Comments by "Historia, Magistra Vitae" (@Historia.Magistra.Vitae.) on "Was Fascism Left Wing Or Right Wing? Episode 2" video.

  1. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    6
  2. Reagan had no clue what he was talking about.
    4
  3.  @faketheo3432  "fascism ultimately diverged significantly from socialist and Marxist traditions." It never diverged from socialism, which is nothing more than an economic system where the collective (such as workers, guilds, the government etc.) either directly own or control the buildings and tools that make goods and services like farms and factories. This can be achieved through decentralized and direct worker-ownership, or through centralized state-ownership or control of the means of production. Fascists had the latter. On the contrary, it got more socialist as the time went on. When Mussolini was confined in Northern Italy as a puppet government for the Nazis in 1943, Mussolini promoted "socialization", under the Italian Social Republic. In early 1944, Mussolini's "socialization law" called for nationalization of industry that would pursue a policy where "workers were to participate in factory and business management."
    4
  4.  @faketheo3432  "Fascism is generally categorized as far-right due to its emphasis on nationalism, hierarchical social structures, and authoritarianism ... Moreover, fascism's strong focus on nationalism, militarism, and racial purity places it firmly on the right side of the political spectrum. " None of them have anything to do with Right wing of any kind. Nationalism and racial purity are forms of collectivism, advocated by the Left. Hierarchical social structures are part of every political ideology. Authoritarianism is only necessary under collectivist ideologies. Meanwhile people on the Far-Right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized.
    4
  5.  @faketheo3432  "and didn't aim to abolish private property or class distinctions," Private property wasn't a thing, as it was made conditional. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state. Class distinctions weren't an issue since Fascism rejected the Marxist idea of the "class struggle" and advocated for class collaboration under the iron boot of the State.
    4
  6.  @faketheo3432  " which are core goals of socialism. " Wrong. They are core goals of Marxism. Not socialism, which again, is an economic system and not an ideology with goals.
    4
  7.  @faketheo3432  "The state’s role in fascist economies was more about maintaining the existing class structure and avoiding class conflict, rather than achieving economic equality." Wrong. The State's role in the economy was neatly explained in "the Philosophy of Fascism" by Mario Palmieri (1936); "Fascism, which is the very antithesis of Individualism, stands as the nemesis of all economic doctrines and all economic practice of both the capitalistic and the communistic systems. Fascism holds that: 01. The economic life of man cannot be abstracted and separated from the whole of his spiritual life. In the words of Mussolini: “The economic man does not exist. Man is integral; he is political, economic, religious, saint and warrior at the same time.” 02. The economic life of man is influenced, if not actually determined, by idealistic factors. 03. True economic progress can derive only from the concerted effort of individuals who know how to sacrifice their personal egoism and ambitions for the good of the whole. 04. Economic initiatives cannot be left to the arbitrary decisions of private, individual interests. 05. Open competition, if not wisely directed and restricted, actually destroys wealth instead of creating it. 06. The wealth of a community is something intangible which cannot be identified with the sum of riches of single individuals. 07. The proper function of the State in the Fascist system is that of supervising, regulating and arbitrating the relationships of capital and labor, employers and employees, individuals and associations, private interests and national interests. 08. Class war is avoidable and must be avoided. Class war is deleterious to the orderly and fruitful life of the nation therefore it has no place in the Fascist State. 09. More important than the production of wealth is its right distribution, distribution which must benefit in the best possible way all the classes of the nation, hence, the nation itself. 10. Private wealth belongs not only to the individual, but in a symbolic sense, to the State as well. These fundamental tenets of Fascist economy derive in turn from those basic conceptions of the Fascist doctrine of the State which we have expounded in the chapter of the “Fascist State.” We have said there, in fact, that the Fascist State is a Sovereign State. This means that there cannot be any single economic interests which are above the general economic interests of the State, no individual, economic initiatives which do not fall under the supervision and regulation of the State, no relationships of the various classes of the nations which are not the concern of the State ... We see thus the Fascist State resolutely enter the economic field to dictate what shall be from now on the relationship between the capital and labor, employer and employees, landowner and farmhand, industrialist and worker."
    4
  8.  @faketheo3432  " Corporatism in fascism often benefited elites, not the working class." Wrong. Corporatism ("corporativismo" in Italian) was one of the cornerstone principles in Mussolini's fascism, and had to do with the way society and the economy would be organized, with state power at the head of a system of nationalized syndicates ("corporazione") representing each major industry. Mussolini's corporatist view stressed total state power over businesses as much as over individuals, via these governing industry bodies controlled by the Fascist party, in which businesses retained the responsibilities of property, but few if any of the freedoms. Sectors of the economy were divided into syndicates (which were nationalized Unions that then elected their own members into government as well as democratically run their workspaces. Each profession and field had their own Syndicate, which in turn, operated symbiotically with its composed members), whose activities and interactions were managed and coordinated by the government. The idea was to let the state control and direct the economy from the top-down without itself owning the means of production.
    4
  9. Wrong. Denying "class warfare" only makes you a non-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    3
  10. Wrong. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    3
  11. Wrong. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    3
  12. This "horseshoe theory" is not a thing. Extreme Right is Anarcho-Capitalism. Fascism was a socialist Far-Left ideology and came from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve Socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a Socialist Society.
    3
  13. "Fascism is right wing" Wrong. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    3
  14. "I dont like the tieing of Fascism to socialism. " By definition it was a socialist ideology. Socialism is an economic system where the collective (such as workers, guilds, syndicates, unions, the government etc.) either directly own or control the buildings and tools that make goods and services like farms and factories. This can be achieved through decentralized and direct worker-ownership, or through centralized state-ownership or control of the means of production. Fascist had the latter.
    2
  15. "Fascism has Never instilled any socially run economics, " Wrong. They did. They had a socialist Command economy via Corporatism ("corporativismo" in Italian), which was one of the cornerstone principles in Mussolini's fascism, and had to do with the way society and the economy would be organized, with state power at the head of a system of nationalized syndicates ("corporazione") representing each major industry. Mussolini's corporatist view stressed total state power over businesses as much as over individuals, via these governing industry bodies controlled by the Fascist party, in which businesses retained the responsibilities of property, but few if any of the freedoms. Everything was managed and coordinated by the government. The idea was to let the state control and direct the economy from the top-down without itself owning the means of production.
    2
  16.  @Pidgensarefake  "Fascism is the outcome of Capitalism in decay," Wrong. Fascism was the enemy of Capitalism. If anything, it was Marxist-Leninism in decay.
    2
  17.  @Pidgensarefake  "You can not be trying to equate fascism to the cause of the proletariat because inherently it goes against it to restore the old order in a new way." Nobody is arguing that Fascism was Marxism. They were two rival socialist ideologies.
    2
  18.  @Pidgensarefake  " that’s my point this fascism is not a socialist ideology. " And you are wrong. By definition it was a socialist ideology.
    2
  19.  @Pidgensarefake  "But inherently it goes against the ideology." Socialism is not an ideology, it is an economic system where the collective (such as workers, guilds, syndicates, unions, the government etc.) either directly own or control the buildings and tools that make goods and services like farms and factories. This can be achieved through decentralized and direct worker-ownership, or through centralized state-ownership or control of the means of production. Fascist had the latter.
