Comments by "faron tilley" (@forzaisspeed) on "Binkov's Battlegrounds"
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No they do not.
The Eurofighter has a HMD, the F-22 does not, that is why reports have come out with details on the F-22's upgrades, and one of the many upgrades for it is a HMD, but it won't get it until I think 2024.
The Eurofighter on the other hand does have a HMD, and one of the most advanced to date, out performance the F-35's G3 Helmet System in area's, the Eurofighter's Strike 2 is able to see though the body and able to use its IRST and Captor Radar, to find and track plus able to fire missiles in a LOBL OTS, while the Eurofighter is pointing in the opposite direction, something the F-22 can't do.
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@KjetilBalstad
I think you'll find that what I have put is more Fact then anything you will find on youtube.
And you seen to not know that first see first shot is not as good as you think, for many reasons, RWS's Defences and the fact that missiles have a bad hit rate at distance.
Yes I know that the 120D and 9x are both LOAL and LOBL, just like the Meteor and ASRAAM, but the point being that you have missed, is that the F-22 can't lock on and fire unless the F-22 is pointing in the same area, cause if it fires a 120D for example and it does not see the jet with its own seeker then its a wast of a missile, at least the Eurofighter can help the Missile in LOAL with the helmet to find the target.
With RWS's and MWS's the Eurofighter will know as soon as the F-22 sees the it, and will start to counter, remember missiles have a bad hit rate at distance, so the F-22 only holds 6 BVR missiles max and both the 120D and 120C aren't as advanced as the Meteor in terms of Performance and Harder to Jam and Trick for example, plus the Eurofighter holds more Defences then the F-22, as well as being more agile, the F-22 has a harder time to hit the Eurofighter then the other way round, plus the Eurofighter can jam the F-22 and then use its helmet or IRST to lock on and fire against the F-22 while the F-22 is blind, while Jamming the F-22 has to get about 30km to the Eurofighter to it on radar again, so just cause the F-22 can see the Eurofighter first means nothing, the Eurofighter is more advanced better performance, better Missiles and a better jet all round.
The Eurofighter and F-22 have not done BVR Fights before, just WVR and the Eurofighter has won so many times even the German Eurofighter's lacking some hardware and software, but even them kicked the F-22's ass.
With guiding missiles to the target yes a jet must maintain radar lock for example Fox 1's are a guide missile needing lock on, Fox 2's are IR base basically WVR Missiles, Fox 3's are like Meteor and 120D LOAL and LOBL missiles, but in a BVR case Missiles give off radiation to the enemy jet that it is targeted, making it easier for the enemy jet to counter with its RWS, when you fire and guide the Missile with the jets radar or helmet or IRST helping for example, the Missile doesn't give off radiation due to not it's self targeting the enemy but other systems on enemy jet's have MWS basically able to detect anything coming for it the same thing that somewhat helps detect IR Missiles in newer systems, due to IR Missiles not giving any radiation cause no radar in it.
And yes IR Missile like the 9x and ASRAAM are both LOAL and LOBL as well.
The Eurofighter with the Captor M is still better jet then the F-22 in a real fight WVR and BVR, when the Captor E comes in properly then the Eurofighter will be untouchable.
If you read my post again and read it properly then you'll find that it makes more sense than you think.
So again I think all find what I say is more true then what you'll find.
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@KjetilBalstad
I've reworded some of it to make it easier for others to understand and read now so hope it is easier for people to know what I mean, you don't have to read it just up for anyone that is interested.
The Eurofighter is the best.
Some Example's to show why the Eurofighter is king, few years reading reports and papers and speaking with pilots themselves on the matter, and all can be found online Paper's and Reports open to read.
The Specs of the Eurofighter vs F-22 for example and some others to compare.
Speed /
Eurofighter - 1550 mph - Mach 2.0 TMS.
F-22 - 1495 mph - Mach 1.95 TMS.
Rafale - 1381 mph - Mach 1.8 TMS.
F-16 - 1500 mph - Mach 1.95 TMS.
F-35 - 1200 mph - Mach 1.56 TMS.
Altitude Ceiling /
Eurofighter 65,000 f.
F-22 65,000 f.
Rafale 50,000f.
F-16 50,000+f.
F-35 50,000f.
The Sustained and Instantaneous Turn Rates, reports and papers that I've read over the years, state some what different numbers to others, so I've found the mid of the numbers for a ( about number ), for example the Eurofighter some reports and papers say between 26 to 31 D/S, so about 28.5 D/S and again for the F-22 between 25 to 29.5 D/S so about 27 D/S.
But just to say that yes the F-22 uses 1D Thrust Vectoring, but the Eurofighter had the highest number, in most reports and papers, but I'll get to why Thrust Vectoring on the F-22 is not something you want to trust in, due to its quick energy bleed and loss of speed quite fast, and if it does not get in to position quickly, it's like a sitting duck.
Sustained Turn Rate /
Eurofighter - about 28.5 D/S.
F-22 - about 27 D/S.
Rafale - about 27 D/S.
F-16 - about 18 D/S.
F-35 - about 11 to 16 D/S.
Instantaneous Turn Rate /
Eurofighter - about 36.5 D/S.
F-22 - about 35 D/S.
Rafale - about 36 D/S.
F-16 - about 26 D/S.
F-35 - about 26.5 D/S.
Now focusing more on the Eurofighter vs F-22.
Engine Thrust /
Eurofighter 21,500 ibf x2.
F-22 35,000 ibf x2.
Plus the Eurofighter's EJ200 Engines are the most advanced, with a reliability rate of over 1000 hours and still performance like new.
Eurofighter is lighter and smaller so a higher Thrust to weight ratio.
