regulations that control them. Both parties are complicit but I would argue they are both acting deeply right wing and neither party represents the left who has practically no voice in our system. Right wing policies do nothing but enrich the owner class at the expense of the citizens. GM made great profits last year and got a giant tax cut and what are they doing now, moving to mexico and cutting 15k of jobs because it means the execs will make a bigger bonus. The trade polices of the right own this failure and pretending enriching these greedy already rich assholes more is good for the country is an impossible argument to make from any practical stand point. The spin that giving the rich money does anything but make them richer is fact free spin written by the assholes who get all the money at working Americans expense. I am not saying that all right wing polices are bad, but you have yet to point out one that is good. I agree, many morons vote against their own interest. I know some, they have been cheated out of leadership by the fact until lately "left" was basically center right as well giving them the choice between a republican sellout and a lame version of a republican sellout with a D after their name. The version of the republicans that created the EPA are no where to be found in this environment and we need to get back to a point both parties do something besides work for the highest bidder. This is no longer an issue of left vs right, but corrupt vs working for the voters .
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  41442.  @dodioxoopey8843  The dif in this case is they are not blaming nameless Russians who will never see court. There was enough evidence in those cases there were charges laid against the hackers even if they will never see trial. Criminal charges. As for trump there was a great deal of evidence he was associated with the Russians. 4 of his staff went to jail for various lies or crimes they committed on his behalf that surfaced as a result of the investigation. Because the GOP chose to forgo their oaths and let Trump walk scot free does not mean there was no there there. Trumps cronies attempted to say the voting machine manufactures rigged the election. Making that claim has fallout and is liable if false. These corps care about their ability to continue to prosper more than rigging any election. Conflating what the the Sydney Powel said about this election and what was done post 2016 where actual charges were laid does not make sense. In one case they had enough evidence to proceed in court, in 2020 they never never did. Like I said we will see either way as they sue Sydney and she defends herself with evidence or she is ruined. Anyone who did what Trump did would be banned off any service with a TOS. Starting a riot is considered bad everywhere. Big tech is about making money, not politics. They silence the actual economic left as much as targeted groups on right and every time it is to protect profits and advertising. Look at any choice they ever make as financial and you will better understand their motivations. No one is silencing anyone, actually Trump still has more free speech than either of us. He can call a press conference any time. He has no right to anyone's service just like I have no right to use your backyard without your permission Even the standard actual free speech in the 1st has distinct limits. I can not yell fire in a crowded theater and neither can Trump.
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  41568. joe hilner I guess you have not noticed but we do have some now. We have establishment lackeys like Cory Booker spending a great deal of effort to pretend to be progressive, he is a liar and a shill but his simple attempt at mimicry speaks to a victory for changing the values of the party from the ground up. That he is disingenuous is irrelevant to the importance of him pretending to be populist. Unthinkable policies like Medicare for all now have majority support with more coming on daily due to pressure from an engaged base. These are just few examples of the rise in power promoting popular progressive ideas that have been entirely stifled by the corporatists in the past. There are many others, this is not to say the heart of the leadership is not still cancerous but they can be manipulated by a progressive base, the GOP can not. While this is happening these new brand of candidates for the democrats spread progressive 3rd party policies which in turn builds a larger constituency for the 3rd parties as formerly politically estranged people become involved and feel they have a voice in the process. Nothing is yet solved, we have not put one of these new brand of politicians in power yet but it is a statistical certainty we will. The ideas of the establishment democrats are not popular at the root and they are badly hobbled by their ties to donors who have demands. It makes their position innately weak against a populist candidate and they have held their seats to date by the controlling media and having way more money to buy ads while counting on low voter turnout. Against candidates that actually make you want to vote this is a losing strategy that can only hold so long. The establishment will continue to lose seats an an accelerating rate going forward as they have no good arguments toe to toe have been winning on name recognition alone. They will do this while grudgingly moving left as the base is now demanding. This is a fight worth trying because a quick look around proves it is already bearing fruit.