    2
  20.  @faketheo3432  : Cope harder and go read some history, starting from these; [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] "The Birth of Fascist Ideology" by Zeev Sternhell [09] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    2
  21.  @Pidgensarefake  : Go read some history and stop coping like this other guy who has no clue what he is talking about, like you.
    2
  22.  @Pidgensarefake  " I just understand how fascism has been used by the current ruling parties in America as a weapon and see the propaganda." Oh honey, there is no Fascism of any kind in America. You people are so clueless. Please go study these before commenting anything about Fascism; [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] "The Birth of Fascist Ideology" by Zeev Sternhell [09] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    2
  23. Fascism had nothing to do with Right wing of any kind. It was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    2
  24.  @54032Zepol  : Nope. Go read some history.
    2
  25.  @romanempire8370  "Liberalism and democracy are closer to the far left then Fascism." Liberalism is a Far-Right ideology in our modern day political spectrum and Democracy is not an ideology in the first place, as it is a form of governance.
    2
  26.  @jtinalexandria  : Neither had anything to do with Right wing of any kind. Both were part of the 3rd position movement.
    2
  27.  @SingleMarketEnjoyer-ft8vc  : The origins of the Left/Right lead to France, however that has nothing to do with our modern day political spectrum and how it is used today. Unless you are suggesting that 99% of the modern day political ideologies are on the Left since ain't nobody advocating for Monarchism anymore, let alone Absolute Monarchism.
    2
  28. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    2
  29.  @MandyMoorehol  "Anarchism by definition is incompatible with capitalism. Anarcho- capitalism doesn’t exist sweetheart." Wrong. Anarchy generally refer to a stateless society, or a society without government. It doesn't specify any kind of an economic system, which is up to the society.
    2
  30. Wrong. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    2
  31. Umberto Eco strictly denies that Fascism is even an ideology, and his compiled list of "ur-fascist" characteristics are so vague and generic, that they can be applied to almost every single totalitarian and dictatorial regime. No historian takes this medieval hobbyist seriously. I would suggest studying actual Italian historians, such as Renzo De Felice and Emilio Gentile.
    2
  32. None of those 4 things listed have anything to do with Right wing. All of them are part of Collectivism, which is a Leftist trait.
    2
  33. Both Fascism and National Socialism are on the Right side of Marxism (adjacent), not on the Right side of the spectrum. Someone has to sit on the right side of the North Korean parliaments also, even though they have no Right wing.
    2
  34.  @faketheo3432  "never heard of anarchism or a class-less society, have you?" Anarchism is a form of governance, or lack there of. Generally refers to a stateless society, or a society without government. Even under it and classless Communism you can and eventually develop hierarchies, especially if democracy is involved as that immediately creates two classes; majority and minority.
    2
  35.  @faketheo3432  " I asked you for a single scholar who would approve of your left-right distinctions." If socialism is advocated by Left wing ideologies, then logic dictates that Capitalism is advocated by Right wing ideologies. You cannot be anti-capitalist Right winger, nor a Capitalist Left winger. You don't need a scholar for logical consistency.
    2
  36. Because he has nothing to do with the ideology whatsoever.
    2
  37. Wrong. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] "The Birth of Fascist Ideology" by Zeev Sternhell [09] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    2
  38. No. Centrism is what most of the modern day countries have now, such as Social-Democracy and Mixed economies in general.
    2
  39.  @MeanBeanComedy  : No. Fascism had a socialist Command economy via Corporatism (National Syndicalism).
    2
  40.  @faketheo3432  Wrong. The fundamental differences between left-wing and right-wing ideologies center around the the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left-wing beliefs are based on the notion that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized.
    2
  41. Wrong. Fascism was a very specific ideology based on National Syndicalism and Hegelian philosophy.
    2
  42. "and even worse that it seems you just skip over Ur-Fascism, probably because Umberto Eco very explicitly calls it a Right-Wing Ideology" Umberto had no clue what he was talking about and he specifically doesn't even regard Fascism as an ideology in the first place. Try some actual Italian historian, such as Renzo De Felice or Emilio Gentile.
    2
  43.  @scruffopone3989  " I like that you suggest one of the best thinkers of our time "had no clue what he was talking about"" He was nowhere near to be a "best thinker". He was merely a medievalist, not even a historian.
    2
  44. Fascism had nothing to do with Right wing of any kind. It was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    2
  45.  @FlyinJMan  : Yes it was.
    2
  46. Actually Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    2
  47. All of them were socialist Far-Left ideologies.
    1
  48. "I’ve always thought that the political right and left are two sides of the same coin, " They are not. This "horseshoe theory" is not a thing.
    1
  49. Well, individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state. “The Fascist State directs and controls the entrepreneurs, whether it be in our fisheries or in our heavy industry in the Val d'Aosta. There the State actually owns the mines and carries on transport, for the railways are state property. So are many of the factories… We term it state intervention… If anything fails to work properly, the State intervenes. The capitalists will go on doing what they are told, down to the very end. They have no option and cannot put up any fight. Capital is not God; it is only a means to an end.” — Benito Mussolini, As quoted in Talks with Mussolini, Emil Ludwig, Boston, MA, Little, Brown and Company (1933)
    1
  50.  @TenebrisNatus  "The core of fascist ideology is anti socialism, " Wrong. Fascism was never anti-socialist. They were specifically anti-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  51.  @TenebrisNatus  " Hitler openly declared that what he called “socialism” was not socialism, " Wrong. Hitler declared that his National Socialism was "the socialism" and the only "proper" socialism. This conversation has nothing to do with Hitler though.
    1
  52.  @TenebrisNatus  "because it was not collective ownership of the means of production. " Wrong. It was. Government controlled the means of production.
    1
  53.  @TenebrisNatus  "Fascism was deeply opposed to collective ownership, and maintained private property." Wrong. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state.
    1
  54.  @romanempire8370  "If Statism is your definition of left wing then would you consider Augustus far left? " Statism is just one manifestation of the core part of Left wing, that is, Collectivism.
    1
  55.  @romanempire8370  "Their economic system, corporatism was based on what the Catholic Church promoted during the 19th century (Is Catholicism far left?)." Theocracies aren't any different from Absolute Monarchies and one-party dictatorships in general. It's about how much government control there is, not which book they claim to get their authority from.
    1
  56.  @romanempire8370  "Taking inspiration from Soreal, which according to you is marxist (which contradicts your acknowledgement of Fascist opposition to marxism btw)" Sorel's revision of Marxism broke the necessity of the link between revolution and working class, opening up the possibility of replacing the proletariat with the national community. Many revolutionary syndicalists followed Sorel and his Sorelian socialism towards the allure of a radical nationalism after he praised Maurras and displayed his sympathies for French integral nationalism in 1909. The appeal that Charles Maurras presented was his nationalistic approach against bourgeois democracy, the Enlightenment, and "its liberalism, its individualism, and its conception of society as an aggregate of individuals." This trend continued and by 1911, revolutionary syndicalists had acknowledged that two important political currents had come together, forging "a new nationalism and revolutionary socialism." This coalescence finally surfaced as a major facet of Italian Fascism, where Mussolini himself confessed: "What I am, I owe to Sorel." This integration of syndicalism with nationalism was a factor in why Italian revolutionary syndicalism became the backbone of fascist ideology.
