Comments by "Sandy Tatham" (@sandytatham3592) on "Middle East Eye"
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@DunkmeisterFresh : I suggest you learn more about how the new nation-states of Israel, Jordan, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon and Syria were established out of the DEFEAT of the Ottoman Empire in 1918. Due to the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, the Arabs gained self-determination over more than 99% of the Middle East land. The Jews were recognised in 1920 by the League of Nations (today's UN) as the indigenous people of historic Palestine and they were permitted to establish a secure homeland there, on less than 1% of the ME land, under the condition that all non-Jews have 'equality under the law'. Those Arab families who ACCEPTED the Jewish state of Israel in 1948 today comprise 21% of Israeli citizens who have 'equality under the law'.
Those who REJECTED Israel and stood on the side of the seven Arab nations which went to war against Israel to obliterate it are the so-called 'Palestinians' we see today who are still being used as "weapons" against the Jews. It's time they stopped playing victim. We should support them being relocated to third countries if they are still HOSTILE to the Jews, or if they are fed up with their corrupt terrorist leaders. The key to this horrible problem is that the Arab League forbids giving citizenship to the 'Palestinians' because they are still being used to continue the efforts to obliterate Israel. Thankfully this is all changing with the #AbrahamAccords and the fact that Islam is losing power all over the world.
I would absolutely not hesitate to move if China invaded my country, Australia!!! I'm not interested in playing the 'victim'. I would happily begin a new life in a supportive country. I would be grateful that I was safe and secure. I'm not interested in revenge or 'an eye for an eye' which is the code that the Qur'an promotes to Muslims. It also sickens me that Muslims are obligated by Qur'an 2:191 to "drive them [the Jews] out from where they drove you out...". Thankfully a growing number of Muslims now openly reject parts of Islam, and we are seeing big changes in the Middle East.
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@Hanan Albataineh: Thousands of people leave Gaza and the West Bank every day to work in Israel. They need permits and security clearance because there is a huge terror risk in Israel which saw 19 people being killed recently, including Arab Muslim Israeli citizens. The so-called 'Palestinians' do have access to water but it's controlled by their corrupt leaders who are millionaires or even billionaires and who do little for their people. Some of their leaders live safely and luxuriously in Qatar and Turkey, where their children go to expensive private schools.
Gaza is not occupied but it is under siege by Israel and Egypt because it harbours probably the largest number of Islamic jihad organisations in the world. You might call this jihad terror a form of 'resistance'. Others call it a high security risk.
There is no 'Palestine' under international law. The Palestinian leaders have rejected EVERY offer of a peace plan, and seven Arab nations went to war to obliterate the new state of Israel in 1948–49, 1956, 1967, 1973, 1982, and 2006. These Palestinian Arabs do not recognise the state of Israel. Around 20% of Israeli citizens are Arab Muslims whose families DID ACCEPT life under Israeli rule in 1948. Today they live with equal rights under the law.
Many Arab nations no longer actively support the 'Palestinian' resistance movement, as we see with the #AbrahamAccords. The victim status can only be perpetuated for so long, particularly when we see the corruption of all of the leaders.
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@Hanan Albataineh: What is Hezbollah resisting? Do they disagree with the legitimacy of the state of Israel? Which country will they go for next? They sound like criminal thugs to me. We all know that there are peaceful ways to deal with things that you don't believe are legal.
When the Ottoman Empire was DEFEATED and collapsed in 1918, Arabs of the Middle East were granted self-determination over 99+% of the Ottoman Empire Middle East land, in today's Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia and Jordan. In 1920 at the San Remo Conference, the League of Nations (today's UN) recognised the Jews as the indigenous people of 'historic Palestine'. They were given permission to form their own nation-state in 'historic Palestine', providing that equal rights were given to the non-Jewish people who were also living there at the time. This has clearly been done. Today Israel has over two million Arab non-Jewish citizens. There are Arab Israelis in the Knesset, in security, in the IDF, in the Supreme Court, and in the top levels of industry, education, technology and science. They have equal rights under the law.
Even though the same international agreements created Syria, Iraq, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia and Jordan, it is only Israel that is still struggling to be secure on less than 1% of that collapsed Ottoman Empire land. They didn't 'steal it'. That's a lie that unhappy Muslims appear to spread. They want to perpetuate the status of 'victimhood' for Muslims. It's sickening.