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  41633.  @jeremytee2919  I told you why, I am just pointing out that least they are not entirely intransigent. The key difference between them is one has a constituency that cares about meaningful policy and one does not. The dems are not acting and I am not pretending they will. But they are not openly and regressive either and are not planning on rolling us back to the 50's. Please note this is damning with very faint praise. You have me confused with a democratic supporter, I just recognize they are better than the GOP for a couple key reasons but share many failures. The point is under the current structure there is no reason to ever treat with republican's if you expect to pass popular policy. They are not interested in solving problems, what they are doing is just fine. As long as the dems do not fight or try the gop will sill be elected to plenty of seats even as they are the party of doing nothing. Except rolling things back and handing tax cuts to the richest at our expense. There are a handful of elect ed leaders that are unowned and not beholden to the establishment trough. I see no reason to single them out as failures when they are not burdened with our systems chief problem. That is our most of our leaders are for sale. I do not know what you are even proposing, our entre system is a shit stain with a handful of good actors in it. I am not sure what you are expecting from anyone. I get you see the dems are acting useless, that does not change the GOP is acting end democracy fascist.
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  41643.  @jeremytee2919  "legislators don’t require other legislators, to do their job." Perhaps do not lecture anyone on not understanding how congress works, you throw rocks from a paper thin glass house as you do. No congressmen can do anything significant alone. As stated over and over, she can not pass anything or enact new rules without the consensus of other members of congress. Your original complaint was AOC was not working justice reform with the GOP, a unworkable suggestion given their stands. What did Katie get passed? I can tell you what initiatives of hers they systematically blocked or paired down to be almost useless in the senate. But not what she got through. Whatever it is you imagine AOC can do would change NOTHING. We agree, Katie is a beast. But by any reasonable standard she does not get much done either. The corporate dems in conjunction with their allies the in the GOP ensure it. There is a good reason why Katie is attempting to move to the Senate. You have not told me what you expect from a single congress person outside an appreciation for some entertaining grand standing we both happen like. I have seen AOC do the same kind of performative things. Not as well as Katie, but Porter is pretty singular. I just do not get your hate, you seem lost in a corporate media narrative If I ever find myself nodding along with a main stream media I step back and revaluate my position. I suggest you may want to do something similar. You seem to be targeting arguably weak but workable allies in a sea of enemies that you could not miss if you fired blindly.
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  41682.  @waltermorales3084  I am not sure why you can make the assertion you do so boldly. Frankly we have barely began to fight and just this cycle we elected over handful of un-corrupted candidates on our first try. I am not convinced it can not be done as the "establishment" business as usual politicians policies are not popular and the movement to replace them will get stronger the longer it is in play and the more it leaks past the media filter trying to stop it. We can win by appealing to the mass of voters you just pointed at who stay home because they know the candidates they vote for are sellouts making their votes mostly meaningless. Driving down voter turnout serves the establishment nicely and to beat them all we have to do is run candidates that are genuine and clearly not in it for the big pay check that so many of our leaders work for. This has been hard to impossible in the past but since has been proven a viable path. This group will only get stronger as their voices are amplified by the winners who make it through. No one likes corruption and running against it makes impossible races possible. We do not even have to win every race to effect change as we drive all candidates against them further to left or face the danger of estranging the base that votes them in destroying them in the next cycle. I am not counting on wishful thinking and have put my effort in being part of a real solution. We are appealing to the large block of voters so disillusioned with our non choices they are no longer even voting. This is the key and only path I see to taking our system back. Hoping someone gets their ass in gear and prosecutes the blatant robbery that goes on behind closed doors in Washington is not a solution I expect to bear much fruit.
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  41735. John Smith We are responsible, but free speech does have limits. Yelling fire in a crowded theater and defamation are examples of speech that is not protected anywhere. No platform should be forced to carry anyone that is defaming others or making them a target for violence in their estimation. Everyone is responsible for their actions, this includes what you say and it is more than reasonable to hold you to account and limit your access to a service if you are acting in a way which is determined to promote harm by the provider. Jones has done this over and over and this incident alone probably does not warrant banning but added together with his record it is more than reasonable. He has no innate right to twitter. We do agree that their application of the TOS is not consistent. Google and Facebook have the same issue of TOS enforcement inconsistency. In spite of what right wingers will insist the targets are not political and are most often picked out by an algorithm meant to weed out specific content that breaks the TOS or pushes a hot seat issue they want to avoid because of feared bad press or loss of Ad revenue for the provider. Jones is a special case and became the poster boy for ugly speech and fake news and like him or hate him he had lots of warning, if you just look at the law suits against him alone it is clear his speech was going to get him in trouble. I will not shed a tear for him and I am surprised he was not banned sooner and they all would have if they applied their TOS evenly.