    1
  57.  @romanempire8370  "Capitalism and marxism both have internationalism as a core element, which if you still go by a left V Right dichotomy, makes them both left wing while Fascism Right wing." The fundamental differences between left-wing and right-wing ideologies center around the the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left-wing beliefs are based on the notion that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized.
    1
  58.  @romanempire8370  "Only in the mind of mentally ill left wingers," Wrong. By definition. Liberalism as it was put forth by John Locke, was based on the idea that the sole purpose of the Government was to protect people's lives, liberty and property. That's about it. Liberalism advocates for free market and laissez-faire economics and civil liberties under the rule of law, with special emphasis on private property, individual autonomy, limited government, economic freedom, political freedom and freedom of speech. In practice, this would result in a Minarchist society / a Night-watchman State.
    1
  59.  @romanempire8370  "And if we go by "modern day" we imply a subjectivity to politics, " No, we do not. What is meant by "modern day" is the simple fact that socialist ideologies are accepted to be on the Left. This runs contrary to the historical idea (French Revolution) of the left/right as the Left was represented by people who were in favor of individual freedoms, property rights and republicanism for example.
    1
  60.  @romanempire8370  "But somehow you think hes on team left." That is because Maurrassisme was in opposition to democracy, liberalism and capitalism.
    1
  61.  @romanempire8370  "Wrong, it's about Hierarchy vs equality." Every single political ideology has hierarchies, some more and some less. They are always present. Regarding equality, what kind? Right is about the equality of opportunity, while the Left is about equality of outcome i.e. equity. The latter also needs enforcement from an authority of some kind since you cannot have such equality without limiting freedoms and liberties of people.
    1
  62.  @romanempire8370  "Because by your definition, the Medieval Kingdoms and Church, Napoleon, the Roman Empire, etc.. are all left wing." They were, as they opposed everything that the modern day Right wing advocates for. Also Absolute Monarchies and Theocracies worked very similarly to socialist one-party dictatorships.
    1
  63.  @romanempire8370  "Do you consider a BLM person on the same team as a Monarch or a Nationalist? I hope not, because if you do, then you need help." BLM person generally is a militant Marxist, who is a collectivist and against individual rights and freedoms. Their modus operandi doesn't differ from that of a Monarch or a nationalist... you either bent the knee to their collective subset of beliefs or else.
    1
  64.  @romanempire8370  "With your approach we will never get out of the current predicament in the west, because you still think inside the box that is provided by the societal establishment." Except I'm against this current "societal establishment". It needs to come down, and be made as small as possible, just like governments in general.
    1
  65.  @romanempire8370  "That's another reason why capitalism and communism are two sides of the same coin." The difference between Capitalism and Communism is the simple fact that the former is the natural state of man, as Capitalism is just the result of free humans making voluntary exchanges with one another in the absence of outside coercion. Meanwhile Communism is something that needs to be enforced upon people.
    1
  66. No.
    1
  67.  @KSmithwick1989  : Franco had his own ideology, reformed Falangism. It wasn't the same as Fascism but both of them fought under the same banner, known as 3rd positionism.
    1
  68.  @SingleMarketEnjoyer-ft8vc  : No. The fundamental differences between left-wing and right-wing ideologies center around the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left-wing beliefs are based on the notion that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized.
    1
  69.  @TenebrisNatus  "The core of fascist ideology is anti socialism, " Wrong. Fascism was never anti-socialist. They were specifically anti-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  70.  @TenebrisNatus  " Hitler openly declared that what he called “socialism” was not socialism, " Wrong. Hitler declared that his National Socialism was "the socialism" and the only "proper" socialism. This conversation has nothing to do with Hitler though.
    1
  71.  @TenebrisNatus  "because it was not collective ownership of the means of production. " Wrong. It was. Government controlled the means of production.
    1
  72.  @TenebrisNatus  "Fascism was deeply opposed to collective ownership, and maintained private property." Wrong. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state.
    1
  73. The fundamental differences between left-wing and right-wing ideologies center around the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left-wing beliefs are based on the notion that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the Right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized. - The more Right you go, the more individual rights and liberties are allowed, hence resulting in an economic liberalization and eventually, Laissez-faire. - The more Left you go, the more collectivism is unleashed upon the society, hence resulting in an economic centralization and usually Socialism.
    1
  74. Indeed. Also for reference; [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  75.  @gs7828  : There is no such thing as "social right". They belong to the Conservatism vs. Progressivism spectrum. They do not exist on the political left/right spectrum.
    1
  76. @giovannipanzeri6431 "Right wing, as was Nazism of course, " Wrong. Not only has this topic nothing to do with National Socialism but also by definition, National Socialism was a totalitarian Far-Left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on ethnonationalism trying to supersede Marxism as the most common socialist ideology. They had nothing to do with Right wing of any kind. You cannot be an advocate for centralized planning and strong government controls without being a socialist. That's what made Hitler a socialist. He may have been to the right from the Bolsheviks, but he was still a socialist leftist as he believed in strong central government control. Hitler outright declared himself a socialist in Mein Kampf, just not the Marxist international or full Soviet type. He struggled with HOW to distinguish his socialism from the rest of the Marxist crowd.
    1
  77. @giovannipanzeri6431 "Nazism retained “socialist” in the name and an apparently “pro-worker” rethoric in order to attract working class voters from the real socialist parties and members" They retained “socialist” in the name because they were advocating for socialism on a national level, or "socialism in one country" as Stalin would put it. "The first three principles were clear, and they are inseparable from each other. Socialism as the final concept of duty, the ethical duty of work, not just for oneself but also for one’s fellow man’s sake, and above all the principle: Common good before own good, a struggle against all parasitism and especially against easy and unearned income. And we were aware that in this fight we can rely on no one but our own people. We are convinced that socialism in the right sense will only be possible in nations and races that are Aryan, and there in the first place we hope for our own people and are convinced that socialism is inseparable from nationalism. (Loud applause) To be nationalist does not mean for us to belong to one party or another, but to show with every action that one benefits the people; it means love for all the people without exception.From this point of view we will realize that it is necessary to preserve the most precious thing a people has, the sum of all active creative powers of its workers, to keep it healthy in body and soul.(Cheers) And this view of nationalism compels us to immediately form a front against its opposite, the Semitic conception of the idea of people (Volk), and especially against the Semitic concept of work. Since we are socialists, we must necessarily also be antisemites because we want to fight against the very opposite: materialism and mammonism. (Lively bravo!) And when today the Jew still runs into our factories and says: How can you be a socialist antisemite? Are not you ashamed? – there comes a time in which we will ask: How can you not be an antisemite, being a socialist! (Hear, hear) There comes a time when it will be obvious that socialism can only be carried out accompanied by nationalism and antisemitism. The three concepts are inseparably connected. They are the foundations of our program and therefore we call ourselves National Socialists. (Cheers)" — "Why We Are Anti-Semites" (August 15, 1920 speech in Munich at the Hofbräuhaus).
    1
  78. Nope. That is not how the spectrum works.
    1
  79.  @TenebrisNatus  "The core of fascist ideology is anti socialism, " Wrong. Fascism was never anti-socialist. They were specifically anti-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  80.  @TenebrisNatus  " Hitler openly declared that what he called “socialism” was not socialism, " Wrong. Hitler declared that his National Socialism was "the socialism" and the only "proper" socialism. This conversation has nothing to do with Hitler though.