What is your personal stake is in this conflict? Do you live there? Do you also believe in resisting things that are deemed legitimate under law? Do you want to perpetuate 'victimhood' rather than supporting ALL people in finding a better life?
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@lifeisreallyshortknowyourr4724 : So I didn't "misquote from the Qur'an" but I forgot to provide the 'conditions' upon which the Holy Land was promised to them? Where are these 'conditions' stated? Aren’t Allah's promises eternal? I understand that the Qur'an affirms the Torah, so where is there any evidence that it was ever changed? Please educate me. I've found many prominent Muslims and Muslim scholars who strongly believe that Jerusalem belongs to the Jews. [Note: I'm not religious, so none of this is a personal belief of mine.]
This is from an article by Dr Qanta Ahmed...
"But as a believing Muslim observing Islam, I am compelled by the Quran to support Israel’s sole claim to the Holy Land; the Quran says it is so. The 80,000-word document 1.6 billion Muslims accept as the revealed word of God, the Quran, is categorical about the destiny of Israel and the people who can claim its ownership.
The Quran states: “Moses said to his people: O my people! Remember the bounty of God upon you when He bestowed prophets upon you, and made you kings and gave you that which had not been given to anyone before you amongst the nations. O my people! Enter the Holy Land which God has written for you, and do not turn tail, otherwise you will be losers.”
Nowhere does the Quran make mention of the Muslims’ claim to the Holy Land. Instead, God reveals in the Quran that The Holy Land is designated for the followers of Moses. Because the Promised Land is theirs according to the Quran, only the followers of Moses may determine where their capital must lie."
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@Hanan Albataineh: I'm very sorry for those families who were exiled. I would say this occurred mostly on the basis of religion, not race, because Islam obligates Muslims to fight against the Jews. And remember that 850,000 thousand Jews were also expelled from their multi-generational homes in Arab countries where they were no longer safe. Wars are horrible. But you have to get on with your life and stop playing the #victim 73 years later.
Millions of people have been 'displaced' over the last 100 years due to the creation of new nation states. The creation of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan saw 13 million South Asian Hindus, Sikhs, Buddhists and Christians fleeing, leaving behind property, in fear of their lives or of being raped. China persecuted the Tibetans in the 50s and an estimated 150,000 peaceful Tibetan Buddhists fled from their homeland and an estimated 87,000 were killed. The creation of Turkey saw in 1922 a vast population exchange of around 1.6 million Greeks and 400,000 Muslim Turks. And what happened to the 40 million Kurds who also have a claim for their own nation?
Can you tell me why today we only focus on the #Palestinian problem? Why does this get special UN funding and so much publicity?
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@soniahemmati2372 : I get where you are coming from regarding Arabs also being considered indigenous, but it's not my rule. It's the League of Nations who recognised the Jews as the indigenous people of historic Palestine, deserving of the right to return to their ancestral homeland (San Remo Resolution of 1920). The Arabs were granted the right to self-determination over the REMAINING collapsed Ottoman Empire, comprising more than 99% of that land. Those Arabs who currently lived in historic Israel were to be guaranteed equal citizenship to the Jews, and that's the situation today where Arabs sit in the Knesset, in the highest places in judiciary, health, education, technology and business, as well as the security services. If the Arabs had not conducted a war of aggression against the Jews in 1948, during which thousands of Palestinian Arabs fled to Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon and Syria hoping to return within days after the Jews had been obliterated, we might have seen more of an equal demographic balance today.
As for the Golan Heights, they contain over 100 ancient synagogues and are therefore considered part of historic Israel, though some deal was made by Britain with France at the end of WWI to tack that area onto the French Mandated area of today's Syria. I'm not interested in the Bible but in the archaeological evidence for the traditions of the Jewish people dating back thousands of years, certainly predating that of the Arabs. The Golan Heights was only annexed by Israel AFTER the wars of aggression against them by Arabs. This has validity in international law. I stand for the rights of all indigenous peoples where pragmatic to have sovereignty in their own ancestral lands, so long as equal rights are granted to others who currently live there. I am disappointed that the Kurds were not granted the right to self-determination in their ancestral homeland by the League of Nations conference in 1920. Do you support indigenous rights in principle?
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