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  42065. Chris Moreau The wait time talking point you attempt to use has been debunked as spin. EVERY system rations care! It is just a matter of how, your system is rationed based on need and ours based on the size of your wallet. The wait times you refer to are for elective and non critical surgeries. There is no significant wait time on critical life or death issues and your wait times on critical care needs are not problematic. On the other hand the rich here can rapidly get hip surgeries and vasectomies while 45,000 Americans a year die because of a lack of any access care outside emergency room visits. 643,000 go bankrupt directly because of medical bills, 80 percent of which have insurance. Both of those numbers are zero in Canada. Let me use your numbers rounded flat as an example why your system makes sense. Your numbers above roughly show that for average earners of 50,000 they pay far less than the family in the US does, basically half. Lets say they save 3k (7,000 us (with huge deductibles - 4,000 cdn, no deductibles), that amounts represents 6% of their gross income, forget about the trouble if they need to access care. A quick look at difference between them and their more affluent Canadian and the American counterparts making 100k shows the Canadians pay 3% (8400 us (average us rate) - 11,400 cdn) more as percentage of their income than the Americans do. This does not take into account conversion which would make your numbers even better. Converted to American dollars you pay a pittance of what we do. It makes it clear those who make more can better afford to pay extra as the extra cost effects them less. If you need a MRI for cancer screening you can expect as rapid access as ours. If you are doing it for a sore knee then you may wait longer. I see this as a humane trade off that puts value of human life over earnings of those who are already doing really well and can afford pay a little more in taxes.
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  42133. John Smith The assertion that freedom for gay people restricts religious rights for others is total nonsense. The people in question are free to hate gay people all they want but the idea the state should be restricting their rights is untenable and that is why the courts ruled as they did. There is no scenario where the freedom to practice ones religion is restricted by any of these rulings. There is no case associated with this subject where ones religious rights are violated. Even in the edge case where bakers do not want to bake cakes for gay people no one is forcing them to do so unless they also want to sell to the public as a business. In this case it is their religious beliefs limiting them and like a Mennonite should never apply to drive a bus these people should not sell to the public as their religion dictates they can not serve all. The limitation should be theirs alone and that is how it was ruled. This is not a case where the law is being bent. It is being extended and applied to people not originally considered because of the time it was written in. The wording does leave it open to this interpretation and rolling back rights because they were not initially implicitly extended is a hard sell when it was your ideology which universally opposed them in the first place. This is a case where more rights are extended and no one lost a single right, there is no literally no down side to it except if it steps on your brand of bigotry and then it enrages you because the law no longer backs your spin. Sessions is an old school bigot who hates the civil rights act and everything it stands for. Trusting his proclamations to be come standard or long term law is not well founded because the arc of history has already made its call on this issue. Jeff and trumps push back is a failed bump on the road to the inevitable conclusions on gay and trans rights issues that are already decided in the rest of the first world.
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  42710. They are, they see all fundamentalists as lunatics and the moderates as poorly focused. They believe in freedom of religion for everyone because if you support attacking the right to follow one faith when you are anything but member of the status quo then you set yourself up to be attacked next. Freedom of religion means nothing if we let other brands fundamentalists limit it like they always want to. When your allies in attacking a brand of fundamentalists are fundamentalist too and you use their talking points it should be clear you are going the wrong way. The fact is fundamentalist christian groups have most of the same problems as their Islamic counterparts and are only tempered by the fact they are in secular society which curbs enacting fundamentalist policy unlike the dictatorships in the middle east. The only reason they are better is we force them to be or do not let them enact backward law. In the presence of secularism over time the majority of people consistently choose an ever more moderate versions of faith or none at all. In fact american non fundamentalist Muslims accept gay people at far higher rates than evangelical Christians do. This shows the real cancer of any faith is fundamentalism, this problem is exacerbated if they have the power to write law and that is part of the reason why the middle east is a giant shit show. Islam is not the problem per se, just like when Christianity had power to write law the places that still enforce religious edicts with state power are deeply backward.