    1
  81.  @TenebrisNatus  "because it was not collective ownership of the means of production. " Wrong. It was. Government controlled the means of production.
    1
  82.  @TenebrisNatus  "Fascism was deeply opposed to collective ownership, and maintained private property." Wrong. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state.
    1
  83.  @TenebrisNatus  "government doesn’t equal collective." Government is one form of a collective, as by definition, a collective is a group of entities that share or are motivated by at least one common issue or interest or work together to achieve a common objective.
    1
  84.  @TenebrisNatus  " If a state is authoritarian, it’s not collective." Wrong. How such entity acts has nothing to do with it being a collective or not.
    1
  85.  @TenebrisNatus  "Nazi Germany was an authoritarian state, not a democracy." It was a socialist one-party dictatorship, yes.
    1
  86.  @TenebrisNatus  "The core of fascist ideology is anti socialism, " Wrong. Fascism was never anti-socialist. They were specifically anti-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  87.  @TenebrisNatus  " Hitler openly declared that what he called “socialism” was not socialism, " Wrong. Hitler declared that his National Socialism was "the socialism" and the only "proper" socialism. This conversation has nothing to do with Hitler though.
    1
  88.  @TenebrisNatus  "because it was not collective ownership of the means of production. " Wrong. It was. Government controlled the means of production.
    1
  89.  @TenebrisNatus  "Fascism was deeply opposed to collective ownership, and maintained private property." Wrong. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state.
    1
  90. Wrong. So called "Extreme Far-Right" is Anarcho-Capitalism. Meanwhile Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  91. Fascism can only be Far-Left, as it was a socialist ideology. However it was strictly a rival socialist ideology to Marxism / Communism.
    1
  92. So called "Extreme Far-Right" would be Anarcho-Capitalism. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  93. By definition, Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  94.  @L14MA  : Yup. Go read some history.
    1
  95.  @L14MA  : What "academics" ? The loonies in America? If you want to know what the fascists actually did while in power then I suggest reading from actual Italian historians, such as Renzo De Felice and Emilio Gentile.
    1
  96.  @L14MA  "makes its pretty obvious its right wing, especially in relation to the way European political science defines left and right. " The fundamental differences between left-wing and right-wing ideologies center around the the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left-wing beliefs are based on the idea that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized.
    1
  97.  @L14MA  "rather than using the consensus that political science academics use" They use the "horseshoe theory" which has been disproven.
    1
  98.  @L14MA  "They don't use horseshoe theory. The consensus is that Fascism is right wing. That's the facts. " By definition they use the "horseshoe theory" if they think both the Left and the Right are advocating for totalitarian collectivism, and socialism.
    1
  99.  @L14MA  "Is Emilo Gentile part of the consensus academics that I shouldn't use or does he get the tick of approval from you? " Emilio Gentile has never said that Fascism is on the Right.
    1
  100.  @L14MA  "It makes me think you don't even know what your own suggested sources say. " My sources specifically say that Fascism was a socialist ideology, based on National Syndicalism and Hegelian philosophy. This is also said by Giovanni Gentile himself. “The Fascist, on the other hand, conceives philosophy as a philosophy of practice (”praxis”). That concept was the product of certain Marxist and Sorellian inspirations (many Fascists and the Duce, himself, received their first intellectual education in the school of Marx and Sorel)—as well as the influence of contemporary Italian idealistic doctrines from which Fascist mentality drew substance and achieved maturity.” “It is necessary to distinguish between socialism and socialism—in fact, between idea and idea of the same socialist conception, in order to distinguish among them those that are inimical to Fascism. It is well known that Sorellian syndicalism, out of which the thought and the political method of Fascism emerged—conceived itself the genuine interpretation of Marxist communism. The dynamic conception of history, in which force as violence functions as an essential, is of unquestioned Marxist origin. Those notions flowed into other currents of contemporary thought, that have themselves, via alternative routes, arrived at a vindication of the form of State—implacable, but absolutely rational—that finds historic necessity in the very spiritual dynamism through which it realizes itself.” Che cosa è il fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche (“What is Fascism?”) (Origins and Doctrine of Fascism), Florence: Vallecchi, (1925)
    1
  101.  @L14MA  : "Yeah but does he say it's left wing?" When an ideology is based on socialism, run by a socialist and wants to do socialism better than other socialist ideologies out there, it should be rather obvious that it was Left wing.
    1
  102.  @L14MA  "They weren't socialists, " Wrong. By definition they were, and according to their own very words and beliefs.
    1
  103.  @L14MA  " they rejected almost every aspect of the economic and class analysis aswell the internationalist perspectives that socialists have." They rejected the aspects that Marxists have, not socialists in general.
    1
  104.  @L14MA  " It's why they didn't call themselves socialists but called themselves fascists to differentiate themselves from socialists." Mussolini called himself a socialist multiple times and that their movement was advocating for socialism.
    1
  105.  @L14MA  "Ffs Mussolini prisoned and killed the socialists." So did the Bolshevik regime and every single socialist one-party dictatorship. Your point being?
    1
  106.  @L14MA  " (I'm guessing you're conservative or American libertarian). " Neither. I'm an European Minarchist, who advocates for Liberalism, as it was put forth by John Locke and later by Adam Smith etc. I'm the epitome of an Anti-Fascist.
    1
  107. Both Fascism and National Socialism were totalitarian Far-Left, socialist ideologies ... or whatever side you want to put socialism on.
    1
  108. French didn't have Liberalism though.
    1
  109.  @dirtydeeds4free553  While true, the Liberty part was a British thing thanks to John Locke. The French had the equity part thanks to Jean-Jacques Rousseau, who could be considered to be a "proto-socialist".
    1
  110. "Socialism does NOT mean state ownership." Wrong. Socialism is an economic system where the collective (such as workers, guilds, the government etc.) either directly own or control the buildings and tools that make goods and services like farms and factories. This can be achieved through decentralized and direct worker-ownership, or through centralized state-ownership or control of the means of production.
    1
  111.  @TenebrisNatus  "Collective doesn’t equal state." Still wrong. State is a form of a collective by definition.
    1
  112.  @TenebrisNatus  "Socialism can exist without a state," Sure it can. Have never said otherwise.
    1
  113. The so called "horseshoe theory" is a lie and not how our modern day political spectrum works.
    1
  114. Fascism being a socialist ideology based on revolutionary National Syndicalism, it can only be Far-Left.
    1
  115.  @MandyMoorehol  : Nope.
    1
  116.  @TenebrisNatus  "The core of fascist ideology is anti socialism, " Wrong. Fascism was never anti-socialist. They were specifically anti-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  117.  @TenebrisNatus  " Hitler openly declared that what he called “socialism” was not socialism, " Wrong. Hitler declared that his National Socialism was "the socialism" and the only "proper" socialism. This conversation has nothing to do with Hitler though.
    1
  118.  @TenebrisNatus  "because it was not collective ownership of the means of production. " Wrong. It was. Government controlled the means of production.
    1
  119.  @TenebrisNatus  "Fascism was deeply opposed to collective ownership, and maintained private property." Wrong. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state.
    1
  120.  @TenebrisNatus  "Hitler is clearly in favour of private property’s" Wrong. Hitler and NSDAP abolished private property rights via Reichstag fire decree on February 28, 1933. When the government has total control and can legally seize your property if it's used in a manner they dislike, it is not private property ownership? You are not the arbiter of what to do with your own stuff. You are merely a manager of government property, and merely so long as the government permits it.
