Comments by "Historia, Magistra Vitae" (@Historia.Magistra.Vitae.) on "The Majority Report w/ Sam Seder" channel.

  1. Nothing to do with Right wing of any kind. All of those 3rd position movements were Far-Leftists, and socialists to boot.
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  2.  @orphaotheseeker2770  "who thinks anything the government does is "socialism"." Wrong. If the government directly owns or controls the means of production, distribution and exchange of goods, then it is socialism by definition.
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  3.  @orphaotheseeker2770  "Here he is saying the super conservative catholic church who supported fascist regimes like Francos Spain was "leftist"." It is called Collectivism. Every religious group wanting to use the State apparatus to force their views are part of that Leftist trait. Meanwhile, people on the right believe that the best outcome for society is achieved when individual rights and civil liberties are paramount (individualism) and the role — and especially the power — of the government is minimized.
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  4.  @orphaotheseeker2770  "Are you claiming that the government is the same as "a community"?" They most certainly are. Government is the very representative of the community called nation. Socialism is an economic system where the collective (such as workers, guilds, the government etc.) either directly own or control the buildings and tools that make goods and services like farms and factories. This can be achieved through decentralized and direct worker-ownership, or through centralized state-ownership or control of the means of production.
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  5.  @orphaotheseeker2770  "Your stubborn insistence doesn't change the reality that fascism is right wing. " Still wrong and has nothing to do with me. Fascism was a totalitarian Far-Left, socialist ideology based on National Syndicalism which they adapted from a French Marxist, known as Georges Sorel. Nothing to do with Right wing of any kind.
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  6.  @orphaotheseeker2770  "Scholars, academia and everyone who isn't part of the cult of property (libertarians/Objectivists) agrees with me. " Well of course other socialists, Marxists especially would deny the connection. Fascists were part of the cult of anti-property also.
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  7.  @orphaotheseeker2770  "Under fascist Spain, Germany, Greece, Chile, etc. every and all fascist regimes, " Only Italy had a Fascist regime. Spain had reformed Falangism. Germany had National Socialism. All of them were part of the 3rd position movement. Chile under Pinochet was Neoliberal and the complete opposite of previously mentioned socialist countries.
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  8.  @orphaotheseeker2770  "the government did NOT "directly own or control" the economy. " Wrong. They did.
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  9.  @orphaotheseeker2770  " You conflate war time economy's with "direct ownership and control" because you're a dishonest property worshiping cultist who is utterly incapable of acting in good faith." Socialist economy is nothing more than constant "war time economy".
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  10. @Stikibits: Which makes no sense whats oever, since they are the po lar oppo site of things.
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  11.  @Stikibits  "Nope, no they're not." Yes, they are. Fas cism was one of the bran ches of socia lism.
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  12. "form of crony capitalism." Wrong. It was State socialism. Fascism, as created by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile, comes from a belief that the "Stateless and Classless society" Communism calls for after its dictatorship cannot achieve Socialism, and that only the State can properly organize a Socialist Society. Fascism cared about unity in a strong central government with society being brought together by syndicalist organizations obedient to the State.
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  13.  @Chinas-Hurricane-Gun  "Yup , fascism was a reaction against socialism and Marxism ," Fascism was a reaction to failing Marxist-Leninism in Russia specifically, which drove many marxists into syndicalism instead.
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  14.  @Chinas-Hurricane-Gun  "and socialist uprising during the Biennio Rosso in the early 20's." Marxist uprising. They had no problems with socialism, and Fascism was a socialist movement itself.
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  15.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "Hitler was backed by leading German industrialists." Wrong. He was backed by Thyssen mainly. Regardless, the fact that some capitalists and entrepreneurs, faced with the alternative of Marxism or Nazism, chose the latter, does not require any further explanation. They preferred to live as shop managers under Hitler than to be "liquidated" as "bourgeois" by Marxists. Capitalists don't like to be killed any more than other people do.
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  16.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "Nazis allied with other far right parties," Wrong. The entire Nazi regime consisted of former members of other leftist movements and they allied with other leftists movements.
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  17.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "They literally killed off any prominent left leaning members, on the Night of the Long Knives. " Wrong. The Night of the Long Knives had nothing to do with "left leaning members" whatsoever. It was strictly about the internal power struggle between Hitler and Röhm, and simple fact that the German army leaders saw Röhm's SA as a threat. The murder of the SA leadership had several important long-term consequences. First and foremost, it cemented an alliance between Hitler and the German army leadership. In return for Hitler purging the SA and prioritizing the needs of the professional army, military leaders supported Hitler in August 1934 when he took the last key step toward full dictatorial control.