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  42792.  @rayerickson7614  You should not be making up rules as you go along. There is no issue with getting the vaccine if you have had covid, there are no studies or literature suggesting this. It does work on the flu, pretending it does not is dishonest or deeply ignorant. Any vaccine is less effective against the flu because of the nature of that virus. That does not mean it does not work. Some types antibodies decrease in potency over time no matter if they are acquired though contact with the virus or through a vaccine that triggers their creation. Covid is one of those virus's, meaning a booster shot or reinfection will be required to maintain potency. This is pretty common and many vaccine's have booster shot requirements and this is well understood phenomena in the immunology community. Israel's numbers do not validate anything you stand for unless you spin them very specifically while ignoring key data points. Close to 90% of people aged 60 and older in the country have received their first dose of Pfizer’s 2-dose vaccine so far. Data collected by Israel’s Ministry of Health shows that there was a 41% drop in confirmed COVID-19 infections in that age group, and a 31% drop in hospitalizations from mid-January to early February. In comparison, for people aged 59 and younger — of which just more than 30% have been vaccinated — cases dropped by only 12% and hospitalizations by 5% over the same time. The death count is a quarter of what is was when everyone was unvaccinated in January. The hospitalisations are down compared to what they were to that same period when they were reporting the same number of cases. The 25% of the unvaccinated account for half of serious all cases in the hospital in Israel. There is no doubt the Israeli story promotes vaccines but highlights the fact the variant does not make them bullet proof and other measures like social distancing and masks continue to have value. The science is settled, understand you are inside a bubble that is propping up your own feelings. But the data, what we should use to make most important medical decisions is not with you. If you believe any random brand of media over what every health agency on the planet is saying you are not making a rational one.
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  42894. Blue Jay It is the misleading framing I object to. You blame Clinton and the democrats in general for deregulation of the banks conveniently forgetting they had a gop congress and senate that passed those bills. Ignoring that fact and putting it on the democrats alone is dishonest partisan nonsense of no value. You have every right to be more disappointed at the democratic failures because they were supposed to be better but that does not make them objectively worse by any normal standard. They would actually have to be worse or you would have to show how the GOP was better to make this assertion of yours stick. Look at history of the failed do nothing drug war which has imprisoned millions black people and shattered their families. This is owned by the GOP and was literally used as tool to attack constituencies that did not support them. Every step at deregulation or trade policy that saw outsourcing of the black communities manufacturing jobs was fully backed by the GOP. Every three strikes law, every expansion of the industrial prison complex, every cut to funding to help communities or pay education is always supported by the GOP. They have gerrymandered the districts to minimize the value of black votes while changing and wrote voter laws to disenfranchise them and stop them from voting entirely. This whole trope that the democrats are worse for black people is nothing but spin to help otherwise good people ignore every KKK member on the planet votes for the GOP and no one in the white supremacist movement has voted for a democrat since before desegregation. The spin that the dems are worse is directly from the mouth of clowns who spit racist tropes and ignore what group (conservatives) have systemically been at the root of the problems facing black people since the beginning even as the democratic establisghment were sometimes complicit as they chased the same money. The democrats have failed us all because they have sold out, but the GOP is fully owned. The democrats are the Washington generals to the GOP's Harlem globe trotters of corruptions and are therefore implicated in many of the economic failures they mutually push. That being said pretending the dems have been worse for the black community in the last 50 years is dishonest nonsense spin.
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  42923. @always happy Joe beat Paula with the DNC support. This is bizarre and speaks to establishment priorities. There is no justification for the DNC to support a republican running for office as a democrat. He beat a Paula Jean because the establishment media, all the corporate money and the party lined up behind Joe. His win is not a statement on the popularity of his ideas or what he stands for, it is basically built on misinformation, name recognition and buckets of corporate money dumped in a dishonest and misleading way backed by the party. He has consistently voted with the republican's on key issues, the party needs to throw this dino to the curb. If the people insist on supporting him as an independent that is one thing, the DNC doing so is entirely mindless and speaks the to fact they are paid to lose. No one on earth gets excited for what he stands for as he is a down the line donor shill and might as well be GOP given how he votes. If you support the GOP why vote GOP light? This kind of focus by the DNC is why the corporate dems consistently take a beating head to head in any contested state. Joe is taking a seat that should be held by a democrat but is given to a republican because the DNC is not about getting things done. They are there to collect bundled corporate cash to hand out to a political class that runs the party win or lose. There is no point in having 40 democrats if two of them insist on handing power to the GOP. This is while those in the GOP rarely step out of line at the risk of being removed next primary. The GOP has an edge as the playing field has been purposely rigged. Even when the democrats win they still lose and guarantee they get turfed next election as they get little done as per design.
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