    1
  121.  @TenebrisNatus  " for Hitler, socialism is an aryan ethnostate, not collective ownership." ethnostate is a collective. Socialism is an economic system where the collective (such as workers, guilds, the government etc.) either directly own or control the buildings and tools that make goods and services like farms and factories. This can be achieved through decentralized and direct worker-ownership, or through centralized state-ownership or control of the means of production. National Socialists had the latter.
    1
  122.  @TenebrisNatus  "The core of fascist ideology is anti socialism, " Wrong. Fascism was never anti-socialist. They were specifically anti-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  123.  @TenebrisNatus  " Hitler openly declared that what he called “socialism” was not socialism, " Wrong. Hitler declared that his National Socialism was "the socialism" and the only "proper" socialism. This conversation has nothing to do with Hitler though.
    1
  124.  @TenebrisNatus  "because it was not collective ownership of the means of production. " Wrong. It was. Government controlled the means of production.
    1
  125.  @TenebrisNatus  "Fascism was deeply opposed to collective ownership, and maintained private property." Wrong. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state.
    1
  126. "On the level of class fascism and socialism are deeply antagonistic they are polar opposite. Fascism wants to defend the current order of the oligarchy at all costs and socialism wants to remove the oligarchy at all costs." You are conflating socialism and Marxism. They are two different things. Socialism is an economic system where the collective (such as workers, guilds, the government etc.) either directly own or control the buildings and tools that make goods and services like farms and factories. This can be achieved through decentralized and direct worker-ownership, or through centralized state-ownership or control of the means of production. Fascism as a socialist ideology, had the latter.
    1
  127.  @MWhaleK  " It is very much right wing " Wrong. Both Italian Fascism and German National Socialism were socialist Far-Left ideologies. They had nothing to do with Right wing of any kind whatsoever.
    1
  128.  @MWhaleK  "Which is exactly contrary to what experts on the subject say as well as the fact that Neo-Nazi, the Nazi curious, White supremacists and all the various groups that share large chucks of their ideology with Nazis support Right wing parties." Nope. It is not and they share no such thing.
    1
  129.  @MWhaleK  "Maybe try reading the Wikipedia articles on Fascism and the German National Socialist" They are wrong, which is why I gave you a list of actual historical books to read.
    1
  130.  @MWhaleK  " (the Socialist German Workers Party, which actually was neither socialist" Wrong. When it comes to National Socialism, it was a totalitarian Far-Left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on ethnonationalism trying to supersede Marxism as the most common socialist ideology. They had nothing to do with Right wing of any kind. You cannot be an advocate for centralized planning and strong government controls without being a socialist. That's what made Hitler a socialist. He may have been to the right from the Bolsheviks, but he was still a socialist leftist as he believed in strong central government control. Hitler outright declared himself a socialist in Mein Kampf, just not the Marxist international or full Soviet type. He struggled with HOW to distinguish his socialism from the rest of the Marxist crowd.
    1
  131.  @MWhaleK  "how they want after trade/Labor Unions and actual socialists " Every single socialist one-party dictatorship did the exact same thing. Ever heard of the Bolsheviks and their October Revolution? and about the Great purge which came after? In fact, both Hitler and Mussolini were simply imitating Lenin, who had earlier closed down all independent labor associations, factory committees and worker cooperatives, banned strikes, walkouts, and lockouts. Lenin even forced workers to work a slavish 80-hour week. After the Bolsheviks banned all labor unions, one unionist “described the unions as ‘living corpses.’” Any Russian worker who participated in general strikes was arrested, imprisoned or shot. Under Lenin’s regime, workers had no real representation or bargaining rights and were treated like industrial serfs who were chained to their factories. Although Hitler and Mussolini followed Lenin’s nationalizing craze, their treatment of workers did not mimic their Russian counterparts.
    1
  132.  @MWhaleK  "as referenced in the famous "first they came for.." Poem by Pastor Martin Niemöller, " That poem doesn't speak about socialists at all, for obvious reasons as Nazis were one. The poem starts with the Communists, as Nazis were a rival socialist ideology to Marxism.
    1
  133.  @MWhaleK  "Bring the recites and offer some facts/evidence to back up your claim." Fascism; [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] "The Birth of Fascist Ideology" by Zeev Sternhell [09] Any work from Emilio Gentile National Socialism; [01] "Mein Kampf" & "Zweites Buch" by Hitler [02] "Hitler's National Socialism" by Rainer Zitelmann [03] "the Vampire Economy" by Günter Reimann [04] "Omnipotent Government: The Rise of the Total State and Total War" by Ludwig Von Mises [05] "Hitler's True Believers" by Robert Gellately [06] "Backing Hitler" by Robert Gellately [07] "The Cause of Hitler's Germany" by Leonard Peikoff [08] "Hitler's Beneficiaries" by Götz Aly
    1
  134.  @MWhaleK  "also as I recall Fascism explicitly started as an attempt to fuse Right wing and left-wing ideologies. " Wrong. It was a revolutionary National Syndicalist movement, and offshoot from Marxism. It had nothing to do with Right wing of any kind whatsoever.
    1
  135.  @MWhaleK  "Mussolini and Gionvanni Gentile even described their Ideology as Right wing in their Political essay "The Doctrine of Fascism"." Wrong. They say no such thing in their 'Doctrine of Fascism'. They say the exact contrary, that Fascism was about National Syndicalism, that Marxism was doing socialism wrong and they wanted to fix it. “The Fascist, on the other hand, conceives philosophy as a philosophy of practice (”praxis”). That concept was the product of certain Marxist and Sorellian inspirations (many Fascists and the Duce, himself, received their first intellectual education in the school of Marx and Sorel)—as well as the influence of contemporary Italian idealistic doctrines from which Fascist mentality drew substance and achieved maturity.” _“It is necessary to distinguish between socialism and socialism—in fact, between idea and idea of the same socialist conception, in order to distinguish among them those that are inimical to Fascism. It is well known that Sorellian syndicalism, out of which the thought and the political method of Fascism emerged—conceived itself the genuine interpretation of Marxist communism. The dynamic conception of history, in which force as violence functions as an essential, is of unquestioned Marxist origin. Those notions flowed into other currents of contemporary thought, that have themselves, via alternative routes, arrived at a vindication of the form of State—implacable, but absolutely rational—that finds historic necessity in the very spiritual dynamism through which it realizes itself.” _ — Giovanni Gentile, Che cosa è il fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche (“What is Fascism?”), Florence: Vallecchi, (1925)
    1
  136.  @TenebrisNatus  "unlike capitalism which is an economic oligarchy." Wrong. Capitalism is just the result of free humans making voluntary exchanges with one another in the absence of outside coercion.
    1
  137.  @metatronyt  : Certainly not a bad video, however there are many key elements you could have introduced here, like Georges Sorel and how his National Syndicalism greatly influenced Mussolini, not forgetting Gabriele D'Annunzio. Also the many syndicalists who worked with Mussolini, such as Alceste De Ambris & Filippo Tommaso Marinetti, Sergio Panunzio, Alfredo Rocco, Edmondo Rossoni etc. Also how Fascism still appealed to Marxists, one major one being Nicola Bombacci .... also I would consider it rather criminal, that you didn't include anything from Renzo De Felice or Emilio Gentile in this video. 😄
    1
  138. Nope. Fascism was a very specific ideology based on National Syndicalism and Hegelian philosophy.
    1
  139.  @faketheo3432  "False dichotomy and converse fallacy." How exactly?
