Comments by "Scented-leaf Pelargonium" (@scented-leafpelargonium3366) on "Middle East Eye"
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@worshipthecreator9081 In the Bible, where the origin of the Jews is recorded, and the territories in which they lived, the line of descent is patrinlineal, or through the father.
However, there were proselytes from the nations who were Gentile converts who joined the people of Israel and worshipped the God of Israel, and these people got circumcised and were considered part of Israel, before the advent of Christianity when a much wider Gentile majority began to worship the LORD God of Israel through their belief in the Israeli Jew Yeshua, whose Name they later changed to "Jesus," thus the need to convert as before to Israel was lessened.
A person who converts to Judaism today also must go through full circumcision (if male) and keep the Jewish laws, and are regarded as Jewish as far as religious observance is concerned, although some purists will still discriminate against them as not being "racially" Jewish.
However, there are many strands of Judaism today, some more conservative than others, whilst others are more liberal and accepting, such as having women rabbis and accepting gay Jews.
Where did you get your information for your claim that a person who converts to Judaism is not classed as a Jew? When I lived in Israel as a non-Jew from Northern Ireland for 10 years, I applied for citizenship but was turned down, however, the rabbis who check for Kosher observance from the hotel where I worked as a chef told me that I could stay in the country if I converted to Judaism or married a Jewish woman, as a non-Jewish spouse can reside there.
This shows that Gentiles do get accepted in Israel and within Judaism under certain criteria, and even non-Jewish partners of gay people intending to marry can gain full Israeli citizenship.
I wonder if people who convert to Islam are classed as Arabs, or do they discriminate too? 🤔
As like the Jews, the Arabs are a race or a people as opposed to just being a religion.
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@almas806 What the UN says is only an opinion. The Hamas Charter is the one Israelis know about as it declares the full destruction of the State of Israel, so just because people or a people create a Charter does not mean that it is righteous. A charter is just a piece of paper.
Israel only gained extra territory after the Arabs launched attacks on them, and when the Arabs lost, they lost territory as a result. Thus hatred and violence of the "other" by the Arabs has created much of the misery and so-called "occupation" that the Palestinian and former Jordanian Arabs (in Jerusalem & the "West Bank"/Judea) later found themselves in. Before 1967, Jerusalem and Judea, re-named "West Bank" to cover up the territory's Jewish links, was under illegal occupation by the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan.
Prior to 1948 the whole country, including Transjordan, was governed or "occupied" by the British from 1917. Prior to 1917, the territory was occupied by the Turks, ruled from Constantinople, now Istanbul, so there have been many "occupiers", but no complains until the Jews came into the predominance, after being a vilified minority there for centuries.
What there hasn't ever been in history is an "Arab sovereign state" of Palestine. Even prior to 1948, both Jews and Arabs were "Palestinian," the term never applying solely to the Arabs.
Thus the UN Charter concering the "Palestinians" teachically includes those Jewish citizens too. The use of the name by the Arabs today helps to delegitimise the Jews rights to citizenry.
The only reason any Jews began to seek refuge in Palestine from the 1890's onwards was because of the persecutions, pogroms and discrimination meted out to them in the Christian and Muslim nations to where they had been scatttered since being ethically cleansed from their land by Europeans from Rome in 135 CE, culminating in the Germans killing six million of them.
The UN were not calling for THAT persecuted people to offer resistance, but ignored it! 🤯
No nations accepted them, and even in their ancient Biblical homeland they were unwanted by their own Semitic cousins, the Arabs. Technically it is the ancient land of Israel and Judea that is "occupied" by Arabs from Arabia who crossed the porous borders taking advantage of the Jewish land and empty cities after the Jews had been expelled, and now they claim it as their own.
That is why so many "Arab" towns and cities like Bethlehem & Nazareth all have ancient Hebrew place names. They cannot even pronounce "Palestine" as there is no "P" in the Arabic alphabet.
So the Jews are an occupied people too, and it goes back further than just a few generations.
The oldest Charter that outlines the rights of the Jews to the land of Israel is the Holy Bible.
In its pages there is a complete history of how it came into their possession replete with pronouncements by God to make it official, while the Arabs dwelt in oil-rich Arabia.
But now the Arabs want Judea too, believing that the Jews have no rights anywhere.
This is not how their forefather Abraham treated his two sons from whom the Jews and Arabs descend as he was fair to both, allotting land to both peoples, who had Twelve Tribes each, of Ishmaelites and Israelites. The Arabs got a vast area, while the Jews only got a tiny parcel of land.
Still, it is that tiny parcel of land, that was negleected for centuries, that the Arabs suddenly want to rule with the world denigrating the Jews (what's new) and favouring the Arabs to found a Jew-free Apartheid Arab-only Islamic Caliphate called Palestine with Jerusalem as its capital.
You can kiss those Holy Land Tours goodbye if that happens, along with religious freedoms for Jews and Christians. Just check any Islamic country in the region to check out that reality.
The UN was basically formed because of situation in the Holy Land, and now it has become the Judge. Also the one-sidedness of that organisation against Israel is radically hostile to the Jews.
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@mimoiah No, are you justifying terrorists who end up in Israeli jails?