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  18.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "They went after communists, socialists, and unionists, first, for "illegal socialist activity". " Just like the whole Bolshevik Regime, after the October Revolution.
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  19.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "One of the reasons they gave for hating Jws, is for creating scialism, because Marx was of the Jwish "race". Etc. " Wrong. He blamed the Jews for creating Marxism specifically, and Capitalism. Both were seen as "ploys" to take over Germany.
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  20.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "exactly because they had been opposing scialists ... exactly because his black shirts had been going after socialist enclaves." Mussolini opposed Marxism / Communism, not socialism in general.
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  21.  @EricLeafericson  "Hitler wasn't really a socialist. He lied. " Wrong. By definition he was. You cannot be an advocate for centralized planning and strong government controls without being a socialist. That's what made Hitler a socialist. He may have been to the right from the Bolsheviks, but he was still a socialist leftist as he believed in strong central government control. Hitler outright declared himself a socialist in Mein Kampf, just not the Marxist international or full Soviet type. He struggled with HOW to distinguish his socialism from the rest of the Marxist crowd.
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  22.  @Vincent-fo7xp  ""Corporatism and fascism they are the same thing" Benito Mussolini" Where people miss the mark, is the Corporatism part. They do not know what it means in this context. Corporatism ("corporativismo" in Italian) was one of the cornerstone principles in Mussolini's fascism, and had to do with the way society and the economy would be organized, with state power at the head of a system of syndicates ("corporazione") representing each major industry.
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  23.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  " The Harzburg Front weren't leftists." They certainly were.
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  24.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "You think an absolute monarchy, where one person owns everything, is socialism. " It doesn't differ much from a socialist one-party dictatorship. In what way did any of the socialist dictators differ from kings? They were all worshiped and elitist but presented themselves as the ally of the people. Kings have done that in the past to appeal to the population.
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  25.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  : And? Their Doctrine of Fascism keeps referring to Marxist socialism there, which they also specifically point out in previous paragraph. "Such a conception of life makes Fascism the resolute negation of the doctrine underlying so-called scientific and Marxian socialism, the doctrine of historic materialism which would explain the history of mankind in terms of the class struggle and by changes in the processes and instruments of production, to the exclusion of all else."
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  26.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "Nope. He routinely just said "socialism". A "socialism" that repudiates the class struggle isn't socialism." Wrong. You are doing the rookie mistake by conflating Marxism and Socialism. They are two different things. Socialism exists without the "class struggle", as Socialism predates Marx and his buddy Engels.
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  27.  @TheHuxleyAgnostic  "Nope. No such thing as a "socialism" that wants to keep class hierarchies as is." Sure there are, go read some history if you don't know about them. Being against "the class hierarchies" has never been part of the definition socialism.
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  28.  @ianslee4765  "because socialism does have a definition. its when the means of production is owned by the workers." Except that is the definition of Marxism, not socialism, which doesn't care about the workers nor any specific group, regarding ownership or control of the means of production. Again, socialism is an economic system where the collective (such as workers, guilds, the government etc.) either directly own or control the buildings and tools that make goods and services like farms and factories. This can be achieved through decentralized and direct worker-ownership, or through centralized state-ownership or control of the means of production.
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  29.  @ianslee4765  "that it is YOU who is the fascist, doing the number one tactic theyve always done- PRETEND TO BE SOCIALIST" Wrong. They never pretended to be socialist; by their own words, actions and by definition they were socialists. When it comes to me, I'm the epitome of an Anti-Fascist.
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  30.  @ianslee4765  "listen man. youre just a nazi. " Wrong. I'm the epitome of an Anti-National Socialist and Anti-Fascist, hun. Cope harder.
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  31.  @ianslee4765  " the fact i straight up said you have nazi talking points " Wrong. I do not. You have no clue what you are talking about then.
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  32.  @ianslee4765  "the "collective" IS the workers as a unit. " In the Marxist theory and ideology, not in socialism in general.
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  33.  @ianslee4765  " deflecting the fact that the primary socialist thinkers, and therefor ADVANCERS of socialist dialect have been such. " Only Marx and Engels put forth the idea about the proletarian revolution, hun. Socialism has existed way before those two German goofballs, and it had nothing to do with some "workers of the world unite" bs.
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  34.  @ianslee4765  "you cannot today clearly draw a distinction from as all marxist ARE SOCIALIST. " Nobody has argued that they aren't socialists. Marxism is just NOT the only form of socialism there is.