    1
  140.  @faketheo3432  "You're assuming only 2 options (socialism or capitalism) exist," Mixed economies are still a thing, which are closer to the center.
    1
  141.  @VroomVroom-fn6og  : Keep coping.
    1
  142.  @VroomVroom-fn6og  : Go read some history. The book list is above somewhere.
    1
  143.  @VroomVroom-fn6og  Keep coping and again, read some history. I can put the book list here if you are too lazy to look it up. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  144. Fascism is easy to define though.
    1
  145. Nazism, Communism and Fascism were all different socialist ideologies though.
    1
  146. Fascism is not on the rise, anywhere.
    1
  147. What is happening in the American Government is pretty much the opposite of both Fascism and Nazism.
    1
  148. Wrong. Fascism was a very specific political ideology. It was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  149.  @jesustyronechrist2330  " But not every single fascist is an Italian Fascist. ... So conflating Italian Fascism as THE only true representation of fascism while not even coining a separate word for the other types of fascism is really misleading. " Fascism specifically refers to the Italian movement. If you want to talk about ideologies that are similar, then the correct word for such ideologies would be Neo-Fascism or 3rd positionism in general.
    1
  150.  @jesustyronechrist2330  " You could at least call it "ur-fascism" or something." Umberto Eco's ramblings are not a thing.
    1
  151. Need to point out that Fascism actually didn't allow free enterprise nor any kind of Market based economy. They strictly had a Command economy, as neatly put in "the Philosophy of Fascism" by Mario Palmieri (1936); "Fascism, which is the very antithesis of Individualism, stands as the nemesis of all economic doctrines and all economic practice of both the capitalistic and the communistic systems. Fascism holds that: 01. The economic life of man cannot be abstracted and separated from the whole of his spiritual life. In the words of Mussolini: “The economic man does not exist. Man is integral; he is political, economic, religious, saint and warrior at the same time.” 02. The economic life of man is influenced, if not actually determined, by idealistic factors. 03. True economic progress can derive only from the concerted effort of individuals who know how to sacrifice their personal egoism and ambitions for the good of the whole. 04. Economic initiatives cannot be left to the arbitrary decisions of private, individual interests. 05. Open competition, if not wisely directed and restricted, actually destroys wealth instead of creating it. 06. The wealth of a community is something intangible which cannot be identified with the sum of riches of single individuals. 07. The proper function of the State in the Fascist system is that of supervising, regulating and arbitrating the relationships of capital and labor, employers and employees, individuals and associations, private interests and national interests. 08. Class war is avoidable and must be avoided. Class war is deleterious to the orderly and fruitful life of the nation therefore it has no place in the Fascist State. 09. More important than the production of wealth is its right distribution, distribution which must benefit in the best possible way all the classes of the nation, hence, the nation itself. 10. Private wealth belongs not only to the individual, but in a symbolic sense, to the State as well. These fundamental tenets of Fascist economy derive in turn from those basic conceptions of the Fascist doctrine of the State which we have expounded in the chapter of the “Fascist State.” We have said there, in fact, that the Fascist State is a Sovereign State. This means that there cannot be any single economic interests which are above the general economic interests of the State, no individual, economic initiatives which do not fall under the supervision and regulation of the State, no relationships of the various classes of the nations which are not the concern of the State. ... We see thus the Fascist State resolutely enter the economic field to dictate what shall be from now on the relationship between the capital and labor, employer and employees, landowner and farmhand, industrialist and worker." They also point this out in their very "Doctrine of Fascism"; "Fascism is definitely and absolutely opposed to the doctrines of (classical) liberalism, both in the political and the economic sphere .... The Fascist State lays claim to rule in the economic field no less than in others; it makes its action felt throughout the length and breadth of the country by means of its corporative, social, and educational institutions, and all the political, economic, and spiritual forces of the nation, organized in their respective associations, circulate within the State. "
    1
  152. " It has left wing policies, but uses right wing ideology." Fascism had nothing to do with Right wing of any kind. It was strictly a socialist Far-Left ideology.
    1
  153. "Yes, Fascism is fundamentally Right and communism is Left, " No. Fascism is Far-Left. Communism is Extreme Left. They are two rival socialist ideologies.
    1
  154.  @faketheo3432  : Somebody has to teach these people about historical facts. I guess it has to be me.
    1
  155.  @scruffopone3989  "Not the militarism, the emphasis of state violence over people that are deemed degenerate, the hyper nationalism that can't help but wage war on their neighbours, the divisive language that is designed to pit citizens against each other regardless of similar economic problems." All of these are the fruits of Collectivism.
    1
  156. Wrong. Only the socialist Left can become Fascist, as Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  157.  @shadowdante1102  : You need to cope harder than that.
    1
  158.  @shadowdante1102  : Keep coping.
    1
  159.  @shadowdante1102  Nope. Cope harder.
    1
  160. "but not time doing that with the similarity between right wing and Fascism which their are many, " There are none.
    1
  161.  @samtotheg  : Both of them were devout socialists i.e. Far-Left.
    1
  162. "Personally, right wing equates to the belief in the legitimacy of racial stratification/hierarchy as a concept and the pursuit of imperialism. Where left wing polices are defined by class stratification (and class war/struggle) and internationalism. " What is the point of defining Left/Right this way, when none of the mainstream political ideologies in any country align with these things? or alternatively, by this logic, only Marxism is on the Left and rest of the ideologies are on the Right.
    1
  163. It's not rocket science. The fundamental differences between Left wing and Right wing ideologies center around the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left wing beliefs are based on the notion that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the Right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized. - The more Right you go, the more individual rights and liberties are allowed, hence resulting in an economic liberalization and eventually, Laissez-faire. - The more Left you go, the more collectivism is unleashed upon the society, hence resulting in an economic centralization and usually Socialism.
    1
  164. Wrong. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  165.  @stefanodadamo6809  " To you everything Statist is "far left"." Not necessarily. The fundamental differences between left-wing and right-wing ideologies center around the the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left-wing beliefs are based on the notion that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized.
    1
  166.  @stefanodadamo6809  "Fascism was far right, period. " Wrong. Again, Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  167. The thing is, there are no actual Fascists nowadays. It's a dead ideology.
    1
  168. Wrong. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  169. What you are referring to is called Authoritarianism or Totalitarianism, depending on the degree of control.
    1
  170.  @GreatSageSunWukong  : They are indeed, except Liberalism which is the opposite of Authoritarianism/Totalitarianism.
    1
  171.  @GreatSageSunWukong  : That wasn't Liberalism though, the ideology put forth by John Locke. What Pinochet did was called "neoliberalism" which has very little to do with actual Liberalism funnily enough.
    1
  172. He never left the left.
    1
  173. "Taxation is theft, unless you’re getting something for it. Then it’s called trade." Wrong. Taxation is enforced. Trade is voluntary.
    1
  174.  @scruffopone3989  "Ur-Fascism isn't that big of an essay, I recommend actually reading it." All the points he made in his essay are vague and generic, and could be applied to most totalitarian and dictatorial regimes. None of them are unique to Fascism.