I have seen those rocks that teenagers hurl, and they are small boulders. Believe me if one of those hit your narrowminded head it would kill you. It is a lethal weapon. The best way to keep out of jail is not to commit actions of violence and terrorism (and then blame the authorities for detaining them!)
Why would people be arrested without commiting any crime? I lived in Israel and commited no crime, hence I was not arrested or detained. However, I know people in my home country of Northern Ireland who have commited terrorism with bombs and bullets, killing and maiming indiscriminately out of hatred, and as a result many of them get arrested and sent to prison.
I witnessed many such incidents perpetrated by Arabs out of pure hatred for the Jews.
There are two jurisdictions in Israel and the Palestinian territories, so Israel may detain people who commit violence against them, but that does not give them rights to hold trials for people from another jurisdiction, however the Islamic courts will not try a criminal for attacking Israel!
The Arab hate for the Jews long precedes the State of Israel, and they even descend from two twin brothers, Jacob and Esau, who even struggled with each other in the womb! That's hate!
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@markwoodstock1112 Confusion and mistakes can happen in a fraught atmosphere of continual conflict (I know from living in Northern Ireland), so what you are saying can obviously occur, so I wouldn't be blind enough to ignore fault, but the bigger picture is an entire society bent on the destruction of another, by whatever means, including online delegitimisation and history revisionism, which does as much damage as any physical war or attacks or bombs.
There were many IRA terrorists jailed in Belfast without trial, and innocents caught up in the meleè, so the phenomenon is not unique to Israel. Have you ever srutinised the prisons of China or Russia with as much humanitarian care, or is it critiquing Israel that is your only interest?
If the tables were turned, how do you think the Israelis would fare being locked up in an Islamic Arab Palestinian jail no matter their offence? Would they have justice, and equality and concern for their humanitarian rights? If they hate Jews as it is, how would they treat them in jails? 🤔
You seem to think that Israelis are the only ones who ever do anything wrong. Is that true?
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@intalmdr4627 Most of those "children" are late teens, 16 & 17 years old, not all infants. The people in Gaza are not against Hamas commiting atrocities against innocent Israeli civilians (unprovoked) so by proxy they bring much sorrow upon their own heads, even though it is not the Israeli objective to kill or harm civilians, athough the biased media always portrays it as such.
The rejoicing and dancing among Palestinians after such atrocities shows that they support such terror. It is Hamas who govern Gaza and are responsible for syphoning off money for their military apparatus and the building of tunnels and thousands of lethal rockets instead of improving infrastructure, education, healthcare and not having enough food or fuel reseves to last more than a few days, yet the world blames Israel for the Gazan's daily deprivation. 🙃
The Palestinians did nothing to deserve this (apart from supporting Hamas and hating Israel), however the world blames Israel for all their woes and lets Hamas off Scot-free. 🤯
Also Gaza is bordered by TWO countries, and Egypt blockades Gaza more than Israel, as at least Israel lets everything through in normal "peace time", except for stuff that could be used to destroy Israel, which I think any nation next to a hostile enemy would be vigilent about.
Any of these crimes committed by Russia by any chance or are you only focussed on Israel? 🤔
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@annadentis9743 I'm sure you will find the same in Israel. It is a democracy like America. If the US detained a terrorist from Iraq in their prison system and the prisoner was released still harbouring anti-American sentiment even though he was treated humanely, and went back to his culture in Iraq where anti-American sentiment was very high, would that prisoner tell the Iraqis and those who hate America there that the Americans treated him with the utmost care and manners and that everything about his detention was positive and without fault, or would he say that they treated him not fairly because he is Iraqi and because he is a Muslim in satanic America?
Obviously released Palestinian prisoners are not going to praise their captors, especially if their reason for being detained in the first place was to do harm to Israelis out of hate.
Another side to this conflict is the war of words and propaganda, and if one little lie, untruth, exaggeration or embellishment has success travelling the globe on social media it helps the cause probably more successfully than any terror attacks or physical warfare on the ground.
Sometimes you have to take some accounts of terrorists and criminals with a pinch of Dead Sea salt rather than impugning the legal system of a recognised democracy on that account.
It is obviously in the interests of the Arab convicts to say anything to condemn Israel.
Motives must always be borne in mind. An Arab terrorist is more likely to say negative things about Israel as the hatred is already embedded and it fits their agenda to lie about the Jews.
On the other hand, what is there to gain from the Israeli legal system if they arbitrarily mistreat, torture and persecute political prisoners, as they know that any reports of such will damage the image of Israel's society at large? The truth will always come out in the end, but sometimes the lies that are believed can cause irreparable damage. We must not take everything at face value.
That's what God gave us discernment for. Not just to blindly believe one side that you favour.
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@bubullibooooo9928 Jesus, or YESHUA as He was named by His Father the LORD God of Israel, which means "salvation" ("Jesus" means nothing in any language), taught to love and forgive, not to boycott, but love your enemies, not hate them. ❤❤❤
He was not a non-Semitic Philistine, which is where the name "Palestine" comes from, as the Philistines were the ancient and implacable enemies of the Israelites as the Holy Bible records, and they dwelt in PHILISTIA, the narrow coastal strip of land where Gaza is today, which is not the territory that Yeshua lived in. He was and still is a circumcised Jew born in the land of Israel.
Anything else is Arab propaganda and impugns the Word of God as revealed in the Scriptures.
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