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  35.  @ianslee4765  "ALL removed voting, all created a larger state, a nondeomcratic state = not socialist state. " Nothing to do with socialism whatsoever, since again, socialism is an economic system. Also Fidel Castro did just that, what you mentioned, and Cuba most certainly is a socialist country to this day.
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  36.  @ianslee4765  "Massive movement of PRIVATIZATION and deregulation of industries. " None of this existed, in neither National Socialist German nor in the Fascist Italy. Both nationalized their industries, and during the 1930s, both had one of the largest government owned public sectors in Europe, losing only to the USSR.
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  37.  @ianslee4765  "a FASCIST can say they are socialist or capitalist all they want, " It's not merely about what they said, but also what they did... and what they did was textbook socialism.
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  38.  @ianslee4765  "but what they want is control of a nations/peoples culture and to create a homogeneous society via means of authoritarian control." Correct. That has been the goal of every socialist regime so far.
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  39.  @ianslee4765  "1: if the only thing you changed in my term is that of work to that of collective then not only are you dumb, you are actually classist. As again, it is about being in the collective hands of those who have produced and work the land. not JUST every person, regardless of input. " Socialism is not limited nor restricted to some "proletarian" class. That was your first mistake.
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  40.  @ianslee4765  "Again, giving the state power and having no rights for the peoples isnt socialism. " There is no correlation there. Again, socialism is an economic system and doesn't care if the state has the power or what rights people have. As long as the means of production, distribution and exchange of goods are either collective owned directly, or controlled, then it is by definition, socialism.
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  41.  @ianslee4765  "2. notice how your talking points are that of what fascists SAID or WROTE and not DID" Again, what they did was textbook socialism, by nationalizing and collectivizing the means of production, distribution and exchange of goods. In both National Socialism and Fascism, it was the government which decided what was to be produced, in what quantity, by what methods, and to whom it was to be distributed, as well as what prices would be charged and what wages would be paid.
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  42.  @NeonNights80  "and throwing leftist party members in concentration camps." This still doesn't mean anything, since every socialist regime did the exact same thing to their socialist, political rivals. Including the Bolshevik regime.
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  43.  @NeonNights80  "Also there's no such thing as text book socialism." By textbook socialism, I meant the centralization, nationalization and socialization of the economy by the government.
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  44.  @NeonNights80  "Throwing the working class into a war meat grinder is the antithesis of socialism." Wrong. You are talking about apples and oranges. There is nothing antithetical to socialism there, since again, it's nothing more than an economic system.
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  45.  @ianslee4765  "The word socialism first appeared on 13 February 1832 in Le Globe, a French Saint-Simonian newspaper founded by Pierre Leroux." Wasn't referring to the mere word. I was referring to the collectivized and socialized means of production. There are plenty of sources for this, so I just leave a brief quote from Britannica here; "The origins of socialism as a political movement lie in the Industrial Revolution. Its intellectual roots, however, reach back almost as far as recorded thought—even as far as Moses, according to one history of the subject. Socialist or communist ideas certainly play an important part in the ideas of the ancient Greek philosopher Plato, whose Republic depicts an austere society in which men and women of the “guardian” class share with each other not only their few material goods but also their spouses and children. Early Christian communities also practiced the sharing of goods and labour, a simple form of socialism subsequently followed in certain forms of monasticism. Several monastic orders continue these practices today. ..."
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  46.  @ianslee4765  "both the claim that socialism is not about the workers AND the claim that fascists are socialist are nazi talking points." Wrong. Nothing to do with Nazis nor are they claims in the first place. Both of those statements are historical facts.
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  47.  @aheroictaxidriver3180  " Fascism is dictatorship in the service of the capitalist class. " Wrong. Fascism was strictly against Capitalism, and it only cared about the interests of the State apparatus / Nation as a whole. As said by Mussolini himself: "The State exists for all the people, but is also above the people, and, if necessary, against the people. . . . It is against them whenever they attempt to place their particular interests above the general interests of the Nation. It is the purpose of Fascism to unify the Nation through the sovereign State, the State which is above all and can be against all, because it represents the moral continuity of the Nation. Without State there is no Nation."
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  48. "Right-wing Christians are pushing the boundaries of fasc ism as quickly as possible." They have nothing to do with fasci sm whatsoever. Stop using words that you do not understand.
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  49. @Herbivore : Fascism was a form of socialism, hun ... and I highly doubt Meloni is a socialist.
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  50.  @Human_Herbivore  : Socialism is about collectivism, where the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole. It's an economic theory and has nothing to do with what you just said. Fascism was about extreme statism; subordinating individuals under the rule of the state and eliminating individualism in general.
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