    1
  175. Wrong. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  176.  @ERRATAS0707  : Wrong. Nothing to do with Right wing of any kind. Go read some history.
    1
  177. "right wing fascist" Doesn't exist. Fascists were Far-Left socialists.
    1
  178.  @TenebrisNatus  "The core of fascist ideology is anti socialism, " Wrong. Fascism was never anti-socialist. They were specifically anti-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  179.  @TenebrisNatus  " Hitler openly declared that what he called “socialism” was not socialism, " Wrong. Hitler declared that his National Socialism was "the socialism" and the only "proper" socialism. This conversation has nothing to do with Hitler though.
    1
  180.  @TenebrisNatus  "because it was not collective ownership of the means of production. " Wrong. It was. Government controlled the means of production.
    1
  181.  @TenebrisNatus  "Fascism was deeply opposed to collective ownership, and maintained private property." Wrong. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state.
    1
  182. Not exactly. 3rd positionism specifically rejected Capitalism, but also Marxist interpretation of socialism i.e. the "class warfare". 3rd positionism was a socialist Far-Left movement, just not a Marxist movement.
    1
  183. " If that was the case, what was the need to ideologically differentiate between the two in the first place?" I Am no Metatron, however I can still answer to some of these. Fascism was of the opinion, that Marxism was doing socialism wrong. That the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its "dictatorship of the proletariat" cannot achieve Socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a Socialist Society. “Class war, cannot be more than a transitory episode of the life of a people. It cannot be a daily phenomenon, because it would mean in the end the destruction of all wealth.. . . The mistake of Marxism is that of believing that a nation is made of two classes only. A mistake even greater is that of believing that these two classes are in a perpetual state of war. There may be, it is true, contrast of interests, but it cannot be more than transitory; it can never be systematic. This systematic antithesis, which has furnished the basis for all socialistic theories is not a fact but an assumption. Its place has to be taken by collaboration.” - Mussolini, speech on 20th of December, 1923
    1
  184. " Why would these two ideologies be placed on the far ends of the spectrum if they were one and the same?" The "Horseshoe theory" is a lie. Fascism was a Far-Left ideology while Communism is an Extreme Left ideology. Fascism is adjacent to Marxism as they are two rival socialist ideologies.
    1
  185. "Fascism is far-right, socialism is left-wing or far-left." Wrong. Socialism is not an ideology, however it is used by Left wing ideologies like Fascism, which was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] "The Birth of Fascist Ideology" by Zeev Sternhell [09] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  186. "TL;DR: Fascism is capitalism in decay" Wrong. Fascism was the enemy of Capitalism. If anything, Fascism was Marxism in decay as it was a response to failing Marxist-Leninism.
    1
  187.  @Communism_Inc._official  "The fascists disbanded independent unions and worker’s organisations," They nationalized those unions and transformed them into state run syndicates/guilds. Speaking of unions, Mussolini was simply imitating Lenin, who had earlier closed down all independent labor associations, factory committees and worker cooperatives, banned strikes, walkouts, and lockouts. Lenin even forced workers to work a slavish 80-hour week. After the Bolsheviks banned all labor unions, one unionist “described the unions as ‘living corpses.’” Any Russian worker who participated in general strikes was arrested, imprisoned or shot. Under Lenin’s regime, workers had no real representation or bargaining rights and were treated like industrial serfs who were chained to their factories. Although Mussolini followed Lenin’s nationalizing craze, his treatment of workers did not mimic their Russian counterparts.
    1
  188.  @Communism_Inc._official  "killed, imprisoned or exiled every genuine socialist they could find, " Just like the Bolshevik regime before him... during and after the October Revolution.
    1
  189.  @Communism_Inc._official  "I have also extensively explained why Mussolini was NOT a socialist(he was expelled from the Italian Socialist Party)" You are wrong. Mussolini was a socialist by definition. He started out as a Marxist and switched to revolutionary (national) syndicalism when he figured that Marxism doesn't work. Regarding his expulsion; “Do not believe, even for a moment, that by stripping me of my membership card you do the same to my Socialist beliefs, nor that you would restrain me of continuing to work in favor of Socialism and of the Revolution.” — Benito Mussolini, Speech at the Italian Socialist Party’s meeting in Milan at the People’s Theatre on Nov. 25, 1914. “You cannot get rid of me because I am and always will be a socialist. You hate me because you still love me.” — Benito Mussolini, As quoted by Mussolini after he was expelled from the Italian Socialist Party in 1914. 1910s
    1
  190.  @Communism_Inc._official  "TL;DR: Fascists lie all the time, so don’t cite them," So does every socialist. Should never read any of their work.
    1
  191. @Communism_Inc._official "and free the world from capitalism." That is what the Fascists tried to do.
    1
  192.  @ShogunLazo  "corporatism is leftwing ? What happened to the unions ? What happened to the workers ? What happened to government programs for said people ? ." Yes, Left wing. Corporatism ("corporativismo" in Italian) was one of the cornerstone principles in Mussolini's Fascism, and had to do with the way society and the economy would be organized, with State power at the head of a system of nationalized syndicates ("corporazione") representing each major industry. Mussolini's corporatist view stressed total State power over businesses as much as over individuals, via these governing industry bodies controlled by the Fascist party, in which businesses retained the responsibilities of property, but few if any of the freedoms. Each profession and field had their own Syndicate, which in turn, operated symbiotically with its composed members, whose activities and interactions were managed and coordinated by the Government. The idea was to let the State control and direct the economy from the top-down without itself directly owning the means of production.
    1
  193.  @ShogunLazo  "... Come on now I know you're probably a right winger but to pain fascism as some left wing thing ..." There is nothing to paint. It is a historical fact that Fascism was a socialist Far-Left ideology based on revolutionary National Syndicalism. Both Mussolini and the philosopher behind his ideology, Giovanni Gentile, were very open about this fact. To put it simply, Fascism was a synthesis of anti-materialist socialism and nationalism.
    1
  194.  @ShogunLazo  " If all this was true he should have allied with Stalin and the socialist block, " Why? They represented the wrong type of socialism i.e. Marxism and the "class warfare". Same can be asked if Mensheviks, Trotskyists and other Russian communists were socialists, why didn't they ally themselves with the Bolsheviks?
    1
  195.  @ShogunLazo  "why would the Germans even take you in when socialist and communists were seen lower then Jews" Not sure what the German National Socialists have to do with this, but they had no problems with socialism either. It was Marxism they despised. "It is not Germany that will turn Bolshevist but Bolshevism that will become a sort of National Socialism. Besides, there is more that binds us to Bolshevism than separates us from it. There is, above all, genuine revolutionary feeling, which is alive everywhere in Russia except where are Jewish Marxists. I have always made allowance for this circumstance, and given orders that former Communists are to be admitted to the party at once. The petit bourgeois Social-Democrat and the trade-union boss will never make a National Socialist, but the Communist always will. ... Our spirit is so strong, and the power of our magnificent movement to transform souls so elemental, that men are remodeled against their will. ... A social revolution would lend me new, unsuspected powers. I do not fear permeation with revolutionary Communist propaganda." — Attributed by Hermann Rauschning in Hitler Speaks (1940) also known as The Voice of Destruction
    1
  196. Neither National Socialism nor Fascism had anything to do with centrism. Both were socialist and totalitarian Far-Left ideologies, and rivals to Marxism.