The Eurofighter has better range / Combat and A to B.
The Eurofighter Has a Better Dive/Cilmb Rate with better energy hold.
G's and -G's.
Eurofighter 9+ and -3.5G's.
F-22 9+ and -3.2G's.
Most jet's can pull 9+ G's but only some can high -G's.
Hard Points /
Eurofighter 13.
F-22 8.
Gun /
Eurofighter x1 27mm with 150 rounds.
F-22 x1 20mm with 480 rounds.
Missiles BVR - WVR /
Eurofighter BVR Meteor Missile the best in the world x2 ranges 1st 150km for fast agile Targets 2nd in testing showed to go 300km for other Targets, The Biggest NEZ of 60km, Speed of Mach 4.5, more Agile then the AIM-120D, as well the Meteor uses a ramjet meaning it maintains power to the target, WVR the ASRAAM Faster then the AIM-9X and more agile between 5 to 55km, and the ASRAAM is a 6.5inch diameter vs the 5inch on the AIM-9X so about a 70% more volume rocket propellant, meaning a longer burn time.
F-22 BVR AIM-120D 1x range Maxed at 160km a NEZ of 20km, and a speed of Mach 4, WVR AIM-9X more agile under 5km, range 30+km.
And both AIM-9X and ASRAAM use a IR seeker, so heat seeking and the ASRAAM and newer 9X's able to be used as LOAL and LOBL with the ASRAAM being able to outperform the 9x in 180 over the shoulder launches, and with the ASRAAM using IR imaging to better its ability.
But no pilot will use the full range of their missile, like the 150+km on the Meteor or the 160km on the 120D due to the low chance of really hitting anything, and giving the enemy longer for the RWS's to pick it up and just do a 180 run, making the distance longer for the Missile, you'll want to fire within about 100 - 70km or even 50km, to have a higher chance for the Missile to hit and less time for the enemy to have to counter.
This is what I find funny is that people say, ( well this jet can fire from hundreds of miles away and kill it before ) NO, it's Bullshit their are the one's that don't know about Radar Worning Systems - MTT or even Defences, older 3rd gen jets with old Radar Worning System yes probably, but not 4th gen or 3rd gen with advanced or one of the most advanced RWS's ever in it.
Just to point out that the numbers on all missiles like the 120D Meteor R-77 PL-15 and so on, all have a range of what it can do with still the ability to hit a target ( effective range ), but most of the time it's in good weather conditions, so ranges will very.
Eurofighter uses the Striker 2 Helmet more advanced and able to lock on to targets and fire with out lining the jet up with the target, and has night vision built in, with out needing a different piece of equipment on the pilots head.
F-22 is outdated and old the hardware and software is not there to be able to use the Helmet to lock on and fire like the Eurofighter can, so the F-22 needs to line up to lock and fire.
Radar /
The Eurofighter uses one of the best Radars out today Captor M most powerfule in its class Plus it has a wider field of view then some electronic scan radar with a fixed plate, able to pick up the F-35 and F-22 from distance, and able to track a multi group of targets at once, plus the new Captor E Radar will and is one of the most powerfule Morden Radars for the Future.
F-22 has a good Radar picks up the Eurofighter from distance as well but even though the F-22 may see the Eurofighter at about 200km the 120D's range is 160km max and no pilot will use max range, and with the Eurofighter jamming for example in some exercise the F-22 was not able to get a lock until about 30km away from the Eurofighter, and same with F-22 and most jet's having jamming to stop the lock on's, but the F-22's radar cant handle as much as other radars can, but still can track lots of targets.
Plus the Eurofighter has many different systems around the Jet's body DASS, helping it and able to see a 360 decrease around the Jet, plus the Eurofighter's new Captor E Radar being able to fire Missiles then turn the jet more then 90 dec and still having the ability of guiding the Missiles to the target, as well as the Striker 2 gives the Eurofighter a bigger advantage in a BVR fight, but the F-22 does not have such abilitys and with just the one radar for fox 1 and fox 3's for example needs to maintain the Radar pointing at its target for guiding missiles not using LOAL or LOBL, meaning the F-22 is getting closer and closer to its target unlike the Eurofighter, and does not have IRST like the Eurofighter so the F-22 is blind in the heat seeking area, plus with the Eurofighter's IRST Pirate has a range of over 70 - 100km and able to pick up a stealth jet like the F-22 at 50+km, meaning the Eurofighter can fire a ASRAAM at the F-22, and it being a Imaging IR missile it is harder for the F-22's to pick up on, not impossible but harder to see, the F-22 does not have other systems around the body like the Eurofighter to help guide any missile after it turns beyond its radar sight, so making the F-22 again having to stay pointing at the enemy for a guided missile and with the Eurofighter have IFF DASS MIDS LDP DVI VTAS HOTAS and IRST as well as the mean radar and others the Eurofighter is just getting better and better, as well as its specs and proformas.
In War Games the Eurofighter and F-22 have both won against each other in WVR, but the Eurofighter and F-22 have not fought in BVR yet.
Design /
Eurofighter was designed for Air Dominance and does have some stealth in the design having the smallest RCS against the Rafale and Gripen, with the Wing Design on the Eurofighter it is 20% more efficient then your wing design on the F-22, The Eurofighter is a Swing-Roll as well meaning it can hold both air to air and air to ground payloads at the same time, the F-22 its one or the other.
The Eurofighter can do all the F-22 can do plus more, The Eurofighter has better specs better Missiles better Hardware and Software plus is used by the best the RAF.
Plus the F-22 is to expensive for the US to upgrade and keep maintaining, the F-22 was stop being made years ago, but the Eurofighter is still being maintained and still being updated with newer and newer Hardware and Software.
Eurofighter King.
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