    1
  197. So by this logic, every capitalist ideology would be on the Left then?
    1
  198. "Fascism’s one unique characteristic is its antipathy towards collectivist government, socialism and communism." Wrong. Fascism was a socialist and collectivist ideology and had a socialist and collectivist government. They had no problems with those two. They did reject Communism though, as Fascism came from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its "dictatorship of the proletariat" cannot be achieved, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State.
    1
  199. Except Fascism was strictly anti-capitalist, and a socialist Far-Left ideology.
    1
  200.  @heisvi9317  "You can say Communism and Fascism are offshoots of liberalism" No. They are the enemies of Liberalism.
    1
  201. By modern standards, Fascism was a socialist Far-Left, totalitarian ideology as it was a rival ideology to Marxism.
    1
  202.  @zuzz2216  Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  203.  @zuzz2216  " its core principles—such as nationalism, corporatism, class collaboration, and the use of state power to uphold existing hierarchies" Nothing to do with Right wing of any kind whatsoever. Nationalism is a form of collectivism, advocated by the Left. Nationalism is devotion to the State which sees all other states as inferior and in competition. Right wing ideologies do not embrace Nationalism, but rather Patriotism. In all Right wing ideologies, the Individual is superior to the State. Corporatism ("corporativismo" in Italian) was how Fascists organized their socialist economy, and it was one of the cornerstone principles in Mussolini's fascism, and had to do with the way society and the economy would be organized, with state power at the head of a system of nationalized syndicates ("corporazione") representing each major industry. Mussolini's corporatist view stressed total state power over businesses as much as over individuals, via these governing industry bodies controlled by the Fascist party, in which businesses retained the responsibilities of property, but few if any of the freedoms. Class collaboration was their collectivist method to put everyone under the iron boot of the State apparatus. As Mussolini himself neatly put it; "“The State exists for all the people, but is also above the people, and, if necessary, against the people. . . . It is against them whenever they attempt to place their particular interests above the general interests of the Nation. ... It is the purpose of Fascism to unify the Nation through the sovereign State, the State which is above all and can be against all, because it represents the moral continuity of the Nation. Without State there is no Nation.”"
    1
  204.  @zuzz2216  "—clearly position it within the right-wing spectrum, both economically and socially. " That is not how the left/right spectrum works. The fundamental differences between left-wing and right-wing ideologies center around the the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left-wing beliefs are based on the notion that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized.
    1
  205.  @zuzz2216  "Georges Sorel's move to the right indicates a departure from leftist principles rather than a continuation of them - I do feel weird I have to point that out haha" Sorel never moved to the Right. He was always a socialist leftist, and in the end he ran back to Marxism.
    1
  206. Fascism is actually on the Far-Left, while Communism is on the Extreme Left. They were rival socialist ideologies, as Fascism came from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve Socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a Socialist Society.
    1
  207. " italian cspitalism ( quite primitive to be honest) thrived under Musdolini. " Wrong. There was no Capitalism of any kind under Fascism. They had a strictly socialist Command economy where the State controlled and directed the economy, from top down
    1
  208. "fascism wasn't collectivist," Wrong. Fascism specifically was a collectivist ideologies.
    1
  209. "but rather based on the medieval concept of "corporazione"." That is Collectivism. Corporatism ("corporativismo" in Italian) was how they managed their socialist economy, and one of the cornerstone principles in Mussolini's fascism, and had to do with the way society and the economy would be organized, with state power at the head of a system of nationalized syndicates ("corporazione") representing each major industry. Mussolini's corporatist view stressed total state power over businesses as much as over individuals, via these governing industry bodies controlled by the Fascist party, in which businesses retained the responsibilities of property, but few if any of the freedoms.
    1
  210. "However racism (in bolshevism let’s call it) is not an essential part of the ideology whereas it is in fascism. " It wasn't part of Mussolini's Fascist ideology. It was part of Hitler's National Socialism however.
    1
  211. When it comes to the Left/Right spectrum; The fundamental differences between left-wing and right-wing ideologies center around the rights of individuals vs. the power of the collective. Left-wing beliefs are based on the notion that society is best served with an expanded role for the collective in-group (collectivism). People on the Right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized. - The more Right you go, the more individual rights and liberties are allowed, hence resulting in an economic liberalization and eventually, Laissez-faire. - The more Left you go, the more collectivism is unleashed upon the society, hence resulting in an economic centralization and usually Socialism.
    1
  212.  @TenebrisNatus  "The core of fascist ideology is anti socialism, " Wrong. Fascism was never anti-socialist. They were specifically anti-Marxist. Fascism was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  213.  @TenebrisNatus  " Hitler openly declared that what he called “socialism” was not socialism, " Wrong. Hitler declared that his National Socialism was "the socialism" and the only "proper" socialism. This conversation has nothing to do with Hitler though.
    1
  214.  @TenebrisNatus  "because it was not collective ownership of the means of production. " Wrong. It was. Government controlled the means of production.
    1
  215.  @TenebrisNatus  "Fascism was deeply opposed to collective ownership, and maintained private property." Wrong. Individual ownership rights were understood to be strictly subordinate to collective discipline. It was not the individual ownership of property that concerned Fascists, but its subordination to collective control. Property was understood to perform social functions rather than to manifest individual rights. It was clear that the conception of property as a social function was broad enough to include socialization of the means of production, should that be required by the national interests as interpreted by the state.
    1
  216. "It's Right wing." Wrong. Fascism had nothing to do with Right wing of any kind whatsoever. It was a totalitarian far-left, socialist 3rd position ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. It rejected individualism, capitalism, liberalism, democracy, and marxist interpretation of socialism ("class warfare"). Instead, it advocated for class collaboration where the means of production was organized by national worker syndicals (i.e. trade unions / Fascist Corporatism), and the guiding philosophy of the state was Actual Idealism (Neo-Hegelianism). Being an outgrowth of Sorelian Syndicalism, (which itself was an outgrowth from Marxist socialism), its idea was that society would be consolidated (i.e., incorporated) into syndicates (in the Italian context, fascio/fasci) which would be regulated by and serve as organs for the State, or "embody" the State (corpus = body). The purpose was the centralization and synchronization of society under the State, as an end unto itself. To quote Mussolini's infamous aphorism: "All within the State, nothing outside the State, nothing against the State." As finalized by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile ("the Doctrine of Fascism"), Fascism comes from the belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a socialist society. Therefore, Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State. [01] "La Dottrina Del Fascismo / the Doctrine of Fascism", by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile [02] "Che cosa è il Fascismo: Discorsi e polemiche / Origins and Doctrine of Fascism", by Giovanni Gentile [03] "the Philosophy of Fascism", by Mario Palmieri [04] "Fascism: An Informal Introduction to Its Theory and Practice", by Renzo De Felice [05] "Mussolini's Intellectuals", by A. James Gregor [06] "La Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni", by Rabaglietti Giuseppe & Sergio Panunzio [07] "Teoria generale dello Stato Fascista", by Sergio Panunzio [08] Any work from Emilio Gentile
    1
  217. Conservatism is a completely different thing though, and doesn't exist on the left/right spectrum.
    1
  218.  @abramgaller2037  : Before and during the French Revolution, yes ... however that is something which cannot be applied globally as there are no single set of policies regarded as conservative because the meaning of conservatism depends on what is considered traditional in a given place and time.
    1